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Erdogan says Macron ’needs treatment’ over attitude to Muslims

Also please tell us why do we have to follow a rule book which is clearly loaded against us.

Muslims fight for their rights = Terrorists

Muslims fight against their Pro-western leaders = Rebels

Muslims living life under anti-west leaders = Oppressed

West invades Muslim country = Liberators

Anti-west country invades another = tyrants

West kills women and children in drone strikes = collateral damage

Muslim kills women and children = terrorism

—————————-
I am not justifying anything, all I am saying is that everyone and/or every country does what it wants, however if you are a Muslim you and your actions are portrayed negatively.
 
The difference is everyone condemns that incident, they don't say 'He was asking for it' .. like numerous posters on here.

Go the twitter comments of any incident that involves people being lynched for eating beef and you will 100s of Indians glorying the attackers and blaming the victim.

Your points could have fooled people if the behavior of Indians on social media wasn’t in front of everyone.
 
No one went crazy over it and beheaded someone for it while same can not be said for others where people got beheaded over disagreement.

No one?
I mean, you had innocent people beaten and lynched to death for eating beef.
 
How many Muslims has Macron killed vs the ones Erdoğan killed?

That's a weird metric but France does have occupational troops in African Muslim countries like Mali where they are killing people plus they've bombed libya although this was before he was elected. He still funds Israel, so that's there biggest killing machine.
 
I say localized in case of india for a different reason. Though Muslims are minority in India, it is the 3rd biggest Muslim population across the world. That's not a small number. If religious intolerance was systemic, then India would have been under civil war all the time. But except a few cases from a few particular states, rest is living in peace and harmony which makes the whole case as localized and not systemic.

The religious intolerance in India is of a nature which doesnt press the pressure points of muslims like the French did this time. The last time something like this happened in India, i think a couple of months ago in Banagalore, there was a reaction from Indian muslims who are generally submissive anyway.

Rest of your post I have addressed in one of my previous post and also directed a question.
Do tell

Among the religions, is it easier to use Islam as a weapon to brainwash common people by misinterpreting religious quotes thus fuelling them to fulfill their different agendas by different extremist group who "claims" to follow Islamic ideology?

Otherwise, Christians should have had the same issue.

No its not easier. Find a practicing Christian, make him go through what muslims have gone through in various war torn countries and you can brainwash him too. There is a dominance of "Christian" nations in the world today and hence common christians arent as disgruntled as muslims coming from various parts of the world because they know in some form they are in power.
 
That's a weird metric but France does have occupational troops in African Muslim countries like Mali where they are killing people plus they've bombed libya although this was before he was elected. He still funds Israel, so that's there biggest killing machine.

That's Macron. What about Erdogan who thinks it's fair game to kill Muslims within his own territory as well?

Not to mention his close ties with Israel too.
 
Also please tell us why do we have to follow a rule book which is clearly loaded against us.

Muslims fight for their rights = Terrorists

Muslims fight against their Pro-western leaders = Rebels

Muslims living life under anti-west leaders = Oppressed

West invades Muslim country = Liberators

Anti-west country invades another = tyrants

West kills women and children in drone strikes = collateral damage

Muslim kills women and children = terrorism

—————————-
I am not justifying anything, all I am saying is that everyone and/or every country does what it wants, however if you are a Muslim you and your actions are portrayed negatively.

All the things you mentioned, muslims have done them when they had power.
 
That's Macron. What about Erdogan who thinks it's fair game to kill Muslims within his own territory as well?

Not to mention his close ties with Israel too.

This is where you miss the point, it takes some intelligence to understand nuance. Is he killing people because they're Muslim or are the people he killed happened to be Muslims? It's obviously the second case. That said, just because Erdogan is bad doesn't make Macron better. I don't know why our Indian 'friends' on here see the world in black and white and think two wrongs make a right. I'm wondering what the dharmic explanation for this thinking is.
 
This is where you miss the point, it takes some intelligence to understand nuance. Is he killing people because they're Muslim or are the people he killed happened to be Muslims? It's obviously the second case. That said, just because Erdogan is bad doesn't make Macron better. I don't know why our Indian 'friends' on here see the world in black and white and think two wrongs make a right. I'm wondering what the dharmic explanation for this thinking is.

Don't be misled by your indian friends here. They know zero about dharma, and mostly exhibit the baniya mentality indians are famous for.
 
—————————-
I am not justifying anything, all I am saying is that everyone and/or every country does what it wants, however if you are a Muslim you and your actions are portrayed negatively.

Yes, that is sadly, very true.

While only a minority of muslims may be radicalised and involved in terrorism, they have succeeded in giving the whole of Islam a bad name. Innocent muslims who have nothing to do with terrorism are suffering as a result.
 
I am not justifying anything, all I am saying is that everyone and/or every country does what it wants, however if you are a Muslim you and your actions are portrayed negatively.

The western media will have its own bias. muslim world should have their own global news publications and stop giving importance to the western press. Balance of narratives is very important.
 
Yes, that is sadly, very true.

While only a minority of muslims may be radicalised and involved in terrorism, they have succeeded in giving the whole of Islam a bad name. Innocent muslims who have nothing to do with terrorism are suffering as a result.

The networking web is all wrong.

Basically somebody from Algeria commits a terrorist attack in France, and Pakistanis get nervous about the consequences to their family and friends living in the USA. No Hindu in India can relate to such a thing I'm sure.

Regardless of what Macron has said, why lump yourself with those African losers? Can you not make a distinction that you are different Muslims than them?
 
All the things you mentioned, muslims have done them when they had power.

So that is the justification to do it to Muslims in modern times? Are you saying that Muslims are experiencing a collective act of revenge from the World?
 
So that is the justification to do it to Muslims in modern times? Are you saying that Muslims are experiencing a collective act of revenge from the World?

Not justifying and it is absolutely wrong to target a community or race for their faith and beliefs.
Nobody remembers what Muslims have done centuries ago. But what people do remember is what some Muslims are doing in the name of their religion in recent times which is causing anti-Islamic sentiment to grow.
 
Not justifying and it is absolutely wrong to target a community or race for their faith and beliefs.
Nobody remembers what Muslims have done centuries ago. But what people do remember is what some Muslims are doing in the name of their religion in recent times which is causing anti-Islamic sentiment to grow.

Quick qs Why is bhagat singh celebrated as a martyr and national hero in india?

Didnt he murder someone?
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-conversation="none"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BREAKING?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#BREAKING</a> Turkish President Erdogan: Muslims in Europe subjected to a "lynch campaign similar to that against Jews before World War II" <a href="https://t.co/TAfoneNPvB">pic.twitter.com/TAfoneNPvB</a></p>— AFP news agency (@AFP) <a href="https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1320709418263130112?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 26, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-conversation="none"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BREAKING?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#BREAKING</a> Turkey condemns 'monstrous' murder of teacher Samuel Paty in France: Erdogan spokesman <a href="https://t.co/K4Rz2COr8k">pic.twitter.com/K4Rz2COr8k</a></p>— AFP news agency (@AFP) <a href="https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1320721629304000517?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 26, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Erdogan calls on Turks to boycott French goods

ANKARA (Reuters) - Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan called on Monday for Turks never to buy French goods and urged European Union leaders to halt French leader Emmanuel Macron’s “anti-Islam” agenda.

Erdogan said on Saturday Macron had a problem with Muslims and needed checks on his mental health - a rebuke that caused France to recall its ambassador from Ankara. He made similar comments the next day and again on Monday.

“Just like they say ‘Don’t buy good with Turkish brands’ in France, I am calling to all my citizens from here to never help French brands or buy them,” Erdogan said.

France is the 10th biggest source of imports into Turkey and the seventh biggest market for Turkey’s exports, according to Turkey’s statistical institute. Among major French imports, French autos are among the highest selling cars in Turkey.

Macron has pledged to fight “Islamist separatism”, saying it was threatening to take over some Muslim communities in France. The country has since been shaken by the beheading of a teacher by an Islamist militant, avenging the use of cartoons of the Prophet Mohammad in a class on freedom of expression.

European leaders must put an end to Macron’s “anti-Islam” agenda, Erdogan said in a speech at the start of a week of activities in Turkey to commemorate the birthday of the Prophet Mohammad.

Turkey and France are both members of the NATO military alliance, but have been at odds over issues including Syria and Libya, maritime jurisdiction in the eastern Mediterranean, and the conflict in Nagorno-Karabakh.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...s-turks-to-boycott-french-goods-idUSKBN27B1HZ
 
Go the twitter comments of any incident that involves people being lynched for eating beef and you will 100s of Indians glorying the attackers and blaming the victim.

Your points could have fooled people if the behavior of Indians on social media wasn’t in front of everyone.


Who cares about anonymous social media accounts who we can't even verify .. they could even be some nefarious IT cell. I can point to social media accs as well who say terrible things.

For a proper dataset, look at this forum with regular members.

Posters here justifying beef attacks : 0
Posters justifying cartoon beheading : Hundreds ..
 
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Who cares about anonymous social media accounts who we can't even verify .. they could even be some nefarious IT cell. I can point to social media accs as well who say terrible things.

For a proper dataset, look at this forum with regular members.

Posters here justifying beef attacks : 0
Posters justifying cartoon beheading : Hundreds ..

You know forums are anonymous as well right? Anyways this is a Pakistani forum not really a place where you would find too many far right Indians. A post defending lynchings on this forum would likely result in a ban. I have seen countless post justifying lynchings on Indian forums and reddits. Can’t post them here because it’s against forum rules.

Btw you said there 100s of post defending the beheading on this forum, can you post 5?
 
You know forums are anonymous as well right? Anyways this is a Pakistani forum not really a place where you would find too many far right Indians. A post defending lynchings on this forum would likely result in a ban. I have seen countless post justifying lynchings on Indian forums and reddits. Can’t post them here because it’s against forum rules.

This forum likely has members mostly from the middle class and I assume more educated and civilized with discussions on many other topics of life, hence why I said this is a far better dataset .. the background of many members here are known instead of anonymous unverifiable posts on social media that you refer to.

Nevertheless, any indian who does justify or subtly support lynchings is an extremist in my book and is likely mentally ill. Will you same, on the other side? I doubt it. Imran Khan responded to the cartoon beheading by re-posting his old UNGA speech about hurting muslim sentiments. Amazng.

Btw you said there 100s of post defending the beheading on this forum, can you post 5?

Too many to list. Many have said 'He was asking for it' or 'Both of them were wrong' .. which is implicit or indirect justification for murder.
 
Nevertheless, any indian who does justify or subtly support lynchings is an extremist in my book and is likely mentally ill. Will you same, on the other side? I doubt it. Imran Khan responded to the cartoon beheading by re-posting his old UNGA speech about hurting muslim sentiments. Amazng.
It

r.

So you are just making things up now? Imran Khan’s response was in relation to the French government displaying the offensive caricatures on government buildings not the beheading. It seems like you are deliberately trying to spread misinformation.

Also what’s amazing is the fact that you claimed there were 100s of post in this forum defending the beheading but couldn’t even show one as an example when asked.
 
This forum likely has members mostly from the middle class and I assume more educated and civilized with discussions on many other topics of life, hence why I said this is a far better dataset .. the background of many members here are known instead of anonymous unverifiable posts on social media that you refer to.

Nevertheless, any indian who does justify or subtly support lynchings is an extremist in my book and is likely mentally ill. Will you same, on the other side? I doubt it. Imran Khan responded to the cartoon beheading by re-posting his old UNGA speech about hurting muslim sentiments. Amazng.



Too many to list. Many have said 'He was asking for it' or 'Both of them were wrong' .. which is implicit or indirect justification for murder.

I haven't read any post justifying the beheading, this is misinformation which is constantly being pushed here. Quite astonishing that you are claiming there have been hundreds of posts supposedly justifying it. Then when you get challenged to produce a quote you fob it off and make excuses.
 
There's a difference between getting upset and introducing terrorism/beheading people over religion worldwide.

Former is normal human reaction while latter isn't.

In India people get lynched for a simple act of consuming beef, must be a normal human reaction.
 
Who cares about anonymous social media accounts who we can't even verify .. they could even be some nefarious IT cell. I can point to social media accs as well who say terrible things.

For a proper dataset, look at this forum with regular members.

Posters here justifying beef attacks : 0
Posters justifying cartoon beheading : Hundreds ..

Can you post links to these posts where posters have justified them? the 100's? as they can be banned or reprimanded...of course if your talking out of where the sun doesnt shine, then i suggest you apologise to members on this forum.
 
so looks like our Indian friends are upto their old racists tricks again..."see you Moozlums are uncivilised and support beheadings blah blah" when they voted in a known fascist..its beyond laughable..personally i think most of you should shut the hell up..but hey thats just me..
 
The religious intolerance in India is of a nature which doesnt press the pressure points of muslims like the French did this time. The last time something like this happened in India, i think a couple of months ago in Banagalore, there was a reaction from Indian muslims who are generally submissive anyway.

If you are talking about India, it isn't homogenous. You have to talk stat by state. You can make that assumption but the point is, living side by side, if there was systemic religious intolerance, it would have been bloodbath. Indian muslims are submissive. I disagree. They trust the system, they know that these are localized issue and hence, it is useless to distablize the system which have always yielded peace and harmony for years.

No its not easier. Find a practicing Christian, make him go through what muslims have gone through in various war torn countries and you can brainwash him too. There is a dominance of "Christian" nations in the world today and hence common christians arent as disgruntled as muslims coming from various parts of the world because they know in some form they are in power.

Your case is understandable. But what doesn't fit is, a major share of UK muslim population who seems to go for extreme when it comes to islam. I have yet to see this from US muslims. Those particular sect of british muslims have healthy life style, educated and living comfortably yet they propgate extreme version. Why they are brainwashed?
 
It’s clever how you put “worldwide” in there knowing that Hindus actively lynch people of other religion if religious sentiments are offended.

The reason things did not escalate is because upon Hindus expressing their discontent, the fashion label decided to pull the clothing item.

Muslims on the other hand were told to shut up and put up with it.

The world treated two religions differently in terms of respect is concerned and hence two different reactions.

If you want I can give you many examples where religious warnings were not heeded to with serious consequences

Why is that?

Let me give an example, you have two posters here X and Y who posted the same comments.

X is generaly sensible but in this case, he posted a bit of extreme.
Y is carries a victim mentality and hence, more often than not, gives an over-reaction against simple actions.

While your reply towards X will be a bit milder (considering his posting history) but for Y, it won't.

Same goes for moderation also. For the same comment in above case, X will be given a lesser punishment whilst Y could be banned.

This is what reputation does. Why mulsims have bad reputation? I will point towards instances such as supportive of behading of that teacher by multiple people even in this small community. Excluding the incidents which could be attirbuted to one person, this support paints a very bad picture regarding the community.
 
Iran accuses France’s Macron of fuelling ‘extremism’

Iran has accused France of fuelling “extremism” after President Emmanuel Macron defended the publication of cartoons depicting the Prophet Muhammad.

“Muslims are the primary victims of the ‘cult of hatred’ – empowered by colonial regimes & exported by their own clients,” Foreign Minister Mohammad Javad Zarif tweeted.

“Insulting 1.9B Muslims – & their sanctities – for the abhorrent crimes of such extremists is an opportunistic abuse of freedom of speech. It only fuels extremism,” he said

It follows statements Macron made after a Chechen teenager murdered a French teacher on October 16.

Macron said history teacher Samuel Paty was beheaded for showing caricatures of the prophet to pupils “because Islamists want our future”.

On Sunday, Macron said in a tweet: “We will not give in, ever.”

“We do not accept hate speech and defend reasonable debate,” the French leader added.

Macron has declared war on “Islamist separatism”, which he said is taking over some Muslim communities in France.

‘Irrational behaviour’
Boycotts of French goods are under way in supermarkets in Qatar and Kuwait.

Iran’s religious leaders have not called for a boycott of products from France. But several Iranian officials and politicians have condemned Macron for “Islamophobia”, according to Iranian state media.

Ali Shamkhani, the secretary of Iran’s Supreme National Security Council, said Macron’s “irrational behaviour” displayed his “crudeness in politics”.

Shamkhani tweeted Macron’s comments showed “his lack of experience in politics, otherwise he would not have dared insult Islam”.

He advised the French leader to “read more history” and not rely on the “support of a declining American and deteriorating” Israel.

Parliament speaker Mohammad-Bagher Ghalibaf slammed France’s “foolish enmity” with the Prophet Mohammed, and said his sayings and “light cannot be put out with such blind, futile and anti-human acts”.

Ali Akbar Velayati, adviser to Iran’s supreme leader on foreign policy, said the cartoon should not have been reprinted following “global condemnation” of France’s Charlie Hebdo satirical magazine.

“We should have seen … the obscene magazine insulting the Prophet prevented from printing, but implementing double standards caused this heretical and anti-religious thinking to also manifest itself in the country’s education system,” he said in a statement.

Macron’s comments triggered protests in some Muslim-majority countries with people burning pictures of him in Syria and setting fire to French flags in Libya.

https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/...-fuelling-extremism?__twitter_impression=true
 
There's a difference between getting upset and introducing terrorism/beheading people over religion worldwide.

Former is normal human reaction while latter isn't.

How about this?

https://www.opindia.com/2020/10/fir-registered-against-deepika-singh-rajawat-over-hinduphobic-cartoon/

FIR registered against activist-lawyer Deepika Singh Rajawat for cartoon linking rape with Hindu Goddess worship

On 19th October, the lawyer had posted a cartoon on Twitter linking rape with worshipping Devi during the Navaratri and Durga Puja


25 October, 2020
OpIndia Staff
Deepika Singh Rajawat Deepika Singh Rajawat
https://www.facebook.com/sharer.php...epika-singh-rajawat-over-hinduphobic-cartoon/


The Jammu and Kashmir police has registered an FIR against controversial advocate Deepika Singh Rajawat for hurting the sentiments of Hindus. She has been booked after she had posted a cartoon a few weeks ago where all the Hindu men were depicted as rapists.

According to Bar & Bench, the FIR has been registered against Deepika Singh Rajawat under sections 505 (b)(2), 294 and 295 A of the Indian Penal Code. The case has been registered at the ammu Gandhi Nagar police station.

On 19th October, the lawyer had posted a cartoon on Twitter linking rape with worshipping Devi during the Navaratri and Durga Puja. In the cartoon, a man could be seen raping a woman at some place during ordinary days while it says that on Navratri, the man worships the Goddess at the same place, presumably a “Devisthan”.

Such depiction of Hindu men and disrespect of Hindu religious places had attracted widespread criticism on social media. People slammed her for unnecessarily targeting a pious Hindu festival, while pointing out how she didn’t use festivals of other religions to post such ‘social message’.



Following she posted the cartoon, several complaints were filed against her at various places in the country. Vishwa Hindu Parishad had filed a complaint with the Delhi police on 20th October.

The joint general secretary of VHP, Dr. Surendra Jain, had slammed Rajawat saying that the post was not merely an attack on Hindus, but on India as a whole.
On October 21, Dalit Positive Movement had lodged a complaint with the DGP UP against Deepika Singh Rajawat under SC/ST act and NSA ‘for sharing malicious & highly enraging cartoon insulting Hindu Godess’.

Others also filed complaints against the advocate for the cartoon.




It may be noted that Deepika Singh Rajawat is the same lawyer who had used the Kathua rape and murder case to promote herself as the saviour of the victim family, but attended almost none of the court hearings during the trial of the case. She attended merely two out of a hundred and ten hearings and was ultimately removed by the family of the victim.
It may be recalled here that following the tragic rape and murder of an eight-year old girl in Kathua, liberals and their Bollywood counterparts made a beeline to malign Hinduism and Hindus by highlighting the fact that the rape and murder presumably took place inside a ‘Devisthan’. A placard campaign was run on social media where liberals took special care to point out that the incident took place inside a “Devisthan”. And now Deepika Rajawat had revived the same angle to allege that Hindu men rape women inside Devi temples outside the days when the Devi is worshipped.

Why getting bent out of shape and arresting people on mere cartoons eh?
 
If you are talking about India, it isn't homogenous. You have to talk stat by state. You can make that assumption but the point is, living side by side, if there was systemic religious intolerance, it would have been bloodbath.

You are repeating yourself again. I mentioned pressure points of muslims which arent pressed by the kind of religious intolerance in India. Like triple talaq ban, or beef ban, cow lynching, ban on mosque loudspeakers (was it in Himachal?) etc. Muslims can bear this kind of intolerance especially the submissive Indian muslims. The pressure points which cause muslims to react are different like the ones France is pressing today.

Indian muslims are submissive. I disagree. They trust the system, they know that these are localized issue and hence, it is useless to distablize the system which have always yielded peace and harmony for years.
You made this claim in another thread as well and were debunked by an Indian muslim from South India of all places where there is almost no friction between communities.

Your case is understandable. But what doesn't fit is, a major share of UK muslim population who seems to go for extreme when it comes to islam. I have yet to see this from US muslims. Those particular sect of british muslims have healthy life style, educated and living comfortably yet they propgate extreme version. Why they are brainwashed?

I am not sure about the background of these muslims which you mention and whether your claims that they live in prosperous conditions with dignity are correct or not. I dont know the statistics of how many muslims from such affluent backgrounds in the UK indulge in such revenge attacks. If the numbers in this category are miniscule then it must be looked at as a minor criminal elements (as is the case with any other community) rather than the norm. If the numbers are heavily skewed and show that most of these attacks are carried out by people coming from comfortable backgrounds then it must be investigated with seriousness.

From what I have observed, and it is a mere observation, most of such attacks are carried out by refugees and migrants who have lived in war torn countries pounded by western bombs for the better part of their lives.
 
Atleast those hindus fought back to keep their culture and religion, similarly in Spain Christians fought back, the jews have got their land. Fighting back is the spirit, not giving up.

"Sir yes sir, we are with you. Please go ahead. You lead and we will follow. Love you till our last breath. We stand with you"
 
Lol why are indians ‘begani shaadi mai Abdullah deewana’ in occasions like these :)))
 
Lol why are indians ‘begani shaadi mai Abdullah deewana’ in occasions like these :)))

it shows a deep psychological problem within their society that they are loathe to acknowledge. Hence why they vote for people like Modi jee..
 
Well my upbringing didn't normalize consumption of an animal's excrement. I'm forever grateful for that.

Lol. You just burned them with this. Now they are losing their marbles. May have had a bit too much.
 
How about this?

https://www.opindia.com/2020/10/fir-registered-against-deepika-singh-rajawat-over-hinduphobic-cartoon/



Why getting bent out of shape and arresting people on mere cartoons eh?

An "FIR" is lodged. The legal framework will investigate based upon the relevant sections within consitution.

But this is what a civilized society does.

Instead of descending in to anarchy by going around beheading people, the civilized ones will protest the subject while remaining inside the law and order to continue peace and harmony even amidst protest.
 
You are repeating yourself again. I mentioned pressure points of muslims which arent pressed by the kind of religious intolerance in India. Like triple talaq ban, or beef ban, cow lynching, ban on mosque loudspeakers (was it in Himachal?) etc. Muslims can bear this kind of intolerance especially the submissive Indian muslims. The pressure points which cause muslims to react are different like the ones France is pressing today.

You see it as "pressure points". I call it "localized ones".


You made this claim in another thread as well and were debunked by an Indian muslim from South India of all places where there is almost no friction between communities.

It was Kaayal.

"debunked" is what you see as. Read that post again. It mentions instances from UP. And most indians will say that UP does have its issues under the political cloud. But that doesn't make it systemic. It is just a state in India. Hence, I call it "localized". You and her, both may disagree but except one off incidents, there's very little that can be attributed to the other states.



I am not sure about the background of these muslims which you mention and whether your claims that they live in prosperous conditions with dignity are correct or not. I dont know the statistics of how many muslims from such affluent backgrounds in the UK indulge in such revenge attacks. If the numbers in this category are miniscule then it must be looked at as a minor criminal elements (as is the case with any other community) rather than the norm. If the numbers are heavily skewed and show that most of these attacks are carried out by people coming from comfortable backgrounds then it must be investigated with seriousness.

point taken.

From what I have observed, and it is a mere observation, most of such attacks are carried out by refugees and migrants who have lived in war torn countries pounded by western bombs for the better part of their lives.

But a religion is supposed to give the people the ability to choose between right and wrong. Has Islam failed in doing so among the people in which it was needed the most?
 
So you are just making things up now? Imran Khan’s response was in relation to the French government displaying the offensive caricatures on government buildings not the beheading. It seems like you are deliberately trying to spread misinformation.

Where is the misinformation ? After the beheading, Macron said nobody should be harmed for expressing a view or drawing cartoon and Imran responded by accusing him of being an islamophobe and then said muslim sentiments are hurt.. instead of offering condolences for Samuel Paty. You should be ashamed of having such a person as PM.
 
I haven't read any post justifying the beheading, this is misinformation which is constantly being pushed here. Quite astonishing that you are claiming there have been hundreds of posts supposedly justifying it. Then when you get challenged to produce a quote you fob it off and make excuses.

Your own posts on this topic have been called out so its amusing to see you ask me for proof. I was referring to you and many others like kingkhanwc who said 'He was asking for it'. If the first instinct to a beheading is, 'we have to strengthen blaasphemy laws in Frrance' .. instead of weeding out extremists in a community, then its clear who people sympathise with. It's definitely not the teacher.
 
Can you post links to these posts where posters have justified them? the 100's? as they can be banned or reprimanded...of course if your talking out of where the sun doesnt shine, then i suggest you apologise to members on this forum.

Check the post above.
 
Where is the misinformation ? After the beheading, Macron said nobody should be harmed for expressing a view or drawing cartoon and Imran responded by accusing him of being an islamophobe and then said muslim sentiments are hurt.. instead of offering condolences for Samuel Paty. You should be ashamed of having such a person as PM.

Again with the misinformation, Imran isn't reacting to what Marcon said, he was reacting to the French government displaying the insulting caricatures on public buildings. Why is that so hard to understand?

Also when your own PM is a guy who is involved with religious extremist and is under the shadow of murder accusations , you really should not take shots at others. IK is far from perfect but at least he doesn't have blood on his hands.
 
Again with the misinformation, Imran isn't reacting to what Marcon said, he was reacting to the French government displaying the insulting caricatures on public buildings. Why is that so hard to understand?

Also when your own PM is a guy who is involved with religious extremist and is under the shadow of murder accusations , you really should not take shots at others. IK is far from perfect but at least he doesn't have blood on his hands.

Modi does have blood on his hands. Can’t argue that.
 
Again with the misinformation, Imran isn't reacting to what Marcon said, he was reacting to the French government displaying the insulting caricatures on public buildings. Why is that so hard to understand?

Also when your own PM is a guy who is involved with religious extremist and is under the shadow of murder accusations , you really should not take shots at others. IK is far from perfect but at least he doesn't have blood on his hands.

Pakistanis accuse India and Indians of a lot of things. Hardly any of that narrative is taken seriously by most of the world.

The world isnt talking about Modi, its worried about muslim extremism.
 
Pakistanis accuse India and Indians of a lot of things. Hardly any of that narrative is taken seriously by most of the world.

The world isnt talking about Modi, its worried about muslim extremism.
The only reason world is not worried about Hindu fanatics is because it’s very localized. It stays in India. Where as Islamist have a world wide agenda.
 
It was Kaayal.

"debunked" is what you see as. Read that post again. It mentions instances from UP. And most indians will say that UP does have its issues under the political cloud. But that doesn't make it systemic. It is just a state in India. Hence, I call it "localized". You and her, both may disagree but except one off incidents, there's very little that can be attributed to the other states.

If i remember correctly, she said the faith in Indian judiciary has dwindled and muslims now dont expect justice from Indian courts. Localized incidents wasn't the point of discussion, it was how the Indian judiciary has been compromised.

But a religion is supposed to give the people the ability to choose between right and wrong. Has Islam failed in doing so among the people in which it was needed the most?

I am not able to make heads or tails of this statement because it is problematic on many fronts.
How do you define failure? How many muslim refugees are living in western countries and what percentage of them indulge in such attacks? What percentage will be considered a failure? Has Christianity and Hinduism failed to give christian and hindu criminals who murder and rape the sense of what is right or wrong? Or will they be considered aberrations? And the biggest of all questions, does any religion claim to have perfect believers or does it simply put forth a set of ideals which the individual is free to follow or ignore or stay ignorant of?
The point is that in real life, many factors including personal life experiences and frustrations come into play and in cases which still remain comparatively rare, these factors play a big role in making a person take an extreme action.
 
The only reason world is not worried about Hindu fanatics is because it’s very localized. It stays in India. Where as Islamist have a world wide agenda.

Yes. No one is concerned about what is happening inside another country. Islamic nations have little religious freedom, minorities are brutalized and except the token statement no one is interested.

Islamic nations now must learn the same, stop meddling in whats happening in some country in Europe or Americas or elsewhere. You govern your country as per your rules, others will do the same.
 
Top Turkish officials condemned a caricature scorning President Tayyip Erdogan in the French satirical weekly Charlie Hebdo on Wednesday, calling it a “disgusting effort” to “spread its cultural racism and hatred”.

Turkish anger at the caricature added fuel to a row between Turkey and France about blasphemous sketches of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), which flared after a teacher who had shown pupils the cartoons in a lesson on freedom of speech was beheaded in France this month.

“We strongly condemn the publication concerning our President in the French magazine which has no respect for any belief, sacredness and values,” presidential spokesman Ibrahim Kalin wrote on Twitter.

“They are just showing their own vulgarity and immorality. An attack on personal rights is not humour and freedom expression,” he said.

The cartoon on the cover of Charlie Hebdo, showed Erdogan sitting in a white T-shirt and underpants, holding a canned drink along with a woman wearing an Islamic hijab.

Turkish presidential communications director Fahrettin Altun said “Macron’s anti-Muslim agenda is bearing fruit!”.

“We condemn this most disgusting effort by this publication to spread its cultural racism and hatred,” Altun wrote on Twitter.

Erdogan sharply criticised Macron at the weekend, saying the French leader needed a mental health check, prompting France to recall its ambassador from Ankara. On Monday, Erdogan urged a boycott of French products.


The blasphemous sketches of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) have been displayed in France in solidarity.

Meanwhile Macron's remarks that Islam is “a religion in crisis all over the world today” and his support for publishing and publicly exhibiting the blasphemous caricatures has angered many Muslims across the globe.
 
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France is now officially an uncouth state with no respect and regard for others. Anyone who supports this abominable vulgarity is as disgusting as the cartoons.
 
Your own posts on this topic have been called out so its amusing to see you ask me for proof. I was referring to you and many others like kingkhanwc who said 'He was asking for it'. If the first instinct to a beheading is, 'we have to strengthen blaasphemy laws in Frrance' .. instead of weeding out extremists in a community, then its clear who people sympathise with. It's definitely not the teacher.

But you said hundreds of posters had been supporting the beheading, you have produced one example from a singular poster. You claim my posts have been called out, but when challenged none of those I have responded to have been able to back anything up with actual quotes. What have I been called out for may I ask?
 
But you said hundreds of posters had been supporting the beheading, you have produced one example from a singular poster. You claim my posts have been called out, but when challenged none of those I have responded to have been able to back anything up with actual quotes. What have I been called out for may I ask?

Usually all of us have a blind side while we support or oppose something. The poster you are quoting has many of them.
 
France is now officially an uncouth state with no respect and regard for others. Anyone who supports this abominable vulgarity is as disgusting as the cartoons.

No one supports the cartoons but most think that that should result in beheading of a person. Some thinking it is justified is even more worse and scarier than the actual cartoons.

I think god and prophet (pbuh) are way above getting offended on something as silly as that. So when idiots are running around with machetes and beheading mainstream journalists, it’s about time to say wait hold on a second, there is a problem
 
No one supports the cartoons but most think that that should result in beheading of a person. Some thinking it is justified is even more worse and scarier than the actual cartoons.

I think god and prophet (pbuh) are way above getting offended on something as silly as that. So when idiots are running around with machetes and beheading mainstream journalists, it’s about time to say wait hold on a second, there is a problem

Indians and in particular hindus are supporting these cartoons. Go to twitter and see whats trending in India and the language of hindus there.
I agree nobody should be beheaded for cartoons, lynched for eating beef or burnt alive over allegations of converting people to christian faith.
 
Turkey has vowed to take "legal, diplomatic actions" over a cartoon of President Recep Tayyip Erdogan in French magazine Charlie Hebdo.

The cartoon depicts Turkey's president lifting the dress of a veiled woman.

State media say Turkish prosecutors have launched an official investigation into the satirical magazine.

Tensions between France and Turkey are high after President Emmanuel Macron pledged a tougher stance against radical Islam.

Mr Erdogan, who has also launched legal action against an anti-Islam MP in the Netherlands over a separate cartoon, has called on Turks to boycott French goods and said Mr Macron needed "mental checks".

The dispute has reverberated across the world, spurring boycotts and protests against France in several Muslim-majority countries including Bangladesh, Kuwait, Jordan and Libya.

The controversy also follows Mr Macron's pledge to defend secularism after the gruesome murder of a French teacher who showed cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad in class.

The president said the teacher, Samuel Paty, "was killed because Islamists want our future", but France would "not give up our cartoons".

Depictions of the Prophet Muhammad are widely regarded as taboo in Islam, and are offensive to Muslims.

But state secularism is central to France's national identity. Curbing freedom of expression to protect the feelings of one particular community undermines unity, the state says.

Presidential communications director Fahrettin Altun said: "Charlie Hebdo just published a series of so-called cartoons full of despicable images purportedly of our president. We condemn this most disgusting effort by this publication to spread its cultural racism and hatred."

Vice-President Fuat Oktay called on the international community to raise its voice against "this disgrace".

"You cannot fool anyone by hiding behind freedom of thought," he said on Twitter.

In response, the Turkish pro-government satirical magazine Misvak posted a number of cartoons criticising Mr Macron and Charlie Hebdo on its Twitter page.

But it is not the only cartoon to have angered the Turkish government this week, with President Erdogan launching legal action against far-right Dutch MP Geert Wilders over an image he shared on Twitter.

The cartoon depicted President Erdogan wearing an Ottoman hat shaped like a bomb, which Mr Wilders captioned with the word "terrorist".

Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte criticised the Turkish leader's response.

"I have a message for President Erdogan and that message is simple: In the Netherlands, freedom of expression is one of our highest values," he said.

What's the story with Charlie Hebdo?
The French magazine is no stranger to controversy.

In 2015, 12 people were killed in an attack on the offices of the magazine in Paris. It was targeted by Islamic extremists for publishing cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad.

The same year, Russia heavily criticised the magazine for two cartoons depicting the Sinai air crash in which 224 people, mostly Russians, died.

In 2016, a cartoon depicting Italian earthquake victims as pasta dishes caused outrage.

What's the latest on the backlash against France?

Anger is building across the Muslim world at Mr Macron over his perceived attacks on Islam and the Prophet Muhammed.

This fury has led to protests, calls for boycotts of French products and security warnings for French citizens abroad.

In Bangladesh, hundreds of people took part in an anti-France rally outside the Baitul Mukarram National Mosque on Wednesday. Protesters burned an effigy of Mr Macron.

A faith group in Malaysia added to calls for French products to be removed from shops. The Malaysian Consultative Council (MCC) said the boycott would "send a strong message to France".

French goods have already been pulled from supermarket shelves in Jordan, Qatar, Kuwait and some other Middle Eastern countries.

A plea for the criminalisation of "anti-Muslim" actions came from the Grand Imam of al-Azhar university in Egypt. The country's president, Abdul Fattah al-Sisi, said on Wednesday freedom of expression should stop if it offends more than 1.5 billion people.

Amid concerns over safety, the French foreign ministry has issued a warning to its citizens in Indonesia, Iraq and Mauritania - countries where protests have taken place - and advised them to exercise caution.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-54717587
 
Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte criticised the Turkish leader's response.

"I have a message for President Erdogan and that message is simple: In the Netherlands, freedom of expression is one of our highest values," he said.


So both the French and the Dutch are now using freedom of expression to draw offensive cartoons of the Turkish president. That's fine and well, but why does the Dutch Prime Minister need to send a message of support for offensive drawings of a President of another country? He could just have stayed silent or said it was for the Dutch courts to deal with. Don't these leaders have any concept of diplomacy in international relations?
 
So both the French and the Dutch are now using freedom of expression to draw offensive cartoons of the Turkish president. That's fine and well, but why does the Dutch Prime Minister need to send a message of support for offensive drawings of a President of another country? He could just have stayed silent or said it was for the Dutch courts to deal with. Don't these leaders have any concept of diplomacy in international relations?
Same could not be said of imran khan?
 
Same could not be said of imran khan?

Imran Khan hasn't backed anyone from Pakistan drawing offensive caricatures of French or Dutch leaders, so no same can't be said of Imran Khan. He is smart enough to understand at that level you need to show some respect...unless of course you are attacked personally, then whoever has stepped over the line loses that grace.
 
Imran Khan hasn't backed anyone from Pakistan drawing offensive caricatures of French or Dutch leaders, so no same can't be said of Imran Khan. He is smart enough to understand at that level you need to show some respect...unless of course you are attacked personally, then whoever has stepped over the line loses that grace.

I don’t see the difference between Dutch supporting the French and imran supporting the Turk.
 
An "FIR" is lodged. The legal framework will investigate based upon the relevant sections within consitution.

But this is what a civilized society does.

Instead of descending in to anarchy by going around beheading people, the civilized ones will protest the subject while remaining inside the law and order to continue peace and harmony even amidst protest.

Civilized society where Mosques are demolished by mobs while being egged on by ruling politicians. Muslims are lynched even at rumors of beef eating. yup very civilized.....
 
Same will happen to anyone insulting Islam or Sikhism or Christianity. The laws in India dont allow mockery of religion.

But they also dont allow anyone to behead someone for such acts.

I didn't see you sanctimonious sanghis condemning the teacher or the French government when they are insulting the whole religion?
 
I didn't see you sanctimonious sanghis condemning the teacher or the French government when they are insulting the whole religion?

Did he do it in India? No. He did it in france. France have their own culture customs and way of living.

Someone insulted the prophet pbuh in India and he was jailed for 1.5 yrs.
 
You claim my posts have been called out, but when challenged none of those I have responded to have been able to back anything up with actual quotes. What have I been called out for may I ask?

Read my post again. I quoted you and others verbatim.. did you not say that?
 
Read my post again. I quoted you and others verbatim.. did you not say that?

Where did you quote me justifying the beheading? What was it I was called out for? You don't have a leg to stand on and that is why you are resorting to lies and misinformation.
 
So both the French and the Dutch are now using freedom of expression to draw offensive cartoons of the Turkish president. That's fine and well, but why does the Dutch Prime Minister need to send a message of support for offensive drawings of a President of another country? He could just have stayed silent or said it was for the Dutch courts to deal with. Don't these leaders have any concept of diplomacy in international relations?

If you're going to prattle out the Ummah card for everything big, medium or small that happens in the world, it's only fair that two bite sized European nations try to do the same.
 
Where is the misinformation ? After the beheading, Macron said nobody should be harmed for expressing a view or drawing cartoon and Imran responded by accusing him of being an islamophobe and then said muslim sentiments are hurt.. instead of offering condolences for Samuel Paty. You should be ashamed of having such a person as PM.

You literally have no idea of what’s going on. Macron said ‘Islam is a religion in crisis’ and That’s why this reaction.

Also lol at last sentence. If Pakistanis should be ashamed of IK as their PM, should indians commit suicide to have Modi as theirs lol?
 
If you're going to prattle out the Ummah card for everything big, medium or small that happens in the world, it's only fair that two bite sized European nations try to do the same.

Ummah card is there, always has been even if it seems to rattle some folk for whatever reason. Why is it a problem though? But what is the point in having diplomatic relations if you can't show some diplomacy? You think Presidents of countries should be backing drawing abusive portraits of leaders of other countries? It's a simple enough question.
 
You think Presidents of countries should be backing drawing abusive portraits of leaders of other countries? It's a simple enough question.

I don't know what to make of it actually when both sides have pushed the line to an extreme here. Sure, if drawing pictures of the Prophet (PBUH) is forbidden the magazine shouldn't have done it, but equally, all bets are off when the beheading incident took place.

Everybody needs to cool down and examine what has happened in a benign manner, but no - we have an attack a day in France looking at the news.
 
I don't know what to make of it actually when both sides have pushed the line to an extreme here. Sure, if drawing pictures of the Prophet (PBUH) is forbidden the magazine shouldn't have done it, but equally, all bets are off when the beheading incident took place.

Everybody needs to cool down and examine what has happened in a benign manner, but no - we have an attack a day in France looking at the news.

Well that shouldn't be so surprising seeing as how things are escalating. Rather than calm the population, seems that the French govt is intent on stoking the flames further. Perhaps they think it will be worth it in the long run, but personally I think it will just cause more resentment and more outrages.
 
France is headed towards the pits. Economy is tanking, power is waning, and Macron is half the age of his teacher wife. That's right he married his teacher that is twice his age. Sickening peado.

Penn will be in power soon, and then your liberals will blame Brexit.

Can't wait to starve France of fish.

France will get what it deserves for being a racist warmongering nation, and its leader a puppet of the Rothschilds.
 
You literally have no idea of what’s going on. Macron said ‘Islam is a religion in crisis’ and That’s why this reaction.

You are even more clueless than me. These are Imran's own words -

"Sadly, President Macron has chosen to deliberately provoke Muslims, including his own citizens, and encouraged the display of blasphemous cartoons targeting Islam and the Holy Prophet."
 
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