First report on Mohammad Asif's performances at the NCA

[Junaids]

According to an article on another website today, Mohammad Asif has been busy "making fools of the best batsmen in the country" in the nets at the NCA in Lahore.

Do we have any other reports on how he is performing?

I was wondering why the PCB had initially set a date of late February for Asif and Butt to have clearance to play, only for them to now advance it to next month.

Is this why?

I have to admit that I have considered that - even at the same age as Jimmy Anderson - I thought that Asif was unlikely to regain his former performance levels. Not too many 33 year old pacemen make waves.

But if - and it is a very big if - Asif is back to somewhere near his former level, suddenly a year on the road to England, New Zealand and Australia is transformed from a potential disaster to a potential triumph.

A Test bowling attack outside Asia of:

8. Mohammad Amir
9. Yasir Shah
10. Wahab Riaz
11. Mohammad Asif


.......would be clearly the best in the world, by a massive margin.

 

[Aman]

Amir and Asif aren't going to win Pakistan a series in Aus, they couldn't do it before and they won't do it now after 5 years away from cricket.

 

[Bullet Drive]

Amir and Asif aren't going to win Pakistan a series in Aus, they couldn't do it before and they won't do it now after 5 years away from cricket.

That was a different AUS. Current Aussie team isn't as good.

We will beat them.

 

[Junaids]

Amir and Asif aren't going to win Pakistan a series in Aus, they couldn't do it before and they won't do it now after 5 years away from cricket.

Asif basically bowled Pakistan to victory in the 2009-10 Sydney Test with Amir out injured. They only lost because key players fixed their defeat - Mazhar Majeed has confessed to this. The Third Test ended up being a farce.

You have to remember that in 2009-10 Pakistan was playing without its best batsman (Younis Khan was excluded by special instructions from the Chairman of the PCB) and with several key players fixing.

Just compare these two lower orders in terms of ability and propriety:

7. Kamran Akmal v Sarfraz Ahned
8. Mohammad Amir
9. Mohammad Sami v Wahab Riaz
10. Danish Kaneria v Yasir Shah
11. Mohammad Asif

To be honest, I'd say the same about the top six too, given Misbah's serial failures in Australia and South Africa - indeed he had to be dropped after the Sydney Test.

1. Imran Farhat v Ahmed Shehzad.
2. Salman Butt
3. Faisal Iqbal v Azhar Ali
4. Mohammad Yousuf 2010 vintage v Babar Azam
5. Umar Akmal
6. Misbah 2010 vintage v Asad Shafiq

 

[Aman]

That was a different AUS. Current Aussie team isn't as good.

We will beat them.

Wickets are flatter and this Aussie side in home conditions can still go at 4-5 an over against any side in the world.

Batting wise, I'd say they're more or less about the same in HOME conditions.

 

[Suleiman]

I have a gut feeling that Asif will be going with us to the England tour. Said it in another thread a while ago before PCB allowed Asif/Butt to play domestic cricket again, and that feeling only has gotten stronger, and no it's not the red chilli taco I had from a mexican place.

 

[Bullet Drive]

Wickets are flatter and this Aussie side in home conditions can still go at 4-5 an over against any side in the world.

Batting wise, I'd say they're more or less about the same in HOME conditions.

Haha. AUS can never go at 5 an over against Riaz, Asif & Amir. No way.

 

[Aman]

Asif basically bowled Pakistan to victory in the 2009-10 Sydney Test with Amir out injured. They only lost because key players fixed their defeat - Mazhar Majeed has confessed to this. The Third Test ended up being a farce.

You have to remember that in 2009-10 Pakistan was playing without its best batsman (Younis Khan was excluded by special instructions from the Chairman of the PCB) and with several key players fixing.

Just compare these two lower orders in terms of ability and propriety:

7. Kamran Akmal v Sarfraz Ahned
8. Mohammad Amir
9. Mohammad Sami v Wahab Riaz
10. Danish Kaneria v Yasir Shah
11. Mohammad Asif

To be honest, I'd say the same about the top six too, given Misbah's serial failures in Australia and South Africa - indeed he had to be dropped after the Sydney Test.

1. Imran Farhat v Ahmed Shehzad.
2. Salman Butt
3. Faisal Iqbal v Azhar Ali
4. Mohammad Yousuf 2010 vintage v Babar Azam
5. Umar Akmal
6. Misbah 2010 vintage v Asad Shafiq

Say Sydney was fixed, Pakistan still lose 2-1.

If Amir and Asif couldn't get the job done then, what makes you think they can do it now after being away from cricket for 5 years and with a pretty weak batting unit to boot?

You're seriously underselling how difficult it is to win a series in Aus.

 

[Aman]

Haha. AUS can never go at 5 an over against Riaz, Asif & Amir. No way.

They've gone 5 an over against an attack of Steyn and Morkel.

 

[StreetSmart]

Amir and Asif aren't going to win Pakistan a series in Aus, they couldn't do it before and they won't do it now after 5 years away from cricket.

Aman, That was the time Pakistani team started their downfall period now it is the different case. Anyways I like your judgement Pakistani team still doesn't have that X-factor player to dominate Aussies

 

[Aman]

Aman, That was the time Pakistani team started their downfall period now it is the different case. Anyways I like your judgement Pakistani team still doesn't have that X-factor player to dominate Aussies

Just have a look at what happened to NZ on roads, the only way I see Aus losing a Test on an Aussie road is if they crumble in the second innings in the face of a big score. But I can't see the Pakistani's scoring enough against an attack of Starc, Hazlewood and Pattinson.

 

[Bullet Drive]

They've gone 5 an over against an attack of Steyn and Morkel.

Riaz, Asif & Amir > Steyn and Morkel.

 

[Aman]

Riaz, Asif & Amir > Steyn and Morkel.

Asif and Amir are returning to international cricket after 5 years.

Riaz has quickly gone from under rated to over rated based on that one spell to Shane Watson.

To give you an indication of how good Riaz is, he's ranked #39 in the world... behind bowlers like Rahat, Bracewell (he's played 4 Tests for us in the last ~2 years), Tahir, Perera (lol), Rehman (can't get a game for Pakistan), Ishant and Siddle (can barely get a game for Aus).

Steyn is an ATG bowler who has been the best Test bowler in world cricket for more than 5 years (he was number 1 when Amir and Asif were banned IIRC). Morkel right now is in the top 10, and will probably improve his ranking after this Test.

 

[Junaids]

Just have a look at what happened to NZ on roads, the only way I see Aus losing a Test on an Aussie road is if they crumble in the second innings in the face of a big score. But I can't see the Pakistani's scoring enough against an attack of Starc, Hazlewood and Pattinson.

I walked past Trent Boult on a pedestrian crossing on Tuesday night, and was a bit shocked at how short he was - he's only a couple of inches bigger than me.

I would fancy Southee and Boult to do well everywhere - except Australia.

But Asif and Amir are similar to Southee and Boult, but Asif is slightly better than Southee is. And then comes the kicker - Yasir Shah is much, much better than Mark Craig (or Mitchell Santner) and Wahab Riaz has the pace and bounce to be much more dangerous in Australia than Dougie Bracewell (whom I actually like).

Pakistan's attack - if they pick the fixers - is as good as any to tour Australia in modern times. There is no weak link - and it would be strengthened even further if they would pick Irfan.

The issue, as you have rightly identified, is the batting. But Asad Shafiq and Azhar Ali are fine and the thing which will decide whether the batting has a par score of 200 or 300 will be whether Pakistan select the only two current batsmen whose techniques have worked in Tests in Australia - which means Salman Butt and Umar Akmal.

If they pick those two they will be in every match. If they don't, they can't score enough runs in Australian conditions.

 

[Stewie]

Bhai, it's not easy for us in australia. Out batting is very bad..we lose due to batting..

 

[Junaids]

Bhai, it's not easy for us in australia. Out batting is very bad..we lose due to batting..

If that was aimed at me, nobody has ever called me "Bhai" before!

Yes, your batting is a major problem. I was a great admirer of the younger Younis Khan, but I know that Hafeez, Younis and Misbah would be roadkill in Australia next year.

But we know that Salman Butt and Umar Akmal can get Test runs in Australia. We know that Asad Shafiq is fine - he did it in South Africa.

If your selectors have done their homework they will pick a top six of:

1. Ahmed Shehzad
2. Salman Butt
3. Azhar Ali
4. Babar Azam
5. Umar Akmal
6. Asad Shafiq.

They are your only real hope in Australia. Plus a lower middle-order of Sarfraz Ahmed and Mohammad Amir.

 

[axl100mph]

I walked past Trent Boult on a pedestrian crossing on Tuesday night, and was a bit shocked at how short he was - he's only a couple of inches bigger than me.

I would fancy Southee and Boult to do well everywhere - except Australia.

But Asif and Amir are similar to Southee and Boult, but Asif is slightly better than Southee is. And then comes the kicker - Yasir Shah is much, much better than Mark Craig (or Mitchell Santner) and Wahab Riaz has the pace and bounce to be much more dangerous in Australia than Dougie Bracewell (whom I actually like).

Pakistan's attack - if they pick the fixers - is as good as any to tour Australia in modern times. There is no weak link - and it would be strengthened even further if they would pick Irfan.

The issue, as you have rightly identified, is the batting. But Asad Shafiq and Azhar Ali are fine and the thing which will decide whether the batting has a par score of 200 or 300 will be whether Pakistan select the only two current batsmen whose techniques have worked in Tests in Australia - which means Salman Butt and Umar Akmal.

If they pick those two they will be in every match. If they don't, they can't score enough runs in Australian conditions.

Lol, dude u try too hard to increase relevance by somehow showing how physically close you are to the subject in discussion.

I remember how u mentioned being a friend of a great player's gf.
Not to forget that u were wasim's neighbour at lancashire on top of being a teammate of atherton during your school years
what have I missed?

 

[volcyz]

Lol, dude u try too hard to increase relevance by somehow showing how physically close you are to the subject in discussion.

I remember how u mentioned being a friend of a great player's gf.
Not to forget that u were wasim's neighbour at lancashire on top of being a teammate of atherton during your school years
what have I missed?

Lol what the...

 

[axl100mph]

If that was aimed at me, nobody has ever called me "Bhai" before!

Yes, your batting is a major problem. I was a great admirer of the younger Younis Khan, but I know that Hafeez, Younis and Misbah would be roadkill in Australia next year.

But we know that Salman Butt and Umar Akmal can get Test runs in Australia. We know that Asad Shafiq is fine - he did it in South Africa.

If your selectors have done their homework they will pick a top six of:

1. Ahmed Shehzad
2. Salman Butt
3. Azhar Ali
4. Babar Azam
5. Umar Akmal
6. Asad Shafiq.

They are your only real hope in Australia. Plus a lower middle-order of Sarfraz Ahmed and Mohammad Amir.

Why do you propose over .
On what grounds?

 

[Sachin136]

I walked past Trent Boult on a pedestrian crossing on Tuesday night, and was a bit shocked at how short he was - he's only a couple of inches bigger than me.

I would fancy Southee and Boult to do well everywhere - except Australia.

But Asif and Amir are similar to Southee and Boult, but Asif is slightly better than Southee is. And then comes the kicker - Yasir Shah is much, much better than Mark Craig (or Mitchell Santner) and Wahab Riaz has the pace and bounce to be much more dangerous in Australia than Dougie Bracewell (whom I actually like).

Pakistan's attack - if they pick the fixers - is as good as any to tour Australia in modern times. There is no weak link - and it would be strengthened even further if they would pick Irfan.

The issue, as you have rightly identified, is the batting. But Asad Shafiq and Azhar Ali are fine and the thing which will decide whether the batting has a par score of 200 or 300 will be whether Pakistan select the only two current batsmen whose techniques have worked in Tests in Australia - which means Salman Butt and Umar Akmal.

If they pick those two they will be in every match. If they don't, they can't score enough runs in Australian conditions.

Sometimes you severely overrate Pakistan players, and then other times you underrate them. If Asif goes back to how he was 5 years back, you think he is only slightly better than Southee?

 

[Junaids]

I was really shocked by Trent Boult. He's a terrific bowler, and I always imagined that he was the same height as Waqar Younis - pretty much 6 foot dead, which is on the short side for a modern quick bowler.

But as I walked past him I realised that he is a fraction taller than I am but no way is he more than 5 foot 9.

And that is why his economy rate at Brisbane and Perth was so awful, indeed why Southee and Bracewell both looked better than him.

In Australia, you need to be at least 6 foot to stay in the game as a quick bowler when the Kookaburra loses its shine, or you go for 4+ runs per over, every over. You need to bowl a full length, but get enough lift that the batsman doesn't know whether to go forward or back.

Boult was fine at Adelaide because the wicket was so green. But he was too short for the Gabba and the WACA.

And this is relevant to my response to [MENTION=132954]Aman[/MENTION]. The Kiwi attack wasn't particularly optimised for playing in Australia. Pakistan can field a much better suited team for Aussie conditions.

 

[axl100mph]

If that was aimed at me, nobody has ever called me "Bhai" before!

Yes, your batting is a major problem. I was a great admirer of the younger Younis Khan, but I know that Hafeez, Younis and Misbah would be roadkill in Australia next year.

But we know that Salman Butt and Umar Akmal can get Test runs in Australia. We know that Asad Shafiq is fine - he did it in South Africa.

If your selectors have done their homework they will pick a top six of:

1. Ahmed Shehzad
2. Salman Butt
3. Azhar Ali
4. Babar Azam
5. Umar Akmal
6. Asad Shafiq.

They are your only real hope in Australia. Plus a lower middle-order of Sarfraz Ahmed and Mohammad Amir.

On your height comparison with boult.
I think you meant 'taller' by a few inches.
Using 'bigger' by a few inches in the same sentence where you say that you were out on a tuesday night has other connotations. Some weird ones at that

[MENTION=46929]shaz619[/MENTION]

 

[yasir]

Wickets are flatter and this Aussie side in home conditions can still go at 4-5 an over against any side in the world.

Batting wise, I'd say they're more or less about the same in HOME conditions.

You have to get Warner early, As can do that I believe. Smith walking across may not work against our seamers. Rest are manageable.

If we play in Sydney, Yasir will play key role.

We just have to score 250/300 run in first innings two times.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[axl100mph]

Sometimes you severely overrate Pakistan players, and then other times you underrate them. If Asif goes back to how he was 5 years back, you think he is only slightly better than Southee?

Southee's skill is just limited to swinging it out and the one that holds its line.
he doesnt seam the ball like asif did

Asif had mastered every art of extracting lateral movt.
He could get it to move in the air when he wanted to, both in and out and was probably one of the few exponents of the wobbly seam delivery, which went straight on but moved appreciably off the pitch.

No comparison, really

 

[MMHS]

Asif is a genius - some of his movements actually defies the laws of physics. I think, he is born with some abnormalities in his wrist, otherwise his away cutters (ball that drifts away from right-handers & cut back sharply off the seam) are impossible to master. I have seen PAK bowlers doing fancy things with old ball, like Imran could swing inwards & then swing away after pitching (right-handers) or Wasim & Waquar could reverse it both ways in air, but a mixture of swing & cut is unique. I have seen the ball of VVS & Ponting (?) at Cape Town (?) several times in slow mo, but no clues yet. I think, Asif is one of those bowlers who could be lethal even at 35 & at 125km speed, particularly in England. At his prime, for few series he was more skillful than Jimmy & more accurate than Styen. In 2010, in 12 Tests in NZ, AUS & ENG, I think he took ~60 wickets, against top 3 of 4 sides in World at their home, and PAK fielders dropped another 20 sitters.....

If AA pair can reach to their level of 2010, backed by Wahab, Yasir, Rahat; PAK 'll be a formidable Test side in UK & down under, as long as the catches are taken. That'll easily be the best Test attack in contemporary world, by some distance.

 

[JibranAnsari]

Forget him for 2016 tests at least, and after that pakistan arent going to visit any of australia, nz, eng or sa before asif is 38. Any half decent pacer can bamboozle our batsmen by the way.

 

[JibranAnsari]

I think the reason behind allowing them to play is that pcb wants amir in the team now and it only makes sense that at least allow the other two to play domestic.. Nothing to do with the performance imo.

 

[kassana420]

Asif is a genius - some of his movements actually defies the laws of physics. I think, he is born with some abnormalities in his wrist, otherwise his away cutters (ball that drifts away from right-handers & cut back sharply off the seam) are impossible to master. I have seen PAK bowlers doing fancy things with old ball, like Imran could swing inwards & then swing away after pitching (right-handers) or Wasim & Waquar could reverse it both ways in air, but a mixture of swing & cut is unique. I have seen the ball of VVS & Ponting (?) at Cape Town (?) several times in slow mo, but no clues yet. I think, Asif is one of those bowlers who could be lethal even at 35 & at 125km speed, particularly in England. At his prime, for few series he was more skillful than Jimmy & more accurate than Styen. In 2010, in 12 Tests in NZ, AUS & ENG, I think he took ~60 wickets, against top 3 of 4 sides in World at their home, and PAK fielders dropped another 20 sitters.....

If AA pair can reach to their level of 2010, backed by Wahab, Yasir, Rahat; PAK 'll be a formidable Test side in UK & down under, as long as the catches are taken. That'll easily be the best Test attack in contemporary world, by some distance.

Agreed.
He really was something special. Hopefully, still is.

 

[JibranAnsari]

Lol we arent going to win in australia with this batting even if we took wasim waqar amir and asif.. No way.

 

[Asadullah]

Thats great to hear.

Love the arguments made by [MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION] and [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION].

Hope PCB gives him ample opportunities to showcase his class once more. He was too good a bowler to be missed

 

[Aman]

I was really shocked by Trent Boult. He's a terrific bowler, and I always imagined that he was the same height as Waqar Younis - pretty much 6 foot dead, which is on the short side for a modern quick bowler.

But as I walked past him I realised that he is a fraction taller than I am but no way is he more than 5 foot 9.

And that is why his economy rate at Brisbane and Perth was so awful, indeed why Southee and Bracewell both looked better than him.

In Australia, you need to be at least 6 foot to stay in the game as a quick bowler when the Kookaburra loses its shine, or you go for 4+ runs per over, every over. You need to bowl a full length, but get enough lift that the batsman doesn't know whether to go forward or back.

Boult was fine at Adelaide because the wicket was so green. But he was too short for the Gabba and the WACA.

And this is relevant to my response to [MENTION=132954]Aman[/MENTION]. The Kiwi attack wasn't particularly optimised for playing in Australia. Pakistan can field a much better suited team for Aussie conditions.

KW is 5'9... Boult is probably around the 5'11-6'1 range.

 

[Aman]

Southee's skill is just limited to swinging it out and the one that holds its line.
he doesnt seam the ball like asif did

Asif had mastered every art of extracting lateral movt.
He could get it to move in the air when he wanted to, both in and out and was probably one of the few exponents of the wobbly seam delivery, which went straight on but moved appreciably off the pitch.

No comparison, really

Yeah, Southee is nowhere near as good as Asif in Tests.

And you're right, Southee is limited to swinging it away or getting a cutter to come back in.

 

[Abid Z]

Asif basically bowled Pakistan to victory in the 2009-10 Sydney Test with Amir out injured. They only lost because key players fixed their defeat - Mazhar Majeed has confessed to this. The Third Test ended up being a farce.

I don't think this is as clear cut as you say. Mm was known to the team then but I've never read anywhere that he fixed the Sydney test. Yes it was suspicious but not proven.

 

[Abid Z]

Amir didn't have the pace in Australia nor the inswinger. Both were developed after that series which is why he was lethal in England later in 2010

 

[Junaids]

I don't think this is as clear cut as you say. Mm was known to the team then but I've never read anywhere that he fixed the Sydney test. Yes it was suspicious but not proven.

Majeed confessed to fixing the Sydney Test.

http://m.smh.com.au/sport/cricket/j...boasts-alleged-matchfixer-20100829-13xlj.html

 

[Stewie]

If that was aimed at me, nobody has ever called me "Bhai" before!
Yes, your batting is a major problem. I was a great admirer of the younger Younis Khan, but I know that Hafeez, Younis and Misbah would be roadkill in Australia next year.

But we know that Salman Butt and Umar Akmal can get Test runs in Australia. We know that Asad Shafiq is fine - he did it in South Africa.

If your selectors have done their homework they will pick a top six of:

1. Ahmed Shehzad
2. Salman Butt
3. Azhar Ali
4. Babar Azam
5. Umar Akmal
6. Asad Shafiq.

They are your only real hope in Australia. Plus a lower middle-order of Sarfraz Ahmed and Mohammad Amir.

Sorry, behn ji, ghalti ho gayi!

 

[axl100mph]

Amir didn't have the pace in Australia nor the inswinger. Both were developed after that series which is why he was lethal in England later in 2010

Lol he bowled at his quickest on that tour with 152.5 being his fastest


Sent from my CHM-U01 using Tapatalk

 

[Junaids]

[MENTION=31509]Abid Z[/MENTION]

The evidence for the Sydney Test being fixed is identical to the evidence that Amir, Asif and Butt bowled no balls to order. It is the same conversation filmed by the News of the World.

So if Amir, Asif and Butt were guilty, it has to be accepted that Sydney was fixed.

And that's where it gets interesting, very interesting.

Because Majeed was clear that Amir (who didn't play), Asif and Butt were not his fixers. They were requested by the newspaper for the later no ball scam because they were the best known players. And Amir didn't play the Sydney Test, while Asif and Butt were both candidates for Man of the Match!

So you are left with the Pakistanis who performed badly as potential suspects. But the Pakistanis who played badly included two players who were always useless on non-Asian tracks (Misbah and Faisal Iqbal), Kamran Akmal and Danish Kaneria, as well as Yousuf's terrible captaincy.

We don't know which players did fix it. But we have Majeed's confession that he earned £1.3 million by fixing the Test.

 

[rhony]

If Pakistan holds on to their catches and if their batting can score 300, we'll have a very interesting series.

 

[Ironcat]

If your selectors have done their homework they will pick a top six of:

1. Ahmed Shehzad
2. Salman Butt
3. Azhar Ali
4. Babar Azam
5. Umar Akmal
6. Asad Shafiq.

They are your only real hope in Australia. Plus a lower middle-order of Sarfraz Ahmed and Mohammad Amir.

I'd be surprised to see if this batting combo scampers to anything more than 200 against the Aussie attack no matter the pitch. If it does on an occasion, it will be most likely due to Azhar or Asad gritting it out. The other 4 are test hacks - though Shehzad can sometimes surprise you.

The combination that has played in most of the last 10 test matches is your best bet. And if Misbah is retired by then, Haris or Babar can be gradually phased in.

 

[Slog]

[MENTION=31509]Abid Z[/MENTION]

The evidence for the Sydney Test being fixed is identical to the evidence that Amir, Asif and Butt bowled no balls to order. It is the same conversation filmed by the News of the World.

So if Amir, Asif and Butt were guilty, it has to be accepted that Sydney was fixed.

And that's where it gets interesting, very interesting.

Because Majeed was clear that Amir (who didn't play), Asif and Butt were not his fixers. They were requested by the newspaper for the later no ball scam because they were the best known players. And Amir didn't play the Sydney Test, while Asif and Butt were both candidates for Man of the Match!

So you are left with the Pakistanis who performed badly as potential suspects. But the Pakistanis who played badly included two players who were always useless on non-Asian tracks (Misbah and Faisal Iqbal), Kamran Akmal and Danish Kaneria, as well as Yousuf's terrible captaincy.

We don't know which players did fix it. But we have Majeed's confession that he earned £1.3 million by fixing the Test.

Ni there is no evidence that Sydney was fixed and Majeed's statement On a hidden camera hardly counts as a confession and certainly not in any court of law.

Majeed's claimed to have fixed the Sydney test when he was selling and negotiating the spot fix for the Lords test. The incident he mentioned was most likely made up in order to increase his worth and credibility in the eyes of the bookies (NOTW in this case.) An off the cut remark where it is obvious that the participant is overselling and overstating his worth and influence cannot be used as an admission of guilt

 

[#GreenRoars]

No doubt if Asif can perform like old Asif, he will be best addition in our squad. But in away conditions, your batsmen should perform if you win the game.

 

[Slog]

If that was aimed at me, nobody has ever called me "Bhai" before!

Yes, your batting is a major problem. I was a great admirer of the younger Younis Khan, but I know that Hafeez, Younis and Misbah would be roadkill in Australia next year.

But we know that Salman Butt and Umar Akmal can get Test runs in Australia. We know that Asad Shafiq is fine - he did it in South Africa.

If your selectors have done their homework they will pick a top six of:

1. Ahmed Shehzad
2. Salman Butt
3. Azhar Ali
4. Babar Azam
5. Umar Akmal
6. Asad Shafiq.

They are your only real hope in Australia. Plus a lower middle-order of Sarfraz Ahmed and Mohammad Amir.

This is a seriously terrible line up and if be highly surprised if they cross 250 more than twice in six innings.

Ahmed Shehzad is a seriously limited batsman and his ability comes down to borderline tailender level when he is playing in pitches with bounce and some pace and if there is a quality bowler coming at him.

Salman Butt averages in the low 30s and this was when he was peak. Do you seriously expect him to be performing after 5 years considering, a) it's harder for batsmen to get back in the groove, b) he wasn't really that good to begin with.

Azhar Ali can grind out some innings and I would expect him to have a couple of good innings and maybe a century but all said and done he is a good batsman but not a great one and can hardly dominate when the guys around him are duds. Just being hardworking and a trier doesn't make you a great batsman in tough conditions

Babar Azam has the requisite skill set it seems but he is struggling to hack it and find some sort of consistency in ODIS in UAE let alone Tests in Australia. Be ready for him to have a Azhar Ali type tour Of England 2010, where he can get some starts and show some baseline skill but not really amount to a whole lot.

Umar Akmal. LOL. It's hard to give a serious reply. You are saying as if he was smashing tons in Aus in 2009/10. No he wasn't. He got some starts and that was that. More importantly that was an Umar Akmal in great form. The Akmal of today is infinitely inferior to him so it's laughable to expect him to score runs.

Asad Shafiq is a great option at number 6 and has done well in UAE, SL and SA. Basically shown ability in tests where he's played but at the end of the day he is not someone who will dominate line ups and does his best when he feeds off others to take the Pakistan score to the next level. He will most likely not get such situations in Aus. Especially his utility comes down a lot when his partners are duds and there is no one to support him. You may expect him to have some decent contributions with the tail but it's not of much use when it gets you from a potent ion 180-200 all out to 230 all out because both are terrible scores

So this potential line up you mentioned is absolutely laughable and ridiculous and it's hard to fathom why you think they have any chance in Aus

 

[zabalestmsm]

They've gone 5 an over against an attack of Steyn and Morkel.

Steyn, when attacked, leaks a lot of runs anyways!

 

[zabalestmsm]

I walked past Trent Boult on a pedestrian crossing on Tuesday night, and was a bit shocked at how short he was - he's only a couple of inches bigger than me.

I would fancy Southee and Boult to do well everywhere - except Australia.

But Asif and Amir are similar to Southee and Boult, but Asif is slightly better than Southee is. And then comes the kicker - Yasir Shah is much, much better than Mark Craig (or Mitchell Santner) and Wahab Riaz has the pace and bounce to be much more dangerous in Australia than Dougie Bracewell (whom I actually like).

Pakistan's attack - if they pick the fixers - is as good as any to tour Australia in modern times. There is no weak link - and it would be strengthened even further if they would pick Irfan.

The issue, as you have rightly identified, is the batting. But Asad Shafiq and Azhar Ali are fine and the thing which will decide whether the batting has a par score of 200 or 300 will be whether Pakistan select the only two current batsmen whose techniques have worked in Tests in Australia - which means Salman Butt and Umar Akmal.

If they pick those two they will be in every match. If they don't, they can't score enough runs in Australian conditions.

Not slightly but much better than Southee!

 

[Abdullah]

[MENTION=31509]Abid Z[/MENTION]

The evidence for the Sydney Test being fixed is identical to the evidence that Amir, Asif and Butt bowled no balls to order. It is the same conversation filmed by the News of the World.

So if Amir, Asif and Butt were guilty, it has to be accepted that Sydney was fixed.

And that's where it gets interesting, very interesting.

Because Majeed was clear that Amir (who didn't play), Asif and Butt were not his fixers. They were requested by the newspaper for the later no ball scam because they were the best known players. And Amir didn't play the Sydney Test, while Asif and Butt were both candidates for Man of the Match!

So you are left with the Pakistanis who performed badly as potential suspects. But the Pakistanis who played badly included two players who were always useless on non-Asian tracks (Misbah and Faisal Iqbal), Kamran Akmal and Danish Kaneria, as well as Yousuf's terrible captaincy.

We don't know which players did fix it. But we have Majeed's confession that he earned £1.3 million by fixing the Test.

Majeed may have been boasting to the notw guys, just to show he was Charlie large.
So its not clear cut

 

[Abdullah]

The key is sticking with the same line ups that play in eng n nz n not change drastically if first 2 tours end in defeat

 

[IAJ]

Even if we restrict Australia to under 200, our batters will not cross 150 against Starc and co.

We can't survive once the ball does something in UAE and you are talking about Australian wickets here. How will our batsmen play bouncers?

Younis Khan, a rubbish puller, has made the bouncers some ego-thing that he just had to play them, and he will get out 9 of 10 times. This will be really tough.

 

[Hawkeye]

Asif is a genius - some of his movements actually defies the laws of physics. I think, he is born with some abnormalities in his wrist, otherwise his away cutters (ball that drifts away from right-handers & cut back sharply off the seam) are impossible to master. I have seen PAK bowlers doing fancy things with old ball, like Imran could swing inwards & then swing away after pitching (right-handers) or Wasim & Waquar could reverse it both ways in air, but a mixture of swing & cut is unique. I have seen the ball of VVS & Ponting (?) at Cape Town (?) several times in slow mo, but no clues yet. I think, Asif is one of those bowlers who could be lethal even at 35 & at 125km speed, particularly in England. At his prime, for few series he was more skillful than Jimmy & more accurate than Styen. In 2010, in 12 Tests in NZ, AUS & ENG, I think he took ~60 wickets, against top 3 of 4 sides in World at their home, and PAK fielders dropped another 20 sitters.....

If AA pair can reach to their level of 2010, backed by Wahab, Yasir, Rahat; PAK 'll be a formidable Test side in UK & down under, as long as the catches are taken. That'll easily be the best Test attack in contemporary world, by some distance.

Good post.

The way Asif moves that special delivery two ways is unbelievable.

It starts to swing and curve away from the right hander before pitching. As soon as it pitches, sharply turns inwards, totally deceiving the batsman, who starts playing for an outswinger, while the delivery comes in and shatters the stumps lol.


Amir, Asif, Wahab, Yasir, Rahat/Irfan . This is the best bowling attack the world will see in recent times.

Probably the best post 2000.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

Good post.

The way Asif moves that special delivery two ways is unbelievable.

It starts to swing and curve away from the right hander before pitching. As soon as it pitches, sharply turns inwards, totally deceiving the batsman, who starts playing for an outswinger, while the delivery comes in and shatters the stumps lol.


Amir, Asif, Wahab, Yasir, Rahat/Irfan . This is the best bowling attack the world will see in recent times.

Probably the best post 2000.

I just was going through some Asif's highlights when i came across this. What a Peach Just watch the dual swing in the delivery.

 

[Hawkeye]

Pakistan's attack - if they pick the fixers - is as good as any to tour Australia in modern times. There is no weak link - and it would be strengthened even further if they would pick Irfan.
.

Haha I just love the way you use this line. ) )

And it's true. It'll be the best Test attack the world has seen post-2000.

 

[Hawkeye]

I just was going through some Asif's highlights when i came across this. What a Peach Just watch the dual swing in the delivery.

THIS.

Shocking man, how is this even possible? This is defying all the laws of physics.

Starts as an outswinger and after hitting the seam nips back in.

I've never seen anyone else do it. Asif is SO SO SO gifted!

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

THIS.

Shocking man, how is this even possible? This is defying all the laws of physics.

Starts as an outswinger and after hitting the seam nips back in.

I've never seen anyone else do it. Asif is SO SO SO gifted!

Also See this one, this is the complete highlights of when we bowled Australia for 88. Just check the delivery Asif bowled to Ponting @ 4:16 Mark. WTH was that I was seeing this game on live TV and the neighbors had to ring our bell to tell me to notch it down a bit. I was screaming like a madman

 

[pacesensation]

Sometimes you severely overrate Pakistan players, and then other times you underrate them. If Asif goes back to how he was 5 years back, you think he is only slightly better than Southee?

i saw your nick and i thought i you should have some of these
enjoy

 

[Zeshan547]

Also See this one, this is the complete highlights of when we bowled Australia for 88. Just check the delivery Asif bowled to Ponting @ 4:16 Mark. WTH was that I was seeing this game on live TV and the neighbors had to ring our bell to tell me to notch it down a bit. I was screaming like a madman

and how can we forget that epic karachi test match where he just made mockery of great indian batting line up in asian conditions and on a pitch where pak scored 599 in second inning. That delivery of to sehwag who was at his peak and the stump reached the keeper kami almost, that was one of ultimate dream sight for a fast bowler, man to this day i can't get over those what ifs, what if he didn't this what he did, he not only made himself suffer but cricket as a game and pak as a team is poorer without an asif.

 

[New Yorker]

Asif is a genius - some of his movements actually defies the laws of physics. I think, he is born with some abnormalities in his wrist, otherwise his away cutters (ball that drifts away from right-handers & cut back sharply off the seam) are impossible to master. I have seen PAK bowlers doing fancy things with old ball, like Imran could swing inwards & then swing away after pitching (right-handers) or Wasim & Waquar could reverse it both ways in air, but a mixture of swing & cut is unique. I have seen the ball of VVS & Ponting (?) at Cape Town (?) several times in slow mo, but no clues yet. I think, Asif is one of those bowlers who could be lethal even at 35 & at 125km speed, particularly in England. At his prime, for few series he was more skillful than Jimmy & more accurate than Styen. In 2010, in 12 Tests in NZ, AUS & ENG, I think he took ~60 wickets, against top 3 of 4 sides in World at their home, and PAK fielders dropped another 20 sitters.....

If AA pair can reach to their level of 2010, backed by Wahab, Yasir, Rahat; PAK 'll be a formidable Test side in UK & down under, as long as the catches are taken. That'll easily be the best Test attack in contemporary world, by some distance.

Yeah, he really was superb. Did anyone see Dobbel's on Cricinfo ask Pietersen, who was the best the bowler he ever faced? Pietersen didn't hesitate for a second.

And after all is said and done, Asif was the only one of the fixers who didn't take money.

I don't know if Pakistan could win a series in Australia, but I'd certainly bet on them winning at least one Test with an attack of Asif, Amir and Yasir plus someone else. And that would be something too.

Sydney was pure robbery; Akmal should have been stood up against a wall and shot.

 

[kassana420]

THIS.

Shocking man, how is this even possible? This is defying all the laws of physics.

Starts as an outswinger and after hitting the seam nips back in.

I've never seen anyone else do it. Asif is SO SO SO gifted!

And he did it at 125kph!
Wow!
Who needs pace when you can do this!?
People who say he might lack pace coming back should watch this, tbh.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

and how can we forget that epic karachi test match where he just made mockery of great indian batting line up in asian conditions and on a pitch where pak scored 599 in second inning. That delivery of to sehwag who was at his peak and the stump reached the keeper kami almost, that was one of ultimate dream sight for a fast bowler, man to this day i can't get over those what ifs, what if he didn't this what he did, he not only made himself suffer but cricket as a game and pak as a team is poorer without an asif.

I still remember that, it was during the winter season and probably the best ball in that spell was to Laxman who was beaten by yet another Asif Special. I think Robin Jackman was on mic and he said something along the lines of 'That stump almost went and impaled K.Akmal...." haha But on a serious note, this guy was / is so gifted I almost get angry when I just count the amount of times he mucked up.

I mean being a genius he was awfully stupid at making the most simple decisions Someone like an Imran would have been an ideal mentor for him who would've made sure he stayed disciplined enough for the sake of everyone.

 

[Haroon786]

Amir and Asif aren't going to win Pakistan a series in Aus, they couldn't do it before and they won't do it now after 5 years away from cricket.

At least they'll avoid a series defeat unlike Boult and Southee.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

Yeah, he really was superb. Did anyone see Dobbel's on Cricinfo ask Pietersen, who was the best the bowler he ever faced? Pietersen didn't hesitate for a second.

And after all is said and done, Asif was the only one of the fixers who didn't take money.

I don't know if Pakistan could win a series in Australia, but I'd certainly bet on them winning at least one Test with an attack of Asif, Amir and Yasir plus someone else. And that would be something too.

Sydney was pure robbery; Akmal should have been stood up against a wall and shot.

Sydney was no less than a heist. Seriously man I'll tell you one personal experience, me, my dad and my kid brother are probably the biggest cricket fanatics my family has ever seen and trust me we sit through even the most painful of drubbings ever handed to us. Yes we sat through the WI loss in 2000/01 and the Mohali Semi Final as well.

When those awful scenes were unfolding in Sydney it was the first time I saw my Dad ever walk away from a Pakistan cricket match. He's a purist and only watches test matches, and believe me I saw real sadness in those eyes. I was a kid when we last won in Australia and here we were on the brink of a historic win and K.Akmal and Yousuf's Captaincy mucking it all up

He just quietly stood up from the couch and went to bed, remember in Pakistan, matches in Australia used to air around 2-3 am at night. At that day I realized what it meant to lose heart as a real fan. I mean I am a very good fan but people like my dad, true and utter devoted fans' hearts were broken that day. I don't know if we ever will get a chance to repeat what we were about to achieve in Sydney 2010

 

[Haroon786]

Could have waited for his first domestic game before making a thread, not sure what the rush was.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Amir avgs 40 plus and Asif avgs 35 plus in Australia.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I just was going through some Asif's highlights when i came across this. What a Peach Just watch the dual swing in the delivery.

I hope you heard the Saffer commentator in that video.

 

[Junaids]

This is a seriously terrible line up and if be highly surprised if they cross 250 more than twice in six innings.

Salman Butt averages in the low 30s and this was when he was peak. Do you seriously expect him to be performing after 5 years considering, a) it's harder for batsmen to get back in the groove, b) he wasn't really that good to begin with.

Umar Akmal. LOL. It's hard to give a serious reply. You are saying as if he was smashing tons in Aus in 2009/10. No he wasn't. He got some starts and that was that. More importantly that was an Umar Akmal in great form. The Akmal of today is infinitely inferior to him so it's laughable to expect him to score runs.

So this potential line up you mentioned is absolutely laughable and ridiculous and it's hard to fathom why you think they have any chance in Aus

My post was specific to playing against Australia.

This is Salman Butt's Test record against Australia:

17 & 9 at Perth in his second ever Test.
70 & 0 at Melbourne where you play next year
108 & 21 at Sydney where you play next year

45 & 33 at Melbourne where you play next year
71 & 21 at Sydney where you play next year
102 & 8 at Hobart

63 & 92 at Lords
45 & 13 at Leeds

That is a brilliant record against Australia, on both bouncy and seaming tracks. Salman Butt clearly has a technique which works against Australian bowling.

As for Umar Akmal, these were his scores in his only series against Australia:

51 & 27 at Melbourne, where you play next year
49 & 49 at Sydney, where you play next year

Don't forget, Umar Akmal hasn't played a Test for nearly half a decade. How can we know whether he can still knuckle down and play Test innings.

For the sake of comparison, here is the record of Misbah-ul-Haq against them outside Asia

MISBAH IN AUSTRALIA

65* & 0 at Melbourne, where you play next year
11 & 0 at Sydney, where you play next year
DROPPED for Hobart

MISBAH IN SOUTH AFRICA IN SIMILAR CONDITIONS
12 & 64 at Johannesburg
0 & 44 at Cape Town
10 & 5 at Centurion

It all reinforces the same point. Against Australia, the first batsman selected should always be Salman Butt.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

I hope you heard the Saffer commentator in that video.

Get your #Facts right, That Saffer commentator is actually a Zimbabwean. It doesn't make the commentary part of the Holy Grail if a Zimbabwean, no offense to him; who probably hasn't seen something like this in his entire cricketing career, gets it incorrect on how the ball deviated in the heat of the moment.

Watch the slow motion for clarity on what I meant, but I know based on how you post, you'll probably miss everything in the video except the remark from the commie on how it was a straight ball. The point is Rameez, who probably has seen bowling of this level during his playing days gets genuinely excited when he sees Asif making a mockery of AB's defense. I am not blaming you but coming from a culture where we really keep high bowling standards, we know what we're talking about just in the case of India's batting strength.

P.S. In this same series Asif made Amla look like a fool when he bowled him with a peach in dipper which Amla was leaving of line. That's the amount of shape in he got using the red cherry. There was a reason why KP without even hesitating stated Asif as the most difficult bowler he faced in internationals.

 

[kassana420]

I hope you heard the Saffer commentator in that video.

It was clearly looking like an out swinger but came back at the last moment.
Perhaps, the commentator was more disappointed in his shot selection.
If the ball would have been straight, it would have been a boundary down the ground.

 

[cricketjoshila]

It was clearly looking like an out swinger but came back at the last moment.
Perhaps, the commentator was more disappointed in his shot selection.
If the ball would have been straight, it would have been a boundary down the ground.

cricket commentators watching the match live and slow mo must be knowing nothing.The ball came with the angle nothing like dual swing as the poster said not is it defying laws of physics.

This is dual swing and magical bowling.

 

[Slog]

I hope you heard the Saffer commentator in that video.

He's Zimbabwean and his understanding is poor

Let's be honest here. Asif was a great bowler and more skilled than any pace bowler India has produced so give credit where credit is due. Purely Skills wise I would say he is 2nd best Pakistani fast bowler after Wasim.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

cricket commentators watching the match live and slow mo must be knowing nothing.The ball came with the angle nothing like dual swing as the poster said not is it defying laws of physics.

This is dual swing and magical bowling.

Countering my argument with a Cute Wasim vintage video won't make me back up on my stance. I know dual swing when I see it and for all the greatness Wasim has in him (Bowling Wise) I sometimes feel that Asif was more gifted and could make the ball talk better than anyone at least I've seen in my life.

And Yes I have seen Wasim, Waqar, Shoaib, Zahid in the 90s as well.

 

[cricketjoshila]

He's Zimbabwean and his understanding is poor

Let's be honest here. Asif was a great bowler and more skilled than any pace bowler India has produced so give credit where credit is due. Purely Skills wise I would say he is 2nd best Pakistani fast bowler after Wasim.

Great bowler.LOL.That word thrown around co cavalierly when describing Pakistanis on PP that its nauseating.The Zimbabwean is a former international cricketer and a cricket commentator,his understanding of cricket is far more than all posters of PP put together.

I am glad that India doesnt have any players with exceptional cheating skills of Asif.Be it steroids,carrying drugs or fixing matches.A man accomplishing all 3 in such a short career.

And please dont insult legendary Pakistani bowlers from Khan Mohammad to Shoaib Akhtar who gave cricket fans round the world the joy of watching quality fast bowling,by comparing them with Asif.

 

[kassana420]

cricket commentators watching the match live and slow mo must be knowing nothing.The ball came with the angle nothing like dual swing as the poster said not is it defying laws of physics.

This is dual swing and magical bowling.

Why is it so hard for you to believe anyways?
There is another example, in post#54 btw, the ball to ricky ponting at 4:16.

 

[Amjid Javed]

Interesting to see how Asif goes on his comeback, if hes anywhere near the bowler he was and makes a comeback to the side he could be a vital bowler in english and new zealand conditions for test matches as he could do damage to the opposition.

 

[Slog]

Great bowler.LOL.That word thrown around co cavalierly when describing Pakistanis on PP that its nauseating.The Zimbabwean is a former international cricketer and a cricket commentator,his understanding of cricket is far more than all posters of PP put together.

I am glad that India doesnt have any players with exceptional cheating skills of Asif.Be it steroids,carrying drugs or fixing matches.A man accomplishing all 3 in such a short career.

And please dont insult legendary Pakistani bowlers from Khan Mohammad to Shoaib Akhtar who gave cricket fans round the world the joy of watching quality fast bowling,by comparing them with Asif.

I am talking on purely skills. Stop being sore Joshila Bhai. Even Kevin Pietersen and James Anderson have said that Asif is the most skilled bowler they have seen. So give him respect.

I am just admiring his bowling skills which ought to be admired. As a cricketer and person I detest him but on a pure skill level he is superior to anyone you guys have had

 

[cricketjoshila]

Countering my argument with a Cute Wasim vintage video won't make me back up on my stance. I know dual swing when I see it and for all the greatness Wasim has in him (Bowling Wise) I sometimes feel that Asif was more gifted and could make the ball talk better than anyone at least I've seen in my life.

And Yes I have seen Wasim, Waqar, Shoaib, Zahid in the 90s as well.

I am not bothered about your stance,You can claim your cousin is the best bowler of all times.The reality of the ball was very well explained by the commentator.

 

[cricketjoshila]

I am talking on purely skills. Stop being sore Joshila Bhai. Even Kevin Pietersen and James Anderson have said that Asif is the most skilled bowler they have seen. So give him respect.

I am just admiring his bowling skills which ought to be admired. As a cricketer and person I detest him but on a pure skill level he is superior to anyone you guys have had

Sore for what?Not having a Asif like character in my country.I am glad we dont have him.It doesnt matter how much skills you have if all you do is cheat.

 

[Slog]

Sore for what?Not having a Asif like character in my country.I am glad we dont have him.It doesnt matter how much skills you have if all you do is cheat.

You guys do have characters like him (minus the cricketing ability ) so get off your high horse. Heck you even elect them to represent your population in the national parliaments (Azharuddin) so in a way it's even worse.

 

[cricketjoshila]

You guys do have characters like him (minus the cricketing ability ) so get off your high horse. Heck you even elect them to represent your population in the national parliaments (Azharuddin) so in a way it's even worse.

1.Azharuddin was acquitted by courts as there was no proof againist him.So first get your facts right.

2.Asif was convicted of felony jailed in UK.Was suspended earlier for steroids.Was caught in Dubai carrying drugs and was in jail before Pak Govt bailed him out but not before he was banned from entering UAE.I wonder which Indian cricketer has such a wonderful resume.

 

[tahir_dj]

O god
Only ones who have problem the most are sore indians..

Its simple if you dont like them dont follow them.

No one is forcing you to watch them play
And as things stands there wont be any Pak ind series.
So no one is forcing you to watch or follow Pak cricket

 

[kassana420]

1.Azharuddin was acquitted by courts as there was no proof againist him.So first get your facts right.

2.Asif was convicted of felony jailed in UK.Was suspended earlier for steroids.Was caught in Dubai carrying drugs and was in jail before Pak Govt bailed him out but not before he was banned from entering UAE.I wonder which Indian cricketer has such a wonderful resume.

Sreesanth comes to mind.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Sreesanth comes to mind.

Sreesanth was banned for steroids?Caught with drugs?When?