Gen Asim Munir takes over as Pakistan's 17th COAS

[HalBass9]

So if I'm outdated, tell me what the truth is .. specifically with regards to Pak Army and India.

I just told you that.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

'Disagree' is such a casual word. Normal human beings would call him a total disgrace to the country and to the uniform for all that he has done and the lives he has ruined, yet here you are approvingly calling him a professional. So weird.

Just a few weeks ago, @Major was telling everyone how the Pak army is just misunderstood by everybody and really has noble intentions.

The khaki brainwashing on the people of Pakistan is unreal.

@Major doesn't represent the whole of Pakistan any more than you represent BJP. What is your broader point? You think the Pakistan generals are deliberately taking their country down a path to poverty and debt?

 

[RexRex]

@Major doesn't represent the whole of Pakistan any more than you represent BJP. What is your broader point? You think the Pakistan generals are deliberately taking their country down a path to poverty and debt?

I can only go by Pakistan's historical actions towards India. If Pak's generals have done it before, I don't see why they can't do it again. The paranoia is justified to an extent.

You are assuming that these generals are rationals actors that care about the country rather than a self-serving cabal. I think it is the latter. Btw I've noticed a couple of other pak posters have said the same.Their theoryis the army is losing popularity in the country due to domestic politics and needed this little adventure. At the end of the day, tis all speculation.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I can only go by Pakistan's historical actions towards India. If Pak's generals have done it before, I don't see why they can't do it again. The paranoia is justified to an extent.

You are assuming that these generals are rationals actors that care about the country rather than a self-serving cabal. I think it is the latter. Btw I've noticed a couple of other pak posters have said the same.Their theoryis the army is losing popularity in the country due to domestic politics and needed this little adventure. At the end of the day, tis all speculation.

Most Pakistan posters agree that the army is self-serving, that is the nature of just about any organisation other than voluntary charity groups. But why would making the country progressively poorer and debt ridden serve their own interests? Why would they not use their power to create harmonious relations with neighbours and take their cut from a prosperous position? In fact they are already doing this for some time with China.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

No, you’re wrong. Again. And I get it, you want it to be true, because it’s what you’ve been conditioned to believe over the years. That’s not truth, it’s just human nature clinging to outdated comfort.

Tbh I don't think he is off the mark by much. It's a fair assessment of large sections of the population.

 

[HalBass9]

Tbh I don't think he is off the mark by much. It's a fair assessment of large sections of the population.

I'm not disputing his assessment, many have made similar points. But suggesting that the Pakistani Army enjoys automatic public support just because of the India Pakistan narrative, and that this would suddenly translate into support for General Asim Munir, is a flawed and oversimplified conclusion.

If India were to attack, yes, Pakistanis would stand behind those defending the country. That’s patriotism, not a vote of confidence in a specific individual or institution.

If India genuinely wants to strengthen its narrative, it should focus on presenting credible evidence, particularly if it involves Asim Munir. That would do far more to widen the already growing gap between the military and the public in Pakistan than empty rhetoric or escalatory moves.

And let’s be honest, the vast majority of Pakistanis aren't looking for conflict over Kashmir. Even the most popular leader in recent years couldn’t mobilize nationwide support after the abrogation of Article 370. That should tell you something.

 

[RexRex]

Why would they not use their power to create harmonious relations with neighbours and take their cut from a prosperous position?

That is the million dollar question. And pakistanis should have asked their army that question in 1965, 1971 and 1999. All those wars were irrational and served no purpose. We established the case they don't act logically.

The obvious answer for yesterday's incident imo is that the khakis are afraid to walk away from a formula that has served them well for 60 years - which is keeping the Kashmir issue alive.

 

[Major]

@Major doesn't represent the whole of Pakistan any more than you represent BJP. What is your broader point? You think the Pakistan generals are deliberately taking their country down a path to poverty and debt?

Major is one of the few guys that live in the country and knows the political system better than the overseas lot.

The establishment protects the country for the long run, whether anyone likes this or not.

 

[LordJames]

That is the million dollar question. And pakistanis should have asked their army that question in 1965, 1971 and 1999. All those wars were irrational and served no purpose. We established the case they don't act logically.

The obvious answer for yesterday's incident imo is that the khakis are afraid to walk away from a formula that has served them well for 60 years - which is keeping the Kashmir issue alive.

The opposite is actually true, the Generals in Pakistan Army would like nothing more then to get rid of Kashmir issue and if they could they would give it to India.

Remember that the first CIC of Pakistan refused to obey the commands of Muhammad Ali Jinnah and take the troops into Kashmir and then Ayub Khan didn't take advantage of Indian vulnerability in 1962.

The Generals of Pakistani Army are self centered, obtuse and cowards (bar from a few) and if they are patriotic to the country they don't have the vision. Kargil was a bad true without the involvement of PAF and Armour/Artillery Corps of Pakistan Army because India turned the tide in Kargil using IAF and Bofors and any plan should have anticipated that reaction from India.

With the combined might of PAF, Pakistan Army and Chinese (in Ladakh) Kargil would have been a game changer...It wasn't because it was stupidly planned.

 

[Farhan The Man]

The obvious answer for yesterday's incident imo is that the khakis are afraid to walk away from a formula that has served them well for 60 years - which is keeping the Kashmir issue alive.

You hit the nail.

Anti-army sentiment in pakistan deserved shock and awe. Mission accomplished with this incident.

A few shaheeds here and there, followed up with ISPR propaganda, more defence budget. To come next.

 

[IAJ]

You hit the nail.

Anti-army sentiment in pakistan deserved shock and awe. Mission accomplished with this incident.

A few shaheeds here and there, followed up with ISPR propaganda, more defence budget. To come next.

Things have changed. The public wont buy this anymore.

 

[Farhan The Man]

Things have changed. The public wont buy this anymore.

Public doesn't care. Either way.

Sentiment in karachi is meh. We didn't do it. Establishment did it. Like they always do.

No one dares raise their voice though. In front of a gun.

 

[shortbread]

Such a conflict was inevitable so they must be prepared, there's no excuse. Time for Munir & Co to prove why they're paid the big bucks and enjoy the power, the privileges that they do. Once successful against the enemy, overnight he'll transform himself into a national hero.

 

[Bewal Express]

Such a conflict was inevitable so they must be prepared, there's no excuse. Time for Munir & Co to prove why they're paid the big bucks and enjoy the power, the privileges that they do. Once successful against the enemy, overnight he'll transform himself into a national hero.

There is a school of thought that Modi and PK mafia have deliberately created this crisis to make the Junta popular. Lest we forget that Ind fully backed the coup against IK, along Biden and Co.

 

[Kianig89]

And whoever does that in aggression and injustice - then We will drive him into a Fire. And that, for Allah, is [always] easy. NISA 30"

Say, "O my people, work according to your position; [for] indeed, I am working. And you are going to know who will have succession in the home. Indeed, the wrongdoers will not succeed. Anaam 135".

And never think that Allah is unaware of what the wrongdoers do. He only delays them for a Day when eyes will stare [in horror]. Ibrahim 42".

Everything got diverted for Hafiz sb, from crushing PTI to now having stressful times trying to judge India's move. Ironic two of his biggest beneficiary MN and NS are completely deaf and dum.

What if India attacked at large scale to Pak, will Coas go all out and risk a big escalation.??

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

That is the million dollar question. And pakistanis should have asked their army that question in 1965, 1971 and 1999. All those wars were irrational and served no purpose. We established the case they don't act logically.

The obvious answer for yesterday's incident imo is that the khakis are afraid to walk away from a formula that has served them well for 60 years - which is keeping the Kashmir issue alive.

In 1965 and 1971 Pakistan was arguably doing better financially than India, and either case they did not launch a war with India, in 1971 India was the one which directly jumped in to take advantage of the dispute between east and west Pakistan.

You cannot just keep referring back to history as your justification, otherwise you are saying India is right every time, and Pakistan by default is at fault.

Each new incident needs to be judged on it's own merit. Unless you are saying that we must be biased right from the outset towards India.

 

[shortbread]

COAS has been noticeably absent in public discourse, very silent.

 

[Hitman]

COAS has been noticeably absent in public discourse, very silent.

I've been hearing over X that he isn't in Pakistan.

 

[Bhaijaan]

COAS has been noticeably absent in public discourse, very silent.

He’s not absent.
He went to Turkey to complete his PhD on Hard State.

 

[shortbread]

I've been hearing over X that he isn't in Pakistan.

He’s not absent.
He went to Turkey to complete his PhD on Hard State.

Untrue, simply Indian bots on overdrive.

Leaving the country now, Zero chances! He'll lose the respect of his men.

 

[Hitman]

Untrue, simply Indian bots on overdrive.

Leaving the country now, Zero chances! He'll lose the respect of his men.

I don't know the reality so I'd rather not speak much.

 

[Kianig89]

Gen sb show up , some PP posters want it.

Regardless of whatever happens right or wrong , Gen sb is a very tough nut and man on mission . He is a Piffer

 

[Bhaijaan]

Gen sb show up , some PP posters want it.

Regardless of whatever happens right or wrong , Gen sb is a very tough nut and man on mission . He is a Piffer

Murd-e-Momin

 

[ChennaiFan]

And whoever does that in aggression and injustice - then We will drive him into a Fire. And that, for Allah, is [always] easy. NISA 30"

Say, "O my people, work according to your position; [for] indeed, I am working. And you are going to know who will have succession in the home. Indeed, the wrongdoers will not succeed. Anaam 135".

And never think that Allah is unaware of what the wrongdoers do. He only delays them for a Day when eyes will stare [in horror]. Ibrahim 42".

Everything got diverted for Hafiz sb, from crushing PTI to now having stressful times trying to judge India's move. Ironic two of his biggest beneficiary MN and NS are completely deaf and dum.

What if India attacked at large scale to Pak, will Coas go all out and risk a big escalation.??

1. Who decides that someone is aggressive and had done injustice? What one thinks as injustice is not injustice in another person's view. That is why we have courts.
2. If the religion advises to drive the subject into fire, can the follower disregard the rules of the law and order of the land and just follow what the religion tells him?

 

[Kianig89]

1. Who decides that someone is aggressive and had done injustice? What one thinks as injustice is not injustice in another person's view. That is why we have courts.
2. If the religion advises to drive the subject into fire, can the follower disregard the rules of the law and order of the land and just follow what the religion tells him?

You follow your religion I will follow mine , end of story.

 

[ChennaiFan]

You follow your religion I will follow mine , end of story.

That is fair. However, I still believe religious advice like the above can sometimes be exploited by the preachers and make the vulnerable youth adopt a path of violence.

 

[Bhaijaan]

He back

https://twitter.com/x/status/1917525236486136080

 

[RexRex]

He back

https://twitter.com/x/status/1917525236486136080

They're probably rolling out old footage to keep up the khaki morale in these stressful times; not good PR to let the Indians know he's fled for his life !

 

[Greenstorm]

There is a school of thought that Modi and PK mafia have deliberately created this crisis to make the Junta popular. Lest we forget that Ind fully backed the coup against IK, along Biden and Co.

I thought about this too but India has not gained much from this incident so far and seem startled in their response. I think they were caught off guard.

Indian strategy has been to do whatever they can in Pakistan and not letting Pakistan respond. They have been targetting key personnel in Pakistan in addition to their activities in Balochistan. Pakistani generals have made massive blunders in KP and Balochistan to make people hostile but such organized attack on the same day (this was before train incident) cannot be carried out by mountain tribals without foreign (Indian) backing. Now whenever such an incident took place in India, they have created a lot of hoopla and tried to mount international pressure on Pakistan essentially telling us that Pakistan cannot play *** for tat. Munir has called their bluff.

Asim Munir is not Bajwa, he has actually doubled down against Indians which is surpurising for me considering the kind of pull India has in Washington.

India and its friend Nawaz deserves it for appointing a retired guy as COAS just because they couldn't see Imran Khan leading Pakistan to a democratic prosperous state. Now we have two madmen in Modi and Munir at the helm. I am positively surpurised by Munir's approach towards India. If only he had the vision and foresight to remove military from political affairs and to release the most popular leader of Pakistan from jail.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Rumours that 100s of Indian soldiers deserted their posts and ran after seeing General Munir peer down at them over the LOC.

@Devadwal any confirmation on the above from your side please?

 

[Bewal Express]

I thought about this too but India has not gained much from this incident so far and seem startled in their response. I think they were caught off guard.

Indian strategy has been to do whatever they can in Pakistan and not letting Pakistan respond. They have been targetting key personnel in Pakistan in addition to their activities in Balochistan. Pakistani generals have made massive blunders in KP and Balochistan to make people hostile but such organized attack on the same day (this was before train incident) cannot be carried out by mountain tribals without foreign (Indian) backing. Now whenever such an incident took place in India, they have created a lot of hoopla and tried to mount international pressure on Pakistan essentially telling us that Pakistan cannot play *** for tat. Munir has called their bluff.

Asim Munir is not Bajwa, he has actually doubled down against Indians which is surpurising for me considering the kind of pull India has in Washington.

India and its friend Nawaz deserves it for appointing a retired guy as COAS just because they couldn't see Imran Khan leading Pakistan to a democratic prosperous state. Now we have two madmen in Modi and Munir at the helm. I am positively surpurised by Munir's approach towards India. If only he had the vision and foresight to remove military from political affairs and to release the most popular leader of Pakistan from jail.

I am not convinced. Munir cannot survive for long if what you say is true. The Inds and the Israelis pretty much control our elite through the Americans and Saudis. Munir and co spent 4 hours doing PowerPoint Presentations( to the Americans elected reps)on Why IK is a danger to America and regional security. The other thing very important is how Important China is to our security, regional peace and keeping Balance against a nutty, fascist govt run by demagogues in India. Let's see how this pans out

 

[JaDed]

Rumours that 100s of Indian soldiers deserted their posts and ran after seeing General Munir peer down at them over the LOC.

@Devadwal any confirmation on the above from your side please?

Don’t confuse Imran Khan with Indian soldiers.

 

[Bewal Express]

Don’t confuse Imran Khan with Indian soldiers.

When has IK deserted anything? Where were these brave Inds soldiers when the Chinese Skirmish broke out.

 

[JaDed]

When has IK deserted anything? Where were these brave Inds soldiers when the Chinese Skirmish broke out.

They were there and died.

 

[LordJames]

I am not convinced. Munir cannot survive for long if what you say is true. The Inds and the Israelis pretty much control our elite through the Americans and Saudis. Munir and co spent 4 hours doing PowerPoint Presentations( to the Americans elected reps)on Why IK is a danger to America and regional security. The other thing very important is how Important China is to our security, regional peace and keeping Balance against a nutty, fascist govt run by demagogues in India. Let's see how this pans out

I thought about this too but India has not gained much from this incident so far and seem startled in their response. I think they were caught off guard.

Indian strategy has been to do whatever they can in Pakistan and not letting Pakistan respond. They have been targetting key personnel in Pakistan in addition to their activities in Balochistan. Pakistani generals have made massive blunders in KP and Balochistan to make people hostile but such organized attack on the same day (this was before train incident) cannot be carried out by mountain tribals without foreign (Indian) backing. Now whenever such an incident took place in India, they have created a lot of hoopla and tried to mount international pressure on Pakistan essentially telling us that Pakistan cannot play *** for tat. Munir has called their bluff.

Asim Munir is not Bajwa, he has actually doubled down against Indians which is surpurising for me considering the kind of pull India has in Washington.

India and its friend Nawaz deserves it for appointing a retired guy as COAS just because they couldn't see Imran Khan leading Pakistan to a democratic prosperous state. Now we have two madmen in Modi and Munir at the helm. I am positively surpurised by Munir's approach towards India. If only he had the vision and foresight to remove military from political affairs and to release the most popular leader of Pakistan from jail.

Munir is not Bajwa—but like many of his predecessors in the Pakistan establishment, he’s highly skilled at spotting an opportunity and using it to serve his own interests. Remember the nickname he earned (aka The Deceiver)? It didn’t come without reason.

While the Pakistan Army may not be directly behind the recent events—whether it’s local Kashmiris or another actor—Modi has boxed himself into a corner. With Hindutva pressure mounting, he has little choice but to escalate through kinetic action. Munir, sensing the winds, likely sees this as his chance: if he can deliver a “befitting response” to India and present himself as the mastermind, it could turn his political fortunes around. All the criticism and oppression associated with him would be drowned in a wave of nationalist euphoria.

Like those before him, Asim Munir lacks the strategic depth for long-term planning. He would rather sacrifice parts of his country than step down from his ego-driven perch.

I believe India has already prepared for limited strikes—possibly with the knowledge and tacit approval of the U.S. and other allies. These powers may have already warned Pakistan and urged them to absorb it without retaliating. But Munir is unlikely to comply—not out of duty or patriotism, but for self-interest. Just as Modi’s actions will also be driven by personal and political gain.

Ultimately, the ordinary people of India and Pakistan are trapped between two narcissists playing dangerous games with national pride.

 

[Bewal Express]

Don’t confuse Imran Khan with Indian soldiers.

So if that is the case why didn't Ind teach China a lesson. Surely a brave nation would teach a country equal its own size and population a lesson.

 

[JaDed]

So if that is the case why didn't Ind teach China a lesson. Surely a brave nation would teach a country equal its own size and population a lesson.

What lesson, Chinese are better than India on most fronts.

 

[JaDed]

So if that is the case why didn't Ind teach China a lesson. Surely a brave nation would teach a country equal its own size and population a lesson.

You quoted the wrong post, so if you are asking why Indian soldiers can’t teach Munir a lesson it’s because Munir is so great thag neither Modi Xi , Imran, Trump anyone can do anything against the legend.

Munir the hero of Pakistan, who has “positively” surprised everyone @Greenstorm

 

[Bewal Express]

You quoted the wrong post, so if you are asking why Indian soldiers can’t teach Munir a lesson it’s because Munir is so great thag neither Modi Xi , Imran, Trump anyone can do anything against the legend.

Munir the hero of Pakistan, who has “positively” surprised everyone @Greenstorm

He isn't a hero to me or to the millions that have seen him destroy PK constitution and kill innocent people

 

[KingKhanWC]

Munir is not Bajwa—but like many of his predecessors in the Pakistan establishment, he’s highly skilled at spotting an opportunity and using it to serve his own interests. Remember the nickname he earned (aka The Deceiver)? It didn’t come without reason.

While the Pakistan Army may not be directly behind the recent events—whether it’s local Kashmiris or another actor—Modi has boxed himself into a corner. With Hindutva pressure mounting, he has little choice but to escalate through kinetic action. Munir, sensing the winds, likely sees this as his chance: if he can deliver a “befitting response” to India and present himself as the mastermind, it could turn his political fortunes around. All the criticism and oppression associated with him would be drowned in a wave of nationalist euphoria.

Like those before him, Asim Munir lacks the strategic depth for long-term planning. He would rather sacrifice parts of his country than step down from his ego-driven perch.

I believe India has already prepared for limited strikes—possibly with the knowledge and tacit approval of the U.S. and other allies. These powers may have already warned Pakistan and urged them to absorb it without retaliating. But Munir is unlikely to comply—not out of duty or patriotism, but for self-interest. Just as Modi’s actions will also be driven by personal and political gain.

Ultimately, the ordinary people of India and Pakistan are trapped between two narcissists playing dangerous games with national pride.

Good points.

Imo Munir is arrogant and narcissistic who wants to leave a mark or legacy . The Americans don't really want any real armed conflict as they atm control both nations with these in charge across both borders. I feel india is attempting to copy Israeli policies, suspending water treaties , calling of boycotts leading to economic issues etc Not much any specific mention of surgical strikes as they previously did. Modi has hardliners who will be pushing him and Munir will welcome any attacks for the reasons you mentioned. Previously PAF locked on to indian bases as response but now they will hit under his command.

What might be an interesting turn if Sharifs fall out with Munir if military attacks escalate rapidly. An unlikely but real danger if something does kick off. I dont think these madmen will get thr opportunity.

 

[LordJames]

Good points.

Imo Munir is arrogant and narcissistic who wants to leave a mark or legacy . The Americans don't really want any real armed conflict as they atm control both nations with these in charge across both borders. I feel india is attempting to copy Israeli policies, suspending water treaties , calling of boycotts leading to economic issues etc Not much any specific mention of surgical strikes as they previously did. Modi has hardliners who will be pushing him and Munir will welcome any attacks for the reasons you mentioned. Previously PAF locked on to indian bases as response but now they will hit under his command.

What might be an interesting turn if Sharifs fall out with Munir if military attacks escalate rapidly. An unlikely but real danger if something does kick off. I dont think these madmen will get thr opportunity.

Surgical strike is an "Israeli concept" where IAF (Israeli Air force) destroyed Royal Egyptian Air Force (REAF) in June 1967 but IAF (Indian Air force) is no IAF (Israeli Air force) and PAF is certainly no Royal Egyptian Air Force (REAF)

 

[KingKhanWC]

Surgical strike is an "Israeli concept" where IAF (Israeli Air force) destroyed Royal Egyptian Air Force (REAF) in June 1967 but IAF (Indian Air force) is no IAF (Israeli Air force) and PAF is certainly no Royal Egyptian Air Force (REAF)

Since the late 90s when Ariel Sharon met with BJP/RSS government, Indian strategy, thinking and propaganda have been aligned to israeli . Making theft of land via laws legal, media , movies and bringing in religion . What most ignorant indians are unaware of is , Israel would
love an all out war , even nuclear between the two. They don't care for brown idol worshipping people, as they see them.

 

[HalBass9]

Munir is not Bajwa—but like many of his predecessors in the Pakistan establishment, he’s highly skilled at spotting an opportunity and using it to serve his own interests. Remember the nickname he earned (aka The Deceiver)? It didn’t come without reason.

While the Pakistan Army may not be directly behind the recent events—whether it’s local Kashmiris or another actor—Modi has boxed himself into a corner. With Hindutva pressure mounting, he has little choice but to escalate through kinetic action. Munir, sensing the winds, likely sees this as his chance: if he can deliver a “befitting response” to India and present himself as the mastermind, it could turn his political fortunes around. All the criticism and oppression associated with him would be drowned in a wave of nationalist euphoria.

Like those before him, Asim Munir lacks the strategic depth for long-term planning. He would rather sacrifice parts of his country than step down from his ego-driven perch.

I believe India has already prepared for limited strikes—possibly with the knowledge and tacit approval of the U.S. and other allies. These powers may have already warned Pakistan and urged them to absorb it without retaliating. But Munir is unlikely to comply—not out of duty or patriotism, but for self-interest. Just as Modi’s actions will also be driven by personal and political gain.

Ultimately, the ordinary people of India and Pakistan are trapped between two narcissists playing dangerous games with national pride.

No matter who’s in power, elected, selected, or installed, Pakistanis simply won’t absorb Indian aggression without a response. That’s not just about military posture, it's about national psyche. We saw it in 2019, even when the chips were down, the pressure to respond was immense. Because every time India crosses a line, it forces a reaction, and that inherently shifts the regional balance, even if just slightly, and even if Pakistan isn't in a position of strength.

But the deeper issue is how both the military and politicians have, over the years, inflated India’s image into something monolithic, sometimes for fear, sometimes for leverage. Take Nawaz Sharif, for example, lining up at Modi’s coronation like it was a royal wedding. That wasn’t diplomacy, it was political theater. He could’ve sent a foreign secretary. Instead, he handed Modi a photo-op on a silver platter, and set the tone for Pakistan appearing smaller than it is.

That’s not strategy. That’s a credibility problem.

 

[LordJames]

No matter who’s in power, elected, selected, or installed, Pakistanis simply won’t absorb Indian aggression without a response. That’s not just about military posture, it's about national psyche. We saw it in 2019, even when the chips were down, the pressure to respond was immense. Because every time India crosses a line, it forces a reaction, and that inherently shifts the regional balance, even if just slightly, and even if Pakistan isn't in a position of strength.

But the deeper issue is how both the military and politicians have, over the years, inflated India’s image into something monolithic, sometimes for fear, sometimes for leverage. Take Nawaz Sharif, for example, lining up at Modi’s coronation like it was a royal wedding. That wasn’t diplomacy, it was political theater. He could’ve sent a foreign secretary. Instead, he handed Modi a photo-op on a silver platter, and set the tone for Pakistan appearing smaller than it is.

That’s not strategy. That’s a credibility problem.

I hope so...

People of Pakistan are stuck between a rock and hard place.

1. If the retaliation against India is successful, Asim Munir gets a new lease on life to continue his human right abuses
2. If retaliation against India isn't successful or doesn't happen then a "new normal" is established by India

The most prudent course of action and win-win for Pakistan is to release Imran Khan and let him lead the Nation at this hour and let the military do its professional job but that will be death of Pakistan Army domination in Pakistan so Asim Munir and other generals won't do that.

Since the late 90s when Ariel Sharon met with BJP/RSS government, Indian strategy, thinking and propaganda have been aligned to israeli . Making theft of land via laws legal, media , movies and bringing in religion . What most ignorant indians are unaware of is , Israel would
love an all out war , even nuclear between the two. They don't care for brown idol worshipping people, as they see them.

Israeli tactics have limited success in Kashmir but much of it won't work against Pakistan.

Israel hasn't even won against Hamas despite all its barbarity and not fought a conventional war for decades and would have lost in 1973 if US hadn't come to its aid.

 

[HalBass9]

I hope so...

People of Pakistan are stuck between a rock and hard place.

1. If the retaliation against India is successful, Asim Munir gets a new lease on life to continue his human right abuses
2. If retaliation against India isn't successful or doesn't happen then a "new normal" is established by India

The most prudent course of action and win-win for Pakistan is to release Imran Khan and let him lead the Nation at this hour and let the military do its professional job but that will be death of Pakistan Army domination in Pakistan so Asim Munir and other generals won't do that.



Israeli tactics have limited success in Kashmir but much of it won't work against Pakistan.

Israel hasn't even won against Hamas despite all its barbarity and not fought a conventional war for decades and would have lost in 1973 if US hadn't come to its aid.

Asim Munir wasn’t going anywhere, he was comfortably seated for his full term, and probably the next, as long as he could keep the economy from completely collapsing. That’s all it takes, not reform, not democracy, just enough stability for people to stay distracted and disengaged.

Pakistanis weren’t out on the streets en masse demanding democracy before this latest escalation, and they won’t be after either. The mandate was stolen in broad daylight, and the reaction? None. The military owns the narrative where it counts the institutions, and the airwaves.

 

[RexRex]

Take Nawaz Sharif, for example, lining up at Modi’s coronation like it was a royal wedding. That wasn’t diplomacy, it was political theater. He could’ve sent a foreign secretary. Instead, he handed Modi a photo-op on a silver platter, and set the tone for Pakistan appearing smaller than it is.

That’s not strategy. That’s a credibility problem.

You're upset that Nawaz Sharif went to India to forge good relations with a newly elected leader ? What kind of oversized ego do you have that you are affected by such trivial things ? I thought it was a nice gesture by NS, and if I recall correctly Modi in return went to Pakistan next year for Sharif's birthday. Or something like that.

Lot of Pakistanis have a delusional sense of pride that I've never understood. Maybe it's all the cricket matches you beat us at in the 90s, that's got to your head.

 

[cricketfan24]

You're upset that Nawaz Sharif went to India to forge good relations with a newly elected leader ? What kind of oversized ego do you have that you are affected by such trivial things ? I thought it was a nice gesture by NS, and if I recall correctly Modi in return went to Pakistan next year for Sharif's birthday. Or something like that.

Lot of Pakistanis have a delusional sense of pride that I've never understood. Maybe it's all the cricket matches you beat us at in the 90s, that's got to your head.

There is a group in Pakistan, known as PTI, that opposes peaceful relations with neighbouring countries. This same group supported the violent events of May 9th in Pakistan and refers to Osama Bin Laden as a 'martyr.'

However, it is important to note that the vast majority of Pakistanis do not support this extremist ideology or align themselves with such a cult-like mindset.

 

[HalBass9]

You're upset that Nawaz Sharif went to India to forge good relations with a newly elected leader ? What kind of oversized ego do you have that you are affected by such trivial things ? I thought it was a nice gesture by NS, and if I recall correctly Modi in return went to Pakistan next year for Sharif's birthday. Or something like that.

Lot of Pakistanis have a delusional sense of pride that I've never understood. Maybe it's all the cricket matches you beat us at in the 90s, that's got to your head.

No Sir, I am not upset, I am all for to forge good relations with its neighbors. But Pakistan is neither Maldives nor Nepal.

 

[HalBass9]

There is a group in Pakistan, known as PTI, that opposes peaceful relations with neighbouring countries. This same group supported the violent events of May 9th in Pakistan and refers to Osama Bin Laden as a 'martyr.'

However, it is important to note that the vast majority of Pakistanis do not support this extremist ideology or align themselves with such a cult-like mindset.

If Imran Khan had been in office during Modi’s first swearing in, he wouldn’t have been lining up like a fanboy at a meet and greet. He would’ve followed diplomatic protocol and sent a trusted senior minister, maintaining dignity without turning it into a spectacle.

What Nawaz Sharif did wasn’t statesmanship, it was optics driven appeasement. Getting in line with other SAARC leaders just to shake hands might’ve played well on Indian TV, but back home, it sent the wrong message, that Pakistan was eager to please, not engage as an equal. That’s not diplomacy, that’s deference. And it cost us more than just a photo op.

 

[KingKhanWC]

I hope so...

People of Pakistan are stuck between a rock and hard place.

1. If the retaliation against India is successful, Asim Munir gets a new lease on life to continue his human right abuses
2. If retaliation against India isn't successful or doesn't happen then a "new normal" is established by India

The most prudent course of action and win-win for Pakistan is to release Imran Khan and let him lead the Nation at this hour and let the military do its professional job but that will be death of Pakistan Army domination in Pakistan so Asim Munir and other generals won't do that.



Israeli tactics have limited success in Kashmir but much of it won't work against Pakistan.

Israel hasn't even won against Hamas despite all its barbarity and not fought a conventional war for decades and would have lost in 1973 if US hadn't come to its aid.

Agree but as long as their dark occupation , killings and general oppression continues they are content to some degree .

 

[RexRex]

Getting in line with other SAARC leaders just to shake hands might’ve played well on Indian TV, but back home, it sent the wrong message, that Pakistan was eager to please, not engage as an equal. That’s not diplomacy, that’s deference. And it cost us more than just a photo op.

Please elaborate how Nawaz going to India in 2014 was
> ' sending the wrong message '
> ' cost us more than just a photo op '

What subsequent events proved the above to be true ?

India has a lot of sympathy for Nawaz Sharif. Poor guy tried forge a new beginning in 1999 with Vajpayee and got stabbed in the back by Musharraf with a coup. Same happened in 2016, where he was eventually replaced by the army with golden boy Imran Khan. I still remember the euphoria on PP when Imran became PM. Of course, he then got chewed out by the Army 6 years later but that's another story

 

[RexRex]

No Sir, I am not upset, I am all for to forge good relations with its neighbors. But Pakistan is neither Maldives nor Nepal.

That's all they are, just another neighbour.

 

[Greenstorm]

You quoted the wrong post, so if you are asking why Indian soldiers can’t teach Munir a lesson it’s because Munir is so great thag neither Modi Xi , Imran, Trump anyone can do anything against the legend.

Munir the hero of Pakistan, who has “positively” surprised everyone @Greenstorm

Where did I mentioned him as a hero ? Is Modi your hero ?

 

[Greenstorm]

Munir is not Bajwa—but like many of his predecessors in the Pakistan establishment, he’s highly skilled at spotting an opportunity and using it to serve his own interests. Remember the nickname he earned (aka The Deceiver)? It didn’t come without reason.

While the Pakistan Army may not be directly behind the recent events—whether it’s local Kashmiris or another actor—Modi has boxed himself into a corner. With Hindutva pressure mounting, he has little choice but to escalate through kinetic action. Munir, sensing the winds, likely sees this as his chance: if he can deliver a “befitting response” to India and present himself as the mastermind, it could turn his political fortunes around. All the criticism and oppression associated with him would be drowned in a wave of nationalist euphoria.

Like those before him, Asim Munir lacks the strategic depth for long-term planning. He would rather sacrifice parts of his country than step down from his ego-driven perch.

I believe India has already prepared for limited strikes—possibly with the knowledge and tacit approval of the U.S. and other allies. These powers may have already warned Pakistan and urged them to absorb it without retaliating. But Munir is unlikely to comply—not out of duty or patriotism, but for self-interest. Just as Modi’s actions will also be driven by personal and political gain.

Ultimately, the ordinary people of India and Pakistan are trapped between two narcissists playing dangerous games with national pride.

I agree with most of this post. Bajwa was willing to absorb Indian pressure whereas Munir is not. Now is it because Munir considers this as a ploy to preserve his interests only or does he have a genuine anti India ideology remains to be seen. The way he quotes Quranic verses all the time (Bajwa didn't), talks about 'hard state' in Pakistan, he gives me an impression that he is of Zaid Hamid school of thought who don't believe in democracy and supplement their ideology using religious reasoning where a strong 'sipah e salaar' should rule Muslim state. Zaid Hamid has never sucked up to a COAS more than this one.

But then again, deceiver can be deceiving us with his posturing and just using this as an opportunity to gain support of public and troops. Afterall, he didn't do anything against India for 2+ years and was very passive against them. Moreover, if he really wants to stand against India then he would have calmed down Western border and made amends with Taliban government. If Munir is deceiving once again then its a dangerous game. Modi is getting embarrassed which is bad news for Munir's extension as he is retiring this year.

 

[Greenstorm]

I am not convinced. Munir cannot survive for long if what you say is true. The Inds and the Israelis pretty much control our elite through the Americans and Saudis. Munir and co spent 4 hours doing PowerPoint Presentations( to the Americans elected reps)on Why IK is a danger to America and regional security. The other thing very important is how Important China is to our security, regional peace and keeping Balance against a nutty, fascist govt run by demagogues in India. Let's see how this pans out

Munir probably cannot see that or maybe he thinks he can force Shahbaz for an extension later this year. From his speech to overseas, he came across as over confident and over smart. Maybe he thinks he can deceive everyone. Americans always have alternative plans so will be interesting.

It is so unfortunate that a country of 250 million with so much potential can be controlled by major powers through an army chief.

 

[Devadwal]

Lol this is 2022 old video. Another fake news

He back

https://twitter.com/x/status/1917525236486136080

 

[Bewal Express]

Munir probably cannot see that or maybe he thinks he can force Shahbaz for an extension later this year. From his speech to overseas, he came across as over confident and over smart. Maybe he thinks he can deceive everyone. Americans always have alternative plans so will be interesting.

It is so unfortunate that a country of 250 million with so much potential can be controlled by major powers through an army chief.

Munir can never leave office and be safe. Bajwa is in hiding, Isa is in hiding, NS is in hiding and even in office AZ looks like a long dead corpse.

 

[Greenstorm]

Munir can never leave office and be safe. Bajwa is in hiding, Isa is in hiding, NS is in hiding and even in office AZ looks like a long dead corpse.

Unfortunately, izzat and zillat doesn't matter to them. They only care about power and riches. The names you mentioned maybe in hiding but they are hiding in billion dollar mansions while poor Pakistanis have a hard time putting food on table.

Decline of Muslims that started about 300 years ago is still ongoing. We are caught in trappings of time.

 

[Devadwal]

Pakistan establishment be like -

https://twitter.com/x/status/1918361270648242357

 

[Bewal Express]

Unfortunately, izzat and zillat doesn't matter to them. They only care about power and riches. The names you mentioned maybe in hiding but they are hiding in billion dollar mansions while poor Pakistanis have a hard time putting food on table.

Decline of Muslims that started about 300 years ago is still ongoing. We are caught in trappings of time.

Billlion dollars or trillion dollars, it's still hiding and they hate it. All that money and no freedom. Look at Isa or Bajwa walking around like tramps waiting for someone to shout abuse. Munir has been worse and he knows his end will be very painful.

 

[Greenstorm]

Billlion dollars or trillion dollars, it's still hiding and they hate it. All that money and no freedom. Look at Isa or Bajwa walking around like tramps waiting for someone to shout abuse. Munir has been worse and he knows his end will be very painful.

As I said brother, zillat doesn't matter to them.

I have seen a lot of Pakistanis who try to cope with injustices by thinking that tyrants are worse off. You think Bajwa or Isa is worse off but unfortunately it is Imran Khan, a honest and courageous man who is in a small jail cell for years who can't even meet his family ! Will Munir's end in this life will be as painful ? I don't think so.

Truth is that this life is a test. It is not a place for rewards or punishments.

 

[Bhaijaan]

As I said brother, zillat doesn't matter to them.

I have seen a lot of Pakistanis who try to cope with injustices by thinking that tyrants are worse off. You think Bajwa or Isa is worse off but unfortunately it is Imran Khan, a honest and courageous man who is in a small jail cell for years who can't even meet his family ! Will Munir's end in this life will be as painful ? I don't think so.

Truth is that this life is a test. It is not a place for rewards or punishments.

Not according to Sanatan Dharma.

In the eternal framework of Dharma, no act, good or evil, goes without consequence. Those who accumulate bad karma will inevitably face its results whether in this life or the next. Karma keeps perfect accounts, and its justice is inescapable. This certainty of moral cause and effect is the very foundation of Sanatan Dharma.

 

[Greenstorm]

Not according to Sanatan Dharma.

In the eternal framework of Dharma, no act, good or evil, goes without consequence. Those who accumulate bad karma will inevitably face its results whether in this life or the next. Karma keeps perfect accounts, and its justice is inescapable. This certainty of moral cause and effect is the very foundation of Sanatan Dharma.

That is not too different from Islam.

 

[Bhaijaan]

That is not too different from Islam.

This is addressed to those who feel that bad behaviour can go unpunished in life sometimes. Karma receipts are absolute. In this life or the next.