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Hashim Amla vs Muhammad Yousuf in ODIs?

shabir kham

Debutant
Joined
Jun 4, 2017
Runs
105
Who is better?

Mohammad Yousuf
Competition ODI
Matches 288
Runs scored 9,720
Batting average 41.90
100s/50s 15/64


Hashim Amla


Competition ODI
Matches 178
Runs scored 7100
Batting average 50
100s/50s 25/33

For me:moyo
 
Amla his records are much better and not like Yousuf was a crunch game player to chose him over Amla
 
Crunch chocolate?



Yes both are mentally as brittle as crunch chocolate..

If Yousuf was a pressure player one could have argued for him being a better player even though he had an inferior record bt since both were bottlers on big games Amla wins this one hands down..
 
Yousaf would have averaged 50 if he has been at his prime from 2010 to today with 2 new balls, no reverse swing, shorter boundaries, power plays e.t.c.
 
Despite Amla being the biggest bottlejob of his generation. He is still a comfortably better ODI batsman than Moyo.
 
Despite Amla being the biggest bottlejob of his generation. He is still a comfortably better ODI batsman than Moyo.

MoYo is miles ahead... no way.. if he bring back MoYo to the team he would slaughter Amla
 
Moyo scored most of runs on flat subcontinent wickets

Amla scored most of his runs on bowler friendly wickets in South Africa

Amla is much better than Moyo
 
I'd rather have a MoYo than a Amla..

Amla is a huge choker.. he can't bat England he can't bat SC he can't bat UAE... just isn't a good enough bat
 
Some of Amla's records like quickest to 2k, 3k, 4k, 5k, 6k and 7k runs are unmatched by any other batsman in the world. His average is in the 50s whereas Yousuf was just a touch over 40. He is without a doubt one if the best limited-overs batsman in the world and comfortably a better batsman than Yousuf in the shorter format.
 
I'd rather have a MoYo than a Amla..

Amla is a huge choker.. he can't bat England he can't bat SC he can't bat UAE... just isn't a good enough bat

LOL. If Amla is a choker how has Yousuf done any better by not being one? Would like you to name the trophies he has won Pakistan.

You say Amla can't bat in UAE and England yet he averages 50 in UAE and 56 in England. "just isn't a good enough bat" lol. Try backing up your arguements with some actual facts
 
Some of Amla's records like quickest to 2k, 3k, 4k, 5k, 6k and 7k runs are unmatched by any other batsman in the world. His average is in the 50s whereas Yousuf was just a touch over 40. He is without a doubt one if the best limited-overs batsman in the world and comfortably a better batsman than Yousuf in the shorter format.

Amla's prime years were after 2010 when batting became much easier in ODI's with the 2 new ball rules, fielding restrictions, power plays, short boundaries, bat sizes e.t.c. Yousaf was done in 2010, you can't use Yousaf's average against him.

Just because present players have higher averages than players from the 80's and 90's doesn't make them better either.
 
Amla's prime years were after 2010 when batting became much easier in ODI's with the 2 new ball rules, fielding restrictions, power plays, short boundaries, bat sizes e.t.c. Yousaf was done in 2010, you can't use Yousaf's average against him.

Just because present players have higher averages than players from the 80's and 90's doesn't make them better either.

Yousuf scored most of his runs on dead-wickets in Asia. And saying batting has gotten easier is an utterly bogus argument. Amla still has to see off the new ball (something Yousuf never had to do) and scoring runs is always tough against quality bowlers and countries like Australia, South Africa, England, New Zealand still provide something to bowlers if they apply themselves.

I wouldn't compare averages if there was a minute difference. But there is a BIG difference between averaging 41 and averaging 50. In some cases comparing averages between past and present players isn't right. But in this case, it most certainly is. Amla is a significantly better limited-overs batsman than Yousuf ever was.
 
Amla might have many faults, but seriously MoYo... MoYo had all the faults Amla has and some more.
 
Some of Amla's records like quickest to 2k, 3k, 4k, 5k, 6k and 7k runs are unmatched by any other batsman in the world. His average is in the 50s whereas Yousuf was just a touch over 40. He is without a doubt one if the best limited-overs batsman in the world and comfortably a better batsman than Yousuf in the shorter format.


Yousuf scored most of his runs on dead-wickets in Asia. And saying batting has gotten easier is an utterly bogus argument. Amla still has to see off the new ball (something Yousuf never had to do) and scoring runs is always tough against quality bowlers and countries like Australia, South Africa, England, New Zealand still provide something to bowlers if they apply themselves.

I wouldn't compare averages if there was a minute difference. But there is a BIG difference between averaging 41 and averaging 50. In some cases comparing averages between past and present players isn't right. But in this case, it most certainly is. Amla is a significantly better limited-overs batsman than Yousuf ever was.

Yousaf being a Pakistani meant he would end up playing most of his cricket in the Sub Continent, that is certainly not his fault. Yousaf is a middle order batsman while Amla is an opener, that is again not Yousaf's fault.

Yousaf has a double century in NZ, a century in Australia, he has a good record in England, he was not a flat track bully by any means.
 
Yousaf being a Pakistani meant he would end up playing most of his cricket in the Sub Continent, that is certainly not his fault. Yousaf is a middle order batsman while Amla is an opener, that is again not Yousaf's fault.

Yousaf has a double century in NZ, a century in Australia, he has a good record in England, he was not a flat track bully by any means.

I think you have trouble reading. This thread is specifically about ODIs, not tests. And try supporting your argument with some actual facts and statistics instead of random facts like he has a double century against New Zealand that don't even have anything to do with the topic.

I have seen both cricketers play one day crickett. And based on seeing them bat and their respective batting records in ODIs Hashim Amla is the better batsman.
 
I think you have trouble reading. This thread is specifically about ODIs, not tests. And try supporting your argument with some actual facts and statistics instead of random facts like he has a double century against New Zealand that don't even have anything to do with the topic.

I have seen both cricketers play one day crickett. And based on seeing them bat and their respective batting records in ODIs Hashim Amla is the better batsman.

Let me guess, you are now going to say Amla is better than Inzi too because Amla opens the batting, bats in South African conditions, plays bowlers from Australia, NZ, England e.t.c.

You are conveniently underplaying the impact that the 2 new ball rules, modern bat sizes, power plays have had on modern batting averages let alone the absurdity of comparing an opener with a middle order batsman.

The better question to ask is if these modern advantages were given to the players in the past during their prime years, would it have made a significant difference to their stats, i have to say yes.
 
Amla, since Yousuf is really the only other batsman who can give him competition when it comes to choking in tournaments, and averages 9 runs less doing it
 
Let me guess, you are now going to say Amla is better than Inzi too because Amla opens the batting, bats in South African conditions, plays bowlers from Australia, NZ, England e.t.c.

You are conveniently underplaying the impact that the 2 new ball rules, modern bat sizes, power plays have had on modern batting averages let alone the absurdity of comparing an opener with a middle order batsman.

The better question to ask is if these modern advantages were given to the players in the past during their prime years, would it have made a significant difference to their stats, i have to say yes.

I never said he was better than Inzamam. But when comparing two batsmen the only major thing you can put into context is averages, strike rates and performances in countries and tournaments. And I'm sorry but two new balls, bat sizes are bogus excuses and even if they have affected the game the difference in averages and strike rates shouldn't be this much. Amla's average (50) and strike rate (90) is considered among the best of current world cricket. Whereas, during Yousuf's time, his average (41) and strike rate (75) was considered good, not great.

The arguement of comparisons you keep trying to make would be valid if one was comparing someone like Amla and Gavaskar of two completely contrasting generations.

So please stop thinking with your heart. Amla is a far better one day player than Yousuf ever was.
 
Some of Amla's records like quickest to 2k, 3k, 4k, 5k, 6k and 7k runs are unmatched by any other batsman in the world. His average is in the 50s whereas Yousuf was just a touch over 40. He is without a doubt one if the best limited-overs batsman in the world and comfortably a better batsman than Yousuf in the shorter format.

I never said he was better than Inzamam. But when comparing two batsmen the only major thing you can put into context is averages, strike rates and performances in countries and tournaments. And I'm sorry but two new balls, bat sizes are bogus excuses and even if they have affected the game the difference in averages and strike rates shouldn't be this much. Amla's average (50) and strike rate (90) is considered among the best of current world cricket. Whereas, during Yousuf's time, his average (41) and strike rate (75) was considered good, not great.

The arguement of comparisons you keep trying to make would be valid if one was comparing someone like Amla and Gavaskar of two completely contrasting generations.

So please stop thinking with your heart. Amla is a far better one day player than Yousuf ever was.

Inzamam averages 39 in ODI's, Yousaf averages 41 and Amla averages 50 in ODI's. Going by your logic, it means Amla is better than Inzi, isn't that what you are saying if we follow your argument? So how come Amla is better than Yousaf if we go by strike rate, averages which if we look at detailed evidence has been strongly boosted by the 2 new ball rules, bat sizes, smaller grounds, fielding restrictions from 2010-2017 but not better than Inzi?
 
Inzamam averages 39 in ODI's, Yousaf averages 41 and Amla averages 50 in ODI's. Going by your logic, it means Amla is better than Inzi, isn't that what you are saying if we follow your argument? So how come Amla is better than Yousaf if we go by strike rate, averages which if we look at detailed evidence has been strongly boosted by the 2 new ball rules, bat sizes, smaller grounds, fielding restrictions from 2010-2017 but not better than Inzi?

Where does the thread say anything about Inzamam? It's about Amla and Yousuf and me and literally every other person on this thread who watches cricket with this eyes thinks Amla is the better player. I'm not going to be reading any of your idiotic defenses on why Yousuf is a better player since you're going to keep defending your arguemnent with bat sizes, fielding restrictions.

My only advice is learn to be a rational watcher of the game rather than a blind supporter.
 
One thing both have in common, they were quite possibly two of the worst captains for their respective countries.
 
Where does the thread say anything about Inzamam? It's about Amla and Yousuf and me and literally every other person on this thread who watches cricket with this eyes thinks Amla is the better player. I'm not going to be reading any of your idiotic defenses on why Yousuf is a better player since you're going to keep defending your arguemnent with bat sizes, fielding restrictions.

My only advice is learn to be a rational watcher of the game rather than a blind supporter.

I am least bothered about debating who was the better player. I am just arguing the gap b/w the two is not as large as you seem to make out to be. My arguments on bat sizes, fielding restrictions, 2 new balls is pretty valid as it has helped to inflate batting average and strike rates in the last 5-7 years.

And i bought up Yousaf's scores in NZ, England, Australia to prove he was not a flat track bully as you make him out to be.

And yes i bought up Inzamam to bring to notice the fallacy in your argument where you conveniently used Statistics to say Amla was better than Yousaf because Amla has an average of 50 and a SR of 90 whereas Yousaf has an Average of 41 and SR of 75 (conveniently discounting that he batted in a different era).

Well guess what Inzamam has an Average of 39 and a SR of 74, slightly worse than Yousaf. Going by your argument, are you going to now argue that Amla was better and superior than Inzamam as well?

And lol how conveniently you are now shifting from Statistics to anyone who has watched the two bat, everyone participating in this thread feels Amla is better.

The only rational thing is that it is stupid to compare two players from different eras, countries and different batting positions.
 
Amla

Yousuf was even a bigger choker than Amla, did not score a single 50 against any top team in any of WCs he played.
 
Hashim Amla.

Simply a better version of Yousuf.

Both have rubbish track records in pressure situations.
 
At least Amla has balls to open the inning. Both Inzamam and Yousuf hid behind the likes of Malik, Kamran, Butt, etc.
 
At least Amla has balls to open the inning. Both Inzamam and Yousuf hid behind the likes of Malik, Kamran, Butt, etc.

The same argument can be used against Misbah. But out will come the excuses "Yes, a middle order batsman should open the innings, brilliant idea"
 
The same argument can be used against Misbah. But out will come the excuses "Yes, a middle order batsman should open the innings, brilliant idea"

Yes, it does. Team's best batsman should bat in top 3. Misbah's ideal position was #3.
 
Mohammad Yousuf vs Hashim Amla - Better ODI player?

Both similar kind of players. While Amla is a superior test player, who do you think is better in odis?
 
Amla. I dont rate Yousuf in any format of the game.

Not that I rate Amla too much either in odis.
 
Test comparison would be more appropriate. Amla hands down in miles ahead of Yousuf in limited overs
 
Yousuf in Tests

Amla in ODI

Although its hard to judge because Amla played a lot longer and Yousuf's contributions were cut short.
 
Yousuf is the softest cricketer of all time. Averages in 30s in test matches won and did not score even a 50 once in any WC game against a non minnow team.
 
Yousuf in Tests

Amla in ODI

Although its hard to judge because Amla played a lot longer and Yousuf's contributions were cut short.

You must not have followed Amla's career to pick Yousuf over him in tests. That is the only explanation.
 
Both are massive bottlers and liabilities in big matches and in pressure situations, but MoYo's 81* vs India in the 2004 Champions Trophy was a superior innings to any that Amla has played so far.

However, we cannot make a black and white comparison based on raw statistics because context matters. A lot of MoYo's (and Inzamam's for that matter) potential was wasted when he did not open at a time when Pakistan was struggling to produce openers.

Unfortunately he did not have the guts to face the new ball and neither was he pushed by the management, because only in Pakistan is the idea that the best batsman should face maximum deliveries in Limited Overs cricket is considered cancerous.

Had MoYo opened in ODIs in 2010s, I think his stats would not have been much inferior to Amla's. Still, I would give Amla the edge but it is not an absurd comparison as some are suggesting.
 
However, we cannot make a black and white comparison based on raw statistics because context matters.

You can take their ranking graph for entire career. Not perfect, but much better than raw stats. It has a lot more context.

Amla_Moyo_odi.jpg

How are these two even comparable? ICC ranking are not perfect at any time, but when you have a situation where one batsman has been consistently among the top 5-7 rank and other has rarely been among the top 5-7 rank. Only way they are comparable if we go by the theory of past players being far superior as a group.
 
You can take their ranking graph for entire career. Not perfect, but much better than raw stats. It has a lot more context.

View attachment 76925

How are these two even comparable? ICC ranking are not perfect at any time, but when you have a situation where one batsman has been consistently among the top 5-7 rank and other has rarely been among the top 5-7 rank. Only way they are comparable if we go by the theory of past players being far superior as a group.

Didnt Yousuf played in an era where his batting average was among the top batsmen?
 
Didnt Yousuf played in an era where his batting average was among the top batsmen?

Here is batting average of everyone with 2K+ runs during MoYo's entire career.

Moyo.jpg
 
An argument could have been made if we discussed Test cricket. No comparison in ODI's.
 
Only those who watch cricket on cricinfo can say that this is closer comparison in tests.

Yousuf is behind AB in tests who is clearly well behind Amla in that format.

There is no comparison between the two in tests.
 
Both are massive bottlers and liabilities in big matches and in pressure situations, but MoYo's 81* vs India in the 2004 Champions Trophy was a superior innings to any that Amla has played so far.

However, we cannot make a black and white comparison based on raw statistics because context matters. A lot of MoYo's (and Inzamam's for that matter) potential was wasted when he did not open at a time when Pakistan was struggling to produce openers.

Unfortunately he did not have the guts to face the new ball and neither was he pushed by the management, because only in Pakistan is the idea that the best batsman should face maximum deliveries in Limited Overs cricket is considered cancerous.

Had MoYo opened in ODIs in 2010s, I think his stats would not have been much inferior to Amla's. Still, I would give Amla the edge but it is not an absurd comparison as some are suggesting.

If this, if that. Basing your argument on endless hypotheticals is beneath you. Rate the men on what they've done, not imagined possibilities.
 
Both are massive bottlers and liabilities in big matches and in pressure situations, but MoYo's 81* vs India in the 2004 Champions Trophy was a superior innings to any that Amla has played so far.

However, we cannot make a black and white comparison based on raw statistics because context matters. A lot of MoYo's (and Inzamam's for that matter) potential was wasted when he did not open at a time when Pakistan was struggling to produce openers.

Unfortunately he did not have the guts to face the new ball and neither was he pushed by the management, because only in Pakistan is the idea that the best batsman should face maximum deliveries in Limited Overs cricket is considered cancerous.

Had MoYo opened in ODIs in 2010s, I think his stats would not have been much inferior to Amla's. Still, I would give Amla the edge but it is not an absurd comparison as some are suggesting.

MoYo 83 vs India in the 2009 CT trumps any of Amla’s knocks in ICC tournaments ( Better than his 81* in 2004)

However ICC tournaments do not make a career.
 
MoYo 83 vs India in the 2009 CT trumps any of Amla’s knocks in ICC tournaments ( Better than his 81* in 2004)

However ICC tournaments do not make a career.

I rate the 2004 CT innings higher because he was the only batsman that performed and the conditions were extremely bowling-friendly. The 2009 innings was great, but it came on a batting surface with Malik stealing the show.
 
If this, if that. Basing your argument on endless hypotheticals is beneath you. Rate the men on what they've done, not imagined possibilities.

Comparing two players who have barely played in the same era (perhaps for a couple of years only) and have had different batting positions/roles will always be based on hypothetical, assumptions and imagined possibilities.

Apart from their beards, I don't see any points of comparison between a middle-order batsman of the 2000s and an opener of the 2010s. However, that does not mean that a player cannot be considered better because other things aren't equal. In case you missed, I did state that in spite of the different qualifications, Amla is better than MoYo.

However, I will insist that the gap is smaller than what the statistics show, but that will always happen whenever Amla is compared to any other quality ODI batsman, because no player has had so much discrepancy between stats and performance. Amla is living proof of how misleading stats can be, and MoYo's stats are misleading as well because of two factors: he was also a bottler and his skills were not properly utilized.
 
You can take their ranking graph for entire career. Not perfect, but much better than raw stats. It has a lot more context.

View attachment 76925

How are these two even comparable? ICC ranking are not perfect at any time, but when you have a situation where one batsman has been consistently among the top 5-7 rank and other has rarely been among the top 5-7 rank. Only way they are comparable if we go by the theory of past players being far superior as a group.

My assumption (i.e., the gap between them is not as big as the stats show) is based on my belief that MoYo would have done much better as an opener. The ranking will not validate my belief because he never opened. If the condition is to compare Amla the opener to MoYo the middle-order batsman, than obviously Amla is well ahead of MoYo.

However, this is a random comparison in the first place.
 
Amla by a fraction but the gap isnt as big as the avges suggests

Todays stats are rather inflated due to smaller grounds, bigger bats, two new balls etc

An avge of 42 by yousuf then is equivalent to a good 6-8 points more today
 
My assumption (i.e., the gap between them is not as big as the stats show) is based on my belief that MoYo would have done much better as an opener. The ranking will not validate my belief because he never opened. If the condition is to compare Amla the opener to MoYo the middle-order batsman, than obviously Amla is well ahead of MoYo.

However, this is a random comparison in the first place.

But that's the only proven performance here and due to huge gap, it makes little sense to compare them.
 
Amla is comfortably superior to MoYo in the test format. I have seen entire career of these two.
 
But that's the only proven performance here and due to huge gap, it makes little sense to compare them.

Yes. Generally speaking, I am not a fan of comparing openers to middle-order batsmen across eras. However, that doesn't mean we can't tell who is better.
 
Probably true. MoYo had trouble with spin and bounce.

He did, but Yousuf was a very good/great test batsman despite his flaws. I'll place him alongside Mahela, Clarke and Laxman.
 
Fantasizing about what Yousuf could do as an opener is silly because the man never liked facing the new ball and unlike Inzamam, there was no sense of wasted potential with Yousuf.

If anything, that great year he had in '06/07 made people overestimate his ability. Would walk into any team today however.
 
Laxman and Clarke are so far ahead of Yousuf that its not even funny.

Yousuf is at Hussey level in tests.
 
Yousuf!
Underrated by Pakistanis.. But you cant expect anything from these people as they took ages to identify the potential of Babar and Haris; best batting talents in Pakistan after Yousuf.
 
Yousuf!
Underrated by Pakistanis.. But you cant expect anything from these people as they took ages to identify the potential of Babar and Haris; best batting talents in Pakistan after Yousuf.

Thread is about actual result and not potential of players.
 
The gap between the two is much wider in Tests.

How so? :13:

Yousuf at his peak averaged 56 in Tests (higher than YK, Inzy, Misbah, Miandad ever achieved)

He was tremendous against pace and swing and had immaculate footwork so hence he succeeded in England.

Despite not being the greatest against spin - he still has centuries in India and SL and was a beast on the flat wickets of Pakistan. Seem to also recall him scoring a century against an ATG Aussie attack during our 04/05 tour.
 
How so? :13:

Yousuf at his peak averaged 56 in Tests (higher than YK, Inzy, Misbah, Miandad ever achieved)

He was tremendous against pace and swing and had immaculate footwork so hence he succeeded in England.

Despite not being the greatest against spin - he still has centuries in India and SL and was a beast on the flat wickets of Pakistan. Seem to also recall him scoring a century against an ATG Aussie attack during our 04/05 tour.

There are similarities between the two. Both are very good batsmen but looked liked ATGs during their purple patches. Amla is a much better player of pace, swing, seam and spin, although he was rubbish in India in 2015 on dustbowls.

MoYo is close to him when it comes to playing swing, but Amla is comfortably ahead in other facets.
 
Both are third tier ATGs
yousuf is slightly ahead of Amla but he have chance to match or surpass Yousuf at the end of his career
 
Thread is about odis and Yousuf is better for me here. Considering the team, type of conditions, impact etc I will pick Yousuf..

Did you consider that PPers are rightly rating a batsman who rarely featured in the top 10? May be you are overrating for no obvious reason. Amla is not really compared with some one like AB here. It's MoYo who had trouble playing spin and bounce both.
 
On one side MoYo is deemed a lesser player due to difference in ODI averages, which I am not doubting or debating either!

But on the flip side, despite having a better Test Average, SR, 100 conversion ratio etc. Amla is far superior Test Batsman, WTH?

I never rated MoYo very highly but he did face the tougher of conditions overall and better bowling attacks as well, that should be taken as an advantage not the other way around.

Side Note: Has there ever been a thread about a Pak batsman/bowler being compared to even a Martian, where all Indians and closet ones as well, rated the Pak player better?
 
Did you consider that PPers are rightly rating a batsman who rarely featured in the top 10? May be you are overrating for no obvious reason. Amla is not really compared with some one like AB here. It's MoYo who had trouble playing spin and bounce both.

I have watched almost the entire the career of both and Yousuf is my pick.. I dont need to underrate Amla as he is likeable player and i have nothing against him..

Amla played for the no 1 side and most of his partners were the likes of De Villers, Smith, Kallis, De Kock and Faf while Yousuf played alongside only 1 great batsman Inzamam and a slight part with Anwar other than that he was partnered by rubbish odi players like Younis etc and fixers.. Don think Amla would have done better in such a team and the era Yousuf played against quality bowlers and when there was a balance b/w bat and ball.. Yousuf is underrated!
 
I have watched almost the entire the career of both and Yousuf is my pick.. I dont need to underrate Amla as he is likeable player and i have nothing against him..

Amla played for the no 1 side and most of his partners were the likes of De Villers, Smith, Kallis, De Kock and Faf while Yousuf played alongside only 1 great batsman Inzamam and a slight part with Anwar other than that he was partnered by rubbish odi players like Younis etc and fixers.. Don think Amla would have done better in such a team and the era Yousuf played against quality bowlers and when there was a balance b/w bat and ball.. Yousuf is underrated!
This makes no sense. Amla opens the innings so he pretty much sets the innings for all the guys that come afterwards. Wouldn't it be them and not him(Amla)* that benefit the most.
 
I have watched almost the entire the career of both and Yousuf is my pick.. I dont need to underrate Amla as he is likeable player and i have nothing against him..

Amla played for the no 1 side and most of his partners were the likes of De Villers, Smith, Kallis, De Kock and Faf while Yousuf played alongside only 1 great batsman Inzamam and a slight part with Anwar other than that he was partnered by rubbish odi players like Younis etc and fixers.. Don think Amla would have done better in such a team and the era Yousuf played against quality bowlers and when there was a balance b/w bat and ball.. Yousuf is underrated!

That's too much hypothetical to really argue for me. Another poster was arguing earlier that MoYo would have done better while opening and all that. I think that line of thinking is pure speculation. We can certainly talk about MoYo facing better bowlers , but talking about a situation where Amla was playing with fixers or MoYo was opening is too imaginary for me to make any comparison.
 
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