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How good was Ramiz Raja?

pakiman740

pakiman740

Tape Ball Regular
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Feb 22, 2011
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iam too young to know,but seeing him talked about and commentating,how good was he exactly,better then most or just an average batsman?
 
His brother was great may be he was more of a reason why he kept on playing for Pakistan. But would love to check out the stats.
 
Limited and not that good, i am surprised that he played for that long but his flicks and cuts were good when they came off.
 
yeah I crinch everytime he talks about sr etc as if this guy had set the world on fire in his playing days....

he was a nothing batsmen...
 
Wasim Raja bowling and Rameez Raja getting hurt while fielding on his brothers bowling;

[utube]d9-YWl9I2wE[/utube]
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Not outstanding but nowhere near as bad as he's made out to be on PP. He was pretty alright without being particularly outstanding.
 
he took the final catch in the wc final 92!

everything else is forgiven :D
 
Rameez raja was a good batsman. Certainly not bad as people are making him here. Limited technique but he played well knowing his limitations.
 
if im not wrong .. Ramiz ONLY hit one 6 in his all career, he was a very mediocre batsman, but that final world cup catch DID IT FOR HIM !! :)
 
On and off the field, in Pakistan cricket, it will be difficult to find a more stylish man than Ramiz Raja. In Pakistan's post-90s mess of scandal, dirt and intrigue, he also emerged, importantly, as a rare man of integrity and considerable dignity on the field and in administration. As an opening batsman Raja arrived on the scene the next Majid Khan. His basic game was built on solid, understated elegance. Some of the leg-side play was outstanding and the flick to square leg soon became a signature stroke. Why he didn't score more runs in Tests remains a mystery, though his importance to Pakistan's strong ODI sides of the 80s and early 90s cannot be underestimated. In the World Cups of 1987 and 1992 he was a key figure and as well as taking the catch that won it for Pakistan in 1992, he scored two hundreds through the tournament. His integrity and seniority helped him in captaining Pakistan late in his career, but the qualities became of greater use after he retired. First, as a bright, dynamic chief executive of the Pakistan board he was instrumental in bringing about a prosperous period in the early 2000s, including negotiating a breakthrough in Pakistan-India ties. The series won an important Laureus award for bringing the countries together through cricket. But by then he had also become an articulate voice of Pakistan the world over as a television commentator. That career has gone from strength to strength so that in the modern turmoil of Pakistan cricket, Raja's has been an authoritative, informed and sane voice amid the madness.
Osman Samiuddin - CRICINFO
 
He was a very average player to be honest ....... Salim Malik was a far better player than him.
 
very good player on the legside, some of his tucks off the pads were really top class. :inzi
 
Indeed a very average batsman. He had only two centuries in 57 test matches. One of them against a minnow of that time SriLanka
 
Only time I saw him play was WC 1992, I quite liked his style and always wanted to see his flicks, he did well in that WC so I am pretty surprised why he isn't liked more here.
 
Even on flat tracks he was just terrible,less said about this technician of a batsman the better!

Ramiz Epitomizes the bad structures of Pakistan domestic cricket flaws!That is why great Pakistani batsman had stint at county cricket and polished there technique, and then went on to become accomplished players.Apart from Inzi.
 
Probably the worst player to have played so frequently for pakistan
 
One has to wonder after seeing this thread how many people have actually seen him play and how many just googled his stats.
 
very good odi player especially when you consider the generation in which he played was a mediocre test match batsman however there were not many better options at that time.
 
Ok as an opener but not too stylish and flamboyant player. He was good in sticking out and grinding a few runs here and there
 
i only can comment on what i saw of him '96 onwards (not much basically). He was the captain for quite a while and his innings were torturous to watch! Extremely low S/R in ODIs!! Anyway though, seeing highlights of '92 though make him out to be quite "alright" and he did score 2 100s in that WC which count for a lot! He performed at the biggest stage, I think that matters more than meaningless stats and averages!
 
ramiz raja aka kameez kacha wasnt good batsman. he could make 30 runs from 400 balls and come back to dressing room raising his bat and people never bothered to clap
 
Desire said:
ramiz raja aka kameez kacha wasnt good batsman. he could make 30 runs from 400 balls and come back to dressing room raising his bat and people never bothered to clap
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Thats a bit OTT. Ramiz wasn't a tuk tuk master, he was just not that great of a batsman but still better than the openers we got and he fit to Imran's plans. If you look at Imran's selection, he didn't entirely select a person for "outstanding talent", he looked for that extra thing, those fighting skills. If you are good and willing to fight for the cause, Imran would pick you, like for example Aamir Malik, wasn't really a gifted player but determined one and on other hand, Saeed Anwar, talented by not responsible. Mansoor Akhtar is the only player i can recall, who never really performed when given chances even though he was quiet talented and determined too.

Also, Cricket was different back then so you cant really trash Rambo for tuk tuk thing. Was he good? No, did he fit into the team plan? To some extent, Could he decide a game on his own? No. But his flicks and cuts were good when they come off and then you'd also see him ballooning it to square leg fielder whipping it off the pads. Really limited player but a determined fellow though.
 
Wasim raja was his brother??? Wow

Btw its stupid to say that rameez was a bad batsmen so his opinion dont count........ Whats next, woolmer was not a good batamen, why was he telling and teaching our players???
 
Rameez Raja's career started after he got retired !!!
When he talks "techniques" about other players he never applied them to himself. Its easy for him to comment on others.
 
Rameez Raja was pathetic when he opened with Saeed Anwar in the Independence Cup , a Tri Nation tourney.
 
I had a VHS of a match winning innings he played against the likes of Marshall, Holding etc in the mid 80's, think it was in Sharjah. He was very young, one of this first innings, and his footwork and stroke play was magnificent. The likes of Richie Benaud commentating felt he would go onto be a great player for Pakistan.

this is it.. it was in Australia

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/65729.html
 
His commentary is better than his batsmanship

scored the most pointless World Cup 100 vs Windies in 1992-the only innings that sticks in my mind

would rate him slightly ahead of Taufeeq he was around today
 
He was a 'smart operator' with the 'willow in hand':raja.
 
He was very strong off his legs....his favourite shot was a dismissive flick off his legs through square leg.

A good player - but had his flaws. A sucker for LBW because of he was mainly a leg side player. He played some excellent innings - but never did enough to jump into the 'top class' category. I would rate him a better batsman then Hafeez. Same sort of quality as Aamir Sohail but more pleasing to the eye. However, no where near the class of Pakistan's best openers (Saeed, Majid, Haneef, Sadiq ).
 
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He was a very good player of pace but he had a habit of throwing his wicket away hence not many centuries to his name. At his peak, he was very attacking too.

All at sea against spin though, nearly as bad as Taufeeq in that department.
 
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There is no way He was that player what PPers are making him out here. I do not see much difference between Farhat and him.
 
Ramiz was an average player for an international, and he also played on when he should have retired. He was practically a specialist captain.

Also, those talking about his 2 centuries in the WC - they need to check out the first century. It was a slow, boring century. Pak only lost 1-2 wickets in that game and Ramiz still scored like a snail. West Indies easily chased down Pak's score of 220 or so.
 
He was a decent bastman but as is being said here he performed very well in the world cup;

keep in mind his century against NZ who up until then were unbeaten allowed Pakistan to advance to the semi-finals
 
AhmadRaja said:
He was a decent bastman but as is being said here he performed very well in the world cup;

keep in mind his century against NZ who up until then were unbeaten allowed Pakistan to advance to the semi-finals
Click to expand...

Did he score a century against NZ when chasing 166? I just remember Sohail's dismissal from that game, never knew that he scored a century. Smooth operator!
 
Fantastic playing off his legs and a brilliant hooker and puller. While his offside game was very limited, his main asset was he was a fearless player of fast bowling. Not many batsmen in his era were capable of hooking West Indian fast bowlers in front of their face. While I can't stand him as a commentator I think he was a useful opener in his time.
 
the other citizen is admire from this player but the bros of rameez raja country he's criticize them.guys very bad.
 
he was good not great batsmenn. I remeber his drives and flicks. He wasnt that bad as some ppl here want him to be. He opned for Pakistan and did "OKI". If he wasnt good Imran Khan would had kicked him out.
 
Player: Average at best.

Commentator: Excellent.

Dress Sense: Classy

Hair Cut: Stuck in 1980s
 
He did pretty good in the 92 world cup from what I remember, but asides from that, definitely not in the top league of Pakistani batsmen, he was the definition of mediocrity.
 
ares1000 said:
Player: Below Average at best.

Commentator: Predicatble and Recycled Garbage All Day.

Dress Sense: Pimp-esque

Hair Cut: Stuck in 1980s...if you can call it a hair cut at all
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Fixed:sami

Seriously, Rameez the player was barely OK except for his batting in 1987 WC (was quite good), and some decent-ish batting in the 1992 WC (remember his snail like century caused us to lose by 10 wickets against WI)...over all an OK ODI batsman

Rameez the Test Player should not have played more than 20 tests but some how dragged on and even became the captain too and famously helped end the career of Mohammed Zahid. He was good on the leg side but when teams figured him out, all they had to do was either bowl straight and he would try to play to leg and end up getting LBW or place a player on silly mid-on and Rameez would be giving them catching practice all day (if possible)

He should be the last person to be lecturing on the run rates, batting techniques, how to rotate the strike etc. etc.

Biggest Achievements of Rameez: A Nehru Cup innings against England in a rain shortened match...he along with Salim Malik took English bowlers to the cleaners and won the game for Pakistan

And Obviously that WC winning catch
 
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The only time i remember Rameez Raja was during the Sahara Cup 1997? He was the captain I think.
I used to pray that he doesn't get out. He was scoring 20's and 30's. But he was eating away almost 80 or 90 deliveries. He was super slow and could not rotate the strike. But he did play 1 good innings in 5 games where he scored over 50.

He looked like a Sifarish guy to me honestly. In the Wajahatulla Wasti mode :asif
 
He was pretty useless. Tried to play everything to leg but without a tenth of the talent or grace of Azharudin. Therefore a walking wicket and prime LBW candidate whenever he played on a pitch with any hint of lateral movement.

According to contempories at Aitchenson there were a number of players better than him at school. However family connections - brother and father opened doors for him and still continue to do so.

His commentary gives him away - he rarely says anything of note on tactics or techniques. An unthinking cricketer - who thought too little about his game and the game in general. Why would you - when you have always had everything on a plate.

A smart operator - he certainly wasn't with either bat or microphone in hand.
 
If you look at him as a pure batsman, he wasn't that good.

However, if you look at him as an opener, he wasn't bad according to Pakistan standards.

He had a great straight drive, and also the flick off his toes was pretty sweet.

In the list of Pakistan openers, here is how I see him,

Level One
1. Saeed Anwar
2. Hanif Mohammad
3. Majid
4. Sadiq
5. Aamer Sohail

Level 2
6. Rameez, Mudassir, Mohsin, Salman Butt, Shoaib Mohd, etc.

Level 3
Mansoor Akhtar, Imran Farhat, WajahtUllah Wasti, etc.

Verdict - Decent Opener
 
This summed up how he sleptwalked when he played - makes Inzy look wide awake. So amazing when he criticises Inzy and Yousuf for example.

<object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/M1tC0Hx31D4?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/M1tC0Hx31D4?version=3&feature=player_detailpage" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object>
 
:malik
TigerJat said:
If you look at him as a pure batsman, he wasn't that good.

However, if you look at him as an opener, he wasn't bad according to Pakistan standards.

He had a great straight drive, and also the flick off his toes was pretty sweet.

In the list of Pakistan openers, here is how I see him,

Level One
1. Saeed Anwar
2. Hanif Mohammad
3. Majid
4. Sadiq
5. Aamer Sohail

Level 2
6. Rameez, Mudassir, Mohsin, Salman Butt, Shoaib Mohd, etc.

Level 3
Mansoor Akhtar, Imran Farhat, WajahtUllah Wasti, etc.

Verdict - Decent Opener
Click to expand...

:facepalm:

and where is hafeez? farhat shouldn't even be on a level
 
ecstatic_freak said:
Did he score a century against NZ when chasing 166? I just remember Sohail's dismissal from that game, never knew that he scored a century. Smooth operator!
Click to expand...

but he wasnt man of the match - that went to :mushy for his 2-18 i think
 
I'm not a man for averages but his overall test average was poor - 31 / 32. However against the best 2 teams at his time - Aus and WI it was around 22 and 19 respectively. Says it all !
Pretty useless!
 
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ecstatic_freak said:
Did he score a century against NZ when chasing 166? I just remember Sohail's dismissal from that game, never knew that he scored a century. Smooth operator!
Click to expand...

Yes and he scored a century against the windies in the first game - which bored us all to sleep. The Windies knocked it off without alarm.....a young BC Lara showing how it should be done.
 
Osman said:
:malik

:facepalm:

and where is hafeez? farhat shouldn't even be on a level
Click to expand...


Hafeez is level 2 for me right now, but he is moving into the top level.

Keep in mind, Pakistan has always had atrocious openers, so he was a decent opener by PK standards, not great, but ok
 
Not sure how you can put Rameez in the same bracket as Mudasser and Mohsin. The latter in particular scored runs in Aus and England, and both scored a number of centuries. Rameez scored 2 - one against India and the other against minnows - SL. Couldn't play the moving ball and played across the line!

Has to be level 3. If we have always had bad openers then being in the lowest category says it all ! Probably worse than Farhat!
 
Never saw him live but just going by stats, it seems he was an average test batsman but a decent ODI opener. He seems to have an extraordinary world cup average of 53 over 16 games and considering he was there during Pakistan's only win in 92, he can't really be in the list of the most insignificant batsmen to play for Pakistan.
 
Osman said:
:malik

:facepalm:

and where is hafeez? farhat shouldn't even be on a level
Click to expand...

Amoeba said:
I'm not a man for averages but his overall test average was poor - 31 / 32. However against the best 2 teams at his time - Aus and WI it was around 22 and 19 respectively. Says it all !
Pretty useless!
Click to expand...

31/32 average is not bad for a pakistani opener. His average in ODIs is 33, which is pretty decent for an opener.

It is bad for a middle order batsman, but for a pakistani opener, it is not bad at all.

TEST Figures
Overall figures
Player Span Mat Runs Ave 100 50
Saeed Anwar 1990-2001 54 3957 47.1 11 25
Majid Khan 1973-1979 26 1985 42.23 5 7
Hanif Mohammad 1952-1969 39 2638 41.87 7 12
Shoaib Mohammad 1983-1995 27 1423 40.65 4 5
Taufeeq Umar 2001-2012 40 2784 39.21 7 13
Mohsin Khan 1979-1986 43 2455 37.76 7 9
Shahid Afridi 1998-2005 15 892 37.16 2 6
Mudassar Nazar 1976-1989 70 3787 36.76 9 15
Mohammad Hafeez 2003-2012 26 1644 36.53 4 7
Aamer Sohail 1992-2000 46 2630 36.02 4 13
Sadiq Mohammad 1969-1981 41 2480 34.92 5 9
Imtiaz Ahmed 1954-1962 17 979 33.75 2 5
Rameez Raja 1987-1997 43 2103 32.85 1 17
Imran Farhat 2001-2010 39 2327 31.87 3 14
Salman Butt 2003-2010 31 1742 31.1 3 10
Yasir Hameed 2004-2010 11 546 26 0 4
Alimuddin 1954-1962 22 856 25.93 1 7
Saleem Elahi 1995-2003 11 286 15.05 0 1


ODI Overall figures
Player Span Mat Runs Ave SR 100 50
Saleem Elahi 1995-2003 28 1138 42.14 74.96 4 6
Saeed Anwar 1989-2003 220 8156 39.98 79.93 20 37
Yasir Hameed 2003-2007 43 1665 39.64 69.05 3 9
Salman Butt 2004-2010 77 2725 37.32 76.3 8 14
Rameez Raja 1986-1997 125 3934 33.62 63.18 8 21
Imran Farhat 2001-2011 43 1322 32.24 70.58 1 10
Aamer Sohail 1990-2000 132 4169 32.06 65.55 5 27
Mohammad Hafeez 2003-2011 81 2194 28.49 69.73 3 12
Mudassar Nazar 1977-1989 91 2472 28.09 52 0 16
Shoaib Mohammad 1984-1993 47 1175 27.32 52.22 1 8
Kamran Akmal 2002-2011 61 1617 26.95 81.58 4 4
Mohsin Khan 1981-1986 69 1742 26.8 56.44 2 7
Shahid Afridi 1996-2009 143 3537 24.9 101.66 3 22
Imran Nazir 1999-2009 78 1891 24.88 81.29 2 9
Taufeeq Umar 2001-2011 22 504 24 56.31 0 3
 
I only really care about tests not jamodis. In Tests he was in the bottom category - about as good as Farhat, actually probably worse!
You only have to see who is top of the pile for jamodis to know that looking at averages in particular in jamodis is flawed.

In tests class will out. Rameez was a useless player - and an even worse commentator....if that is possible,
 
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I think that slow century v Windies is one of the reasons people dislike Raja. Overall he appears, apart from that innings, to have been a fair-enough opener in LOIs.

IMHO Pakistan openers are as follows

Rank 1) Saeed Anwar, Saeed Ahmed (nobody ever mentions this fantastic batsman), Hanif Mohammad, Majid Khan

Rank 2) Aamer Sohail, Mudassar Nazar, Sadiq Mohammad, Shoaib Mohammad, Mohsin Khan

Rank 3) Taufeeq Umar, Ramiz Raja, Salman Butt, Imran Nazir, Yasir Hameed, Saleem Elahi (bear in mind I'm also counting LOIs): useful in one format and poor in another.
 
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anyone remember at least 2 of his stumps being uprooted by devon malcolm in the 92 tour?
 
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