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How great was Barry Richards and where did he rank amongst the greats?

Harsh Thakor

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Although Barry Richards played only 4 official tests and a series of unofficial tests in Kerry Packer WSC he is widely regarded as the greatest post-war opening batsmen of all and a batsmen in the class of Sachin Tendulkar,Viv Richards or Sunil Gavaskar.

To me the game is not only about pure statistics but about flair,artistry,technique and domination.In first class cricket it was not just his staggering statistics but the way he attained them.Arguably no batsmen was ever as clinically perfect complete and no batsmen tore apart oppostion with such flawless technique.Barry was a surgeon ,artists and bulldozer rolled into one blending phenonemenal power with perfect technical skill and the creativity of a painter.No batsmen after Bradman looked more like a perfect cricketing machine.

The fact that he averaged over 79 in the competitive era of WSC supertsets speaks for itself.In both his best innings of 101 not out and 207 he overshadowed the genius Viv Richards.Barry also when scoring 356,including 325 runs in a day took cricketing art and domination to it's most supreme zenith facing bowlers like Lillee.Never forget the great bowling he demolished in 1st class cricket.

To me Barry virtually defined batting more than nay batsmen in anew golden age of cricket giving batting anew dimension.Barry was technical correctness personified and an epitome of domination over an oponent.

Above all Don Bradman rated Bary as the best right-handed opening batsmen he ever saw ,ahead of even Hutton,Hobbs and Gavaskar.

In my book Barry would rank only behind Bradman,Tendulkar,Viv Richards Lara,Hobbs,Sobers and Hammond as a batsmen. The only other cricketers I would rank ahead of Barry were Grace,Warne,Imran,Barnes,Marshall,Murlitharan Kallis,Botham ,Lillee ,Wasim ,Mcgrath and Hadlee.It is a virtual photo seperating Hutton and Gavaskar with Barry which I cannot decide at this moment.Still Barry would rate above greats like Ponting,Weekes,Compton,Headley,Pollock,Chappel bothers,Miandad,Border,Sangakaara etc.I think the game of cricket is more about aesthetics than mere statistics and Barry could make as great an impact on proceedings on his day as any superstar.I have been influenced a lot with his batting in Packer WSC games,whee he overshadowed the great Viv Richards.

John Woodcock ranked Barry as his 15th best cricketer ahead of even Imran and Lillee which I do no agree with.David Gower also placed him above Lillee .Graham Gooch and Dickie Bird rate Barry the most perfect and best batsmen they ever saw .Martin Crowe and Richard Hadlee chose Barry to join Hobbs in the all-time test xi.I feel lot of selectors of all-time xi's unfailrly chose Greenidge instead of Bary to join Gavaskar,Hutton or Hobbs.

Courtesy Madhusudhan Ramakrishnan

Performance of top batsmen in World Series Cricket Batsman Team Matches Innings Runs 100 50 Average
Barry Richards World XI 5 8 554 2 2 79.14
Vivian Richards West Indies and World XI 14 25 1281 4 4 55.69
Greg Chappell Australia 14 26 1415 5 4 56.60
David Hookes Australia 12 22 769 1 7 38.45
Clive Lloyd West Indies and World XI 13 21 683 1 3 37.94
Gordon Greenidge West Indies and World XI 13 23 754 1 4 35.90
Ian Chappell Australia 14 27 893 1 5 35.72

WSC was the most difficult test for batsmen due to incredible line up of pace bowlers present then. Many batsmen failed to perform at the end of the series and only a few were able to counter the aggressive bowling consistently. While the performance of Roberts, Holding, Lillee and Imran was more or less expected considering their reputation, the showing of the South African all-rounder Mike Procter and Garth le Roux was highly impressive. Dennis Lillee picked up the most wickets for Australia and was ably supported by Max Walker and later Jeff Thomson.


ALAN MCGILVRAY

Alan McGilvray, in his very informative and knowledgeable book, "The Game Goes On" as told to Norman Tusker, published after his retirement, in a chapter titled "Bradman Revisited", compares several leading batsmen (except Hayden, who was yet to emerge on the cricketing scene and Sachin Tendulkar who had just begun his career) to the great Don.

He rates the South African Barry Richards, now a leading commentator, who is one of those covering the present Test series between the Sri Lankans and the Proteas, as the closest to Bradman.

"Nobody will ever touch Bradman. He was one apart. Yet, through a couple of generations of cricketers since Bradman left center stage, comparisons have repeatedly been made, or at least attempted. Perhaps it is because those who saw him long to see something like him again. Maybe it is just the eternal hope that ultimate excellence regenerates itself. Whatever the basis of it, another Bradman is a tag that has been given to more than one young hopeful in the forty years since Bradman ended his playing days".

Citing a couple of examples of the new Bradman tag, McGilvray speaks of Ian Craig who first made the New South Wales team at 16, scored a magnificent double-century against South Africa at 17, and found himself in an Australian team of extraordinary talent and experience when still three months short of his 18th birthday.

There was a natural romance of one so young in the Australian side, which, boasted Arthur Morris, Lindsay Hassett, who succeeded Bradman as captain, Keith Miller, Neil Harvey, Bill Johnston and Douglas Ring, to say nothing of young bloods like Richie Benaud and Colin McDonald.

However, Craig found the Bradman comparison hard to live with. He failed in England in 1953, did a little better there in 1956 and ended up as captain of Australia at age 22. An illness thwarted his career thereafter. But McGilvray felt that Craig would have done so much more had the world not lined him up as another Don Bradman.

O'Neil too, found the weight of Bradman stature within the cricketing community, and particularly the press, weighing upon him.

O'Neil made a spectacular impact on Sheffield Shield cricket in the 1950s, scoring 1,005 runs in the 1957-58 season when he was just a lad of 21. Most of his runs came with a great flourish and he had some glorious strokes, wonderful strength off the blackfoot, an attitude that demanded he get on with it. He had also had enormous crowd appeal. O'Neil scored plenty of runs for Australia for seven or eight years and captured all those qualities of daring and aggression so admired in the Australian nature. But, another Bradman? That was asking too much, says the veteran broadcaster.

"I have watched many great players down the years and there is only one ever considered to be in the Bradman mould. I have seen the best from those who pre-dated Bradman like the remarkable Charlie Macartney, to contemporaries Bill Woodfull and Bill Ponsford through a plethora of world-class batsmen of every nation who have graced the game in the half-century since. For sure, there have been plenty of masterful players. Charlie Macartney was one of them. They called him the Governor-General, for his bearing at the wicket, one of total command".

"Charlie Macartney perhaps had Bradman's competitiveness. On his day, he certainly had his aggression and when things were right, much of his technical excellence. But for all his strengths, he could never put them all together, match in and match out, as Bradman could. He was no Bradman".

"Similarly Woodfull and Ponsford offered their particular strengths. But, they were no comparison to Bradman".

McGilvray says of Barry Richards, "In all the times since, only a handful of players have built careers to be mentioned in the same breath as Bradman. I narrow the field to one. By the test of technique and attitude and precision and performance, the only man I would measure against the Don is the South African Barry Richards. And, all things considered, I would suggest it would be a pretty close thing.

"There was so much about Barry Richards and Don Bradman that was similar. The anticipation and the speed with which they got themselves into position to play a shot. The timing and the power of their strokes. The thoughtful, analytical way they went about working out the bowling.

The manner in which they worked to dominate, then devastate, the best of attacks. Richards, if anything, was a little stronger than Bradman with shots on the off-side.

Bradman undoubtedly was more forceful and more effective than Richards when he played to the on-side. On either count, both were gloriously effective. Their footwork was supreme. They conserved their energy, waiting for the ball to come on and dispatching it with superb timing rather than brute power. Yet, they would dance to smother a spinner; their speed in getting into position seemed to give them so much more time, compared even to the greatest of players down the years".

Richards who launched himself almost at the precise moment when South Africa were banned from Test cricket due to its apartheid policies, could play in only four tests from 1969-70, with an average of 72 and included two centuries against the Australians.

His 140 in the second test when he passed 100 in just 116 balls, and Graeme Pollock who hit a majestic 274, consigned Australia to the scrap heap, says McGilvray. Richards scored 79 centuries in first class cricket.

"This cricket would have given Richards the hard edge he needed, enough, perhaps, even to have challenged the redoubtable Bradman".

"I have always liked to use a particular innings of each player as a measuring stick of just how similar their talents were. These were innings in which each of them scored 300 runs in a day. Bradman's was scored at Leeds in 1930 in a Test against England when Bradman was a 22-year-old prodigy.

Richards' was scored at perth in 1970, in a sheffield shield match between South Australia and Western Australia. Bradman went in eight minutes after the start of play at the fall of Archie Jackson's wicket, finished the day on 309 not out and was out next morning for 334. Richard opened up, ended the day on 325 not out, and was eventually out for 356".

"Bradman took 375 minutes to hit his 334 and hit 46 boundaries. Richards hit his 356 in 372 minutes. He found the boundary rope 48 times, and hit a six as well. It takes batsmen of rare quality to play like that. Neither player managed a century in each session in topping the 300.

Bradman hit 105 before lunch, 115 in the session between lunch and tea, and 89 in the final period when weariness was catching up with him. Richards hit 79 in the first session, 137 in the next and 109 in the last".

Both Bradman and Richards made these blistering triple centuries against very strong bowling attacks.

McGilvray says that "some would put Vivian Richards, the man who had been widely labelled as the Black Bradman, into the same class of supreme players to be measured with the Don. Great player Richards has been, he is limited when he is put against the standards of Bradman and Barry Richards".

In a world xi of his time I would always back Barry instead of anyone to bat with Gavaskar and would prefer Barry to open the all-time world xi than any batsmen because of his great attacking prowess.


QUOTING MARTIN CHANDLER

I have never enjoyed seeing Lancashire bested, but the prospect of watching Barry Richards and Gordon Greenidge continuing their partnership carried the day and I decided to go with him. The pair lifted the score to 200 before Richards, having comfortably outscored the powerful Greenidge, took one liberty too many with “Flat Jack” Simmons and was out for a glorious 128. Try as I might to put that day in perspective however I can’t – it still seems like yesterday – and in forty years I have never seen a batsman as good as Richards. Once or twice Brian Lara has come close, and occasionally I thought Martin Crowe might touch the same heights, but I know in my heart of hearts that I will never see Richards’ like again.

Richards is the greatest of my time, if not by a distance then certainly without a doubt, but few seem to agree. “Am I out of step, or is everyone else?” is the sort of question we are supposed to ask ourselves as part of a catharsis when we have made mistakes, and I have been there with Barry Richards, but nothing ever changes my mind about him, and while I am not about to suggest he was a greater batsman than Sir Donald Bradman, nor necessarily even his equal, I cannot get the thought out of my head that, had he not been a victim of the circumstances that did blight his career, Richards might have earned the right to be mentioned in the same breath as “The Don”.

Clearly that is an opinion I need to justify but I am not alone in holding it. As his career came to a close Tony Greig considered Richards to be the finest batsman in the world and expressed the view that in different circumstances I am convinced he could have rewritten the record books – and rewritten them with a style and grace matched by precious few players in the history of the game. And if that gives a clue to the way Richards batted John Arlott’s words he butchers bowling, hitting with a savage power the more impressive for being veiled by the certainty of his timing, are as good a summary as I have read.


And so to return to the comparison with Bradman. It is not without relevance to quote the great man himself on the subject of Richards; You could never tire of watching him ….. it was a privilege to see him play. The Don also had no hesitation in declaring that Richards was the best right-handed opening batsman he had seen. Perhaps he did not want to make a comparison with the left-handed Arthur Morris, who was Richards’ opening partner in his dream eleven, but he clearly ranked him above Len Hutton and Sir Jack Hobbs. The Master was past his best by the time Bradman encountered him, but he saw the best of Hutton.

That Bradman had advantages that Richards did not must be the case. For half of Bradman’s career he could not be out lbw to a delivery that pitched outside the off stump. Richards always could, and indeed for most of his time a delivery that did not strike him in line either, although that is perhaps a minor point – Barry Richards was not in the habit of not playing a shot in those circumstances. On another legal issue Bradman had uncovered wickets to contend with, although so did Richards for part of his career, and he also played much more of his cricket on the soft English wickets of the 1970s rather than the rock hard Australian shirtfronts that Bradman enjoyed in the 1930s.

S.RAJESH IN CRICINFO
In the first of the three Supertests he played that season for WSC World XI, in Sydney, Richards got starts in both innings but couldn't convert them into huge scores, scoring 57 and 48. Then came a truly magnificent display in the second match, which justified all the hype. Opening the innings with his Hampshire team-mate Gordon Greenidge, Richards scored a wonderful 207, adding 234 for the opening wicket before Greenidge was forced to retire hurt. That brought the other great Richards, Viv, to the wicket, and for the next few hours the Australian bowlers didn't know what hit them. Viv was generally a more destructive batsman, but on this day Barry outshone him, scoring 93 in the next 90 minutes, even as Viv made only 41. When Barry finally fell, the scoreboard read 369 for 1 in 60 eight-ball overs.

In the next Supertest, Barry made a half-century in the first innings but fell for a duck in the second as WSC World XI, chasing 272 for victory, fell 41 runs short. He finished the three matches with an aggregate of 388 runs in five innings, second only to Viv's 502. (Click here for more details.)

In the next season there was another Richards special, this time in the final of the World Series Supertests: in a tense, low-scoring game, where neither team had scored more than 219, WSC World XI needed to score 224 in the fourth innings. Richards stamped his presence on the chase with an outstanding unbeaten 101; the next-highest score from one of his team-mates in either innings was 44. At 84 for 4 the Australians had a slight edge, but Richards took on Dennis Lillee and Gary Gilmour and ultimately led his team to a five-wicket win.

Overall Barry Richards played only five Supertests, but he clearly left his mark - in eight innings he scored two hundreds and two fifties and averaged almost 80, which was easily the highest. Since he wasn't from Australia or West Indies he didn't play as many matches as the others, but that's hardly his fault.

QOUTING MARK NICHOLAS

Mark Nicholas: Barry Richards – A Genius In Straight Lines
October 9th, 2014



One-time AOC guest editor Mark Nicholas explains what made the great South African batsman Barry Richards his favourite player.

To me, cricket’s greatest appeal is in the aesthetics, and particularly in straight lines – I’ve always preferred say, Tendulkar to Lara – which isn’t to say I don’t like Lara – just that I like the exactness of straight lines.

When I first saw Barry, what I loved was the time he had to play, however challenging the bowler. Jeff Thomson was the first truly fast bowler I saw bowl at Barry and Barry had time to play him. He played fantastically, scoring 90-odd at Southampton against the Australian tourists in 1975. I liked the exactness of his technique, both against speed and spin.
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And then what I loved most of all was that he could use that to his advantage with his great sense of adventure. So, even when he was hitting inside out over extra cover – which in those days people didn’t really do – or backing away and late cutting, he was still doing it from a perfect technical foundation.

It may be that your thing is the Kevin Pietersen flamingo shot or the Garry Sobers back-foot drive from a half-volley. But mine was Barry using his imagination and sense of adventure to provide something close to perfect both when defending and attacking.

So risqué could he be that when you went to watch him you spent your time fearing he’d get out. That added such a frisson to the moments. But the truth is, Barry set out to entertain. He brought joy to a lot of people, but through that determination to entertain he also brought frustration – particularly in his own team, who could see that he when he got out for 100, he should have got 150 or 200. Instead, often he’d just hit it up in the air, because he’d got bored with the challenge.

People say it’s impossible to judge him because he only played four Test matches. That is a perfectly fair argument, but equally history shows that every challenge put before him, he rose to. When he went to play in the Sheffield Shield, his record was sans pareil. When he played in World Series Cricket, he thrived – I’ll never forget the fighting innings that won the Super Test Final against the Australians – when they threw everything at him, he made an unbeaten hundred and saw the Rest of the World through. His double hundred at Gloucester Park in conjunction with the other great strokemaking Richards – Viv – was also very special. In England, when the tourists came, Barry made runs against them. I believe that Test cricket would have been the next challenge that he would have mastered.

Of all the great honours that have been bestowed upon him in words, the one that might mean the most was being selected in Donald Bradman’s all-time XI – that gave him a rubber stamp from someone whose opinions became almost as important as his own batting.

Barry combined everything that I wanted out of batting and could do it all as if it was a walk in the park
 
Best batsman that I have ever seen, ahead of Viv Richards.
 
4 test matches.Almost every great in the game has Close to 50 or more.He doesnot avg 60-70 in FC despite not playing tests.No performance againist spinners on SC tracks.No way to put him up among the greats.He is a what could be case like Shane Bond.
 
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Ramprakash failed in tests while these guys shined whatever limited opportunities they got (tests or WSC)
 
Lillie has said toughest batsmen he has bowled against are two Richards and Sobers.
 
One thing for sure I believe - the best ever white man against spin.
 
At the end of the day it doesn't matter how talent he was or what he did in formats other than Tests, he played just 4 Tests and that itself disqualifies him from being compared to true established greats of the game. A player has not and can not become a great of the game without performing in Test cricket.
 
First class record suggests sub 60 avg in test cricket long term we'll never know but he was a great batsman in the making just didn't play enough tests.
 
he may be brilliant but he is irrelevant in history because he played less tests than umar akmal and faisal iqbal
 
To gain such critical acclaim without a long international career says a lot about how good he was.
 
I don't remember him but a friend saw him in County cricket. He said Richards made Snow and Underwood - arguably the best English quick and spinner of the last fifty years - look rubbish.

He averaged 79 in the Packer Supertests, though he only played five matches, facing Peak Lillee.
 
Guys like Richards, Pollock, Headley, Proctor will always be stuck in the limbo.

The fact remains SA started beating top class test teams right after coming from years of isolation. So, they always had a very rich tradition of domestic cricket culture going on and combine that with glowing testimony of observers and supreme stats tilt the argument in favor of these players for me.
 
I don't get how someone who played 4 Tests can be ranked among the greats.
 
I don't remember him but a friend saw him in County cricket. He said Richards made Snow and Underwood - arguably the best English quick and spinner of the last fifty years - look rubbish.

He averaged 79 in the Packer Supertests, though he only played five matches, facing Peak Lillee.

And you expect people to go by your friends words, who may or may not have exaggerated, based on a days play? What an analysis!
 
When did he played on turning bouncing subcontinental tracks?

There are spin tracks outside subcontinent as well - it's not a monopoly. I am quoting based on several spinners bowling against him throughout 70s, notably Bedi, Underwood & Intekhab.
 
To gain such critical acclaim without a long international career says a lot about how good he was.

Or, it says a lot about how his hype is mostly based on hearsay, assumption, word of mouth and hero worship rather than cast-iron numbers and consistent performances. You are already seeing it all over this thread. Legends never live up to their reputation in reality.
 
Or, it says a lot about how his hype is mostly based on hearsay, assumption, word of mouth and hero worship rather than cast-iron numbers and consistent performances. You are already seeing it all over this thread. Legends never live up to their reputation in reality.

Possibly. But the thing is Richards has faced several international bowlers like Lillie in domestic circuit and did quite well.

The most direct comparison is both him and Greenidge opened for the same team in county cricket and Richards averaged 50 while Greenidge averaged 45 iirc and we all know how good Greenidge was
 
Javed Miandad scored 1800+ runs in his first 20 matches at an avg of 70.

During this period he faced Lille, Hadlee, Botham, Willis and many more.
 
There are spin tracks outside subcontinent as well - it's not a monopoly. I am quoting based on several spinners bowling against him throughout 70s, notably Bedi, Underwood & Intekhab.

There is a hell lot of difference between a spinning track in Asia and outside.The turn is much quicker and bounce more disconcerting and turn appears earlier.

He never faced the spin quatret together.Its different facing Bedi Prasanna Venkat chandra in 4 different teams and facing 3 of them in India together.

Gavaskar was a much better player of Spin than Barry Richards.So was Zaheer Abbas.
 
And the best batsman he saw was gavaskar :)

But that doesnt matter.Because Barry Richards was the best.

Some here say he is the best againist pace.MMHS says he is the best againist spin.Basically best ever.
 
He was no doubt one of the best . How big he would have made had he played 50 - 60 test matches.
 
There is a hell lot of difference between a spinning track in Asia and outside.The turn is much quicker and bounce more disconcerting and turn appears earlier.

He never faced the spin quatret together.Its different facing Bedi Prasanna Venkat chandra in 4 different teams and facing 3 of them in India together.

Gavaskar was a much better player of Spin than Barry Richards.So was Zaheer Abbas.

??!!! you missed my post completely - "the best ever white man against spin". Not only those two, but I believe Javed, Azhar (uddin) & Lara were better spin player than BA Richards - probably YK, ST, RD & GR Vishi as well.
 
But that doesnt matter.Because Barry Richards was the best.

Some here say he is the best againist pace.MMHS says he is the best againist spin.Basically best ever.


Read MMHS's post first, instead of looking at his flag - your eyes won't deceive you then.
 
To gain such critical acclaim without a long international career says a lot about how good he was.

No ... it tells you how strong the hold is of crickets propaganda machinery from the Anglo press and writers. People still blindly believe whatever was written even though the evidence suggests otherwise.

here watch for yourselves : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVjA9vI-i18&t

None of the Barry Richards supporters have been able to justify that "Technique".
 
You can't rank anyone in true sense if player has not played enough international cricket.
 
Or, it says a lot about how his hype is mostly based on hearsay, assumption, word of mouth and hero worship rather than cast-iron numbers and consistent performances. You are already seeing it all over this thread. Legends never live up to their reputation in reality.

You don't give credence to his Packer scores? He averaged about 20 more than Viv Richards and Greg Chappell, albeit from fewer tests.
 
He has got so much time to play his shots as compared to the other guy.

look at the footwork (which is non-existant) and the bowling quality which is friendly at best. the footage has ordinary cricket written all over it.
 
He does not rank among the greats. He simply did not do enough in tests. Granted it is not his fault and he was off to a great start but we do not talk about "what could have been?" People can bring in his other records but they do not matter. Tests are considered as a yardstick for doing well and he did not play enough. No one apart from some "experts" here even talk about him. He is not even a footnote in cricket history.
 
??!!! you missed my post completely - "the best ever white man against spin". Not only those two, but I believe Javed, Azhar (uddin) & Lara were better spin player than BA Richards - probably YK, ST, RD & GR Vishi as well.

Among white men Gooch Kallis KP were better players of spin than Barry Richards.Infact we cannot judge his batting againist spin on basis of playing in England.
 
Among white men Gooch Kallis KP were better players of spin than Barry Richards.Infact we cannot judge his batting againist spin on basis of playing in England.

But, looks like you can judge that the 3 you mentioned are better players of spin than him.

Anyway, Richards & Gooch were contemporary players and played in County in similar times for a decade - County spinners rate Richards better spin player than Gooch, I'll belive their comments, in this regard. KP, Kallis - may be, I don't know; KP was among top 3/4 in my list always, but not sure about Kallis - I believe, spin play doesn't mean dead bat blocking whole day.
 
He played 4 tests which isn't enough for him to be ranked amongst the greats.
 
You don't give credence to his Packer scores? He averaged about 20 more than Viv Richards and Greg Chappell, albeit from fewer tests.

He didnt score runs againist WI bowlers.

Almost all his runs came againist Aus11 which had one ATG bowler Lillee.
 
But, looks like you can judge that the 3 you mentioned are better players of spin than him.

Anyway, Richards & Gooch were contemporary players and played in County in similar times for a decade - County spinners rate Richards better spin player than Gooch, I'll belive their comments, in this regard. KP, Kallis - may be, I don't know; KP was among top 3/4 in my list always, but not sure about Kallis - I believe, spin play doesn't mean dead bat blocking whole day.

They werent contemporaries.

There was a decade of difference between them.County spinners mean little to me.Gooch batted on minefields in India and scored runs.

Kallis scored enough runs in India when rest of the world were falling like nine pins.
 
Tough to rate up there among the very best with just a few Tests and WSC games under his belt. Wasn't his fault tho obviously very unfortunate.
 
I seen his batting on YouTube. He is over rated on PP. His shot placement was a bit sketchy at times and I did come across a wild swing or two.
 
They werent contemporaries.

There was a decade of difference between them.County spinners mean little to me.Gooch batted on minefields in India and scored runs.

Kallis scored enough runs in India when rest of the world were falling like nine pins.

I am not sure what you are up to here, but since you bothered to respond, let's dig a bit more now. Gooch was born in '53, Richards '47, interestingly in 3 days apart of July & I knew that from the start, because they share my birth month. Those two played almost a decade together in Counties, in a 20 years career span, therefore I believe they are more contemporary than a decade apart, but let's not argue here.

Coming to GG & BAR, your first filter was BAR didn't master the fearsome Indian spin quartet, but neither did Gooch - he first played against IND, in IND was 1979 .

Next comes on "Gooch batted on minefields in India and scored runs" part, which needs a bit closer scrutiny -

GG had played 9 Tests in IND, and this is his stats : 9 Test - 16 innings - 2 Not Outs - 571 Runs - 42.21 Average - 1 Century - 4 Fifties.

If you ask me - that's at best average or may be a bit above, noting, one of the greatest ever white man, may be your standard for the white men isn't that high. But, I decided to dig in a bit deeper - here are GGs innings in India

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...=6;template=results;type=batting;view=innings


For the sake of argument, Gooch's BIG innings in IND, based on which he was a master of spin was his following Tests

Mumbai: 8, 49*
Bangalore : 58, 40
Calcutta : 71, 20*
Madras : 127
Kanpur: 58
Rest are basically single digit scores (now, don't come back to say that there were couple of double digit as well).

Digging a bit deeper, this is what I found as mine field -

Bombay: IND 242 & 149; ENG 296 & 98/0 (10 Wicket win, in a match Botham took 13 wickets, & 2 Indian spinners Yadav & Doshi bowled 41 overs in total)
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/17057/scorecard/63262/India-vs-England-Only-Test

Bangalore : ENG 400 & 173/3; IND 428
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/17025/scorecard/63299/India-vs-England-2nd-Test

Delhi: ENG 476/9d & 68/0; IND 487
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/17025/scorecard/63300/India-vs-England-3rd-Test

Calcutta: 248, 265/5d, IND 203, 170/3
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/17025/scorecard/63301/India-vs-England-4th-Test

Madras: 481/4d & 160/3d; ENG 328
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/17025/scorecard/63302/India-vs-England-5th-Test

Kanpur: ENG 378/9d; IND 377/7d
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/17025/scorecard/63303/India-vs-England-6th-Test

I haven't seen those Tests, therefore can't tell actually what explosive was used in those mines, but from scorecard it looks that must have been damp.

Besides, he basically scored in IND, in that one 1980-81 series, when he scored 487 @ 54+ in 6 Tests, in what was one of the most boring & high scoring series that saw the first Test won by hosts on a turner and GG's score was 2 & 1 (He in fact didn't last long enough to face spinners in either innings)
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/...dia-vs-England-1st-Test-England-tour-of-India

Rest 5 Tests ended in draws with highest wickets down in one Test was 28 (103 in 5 Tests, out of possible 200).
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/series/61792.html

Also, since you are too specific about the the quality of the spinners - the spinners that IND used in that Series 1980-81 was Shivlal Yadav, Dulip Doshi, Ravi Shastri & Kirti Azad (few from Srikkanth as well ...). Now, I do understand, you have a bit of soft corners for Indian players, any of them, but I believe neutral world would give a bit more weight to the County spinners like Underwood, Bedi, Intekhab, Gifford, Embury, Edmonds ... than these GREATS (Interestingly, Doshi was one of those County admirers of BA Richards, during his County days - you can still find it in some archives of "Desh" magazine).

I never argue on such subjective calls - I take my inputs from several sources on this one & from there my understanding was that Richards was one of the best ever spin players outside Asia - that's what I believe, I can't force others, but obviously we can discuss in proper spirit. BA Richards didn't play any Test after 1970 & that AUS side didn't have any decent spinner, let alone great - this is enough to put a counter argument - you don't need to glorify Indian spin attack for this.


Hope, it helps you better in you next effort ...........
 
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You can't rank anyone in true sense if player has not played enough international cricket.
It depends upon the quality of what they played.

He played 5 SuperTests - matches of a far, far higher level of difficulty than anything modern Test players ever play on their flat, grassless little pitches with their Kookaburra balls with no seam.

I agree with Imran Khan and Dennis Lillee in their claims that each of their SuperTests was worth 10 of their Tests. So by that measure, Barry Richards had a career equivalent to 54 Test matches.
 
You don't give credence to his Packer scores? He averaged about 20 more than Viv Richards and Greg Chappell, albeit from fewer tests.
This is everything anyone needs to know.

That's why Barry Richards was the greatest batsman I've ever seen, and almost certainly the greatest since Bradman.
 
They werent contemporaries.

There was a decade of difference between them.County spinners mean little to me.Gooch batted on minefields in India and scored runs.

Kallis scored enough runs in India when rest of the world were falling like nine pins.
You are showing your (lack of) age.

"County spinners"?

Bishan Bedi on a dusty square turner at Northampton.

Emburey, Edmonds and Titmus at Lords, one of the greatest spin attacks the world has ever seen.

Don Shepherd - who died last week - who took over 2,000 wickets.

When Barry Richards played county cricket, he did so in an era of 4 or 5 overseas players per team.

And he scored a lot of runs against the spin bowlers who in the All-Time Test wicket list for spinners were at:

NUMBER 1 - Lance Gibbs - 309 wickets
NUMBER 2 - Derek Underwood - 297 wickets
NUMBER 3 - Bishan Bedi - 266 wickets

Barry Richards dominated the three spinners who were the Top Three in the all-time Test wicket list.
 
You are showing your (lack of) age.

"County spinners"?

Bishan Bedi on a dusty square turner at Northampton.

Emburey, Edmonds and Titmus at Lords, one of the greatest spin attacks the world has ever seen.

Don Shepherd - who died last week - who took over 2,000 wickets.

When Barry Richards played county cricket, he did so in an era of 4 or 5 overseas players per team.

And he scored a lot of runs against the spin bowlers who in the All-Time Test wicket list for spinners were at:

NUMBER 1 - Lance Gibbs - 309 wickets
NUMBER 2 - Derek Underwood - 297 wickets
NUMBER 3 - Bishan Bedi - 266 wickets

Barry Richards dominated the three spinners who were the Top Three in the all-time Test wicket list.

I forgot that Gibbs also played for Warwickshire that time.
 
He played 5 SuperTests - matches of a far, far higher level of difficulty than anything modern Test players ever play on their flat, grassless little pitches with their Kookaburra balls with no seam.
.

Try getting your hands on a SG TestMatch cricket ball ... It *Might* make a difference to your "OLD is Gold" theme. But then again ... video evidence, simple logic and blunt facts could not even make a dent to your staunch stubborn belief that almost everything we see today is of inferior quality .... so Iam not going to hold my breath that this will do any difference. :))

But I await your response on why we are supposed to believe that batsmanship as seen in this clip is of superior quality to anything that we see from the likes of Kohli, Root, Smith, ABD , SRT, Ponting, Lara etc etc ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVjA9vI-i18

Please stick to the batting technique and bowling quality ( not the names again !! ). I am well aware of the name dropping and certificates of achievements that you will reach out for to. They mean very little to me.

So explain away ... Ball 1 in that clip... why is that shot so out of the world ?

Keep in mind that this clip is from his prime and supposedly the best inngs he played.
 
[MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION]

Your request is plain silly. 99% of shots in any First Class innings display ordinary technique: I don't even understand what you think is missing.

This is an innings in which Richards scored 325 not out in a day, completely outpacing Ian Chappell who was a top, top batsman, against two ATG Australian quick bowlers, plus the best slow left-arm chucker of all-time.

The thing about Richards is that against pace, against swing, against seam and against spin he had more time than ANY other batsman. And he played at the same time as Viv Richards, Garry Sobers, Graeme Pollock and Greg Chappell, all of whom are on the All-Time Top Ten batsmen.

The only reference you need is "averaged 79 in Packer SuperTests", while batsmen generally averaged 5-10 LESS than their Test averages. While Richards averaged 20 more than Viv Richards or Greg Chappell.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Kerry Packer didn't even try to sign Sunil Gavaskar, because he had Barry Richards. Packer didn't like limited defensive robots, which is why he didn't want Boycott or Gavaskar.
 
You are showing your (lack of) age.

"County spinners"?

Bishan Bedi on a dusty square turner at Northampton.

Emburey, Edmonds and Titmus at Lords, one of the greatest spin attacks the world has ever seen.

Don Shepherd - who died last week - who took over 2,000 wickets.

When Barry Richards played county cricket, he did so in an era of 4 or 5 overseas players per team.

And he scored a lot of runs against the spin bowlers who in the All-Time Test wicket list for spinners were at:

NUMBER 1 - Lance Gibbs - 309 wickets
NUMBER 2 - Derek Underwood - 297 wickets
NUMBER 3 - Bishan Bedi - 266 wickets

Barry Richards dominated the three spinners who were the Top Three in the all-time Test wicket list.

Playing for a county was same playing for your nation.

Playing Bishan Bedi on a nottingham wicket is same as playing Bedi Chandra Prasanna on a spinning spitting minefield at Bangalore or Mumbai or Kolkata.Right?

Or playing Abdul Qadir in Karachi or Faislabad when you have already been peppered by Imran and Sarfaraz.


So how much did Barry Richards avg in First class cricket?Considering his avg wont be brought down by playing test cricket i am assuming Barry Richards avgd 60 plus in FC?
 
[MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION]

Your request is plain silly. 99% of shots in any First Class innings display ordinary technique: I don't even understand what you think is missing.

This is an innings in which Richards scored 325 not out in a day, completely outpacing Ian Chappell who was a top, top batsman, against two ATG Australian quick bowlers, plus the best slow left-arm chucker of all-time.

The thing about Richards is that against pace, against swing, against seam and against spin he had more time than ANY other batsman. And he played at the same time as Viv Richards, Garry Sobers, Graeme Pollock and Greg Chappell, all of whom are on the All-Time Top Ten batsmen.

The only reference you need is "averaged 79 in Packer SuperTests", while batsmen generally averaged 5-10 LESS than their Test averages. While Richards averaged 20 more than Viv Richards or Greg Chappell.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Kerry Packer didn't even try to sign Sunil Gavaskar, because he had Barry Richards. Packer didn't like limited defensive robots, which is why he didn't want Boycott or Gavaskar.

Packer "Super Tests" have ZERO value.They are unrecognised unofficial mohalla matches.

All Barry Richards runs bar a 37 came againist Aus11.In one of the matches Lillee didnot play.So the runs mean ZILCH.

Sunil Gavaskar has 10k test runs.He doesnt need Kerry Packers endorsement.
 
[MENTION=134300]Tusker[/MENTION]

Your request is plain silly. 99% of shots in any First Class innings display ordinary technique: I don't even understand what you think is missing.

That make no sense whatsoever .... so batsmen in those days had 2 different techniques for Tests and FC Matches ? If so its news to me.

As I said the reason for including that footage is because it is hailed as one of the finest innings ever played by Barry.

This is an innings in which Richards scored 325 not out in a day, completely outpacing Ian Chappell who was a top, top batsman, against two ATG Australian quick bowlers, plus the best slow left-arm chucker of all-time.

Not interested in names. only interested in the cricket. So talk about the actual batting styles and techniques ... and the logic is very simple ... if the bloke is soo outrageously good as you try to paint him it should be very obviously visible in the footage. So

The thing about Richards is that against pace, against swing, against seam and against spin he had more time than ANY other batsman. And he played at the same time as Viv Richards, Garry Sobers, Graeme Pollock and Greg Chappell, all of whom are on the All-Time Top Ten batsmen.

The only reference you need is "averaged 79 in Packer SuperTests", while batsmen generally averaged 5-10 LESS than their Test averages. While Richards averaged 20 more than Viv Richards or Greg Chappell.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Kerry Packer didn't even try to sign Sunil Gavaskar, because he had Barry Richards. Packer didn't like limited defensive robots, which is why he didn't want Boycott or Gavaskar.

Back to name dropping arent we ... ? :facepalm:


[MENTION=76058]cricketjoshila[/MENTION] has answered the flaw in your "Avg 79 in SuperTests " theory. Moreover they are made in just a handful of Super Tests so again another big flaw even if we were to pretend that they were of better standard than any Test Cricket.
 
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