"I still do not understand the grounds for my dismissal" : Nawaz Sharif

[MenInG]

Nawaz Sharif, who was ousted from office for the third time on July 28, while addressing his party's leadership on Saturday expressed disbelief over the grounds for his dismissal, but resolved to continue struggling for the supremacy of the Constitution and rule of law in the country.

"I still do not understand the grounds for my dismissal," Nawaz Sharif said during a parliamentary committee meeting. "I am only content that I was not disqualified on the grounds of alleged corruption."

"When I never took a salary, what would I declare?" he asked, referring to the Supreme Court judgement that led to his ouster.

The joint investigation team report examined by the SC during the course of the Panamagate hearings revealed that Nawaz Sharif had not declared on his nomination papers for the 2013 General Election an income of 10,000 dirhams drawn from a Dubai-based company between Aug 7, 2006 and April 20, 2014.

"I was in exile and getting a visa at that time was difficult. When I went to London for Saudi Arabia, I could not live there for over six months. I had to travel to another country and return... So I would get my visa from Dubai every six months since London was the centre of our politics," he explained.

"So to get a visa, we thought, this would be a legal method ─ my son opened a company... He made me the chairman. And a salary was decided since you are required to be a salaried individual," he added.

"They disqualified me for not receiving a salary. Since it was not received, it is an asset that had to be declared. It is my son's company, not the government's company, and I was not making millions out of it," he claimed.

"When you take something, there's a problem; when you don't, there's a problem," he observed.

"Is it only my family that should be held accountable? Is everyone else in this country sadiq and ameen?" he asked.

"Some people urged me to resign, but I told them that it is not a bed of roses, but a bed of thorns that I am sitting on, and my conscience is telling me not to resign because I did nothing wrong."

"My conscience is clear," he continued. "If I had done something wrong; or taken something from this country that was not mine, I would have felt the guilt myself," he said.

"Maybe some 20 years ago I was not so ideological but time and various events have made me ideological. Living outside your country for seven years is not easy."

"My struggles throughout my life — to be exiled, to be jailed, to be sentenced for 27 years in jail, to be called a hijacker when I was the sitting prime minister — I have seen all that and suffered all that. There have been prime ministers before me, they've been hanged, and you've seen that."

"The way forward is clear: there should be supremacy of the Constitution and the rule of law. We've had regrettable moments in our history, but our future should be free of these regrets. We should all sit together and contemplate: how do we run this country better?" he continued.

"I do not care for myself: I only care for this country and its people," the former prime minister said.

"Everyone in the world is talking about this judgement: read their publications. See what they're saying. What more can I add?" he said.

"Nonetheless, like a jawaan who is willing to sacrifice himself for the country, I will always defend the rule of law and the Constitution for this country," he said. "I want my party leaders to support me in this. The 200 million people in this country are looking at you. Whatever happened has happened: I am happy there's no blemish on my character."

"We have to change Pakistan. I will support you day and night. I do not want power — this will be my struggle for the country. If we do right by this country, we will walk with our heads held high. I am no longer the prime minister, but I am still willing to do my bit."

"I do not want my life's work to go to waste. I want my struggles to bear fruit for this country. The 200 million people of this country deserve it. Again, I have no thirst for power. I no longer desire office — I only desire that my country is free of its burdens."

"What I have done for this country should be accepted," he said, reminding the party of his hand in various infrastructural and power projects, including the Lowari Tunnel and the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor, the performance of the economy, and various social uplift projects like the PM's Health Card Scheme.

"I do not mean to sing my own praises, but I do want that my services to this country are acknowledged," Nawaz said. "The way we have been treated is shameful, and it should not have been so."

"We should not be destined to remain wayward wanderers. Please support me in leading this country forward. I promise you that this country will become a beautiful nation one day."

https://www.dawn.com/news/1348403/m...ddresses-party-workers-after-disqualification

 

[Napa]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

 

[mmkextreme_1]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

This is why a system of checks and balances are put in place. The job of the judiciary branch of government is to make sure this stuff is stamped out. Just like here in the US, a President is caught in a corruption scandal like this, you better believe he will be impeached. This has nothing to do with people electing a leader, it's about principle.

 

[proud_pakistani]

Yes as per Nawaz Sharif the commissions he makes on projects make no harm to the country. The bridges he builds which are primarily made so that they can give the steel contracts to Ittefaq
industries has no harm on the country. When he forges documents and influences government institutions like NAB and SECP it is all normal. Why has he been disqualified?

 

[Arham_PakFan]

Read the JIT report as well as the Supreme courts report.Maybe then you will understand.

 

[proud_pakistani]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

How can the people decided if a person is corrupt or not? What proofs do they have. They will believe what the media tells them and where propaganda is strongest. Only institutions like NAB, JIT and SC can make such decisions.

As per your theory the public shud read the JIT report and we should have a vote whether PM is Sadiq and Ameen. If you expect aam awaam to be able to interpret the report then why do lawyers study so hard and go through such a rigorous time. There are some things which only professionals can do.

 

[RickyG]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

Does PP have a "Stupid Post of the Week" award? If so, here is your winner.

What kind of democracy doesn't have a judicial system? What kind of democracy doesn't have criteria that needs to be fulfilled before one can run for office?

And you're wrong about the economy but I'm curious to know what prompted you to make that ill-informed statement?

 

[King-Misbah]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

The fundamentals of democracy is a check and balance system between the three institutions. Without this check, the democratic system is a sham.

 

[Pakpak]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

Deficits breaking all records, energy projects down in the dump, our loans from low 20s are now nearly $100 billion, our economy has been an utter disaster. For every 100 cents we earn we have to pay 45 cents back.
[MENTION=26195]DW44[/MENTION] and [MENTION=138463]Slog[/MENTION] can explain more.

As for judges, Nawaz led the last PM's removal in 2012, infact cheer-led and demanded that SC remove Gilani. Which they did.

What influenced their judgement? Take your pick:

-fake letters
-saying one thing in a speech, then something different in Parliament and then complete u-turn in the Court
-forging fake signatures
-bogus money trail contradicted by official documents from England and UAE
-fake stamps on documents
-holding iqamas and jobs in another nation while being PM
-unable to account how his teenage kids bought flats worth 8 million pounds when he became PM

I mean which excuse do you need? The above are all established facts, which weren't even disputed by his legal team in the end. And faking signaures and faking documents in court carries a prison sentence under our law.

Quit trolling and post something of substance instead of your usual nonsense.

 

[Slog]

Thats why you keep getting dismissed

Third time you have been sent packing and youre still clueless?

 

[Pakpak]

[MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] add to the fact his new off-shore company, which was running losses in millions yet somehow still managed to send ten times that to Nawaz's account.

I mean please don't start with this nonsense. He would be dismissed a thousand times.

 

[PakLFC]

He will never understand because he does not consider treachery and theft as being crimes. He believes that looting the country was part of his job during his tenure as PM.

 

[Poutine]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

Wait,what? So if an elected official commits a crime, the courts should do nothing and wait for the people to decide?

 

[Syed1]

He will never understand because he does not consider treachery and theft as being crimes. He believes that looting the country was part of his job during his tenure as PM.

He would have continued to rule hadn't it been for that pesky Army and their deep state sazish along with the help they received from their puppet who is also a Jewish agent at the same time.

 

[Pakpak]

Thats why you keep getting dismissed

Third time you have been sent packing and youre still clueless?

I just don't get them, in these statements they also start giving more money trails. Where was all this when the judges, LITERALLY, begged them to show it? I remember one Justice saying ''kuch toh dekha dein humein, please just something''.

 

[Pakpak]

He would have continued to rule hadn't it been for that pesky Army and their deep state sazish along with the help they received from their puppet who is also a Jewish agent at the same time.

Army adores Nawaz, this notion he's their man is so silly I find it hard to fathom people believe it. Zia's Minister, took ISI's money to beat Benazir, daughter married a captain and then surviving 2014 dharnas, Model town killings and Dawn leeaks because of Army.

 

[Savak]

He can pretend to misunderstand as much as he wants, deep down he knows.

 

[Pakpak]

[MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] and other trolls, this was the ruling party's reaction when Nawaz led mass protests in 2012 which resulted in the Supreme Court dismissing our then PM Gilani of PPP. Over one unwritten response to some court letter, that's it, not even corruption.

 

[DRsohail]

[MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] and other trolls, this was the ruling party's reaction when Nawaz led mass protests in 2012 which resulted in the Supreme Court dismissing our then PM Gilani of PPP. Over one unwritten response to some court letter, that's it, not even corruption.

View attachment 75668

meetama karrha karrhwa tu wali bat ha,,noon league....lolz

 

[Hamza78]

Gali gali main shore hai nawaz sharif chor hai

 

[90MPH]

The truth is He understands very well.

He should have completely stopped the corruption game personally (not withstanding whatever he did in the past) once he was in power if he truly wanted to redeem himself but the evidence is clear he didn't want to or couldn't turn the tap off.

Now he has paid the price for that decision and his constant denials isn't going to convince anyone but his die hard supporters.

 

[from_da_lost_dim3nsion]

Hota,hota hia .... Jab Dil per chot lagti hai to uska asar seedha dimagh per hota .

 

[srh]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

The bold line is an extremely stupid remark from you. You have no idea what is the meaning of democracy. Corruption is a criminal offence. Democracy does not give rulers right to indulge in corruption without mean any fear of law.

 

[ahmedwaqas92]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

Obviously you're trolling because I've read your previous posts on various other issues.

Either this was a brainfade or a sorry attempt to rile PP up because factually what you're written is as good as toilet paper.

What I don't understand is the Matam and Afsoos Indians are having on the disqualification of Nawaz, (it would entirely seem as if SC had disqualified an Indian PM )

It's evident that Indians by large do not want anything positive coming out of Pakistan that the majority of Pakistanis support. The hate is indoctrined into you guys so deep that it's actually sad to see you resort to idiocy to put down this historic SC decision. I just hope you lot find peace in future - let it go brother.

 

[Napa]

This is why a system of checks and balances are put in place. The job of the judiciary branch of government is to make sure this stuff is stamped out. Just like here in the US, a President is caught in a corruption scandal like this, you better believe he will be impeached. This has nothing to do with people electing a leader, it's about principle.

How can the people decided if a person is corrupt or not? What proofs do they have. They will believe what the media tells them and where propaganda is strongest. Only institutions like NAB, JIT and SC can make such decisions.

As per your theory the public shud read the JIT report and we should have a vote whether PM is Sadiq and Ameen. If you expect aam awaam to be able to interpret the report then why do lawyers study so hard and go through such a rigorous time. There are some things which only professionals can do.

Does PP have a "Stupid Post of the Week" award? If so, here is your winner.

What kind of democracy doesn't have a judicial system? What kind of democracy doesn't have criteria that needs to be fulfilled before one can run for office?

And you're wrong about the economy but I'm curious to know what prompted you to make that ill-informed statement?

[MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] add to the fact his new off-shore company, which was running losses in millions yet somehow still managed to send ten times that to Nawaz's account.

I mean please don't start with this nonsense. He would be dismissed a thousand times.

Wait,what? So if an elected official commits a crime, the courts should do nothing and wait for the people to decide?

[MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] and other trolls, this was the ruling party's reaction when Nawaz led mass protests in 2012 which resulted in the Supreme Court dismissing our then PM Gilani of PPP. Over one unwritten response to some court letter, that's it, not even corruption.

View attachment 75668

The bold line is an extremely stupid remark from you. You have no idea what is the meaning of democracy. Corruption is a criminal offence. Democracy does not give rulers right to indulge in corruption without mean any fear of law.

Guys, it is your country, you have to fix it. If I give you advice, you can reject it, but there is no reason to get agitated or abusive. I am not that devious to spend my time giving people advice that I have calculated will somehow harm them.

Generally, I get the feeling that you do not trust elections and think that the elites should decide rather than the people. If that works, more power to you. If Pakistan succeeds and is prosperous, that is not only good for Pakistanis but also Indians.

Come back to this thread after 5 or 10 years and see if things worked out the way you are hoped for with an elected PM being dismissed by un-elected judges.

 

[mmkextreme_1]

Guys, it is your country, you have to fix it. If I give you advice, you can reject it, but there is no reason to get agitated or abusive. I am not that devious to spend my time giving people advice that I have calculated will somehow harm them.

Generally, I get the feeling that you do not trust elections and think that the elites should decide rather than the people. If that works, more power to you. If Pakistan succeeds and is prosperous, that is not only good for Pakistanis but also Indians.

Come back to this thread after 5 or 10 years and see if things worked out the way you are hoped for with an elected PM being dismissed by un-elected judges.

It's not about our advice or your advice. It's about a system that is put in place. What you're saying doesn't make sense. How can one "elect" judges? Remember these judges are chosen by the government. Your ignoring the fact, the judiciary branch of government is put in place to keep a balance between other branches. Just like other branches do the same to it.

If one is committing corruption then they are breaking a law. Which comes under the system of the courts. What you're saying, its ok to break the law? Law and order are what holds the society together. With this decision from the supreme court, it lets everyone know that no one is above the law. It has nothing to do with whether one is elected or not.

 

[WebGuru]

In a democracy, it is for the people to decide by means of elections whether a PM is corrupt or not, and whether he should remain in office.

Instead here you have 5 unelected elites removing a legally elected PM. Who are these 5 judges? Who and what influenced their judgement? We will never know.

The last few years with Nawaz as PM have probably been the best for Pakistan's economy for a long time. This is my opinion, if the facts are otherwise I am willing to change my opinion. The removal of Nawaz by judges is bad for both Pakistan's democracy and economy.

So in short democracy gives you a 5 year license to do whatever you want? including murders of pregnant women like they did in model town or corruption of trillions? or using state machinery against their enemies. How many crimes of Sharifs you want me to mention?

 

[WebGuru]

Guys, it is your country, you have to fix it. If I give you advice, you can reject it, but there is no reason to get agitated or abusive. I am not that devious to spend my time giving people advice that I have calculated will somehow harm them.

Generally, I get the feeling that you do not trust elections and think that the elites should decide rather than the people. If that works, more power to you. If Pakistan succeeds and is prosperous, that is not only good for Pakistanis but also Indians.

Come back to this thread after 5 or 10 years and see if things worked out the way you are hoped for with an elected PM being dismissed by un-elected judges.

Elites? So who are these Sharifs? A middle class man can't even think about contesting in elections thanks to this fixed rigged corrupt system forget about winning because you need at least 3 to 5 crore for your election campaign.

 

[ExpressPacer]

[MENTION=142162]Napa[/MENTION] and other trolls, this was the ruling party's reaction when Nawaz led mass protests in 2012 which resulted in the Supreme Court dismissing our then PM Gilani of PPP. Over one unwritten response to some court letter, that's it, not even corruption.

View attachment 75668

So many grammatical mistakes in all of her tweets and she claims to have a Masters from some top school.

 

[ExpressPacer]

So in short democracy gives you a 5 year license to do whatever you want? including murders of pregnant women like they did in model town or corruption of trillions? or using state machinery against their enemies. How many crimes of Sharifs you want me to mention?

Exactly. It is beyond me how supporters of Nawaz Sharif can actually even try to justify this. My own father, who is an extremely qualified lawyer has started supporting Nawaz Sharif over the years and he justified his crimes as calling it his right as he was in power. PMLN supporters don't support any logic.

 

[Cricket lover 27]

Well how about looting the country for one!!!

 

[WebGuru]

Exactly. It is beyond me how supporters of Nawaz Sharif can actually even try to justify this. My own father, who is an extremely qualified lawyer has started supporting Nawaz Sharif over the years and he justified his crimes as calling it his right as he was in power. PMLN supporters don't support any logic.

TBH when i look at the thinking level of majority of my nation i think we don't deserve democracy.

 

[Pakpak]

Guys, it is your country, you have to fix it. If I give you advice, you can reject it, but there is no reason to get agitated or abusive. I am not that devious to spend my time giving people advice that I have calculated will somehow harm them.

Generally, I get the feeling that you do not trust elections and think that the elites should decide rather than the people. If that works, more power to you. If Pakistan succeeds and is prosperous, that is not only good for Pakistanis but also Indians.

Come back to this thread after 5 or 10 years and see if things worked out the way you are hoped for with an elected PM being dismissed by un-elected judges.

The only Indian who has shown goodwill after this decision has been [MENTION=76058]cricketjoshila[/MENTION]. And he knows every Pakistani here disagrees with him on literally every single issue but fair play to him.

 

[santos11]

I agree that it's unfortunate how a democratically elected leader of the people has been forcibly removed by the Forces loyal to the Army. In the longer run, it would mean the death of democracy in Pakistan and further weakening of it's institutions.

The same people who are rejocing today will mourn in the future when their beloved leader will be removed and replaced by another crook appointed by the Army.

 

[WebGuru]

I agree that it's unfortunate how a democratically elected leader of the people has been forcibly removed by the Forces loyal to the Army. In the longer run, it would mean the death of democracy in Pakistan and further weakening of it's institutions.

The same people who are rejocing today will mourn in the future when their beloved leader will be removed and replaced by another crook appointed by the Army.

Still better thn a mass murderer running the biggest democracy...

 

[hafeezrocks]

Lol the Indians are constantly whining over the disqualification of NS.

 

[Eagle_Eye]

It doesn't surprise me. First they couldn't even forge properly and now seemingly none of them can read....

 

[CricketCartoons]

Lol the Indians are constantly whining over the disqualification of NS.

I cannot come to grips with this tragedy, where a person of such grace and humility was disallowed to serve his people. An innocent and gentle leader, who was too naive to understand the machinations and manipulations of the power hungry enemies.

Here is hoping that he comes back to serve his people like this..

 

[hafeezrocks]

I cannot come to grips with this tragedy, where a person of such grace and humility was disallowed to serve his people. An innocent and gentle leader, who was too naive to understand the machinations and manipulations of the power hungry enemies.

Here is hoping that he comes back to serve his people like this..

Funny and APT pic.

He is indeed serving his people too well there.

 

[Waseem]

Deficits breaking all records, energy projects down in the dump, our loans from low 20s are now nearly $100 billion, our economy has been an utter disaster. For every 100 cents we earn we have to pay 45 cents back.
[MENTION=26195]DW44[/MENTION] and [MENTION=138463]Slog[/MENTION] can explain more.

As for judges, Nawaz led the last PM's removal in 2012, infact cheer-led and demanded that SC remove Gilani. Which they did.

What influenced their judgement? Take your pick:

-fake letters
-saying one thing in a speech, then something different in Parliament and then complete u-turn in the Court
-forging fake signatures
-bogus money trail contradicted by official documents from England and UAE
-fake stamps on documents
-holding iqamas and jobs in another nation while being PM
-unable to account how his teenage kids bought flats worth 8 million pounds when he became PM

I mean which excuse do you need? The above are all established facts, which weren't even disputed by his legal team in the end. And faking signaures and faking documents in court carries a prison sentence under our law.

Quit trolling and post something of substance instead of your usual nonsense.

Very nice post bro but i think Napa was just trolling, who would in their right mind would say that voters decide whether leader committed a crime and not courts. Ironically these people want a non corrupt Modi for their country even ignoring his extremely dark past in Gujrat.

 

[Arham_PakFan]

Lol at someone saying our economy has progressed since NS took over.Nawaz Sharif and his darbar(family) are crooks and deserve what is coming at them.

Democracy has prevailed,has it not?PML N is still in power,isn't it?

 

[Black Zero]

He should call Gillani and Gillani would explain to him.

 

[Napa]

Deficits breaking all records, energy projects down in the dump, our loans from low 20s are now nearly $100 billion, our economy has been an utter disaster. For every 100 cents we earn we have to pay 45 cents back.
[MENTION=26195]DW44[/MENTION] and [MENTION=138463]Slog[/MENTION] can explain more.

Has Nawaz been good for Pakistan's economy? The evidence is mixed I would say. Here are the GDP growth rates for the last 5 years:



Nawaz took office in mid-2013. Since then the economy has generally grown at a rate of 4% to 4.5%. Is that a good performance? Here are Pakistan's GDP growth rates for its entire existence:



A growth of 4% to 4.5% doesn't seem impressive in the historical context where growth rates have touched 10%. However, there is the important issue of Pakistan's stage of economic development.

After India and Pakistan became independent, growth was easy for a few decades given the grinding poverty and lack of industrial development the British had left the country. Set up a power plant, set up a textile mill, set up a steel mill, build a dam and immediately you start getting 8% to 10% growths. Once all these industries that have a <b>domestic market</b> are completed, then the question becomes where does the next stage of growth come from?

The next stage comes from the more advanced industries like electronics, software, pharma, autos, management consulting and engineering services etc. These are industries that cannot develop based on the domestic market, but have to be competitive on the world scale. Pakistan isn't going to build a domestic smartphone maker.

Two obvious countries to compare Pakistan to are India and Egypt. India because ethnically the people are similar to India. After exhausting the first stage of development, India stagnated for a couple of decades. Starting in the early 1990s, India liberalized, reducing government involvement and giving more freedom to the private sector. Over the next 2.5 decades many industries have developed in India which are competitive in the world market. A couple of days ago I was speaking with a classmate of mine, who is a partner at a mid-sized American consulting firm. He mentioned that over the last ten years, their back office operations have entirely moved to Bengaluru.

When India began liberalizing, its per cap PPP GDP was about 20% behind Pakistan. Now it is about 20% more than Pakistan. A more accurate comparison is comparing Indian states that are more similarly ethnically and geographically to Pakistan, which are Delhi, Haryana, Himachal Pradesh and Punjab (rather than UP, MP and Bihar). The per cap PPP GDP of these states is about 100% more than Pakistan's.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_states_and_union_territories_by_GDP_per_capita

Pakistani people have the talent to set up industries that compete at the world level, but it is not happening. Why is it not happening? Because due to the antics of the Pakistani Army with its support for various jihadi outfits, Pakistan has become associated with terrorism. Every time there is a new article in the West about a terror attack in which the perpetrator is "Pakistani-born" it reinforces that image. The bottom line is that multinationals do not believe their investments would be safe in Pakistan.

There are many other investment destinations in the world. India due to it low labor costs for white collar workers (IBM for long has had the largest number of employees in India). Vietnam with its low labor costs for skilled labor. Pakistan will have to compete with these countries for investment. And that will only happen after a few decades of no terrorist activities.

Egypt too is stagnating, with its major foreign export earnings coming from old world industries of cotton exports and tourism.

Egypt is similar to Pakistan in two important respects, the presence of Islam in public life and the influence of the military. Egypt hasn't developed modern industries either, though due to its proximity to Europe its tourism industry has much greater earning power than Pakistan. That industry too has been hammered by terrorist attacks. Of course, Egypt doesn't have Pakistan or India's intellectual manpower which makes the development of white collar industries that compete at the world level unlikely.

So was Nawaz good for Pakistan's economy? I believe that he was Pakistan's best chance for reducing terrorism and the Army's power. You are free to disagree and only time will give us more data to judge.

Paging [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION], would like to hear his thoughts.

This is my assessment of Pakistan's economic situation. I understand that there is a lot of hope that with the departure of Nawaz, corruption will be reduced and the nation be set on a path of progress. I think reality is more complicated than this simple hope. I have already spent a lot of time on this subject and am unlikely to participate any further unless there is a really thought provoking reply.

 

[Bewal Express]

Has Nawaz been good for Pakistan's economy? The evidence is mixed I would say. Here are the GDP growth rates for the last 5 years:

View attachment 75674

Nawaz took office in mid-2013. Since then the economy has generally grown at a rate of 4% to 4.5%. Is that a good performance? Here are Pakistan's GDP growth rates for its entire existence:

View attachment 75675

A growth of 4% to 4.5% doesn't seem impressive in the historical context where growth rates have touched 10%. However, there is the important issue of Pakistan's stage of economic development.

After India and Pakistan became independent, growth was easy for a few decades given the grinding poverty and lack of industrial development the British had left the country. Set up a power plant, set up a textile mill, set up a steel mill, build a dam and immediately you start getting 8% to 10% growths. Once all these industries that have a <b>domestic market</b> are completed, then the question becomes where does the next stage of growth come from?

The next stage comes from the more advanced industries like electronics, software, pharma, autos, management consulting and engineering services etc. These are industries that cannot develop based on the domestic market, but have to be competitive on the world scale. Pakistan isn't going to build a domestic smartphone maker.

Two obvious countries to compare Pakistan to are India and Egypt. India because ethnically the people are similar to India. After exhausting the first stage of development, India stagnated for a couple of decades. Starting in the early 1990s, India liberalized, reducing government involvement and giving more freedom to the private sector. Over the next 2.5 decades many industries have developed in India which are competitive in the world market. A couple of days ago I was speaking with a classmate of mine, who is a partner at a mid-sized American consulting firm. He mentioned that over the last ten years, their back office operations have entirely moved to Bengaluru.

When India began liberalizing, its per cap PPP GDP was about 20% behind Pakistan. Now it is about 20% more than Pakistan. A more accurate comparison is comparing Indian states that are more similarly ethnically and geographically to Pakistan, which are Delhi, Haryana, Himachal Pradesh and Punjab (rather than UP, MP and Bihar). The per cap PPP GDP of these states is about 100% more than Pakistan's.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_states_and_union_territories_by_GDP_per_capita

Pakistani people have the talent to set up industries that compete at the world level, but it is not happening. Why is it not happening? Because due to the antics of the Pakistani Army with its support for various jihadi outfits, Pakistan has become associated with terrorism. Every time there is a new article in the West about a terror attack in which the perpetrator is "Pakistani-born" it reinforces that image. The bottom line is that multinationals do not believe their investments would be safe in Pakistan.

There are many other investment destinations in the world. India due to it low labor costs for white collar workers (IBM for long has had the largest number of employees in India). Vietnam with its low labor costs for skilled labor. Pakistan will have to compete with these countries for investment. And that will only happen after a few decades of no terrorist activities.

Egypt too is stagnating, with its major foreign export earnings coming from old world industries of cotton exports and tourism.

Egypt is similar to Pakistan in two important respects, the presence of Islam in public life and the influence of the military. Egypt hasn't developed modern industries either, though due to its proximity to Europe its tourism industry has much greater earning power than Pakistan. That industry too has been hammered by terrorist attacks. Of course, Egypt doesn't have Pakistan or India's intellectual manpower which makes the development of white collar industries that compete at the world level unlikely.

So was Nawaz good for Pakistan's economy? I believe that he was Pakistan's best chance for reducing terrorism and the Army's power. You are free to disagree and only time will give us more data to judge.

Paging [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION], would like to hear his thoughts.

This is my assessment of Pakistan's economic situation. I understand that there is a lot of hope that with the departure of Nawaz, corruption will be reduced and the nation be set on a path of progress. I think reality is more complicated than this simple hope. I have already spent a lot of time on this subject and am unlikely to participate any further unless there is a really thought provoking reply.

The slightly higher growth for PK since the PPP era is more to do with low oil prices than any Noora plan. Both the PPP and Nooras have doubled the national debt, where did the money go? Democracy as it is practiced by these crooks is the best revenge on the poor.

 

[Pakpak]

Has Nawaz been good for Pakistan's economy? The evidence is mixed I would say. Here are the GDP growth rates for the last 5 years:

View attachment 75674

Nawaz took office in mid-2013. Since then the economy has generally grown at a rate of 4% to 4.5%. Is that a good performance? Here are Pakistan's GDP growth rates for its entire existence:

View attachment 75675

A growth of 4% to 4.5% doesn't seem impressive in the historical context where growth rates have touched 10%. However, there is the important issue of Pakistan's stage of economic development.

After India and Pakistan became independent, growth was easy for a few decades given the grinding poverty and lack of industrial development the British had left the country. Set up a power plant, set up a textile mill, set up a steel mill, build a dam and immediately you start getting 8% to 10% growths. Once all these industries that have a <b>domestic market</b> are completed, then the question becomes where does the next stage of growth come from?

The next stage comes from the more advanced industries like electronics, software, pharma, autos, management consulting and engineering services etc. These are industries that cannot develop based on the domestic market, but have to be competitive on the world scale. Pakistan isn't going to build a domestic smartphone maker.

Two obvious countries to compare Pakistan to are India and Egypt. India because ethnically the people are similar to India. After exhausting the first stage of development, India stagnated for a couple of decades. Starting in the early 1990s, India liberalized, reducing government involvement and giving more freedom to the private sector. Over the next 2.5 decades many industries have developed in India which are competitive in the world market. A couple of days ago I was speaking with a classmate of mine, who is a partner at a mid-sized American consulting firm. He mentioned that over the last ten years, their back office operations have entirely moved to Bengaluru.

When India began liberalizing, its per cap PPP GDP was about 20% behind Pakistan. Now it is about 20% more than Pakistan. A more accurate comparison is comparing Indian states that are more similarly ethnically and geographically to Pakistan, which are Delhi, Haryana, Himachal Pradesh and Punjab (rather than UP, MP and Bihar). The per cap PPP GDP of these states is about 100% more than Pakistan's.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_states_and_union_territories_by_GDP_per_capita

Pakistani people have the talent to set up industries that compete at the world level, but it is not happening. Why is it not happening? Because due to the antics of the Pakistani Army with its support for various jihadi outfits, Pakistan has become associated with terrorism. Every time there is a new article in the West about a terror attack in which the perpetrator is "Pakistani-born" it reinforces that image. The bottom line is that multinationals do not believe their investments would be safe in Pakistan.

There are many other investment destinations in the world. India due to it low labor costs for white collar workers (IBM for long has had the largest number of employees in India). Vietnam with its low labor costs for skilled labor. Pakistan will have to compete with these countries for investment. And that will only happen after a few decades of no terrorist activities.

Egypt too is stagnating, with its major foreign export earnings coming from old world industries of cotton exports and tourism.

Egypt is similar to Pakistan in two important respects, the presence of Islam in public life and the influence of the military. Egypt hasn't developed modern industries either, though due to its proximity to Europe its tourism industry has much greater earning power than Pakistan. That industry too has been hammered by terrorist attacks. Of course, Egypt doesn't have Pakistan or India's intellectual manpower which makes the development of white collar industries that compete at the world level unlikely.

So was Nawaz good for Pakistan's economy? I believe that he was Pakistan's best chance for reducing terrorism and the Army's power. You are free to disagree and only time will give us more data to judge.

Paging [MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION], would like to hear his thoughts.

This is my assessment of Pakistan's economic situation. I understand that there is a lot of hope that with the departure of Nawaz, corruption will be reduced and the nation be set on a path of progress. I think reality is more complicated than this simple hope. I have already spent a lot of time on this subject and am unlikely to participate any further unless there is a really thought provoking reply.

When we had PPP, the last government, our country was a disaster zone with thousands of deaths, terrorism out of control, daily crime, Karachi unbelievably bad, daily Taliban attacks etc and a big chunk of country only 50 miles from Islamabad was under Taliban control. And now? Now when attacks are negligible, there is peace, Karachi has been unbelievably quiet since 1990s for the first time, there is no Taliban presence of any significance in Pakistan the growth is STILL almost the same as PPP. And even then the operations against terror he was forced by the army to do so.

You call that improvement? And even if it was, by law looters, thieves, people who disrespect the courts by using forgeries shouldn't be allowed to say. You're right, its best if you don't participate more, its great news. Your posts are garbage.