"If Pakistan get to the play-offs, they can beat any side in the world" : Kumar Sangakkara

[Abdullah719]

Kumar Sangakkara believes Sri Lanka will stage England's scheduled tour of the island next year despite safety concerns caused by the Easter Sunday terror attacks.

More than 250 people were killed and nearly 500 wounded in a series of attacks claimed by Islamic State on churches and hotels in Sri Lanka on April 21.

England are due to play Tests in Colombo and Galle next March but the attacks have led to fears Sri Lanka could join Pakistan as a no-go area for major international sides.

Pakistan have been forced to play the bulk of their home games in the United Arab Emirates since 2009, when armed militants targeted Sri Lanka's team bus in Lahore.

Sri Lanka great Sangakkara, who will later this year become the first non-British president of Marylebone Cricket Club (MCC), lamented the fact some Pakistan players had never played a Test in their own country and hoped his own nation would not face a similar fate.

"I was in the bus in 2009 when the Sri Lanka team got attacked and I understand the reservations and the security concerns that come after such an incident or even as an observer looking from the outside in," Sangakkara told reporters at Lord's on Thursday.

"We need a very open conversation with the necessary security aspects that are in place, make sure there are independent assessments done, that the boards connect openly and fully," he added.

"We always talk about cricket transcending politics and that has to be the case with tours, as long as security and safety is assured, and there is an honest commitment from every country to put those security measures in place."

He said Sri Lanka, which endured a long and bloody civil war until 2009, had managed to host cricket tours, including a World Cup "in very trying circumstances" in the past.

- World Cup tips -

Sangakkara was speaking just a week from the start of the World Cup, with hosts England opening the tournament against South Africa on May 30.

One of the best batsmen of his generation and twice a losing World Cup finalist, Sangakkara has been impressed by the way Eoin Morgan's England side have climbed to the top of the one-day international rankings since their first-round exit in Australia four years ago.

"Since 2015 England have changed their mindset about how they play their cricket and that has revolutionised their performances," Sangakkara said.

"It's a strange kind of shift. When you're young in Sri Lanka the coaching methods are very English, what you wear, how you conduct yourself... everything about the game is very much old school.

"Then the shift starts later on in your teen years when the Asian genes kick in -- the supple wrists and experimentation, flamboyance, panache -- not restricting that natural ability with too much technique. In England now you see that shift towards vibrancy and individuality. It's been great to see."

But Sangakkara, who also acknowledged the strength of India and Australia, highlighted the World Cup threat posed by the West Indies and Pakistan.

"The West Indies are an incredible T20 side and it's great to see they're more open to their best players representing them," he said. "A strong West Indies side means strong world cricket.

"Pakistan are always inconsistent but if they get to the play-offs, they can beat any side in the world."

https://www.france24.com/en/2019052...nka-will-stage-england-series-despite-attacks

 

[Mkumar825]

All top team expect BD& Afg can beat each other in pressure match .

 

[Jill Sandwich™]

All top team expect BD& Afg can beat each other in pressure match .

Include SL, watch their fielding in the PAK Vs SL game from the 2017 CT.

 

[Hasan123]

Just like any team. So bored of these cliches.

 

[PakLFC]

With the exception of Afghanistan all others are capable of defeating each other. Even Bangladesh can not be taken for granted.

 

[Pete Rose]

Just like any team. So bored of these cliches.

Its not a cliche. It pretty much approximates the truth, we have a good record when we get on a roll.
In my opinion, Pakistan is in a better space going in this world cup, because their batting no longer seems to be their achilles heel. Also agree with what Kohli said - this is a long tournament and a hot summer forecast. All pitches wont be easy.

 

[Hasan123]

Its not a cliche. It pretty much approximates the truth, we have a good record when we get on a roll.
In my opinion, Pakistan is in a better space going in this world cup, because their batting no longer seems to be their achilles heel. Also agree with what Kohli said - this is a long tournament and a hot summer forecast. All pitches wont be easy.

I don't disagree with what Kohli said but all teams can get on a roll and be unstoppable.

 

[saeed5646]

Its not a cliche. It pretty much approximates the truth, we have a good record when we get on a roll.
In my opinion, Pakistan is in a better space going in this world cup, because their batting no longer seems to be their achilles heel. Also agree with what Kohli said - this is a long tournament and a hot summer forecast. All pitches wont be easy.

pretty much that .LoL some sense need to be prevail to our fans

 

[octavian]

Whether we will get to semis is a big question. But if we do somehow get there, we will be very dangerous.

 

[Tubs]

As others have said, it's a common cliche. I'm unsure if the 'unpredictable' tag works for Pakistan anymore. They seem predictably sub-par as of late. Here's to hoping a CT17-esque performance!

 

[Mean&Green]

Ok tell us something new Sanga

 

[Hasan123]

As others have said, it's a common cliche. I'm unsure if the 'unpredictable' tag works for Pakistan anymore. They seem predictably sub-par as of late. Here's to hoping a CT17-esque performance!

It's common sense that any team can beat another team in a knockout round. Why does this only apply to Pakistan? People only think we have a chance at this WC from what we did in the past not because of the current team.

 

[Tubs]

It's common sense that any team can beat another team in a knockout round. Why does this only apply to Pakistan? People only think we have a chance at this WC from what we did in the past not because of the current team.

True, true. I don't know when it started, maybe before I started following cricket, but the 'unpredictability' factor of Pakistan has always be talked about before big tournaments. Maybe it's a bit of romanticism and a bit of hype.

 

[Hasan123]

True, true. I don't know when it started, maybe before I started following cricket, but the 'unpredictability' factor of Pakistan has always be talked about before big tournaments. Maybe it's a bit of romanticism and a bit of hype.

In WCs since 92 , we have reached 1 semi and got to 1 final. It's hardly anything to do call unpredictable . Even in 92, we had won 5 out of 7 bilaterals at home , in 89 we won the Nehru Cup in India which had all test nations in it apart from New Zealand, we won 57 out of 101 ODIs before the tournament, only Australia had a better record . So even our 92 win should not have been a surprise. It was only shock due to our form in the tournament. Had we started the tournament like we had been playing before it , 92 would not have been a surprise.

 

[Tubs]

In WCs since 92 , we have reached 1 semi and got to 1 final. It's hardly anything to do call unpredictable . Even in 92, we had won 5 out of 7 bilaterals at home , in 89 we won the Nehru Cup in India which had all test nations in it apart from New Zealand, we won 57 out of 101 ODIs before the tournament, only Australia had a better record . So even our 92 win should not have been a surprise. It was only shock due to our form in the tournament. Had we started the tournament like we had been playing before it , 92 would not have been a surprise.

Oh right the whole 'cornered tigers' thing. Was 5 years before my birth, but I know of it well from my parents. It goes without saying that the '92 team was far superior. But let's hope history repeats itself!

 

[Sirris]

Ok tell us something new Sanga

Actually looking at the past couple of world cups we never got passed the playoffs so sanga is wrong.

The correct statement would be:


If Pakistan can get to the finals the might win the world cup.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Oh right the whole 'cornered tigers' thing. Was 5 years before my birth, but I know of it well from my parents. It goes without saying that the '92 team was far superior. But let's hope history repeats itself!

Real cornered tigers thing happened in CT2017. Man to man Pakistan was inferior to England, SA and India. Managed to beat them in crunch games.

 

[Usman Chadda]

True, true. I don't know when it started, maybe before I started following cricket, but the 'unpredictability' factor of Pakistan has always be talked about before big tournaments. Maybe it's a bit of romanticism and a bit of hype.

I think it's more to do with the fact that we look so hopeless at times, then turn it on and absolutely shock the opposition into submission.

2009 T20WC, we were an absolute joke against both England and Sri Lanka in the initial stages. We would have been knocked out if NZ had defeated us. What transpired was a performance that literally turned the WC upside down, when Umar Gul destroyed NZ with a 5-fer and Pakistan shot them out below 100 I believe. South Africa were nigh unbeatable, and we proceeded to beat them into submission in the Semi-Final

2017 CT, similar story. Got mauled by India, scraped past South Africa and Sri Lanka. Come England, we were not given a chance. Proceeded to humiliate them out of the tournament on their own turf. Beat the living daylights out of the same opposition that thrashed us just a week back lol.

Teams win tournaments when they show some sort of consistency. With Pakistan, you have opposition fans not giving us an inch only for them to be left shell-shocked and wondering "what the hell just happened?!" We can get thrashed by both Bangladesh and Afghanistan in this tournament, only to beat up two-three sides aswell in the end.

For bilaterals, please refer to the NZ series in 2018 and the SA series in 2019. Boult wrecked us to piece in the first ODI, only to get butchered like an absolute goat in the next two games. SA were on a high, winning two games in a row in the ODI series, and Pakistan surrendering meekly, only for them to be shot out for 120 odd in the 4th ODI

Heck I doubt England expected Pakistan to end up making 361 in response to 373 in the 2nd ODI.

 

[Mean&Green]

Actually looking at the past couple of world cups we never got passed the playoffs so sanga is wrong.

The correct statement would be:


If Pakistan can get to the finals the might win the world cup.

True dat but going by the trend it should be a first round exit for Pakistan

 

[JibranAnsari]

Yaar play offs tak pohunchna hee hamare liye achievement ho gee.

 

[Mamoon]

I think it's more to do with the fact that we look so hopeless at times, then turn it on and absolutely shock the opposition into submission.

2009 T20WC, we were an absolute joke against both England and Sri Lanka in the initial stages. We would have been knocked out if NZ had defeated us. What transpired was a performance that literally turned the WC upside down, when Umar Gul destroyed NZ with a 5-fer and Pakistan shot them out below 100 I believe. South Africa were nigh unbeatable, and we proceeded to beat them into submission in the Semi-Final

2017 CT, similar story. Got mauled by India, scraped past South Africa and Sri Lanka. Come England, we were not given a chance. Proceeded to humiliate them out of the tournament on their own turf. Beat the living daylights out of the same opposition that thrashed us just a week back lol.

Teams win tournaments when they show some sort of consistency. With Pakistan, you have opposition fans not giving us an inch only for them to be left shell-shocked and wondering "what the hell just happened?!" We can get thrashed by both Bangladesh and Afghanistan in this tournament, only to beat up two-three sides aswell in the end.

For bilaterals, please refer to the NZ series in 2018 and the SA series in 2019. Boult wrecked us to piece in the first ODI, only to get butchered like an absolute goat in the next two games. SA were on a high, winning two games in a row in the ODI series, and Pakistan surrendering meekly, only for them to be shot out for 120 odd in the 4th ODI

Heck I doubt England expected Pakistan to end up making 361 in response to 373 in the 2nd ODI.

If you look at individual tournaments and series, you can make any team look unpredictable.

These cliches are getting tiresome because not only are they applicable to other teams, it is quite easy to prove that Pakistan are very predictable as well.

Pakistan has lost every single Test in Australia since 1995, they have won only 1 World Cup since 1975, they have won only 1 Test series in England, South Africa, Australia and New Zealand since 1995, they have lost over 85% of bilateral ODI series against the top teams since 2005 etc. etc.

There is nothing unpredictable about those performances. It is predictable underperformance.

Our fans tend to take pride in the unpredictability label, but it just a nicer way of calling us inconsistent, and inconsistency is a product of mediocrity.

Pakistan are usually ranked 5th or 6th in Tests and ODIs. We have probably spent more time at those spots in the last 15 years than at any other position, and they perfectly capture our inconsistency.

This cliche has a lot to do with the 90’s generation. That team had superstars at their disposal but never performed consistently, which is why we become known as the mercurial and unpredictable (inconsistent) team.

 

[Usman Chadda]

If you look at individual tournaments and series, you can make any team look unpredictable.

These cliches are getting tiresome because not only are they applicable to other teams, it is quite easy to prove that Pakistan are very predictable as well.

Pakistan has lost every single Test in Australia since 1995, they have won only 1 World Cup since 1975, they have won only 1 Test series in England, South Africa, Australia and New Zealand since 1995, they have lost over 85% of bilateral ODI series against the top teams since 2005 etc. etc.

There is nothing unpredictable about those performances. It is predictable underperformance.

Our fans tend to take pride in the unpredictability label, but it just a nicer way of calling us inconsistent, and inconsistency is a product of mediocrity.

Pakistan are usually ranked 5th or 6th in Tests and ODIs. We have probably spent more time at those spots in the last 15 years than at any other position, and they perfectly capture our inconsistency.

This cliche has a lot to do with the 90’s generation. That team had superstars at their disposal but never performed consistently, which is why we become known as the mercurial and unpredictable (inconsistent) team.

Explain the 2009 T20WC and 2017 CT. I don't even need to bring the 90s generation into this, as that team gave birth to this tag in the first place.

But let me see you press precedent for the aforementioned tournaments for any other team (even Windies in 2004 CT).

 

[Mamoon]

Explain the 2009 T20WC and 2017 CT. I don't even need to bring the 90s generation into this, as that team gave birth to this tag in the first place.

But let me see you press precedent for the aforementioned tournaments for any other team (even Windies in 2004 CT).

Pakistan's WT20 win in 2009 was hardly different to England's in 2010 or India winning the inaugural edition in 2007.

2010 WT20 - England were not considered one of the favourites leading into the tournament, and finished the group stage with only 1 point but somehow qualified because of Ireland and plenty of luck.

Against Ireland, they were 120 for 8 or something before the match was abandoned. However, in the Super 8s and knockouts, they turned it around and beat the likes of Pakistan, South African and Australia after losing to West Indies and almost losing to Ireland earlier.

Their journey to the title was hardly different to Pakistan's in 2009 and 2017, but since it wasn't Pakistan, the tournament is not remembered for England's "unpredictable" and "cornered tiger" performance.

Similarly, India came into the WT20 2007 as an underdog team with a new captain and plenty of young players. They tied with Pakistan thanks to Misbah's choke (couldn't finish off 1 required in 2 balls), lost to New Zealand, beat South Africa in the must win-match when they were reduced to 50/4, and eventually ended up winning the tournament.

Again, quite a remarkable story and if it was Pakistan, people would be coming with the unpredictable and cornered tigers cliches.

When other teams defy the odds, it is normal, but when Pakistan do it, it is because they are unpredictable, mercurial and cornered tigers. These exhausted cliches are based on perception rather than reality (thanks to 90's generation), and we will never be able to overcome them as long as we take pride in it.

Also, I am not sure why West Indies in 2004 is not a precedence for the Champions Trophy. Australia were the greatest side in the world at that time, and West Indies were a low ranked side who shocked the world by winning the tournament.

Yes they won all games, but had Pakistan beaten India in the first match of the 2017 Champions Trophy, would their triumph not be considered unpredictable and cornered tigers or whatever? Of course it would be, because they were the bottom-ranked side and no one gave them a chance going into the tournament, just like West Indies in 2004.

In fact, is there a bigger unpredictable and cornered tiger team than West Indies? They have been at their lowest ebb in their history in this millennium, but they have still managed to win three trophies. Only Australia (5) have won more ICC trophies than West Indies (3) and India (3) since Jan 1, 2000.

Who deserves the unpredictability tag more? West Indies or Pakistan?

 

[topspin]

Explain the 2009 T20WC and 2017 CT. I don't even need to bring the 90s generation into this, as that team gave birth to this tag in the first place.

But let me see you press precedent for the aforementioned tournaments for any other team (even Windies in 2004 CT).

Once again always showing your despise for the 90s team. I yearn for Pakistan to have that calibre of star quality they had back then.

 

[Usman Chadda]

Pakistan's WT20 win in 2009 was hardly different to England's in 2010 or India winning the inaugural edition in 2007.

2010 WT20 - England were not considered one of the favourites leading into the tournament, and finished the group stage with only 1 point but somehow qualified because of Ireland and plenty of luck.

Against Ireland, they were 120 for 8 or something before the match was abandoned. However, in the Super 8s and knockouts, they turned it around and beat the likes of Pakistan, South African and Australia after losing to West Indies and almost losing to Ireland earlier.

Their journey to the title was hardly different to Pakistan's in 2009 and 2017, but since it wasn't Pakistan, the tournament is not remembered for England's "unpredictable" and "cornered tiger" performance.

Similarly, India came into the WT20 2007 as an underdog team with a new captain and plenty of young players. They tied with Pakistan thanks to Misbah's choke (couldn't finish off 1 required in 2 balls), lost to New Zealand, beat South Africa in the must win-match when they were reduced to 50/4, and eventually ended up winning the tournament.

Again, quite a remarkable story and if it was Pakistan, people would be coming with the unpredictable and cornered tigers cliches.

When other teams defy the odds, it is normal, but when Pakistan do it, it is because they are unpredictable, mercurial and cornered tigers. These exhausted cliches are based on perception rather than reality (thanks to 90's generation), and we will never be able to overcome them as long as we take pride in it.

Also, I am not sure why West Indies in 2004 is not a precedence for the Champions Trophy. Australia were the greatest side in the world at that time, and West Indies were a low ranked side who shocked the world by winning the tournament.

Yes they won all games, but had Pakistan beaten India in the first match of the 2017 Champions Trophy, would their triumph not be considered unpredictable and cornered tigers or whatever? Of course it would be, because they were the bottom-ranked side and no one gave them a chance going into the tournament, just like West Indies in 2004.

In fact, is there a bigger unpredictable and cornered tiger team than West Indies? They have been at their lowest ebb in their history in this millennium, but they have still managed to win three trophies. Only Australia (5) have won more ICC trophies than West Indies (3) and India (3) since Jan 1, 2000.

Who deserves the unpredictability tag more? West Indies or Pakistan?

LOL what? England dominated the Super 8s mate, and only had to settle for a late qualification to the Super 8s because of rain severely hampering both their matches. They beat Pakistan and South Africa comfortably, while their win against NZ could be considered close academically, even though NZ was well out of the contest by the beginning of that final over.

Clutching at straws here. Not even close.

India's T20WC might be the closest I agree, but the fact of the matter is that they did top their group. New Zealand surprised them, while their seamers took apart South Africa in a hi-octane match. Also a small note that RP Singh, the wrecker-in-chief, had bowled well throughout the tournament till then. Nowhere did India have that hopeless feeling though, where you thought that team was utterly useless and they proceeded to beat the living daylights out of the opposition later leaving you look like a clown in the end.

Your emotional rant of Windies aside, they were clinical in that CT. Their closest game was probably in the final, but I don't remember. I remember them beating a strong South Africa comfortably and setting off the alarm bells early in the tournament.

 

[Mamoon]

LOL what? England dominated the Super 8s mate, and only had to settle for a late qualification to the Super 8s because of rain severely hampering both their matches. They beat Pakistan and South Africa comfortably, while their win against NZ could be considered close academically, even though NZ was well out of the contest by the beginning of that final over.

Clutching at straws here. Not even close.

India's T20WC might be the closest I agree, but the fact of the matter is that they did top their group. New Zealand surprised them, while their seamers took apart South Africa in a hi-octane match. Also a small note that RP Singh, the wrecker-in-chief, had bowled well throughout the tournament till then. Nowhere did India have that hopeless feeling though, where you thought that team was utterly useless and they proceeded to beat the living daylights out of the opposition later leaving you look like a clown in the end.

Your emotional rant of Windies aside, they were clinical in that CT. Their closest game was probably in the final, but I don't remember. I remember them beating a strong South Africa comfortably and setting off the alarm bells early in the tournament.

England dominated the super eights, but they barely scraped through the group stages, and may even have lost to Ireland had rained not saved the day for them. If Pakistan were to win a tournament in exactly the same fashion, they would be called unpredictable.

Yes West Indies were dominant in that tournament, but weren't Pakistan in the Champions Trophy as well? They steamrolled England and India, and the only match that went to the wire was against Sri Lanka.

Again, I will ask you the same question - had Pakistan not lost to India in the opening game, would cliches like unpredictability and cornered tigers. not have been used for the Champions Trophy triumph, considering it was the lowest ranked team in the competition and were not considered as one of the favourites by any measure?

I am not sure what straw clutching you are talking about. I have proved to you with facts that a team that loses 85% of its bilaterals against the top sides, has won only 1 World Cup since 1975, has lost every Test in Australia since 1995 etc. is not unpredictable by any measure. Those are very predictable below par performances.

Your entire justification of using terms like unpredictable etc. to describe Pakistan cricket is based on the WT20 2009 and Champions Trophy 2017, even though Pakistan is not the only team to have won a tournament when (a) they are not among the pre tournament favourites and (b) after making a shaky start and building momentum later.

There are other examples as well - Sri Lanka have not been among the elite sides in this millennium either, but they have won a Champions Trophy, a World T20, and made two World Cup finals. In addition, they won Test series in England and South Africa, the latter came earlier this year when they were at their lowest ebb. However, we don't see people calling Sri Lanka an unpredictable team who have achieved highs in spite of their general struggles.

Calling Pakistan unpredictable, mercurial, cornered tigers, a dangerous team when it gains momentum etc. etc. are lazy stereotypes and cliches that are based on perception rather than reality.

It is an image that we have built thanks to the inconsistency of the 90's generation - a team that had superstars but flattered to deceive due to multiple reasons. Since the 2000s, Pakistan has been predictability mediocre and have punched above their weight on occasions, but so have other teams.

People see others use these terms to describe Pakistan cricket but no one bothers to dig deep and see if there is any truth behind this rhetoric. It is a bit like how people believe that Australia raises its game in ICC events which is another myth thanks to the success of their greatest ever side.

 

[Usman Chadda]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] No - England were one of the two best teams in that WT20. Don't bother comparing it to any of these two tournaments because it's not true, and no amount of long boring posts will make it otherwise.

No - West Indies played well consistently in that CT, so not comparable to the shaky starts Pakistan have had in those two tournaments. No amount of long boring posts will make it otherwise.

You are deliberately not trying to understand what my point. Don't waste our time with long posts, when your point could he made with less so.