Indian Test team and its potential in the next few years

[Ab Fan]

I think the Indian test team under the leadership of Virat Kohli( not sure if this is the reason or not) is shaping pretty nicely and in the next few years could well do something special away from the home as this team truly has huge potential given the quality and the balance that has been maintained across the team.

Firstly, this team has some really quality MATCH-WINNERS in the line-up.

The top 5 is as good as you could ask for.

Then spinners who can take wickets..

A bowling all-rounder who can contribute with the bat.

And one pacer who can lead the team outside Asia..

Lets have a look at quality first :-

R Ashwin( potential ATG bowling All-Rounder)

A Rahane( Great batsmen)
V kohli( Great batsmen)
C Pujara(Great batsmen)
M Vijay(Great opener)

M Shami( the pace bowler India need the most and can match Zak or surpass him if he is utilised and taken care nicely)

And then you have KL Rahul with very solid potential and although he has his issues but let him get to 20-25 tests mark and 25+ age before really coming into conclusion.

Jadeja and Bhuvi are very valuable players too if they get the conditions favourable to them..

India's only major weakness is a wicket keeper who is good enough to bat at no.6 and give Ashwin a more safer position of no.7.If this issue gets sort out or if India could find a pace bowling AR for non-Asian conditions then this team can really do great in next few years and win/draw series outside Asia.

Btw how this team compares to the ATG Indian team between 2009-11?

 

[Hasan123]

ATG Indian team were overall better players of spin.

Current Indian is very good, only issues are Saha and lack of a fast bowling all rounder. Under Virats captaincy I think they will give a good fight in NZ,SA,Australia, and England. If Indian bowlers can find a way of getting 20 wickets in these countries India will come close to winning some series in these countries.

A solid outfit with room for improvement.

 

[Buffet]

Pace attack is needed to do well away where spinners can't do well.

 

[Ab Fan]

ATG Indian team were overall better players of spin.

Current Indian is very good, only issues are Saha and lack of a fast bowling all rounder. Under Virats captaincy I think they will give a good fight in NZ,SA,Australia, and England. If Indian bowlers can find a way of getting 20 wickets in these countries India will come close to winning some series in these countries.

A solid outfit with room for improvement.

The first statement is true but that is hardly an issue in this era because others play spin even worse except Pakistan who can definitely be the toughest team to face even at home..

And what about Shami?

He can do well for India and match Zak. Ha been very impressive as of yet but outside Asia he has to lead the pace attack rather than be just a supportive part to Ashwin and other spinners.

 

[Ab Fan]

Pace attack is needed to do well away where spinners can't do well.

Yeah..Shami has to be the real deal for India outside Asia.

 

[Hasan123]

The first statement is true but that is hardly an issue in this era because others play spin even worse except Pakistan who can definitely be the toughest team to face even at home..

And what about Shami?

He can do well for India and match Zak. Ha been very impressive as of yet but outside Asia he has to lead the pace attack rather than be just a supportive part to Ashwin and other spinners.

Shami is a good bowler but you can't just relay on him. Bhuvi is also good as well but dont know how useful he will be in Australia and South Africa.

 

[Buffet]

Yeah..Shami has to be the real deal for India outside Asia.

You need 3-4 good pacers and develop them.

 

[Cricfan4eva]

Shami is a good bowler but you can't just relay on him. Bhuvi is also good as well but dont know how useful he will be in Australia and South Africa.

Bhuvy needs to learn what Philander is doing and Mcgrath/Pollock did. They rely on line and length and swing the ball just enough to trouble batsman on any surface.

 

[Suleiman]

Need Pujara to perform overseas as well.

Vijay + Rahul is a good opening pair, Rahul has a much higher ceiling than Dhawan.

Pace bowling needs to step-up, Bhuvi is good but idk why Shami can't deliver overseas. Seems to have the right tools.

 

[Sin Nombre]

There are lots of question marks.

- Rahul has undoubted talent and should be part of the best of the 1992-94 age group along with de Kock and Babar Azam (maybe even Sarkar) but is yet to prove it in tests.
- Pujara needs to perform overseas.
- Saha is not good enough and Pant needs to be slowly brought in the team.
- Bhuvi is excellent under swinging conditions but needs to figure out how to bowl in SA or Aus. Or NZ after day 2.
- Shami is like Rahul. Undoubted talent but hasn't performed in tests away. Has shown his class in ODIs though.

Actually Ishant (lol) is less of a question mark and has at least become relatively decent and consistent away from Indian pitches (averaging 30 over his last 16 away tests).

 

[street cricketer]

I'm sorry but you can't win overseas without great pacers, which we don't have atm.

Shami, Bhuvi, Ishant, Yadav are good. But will yoh expect them to pick 20 English or South African wickets everytime in their home?

We will start winning only when our bowlers (Ashwin/Jadeja included) start picking wickets on flat pitches. Our pacers were near to useless the last time we were on the verge of winning but couldn't close it out because of the flat conditions that didn't help our pacers.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

India's batting lineup

Shaping up nicely but its not like its without issues.

Vijay - Excellent all conditions batsman but somehow doesn't score consistently these days which is why he is unable to bring his average up
Rahul - Incredible potential but its taking a while to kickstart
Pujara - Gun on spin tracks...not so gun outside Asia
Kohli - Seems like he is got it right in test cricket...fingers crossed
Rahane - Has to improve his spin game big time. Gun against all other types of bowling
Ashwin - Has the skills but not the temperament needed for a No 6 batsman. Needs to develop that or get demoted (its not about runs....in a good patch, you will get those runs but when bad patch comes, it will hurt us more...his game needs to tighten up even more)
Saha - We need him for now but unreliable bat (from a proper batsman's perspective) and not a long term prospect
Jaddu - Good for slogging a few runs

Indian spinners

Excellent in Asian tracks. In outside Asia, they will be reduced to being a support cast (barring the odd pitch) so yet to see how they do there.

Indian pacers

Shami is the best. Bhuvi is coming up nicely. Umesh has improved. But only when they are put under the pump to take majority of wickets, we will know how good they are. For now, they are decent I would say. I don't see anything that makes me believe our pacers are gonna power through on a flat track (with a bit of life) and win a game.

---

I think Kohli is slowly and steadily working on everything and helping us find the right combo. We are nowhere near the peak Indian side which had an ATG batting lineup and a workable bowling attack but we seem to be improving day in and day out.

 

[sensible-indian-fan]

When we have good spin tracks/rank turners,

Only Vijay and Pujara score the important runs (now I suppose Kohli may join the party).

When we had swing/pace/bouncy tracks,

Only Vijay, Kohli and Rahane scored the important runs.

For example:

SA - Pujara, Kohli and Rahane came to party (With Vijay doing the block work)
NZ - Dhawan, Rahane and Kohli came to party
Eng - Vijay, Rahane came to party
Aus - Vijay, Kohli, Rahane came to party

The issue is that even though we have 4 quality bats (with Rahul added now), only 2-3 come to party for an entire series which hurts us.

On paper, things would look great but until Pujara and Rahane sort their issues, we will find it hard.

I hope Rahul is an all-conditions player and helps bridge this gap a bit.

 

[Nil Dhumrojal]

Not so great future. Still need those improvements which were needed in the past. Abhi bhi Ind ghar ka sher jo past mein tha.

 

[Indiafan]

Not so great future. Still need those improvements which were needed in the past. Abhi bhi Ind ghar ka sher jo past mein tha.

At one point of time India won series in England, NZ, WI, SL and drew in SA and Aus. We just went back a bit under Dhoni but we will be back

 

[jeetu]

Good future in Asia. Good in WI, Zim. Competitive in Nz. Not good in Eng , SA and Aus.

 

[Nil Dhumrojal]

Good future in Asia. Good in WI, Zim. Competitive in Nz. Not good in Eng , SA and Aus.

That's it. Nailed it. Though have doubt in uae of asia

 

[Ab Fan]

I'm sorry but you can't win overseas without great pacers, which we don't have atm.

Shami, Bhuvi, Ishant, Yadav are good. But will yoh expect them to pick 20 English or South African wickets everytime in their home?

We will start winning only when our bowlers (Ashwin/Jadeja included) start picking wickets on flat pitches. Our pacers were near to useless the last time we were on the verge of winning but couldn't close it out because of the flat conditions that didn't help our pacers.

Not saying simply to win test series in Aus and SA but we can be more competitive in those places and also do better atleast in England and NZ.

Indian bowling has never been great. The Indian line up of last decade itself didn't had great bowlers but we got a test series draw in Aus and SA and series win in other places.

Zaheer was there but I think Shami can match him.

So, its not that unless you have a pace bowling line up of say three bowlers, all averaging below 30, you can't win or draw series there.

 

[Ab Fan]

When we have good spin tracks/rank turners,

Only Vijay and Pujara score the important runs (now I suppose Kohli may join the party).

When we had swing/pace/bouncy tracks,

Only Vijay, Kohli and Rahane scored the important runs.

For example:

SA - Pujara, Kohli and Rahane came to party (With Vijay doing the block work)
NZ - Dhawan, Rahane and Kohli came to party
Eng - Vijay, Rahane came to party
Aus - Vijay, Kohli, Rahane came to party

The issue is that even though we have 4 quality bats (with Rahul added now), only 2-3 come to party for an entire series which hurts us.

On paper, things would look great but until Pujara and Rahane sort their issues, we will find it hard.

I hope Rahul is an all-conditions player and helps bridge this gap a bit.

I agree that there have been series away from home where 2-3 players have went missing in one whole series but those were their first tour outside Asia and neither of them had the experience of past overseas tours.

But now they had their first tour in those places and are becoming consistent more the game they are playing.

I back Ashwin(particularly with the ball) and Rahul to do well this time outside Asia and join the trio of Vijay/Kohli/Rahane(the ones who were successful there).

Pujara has some mental blog when he goes outside Asia( not sure what ) but he didn't looked good even in WI. However, he does his work by going through the initial overs of the game till the ball loses the shine.He is expected to improve too with the bat.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Obviously we will look good currently because we are playing at home. Real test is when you play away from home and there is a 85% chance we won't replicate our home performances away.

 

[street cricketer]

Not saying simply to win test series in Aus and SA but we can be more competitive in those places and also do better atleast in England and NZ.

Indian bowling has never been great. The Indian line up of last decade itself didn't had great bowlers but we got a test series draw in Aus and SA and series win in other places.

Zaheer was there but I think Shami can match him.

So, its not that unless you have a pace bowling line up of say three bowlers, all averaging below 30, you can't win or draw series there.

Zaheer and Shami are not comparable. Zaheer was a wily bowler who was primarily a swing bowler. He was good with the new ball and the old ball. Shami is faster than Zaheer but more of a seam bowler than swing bowler. Shami has a low skiddy action and the ball skids off the pitch onto the batsman at a deceptive pace. He is more potent in Asia than outside asia because of the fact that you need to attack the stumps more in Asia, especially when it starts reversing and Shami's low skiddy action fits perfectly into that role.

Whereas outside asia, you need to move the ball in the air and challenge and beat the outside edge of the bat more. Zaheer was a master at it, especially after his stint at Worcestershire. We don't have many swing bowlers apart from Bhuvi whose lack of pace may render his swing less potent (although he has improved on this and would be interesting to see him next year in South Africa). All the other three (Shami, Yadav and Ishant) are more of seam bowlers. Yadav might produce a jaffa here and there but mixes it up with hit me balls. Ishant probably is the most consistent at line and length for outside asia right now but he isn't world class.

Overall we are developing a good pace attack. Even many English commentators remarked that this pace attack was the fastest Indian attack they had seen in a long time. But whether they can translate it outside asia, we'll wait and see. I have seen so many Indian pacers have an impressive start only to flatter in the end. We don't need Starc or Rabada like pacers. But if they can chip in with great spells all over the world like Zaheer did, that would help us in winning test matches outside asia.

Our biggest weakness is flat tracks. Our pacers become useless on flat tracks and need helpful conditions to trouble the opposition team. The last time we were on the verge of squaring a series outside asia in South Africa and New Zealand, our bowlers flopped so bad that we had to cling on to a draw from a certain winnable position. These lot have promise, but I won't be holding my breath on them the next time we need them to step up in flat conditions outside asia.

 

[RamLakhan]

The first statement is true but that is hardly an issue in this era because others play spin even worse except Pakistan who can definitely be the toughest team to face even at home..

And what about Shami?

He can do well for India and match Zak. Ha been very impressive as of yet but outside Asia he has to lead the pace attack rather than be just a supportive part to Ashwin and other spinners.

If Pakistan come to India (somehow if possible), then India will convert these pitches into green-tops (also schedule the matches in Winter or Rainy Seasons/Venues)which will bring Bhuvi & co into equations (maybe even Pathan & Balaji might be recalled ) And Pakistan will struggle!

 

[anindo]

Indian fast bowlers don't get to bowl more than 10-15 overs a day when they play at home. While touring in England or the Southern hemisphere countries they are required to bowl 20-25 overs a day and they tend to just fall flat after the initial burst especially if the pitch is flat and offering no sideways movement. That is why we have a huge problem in dismissing lower order batsmen in these countries. The absence of a seam bowling allrounder who can bowl 10-15 overs a day and pick up 1-2 wickets puts even more pressure on these guys.

Moreover, in India the pacers are constantly looking for wickets trying all sorts of variations because they know that they need to make the most of limited bowling opportunities otherwise they would be replaced quickly by the spinners who will bowl all day (Jadeja and Ashwin can bowl 30+ overs a day if asked to). As a result they don't have the patience to keep plugging away at a line and length for 6-7 overs at a stretch which is a must if you want to succeed abroad. This is one reason why they bowl so many loose deliveries.

So, the likes of Shami,Umesh,Bhuvi and Ishant will have to get stronger, build more stamina and learn how to bowl longer spells and more overs. I don't see how they can do that given the conditions in India

 

[Justcrazy]

If Pakistan come to India (somehow if possible), then India will convert these pitches into green-tops (also schedule the matches in Winter or Rainy Seasons/Venues)which will bring Bhuvi & co into equations (maybe even Pathan & Balaji might be recalled ) And Pakistan will struggle!

Nothing wrong in that , you need to play to your strengths.
Pakistan bowlers will have use the surface as well.
You need to win in variety of condition to be true number one.

 

[ali2220]

If Pakistan come to India (somehow if possible), then India will convert these pitches into green-tops (also schedule the matches in Winter or Rainy Seasons/Venues)which will bring Bhuvi & co into equations (maybe even Pathan & Balaji might be recalled ) And Pakistan will struggle!

If ever that happens, Pak will also bring back Mohd Asif, and on green top Asif can still trouble most batting lineups!

 

[Bilal7]

It's all rosy until you have to tour England or Australia again. South Africa won't be in a hospitable mood either, next time around.

 

[soso_killer]

India had a better team before and still lost heavily away. I'm not sure what to make of this group who have virtually no bowling attack to speak of.
Kumble and Srinath were a much better bowling pair with the support of Harbhajan as well.
Time will tell, only player I'd classify as great is Rahane who has played well on some tough surfaces consistently away.

 

[R0H1T]

India had a better team before and still lost heavily away. I'm not sure what to make of this group who have virtually no bowling attack to speak of.
Kumble and Srinath were a much better bowling pair with the support of Harbhajan as well.
Time will tell, only player I'd classify as great is Rahane who has played well on some tough surfaces consistently away.

Well it wasn't necessarily because you (SA) were awfully better than us. In 2006/07 tour SRT dropped Prince's catch IIRC on the first day of the second test otherwise it would've gone the same way as the first, with SA being shot for a below par total. The third test was also lost in similar circumstances except with the bat btw there was no Srinath then.

In 2010/11 it took a Kallis special to save SA from defeat, Harbhajan was on form that series & so was SRT. In both these tours India could've won very easily with a bit of luck & better performance in certain sessions. Both series were basically decided by a couple of bad sessions from India's side.

As for Oz 2008/09 we all know how bad the umpires were in Sydney, unless of course people deny that such blatant (umpiring) incompetence wasn't the main reason why Aus won that test.

 

[street cricketer]

India had a better team before and still lost heavily away. I'm not sure what to make of this group who have virtually no bowling attack to speak of.
Kumble and Srinath were a much better bowling pair with the support of Harbhajan as well.
Time will tell, only player I'd classify as great is Rahane who has played well on some tough surfaces consistently away.

Oh geez please.

India were on the verge of winning a series in South Africa and only a Kallis special earned SA a draw in 2010. Was again a well competed series in 2006 with SA winning 2-1 iirc. Even the rookie Indian team was on the verge of winning the first test at Johannesburg but our popgun attack couldn't clean up South Africa with a 400+ lead when the wicket flattened out in the last 3 days. India have had a poor record in England and Australia off late, but they have always performed better in South Africa in the last ten years or so.

As for Australia, India had the best win loss ratio among all other teams in Australia in the last decade. India (with their pop gun attack) and England to an extent were the only teams who challenged that ATG Aussie team. All other teams were cannon fodder to that Australian team both home and away. South Africa with its great fast bowlers hardly ever mustered up a challenge against that Australian team at its peak regardless of where it was played. They only managed to beat Australia in the fag end of the last decade when many of the great players had retired and Hayden, Ponting et al were on their last legs. And credit to South Africa, they have been beating Australia in Australia regularly since then, but it's a blackmark against them that they were hardly a contest when the Australian team were strong and in their pomp.

India always had a good record in England in the last decade drawing one series and winning another there. Won a series at NZ too. India started getting battered only after 2010 when pretty much everyone of their golden generation were past it and the newbies struggled to fill their boots. So let's not make up facts shall we..

 

[RamLakhan]

Well it wasn't necessarily because you (SA) were awfully better than us. In 2006/07 tour SRT dropped Prince's catch IIRC on the first day of the second test otherwise it would've gone the same way as the first, with SA being shot for a below par total. The third test was also lost in similar circumstances except with the bat btw there was no Srinath then.

In 2010/11 it took a Kallis special to save SA from defeat, Harbhajan was on form that series & so was SRT. In both these tours India could've won very easily with a bit of luck & better performance in certain sessions. Both series were basically decided by a couple of bad sessions from India's side.

As for Oz 2008/09 we all know how bad the umpires were in Sydney, unless of course people deny that such blatant (umpiring) incompetence wasn't the main reason why Aus won that test.

India has been competitive in most overseas test series (barring the 2 whitewashes which happened during their transition period) They have tried to level the series, at least won few test matches, drew matches comprehensively and with bit of luck as you say (and of course without bad umpires) might have won some series! Also I remember rain prevented India in some Test/Series wins overseas especially I remember a Test Match in South Africa where Dravid was in prime form and only Rain & Cullinan saved South Africa from losing that match! Srinath & Prasad were brilliant. (Srinath always did well in South Africa, the pitches suited his style)

On the other hand teams coming to India have been brutally defeated hands down (of course with the exception of occasional moral victories ) The one series victory by England last time around is talked off too much as if it happened yesterday (and also that Pakistan Test wins in Kolkata and Chennai which had an attack comprising of Wasim, Shoaib, Saqlain and best batting line up of Pakistan in its entire history! Still the matches were damn close, while India dominated the Delhi match! Its Amazing how Pakistanis feel that they can still win in India on this account! At the most they can do what Srilanka can do against us now!)

 

[Tusker]

India had a better team before and still lost heavily away. I'm not sure what to make of this group who have virtually no bowling attack to speak of.
Kumble and Srinath were a much better bowling pair with the support of Harbhajan as well.
Time will tell, only player I'd classify as great is Rahane who has played well on some tough surfaces consistently away.

India is the only Asian team that has won Tests in Most of the difficult venues for Asian teams : Perth, Jo'Burg,Durban,Lords,Melbourne,Adelaide,Sabina Park. Only Gabba is the exception.

 

[street cricketer]

India is the only Asian team that has won Tests in Most of the difficult venues for Asian teams : Perth, Jo'Burg,Durban,Lords,Melbourne,Adelaide,Sabina Park. Only Gabba is the exception.

Adelaide, Lords and Durban usually support Asian teams. Melbourne too before it became a road.