India's young fast bowling factory - 38 better bowlers than Naseem Shah?

[Mamoon]

Looks like you lost your memory, this started becaus of speed. The title isnt literal but read the first part, fast bowling factory.

Ive checked the list earlier in the thread, many are older bowlers and the youngers , none can reach Naseems speed. Indians will never overall be faster bowlers than Pakistan, history, present and future will prove this.

Can you name 38 young faster bowlers from India or not? Its been weeks lol.

I see. So the problem is that your English is weak. If it wasn’t weak, you wouldn’t have used the word “better” in your title. You would have either “quicker” or “faster”.

When you say 38 better bowlers than Naseem, you are not restricting it to speed only.

Naseem Shah is a joke of a bowler who is also just fast-medium these days. You will find better bowlers than him in Ireland and Zimbabwe let alone India.

He averages 70+ in Australia, England and New Zealand, and his humiliation yesterday made him the most expensive pacer in history in a wicket-less innings. He is that rubbish.

I don’t remember what your point of view was in the original discussion because I don’t keep much track of your ignorant and delusional posts, but my perspective was based on his garbage bowling and not just speed.

If you could bump that thread maybe we could have a look at your perspective as well, because perhaps I wasn’t paying attention to your ignorance.

As far as speed is concerned, he was trundling in mid 130s this series and his effort balls were reaching 140. In fact, I think he didn’t even reach 140 in the first Test.

130s are standard speeds at the professional level. Forget 38, you will find 50+ Indian pacers with similar speeds. Just check the squads of Ranji Trophy and pick out any 50 names from the pace bowlers list and you will find similar speeds.

Besides, even if we assume that the earth is flat, pigs fly and Naseem is faster than Indian domestic pacers, what difference does it make?

He is a pathetic bowler who averages 70+ in Australia, England and New Zealand and has a set a world record for the most expensive spell ever by a pacer. He is not good enough to play in Indian domestic cricket let alone play in international cricket.

This fixation with pace shows how deluded ne out of touch with reality Pakistani fans are. They are not backing out even if after the treatment Naseem has received in Australia, England and New Zealand.

 

[KingKhanWC]

I see. So the problem is that your English is weak. If it wasn’t weak, you wouldn’t have used the word “better” in your title. You would have either “quicker” or “faster”.

When you say 38 better bowlers than Naseem, you are not restricting it to speed only.

Naseem Shah is a joke of a bowler who is also just fast-medium these days. You will find better bowlers than him in Ireland and Zimbabwe let alone India.

He averages 70+ in Australia, England and New Zealand, and his humiliation yesterday made him the most expensive pacer in history in a wicket-less innings. He is that rubbish.

I don’t remember what your point of view was in the original discussion because I don’t keep much track of your ignorant and delusional posts, but my perspective was based on his garbage bowling and not just speed.

If you could bump that thread maybe we could have a look at your perspective as well, because perhaps I wasn’t paying attention to your ignorance.

As far as speed is concerned, he was trundling in mid 130s this series and his effort balls were reaching 140. In fact, I think he didn’t even reach 140 in the first Test.

130s are standard speeds at the professional level. Forget 38, you will find 50+ Indian pacers with similar speeds. Just check the squads of Ranji Trophy and pick out any 50 names from the pace bowlers list and you will find similar speeds.

Besides, even if we assume that the earth is flat, pigs fly and Naseem is faster than Indian domestic pacers, what difference does it make?

He is a pathetic bowler who averages 70+ in Australia, England and New Zealand and has a set a world record for the most expensive spell ever by a pacer. He is not good enough to play in Indian domestic cricket let alone play in international cricket.

This fixation with pace shows how deluded ne out of touch with reality Pakistani fans are. They are not backing out even if after the treatment Naseem has received in Australia, England and New Zealand.

lol. It was speed. Carry on with your essays trying to wiggle out of it now. You can find the thread and posts. Ive even quoted you.

Do you know of 38 faster young Indians or not? Lets get on with the issue, not your wriggles.

 

[Mamoon]

lol. It was speed. Carry on with your essays trying to wiggle out of it now. You can find the thread and posts. Ive even quoted you.

Do you know of 38 faster young Indians or not? Lets get on with the issue, not your wriggles.

I get quoted hundred times a day. I don’t keep track and I don’t check my notifications because I post from my phone through the mobile version. If you remember that thread, you can bump it so that I can take a look at it and check your perspective.

As I said, Naseem is just a fast medium bowler, and a terrible one. If you think India doesn’t have 38+ 130-140 kph bowlers in domestic cricket, you are kidding yourself.

Go to Ranji Trophy squads and check the listing of fast and fast medium bowlers. You will find about 60+ bowlers who must be bowling at the same speed and definitely 38+ bowlers who will be faster than him on average.

If you think I am “wiggling” out, that is fine. You can think what you want to think. Congratulations on your speed demon who averages 70+ in Australia, England and New Zealand and has set a world record for the most expensive figures by a pacer in Test cricket history.

 

[KingKhanWC]

I get quoted hundred times a day. I don’t keep track and I don’t check my notifications because I post from my phone through the mobile version. If you remember that thread, you can bump it so that I can take a look at it and check your perspective.

As I said, Naseem is just a fast medium bowler, and a terrible one. If you think India doesn’t have 38+ 130-140 kph bowlers in domestic cricket, you are kidding yourself.

Go to Ranji Trophy squads and check the listing of fast and fast medium bowlers. You will find about 60+ bowlers who must be bowling at the same speed and definitely 38+ bowlers who will be faster than him on average.

If you think I am “wiggling” out, that is fine. You can think what you want to think. Congratulations on your speed demon who averages 70+ in Australia, England and New Zealand and has set a world record for the most expensive figures by a pacer in Test cricket history.

Naseem bowled 145k in this current test and has clocked more in the past. Look im not here to be friends with you. Give me some names or take back your comments of 38 Indians (youth) being faster bowlers? Do you have these or do you want me to wait another year?

 

[Shoaib88]

Looks like you lost your memory, this started becaus of speed. The title isnt literal but read the first part, fast bowling factory.

Ive checked the list earlier in the thread, many are older bowlers and the youngers , none can reach Naseems speed. Indians will never overall be faster bowlers than Pakistan, history, present and future will prove this.

Can you name 38 young faster bowlers from India or not? Its been weeks lol.

What is your opinion about the 23 Indian pacers I named? How many of those do you think are better than Naseem?

 

[Shoaib88]

[MENTION=43583]KingKhanWC[/MENTION] Btw bro, this was a very ill timed thread. Naseem has just become the most expensive test pacer in history to go wicketless. That's about as terrible as you get. So getting hard to defend you on Naseem now...

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Yes he was bowling a lot faster, upto 145k.

I dont think India has 38 young bowlers around his age anywhere near his speeds.

The topic is faster bowlers not better.

At least don’t lie man. Be honest.
No he was not bowling 145+. None of the bowlers from Pakistan were bowling at that speed. He was trundling around 133-139 most of day, and some real effort balls were at 140.. half of which were no balls.
There are many at his age bowling at or around 140 with red ball. Ishan Porel,
Avesh Khan, Mavi,NagarKoti, Tyagi all can bowl at that speed of around 140.
But there is no point in discussing all these when you will continue lying .
Keep living in your delusional world where you think Indians can never produce fast bowlers. Guess what, we have and they are doing pretty well.
Check the MCG bowling highlights of Bumrah bowling his third or fourth spell, he was bowling 145+.
But I guess you won’t as you feel Pakistan has some god given right to produce athletes

 

[Sir Alex]

Yeah India had Mavi and Nagarkoti who were bolwing 140 kph plus at same age as Naseem but never were fast tracked to senior team.

 

[Shoaib88]

Yeah India had Mavi and Nagarkoti who were bolwing 140 kph plus at same age as Naseem but never were fast tracked to senior team.

But Mavi got fast tracked into Uttar Pradesh team didnt he? You guys have to remember: India = 1.4 Billion, Pakistan = 200 million, Uttar Pradesh = 200 million. Pakistan should be compared to Uttar Pradesh not India which has 7 times more people.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

But Mavi got fast tracked into Uttar Pradesh team didnt he? You guys have to remember: India = 1.4 Billion, Pakistan = 200 million, Uttar Pradesh = 200 million. Pakistan should be compared to Uttar Pradesh not India which has 7 times more people.

You can’t keep on making the population excuse.. per capita income and economy is what counts. In That regards India and Pakistan have done much better then England given the resources.

Pakistan is in much better situation then India, less population comparatively, better meat eating diet with high proteins. You should be producing much better athletes

 

[Shoaib88]

You can’t keep on making the population excuse.. per capita income and economy is what counts. In That regards India and Pakistan have done much better then England given the resources.

Pakistan is in much better situation then India, less population comparatively, better meat eating diet with high proteins. You should be producing much better athletes

If having less population means you should have better team then City of Amritsar must have better cricket team than rest of India combined together.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

If having less population means you should have better team then City of Amritsar must have better cricket team than rest of India combined together.

Population has nothing to do with sporting culture and access to resources. If you have really good economic, and then interest to invest in sports thing start falling in place.
Less population helps because 200 mediocre players will not be able to compete with 5 great ones.
Less population means less strain on resources. Off course system should be not corrupt as well.

 

[Shoaib88]

Population has nothing to do with sporting culture and access to resources. If you have really good economic, and then interest to invest in sports thing start falling in place.
Less population helps because 200 mediocre players will not be able to compete with 5 great ones.
Less population means less strain on resources. Off course system should be not corrupt as well.

If population has nothing to do with quality of sports teams it can produce, can a small village of 50 people with really good economy and sporting culture win the cricket world cup?

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

If population has nothing to do with quality of sports teams it can produce, can a small village of 50 people with really good economy and sporting culture win the cricket world cup?

Come on man stop taking things literally.
If those 50 are better trained, and not malnutrioned then most of the populace in Indian and Pakistan, then may be yes.

Just take Australia for example, a nation of only 25 million people.
They have won more Olympic gold medals then India, Pakistan, Bangladesh and at one point including China as well. Thats freaking 3 Billion people vs 25 million.
Why do you think that happened ?

I will wait for your response.

 

[Sir Alex]

But Mavi got fast tracked into Uttar Pradesh team didnt he? You guys have to remember: India = 1.4 Billion, Pakistan = 200 million, Uttar Pradesh = 200 million. Pakistan should be compared to Uttar Pradesh not India which has 7 times more people.

Yes, that's what state teams and competitions are there for, aren't they ?

Unless you are suggesting Pakistan and UP are at same level from a cricketing perspective ?

 

[pillionrider]

Indians will never overall be faster bowlers than Pakistan, history, present and future will prove this.

That may be true.

What is also true is that India will never scale the heights that Pakistan have managed to. And before you get excited about Ashwin in there, look at the wickets column

 

[Shoaib88]

Come on man stop taking things literally.
If those 50 are better trained, and not malnutrioned then most of the populace in Indian and Pakistan, then may be yes.

Just take Australia for example, a nation of only 25 million people.
They have won more Olympic gold medals then India, Pakistan, Bangladesh and at one point including China as well. Thats freaking 3 Billion people vs 25 million.
Why do you think that happened ?

I will wait for your response.

Very good comment. How has Australia with population of 25 million managed to dominate countries much bigger in sports? Because of it's strong investment in sporting infrastructure & culture and also strong genes. This is nothing to away from my point that the population of the country has big effect on the quality of sports teams a country can produce. If Australia had the population of 70 million with the same sporting infrastructure per capita and the sporting culture, it would be much more DOMINANT in sports and if it had population of 1.2 million, it would be much less DOMINANT in sports.

 

[Shoaib88]

Yes, that's what state teams and competitions are there for, aren't they ?

Unless you are suggesting Pakistan and UP are at same level from a cricketing perspective ?

I am saying Pakistan and UP are at the same level from a population perspective

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Very good comment. How has Australia with population of 25 million managed to dominate countries much bigger in sports? Because of it's strong investment in sporting infrastructure & culture and also strong genes. This is nothing to away from my point that the population of the country has big effect on the quality of sports teams a country can produce. If Australia had the population of 70 million with the same sporting infrastructure per capita and the sporting culture, it would be much more DOMINANT in sports and if it had population of 1.2 million, it would be much less DOMINANT in sports.

Back to gene theory!! Alas !!.
From a statistic point of view, don't you think out of 3 Billion people in those countries at least 50 million will have better or similar genetic make up as Australians. Good built, height, long legs.

It is more to do with infrastructure and culture. Nothing to do with genes.

 

[Sir Alex]

I am saying Pakistan and UP are at the same level from a population perspective

But you implied otherwise - that UP fast tracking Mavi is comparable to Pak fast tracking Naseem. First Class cricket exists to find and prepare talents for national team selection. For all the temptation, Mavi and Nagarkoti were made to play domestic and A games and are not yet considered seriously for national selections.

Shows the difference in professionalism and cricketing cultures of both countries. In India pace isn't be and end of everything.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

Very good comment. How has Australia with population of 25 million managed to dominate countries much bigger in sports? Because of it's strong investment in sporting infrastructure & culture and also strong genes. This is nothing to away from my point that the population of the country has big effect on the quality of sports teams a country can produce. If Australia had the population of 70 million with the same sporting infrastructure per capita and the sporting culture, it would be much more DOMINANT in sports and if it had population of 1.2 million, it would be much less DOMINANT in sports.

Also, overpopulation, or more population than resources available kills every other development.
If Australia has a population of 70 million, it will go down to the dogs.
2/3rd of Australia is desert and uninhabitable.

They already have water quotas in some towns and cities.
Melbourne and Sydney are already overcrowded, the trains are packed in the morning. I live 25 KM out of City of Melbourne, takes me 1 hour to reach city to work and I never get a place to sit in the morning between 7:30 AM to 8:30 AM.
So with current infrastructure, resources available even Australia can only sustain at max the 35-40 million of population.

They will run out of water and food for 70 million population.
Forget about Sports and better Genes if there is no proper food to eat.

 

[Devadwal]

If population has nothing to do with quality of sports teams it can produce, can a small village of 50 people with really good economy and sporting culture win the cricket world cup?

I'f population is benchmark than Mumbai GDP Is greater than entire Pakistan .why??

 

[Shoaib88]

Back to gene theory!! Alas !!.
From a statistic point of view, don't you think out of 3 Billion people in those countries at least 50 million will have better or similar genetic make up as Australians. Good built, height, long legs.

It is more to do with infrastructure and culture. Nothing to do with genes.

If nothing to do with genes then how come some starving sub saharan african nations win more medals than India in Olympics (specifically in athletics).

 

[Shoaib88]

I'f population is benchmark than Mumbai GDP Is greater than entire Pakistan .why??

Lol your comment doesn't even make any sense. What are you trying to say?

 

[Shoaib88]

Also, overpopulation, or more population than resources available kills every other development.
If Australia has a population of 70 million, it will go down to the dogs.
2/3rd of Australia is desert and uninhabitable.

They already have water quotas in some towns and cities.
Melbourne and Sydney are already overcrowded, the trains are packed in the morning. I live 25 KM out of City of Melbourne, takes me 1 hour to reach city to work and I never get a place to sit in the morning between 7:30 AM to 8:30 AM.
So with current infrastructure, resources available even Australia can only sustain at max the 35-40 million of population.

They will run out of water and food for 70 million population.
Forget about Sports and better Genes if there is no proper food to eat.

Read my comment properly before replying, I am saying if Australia had 70 million population with same infrastructure per capita

 

[Mesozoic]

OP has been humiliated left right and centre....

Well done Naseem Shah.

 

[Devadwal]

Lol your comment doesn't even make any sense. What are you trying to say?

Firstly your comment about population don't make any sense .if population is all about then my statement is true. .
Mumbai GDP > Pakistan GDP

 

[Mesozoic]

Indians will never overall be faster bowlers than Pakistan, history, present and future will prove this.

We can't change the past and predict the future but let's look at the present here....

India's first choice pace attack has three guys who bowl consistently in the early 140s (Bumrah, Shami and Yadav). Ishant bowls late 130s and our slowest bowler Siraj is atleast 8-10 kph faster than Pak's first choice new ball bowler.

Meanwhile Pakistan has Abbas whose deliveries bounce twice before reaching the wicket keeper and then a "kid" who is bowling mid 130s and is getting walloped onto the grass banks. Only Shaheen is anywhere near top3 Indian bowlers and even he is barely half as good as them.

So, just take it on the chin and stop making a fool out of yourselves with these lame deflections of better=faster. Just a friendly advice.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

If nothing to do with genes then how come some starving sub saharan african nations win more medals than India in Olympics (specifically in athletics).

Why do they have more medals than Pakistan in athletics ?

Go check this list https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_African_Olympic_medalists
After South Africa, which definitely has better sporting infrastructure then sub continent, next most of the names are Kenyan and Ethiopia.
Go check the craze for the sport there, the infra available and support those guys get from International organisations once they win something.

Those guys are not starving.
You some how want to peddle the theory that India has under achieved as more population should mean more medal.. reality is a lot more complex.
Its more economic and socio-cultural.
Indian Kabaddi team beats the crap out of every other team and wins World Cup every time. Because related required infrastructure is there with adequate interest.

 

[amit]

Don't know about 38 but here's the name of only 23 Indian pacers which I could find. How many of them are better than Naseem?

1. Jasprit Bumrah
2. Mohammed Shami
3. Ishant Sharma
4. Umesh Yadav
5. Navdeep Saini
6. Shardul Thakur
7. Varun Aaron
8. T. Natarajan
9. Avesh Khan
10. Mohammaed Siraj
11. Bhuvneshwar Kumar
12. Hardik Pandya
13. Kamlesh Nagarkoti
14. Ishan Porel
15. Shivam Mavi
16. Akashdeep Singh
17. Karthik Tyagi
18. Khaleel Ahmed
19. Ankit Rajpoot
20. Jaydev Unadkat
21. Dhawal Kulkarni
22. Sandeep Warrier
23. Rajneesh Gurbani

We can extend this list further

24. Deepak Chahar
25. Lukman Meriwala
26. Chetan Sakariya
27. Varun Aaron
28. Basil Thampi
29. Sandeep Sharma
30. Arzan Nagwaswalla
31. Mujtaba Yousuf
32. Mohsin Khan
33. Tushar Deshpande
34. Darshan Nalkande
35. Aditya Thakare
36. Ishwar Pandey
37. Vaibhav Arora
38. Harshal Patel
39. KM Asif

 

[Slog]

There's probably 38 better bowlers than Naseem Shah in Pakistan

 

[MesonK]

Kapil dev averaged 30 with bowl ... How many Pakistanis playing in PSL are better than Kapil Dev ? I guess many of them

 

[BreadPakoda]

Kapil dev averaged 30 with bowl ... How many Pakistanis playing in PSL are better than Kapil Dev ? I guess many of them

Indeed. He is 62.

 

[Bilal7]

Naseem Shah is 18 years old. I have no idea why these 30 year old professional critics on PP are trashing someone who played for Pakistan when they were 16-17 years in age. That is a huge achievement, regardless of the fact that he isn't ready for the highest level.

There aren't 38 18-year olds in the whole world that are better fast bowlers than Naseem Shah. However, Shah needs to improve if he ever wants to play for Pakistan again.

 

[OMB]

Kapil dev averaged 30 with bowl ... How many Pakistanis playing in PSL are better than Kapil Dev ? I guess many of them

Kapil paaji - Super Legend! He was known for his focus on longevity than express pace. probably because he had a very heavy workload and heavy expectation from fans. Guess how many tests he missed due to Injuries?

 

[mastimasti]

Naseem Shah had a five for aged 16....is now 18 and going to rebuild after injury.

I have read through the thread and not found a list of 38 Indian bowlers. Did I miss something?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Naseem Shah is 18 years old. I have no idea why these 30 year old professional critics on PP are trashing someone who played for Pakistan when they were 16-17 years in age. That is a huge achievement, regardless of the fact that he isn't ready for the highest level.

There aren't 38 18-year olds in the whole world that are better fast bowlers than Naseem Shah. However, Shah needs to improve if he ever wants to play for Pakistan again.

I think the criticism is a bit over the top, while Shah is clearly not ready yet for international cricket, the same could have been said about Hasnain, and now he looks the real deal. Like Hasnain, one thing which Shah has got is sheer pace. If he can get his radar right he will be a difficult prospect for any batsman. He is 18 officially, even if he is actually 22 that is still pretty young so every chance he can get better.

 

[Bilal7]

I think the criticism is a bit over the top, while Shah is clearly not ready yet for international cricket, the same could have been said about Hasnain, and now he looks the real deal. Like Hasnain, one thing which Shah has got is sheer pace. If he can get his radar right he will be a difficult prospect for any batsman. He is 18 officially, even if he is actually 22 that is still pretty young so every chance he can get better.

I've been away for a while and apparently his age is a controversial subject. Why do people think that he's four years older than his official age? He definitely looks like a teenager and has no facial hair to speak of.

 

[NoBallZombie]

We can't change the past and predict the future but let's look at the present here....

India's first choice pace attack has three guys who bowl consistently in the early 140s (Bumrah, Shami and Yadav). Ishant bowls late 130s and our slowest bowler Siraj is atleast 8-10 kph faster than Pak's first choice new ball bowler.

Meanwhile Pakistan has Abbas whose deliveries bounce twice before reaching the wicket keeper and then a "kid" who is bowling mid 130s and is getting walloped onto the grass banks. Only Shaheen is anywhere near top3 Indian bowlers and even he is barely half as good as them.

So, just take it on the chin and stop making a fool out of yourselves with these lame deflections of better=faster. Just a friendly advice.

Not sure how you got to this conclusion. Shaheen would be one of the top names in a combined indo-pak Xi. Who is Yadav again? Last time I associated that name with a spray gun and wahab riaz was far superior to that bloke.

India has got a good pace attack but even after a long hiatus, Pak pacers are not down. Shaheen and Hassan would make a good combo -- need to give them a couple of years together at least as Indian pacers have had longevity on their side. There would be more pacers coming soon, but given this is India's best bowling attack ever, I find it hard that India are going to be able to maintain this. I would be surprised if they do.

 

[NoBallZombie]

We can extend this list further

24. Deepak Chahar
25. Lukman Meriwala
26. Chetan Sakariya
27. Varun Aaron
28. Basil Thampi
29. Sandeep Sharma
30. Arzan Nagwaswalla
31. Mujtaba Yousuf
32. Mohsin Khan
33. Tushar Deshpande
34. Darshan Nalkande
35. Aditya Thakare
36. Ishwar Pandey
37. Vaibhav Arora
38. Harshal Patel
39. KM Asif

Someone can list 40 bowlers in Pak domestic. I am not sure who is deciding how these random names are better than Naseem who has got a 5ver in Tests and a hattrick. I keep hearing names of Avesh, Mavi, Tyagi ... why are they better? Speed? Stats? Potential?

 

[Shafi]

Give him a break!!!! This kid was over used by Waqar and then forced to change his run-up. Our fielders are worst among test team and drop crucial catches of top batsmen on his bowling. He needs to recover injury and train by professional bowling coach.

 

[hitthestump]

Give him a break!!!! This kid was over used by Waqar and then forced to change his run-up. Our fielders are worst among test team and drop crucial catches of top batsmen on his bowling. He needs to recover injury and train by professional bowling coach.

Sums it up very well.

 

[hitthestump]

I've been away for a while and apparently his age is a controversial subject. Why do people think that he's four years older than his official age? He definitely looks like a teenager and has no facial hair to speak of.

You'd be surprised how close that razor can get when it's required. I've seen "16 year old" asylum seekers in the UK pull that off pretty well just as an example.

 

[Slog]

I've been away for a while and apparently his age is a controversial subject. Why do people think that he's four years older than his official age? He definitely looks like a teenager and has no facial hair to speak of.

He clearly shaves lol. That’s why no facial hair. Like it’s so obvious. Also as per Saj only he is 3-4 years older. A big giveaway is that he was discovered 2016-17 as a 16-17 year old and somehow 3 years later his age hadn’t changed.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

Give him a break!!!! This kid was over used by Waqar and then forced to change his run-up. Our fielders are worst among test team and drop crucial catches of top batsmen on his bowling. He needs to recover injury and train by professional bowling coach.

Very right. He hasn’t bowled nearly as bad as people are construing him to have bowled. Has the wickets of top, top, top class batsmen under his belt already by the age of 18 and would have 1.5 times more if our fielding was up to the mark. On top of that, the shortening of his run up.

Naseem is a top class prospect, dare I say the best bowler in the world under the age of 19 right now. Even if he were 20 years old or something, he is in the top 10 bowlers of that age group easily.

 

[Kingpin786]

He clearly shaves lol. That’s why no facial hair. Like it’s so obvious. Also as per Saj only he is 3-4 years older. A big giveaway is that he was discovered 2016-17 as a 16-17 year old and somehow 3 years later his age hadn’t changed.

Please provide evidence as you are quoting Saj

 

[Junaids]

Everyone needs to calm down.

Naseem Shah is probably 19 or 20 years old. He's got a beautiful action but his shortness is going to limit how good he can become.

There is no more promising fast bowler under 23 years of age in the world except for Shaheen Shah Afridi. And Afridi is only more promising because of his height - and absolutely nothing else.

Naseem Shah wasn't ready for prime time when he was rushed into the Test squad. And he has gone backwards because he has been paired with a completely incompetent coach in Waqar Younis, who only understands inswing bowling and is ruining a terrific outswing prospect.

I've seen this before. I remember Craig McDermott and Mitchell Johnson losing their way when people tried to "improve" lovely teenage bowling actions.

Naseem Shah will get back his pace and his shape when he is distanced from Waqar Younis. It's as simple as that!

 

[Xoib]

Will get to spend some time with Steyn this season hopefully picks up a thing or two I still feel with right guidance there is a world class fast bowler hidden in him.

 

[Bilal7]

You'd be surprised how close that razor can get when it's required. I've seen "16 year old" asylum seekers in the UK pull that off pretty well just as an example.

He clearly shaves lol. That’s why no facial hair. Like it’s so obvious. Also as per Saj only he is 3-4 years older. A big giveaway is that he was discovered 2016-17 as a 16-17 year old and somehow 3 years later his age hadn’t changed.

Seems like a silly conspiracy theory based on world class Gillette and Manscaped technology. He has no reason to look like a kid for the fans and the coaches and selectors in the domestic scene would know how old he is. It's not like he's doing this to be selected for the under-21 side.

When any of your team-mates or a domestic coach or selector can expose you, it seems like a huge waste of time to shave thrice a week. Besides, it's not just the lack of facial hair but his face itself. This isn't a 22 year old.

 

[Slog]

Please provide evidence as you are quoting Saj

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Highly rated 17 year old pace bowler Nasim Shah who was signed by Quetta Gladiators for the Pakistan Super League has suffered a back injury. He is back in training and hopes to be fit for PSL4 <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PSL4?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PSL4</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@Saj_PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saj_PakPassion/status/1068889295556100096?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 1, 2018</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

This is one example. He is 17 in December 2018 but magically became 16 at the time of his debut in November 2019? If you look at articles on him around 2017-18; all sources quote him as 17-18 year old but magically his age reduced couple of years later at time of his debut....
\=

 

[Slog]

Anyways this age debate is futile. The major issue is that he is mediocre regardless of age.

The only injustice is that he was hyped and picked as a '16 year old.' You can find many 20-21 year olds with similar skill set and the only reason he stood out was due to this fake age.

 

[Kingpin786]

Anyways this age debate is futile. The major issue is that he is mediocre regardless of age.

The only injustice is that he was hyped and picked as a '16 year old.' You can find many 20-21 year olds with similar skill set and the only reason he stood out was due to this fake age.

please name those skillfull 21 years olds

 

[Slog]

please name those skillfull 21 years olds

21 year olds with a similar mediocre skill level to the 40+ averaging Naseem Shah?

 

[Kingpin786]

21 year olds with a similar mediocre skill level to the 40+ averaging Naseem Shah?

Those21-year-olds who have batter fc average than 26.xx

 

[Usman Chadda]

What I want to know how on earth does a pacer averaging 140kph in Test cricket, 145 kph in last year’s PSL end up bowling 130-135 kph nonsense within a year?!

Forget Naseem for a moment, and think about how inept our team management really is. How do our pacers end up losing pace overtime, when they should in fact be getting faster?

 

[Thunderbolt14]

What I want to know how on earth does a pacer averaging 140kph in Test cricket, 145 kph in last year’s PSL end up bowling 130-135 kph nonsense within a year?!

Forget Naseem for a moment, and think about how inept our team management really is. How do our pacers end up losing pace overtime, when they should in fact be getting faster?

This is the right question.

 

[Napa]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Highly rated 17 year old pace bowler Nasim Shah who was signed by Quetta Gladiators for the Pakistan Super League has suffered a back injury. He is back in training and hopes to be fit for PSL4 <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PSL4?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PSL4</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@Saj_PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saj_PakPassion/status/1068889295556100096?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 1, 2018</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

This is one example. He is 17 in December 2018 but magically became 16 at the time of his debut in November 2019? If you look at articles on him around 2017-18; all sources quote him as 17-18 year old but magically his age reduced couple of years later at time of his debut....
\=

I don’t understand this fake age mentality? Why lie about age? It’s not going to get the bowler more wickets. All it does is distract the player and put more pressure on him.

 

[Slog]

What I want to know how on earth does a pacer averaging 140kph in Test cricket, 145 kph in last year’s PSL end up bowling 130-135 kph nonsense within a year?!

Forget Naseem for a moment, and think about how inept our team management really is. How do our pacers end up losing pace overtime, when they should in fact be getting faster?

That is petty standard for most fast bowlers. Naseem isn’t the first one and won’t be the last one who’s pace drops in test cricket as he bowls longer spells esp because we end up being 100+ overs almost every time he has players

And pretty daft to compare average speed in t20s to average speed in tests.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

That is petty standard for most fast bowlers. Naseem isn’t the first one and won’t be the last one who’s pace drops in test cricket as he bowls longer spells esp because we end up being 100+ overs almost every time he has players

And pretty daft to compare average speed in t20s to average speed in tests.

Bro read his post again. He went from averaging 140 in tests to 135 in tests and 145 in limited overs to 140 in limited overs.

Our management has ****** with his runup.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Anyways this age debate is futile. The major issue is that he is mediocre regardless of age.

The only injustice is that he was hyped and picked as a '16 year old.' You can find many 20-21 year olds with similar skill set and the only reason he stood out was due to this fake age.

I haven't seen many who can bowl as quickly as Naseem. Agree he is still a mediocre bowler, but he has some raw ability if he can improve the accuracy a bit.

 

[Usman Chadda]

That is petty standard for most fast bowlers. Naseem isn’t the first one and won’t be the last one who’s pace drops in test cricket as he bowls longer spells esp because we end up being 100+ overs almost every time he has players

And pretty daft to compare average speed in t20s to average speed in tests.

You completely missed the point of my post, well done.

Regardless of how good or bad he is, a young pacer losing 10-15 kph within a year is only seen in Pakistan. It’s not just Naseem affected, Hasnain, Shaheen and Rauf have also reduced their average speeds since their debuts. Faheem Ashraf barely touches 135 kph, when he could bowl up to 140 kph before. There is video evidence of this, so I request someone to delve deep into this. Our bowlers are getting smacked regardless, but to lose the BASIC skillset they were actually selected for is mind-boggling to say the least.

 

[street cricketer]

Whose bright idea was it anyway to pick a "16 year old" to lead the pace attack in Australia of all places. Even if he was 20 at the time of his debut, that's still too young to know what lengths to bowl in Australia.

He was probably picked for his pace but once you make the step up to international cricket, test level batsmen of top teams don't get intimidated by pace unless it's above 150ks or you're playing one of the weak teams. The most important factor of fast bowling is actually accuracy, a bowler who bowls the awkward lengths at a lively pace will be the most difficult to face for most batsmen. Cummins often bowls only in the high 130s and only ramps it up when absolutely needed, but his high 130ks away seamers with his almost McGrath like accuracy makes him the best bowler in the world. Starc is much quicker on average pace but he has ordinary accuracy which is why he gets feasted upon even in Shield cricket these days.

Naseem needs to spend atleast 2-3 seasons in domestic cricket till he matures as a bowler and has full control over his lengths. He has raw pace, so that's his advantage. His disadvantage is probably his height, the bounce you're able to generate from a good length is a huge factor in determining a pacer's success on wickets with pace and bounce and usually tall quicks with high arm action like Hazlewood, Morkel generate the most bounce from the good length area. Naseem I think with right guidance can become a top quick with skiddy pace like Shami who is lethal in the subcontinent. And if he learns some new ball skills, I don't see why he can't be successful overseas too. But at the moment, he is raw and needs more experience in domestic cricket before becoming a top level quick.

 

[Slog]

You completely missed the point of my post, well done.

Regardless of how good or bad he is, a young pacer losing 10-15 kph within a year is only seen in Pakistan. It’s not just Naseem affected, Hasnain, Shaheen and Rauf have also reduced their average speeds since their debuts. Faheem Ashraf barely touches 135 kph, when he could bowl up to 140 kph before. There is video evidence of this, so I request someone to delve deep into this. Our bowlers are getting smacked regardless, but to lose the BASIC skillset they were actually selected for is mind-boggling to say the least.

It seems you’ve completely missed the point. Pace generally drops as you bowl longer spells + adrenaline goes away.

Before his debut in Australia; Naseem had never bowled more than 12 overs in an innings of
Competitive cricket. So doesn’t take Einstein to know that he doesn’t have experience in workload management and maintaining pace through long spells.

 

[Thunderbolt14]

It seems you’ve completely missed the point. Pace generally drops as you bowl longer spells + adrenaline goes away.

Before his debut in Australia; Naseem had never bowled more than 12 overs in an innings of
Competitive cricket. So doesn’t take Einstein to know that he doesn’t have experience in workload management and maintaining pace through long spells.

And you missed his point again, no one is talking about his second or third spells. In his first spells, he is 10kph slower than he was in his first spells a year ago. This is true across formats

 

[Kingpin786]

It seems you’ve completely missed the point. Pace generally drops as you bowl longer spells + adrenaline goes away.

Before his debut in Australia; Naseem had never bowled more than 12 overs in an innings of
Competitive cricket. So doesn’t take Einstein to know that he doesn’t have experience in workload management and maintaining pace through long spells.

But even after bowling 15+ over in an innings most of the times his average pace was above 140kph.

 

[Stewie]

Whose bright idea was it anyway to pick a "16 year old" to lead the pace attack in Australia of all places. Even if he was 20 at the time of his debut, that's still too young to know what lengths to bowl in Australia.

He was probably picked for his pace but once you make the step up to international cricket, test level batsmen of top teams don't get intimidated by pace unless it's above 150ks or you're playing one of the weak teams. The most important factor of fast bowling is actually accuracy, a bowler who bowls the awkward lengths at a lively pace will be the most difficult to face for most batsmen. Cummins often bowls only in the high 130s and only ramps it up when absolutely needed, but his high 130ks away seamers with his almost McGrath like accuracy makes him the best bowler in the world. Starc is much quicker on average pace but he has ordinary accuracy which is why he gets feasted upon even in Shield cricket these days.

Naseem needs to spend atleast 2-3 seasons in domestic cricket till he matures as a bowler and has full control over his lengths. He has raw pace, so that's his advantage. His disadvantage is probably his height, the bounce you're able to generate from a good length is a huge factor in determining a pacer's success on wickets with pace and bounce and usually tall quicks with high arm action like Hazlewood, Morkel generate the most bounce from the good length area. Naseem I think with right guidance can become a top quick with skiddy pace like Shami who is lethal in the subcontinent. And if he learns some new ball skills, I don't see why he can't be successful overseas too. But at the moment, he is raw and needs more experience in domestic cricket before becoming a top level quick.

There is little to no quality coaching in first class setups in Pakistan. Most players learn more either playing grade cricket for Pakistan or international or overseas cricket.. franchise or otherwise.

I think it’s good that Pakistan fast tracks these players and throws them in the deep end because it’s either sink or swim for them and such a trial by fire method has historically worked for us.

For a while we tried the bring domestic performers and they are well into their thirties when they debut and well past their prime and can’t learn new tricks at that age.

If we had a wonderful domestic structure with proper quality coaching stuff for each team, yes this conventional wisdom would work.

 

[hitthestump]

What I want to know how on earth does a pacer averaging 140kph in Test cricket, 145 kph in last year’s PSL end up bowling 130-135 kph nonsense within a year?!

Forget Naseem for a moment, and think about how inept our team management really is. How do our pacers end up losing pace overtime, when they should in fact be getting faster?

What has Waqar achieved with any of our current bowlers? I don't know how he's still hanging around the national team.

 

[Rana]

Just 38?

 

[Mamoon]

Naseem Shah in Australia, England and New Zealand:

Australia:

Average 68, economy 3.4

England:

Average 69, economy 3.4

New Zealand:

Average 73, economy 4.5

Remarkable consistency.

Vs Australia at home:

Average 89, economy 4.2

)

Another series against a big team, another humiliation. The worst fast bowler in the world.

 

[Major]

This thread is for the future.

If Naseem isnt able to have a career and 37 bowlers from India end up making their debut after Naseems debut, I hope OP exists till than for the humble pie

 

[Mobashir]

Wow, so much talent in India that they have 38 better fast bowlers than Naseem Shah.

 

[Varun]

Wow, so much talent in India that they have 38 better fast bowlers than Naseem Shah.

I would be disappointed if we only had 38 better fast bowlers than a guy who averages 45 in test cricket.

 

[Rana]

Seems like 38+ better fast bowlers in India who can pick up Smith, Root and Williamson at the age of 19.

India is truly the land of fast bowlers!

 

[Rajdeep]

Wow, so much talent in India that they have 38 better fast bowlers than Naseem Shah.

Not a time to boast about. Pakistan is playing at home and even after 2 test matches, the series is still even stevens. India beat Australia in Australia twice, let alone destroying them in India.

 

[Ismailtoca]

Not a time to boast about. Pakistan is playing at home and even after 2 test matches, the series is still even stevens. India beat Australia in Australia twice, let alone destroying them in India.

lol. that is salty.

The discussion isn't whether Pakistan is better than India; the discussion was the fact that, "India has 38 better bowlers than Naseem Shah"

Which is laughable.

 

[Villager6964]

Naseem Shah is the fastest pacer in Asia right now.His average pace is right up there with fastest bowlers in the world.
He is getting the ball to shape he is gonna get better with time.
He is gonna serve Pakistan for long time.

 

[Ab Fan]

Quite a landmark for Naseem Shah that there are less than 38 better Indian bowlers at the moment.

 

[Ismailtoca]

Quite a landmark for Naseem Shah that there are less than 38 better Indian bowlers at the moment.

This reminds me of:
https://www.hindustantimes.com/cric...ll-rounder-hardik-pandya-101627091112926.html

and then India got knocked out round 1 in T20 WC.

 

[Mesozoic]

Saw this thread and immediately checked out the scorecard thinking he might have picked up a fifer or something.

Nope. It's a cute little 2-fer.

 

[Ab Fan]

Saw this thread and immediately checked out the scorecard thinking he might have picked up a fifer or something.

Nope. It's a cute little 2-fer.

Yeah, I thought the same as well. But then realised that they are actually arguing for the 38 names that OP posted