Is Joe Root a better all rounder than Ben Stokes ?

[stevewittry]

I have been wondering on this topic for a while and thought it would be good to discuss here. Well, stats aside and also keeping aside Joe Root's batting records, I've found him to be a heavily under-rated but a seriously good spinner. In two successive tours to the sub-continent and more specifically in India, he has out performed the regular spinners on tour and got a bagful of wickets. He has also been a bowler of choice when operating with new ball. All opposition batsmen have found him difficult to get away and he is very accurate and also generates a fair amount of turn. If you're to ask the Indian batters as to who would be the most difficult bowler they've come across from England, I'm sure most would have Joe Root as response. He was the only one to have Jaiswal (the most prolific batter in this series) in trouble and had his wicket on multiple occasions. Couple this with his enviable batting records, and he becomes a serious batting all rounder (and with enough bowling opportunities) he should have been one of the top all rounders in this era.

On the contrary, there is this Ben Stokes who claims to be an all rounder but have not bowled for quite some time. His bowling is anything of a threat. He is also inferior to Joe Root as a batter. But many claim him as the all time great all rounders in the game. I find this more of an exaggeration. He has been lucky to win the World Cup 2019 due to some dubious decisions and did feature in one great knock in the Ashes in a chasing cause but his commitment to the game and his batting credentials are no match to Joe Root. Your thoughts ?

 

[Mamoon]

Ben Stokes had a purple patch from 2016 to 2019 but either side of this patch he has been an average cricketer.

He is a mediocre batsman who has played 2-3 exceptional knocks in his career and as a bowler he has always been poor and has never looked like someone who could really threaten the opposition.

In 2019, at the age of 28, it looked like Stokes was going to take the game by storm over the next 5-6 years which should have been his golden years. However, he has done absolutely nothing in the last 5 years in Tests and ODIs and his status as a great all-rounder has taken a beating.

He has been comfortably surpassed by the likes of Ashwin and Jadeja as the premier Test all-rounders and right now, even Root looks like a more threatening all-rounder.

There has never been a comparison between the two as batsmen but at the moment, Root seems to be a better bowler as well and he is also fit.

Root is a year older than Stokes but Stokes looks knackered and someone in his 40s. If he was an Asian player he would have been accused of age cheating because I have never seen a 32 year old cricketer look so miserable.

Root looks like someone who can play for the next 5 years while Stokes would do really well to last another 12-18 months.

In my opinion, it is time for England to move on from Stokes. His captaincy has also been exposed now and he cost England two Test matches (first Ashes Test & fourth Test in India) purely due to his terrible leadership.

Stokes has developed a bit of a cult fan following and seems to be untouchable thanks to his contribution to England’s success in 2019 and 2022, but time doesn’t stop for anyone.

He is washed up now and England have a lot of soft matches coming up after this series. It is the perfect time to blood in a replacement.

 

[James]

Currently Root is better for sure, albeit by default, because Stokes isn’t an all rounder at the moment.

Stokes right now is a specialist captain who contributes an occasional innings with the bat, similarly to how Morgan became in his twilight years for the white ball setup, although Stokes is not as good at either discipline as Morgan was.

Stokes looks like he could be bowling again soon so we will see if/when that happens, if he can still deliver wicket taking spells.

Re him stepping down, I don’t think he or England are ready for this yet and there isn’t an obvious fully prepped replacement, although I can see Pope taking over in 2025/6.

The other option if Stokes body breaks down earlier than this would be going back to Root as an interim appointment, but I don’t think Joe would want to do that.

 

[160KPH]

Root has some amazing bowling performances, but also not a significant degree of consistency with his bowling. Stokes, on the other hand, does not bowl at all anymore.

The thing about Stokes is that his overall record seems rather mediocre, but he has some of the most impactful and legendary innings of all the time like the WC Final, the 135* at Headingley, and many more.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

is there any comparission between both of them?

one is a atg Test batter and other one is a good white ball cricketer.

 

[Ab Fan]

Neither are all rounders. Root is willing to do the job of 5th bowler for England but ultimately he is an ATG test batter and a good part time spinner.

Stokes is a good test batter but an average bowler over his career.

 

[cricketcricket79]

Ben Stokes had a purple patch from 2016 to 2019 but either side of this patch he has been an average cricketer.

He is a mediocre batsman who has played 2-3 exceptional knocks in his career and as a bowler he has always been poor and has never looked like someone who could really threaten the opposition.

In 2019, at the age of 28, it looked like Stokes was going to take the game by storm over the next 5-6 years which should have been his golden years. However, he has done absolutely nothing in the last 5 years in Tests and ODIs and his status as a great all-rounder has taken a beating.

He has been comfortably surpassed by the likes of Ashwin and Jadeja as the premier Test all-rounders and right now, even Root looks like a more threatening all-rounder.

There has never been a comparison between the two as batsmen but at the moment, Root seems to be a better bowler as well and he is also fit.

Root is a year older than Stokes but Stokes looks knackered and someone in his 40s. If he was an Asian player he would have been accused of age cheating because I have never seen a 32 year old cricketer look so miserable.

Root looks like someone who can play for the next 5 years while Stokes would do really well to last another 12-18 months.

In my opinion, it is time for England to move on from Stokes. His captaincy has also been exposed now and he cost England two Test matches (first Ashes Test & fourth Test in India) purely due to his terrible leadership.

Stokes has developed a bit of a cult fan following and seems to be untouchable thanks to his contribution to England’s success in 2019 and 2022, but time doesn’t stop for anyone.

He is washed up now and England have a lot of soft matches coming up after this series. It is the perfect time to blood in a replacement.

Agreed. I think his cult followers will get a little dose of reality after this India series. If they had won the series or even drawn it, they would have put up a statue of him in Lords.

 

[AMSS]

People remember iconic knocks and memorable moments. This series has been a rank illustration on the utter gulf between Jadeja and Stokes as ARs for their teams. There's an unbridgeable gap of skill and talent. But a handful of performances across his career would convince people that Stokes is not only in the same league as Jaddu but actually a better cricketer.

 

[Ab Fan]

Basically, the conclusion is that Stokes is not in the same league of Anderson, Root, Cook and KP as test cricketers. Those guys are top cricketers produced by England in this millenium.

People need to move on from the romanticism for that World Cup Final and Headingley Knock.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Root is turning into a good handy bowler and he already is a great batter in red ball format while Stokes is not bowling anymore so should consider him a specialist captain who can bat a bit.

 

[Mamoon]

Agreed. I think his cult followers will get a little dose of reality after this India series. If they had won the series or even drawn it, they would have put up a statue of him in Lords.

Yes, they were ready to declare him as the greatest captain in history.

 

[Mamoon]

Basically, the conclusion is that Stokes is not in the same league of Anderson, Root, Cook and KP as test cricketers. Those guys are top cricketers produced by England in this millenium.

People need to move on from the romanticism for that World Cup Final and Headingley Knock.

Stokes had the world at his feet in 2019 but he did absolutely nothing in the next 5 years especially in Test cricket. Right now he is clearly a rung below the best English Test cricketers of all time.

In 2019, it looked like he was going to surpass Botham as England’s greatest all-rounder, but as things stand, he is not half the player Botham was.

 

[Markhor]

Yes, they were ready to declare him as the greatest captain in history.

Not as absurd as suggesting he ought to be sacked after the first Test series defeat in 2 years - while a captain that wins 1 in 17 must be retained.

Why did you run away like a startled hare from the other thread where I highlighted your dishonesty and goalpost changing for the umpteenth time ?

 

[Markhor]

Ben Stokes had a purple patch from 2016 to 2019 but either side of this patch he has been an average cricketer.

He is a mediocre batsman who has played 2-3 exceptional knocks in his career and as a bowler he has always been poor and has never looked like someone who could really threaten the opposition.

In 2019, at the age of 28, it looked like Stokes was going to take the game by storm over the next 5-6 years which should have been his golden years. However, he has done absolutely nothing in the last 5 years in Tests and ODIs and his status as a great all-rounder has taken a beating.

He has been comfortably surpassed by the likes of Ashwin and Jadeja as the premier Test all-rounders and right now, even Root looks like a more threatening all-rounder.

There has never been a comparison between the two as batsmen but at the moment, Root seems to be a better bowler as well and he is also fit.

Root is a year older than Stokes but Stokes looks knackered and someone in his 40s. If he was an Asian player he would have been accused of age cheating because I have never seen a 32 year old cricketer look so miserable.

Root looks like someone who can play for the next 5 years while Stokes would do really well to last another 12-18 months.

In my opinion, it is time for England to move on from Stokes. His captaincy has also been exposed now and he cost England two Test matches (first Ashes Test & fourth Test in India) purely due to his terrible leadership.

Stokes has developed a bit of a cult fan following and seems to be untouchable thanks to his contribution to England’s success in 2019 and 2022, but time doesn’t stop for anyone.

He is washed up now and England have a lot of soft matches coming up after this series. It is the perfect time to blood in a replacement.

For those wanting a textbook definition of intellectual dishonesty and goalpost changing to suit one's agenda - here's a quote from April 28th 2022.

It was a mistake to sack Root. England’s Test team was not held back by his tactics but by the lack of Test quality players coming through the ranks.

Root was scapegoated. He was an easy target because ECB are not ready to concede that they have allowed County Cricket to rust and it needs a major shakeup.

Replacing him with a quitter like Stokes will not improve anything as long as Test quality players are not coming through.

Then the argument changed to McCullum deserves all the credit for England's success - not Stokes. Yet this same McCullum was derided as a "suicidal maverick" by you pre-appointment.

Suddenly this Monday a new line appears:

England under Stokes have not won any matches that they would not have won under Root or any other captain.

Who are you fooling apart from your small band of loyal acolytes here ? I'm not a Stokes fan - the cultlike evangelism irritates me no end and I prefer Test cricket not to become prolonged ODIs. However please learn to separate your personal emotions and individual likes/dislikes from objective reality.

 

[Swashbuckler]

Stokes is extremely poor against spin, almost as bad as Faf du Plessis. Zero footwork, always stuck in the crease.

 

[Mamoon]

Hoodwinked by Kuldeep again. They cannot play him.