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Is the current Pakistan Test team the worst ever to have played?

Ucdkee

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The topic says it all. I am not sure if I have seen a worse Pakistani lineup to have played in history. Even though our batting and fielding has always been mediocre, we have always made up for it with our quality of bowlers. The 2010 test team which toured England had probably the worst batting lineup in history with several batsmen making their debuts or starting their careers but even at that time we had Amir, Asif and Gul in red hot forms with Kaneria and Ajmal backing them up. The current lineup does not have a single world class player.

Have your say...
 
Not really worst. Others just got better. We are still stuck with stoneage mindset. At least our PSL has good bowling standards and merit, otherwise we would have same old wahab like players in the team.
 
cant see it getting better anytime soon, toothless bowling, batting even worse, and don't get me started on the fielding.

Hassan Ali and Mohammed Amir to be recalled for SA? same old cycle
 
Post the retirement of Mis-You, Pak have been a very poor test team and this will continue till Babar hits his peak and one of the pacers, probably Shaheen, establishes himself as a world class test bowler with a test average under-30.
 
Post the retirement of Mis-You, Pak have been a very poor test team and this will continue till Babar hits his peak and one of your pacers, probably Shaheen, establishes himself as world class test bowler with an average under-30.

How far can they get without good support though? Rizwan seems to be during a purple patch but no idea how long it will last, not one other batsman looks to be even Vihari, Latham, Nicholls, Pujara, Rahane level.

You need these kind of support batsmen to bat around Babar like Kohli or Williamson, we don’t have anyone like that. The hope is that we can find someone soon between Saud, Haider, and Kamran Ghulam.

Fawad, Abid, and Azhar will be out of the side by the time Babar and Shaheen find their purple patch. Who will replace them?

Who will support Shaheen with the new ball or the old ball?

We have a lot of problems - not only is this current Pak side one of the worst we’ve ever had, there’s no clear direction no matter who the management is and we’re likely to be “rebuilding” for another 3 years or so. I don’t envy the job, a lot depends on 3-4 unknown commodities stepping up quickly. That’s unlikely.
 
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This team needs decent openers and two good pacer to support Shaheen, and one decent spinner(perhaps Zahid M, Sajad). Haris S needs to be given one more series to regain form and fitness. Fawad, Azhar, Rizwan, Fahim, Afridi, Babar are the 6 players still deserving their places.
 
Nah, it's not.

Probably worst pact unit.
 
not really, this team has three to four potential long term player in babar, rizwan, fahim and shaheen, and dropped catches aside better asian teams have struggled in nz.

rock bottom was losing a test series at home to zim in 98 imo. never want to see that happening again.
 
India were very mediocre in 1990s. We were so awful that losing with respect was a bench mark at one point. :))
 
We're going through transition post Misbah-YK. Babar is not playing. Tbh, this is not really unexpected. We need to be patient. We will do well going forward.
 
Yes indeed with poor choice of players... Ever since misbah and waqar took over the pace bowling has been going down the hill... 3 SENA tours 7 tests where pace bowlers would be mouth watering to take wickets, except Shaheen everyone was wicketless, Misbahs selection of pace bowling except Abbas and Shaheen was appalling to say the least..

Sohail khan was picked for every single SENA tour and never played a game, so then why is he selected that too at the age of 37 lol...
 
How far can they get without good support though? Rizwan seems to be during a purple patch but no idea how long it will last, not one other batsman looks to be even Vihari, Latham, Nicholls, Pujara, Rahane level.

You need these kind of support batsmen to bat around Babar like Kohli or Williamson, we don’t have anyone like that. The hope is that we can find someone soon between Saud, Haider, and Kamran Ghulam.

Fawad, Abid, and Azhar will be out of the side by the time Babar and Shaheen find their purple patch. Who will replace them?

Who will support Shaheen with the new ball or the old ball?

We have a lot of problems - not only is this current Pak side one of the worst we’ve ever had, there’s no clear direction no matter who the management is and we’re likely to be “rebuilding” for another 3 years or so. I don’t envy the job, a lot depends on 3-4 unknown commodities stepping up quickly. That’s unlikely.

The only way for us to move up from this pit we've reached is through experimentation, and that's something I expect from Mohammad Wasim, and I hope he doesn't disappoint. A lot of people here were talking about how we won't improve with changes, but need I remind you that the likes of Kohli, Williamson, Babar, and the others were all made because someone gave them a chance. Babar was horrible in tests until that SA tour, and it looks like a lot of us have forgotten.

Until, and only until you try the resources at your disposal, such as domestic batsmen and bowlers, you cannot claim that the team won't improve.

Get some new players in, see how they adapt to the team. Set up victories with planning and execution.

And one thing I want to say is that be merciless with pitch curations at home. New Zealand have batted us out heavily, and they know that our weaknesses lie in both batting and bowling. South Africa will come soon, so I suggest that whoever is in the management should think long and hard about creating the dustiest, driest pitch they can so that we can spin South Africa back to Johannesburg.

Stop trying to "create competitive pitches" when countries we tour don't care about that at all. Bring youngsters into a winning environment where young spinners have things assisting them, and our batsmen can play with less risks to allow them to settle. Dry pitches offer nothing to fast bowlers unless you get some overcase conditions. South Africa were outdone the same way by India, through dust tracks and the left-right hand combo of Ashwin and Jadeja.

The bowling attack needs a total revamp. Bring in Hasan, kick out Naseem and Abbas. In place of Abbas, play Faheem if you still want someone to do the holding role, or bring in a domestic player like Ehsan Adil, Usman Shinwari, Irfanullah Shah, Mir Hamza, etc.

The most important thing this team can do is find a few players to gather behind and get that confidence and self-belief back. Failure happens, that's normal, but learn from failure. I saw a measly low ranked Pakistan team in 2017 with players who were unheard of step up and win a trophy against giants. We have been in dark phases, that was one of our darkest time periods in white ball cricket. This is our darkest time period in test cricket. The way we survived then was by introducing youth in the form of Shadab, Babar, Hasan, Faheem, etc. We must look to do the same now. Inshallah, we will become a better team.
 
Probably at per with 1960s. I think the lowest point was to losing home series to NZ in 1969. However, it may go further down, while that 1960s team was replaced by young County groomed pros & suddenly in 2-3 years became a formidable unit..... not seeing that to happen here to be honest.

There are 8 players in this lineup officially 30+ and their replacements are just not good (in last Test, there was 9). Still Azhar is the best specialist Test batsman while Yasir, Abbas, Rizwan, Fakhar are earning their spot. May be Abid & Haris as well, though recently Haris is completely out of touch. Apart from Saud, I don’t see any young batsman to make any significant improvement, in spin bowling there is absolutely no one close to a fade away 36+ Yasir and probably a washed-up Amir still will be best pacer if he can run for 35 overs in a Test.
 
I think it is one of the worst Pakistani sides definitely. Bowling needs attention.
 
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Not the worst compared to the past pakistani team. But other teams have adopted better to the demands of the game.
 
Post the retirement of Mis-You, Pak have been a very poor test team and this will continue till Babar hits his peak and one of the pacers, probably Shaheen, establishes himself as a world class test bowler with a test average under-30.

You cannot achieve anything if only Babar & Shaheen are world class & the rest are pure garbage. You need really good if not excellent supporting batsmen who will carry on on the days that the two will invariably fail. And yes, more importantly we need a good quality finger spinner PRONTO.
 
I don't know if it's the worst or not but even an optimistic person like me finds it so hard to sit through the matches of this train wreck of a team.

The captains feel like auditioning for a zombie movie where the more mindless you are, the higher chance of survival you have. The bowlers are so toothless they'd give competition to elephants who have their tusks removed so poachers don't go after them. The less said about the fielding in fact the thing that irks me the most is the terrible fielding standard of the team. I can understand that we have a dearth of quality in batting and bowling but the fielding continues to remain in the doldrums and it's one aspect of the game that can be improved.

I never mind losing but repeating the same mistakes over and over and showing no signs of cerebral activity drive me insane. All I ask from my team is a willingness to fight and nothing more but that just isn't happening.

A genuine speedster comes to the team, six months down the line he's trundling and there's a genuine fear that an entire career will be scapegoated to protect the egos of some individuals who even after all of this will maintain their cushy jobs.

A line and length bowler bowls 40 overs in a test yet doesn't deliver a single ball in the entire spell that is hitting the top of the off-stump.

The star batsman is out of the team because he gets his thumb broken by throwdowns, that too a day after another batsman has his thumb broken in practice.

The best performers in the only practice game before the test are sitting out in favor of people who didn't even participate in the practice game and have a terrible record outside Asia.

The main man at the helm fired the previous incumbent then applied for the same job and picked himself because there was no other candidate.

The entire team is acting as a goodwill ambassador and the offerings aren't limited to off-field events but on-field events where the advantage is being handed to the opposition through dropped catches, no-balls, and mindless strategies.
 
Nah. Between 1995 and 2003, Pakistan had some atrocious results in test cricket. This team will get better methinks.
 
Probably at per with 1960s. I think the lowest point was to losing home series to NZ in 1969. However, it may go further down, while that 1960s team was replaced by young County groomed pros & suddenly in 2-3 years became a formidable unit..... not seeing that to happen here to be honest.

There are 8 players in this lineup officially 30+ and their replacements are just not good (in last Test, there was 9). Still Azhar is the best specialist Test batsman while Yasir, Abbas, Rizwan, Fakhar are earning their spot. May be Abid & Haris as well, though recently Haris is completely out of touch. Apart from Saud, I don’t see any young batsman to make any significant improvement, in spin bowling there is absolutely no one close to a fade away 36+ Yasir and probably a washed-up Amir still will be best pacer if he can run for 35 overs in a Test.

Fakhar OK. The guy is struggling in domestics
 
Nah. Between 1995 and 2003, Pakistan had some atrocious results in test cricket. This team will get better methinks.

We’re on our way to 8th in the rankings with only Bangladesh and Zimbabwe below us we surely can’t get any worse can we?

:danish
 
We’re on our way to 8th in the rankings with only Bangladesh and Zimbabwe below us we surely can’t get any worse can we?

:danish

I think you were already ranked 8th for a while towards the end of 2019. This Pakistan team seems a bit directionless under Misbah/Waqar which was to be expected. But you have restructured your domestic and it will reap dividends in a few years. I think a lot of posters, driven by nostalgia, have a very rosy image of the past with great fast bowlers slicing through lineups with irresistible spells of reverse swing etc.

Their expectations are driven by those memories and there lies the issue. That era of cricket is well and truly over. The modern game is simply not played like that and other teams are well ahead of Pakistan in terms of adapting. I don't see any reason why Pakistan cannot consistently be a competitive side in test cricket.
 
Nah. Between 1995 and 2003, Pakistan had some atrocious results in test cricket. This team will get better methinks.

Consistently though.. i started seeing cricket in 90s as well but consistently PCT has been boring in test cricket except in Eng for a while now.
 
Fakhar OK. The guy is struggling in domestics

My mistake- actually my iPhone is too intelligent- it auto corrected Fawad to Fakhar ...

By the way, wasn’t Fakhar the MoTS of domestic T20 cup few days back? It’s about PAK team as a whole and I don’t think the LO team is doing much better than the Test team either, therefore Fakhar also comes in consideration
 
We’re on our way to 8th in the rankings with only Bangladesh and Zimbabwe below us we surely can’t get any worse can we?

:danish

I think we are in pretty safe company considering the teams around at that part of the table are also struggling. Srl is at 86 points currently, Pak is at 85 and will probably go down to 82 after the loss vs NZ, WI is at 77. Definitely bit of competition around but none of the other two are looking like pushing the ranking points either so interesting competition this.
 
You cannot achieve anything if only Babar & Shaheen are world class & the rest are pure garbage. You need really good if not excellent supporting batsmen who will carry on on the days that the two will invariably fail. And yes, more importantly we need a good quality finger spinner PRONTO.

Rizwan is world class too even more than Shaheen. This 2-0 loss is not unexpected at all, NZ at home has been a different beast altogether for sometime, actually this wholesale dhulai of your bowlers is what made Pak fans really upset as many are forced to accept the reality that Pak bowling has been garbage for a very long time. However there are quite a few positives for Pak team to take out this result for example the resurgence of Faheem as a reliable allrounder, rise of Rizwan, hacks like Shan and Haris being exposed and Azhar Ali finding some sort of form. Overall not a bad series at all if you think analytically taking into account Pak's performance in last 3-4 years, current strength and standing at the ranking table.
 
Nah. Between 1995 and 2003, Pakistan had some atrocious results in test cricket. This team will get better methinks.

That team was inconsistent, but not poor. They had atrocious results, some brilliance as in between as well - won Test in SAF, AUS, UK, blew NZ, won 2 of 3 Tests in India. In ODI as well, made WC final, win series in AUS, won series in India from 0-2 down. They could have blasted any team on their day - Shoiaib twice blew worth of 50k Test runs or 40K ODI runs in one spell ...they chased 300 in a day in Tedt match in NZ, after trailing by 170+ in first innings.

Most importantly, that team had players whom you would bother to watch - Wasim, Dhoaib, Saqui, Saeed, Inzi, MoYo, A Razzak.... even Mo Samii was blisteringly quick - you know, for a reason, I recorded a statement here in PP: “.... even Mo Sami had won a Test in NZ on debut, let’s see what Naseem does there” - I guess you have seen what he did ....

I can sum up the difference - officially 18-19 years old Imran Nazir blasted 131 in 4 hours against a WIN attack of Ambrose, Walsh, Rose & King, on the Mecca of WIN cricket (Barbados), after trailing by 150 in first innings, or Faisal Iqbal showed the world how to play against some Shane Warne .... that was youngster of that era, these days it’s been replaced by Naseem Shah, Abdullah Shafique or ..... Haider Ali.

You can’t draw parallel between two bro..
 
I had the pleasure of witnessing the 1982 Pakistan Team touring England and was watching the series and although it had great names and was led by Imran Khan, it came very close to the current team....no existent opening pair and pathetic fielding..
 
I had the pleasure of witnessing the 1982 Pakistan Team touring England and was watching the series and although it had great names and was led by Imran Khan, it came very close to the current team....no existent opening pair and pathetic fielding..

With due respect brother, I beg to disagree. I didn’t see that series but I have studied lot about the series. First difference was, cricket despite being a team game its unique that individuals can dominate the game alone .... and that team had one individual who took like 23 wickets at 15-16 and scored over 200 runs in a low scoring 3 Test series ..... that’s alone more than the total output of this PAK team (trust me - so far they have taken 21 wickets in total.... might not bowl second time here)

Then, they had couple of batsmen by the name of Javed Miandad & Zaheer Abbas. Their seem all-rounder Mudassar took 6-29 or so to set up a famous win......

But, I’m really hurt with the opener comment - yes, as a pair there was not much of a partnership, but didn’t you watch Mohsin Khan scoring 200 at Lord’s to setup Pakistan’s first follow-on enforced to England? That team had AQadir & Sarfraz as well.
 
That's because Pak is not playing a lot of cricket at home. Every team looks great at home and lost when traveling. Pak is no exception.

Maybe with Babar back in the side as batsman and captain, it may look very different. I am looking forward to the series against SA. Pak should make spin pitches and beat SA 3-0.
 
That team was inconsistent, but not poor. They had atrocious results, some brilliance as in between as well - won Test in SAF, AUS, UK, blew NZ, won 2 of 3 Tests in India. In ODI as well, made WC final, win series in AUS, won series in India from 0-2 down. They could have blasted any team on their day - Shoiaib twice blew worth of 50k Test runs or 40K ODI runs in one spell ...they chased 300 in a day in Tedt match in NZ, after trailing by 170+ in first innings.

Most importantly, that team had players whom you would bother to watch - Wasim, Dhoaib, Saqui, Saeed, Inzi, MoYo, A Razzak.... even Mo Samii was blisteringly quick - you know, for a reason, I recorded a statement here in PP: “.... even Mo Sami had won a Test in NZ on debut, let’s see what Naseem does there” - I guess you have seen what he did ....

I can sum up the difference - officially 18-19 years old Imran Nazir blasted 131 in 4 hours against a WIN attack of Ambrose, Walsh, Rose & King, on the Mecca of WIN cricket (Barbados), after trailing by 150 in first innings, or Faisal Iqbal showed the world how to play against some Shane Warne .... that was youngster of that era, these days it’s been replaced by Naseem Shah, Abdullah Shafique or ..... Haider Ali.

You can’t draw parallel between two bro..

This. previously we have had some horrible performance/ losses as well, e.g. losing test to Zim, getting all out under 50 in WI, losing to BAN before they were competitive, etc., however, at none of those times we had such a hopeless team with such consistency in low performance in overseas tests in particular. Even in past tours of australia we either had managed to win a test in 90s, and/or come close to winning a few times (sydney, hobart - catch not called, even Asad coming close, etc.). during the last year and half we have not only been horrible (rare exception being part of first test in england) but also lacking some occasional individual star performances by any batsman or bowler.

over the last 3 decades, to me this does seem like our worst team, which is compounded by probably the worst selections (e.g. Musa in Australia), bowling coaching (these same bowlers were actually performing better a year or two back than now , breaking records for extras, so many no-balls, pace has been reduced for same bowlers, no strategy against batters weaknesses -e.g. Woakes,etc.), and fielding (we used to drop catches, but things were much better during Mickey/Rixon era, and even in some past eras).

The other thing is we really don't have much better replacements sitting out there and future doesn't look too strong in short-term.

It will take a lot of time and patience for things to get back to what used to be normal/average level of performance for Pakistan as a test nation (we used to be 3rd/4th best ranked team with inconsistency for majority of our cricketing history, would rather take that than the 5th/6th type of consistent dull performance).
 
Yep.

I used to think not long ago that if you take out Babar Azam from this Pakistan team, it would be an embarrassingly poor team — and Babar being absent in the NZ test series has confirmed that theory.

It’s the first time I’m actually thinking that even adding Hafeez into this team couldn’t make it any worse - a Pakistani opener getting a 0 four times between then so far in two tests as Shan Masood and Abid Ali have done. Hafeez to his credit at least used to edge a four through slips before getting out ;-)
 
This. previously we have had some horrible performance/ losses as well, e.g. losing test to Zim, getting all out under 50 in WI, losing to BAN before they were competitive, etc., however, at none of those times we had such a hopeless team with such consistency in low performance in overseas tests in particular. Even in past tours of australia we either had managed to win a test in 90s, and/or come close to winning a few times (sydney, hobart - catch not called, even Asad coming close, etc.). during the last year and half we have not only been horrible (rare exception being part of first test in england) but also lacking some occasional individual star performances by any batsman or bowler.

over the last 3 decades, to me this does seem like our worst team, which is compounded by probably the worst selections (e.g. Musa in Australia), bowling coaching (these same bowlers were actually performing better a year or two back than now , breaking records for extras, so many no-balls, pace has been reduced for same bowlers, no strategy against batters weaknesses -e.g. Woakes,etc.), and fielding (we used to drop catches, but things were much better during Mickey/Rixon era, and even in some past eras).

The other thing is we really don't have much better replacements sitting out there and future doesn't look too strong in short-term.

It will take a lot of time and patience for things to get back to what used to be normal/average level of performance for Pakistan as a test nation (we used to be 3rd/4th best ranked team with inconsistency for majority of our cricketing history, would rather take that than the 5th/6th type of consistent dull performance).

Most painful thing is the way PAK is playing these days - I don’t mind losing and I don’t mind losing badly (in 2001-2 that team lost to NZ by innings and NZ put 400 at almost 5, after Tuffy blew PAK either side for like 150 each time), but this PAK is not worth watching. In many days, 1st day of second Test at least had a glimpse of what you would expect from PCT, but then .....
 
Pretty sad what's going on. The usual suspect(s) are having a field day to lay the boot in further.
 
That team was inconsistent, but not poor. They had atrocious results, some brilliance as in between as well - won Test in SAF, AUS, UK, blew NZ, won 2 of 3 Tests in India. In ODI as well, made WC final, win series in AUS, won series in India from 0-2 down. They could have blasted any team on their day - Shoiaib twice blew worth of 50k Test runs or 40K ODI runs in one spell ...they chased 300 in a day in Tedt match in NZ, after trailing by 170+ in first innings.

Most importantly, that team had players whom you would bother to watch - Wasim, Dhoaib, Saqui, Saeed, Inzi, MoYo, A Razzak.... even Mo Samii was blisteringly quick - you know, for a reason, I recorded a statement here in PP: “.... even Mo Sami had won a Test in NZ on debut, let’s see what Naseem does there” - I guess you have seen what he did ....

I can sum up the difference - officially 18-19 years old Imran Nazir blasted 131 in 4 hours against a WIN attack of Ambrose, Walsh, Rose & King, on the Mecca of WIN cricket (Barbados), after trailing by 150 in first innings, or Faisal Iqbal showed the world how to play against some Shane Warne .... that was youngster of that era, these days it’s been replaced by Naseem Shah, Abdullah Shafique or ..... Haider Ali.

You can’t draw parallel between two bro..

I'm not drawing a parallel. I'm just saying that Pakistan's strength in those days was reverse swing and we all know how that happened. That may have been a great team with some brilliance here and there but despite that advantage they lost to Australia, SL(twice), SA,ZIM at home, drew with a weak NZ side at home etc.

NZ are a much stronger side these days. That team that Pakistan played against in 2001 for example had Daryl Tuffey and James Franklin as opening bowlers and their batting was a lot weaker than what NZ is now. And Pakistan only managed to draw the series only due to a performance by Sami.
 
If this is the worst team to have played then this suggests that the New Zealand team is also vastly over rated as this “ supposedly “ worst team were only 20 odd balls away from drawing a match with them in the last test.
 
Consistently though.. i started seeing cricket in 90s as well but consistently PCT has been boring in test cricket except in Eng for a while now.

Yes. But my point, bro, was that they were exciting because they could hoop the ball around corners(which doesn't happen nowadays) and had some Saeed Anwar and a middle order of Inzi, Moyo and Younis. England never had a quality attack of Jimmy,Broad ,Archer, Woakes playing for them at the time. it was Gough a few guys who kept coming in and going out..And yet, they managed to beat Pakistan in Pakistan. They faced Daryl Tuffey, James Franklin etc. as opening bowlers in NZ. They didn't have to contend with the sustained quality of Southee/Boult/Wagner/Jamieson coming at them all day. Windies were in steep decline by 1997 as well.

The only team that had the sustained quality of modern teams was Australia and we know that Pakistan team fared against the Aussies. Even the Saffers had Donald/Pollock and after that their bowlers weren't all that. By the time Ntini emerged, Donald was done.
 
The worse is yet to come im fearing a top 3 of:

Masood
Inzy s nephew
Moins fat son
 
I had the pleasure of witnessing the 1982 Pakistan Team touring England and was watching the series and although it had great names and was led by Imran Khan, it came very close to the current team....no existent opening pair and pathetic fielding..

That team may have had flaws but still could've won the series if not for David Constant's umpiring.
 
I'm not drawing a parallel. I'm just saying that Pakistan's strength in those days was reverse swing and we all know how that happened. That may have been a great team with some brilliance here and there but despite that advantage they lost to Australia, SL(twice), SA,ZIM at home, drew with a weak NZ side at home etc.

NZ are a much stronger side these days. That team that Pakistan played against in 2001 for example had Daryl Tuffey and James Franklin as opening bowlers and their batting was a lot weaker than what NZ is now. And Pakistan only managed to draw the series only due to a performance by Sami.

Those days, everyone was creative with ball, even our Golam Nowser Price used to stop brand new balls rolled to him by stepping on to it with his spikes ... the Pakistani pacers are just way, way ahead with that particular skills. Also, creative or not, if you can put 140k+ balls on batsmen’s toe with precision, every overs 2-3 times, it’s not fun. Kiwi wickets are green and least responsive to reverse swing or creativeness - in rose tracks what WW or Shoaib or Asif or even Sami did with conventional skills ..... current lot won’t see that even in their dreams - it was not only creativeness.

And you know - humility or humbleness was never a great quality that PAK cricketers possessed .... but, I have never heard such false bravado from Was, Waq, Imran .... even Shoaib was humble - at least never saw fear in eyes of batsmen, though batsmen did see fire in his eyes. It’s just not comparable- even yesterday McMillan picked PAK to be toughest place to tour (basically toughest team to play against)!after Australia, and I am sure it wasn’t for a commentator’s gimmick....

By the way, are you sure present day bowlers are not creative any more, with the ball?
 
Those days, everyone was creative with ball, even our Golam Nowser Price used to stop brand new balls rolled to him by stepping on to it with his spikes ... the Pakistani pacers are just way, way ahead with that particular skills. Also, creative or not, if you can put 140k+ balls on batsmen’s toe with precision, every overs 2-3 times, it’s not fun. Kiwi wickets are green and least responsive to reverse swing or creativeness - in rose tracks what WW or Shoaib or Asif or even Sami did with conventional skills ..... current lot won’t see that even in their dreams - it was not only creativeness.

And you know - humility or humbleness was never a great quality that PAK cricketers possessed .... but, I have never heard such false bravado from Was, Waq, Imran .... even Shoaib was humble - at least never saw fear in eyes of batsmen, though batsmen did see fire in his eyes. It’s just not comparable- even yesterday McMillan picked PAK to be toughest place to tour (basically toughest team to play against)!after Australia, and I am sure it wasn’t for a commentator’s gimmick....

By the way, are you sure present day bowlers are not creative any more, with the ball?

I'm not making a defence for Naseem. That was a stupid comment for someone who has not shown the ability to sustain high pace for an entire season even. But, even in the last innings, Shaheen bowled at least 3 deliveries at 140 ks or so at KW's toes and KW put all away to the boundary. That is only a recipe for success if you can add the ingredient of banana reverse swing which simply doesn't happen anymore.

Conventional skills too is subject to a lot of debate. There were plenty of matches when the 2W's would go for plenty with the new ball and only come back and blast the tail out with the old ball. Also, from whatever I've understood, many players from the recent past have consistently commented that the quality of the kookaburra has deteriorated in the last ten years alone - Steyn, Boult etc. The modern kookaburra simply doesn't swing as much. Maybe the odd venue in a country such as Perth in Australia, Wanderers in SA etc. but it just doesn't deviate a large amount. I'm not sure we even have data on what balls were used in each country for tests in those days and compare the quality the modern ball. There was a time when even very average bowlers would get swing with the new ball but lately even top bowlers are struggling to find that swing.

I do believe that bowlers are less 'creative' than bowlers of yester-year. There are too many cameras going around and what's more, we haven't seen spells of massive reverse swing in ages. I can't remember the last time reverse determined the outcome of the match - may Wahab in the UAE vs England but that's about it.
 
On a positive note at least we've finally found some consistency :)
 
I'm not making a defence for Naseem. That was a stupid comment for someone who has not shown the ability to sustain high pace for an entire season even. But, even in the last innings, Shaheen bowled at least 3 deliveries at 140 ks or so at KW's toes and KW put all away to the boundary. That is only a recipe for success if you can add the ingredient of banana reverse swing which simply doesn't happen anymore.

Conventional skills too is subject to a lot of debate. There were plenty of matches when the 2W's would go for plenty with the new ball and only come back and blast the tail out with the old ball. Also, from whatever I've understood, many players from the recent past have consistently commented that the quality of the kookaburra has deteriorated in the last ten years alone - Steyn, Boult etc. The modern kookaburra simply doesn't swing as much. Maybe the odd venue in a country such as Perth in Australia, Wanderers in SA etc. but it just doesn't deviate a large amount. I'm not sure we even have data on what balls were used in each country for tests in those days and compare the quality the modern ball. There was a time when even very average bowlers would get swing with the new ball but lately even top bowlers are struggling to find that swing.

I do believe that bowlers are less 'creative' than bowlers of yester-year. There are too many cameras going around and what's more, we haven't seen spells of massive reverse swing in ages. I can't remember the last time reverse determined the outcome of the match - may Wahab in the UAE vs England but that's about it.

We are making it seam like for the bowling attack of the past it was just reverse swing and nothing else. And even if it was reverse, aside from getting the ball to that condition you also need to bowl at pace and Yorkers etc that current lot is barely doing.

Regardless. As a pakistan cricket fan I would much rather take the test team from any of our past years than the one today. I will tell you there was a certain joy in watching a replacement bowler like Mohammad Sami bowl a spell on first morning of a test match to reduce Australia with 6 for 18 that even if you end up losing the whole series is nowhere there in these dull performances of today. We need to wake up and own up to the fact that today's Pakistan test team is indeed the worst of the last few decades.

Also. Before people start labeling. I am not a wrist slitter, I would support us to win the game no matter who is playing and even in current game i would hope we somehow score big and draw the match but I also believe in calling out facts to come to grips with reality.
 
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Those days, everyone was creative with ball, even our Golam Nowser Price used to stop brand new balls rolled to him by stepping on to it with his spikes ... the Pakistani pacers are just way, way ahead with that particular skills. Also, creative or not, if you can put 140k+ balls on batsmen’s toe with precision, every overs 2-3 times, it’s not fun. Kiwi wickets are green and least responsive to reverse swing or creativeness - in rose tracks what WW or Shoaib or Asif or even Sami did with conventional skills ..... current lot won’t see that even in their dreams - it was not only creativeness.

And you know - humility or humbleness was never a great quality that PAK cricketers possessed .... but, I have never heard such false bravado from Was, Waq, Imran .... even Shoaib was humble - at least never saw fear in eyes of batsmen, though batsmen did see fire in his eyes. It’s just not comparable- even
yesterday McMillan picked PAK to be toughest place to tour (basically toughest team to play against)!after Australia, and I am sure it wasn’t for a commentator’s gimmick....

By the way, are you sure present day bowlers are not creative any more, with the ball?

I understand why Macmillan would say that, as NZ never beat Pakistan in a test series when Macmillan was playing and Fleming was the captain.
 
I'm not drawing a parallel. I'm just saying that Pakistan's strength in those days was reverse swing and we all know how that happened. That may have been a great team with some brilliance here and there but despite that advantage they lost to Australia, SL(twice), SA,ZIM at home, drew with a weak NZ side at home etc.

NZ are a much stronger side these days. That team that Pakistan played against in 2001 for example had Daryl Tuffey and James Franklin as opening bowlers and their batting was a lot weaker than what NZ is now. And Pakistan only managed to draw the series only due to a performance by Sami.

That series might have been drawn but 2003 saw, Pakistan beat quite a strong kiwi team which had drawn a test series in India a month earlier and that too after trailing by 170 runs in the 1st innings. Shoaib blew NZ apart in the 2nd innings, and no there was no ball tampering there.
 
Our batting isn’t that bad for our overall pitiful standards. However, this is easily one of the worst pace attacks we’ve ever put forth on a cricket field.
 
As others have said, credit to the batting minus the openers who should only be opening cans.

We have had far worse batting than this overseas. Refer to Steyn slicing through Hafeez, Jamshed and co like a hot knife through butter in 2013.

Pace bowling is the culprit and is the worst attack fielded of all time.
 
Honestly they are playing way better than India did in NZ...they are giving a stiff competition...
They once again proved their batting is much better than India on SENA pitches
 
My mistake- actually my iPhone is too intelligent- it auto corrected Fawad to Fakhar ...

By the way, wasn’t Fakhar the MoTS of domestic T20 cup few days back? It’s about PAK team as a whole and I don’t think the LO team is doing much better than the Test team either, therefore Fakhar also comes in consideration

Fakhar was a disaster against Zimbabwe. We should put an end to his career.
 
Pakistan heading for 5 straight losses at home. This has never happened in our history
 
100% worst team ive seen and i started watching pakistan in 1987, Humilating in Test and T20s and icing on cake will be ODI team being humiliated in 2023 world cup in india.
 
Yes it is.

This is the outcome of the 2019 reforms introduced by Imran, Mani & Wasim. This is the output after 4 years.

They have destroyed Pakistan cricket & Sethi has his work cut out.
 
Yes it is.

This is the outcome of the 2019 reforms introduced by Imran, Mani & Wasim. This is the output after 4 years.

They have destroyed Pakistan cricket & Sethi has his work cut out.

Lol. This Is a decent team but the problem are the pitches that suit opposition more thsn our team. Misbah yunus team never played in Pakistan otherwise they would have lost as badly as this team.
 
Pakistan always had terrible batting in the past, save for a brief period in the 90s with Anwar, Ijaz etc. But they always made up for it with outstanding bowlers. Now the current team has neither: it is definitely the worst Pakistan team I have ever seen.
 
That's because Pak is not playing a lot of cricket at home. Every team looks great at home and lost when traveling. Pak is no exception.

Maybe with Babar back in the side as batsman and captain, it may look very different. I am looking forward to the series against SA. Pak should make spin pitches and beat SA 3-0.

They couldn't win their last 7 home tests :)):)):))
 
It’s not just the team that’s horrible, the management of Pakistan Cricket are trying their level best to kill cricket. By preparing disgusting dead pitches, assembling a delusional and out of touch team - and if that wasn’t enough - hosting games in stadiums that pose credible health hazards, PCB is doing all it can to drive fans and advertisers away.

The ICC must step in to hold the PCB accountable because the PCB clearly isn't going to hold itself accountable.
 
It’s not just the team that’s horrible, the management of Pakistan Cricket are trying their level best to kill cricket. By preparing disgusting dead pitches, assembling a delusional and out of touch team - and if that wasn’t enough - hosting games in stadiums that pose credible health hazards, PCB is doing all it can to drive fans and advertisers away.

The ICC must step in to hold the PCB accountable because the PCB clearly isn't going to hold itself accountable.

What health hazards in the stadium are you referring to?
 
Selection blunders, injuries and odd pitch quality - all contributors
 
May or may not be the worst team. But this team earned ignominy of producing the world calendar year for Pakistan at home.

Pakistan's home performance since the beginning

tewtwewew.jpg
 
Did Pakistan not win a home Test all year ?

Think they beat Sri Lanka in an away Test, is that it then ?
 
The way things are looking , soon big teams would not come to Pakistan , Pakistan need to see what kind of surfaces they are producing , losing is different issue , but the pitches have been very poor , it does not help the growth also.
 
What health hazards in the stadium are you referring to?

The extremely dirty and disgusting seats, steel pipes exposed to fans and the concrete benches.

I would have loved to post some pictures from the Karachi ‘National’ stadium but I don’t think forum rules will allow for that.
 
We have fielded worse lineups in Tests.

But it's the lack of direction, deflated confidence and haywire selections that have led to current performance.
 
Worst year in tests of all time by Pakistan for sure. If that’s not the final straw in Babar being removed from captaincy, then nothing will be enough to dislodge him in the eyes of the PCB higher ups.
 
Main problem is we don't have any bowlers with Shaheen out at the moment but even if he was fit, probably wouldn't have made much difference.

Batting as always been a bit haywire but we always had bowlers who could take 20 wickets to win a test. Here, there is just no threat. Teams are racking up 600 runs for fun.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Pakistan in the 'relegation zone' in the World Test Championship standings. In 2022 their Test record is:<br><br>Played 9<br>Won 1<br>Lost 5<br>Drawn 3<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#cricket</a> <a href="https://t.co/VO1HGzutbJ">pic.twitter.com/VO1HGzutbJ</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@SajSadiqCricket) <a href="https://twitter.com/SajSadiqCricket/status/1609136460107489281?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 31, 2022</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Sadly, people don't care about Test cricket in Pakistan.

I wonder just how much the players care about Test cricket.

Pakistan once took great pride in the Test team and they were once worthy challengers to the great West Indies team.

These days as long as the PSL is ok that's all that matters.
 
Most home Tests played in a year with 0 wins and losing more than half matches

7 – Pakistan in 2022

6 – England in 1984

6 – England in 1989

6 – New Zealand in 1995
 
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