Is the loss of Salman Butt grossly underrated in comparison to Mohammad Asif and Mohammad Amir?

[GLORY OF '92]

I hate the guy for what he done let's make that clear. But I do think in fairness he was exactly what Pakistan cricket desperately needed if he hadn't been so greedy and brainless at the end.

He was intelligent and a captain with a decent feel for the game. His batting I think is underated. Played some Iconic innings v Australia and India. Pakistan definitely struggled to produce players like him more than high quality fast bowlers so I think in perspective it was a bigger loss than the 2 fast bowlers. In a world where he hadn't been so short sighted I reckon he was going to win a 50 over WC and dominate Tests from 2011 to 2018.

 

[saqib.rai]

He was the worst opener to play for Pakistan. And that list has huge competition with Imran Farhat and Ahmed Shehzad also in the running.
But Salman Butt beats them hands down.

Was recently looking at the scoreboard of the 2010 t20 WC semi-final. Everyone blames Ajmal but Butt Sahab scored 32 off 30 balls when the team made 190. Wasted precious powerplay overs otherwise we would have scored more than 210+ and not lost that match.

In test cricket, had an average of 30 even after playing so much.

In ODIs, the average is 32 but take into consideration that we played 5 matches against Bangladesh and Zimbabwe in 2008 where he scored like 350+ runs against EACH of these cricketing powerhouses. Otherwise that average would have been less than 27-28.

Problem is, interviewers/podcasters don't do their research when they invite ex-cricketers. And these ex-cricketers act as if they was Bradman or Sobers in their playing days. When the reality is something else.

 

[ArabKnight]

He was one of most classiest left-handed batsman Pakistan has ever produced. Extremely talented and high IQ. He was a gem. Unfortunately, he got entrapped by some British bookies.

 

[mominsaigol]

Pretty average batsmen tbh, I didn't see him play much though

 

[GLORY OF '92]

He was the worst opener to play for Pakistan. And that list has huge competition with Imran Farhat and Ahmed Shehzad also in the running.
But Salman Butt beats them hands down.

Was recently looking at the scoreboard of the 2010 t20 WC semi-final. Everyone blames Ajmal but Butt Sahab scored 32 off 30 balls when the team made 190. Wasted precious powerplay overs otherwise we would have scored more than 210+ and not lost that match.

In test cricket, had an average of 30 even after playing so much.

In ODIs, the average is 32 but take into consideration that we played 5 matches against Bangladesh and Zimbabwe in 2008 where he scored like 350+ runs against EACH of these cricketing powerhouses. Otherwise that average would have been less than 27-28.

Problem is, interviewers/podcasters don't do their research when they invite ex-cricketers. And these ex-cricketers act as if they was Bradman or Sobers in their playing days. When the reality is something else.

I think you haven't watched cricket in that era. Stats aren't everything.

 

[saqib.rai]

I think you haven't watched cricket in that era. Stats aren't everything.

Stats show consistency. Otherwise on his day even Wahab Riaz was better than Wasim Akram

Plus 19-20 stats hoo sakte hain but Salman Butt's stats are pathetic to say the least

 

[ElRaja]

dude was the height of mediocrity, the fact that anyone would think a batsman who struggled to strike 75 is suitable for modern odi cricket is amusing. either this is a troll thread or pak fans have truly lost their marbles.

 

[mominsaigol]

I think you haven't watched cricket in that era. Stats aren't everything.

Not really. He's basically an improved version of Ahmed shezad. Like he can take singles and can rotate and has some cool strokes but he was extremely limited and got exposed on certain conditions many times.

Honestly if he was playing today we'd all be targeting him worse then any opener lol.

 

[GLORY OF '92]

dude was the height of mediocrity, the fact that anyone would think a batsman who struggled to strike 75 is suitable for modern odi cricket is amusing. either this is a troll thread or pak fans have truly lost their marbles.

Guy made centuries as opener in Australia in Tests. As captain he was universally praised. ODIs were different in 2006 to 2010 era. 280 was a good score then. 2008 Kitply cup final vs India he made a match winning hundred. 2005 Test series V England he was crucial.

 

[hitthestump]

Not really. He's basically an improved version of Ahmed shezad. Like he can take singles and can rotate and has some cool strokes but he was extremely limited and got exposed on certain conditions many times.

Honestly if he was playing today we'd all be targeting him worse then any opener lol.

Think this sums up Salman Butt pretty well.

It's possible that his ability was consequently overshadowed by the gargatuan loss of Asif and Amir.

But his ceiling was never going to be that spectacular either.

 

[Rana]

6 ODI tons against India

Our Skipper is yet to score an ODI 50 against them

 

[topspin]

Salman Butt was on the ascendency before he was banned.

Looked really good in white ball cricket and was very good in Australian conditions.

Pakistan badly missed him and Amir in the 2011 WC. If we had these two, we would’ve won it easily. Even with Misbah in the team.

 

[Major]

move on, its been 15 years. Anyone who sells pakistan is not required to represent us again.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

6 ODI tons against India

Our Skipper is yet to score an ODI 50 against them

Nasir Jamshed also deserves more recognition as he scored multiple centuries against India.

 

[Rana]

Salman Butt was on the ascendency before he was banned.

Looked really good in white ball cricket and was very good in Australian conditions.

Pakistan badly missed him and Amir in the 2011 WC. If we had these two, we would’ve won it easily. Even with Misbah in the team.

He was brilliant in the T20 World Cup in the West Indies too.

Huge idiot for wasting it as he did, but you get the impression he had watched players do the same as he did and was just waiting for his turn to cash in once he was made captain

 

[Dr_Bassim]

Salman Butt was an inteliigent cricketer.

Even with his limitations, he managed to score well and control the egos of better players and got respect from his players.

His problem was he thought he was over smart.

He thought he could beat the system and circumvent laws and get good deals for all Pakistani cricketers by small bets and fixes.

That brought his downfall.

If he hadnt done that, we might have gone into 2011 World Cup with unbeatable team.

 

[topspin]

move on, its been 15 years. Anyone who sells pakistan is not required to represent us again.

May I ask how did you arrive at that figure of 15 years?

 

[Rana]

May I ask how did you arrive at that figure of 15 years?

He’s still annoyed at how Misbah was dropped on performance for these guys. Misbah’s career was pretty much over. He benefited the most after Salman Butt was banned. He shouldn’t be angry at SB

But I recon SB was smart enough to realise he doesn’t need Misbah in the modern era of cricket, where strike rates would matter more

 

[topspin]

He was brilliant in the T20 World Cup in the West Indies too.

Huge idiot for wasting it as he did, but you get the impression he had watched players do the same as he did and was just waiting for his turn to cash in once he was made captain

I remember that T20 World Cup. He was so good.

This guy could score runs off the front and back foot.

He was the best captain Pakistan had since IK when it came to having that tactical noise and leadership combined in one.

What he did is indeed upsetting for those genuine well-informed Pakistan fans, unlike those who blind followed Misbah.

 

[Rana]

I remember that T20 World Cup. He was so good.

This guy could score runs off the front and back foot.

He was the best captain Pakistan had since IK when it came to having that tactical noise and leadership combined in one.

What he did is indeed upsetting for those genuine well-informed Pakistan fans, unlike those who blind followed Misbah.

I find it so annoying

Guys here trying to argue Rizwan is better than Inzimam because of ICC tournament performances (in T20s)

And Misbah is better than Inzimam because of ICC performances lol

Then the same guys demand that we support the team. They create a divide amongst the fans and then expect people to follow them

 

[topspin]

He’s still annoyed at how Misbah was dropped on performance for these guys. Misbah’s career was pretty much over. He benefited the most after Salman Butt was banned. He shouldn’t be angry at SB

But I recon SB was smart enough to realise he doesn’t need Misbah in the modern era of cricket, where strike rates would matter more

Absolutely, deep down every well informed Pakistan fan knows, Misbah was inferior to Salman in every possible way as a cricketer and skipper.

Misbah’s career only became relevant because Salman thew it away.

That’s why I’m angry at Salman because had he not spot fixed, him and Amir would’ve won the WC in India. Misbah would’ve remained irrelevant.

 

[Rana]

Absolutely, deep down every well informed Pakistan fan knows, Misbah was inferior to Salman in every possible way as a cricketer and skipper.

Misbah’s career only became relevant because Salman thew it away.

That’s why I’m angry at Salman because had he not spot fixed, him and Amir would’ve won the WC in India. Misbah would’ve remained irrelevant.

They would have taken Yousuf to bat in the middle with Younis instead of Misbah

Younis Khan and Yousuf had an amazing chemistry batting together. They would have done better at Mohali for sure

 

[topspin]

They would have taken Yousuf to bat in the middle with Younis instead of Misbah

Younis Khan and Yousuf had an amazing chemistry batting together. They would have done better at Mohali for sure

Younis Khan wasn’t the most amazing ODI batsman but he had some memorable knocks.

As you rightly pointed out this guy had that special chemistry whenever he was batting with Mohammad Yousuf.

Instead he was batting with Asad Shafiq in Mohali. They both batted poorly but I can bet Younis would’ve had a better day with Yousuf at the other end.

 

[Rana]

Younis Khan wasn’t the most amazing ODI batsman but he had some memorable knocks.

As you rightly pointed out this guy had that special chemistry whenever he was batting with Mohammad Yousuf.

Instead he was batting with Asad Shafiq in Mohali. They both batted poorly but I can bet Younis would’ve had a better day with Yousuf at the other end.

That’s the thing with Younis, he switched on with Yousuf or Inzimam at the crease with him. They were great Partnership players. Younis was fine as long as he had Yousuf and Inzimam behind him, and those two also felt comfortable with Younis ahead of them.

Misbah tried to replicate Inzimam, but he wasn’t born to be that guy.

 

[topspin]

That’s the thing with Younis, he switched on with Yousuf or Inzimam at the crease with him. They were great Partnership players. Younis was fine as long as he had Yousuf and Inzimam behind him, and those two also felt comfortable with Younis ahead of them.

Misbah tried to replicate Inzimam, but he wasn’t born to be that guy.

Misbah wanted to show that he was the better “ul Haq” but he was leagues behind him.

Never thought I’d see the day where I’d read an experienced poster tell the world how Misbah was better than Inzi in ODIs.

If I said that I would never have logged back on.

 

[Hitman]

The only team he was good against is India, at a time when we had a joke of a bowling attack. And the only thing he was good at is speaking good English. For a specialist batsman to average 30 after playing 33 Tests is shameful.

 

[mominsaigol]

6 ODI tons against India

Our Skipper is yet to score an ODI 50 against them

That's not really a fair measure. Salman butt played against India far more times then babar has. India and Pakistan don't meet unless its a tournament. We don't play bilaterals against them.

Salman butt was never going to be anything spectacular. He's a better version of Ahmed shezad but he lacks the ability to impact or be anything special.

He's played match losing innings as well. Personally azhar Ali, Imam these guys are superior and I don't rate azhar and imam very well either.

 

[Rana]

The only team he was good against is India, at a time when we had a joke of a bowling attack. And the only thing he was good at is speaking good English. For a specialist batsman to average 30 after playing 33 Tests is shameful.

He was in Shan Masood academy in Test

But he was a good ODI opener. I’m pretty sure he would have scored a 180+ score at some point. Most likely against India too

 

[Rana]

That's not really a fair measure. Salman butt played against India far more times then babar has. India and Pakistan don't meet unless its a tournament. We don't play bilaterals against them.

Salman butt was never going to be anything spectacular. He's a better version of Ahmed shezad but he lacks the ability to impact or be anything special.

He's played match losing innings as well. Personally azhar Ali, Imam these guys are superior and I don't rate azhar and imam very well either.

Babar has played India as much as Fakhar has

Fakhar has scores against them.

Against India, you either are born to play against them or you are not. It’s that simple

 

[mominsaigol]

Babar has played India as much as Fakhar has

Fakhar has scores against them.

Against India, you either are born to play against them or you are not. It’s that simple

I still rate babar as superior to salman butt.

Fakhar I use to rate higher then babar, not anymore. Issue is babar is advertised in the media as the biggest thing on the planet, whereas in reality he's just a class accumulator. He's good but he's the type of guy to require handholding aka stabilise the innings while others bat freely around him. Bur we have no one to bat freely around him except fakhar and fakhar ain't doing so hot.

 

[topspin]

Babar has played India as much as Fakhar has

Fakhar has scores against them.

Against India, you either are born to play against them or you are not. It’s that simple

This is very true. Babar wilts when the stakes are high. Forget India, even Zimbabwe gave him nightmares last year lol.

Babar’s fans always twerk about his 40+ knock in the 2017 CT final but that was all Fakhar before Hafeez came in and scored what was a fine brisk 50.

 

[topspin]

That's not really a fair measure. Salman butt played against India far more times then babar has. India and Pakistan don't meet unless its a tournament. We don't play bilaterals against them.

Salman butt was never going to be anything spectacular. He's a better version of Ahmed shezad but he lacks the ability to impact or be anything special.

He's played match losing innings as well. Personally azhar Ali, Imam these guys are superior and I don't rate azhar and imam very well either.

Azhar Ali was so bad lol.

If you put Salman Butt on those UAE wickets he would out score him easily.

 

[mominsaigol]

Azhar Ali was so bad lol.

If you put Salman Butt on those UAE wickets he would out score him easily.

Azhar scored a match winning knock against India in CT. Imam may be more consistent then azhar but azhar can up the anti and actually attack the bowlers and play at a faster pace.

Azhar also was the only player to actually perform in the 2015 Bangladesh series where Bangladesh smoked us.

He's a solid player and underrated but he became a hasbeen after his odi retirement. He should have been our opener since 2011 tbh.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

Azhar scored a match winning knock against India in CT. Imam may be more consistent then azhar but azhar can up the anti and actually attack the bowlers and play at a faster pace.

Azhar also was the only player to actually perform in the 2015 Bangladesh series where Bangladesh smoked us.

He's a solid player and underrated but he became a hasbeen after his odi retirement. He should have been our opener since 2011 tbh.

Bro I haven't witnessed Azhar Ali attacking against the bowlers.

I'd say he's just as defensive as Imam, In fact I would say that Azhar Ali plays at an even slower pace than Imam.

Imam's ODI SR is: 82.18 whereas Azhar Ali's SR is 74.45

 

[chinaman00]

Azhar Ali was so bad lol.

If you put Salman Butt on those UAE wickets he would out score him easily.

Azhar remains my favorite Pakistani player in recent years, and I have been watching Pakistan cricket since 1998.

The guy is thorough professional, very humble & always gave his all. It’s unfortunate that he couldn’t get a longer robe in white ball cricket but I will always cherish his performance during the 2017 champions trophy was his standout white ball cricket. He had a wonderful tournament, even in the group stage match against India when he was the only batsman to score a 50. His knocks during the semifinal and final match speak highly of his grit and character.

His test record speaks for itself.

Never disrespect Azhar but comparing him to inferior players, especially a certified cheat like Salman Butt.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

I think its better to disscuss Azhar Ali in his thread, let's focus on the subject for which this thread was started.

 

[mominsaigol]

Bro I haven't witnessed Azhar Ali attacking against the bowlers.

I'd say he's just as defensive as Imam, In fact I would say that Azhar Ali plays at an even slower pace than Imam.

Imam's ODI SR is: 82.18 whereas Azhar Ali's SR is 74.45

This is why I keep saying stats aren't everything.

Azhar's odi stats use to be 59-62 in terms of strike rate because he was slow as molasses in 2012 and prior against India.

Moment he comes back onto the scene his strike improved dramatically to international stats of 74 but he would genuinely play at a 85 strike rate of you actually watched his games from 2015 to 2017.

Everyone here needs to stop obsessing with stats. Their have been countless players who have started off ridiculously poor having stats of 12 to 22 and have improved it over time to 35 when in reality they've been playing at am Average of 55+ that year.

Rizwan( Yes ik this forumn Hates him and blah blah 2nd string bashing, regardless) this year has an average of 59 and a strike rate of 95.

Yet his overall stats are 35 average which use to be around 26-29 back when he wasn't a regular.

Don't rely on stats, if you are relying on stats then don't rely on overall stats, rely on years stats only. They tell a better picture.

 

[mominsaigol]

Azhar remains my favorite Pakistani player in recent years, and I have been watching Pakistan cricket since 1998.

The guy is thorough professional, very humble & always gave his all. It’s unfortunate that he couldn’t get a longer robe in white ball cricket but I will always cherish his performance during the 2017 champions trophy was his standout white ball cricket. He had a wonderful tournament, even in the group stage match against India when he was the only batsman to score a 50. His knocks during the semifinal and final match speak highly of his grit and character.

His test record speaks for itself.

Never disrespect Azhar but comparing him to inferior players, especially a certified cheat like Salman Butt.

Azhar is a solid opener for Pakistan. Imam is basically better at rotating and more consistent then azhar but he lacks the ability to actually go after the bowlers like azhar could.

The charge down the wicket for a 6 being azhar's signature shot was such a treat to watch, especially in the CT final.

Only issue with azhar is that his 2012 and before that, his game was purely test so he use to be slow as molasses and he was an absolutely terrible captain. But unlike our selfish captain babar or misbah he wasnt bad on purpose and just like virat actually stepped down from captaincy to focus on batting and gave the ropes to sarfraz.

He's a good cricketer overall, but he should have retired in 2017 altogether.

 

[mominsaigol]

I think its better to disscuss Azhar Ali in his thread, let's focus on the subject for which this thread was started.

Thread is about salman butt but it's only natural that we would compare him to other top order batsmen like babar, Imam, and azhar and have a stat war to justify who was superior.

We aren't really shifting topic here XD.

 

[Mariner1981]

Guys I think we should not compare strike rates for different era’s, attitude was completely different.
For example 200 was a good score till early 90’s, 300 was a good score till 2015 . Now even with 350 you are not sure.
A player with strike rate of 70 would be considered a great player in the earlier times , now a century with strike rate of 100 will be considered as slow innings.

 

[saqib.rai]

Azhar remains my favorite Pakistani player in recent years, and I have been watching Pakistan cricket since 1998.

The guy is thorough professional, very humble & always gave his all. It’s unfortunate that he couldn’t get a longer robe in white ball cricket but I will always cherish his performance during the 2017 champions trophy was his standout white ball cricket. He had a wonderful tournament, even in the group stage match against India when he was the only batsman to score a 50. His knocks during the semifinal and final match speak highly of his grit and character.

His test record speaks for itself.

Never disrespect Azhar but comparing him to inferior players, especially a certified cheat like Salman Butt.

The lost test match against New Zealand in 2018 showed how timid Azhar Ali was.

A guy who had been playing for 8 year regularly before that should have won that match.

In ODIs, his mantra was simple. Block, block, block and hit the odd bad ball for 4. Pathetic mediocre cricketer

 

[saqib.rai]

Guys I think we should not compare strike rates for different era’s, attitude was completely different.
For example 200 was a good score till early 90’s, 300 was a good score till 2015 . Now even with 350 you are not sure.
A player with strike rate of 70 would be considered a great player in the earlier times , now a century with strike rate of 100 will be considered as slow innings.

200 in 50 overs was never a good score. Stop fooling people

 

[Junaids]

I hate the guy for what he done let's make that clear. But I do think in fairness he was exactly what Pakistan cricket desperately needed if he hadn't been so greedy and brainless at the end.

He was intelligent and a captain with a decent feel for the game. His batting I think is underated. Played some Iconic innings v Australia and India. Pakistan definitely struggled to produce players like him more than high quality fast bowlers so I think in perspective it was a bigger loss than the 2 fast bowlers. In a world where he hadn't been so short sighted I reckon he was going to win a 50 over WC and dominate Tests from 2011 to 2018.

His batting was missed massively.

Salman Butt was the only Pakistan opener since Saeed Anwar to be competent outside off-stump against pace bowling outside Asia with a full slip cordon in place. He had an off-drive, a cover-drive, he could cut and most importantly he could leave the ball. He also, like Misbah, had the ability to watch the ball onto the bat very late.

His Test average of 30 is misleading, because he didn't get to bloat his average on easy UAE pitches like Azhar Ali and Misbah.

I don't for a second defend what he did. I'll actually never forgive him.

But that QEA Day/Night Final in 2016, in which he scored a century in both innings, basically proved how good he was outside off-stump with a slip cordon in place.

Azhar Ali only scored runs outside Asia on dead wickets. Salman Butt scored his runs on lively wickets.

 

[FastBowlingAllrounder]

Guy made centuries as opener in Australia in Tests. As captain he was universally praised. ODIs were different in 2006 to 2010 era. 280 was a good score then. 2008 Kitply cup final vs India he made a match winning hundred. 2005 Test series V England he was crucial.

Yasir Shah made a century against Australia in Australia.

He hit a purple patch and got banned shortly thereafter, hence your view that he would've been something special. With the changes in the game in the last decade or so it is highly unlikely he would have maintained those occasional performances for a long enough to be considered a decent player.

 

[FastBowlingAllrounder]

The obsession of certain fans with the Asif/Amir/Butt saga and WC11 offers insights into why as a cricketing nation Pak hasn't been able to move forward. This kash mentality needs to go...

 

[BunnyRabbit]

Yasir Shah made a century against Australia in Australia.

He hit a purple patch and got banned shortly thereafter, hence your view that he would've been something special. With the changes in the game in the last decade or so it is highly unlikely he would have maintained those occasional performances for a long enough to be considered a decent player.

He was Irfan Pathan's bunny in 2006 series.
Was a single digit or big score type of player. I do think he was getting better in 2010 in LOIs. But he himself is to blame.
Was never a good test player.

 

[RKhan_Cricket]

How can a fixer be intelligent?
Please enlighten us.

 

[TheSultan]

As a player he was not the biggest loss, but he was a big loss as captain and as @topspin and @Rana have alluded to, his loss left us with Misbah and the subsequent Misbahism that has effectively set us 20 years behind the rest of the cricketing world.

He was never going to be the best player, but he was an adequate opener and did a job.

 

[Hitman]

200 in 50 overs was never a good score. Stop fooling people

It was still a defendable score in the 90's. Plenty of times team won after scoring 200-220 back then.

 

[Hitman]

How can a fixer be intelligent?
Please enlighten us.

A fixer is intelligent in manipulating people around him.

 

[BouncerGuy]

It was still a defendable score in the 90's. Plenty of times team won after scoring 200-220 back then.

Yes, i agree. Back in 90's it was more like a bowler-dominated era so 200 was a good score and teams would have defended this kind of target easily but today even 400 looks like nothing.

 

[Cryin Out Loud]

I saw (TV) him play. He wasn’t bad. Wasn’t exceptional either.

Let’s not get carried away. What I can say is that with luck he would have become a Misbah light, Iman Ul Haq light. Or maybe another Shoaib Malik ish type of player.

Average. Yes, from a Pakistan batting perspective he would have served your cricket in a plainly average way for another half a dozen years maybe.

 

[Babeikh]

Very average cricketer and, let's face it, he wouldn't have been near the captaincy if he didn't speak good English.

 

[Hitman]

Yes, i agree. Back in 90's it was more like a bowler-dominated era so 200 was a good score and teams would have defended this kind of target easily but today even 400 looks like nothing.

We won the final of the Titan Cup against South Africa in 1996 after scoring 220 batting first.

 

[BouncerGuy]

We won the final of the Titan Cup against South Africa in 1996 after scoring 220 batting first.

Yeah back in those days, anything above 200 was a good score and teams do feel confident that they have done well. But not today. Even after scoring 350 today, the match can go down to the last ball thriller.

 

[Hitman]

Yeah back in those days, anything above 200 was a good score and teams do feel confident that they have done well. But not today. Even after scoring 350 today, the match can go down to the last ball thriller.

The ICC has completely ruined the beautiful ODI format.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Players who fix the match are ruining this whole format and the cricket. Although Salman, Amir, and Asif had served their punishments, their actions should be an example for the upcoming players that such stuff will only bring disgrace to you and your country. Stay away from such activities for your country and your own future.

 

[TheSultan]

The ICC has completely ruined the beautiful ODI format.

I agree. The ICC need to start thinking outside the box instead of their simplistic - “hitting sixes is entertainment”. Flat pitches, shorter boundaries, bigger bats, bowling restriction (2 ball rule, bouncer restrictions).

The only way ODIs become competitive and entertaining are through wickets. You have to bring the bowlers in. Remove the 2 ball rule etc etc.

If you want to watch sixes, head over to the T20 format

 

[owenhcricket]

I hate the guy for what he done let's make that clear. But I do think in fairness he was exactly what Pakistan cricket desperately needed if he hadn't been so greedy and brainless at the end.

He was intelligent and a captain with a decent feel for the game. His batting I think is underated. Played some Iconic innings v Australia and India. Pakistan definitely struggled to produce players like him more than high quality fast bowlers so I think in perspective it was a bigger loss than the 2 fast bowlers. In a world where he hadn't been so short sighted I reckon he was going to win a 50 over WC and dominate Tests from 2011 to 2018.

Are you the same guy who had the sentiments that the loss of Amir was overrated? If so, two clueless threads (sorry!)

Butt had 1 century in the last two seasons of his career in tests, averaged slightly above 30 and had one score of 30+ in that entire England series.

Let's not even start on his LO game...

 

[da_don]

he could have been a sucesfyl captain had he not been corrupt

 

[ElRaja]

Guy made centuries as opener in Australia in Tests. As captain he was universally praised. ODIs were different in 2006 to 2010 era. 280 was a good score then. 2008 Kitply cup final vs India he made a match winning hundred. 2005 Test series V England he was crucial.

he did a job during a time when other options were imran farhat or imran nazir, other than performing against one or two teams in each format he pretty much failed against everyone else.

 

[Rana]

Even ICC makes sure it gets its money in their own ways

 

[Jazx]

A very good opener as per Pakistan's batting standards in ODIs and test. Totally misfit for t20s. Overall a good batsman but not great by any means. Asif and Amir on the other hand were a loss for world cricket, not only for Pakistan.

 

[BouncerGuy]

October 7, 1984.
Happy birthday, Salman Butt! a gifted and elegant batsman and former Captain of Pakistan.

 

[Justcrazy]

Asif was the biggest loss. He was once in a generation player. If Pakistan had these three Pakistan should have won the WC

Salman Butt
Kamran Akmal
Malik
Yousuf
Misbah
Umar Akmal
Afridi
Gul
Ajmal
Amir
Asif

This would have been a strong team.

 

[gazza619]

I am not sure what Salman Butt has been eating & drinking for the past 14 years since the 2010 saga, but man he has turned into such a high intellectual classy minds of the cricket game. I can listen to him for hours and often struggle to find an inch wrong in his words. He is a rarity as I cant find one single ex-cricketer in Pakistan who is so intelligent.

If I had the power I would make Salman Butt the Head Coach of the Pakistan cricket team with a lot of authority and let him clear this clutter of team management/coaches/selectors who are sitting like goons in the existing set up.

 

[Energy]

Loved watching his wristy cover drives. But I agree with the general sentiment that he was finding it difficult to cope as T20s were becoming popular during his last months.

A very classy old-style opener and looked the part. Would have done wonders for Pakistan's image had he kept his shenanigans hidden.

 

[ads101]

I don’t think he would have performed in the long run even though he had talent. Asif i think would have been great for a few more tests but not exactly long term. Amir on the other hand would have carried that bowling line up in three formats.

If I’d have to rank the talents we missed out on in order it’d be Amir, Umar akmal, Kamran akmal, Sharjeel khan, Asif, Butt. The lack of fulfilment of the akmal brothers talent (despite neither fixing unlike the rest) in a lot of ways was more costlier to Pakistan than the loss of most of the fixers.

 

[Hellion]

Butt Sa'ab averaged 30 with bat after playing 7 years Test cricket..

Very mediocre talent.

Aamir had was genuine pace - 150 kph and swinging the ball. Bounce and left armer also

Maybe he also would has failed but at least he had potential.

 

[RidiculousMan]

I am not sure what Salman Butt has been eating & drinking for the past 14 years since the 2010 saga, but man he has turned into such a high intellectual classy minds of the cricket game. I can listen to him for hours and often struggle to find an inch wrong in his words. He is a rarity as I cant find one single ex-cricketer in Pakistan who is so intelligent.

If I had the power I would make Salman Butt the Head Coach of the Pakistan cricket team with a lot of authority and let him clear this clutter of team management/coaches/selectors who are sitting like goons in the existing set up.

He is more suited to a position of an executive or a Director of Cricket.

 

[Unbiased-Fan]

He was a good batsman. He would have completed 10000 ODI runs till 2019. He would have been Pakistan's 2nd best opener after Anwar.

 

[RyanRyan10]

He was the worst opener to play for Pakistan. And that list has huge competition with Imran Farhat and Ahmed Shehzad also in the running.
But Salman Butt beats them hands down.

Was recently looking at the scoreboard of the 2010 t20 WC semi-final. Everyone blames Ajmal but Butt Sahab scored 32 off 30 balls when the team made 190. Wasted precious powerplay overs otherwise we would have scored more than 210+ and not lost that match.

In test cricket, had an average of 30 even after playing so much.

In ODIs, the average is 32 but take into consideration that we played 5 matches against Bangladesh and Zimbabwe in 2008 where he scored like 350+ runs against EACH of these cricketing powerhouses. Otherwise that average would have been less than 27-28.

Problem is, interviewers/podcasters don't do their research when they invite ex-cricketers. And these ex-cricketers act as if they was Bradman or Sobers in their playing days. When the reality is something else.

He had an ODI average of 36.82. This fellow incorrectly mentioned 32. Still, no one corrected him. This is how the false narrative of everything other than Babar and Rizwan being mediocre spread.

@Rana

 

[Rana]

He had an ODI average of 36.82. This fellow incorrectly mentioned 32. Still, no one corrected him. This is how the false narrative of everything other than Babar and Rizwan being mediocre spread.

@Rana

Butt was a good ODI opener and a well known India basher. 6 of his 8 tons were against India. He would have probably scored a 170+ score too at some point in ODI cricket because he played free flow on flat decks once he got going.

He has good/decent innings in Test cricket too. Was starting to become a good T20 opener but then got caught with spot fixing.

 

[Rana]

Butt Sa'ab averaged 30 with bat after playing 7 years Test cricket..

I remember there was a away Test series in which Shane Warne was doing commentary. He pointed it out too, he specifically picked up on Butt, Farhat sand Faisal Iqbal for managing to play 30+ Tests but having mediocre numbers (averaging 30 or below).

He specifically said “30 Tests is a lot of Tests” when highlighting this lot. They didn’t do well in Test cricket although you could argue Farhat and Butt should have done a lot better. They were much more talented as batsmen in comparison to guys like Imam, Abdullah, Shan. They didn’t do justice to their talent.

 

[Hellion]

I remember there was a away Test series in which Shane Warne was doing commentary. He pointed it out too, he specifically picked up on Butt, Farhat sand Faisal Iqbal for managing to play 30+ Tests but having mediocre numbers (averaging 30 or below).

He specifically said “30 Tests is a lot of Tests” when highlighting this lot. They didn’t do well in Test cricket although you could argue Farhat and Butt should have done a lot better. They were much more talented as batsmen in comparison to guys like Imam, Abdullah, Shan. They didn’t do justice to their talent.

Yes. He was better ODI opener. Bit slow but he and Yasir Hameed formed stable opening pair

In Tests, he didn't improve for so long years.

Taufeeq Umar was best Pakistani opener after Anwar.

Last 5/6 matches was bad but he looked better than Farhat, Faisal, Salman and all for Tests.

 

[sweep_shot]

Salman was a great improving batter. Had he not spot-fixed, he might have been a Pakistani ATG by now.

 

[offstump]

I am not sure what Salman Butt has been eating & drinking for the past 14 years since the 2010 saga, but man he has turned into such a high intellectual classy minds of the cricket game. I can listen to him for hours and often struggle to find an inch wrong in his words. He is a rarity as I cant find one single ex-cricketer in Pakistan who is so intelligent.

If I had the power I would make Salman Butt the Head Coach of the Pakistan cricket team with a lot of authority and let him clear this clutter of team management/coaches/selectors who are sitting like goons in the existing set up.

Putting his past aside, the man is a cricketing genius. I agree, I haven’t come across an ex Pakistani cricketer who is able to articulate his thoughts so clearly. He understands the nuances of the game better than anyone. I don’t think he’d make a good coach though, he’s just too smart the better option is to have him oversee broad changes that we are severely lacking. Unfortunately, I doubt he will get hired as wahab tried to bring him on as an advisor and there was too much uproar. The good news is he runs his own academy which should start producing some good players for Pakistan.

 

[Rana]

Taufeeq Umar was best Pakistani opener after Anwar.

For Test cricket he came back well under Misbah, but I think he wasn’t a great white ball batter. Very similar to Sami Aslam in style and approach.

Taufiq came back well for Pakistan a bit like Niel McKenzie did for South Africa. He also had lost his way a bit but then returned strong

 

[mominsaigol]

I respectfully disagree with the people who are supporting butt in this thread.

As a batter he was okay, He wasn't the worst pakistani opener but he was bang average.

He was mostly an Indian basher but that too at a time when Indian team wasn't known for its bowling and the competition between India and pakistan was between pakistan bowling vs Indian batting.

Now India outclasses pakistan in every department. I don't think he'd be bashing Bumrah or kuldeep if he played in this era.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Salman Butt was no boy wonder but was a decent and dependable opener in his era. He was given the captaincy because everyone thought this English speaking decent looking non controversial bloke could be a safe bet to serve Pakistan for a few good years but how wrong were we all. I believe the 2010 spot fixing scandals remains the most embarrassing and hurtful incident in Pakistan cricket history. It made Michael Holding cry on air because despite seeing everything in the 1990 and early 2000s, even he could not fathom how a young captain could influence his two premier fast bowlers including a teenager to commit such blatant cheating in that age. He’s a national traitor and although I believe in forgiveness and giving people a second chance even I feel awkward when I see him presenting his views on cricket.

The fact that people could have sympathy with him after the amount of damage he did to Pakistan cricket brand only goes to show why corruption is such a problem in this part of the world.