Robert
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I won’t watch it. I don’t need stuff like this in my head and no longer have any appetite for it.
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Contact the PP Team
Joker Origin Movie (2019) — possible sequel now announced…
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I won’t watch it. I don’t need stuff like this in my head and no longer have any appetite for it.
Hyperion66
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So I should be ashamed rooting for a fictional supervillain straight out of comic book pages? Not sure if you are high or is it just the age doing it's thing lol.
Robert
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If he isn't real, how can you root for him?
And why the disrespect for your elders?
JaDed
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Yup , it’s depressing and avoidable.
sweep_shot
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IMDB gave it 9.2 out of 10.
Rotten Tomatoes gave it 6.6 out of 10.
Metacritic gave it 6.9 out of 10.
I personally give it 7.5 out of 10.
It was a good movie but not the best I have seen.
Hyperion66
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Same way I root for Cercei and Hannibal Lecter and cheer when they chew up boring one dimensional goody goody heroes.
What disrespect? people tend to lose mental grip with old age, often become overly sensitive and make a taboo out of every topic. Cognitive health issues are pretty common after you go past a certain age, that's like basic biology.
shaz619
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[MENTION=137142]JaDed[/MENTION] [MENTION=7774]Robert[/MENTION] I don't see the issue, The Killing Joke started out with the same narrative, the movie just looked at that first act in more depth, with that being said the Joker in that novel becomes very visceral, there is an element of that here to. Will post a more detailed review, just seen it
shaz619
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Since it's not the best you have seen, what other super-villain origin movies have you seen that were better ?
sweep_shot
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I didn't like this Joker a lot. Heath Ledger's Joker was better for me. Ledger's Joker had better lines and also he had better scenes.
Also, I found Infinity War more entertaining.
Don't get me wrong. Joker (2019) is a brilliant movie but it is not #1 for me.
shaz619
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You said it wasn't the best you have seen so I imagine you watched other super-villain origin movies for you to compare it to, otherwise clarify which comparisons you are making so we can see if they make sense ?
My 2 year old nephew enjoyed infinity war as well
sweep_shot
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I compared the movie with all superhero/super-villain movies. It was not just an origin comparison.
I think this movie would've been much better if Batman was in it. I personally don't care about Joker's boring life story; I want to see the duel between Joker and Batman.
in_cutter
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You are completely missing the point of this movie
Batman vs Joker has been done to death.
sweep_shot
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You are completely missing the point of this movie
Batman vs Joker has been done to death.
The entire Joker character has been done to death. It is about time other villains get spotlight. There are other cool villains like Penguin, Bane, Scarecrow, Poison Ivy, Two-Face, Killer Croc etc.
Batman makes Joker complete. Without Batman, there is no Joker.
JaDed
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There is no issue bro, and its well acted and directed but found too many similarities between taxi driver,King of comedy and I feel i’m at certain mind frame right now where i just want to watch entertainment over something that actually engrossed me so much and now I support Joker over batman in that universe..
I think its not everyone ‘s cup of tea coz it really gets dark like this is a true dark movie imo
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Cpt. Rishwat
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I was really looking forward to it having watched the trailer, but I am also having second thoughts now. I've no doubt Pheonix will produce a bravura performance, but to what end? Not sure I really want to watch a psycopath slowly unravel.
Heath Ledger's Joker was disturbing, but at least you had the other characters like Batman and Dent to offer some relief. Might just wait for it to hit the tv.
JaDed
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The thing is it’s two diff stories , had the movie one more hr more they could had shown that side of the joker.
This story is mostly about how the joker was a decent human as such but he saw so many terrible things around him , betrayal , physically abused , no attention from anyone etc and he still tried to fit in..
And that it got pushed too far one day that he broke, Imagine this as a prequel to Dark Knight.’s joker story. In Dark Knight he wanted to show everyone that even the best man of the city when pushed too far would break(two face), as that had happened to him.
Rana
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With the rubbish that has been released over the years in the name of big name blockbusters. This is by far the best I have seen. I know because I only watch hyped movies
Rana
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Also give it time and watch how the red 3 piece suit scenes will become iconic and a part of cult culture the way Ledger’s joker did.
Ledgers joker is a very PG version compared to Phoenix. Phoenix has the hate that we sympathise with and want for him to get retribution.
Ledgers joker is a very PG version compared to Phoenix. Phoenix has the hate that we sympathise with and want for him to get retribution.
JaDed
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This is what am talking about, Warner Bros releasing a statement as well that the Joker should not be seen as a hero.
shaz619
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I understand that and [MENTION=7774]Robert[/MENTION] choosing not to watch it as a result, that was always the concern because it was very likely that you ought to develop some sympathy for the character ; the killing joke touched on this aspect as well although with not as much depth but we also got the culmination of Joker's peak as a super-villain which it made it very easy to despise his heinous crimes in that story by Alan Moore. With that being said, they did a decent job overall to shed light on his early life; I think if there is any future appearances by this Joker they will do more to try and make you support say Bats over him; I think the solo which will have Pattinson in the lead role wont be a pat of any "DC Universe" either ? it wont have Joker in it, more of a story which will focus on the detective aspect which heavily influenced the original Bats comics; but after that who knows maybe Pattinson and Phoenix will clash
JaDed
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Yeah Phoenix is extremely moody though, don’t think he would ever take up a sequel , I’m reading and as per some articles it says Patt’s Batman would be set in 90s, which kinda makes it perfect for this batman to face a much more mentally ill Joker and if Phoenix plays that , it actually would be remarkable.
sweep_shot
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Releasing this movie without Batman was irresponsible from Warner Bros. They should be fined.
This movie pretty much glorified Joker. I wouldn't be surprised if some psychos get inspired from this movie and kill people.
Every Joker movie should have Batman to keep a balance between order and chaos. Point of Joker is to give Batman adversary; he shouldn't become the main focus. We shouldn't glorify darkness and evil.
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Rinnegan Sasuke
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I disagree, it's always Batman vs Joker because the latter is meant to be a foil.
Ledger's joker was a foil for Batman, an obstacle to overcome and defeat so the hero's morals are left reigning supreme. As amazing as a portrayal it was, the audience watched his beliefs shatter in front of him and he was defeated.
This is completely different, a character study. We're given a look at how a mentally ill man falls through the cracks of society and the system to eventually become a force of chaos. The very framework meant to protect and help this man is what causes him to become the representation of its failures.
Also, I feel like people need to understand the difference between empathy and sympathy. Joker doesn't make you sympathize with him, but he does invoke empathy. I understood his eventual descent into complete madness but never once rooted for him.
I found it amazing, disturbing, but amazing. It has opened an entire frontier for future comic book movies. Joaquin reigns supreme for his portrayal and I feel he covered more ground as a character than Heath, who himself played perhaps the greatest foil in movie history.
in_cutter
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The movie is not the problem. It’s the people that think like this that are the problem.
JaDed
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No, such cinema has always been made, social healthcare should take of nutcases who get inspired.
sweep_shot
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In 2008 Batman movie, Joker mentioned about 3 of his possible origins:
1) His father was an alcoholic and abuser. He abused his mom and abused Joker. His father curved his face and asked him "why so serious?". It is why he hated his father and eventually snapped.
2) Joker had a wife but she was into gambling. Loan sharks eventually injured her and she needed surgery. But, Joker was broke and there was no money. So, he curved his own face and gave himself a "smile". His wife left him. He snapped.
3) Joker hinted that he was possibly in the military and his friends got blown up. Nobody panicked because "it was part of the plan". So, he snapped.
Any of the above three origin story should've been used. It would've been much cooler.
1) His father was an alcoholic and abuser. He abused his mom and abused Joker. His father curved his face and asked him "why so serious?". It is why he hated his father and eventually snapped.
2) Joker had a wife but she was into gambling. Loan sharks eventually injured her and she needed surgery. But, Joker was broke and there was no money. So, he curved his own face and gave himself a "smile". His wife left him. He snapped.
3) Joker hinted that he was possibly in the military and his friends got blown up. Nobody panicked because "it was part of the plan". So, he snapped.
Any of the above three origin story should've been used. It would've been much cooler.
Arham_PakFan
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This is a completely different movie, a completely different take. It has no connection to Batman films or any other superhero films. It's a Dc Black label film.
As such, it was left to the the director to showcase his vision and decide Joker's origin.
Btw Ledgers Joker is nothing similar to any other version of Joker, either in comics, movies or cartoons.
Arham_PakFan
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Pattinson's Batman will not be set in the 90's .
Matt Reeves is rebooting the Batman franchise. Different actors and different Batman.
Phoenix's Joker shouldn't be a part of the new franchise IMO.
Arham_PakFan
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Coming to the film itself, I would rate it maybe 9/10.
What a performance from Phoenix. And what a great ending.
What a performance from Phoenix. And what a great ending.
sweep_shot
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Thank God that Batman is coming back. I don't want them to turn Joker into something he is not.
Joker is incomplete without Batman.
Arham_PakFan
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I would normally agree with you.
The real version of the Joker, who is a part of a greater universe, shouldn't have an origin film.
As a standalone, Phoenix's Joker is great. He is the Joker, only in name.
JaDed
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Every article is saying its being set in 90s , Ofcourse there is no confirmation just talking abt articles.
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Just watched the film. 8/10.
Phoenix’s acting was exceptional. You just cannot compare this Joker to Dark Knight - Heath’s.
This emphasises more on the mental suffering since childhood, bullying and society letting him down; his actions did not have a masterminded plan unlike the Joker in Dark Knight.
The film itself was slow and boring at times. Scary to release such film though given how easy kids these days can be indoctrinated; should have been rated 18. I see now why many felt guilty in watching the film.
Phoenix’s acting was exceptional. You just cannot compare this Joker to Dark Knight - Heath’s.
This emphasises more on the mental suffering since childhood, bullying and society letting him down; his actions did not have a masterminded plan unlike the Joker in Dark Knight.
The film itself was slow and boring at times. Scary to release such film though given how easy kids these days can be indoctrinated; should have been rated 18. I see now why many felt guilty in watching the film.
in_cutter
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Just watched it. Proper dark, brooding character study. Phoenix’s portrayal of the Joker is uneasy and at times disturbing. It is R rated for a reason. I give it 9/10.
The ending is left open to interpretation- there is a theory flying around that this is not THE Joker- I can understand where this theory comes from - the film ends with Fleck in a mental asylum. Was everything in he’s head?
in_cutter
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There are many movies featuring psychopaths. The negative reactions to this movie are OTT.
marlonbrowndo
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I’d give it a 6/10. Great performance by Phoenix but that was expected from an actor of his caliber. The review on Roger Ebert’s website sums up my thoughts pretty well
marlonbrowndo
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Imagine thinking IMDB matters in 2019
Danyaalr01
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Batman wasn't in it because this is Joker's back story, when Bruce Wayne was a kid.
Also saying this movie could cause violence inspired by the movie is like saying video games are the problem not the guns or the people who do it.
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TBH we should focus on the fact that this film focuses more about the downward spiral of a mentally ill man that society had completely discarded and mistreated since childhood. The news, netflix series and social media hype or promote actual killers in the world by giving them a nonstop platform.
Danyaalr01
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It's funny because some people are saying this movie portrays mentally ill people in a negative way, but then there are people who actually suffer from mental illnesses that are saying that it was a very good movie and a must watch for people to know what mentally ill people go through.
It's a classic case of people getting offended when it wasn't supposed to be offensive and wasn't directed at them but the person that does relate with it the most isn't offended.
It's a classic case of people getting offended when it wasn't supposed to be offensive and wasn't directed at them but the person that does relate with it the most isn't offended.
sweep_shot
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That was the issue. It was irresponsible to give Joker an entire movie. It made Joker the central focus and a hero. It is a shame that society nowadays glorify evil and darkness.
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JaDed
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Downton Abbey was 3 and half stars and it didn’t deserve anything above 3 by a mile.
Not all the reviews are great, also War a Bollywood movie got 2 and half and thats lol.
shaz619
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I wouldn't put this film on a pedestal but I read that review from that site and it was absolutely horrible; not very constructive, have a read yourself:
https://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/joker-movie-review-2019
He complains about incoherence when his review lacks just that lmao talk about going off on a big tangent, imagine being asked to review a movie but instead you begin to spew psychobabble about the world coming to an end
) it's more of a personal attack towards the folk who made the movie then anything else, he seems to have an issue with A Star is Born as well LOL among other things aha
JaDed
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I wouldn't put this film on a pedestal but I read that review from that site and it was absolutely horrible; not very constructive, have a read yourself:
https://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/joker-movie-review-2019
He complains about incoherence when his review lacks just that lmao talk about going off on a big tangent, imagine being asked to review a movie but instead you begin to spew psychobabble about the world coming to an end
It was defn a personal attack at Todd, making an analogy as per this critic Adam Mckay who started with Anchorman, Step brothers shouldn’t have made Big Short or Vice.
sweep_shot
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I must say this dance was good.
sweep_shot
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Looks like I am not the only one who thinks this movie was slightly overrated. Here are some negative reviews:
https://www.metacritic.com/movie/joker/user-reviews?dist=negative.
Here's one review:
https://www.metacritic.com/movie/joker/user-reviews?dist=negative.
Here's one review:
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sweep_shot
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More negative reviews from IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7286456/reviews?sort=helpfulnessScore&dir=desc&ratingFilter=1.
Negative reviews from Rotten Tomatoes: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/joker_2019/reviews?sort=rotten.
Negative reviews from Rotten Tomatoes: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/joker_2019/reviews?sort=rotten.
Hyperion66
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Some people should stick to watching Cinderella and Snow White type movies. Wonder what Robert will do if he somehow stumble upon new French extremity, Takashi Mike or Lars Von trier or basically any film beyond his pg13 humpty dumpty realm.
ElRaja
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saw it tonight, and have to say it was.... okish. too much hype. pheonix is a decent joker but i found him one dimensional. i also found the story to be way too cliched, if anything its a disservice to what i thought the joker represented. visually its quite interesting tho.
will assume i havnt watched it in the grander context of the batman universe, as i dont like what it implies, from a narrative pov.
will assume i havnt watched it in the grander context of the batman universe, as i dont like what it implies, from a narrative pov.
Mamoon
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Wow. Masterpiece is definitely the most apt description. Superhero or superhero-related movies are usually not my cup of tea, but this was pure art. Joaquin Phoenix deserves an Oscar.
Mamoon
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Needs to viewed with cautition though. It can seriously have psychological implications on vulnerable, young minds.
I can see why some people find it boring because they associate Joker with Batman and the usual plot of a masterplan to take over Gotham City, but this movie is all about incredible character depth and a point of view of a troubled mind that has been rejected by the society.
You need to get in Joker’s shoes to truly enjoy this incredible film.
I can see why some people find it boring because they associate Joker with Batman and the usual plot of a masterplan to take over Gotham City, but this movie is all about incredible character depth and a point of view of a troubled mind that has been rejected by the society.
You need to get in Joker’s shoes to truly enjoy this incredible film.
marlonbrowndo
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68% on Rotten tomatoes and 58% on Metacritic is pretty accurate for this average movie
globalcitizen
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The movie has lived up to its expectation. I guess violence was expected in this movie, after all joker is a crazy psycho character from Batman movie. So please refrain taking young kids.
The highlights of movie were
character build up from a person loving his mother fondly to a vicious gory character.
how mental illness is something to not laugh about and ignore.
Incredible acting by Joaquin and probably done justice to legend heath ledger.
A 9/10 rating suits perfectly fine to this movie.
The highlights of movie were
character build up from a person loving his mother fondly to a vicious gory character.
how mental illness is something to not laugh about and ignore.
Incredible acting by Joaquin and probably done justice to legend heath ledger.
A 9/10 rating suits perfectly fine to this movie.
in_cutter
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Phoenix added an extra, creepy dimension to the character. Looking back, Ledger’s Joker was one dimensional compared to Phoenix- shows up, tells a tale about he’s scars and disappears.
I didn’t think anyone will be able to out-do Ledger. But it has happened.
I didn’t think anyone will be able to out-do Ledger. But it has happened.
in_cutter
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in_cutter
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It is an experience. One of those movies that stays with you. Definitely art.
Robert
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If I want to watch something “harder” than PG13 I can just turn on the news.
Hyperion66
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Lol that's a good one.
Robert
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Or talk to the ex-soldier living on the street about his experiences. Stuff you could barely believe humans could do to other humans.
Rana
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Mamoon
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It is not right to compare them. Both portrayed differences aspects of the Joker character and both nailed their respective roles. Ledger made you fear him and Phoenix made you feel for him.
Robert
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Agreed, this so-and-so is better is pointless. You either like a portrayal or you don’t. My favourite Batman was Affleck and I didn’t much like Bale, but that’s me.
JaDed
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Rinnegan Sasuke
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The cinematography was especially immaculate, I've never felt so claustrophobic watching a movie. It felt like I just finished a long trek when I walked out of the hall.
Rana
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This is whah I have been constantly arguing to this one guy. They are not comparable but the guy was disappointed with Joaquin because he didn’t fight batman as ledger did.
Nolan must be feeling upset that His Joker deserved at least another decade of dominance due to its outstanding performance.
This joker made it look like that he might literally eat batman alive when he gets to meet him in a real duel
marlonbrowndo
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Says the guy who reckons TDK which is full of plot holes, is the best movie ever
It was my favourite movie up until 3 years ago. Now I just think it’s a really great movie. I’ve seen too many great art films and foreign films in the past 3 years. Now I just find it funny when the average person talks about a movie they like
in_cutter
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Fair...was just messing re my previous post.
Technics 1210
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The latest generation of movie goers are only fascinated with CGI.
Joker is a dialogue movie, and a brilliant one at that.
Joker is a dialogue movie, and a brilliant one at that.
Technics 1210
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That's Rambo innit?
ElRaja
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seen a few presumptions made about the rationale behind why people don't buy into this films hype, fwiw i found the origin story too cliched, the script was ok, but for someone as clever as the joker ends up, arthur fleck shows little flair, intelligence or spark imo.
the scenes with sophie are so out of place u immediately know whats happening.
also don't like that they tried to explain the jokers madness. ive always felt him to represent the transformation of cynicism into evil for the sake of chaos, an acknowledgement of the fleeting temporality of the social strictures we dictate our lives by.
the idea of having to explain away that feeling with the most base cliches, feelings that i'm guessing most people have felt at times is contrary to the idea of the joker in my head.
pheonix carries this film, baaki dhyaari laga rahai hain, but pheonix cant control the script, or the story, which doesn't do it for me.
the scenes with sophie are so out of place u immediately know whats happening.
also don't like that they tried to explain the jokers madness. ive always felt him to represent the transformation of cynicism into evil for the sake of chaos, an acknowledgement of the fleeting temporality of the social strictures we dictate our lives by.
the idea of having to explain away that feeling with the most base cliches, feelings that i'm guessing most people have felt at times is contrary to the idea of the joker in my head.
pheonix carries this film, baaki dhyaari laga rahai hain, but pheonix cant control the script, or the story, which doesn't do it for me.
Rana
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Youve missed the entire plot also. Arthur Fleck is most likely a very intelligent character but has a severe lack of self confidence and his isolation doesn’t allow him to express that intelligence. The end was a sneak peak into how powerful he can be as a person when he goes into his zone as a madman, deranged killer. To think that he thought of the entire plot of murdering 3 white Wall Street brokers and becoming a hero of Gotham is also a very intelligent plot that is going on in his mind.
The sequel will show the professional/ calculated madman criminal who will face the arch nemesis.
ElRaja
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i just dont buy it, someone as intelligent as the joker ends up, despite all his likely social inadequacies is likely to manifest that somehow in his earlier life. being socially awkward or isolated does not stop someone from expressing intelligence or creativity.
i dont see how i missed the plot. i just found it fairly pedestrian.
Robert
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In my mind when you said Affleck was better than Bale as BATMAN I went blasphemy
But I didn’t say that, did I?
sweep_shot
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I must admit I am starting to like this Joker now. I saw some of the clips again on YouTube (some folks uploaded parts from the movie) and this character is starting to grow on me now.
Therefore, I am upgrading my rating from 7.5 to 9 (out of 10). I am giving it 9 out of 10.
I also realize it is not a good idea to compare him with Heath Ledger's Joker. Both Jokers are amazing and we must cherish both.
I hope they will make a sequel with Batman in it. I would love to see this Joker take on Batman.
Therefore, I am upgrading my rating from 7.5 to 9 (out of 10). I am giving it 9 out of 10.
I also realize it is not a good idea to compare him with Heath Ledger's Joker. Both Jokers are amazing and we must cherish both.
I hope they will make a sequel with Batman in it. I would love to see this Joker take on Batman.
Robert
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That’s real human beings who have seen such horrible stuff that they can’t navigate through the world any more.
AFM
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I have the exact same sentiments.
Rana
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Would have been so epic if Nolan’s Batman appears in the next one.
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