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Mohammad Rizwan "The criticism seems to be dying down a bit, so I must be doing something right"

shariqnoor said:
I wouldn't categorize it as selfish. Maybe slow but not selfish. If you have a Mohammad Yousuf at one end and a Abdul Razzaq at the other, should Yousuf be the one who should also be hitting out? Probably not. The sensible approach would be to let Razzaq hit out.

Haris is a good hitter of the ball so it made sense for Rizwan to hold back and let Haris do the power hitting. Also Haris wasn't really taking any risks. He was very measured and hit only those balls that were there to be hit. And he hit them in areas where there weren't fielders so it was a safe shot anyways.

I'm not a fan of Rizwan in the ODI formats as I think he'll be too slow when batting first, but today he recovered well and marshalled the chase nicely. I wouldn't be critical of him for tonight at least. He has been awful in the past 10 ODIs though.
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Except Haris is closer to the yousuf type of player than Razzi.

Haris is a proper middle order batsman like yousuf.

Razzi was dispensable. And rizwan playing as a keeper is more dispensable than Haris.

But it was Haris that had to take the risks.
 
shariqnoor said:
I wouldn't categorize it as selfish. Maybe slow but not selfish. If you have a Mohammad Yousuf at one end and a Abdul Razzaq at the other, should Yousuf be the one who should also be hitting out? Probably not. The sensible approach would be to let Razzaq hit out.

Haris is a good hitter of the ball so it made sense for Rizwan to hold back and let Haris do the power hitting. Also Haris wasn't really taking any risks. He was very measured and hit only those balls that were there to be hit. And he hit them in areas where there weren't fielders so it was a safe shot anyways.

I'm not a fan of Rizwan in the ODI formats as I think he'll be too slow when batting first, but today he recovered well and marshalled the chase nicely. I wouldn't be critical of him for tonight at least. He has been awful in the past 10 ODIs though.
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You gave an example of Mohammad Yousuf. A batter from the 2000s. That’s exactly who he is. Rizwan would’ve been a great batter in the early 2000s.

But, in this current day and age, he is actually has a negative impact and causes a lot of losts.
 
Lol at his haters calling it a selfish innings. If was a fine innings. Rizwan paced his innings well and made sure he was there at the end. We were chasing 255, not 320.
 
Don’t get gassed

He was out for 6, Aleem Darr’s decision was harsh on Kiwis
 
Well played Rizwan.

But he is definitely not a number 4 batsmen.

Should bat lower.
 
A good inninga from rizzy Hes quality no doubt about that Competition between the two keepers is healthy and bringing out the best in each other
 
adzzy786 said:
That’s a stupid statement even by your standards
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[MENTION=2016]Rana[/MENTION] is correct.

Aleem Dar has been giving blunder decisions recently.

That was OUT, 2 Reds, but Umpire’s call stood on hitting the stumps.
 
ArabKnight said:
[MENTION=2016]Rana[/MENTION] is correct.

Aleem Dar has been giving blunder decisions recently.

That was OUT, 2 Reds, but Umpire’s call stood on hitting the stumps.
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Aleem Darr has always been lenient towards him
 
He played a decent knock today, we shall see if he can continue for the next 2 games, If rizwan is our WK-Batsman for white ball cricket, than he needs to continue playing at number 4 in ODIS.
 
Very well paced inning today. Rizwan is here for long time in white ball cricket.
 
To all the Rizwan haters if you think sarfraz will replace him in Odi you need to wake up and smell the coffee. His so unreliable behind the stumps I rather have a good keeper who won’t shell chances and score even at the strike rate today than a sarfaraz who will score a run a ball but drop some crucial chances behind the stumps that would lose us the game before we even start the run chase ( presuming we are chasing)
 
The thing is - you shut haters up with a performance like Naseem’s classy bowling or Sarfraz’ selfless innings in tests where he put all our selfish tuk tuk addicts to shame.

When you play a scratchy innings that is based on self preservation, you ain’t shutting anyone up.
 
TheSultan said:
The thing is - you shut haters up with a performance like Naseem’s classy bowling or Sarfraz’ selfless innings in tests where he put all our selfish tuk tuk addicts to shame.

When you play a scratchy innings that is based on self preservation, you ain’t shutting anyone up.
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That too, when you were actually lucky to be given not out for 6 runs
 
I would have had Haris Sohail ahead of him in the order. Babar-Rizwan combo in the middle overs kind of slowed things down. Hence the poor wicket of Babar.
 
Concerned said:
Well played Rizwan.

But he is definitely not a number 4 batsmen.

Should bat lower.
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I think 4 is fine for him as he takes a while to get set. He also doesn't really give his wicket away so he is handy at the top of the order where he can dig in and create partnerships.

Decent innings today but his ODI returns have left a lot to be desired overall. Hopefully losing his test spot gives him the neccessary motivation to improve.
 
Nice innings for a 50 over game. Played well.
 
Khurram1989 said:
To all the Rizwan haters if you think sarfraz will replace him in Odi you need to wake up and smell the coffee. His so unreliable behind the stumps I rather have a good keeper who won’t shell chances and score even at the strike rate today than a sarfaraz who will score a run a ball but drop some crucial chances behind the stumps that would lose us the game before we even start the run chase ( presuming we are chasing)
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The issue isn't about replacing him or even replacing him with Sarfraz, the issue is that 4 is too high for him cos you need a specialist batsman there. He got played there before cos we were playing the KIA guys. But they've been shipped out and actually replaced by proper batsmen some of whom are still awaiting their chance.
 
His batting number if it's not 4 then it is a issue, if his any lower then he cannot hit out and is not a 6 hitter anyway and he won't open as those slots will be with Fakhar/ Imam so which number would you put him at?
 
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Khurram1989 said:
His batting number if it's not 4 then it is a issue, if his any lower then he cannot hit out and is not a 6 hitter anyway and he won't open as those slots will be with Fakhar/ Imam so which number would you put him at?
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Haris averages 45+ at 5
Rizwan averages 35+ at 4
 
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Khurram1989 said:
His batting number if it’s not 4 then it is a issue, if his any lower then he cannot hit out and is not a 6 hitter anyway and he won’t open as those slots will be with Fakhar/ Imam so which number would you put him at?
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What about what’s actually good for the team? Is this the Rizwan show or something that the whole batting order had to be turned upside down just so rizwan can have a decent performance?

There is no justification for having him above Haris Sohail.

If he can’t push on later in the order then that’s a risk you take or keep pushing him further down depending on the situation.
 
Khurram1989 said:
His batting number if it's not 4 then it is a issue, if his any lower then he cannot hit out and is not a 6 hitter anyway and he won't open as those slots will be with Fakhar/ Imam so which number would you put him at?
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As poster above says, its not about what's best for Rizwan or anyone else. What should matter is what is best for the team. At this point, 6/7 is the most appropriate position for him if he plays. He might not even be needed if the top and middle order play well.

Let me ask you this question, do you honestly believe any other side would play Rizwan at 4 or higher let alone a top side?
 
Any good team posses a dynamic middle order batsmen who is able to increase their strike rates the longer they are at the crease.

Problem with Imam, Babar and Rizwan is even when they are settled they do not have that extra gear.

Not that there are many to pick from, but I rather have the likes of Harris or even Chacha at 4, especially when setting scores
 
What's with the negativity around Rizwan's knock? By all means criticize when he's not playing well, but at least give credit where due. He remained not out and scored at the required pace. What were you expecting?
And for "was out", "catch dropped", "lucky", "given not out" - all batsmen have that, it's part of the game. It's the end result that counts.
 
Rana said:
That too, when you were actually lucky to be given not out for 6 runs
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Ladies and gentlemen, a ‘Pakistan’ fan. More like a fan of his own biases. More similar to Mamoon than he’d like to ever admit.

When Sarfaraz plays well and Pakistan succeeds, I’m a fan of Sarfaraz. When Rizwan plays well and Pakistan succeeds, I’m a fan of Rizwan.

If you’re so fixated on wishing the worst for a player that’s helping Pakistan succeed, the problem isn’t that player. It’s you.
 
Will always need someone to bail him out - today it was Harris.

If others play at a similar rate or do not do the hitting; such innings would lose us most games.

Example: Asia Cup final
 
gazza619 said:
Haris Sohail can only dream of having the fitness to bat more than 15 overs.
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99% of Pakistani bats can only dream of playing knocks like he did in the previous World Cup. He might not have the fitness etc but he’s still by far the best middle order bat in Pakistan.
 
PakEngFan said:
Excellent knock by Pakistan greatest wk though haris should bat ahead of him.
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Haris is perfect for 5. He can rotate the strike and score runs quickly. Rizwan is much better suited to No.4. He needs more time to construct an innings.
 
Ramiz Raja On his YT

"Rizwan was under a lot of pressure too. His runs were very really important. I don't understand why he was removed from vice-captaincy. How will this benefit anyone? We know he gives his best for the team. There is no bigger fighter for Pakistan. Use his energy and commitment."
 
MenInG said:
Ramiz Raja On his YT

"Rizwan was under a lot of pressure too. His runs were very really important. I don't understand why he was removed from vice-captaincy. How will this benefit anyone? We know he gives his best for the team. There is no bigger fighter for Pakistan. Use his energy and commitment."
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Removing him from any position of power will benefit Pakistan the most. Just wait and watch
 
MenInG said:
Ramiz Raja On his YT

"Rizwan was under a lot of pressure too. His runs were very really important. I don't understand why he was removed from vice-captaincy. How will this benefit anyone? We know he gives his best for the team. There is no bigger fighter for Pakistan. Use his energy and commitment."
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Do not agree with Ramiz here. If anything, Rizwan needs to be freed up. He's still consuming way too many balls for the runs he scores. Rizwan always relies on other to up the ante; a VC should be leading from the front.
 
Snowflake said:
Do not agree with Ramiz here. If anything, Rizwan needs to be freed up. He's still consuming way too many balls for the runs he scores. Rizwan always relies on other to up the ante; a VC should be leading from the front.
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This is just Rambo retaliating that one of his decisions has been overturned.

Rambo - you are gone. Bye
 
So Rizwan was the ODI vc??

Based on what??? That’s a bigger farce than Shan Masood getting the role
 
Criticism was regarding his Test performance. It’s nothing to do with ODI and T20. He has another 5 years before his performance begin to drop. Luckily we have backup options,
Rohail Nazir, Mohammad Haris, Haseebullah and Umair Masood should be ready for the assignment.
 
Rizwan is doing a fine job in ODIs, but should not be selected for Tests and T20s as first choice WK. He can be in the squad as back-up keeper though.

To remove him from ODIs will be stupid as he is performing well. But he should bat below Haris, that's for sure. And he should stop with his dramaybaazi. Just play simple cricket and warm up properly so he doesn't cramp up so often. I know he has a difficult job with keeping for 50 overs as well, but he is not the first person to do that.
 
Rana said:
So Rizwan was the ODI vc??

Based on what??? That’s a bigger farce than Shan Masood getting the role
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Come on Rana bhai, I understand Rizwan is not fit for VC.

However, there's no bigger farce than Masood getting the role. Just absolutely horrendous. :najam
 
The only person capable of captaining Pakistan in all three formats is Rizwan. Unlike Babar he comes across as someone with a genuine tactical mindset for the game. And he has experienced success captaining Multan Sultans, KPK and Pakistan U-23.

Shadab has massive potential as a limited-overs captain. But not as an all-format captain.

Shan Masood is not even an automatic selection in the ODI team, while Sarfraz's horrendous run as test captain is why he was replaced to begin with.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
The only person capable of captaining Pakistan in all three formats is Rizwan. Unlike Babar he comes across as someone with a genuine tactical mindset for the game. And he has experienced success captaining Multan Sultans, KPK and Pakistan U-23.

Shadab has massive potential as a limited-overs captain. But not as an all-format captain.

Shan Masood is not even an automatic selection in the ODI team, while Sarfraz's horrendous run as test captain is why he was replaced to begin with.
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You know what

Let him captain Pakistan

Aa jao maidaan main! You’ve seen how a great Batsman like Babar is being hounded. This guy who can’t even bat will be mince meat for critics and journalists. Aoa
 
Rana said:
You know what

Let him captain Pakistan

Aa jao maidaan main! You’ve seen how a great Batsman like Babar is being hounded. This guy who can’t even bat will be mince meat for critics and journalists. Aoa
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Cant even bat? Hes probably already the greatest keeper batter pakistan has produced and hes got another 5 years of play left yet
 
Guy plays an innings bats through to the end and we win. That's the bottom line, not whether Haris upped the scoring rate or how he should not have been at Number 4 or what happened if the score to chase was 300 Plus. The fact is score required was 250 odd and he did the job in THIS game and base it on this innings not anything else. Criticism on this match for Rizwan is Absurd.
 
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Zaz said:
Cant even bat? Hes probably already the greatest keeper batter pakistan has produced and hes got another 5 years of play left yet
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Yeah I 100% stick by that claim

Let him captain. Let’s get all of you guy’s wish granted once and for all.

Bring it Rizwan. Welcome to the gladiators dome!
 
TheSultan said:
What about what’s actually good for the team? Is this the Rizwan show or something that the whole batting order had to be turned upside down just so rizwan can have a decent performance?

There is no justification for having him above Haris Sohail.

If he can’t push on later in the order then that’s a risk you take or keep pushing him further down depending on the situation.
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The justification is that rizwan averages close to 35 at 4 and haris averages close to 45 at 5.
 
On a serious note, I don’t have a problem with Rizwan the keeper per say. If he tameez se plays like a regular keeper, bats at 7 or lower, it’s all fine.

The problem I have is of this ridiculous push to make him some sort of star performer and the team bending over backwards to accommodate what’s good for Rizwan.

We have abandoned so many promising t20 potential opening batsmen for Rizwan. We have demoted natural openers to the middle order - just to accommodate Rizwan.

We are wasting middle order ODI players to fit Rizwan in at 4.

We started ridiculously batting Rizwan at 4 in the SL test series too. Thankfully that idea was nipped in the bud.

He’s a keeper who is a useful bat. Play him in that role and leave the batting to the batsmen.
 
Let’s say he Bats at 7 as some here are saying he should, this means 8,9,10,11 are the 4 recognized bowlers. Where do we get the 5th bowling option from the top 6? Who will cover the 5th bowling quota of 10 overs?
 
Khurram1989 said:
Let’s say he Bats at 7 as some here are saying he should, this means 8,9,10,11 are the 4 recognized bowlers. Where do we get the 5th bowling option from the top 6? Who will cover the 5th bowling quota of 10 overs?
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At a push rizwan can bat at - but You know it against the law to pick an allrounder.
 
PakEngFan said:
99% of Pakistani bats can only dream of playing knocks like he did in the previous World Cup. He might not have the fitness etc but he’s still by far the best middle order bat in Pakistan.
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Javed Miandad played superbly in 1992. Yeah so lets bring him back too.

Haris Sohail has two illnesses. Physical and mental. As such he has no future. Mark my words. He has no future.
 
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KingOfPakBreakfast said:
Ladies and gentlemen, a ‘Pakistan’ fan. More like a fan of his own biases. More similar to Mamoon than he’d like to ever admit.

When Sarfaraz plays well and Pakistan succeeds, I’m a fan of Sarfaraz. When Rizwan plays well and Pakistan succeeds, I’m a fan of Rizwan.

If you’re so fixated on wishing the worst for a player that’s helping Pakistan succeed, the problem isn’t that player. It’s you.
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THIS!!!

We already have one drama queen extraordinaire, no need for more...not sure why, but this Rana guy seems to be copying from the same bad play book (based on a few recent threads he started or commented in). A win for Pakistan is a win for Pakistan, not for a specific player or players!

Note: if a keeper drops catches and misses stumpings like Eidi being passed out, then criticism for that player is valid for sure!
 
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Rana said:
You know what

Let him captain Pakistan

Aa jao maidaan main! You’ve seen how a great Batsman like Babar is being hounded. This guy who can’t even bat will be mince meat for critics and journalists. Aoa
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Your obsession with Rizwan is as sad as it is pathetic.
 
Just let your bat do the talking. PCB should keep him far away from the microphone.
 
Unfortunately I think Rizwans are just becoming a bit of a cult here.

I think you could take a few players who claim they can bat, manoeuvre the whole team to make sure that person bats at the right position to maximise their potential and they’ll have the same success as Rizwan.

The problem is it’s to the detriment of the team. We won, yes, but because of Rizwan it took us to the 49th over to chase down 250. Imagine if we were chasing 300.

Because of Rizwan’s slow start to “construct HIS innings” we’ve lost many matches including the asia cup final and a handful of World Cup matches too.

Rizwan is ok if you want to do the bare minimum. However, if you have some ambition, you don’t set your team up to do the bare minimum.
 
Another big knock for him.

Comes in at 13/2 with Pakistan under pressure.
 
given world cup will be in india, it is crucial for middle order to play spin well, rotate strike and not lose momentum with starts to innings like Rizwan does (currently 11 of 24 as i write this).

its a big dilemma that Sarfraz keeping is lacking, otherwise he would be perfect for middle overs batting against spin. if only his keeping hadn't deteriorated.

if Pakistan has decided they must stick with Rizwan for keeping reason, which can be valid, then we need to let players who can rotate strike better come in earlier. Maybe even someone like Nawaz or Shadab once back. can also help keep left/right combo going. or just let Haris bat at 4 as he is a specialist batsman over Rizwan.

This may mean Rizwan is pushed to number 6 or 7 (once Shadab is back), and he may struggle to score at 8-10 in tail end of innings. That is something he needs to work on, or just give strike to hitters on other end.

Alternative is to give some chances to Muhammad Haris as we know he has better hitting ability. But really doubt that will happen so long as Babar is captain.
 
mon858 said:
given world cup will be in india, it is crucial for middle order to play spin well, rotate strike and not lose momentum with starts to innings like Rizwan does (currently 11 of 24 as i write this).

its a big dilemma that Sarfraz keeping is lacking, otherwise he would be perfect for middle overs batting against spin. if only his keeping hadn't deteriorated.

if Pakistan has decided they must stick with Rizwan for keeping reason, which can be valid, then we need to let players who can rotate strike better come in earlier. Maybe even someone like Nawaz or Shadab once back. can also help keep left/right combo going. or just let Haris bat at 4 as he is a specialist batsman over Rizwan.

This may mean Rizwan is pushed to number 6 or 7 (once Shadab is back), and he may struggle to score at 8-10 in tail end of innings. That is something he needs to work on, or just give strike to hitters on other end.

Alternative is to give some chances to Muhammad Haris as we know he has better hitting ability. But really doubt that will happen so long as Babar is captain.
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Rizwan plays spin well where?!!
 
Rana said:
Rizwan plays spin well where?!!
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i never said he does. i am saying Sarfraz plays spin well which everyone knows. Issue is:
a) where to accomodate Rizwan if we want the best keeper to play in the XI
OR
b) drop Rizwan for Safraz (with risk of missing some chance during bowling innings) or Haris (who needs more time to groom, highly unlikely current management will play him over Rizwan)
 
As usual, rrr went up from when he came to when he got out.

Not scoring is one thing, but putting the rest of team under pressure due your selfishness is not excusable.
 
Snowflake said:
As usual, rrr went up from when he came to when he got out.

Not scoring is one thing, but putting the rest of team under pressure due your selfishness is not excusable.
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Lol, everyone is struggling. The "dangerous" Fakhar made 0 from 7 balls. Imam made 6 from 12 and the great man Haris made 10 from 21, surviving one close lbw shout and two top-edges. And Babar has lover SR at Rizwan at the moment so every single batsman has struggled. Get behind the team instead of showing pure hatred against individuals.
 
Ugly innings that.

Scratched around and never looked settled at the crease.

Dot ball after dot ball and no urgency at all.
 
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