Pakistan's pace factory's revival after almost a decade

[aloo paratha]

Shaheen is great,
Can some one explain why was Musa picked for test, I thought he was a 20/20 bowler, what’s his first class average.

He should only play domestic cricket for now.

People think his issue is that he's too short but it's really the fact that he serves a boundary ball every over and can't move the ball an inch which makes him a trash bowler.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Of the top of my head, 19 year old Ishant Sharma played his 3rd test against Australia on the 2008 tour. I'm sure there will be a few more from other teams.

Irfan pathan 19 year old took out Steve waugh and Gilchrist at the SCG.

 

[Abdullah719]

Even if the ball doesn't swing, the seam position should be right and the ball will seam in. Inseam into a right hander is even more dangerous for a right handed batsmen than inswing which can sometimes be too early.

There was some point during the first innings of this Test where the commentators were analysing some of the issues that might be hindering him in this aspect, one was the positioning of his feet.

Via 7Cricket - McGrath: "See his feet aren't quite aligned, which means it's hard for him to swing the ball into the right hander. But it's easier to hit the pitch and take it away from the right hander. That's what's making him so dangerous (to Labuschagne)."

 

[Bewal Express]

His FC average is 37 and his T20 economy is 10.

He is not ready for international cricket in any format.

His selection was an attempt by Misbah to placate the select the young players brigade and kick the result into developing for the future excuse. As many of us know, developing for the future nonsense has been used for decades.

 

[Titan24]

Of the top of my head, 19 year old Ishant Sharma played his 3rd test against Australia on the 2008 tour. I'm sure there will be a few more from other teams.

He was wicketless in his first match and took 6 wickets in next 4 innings and averaged in high 50s. Its not a memorable performance at all other than a decent spell or two.

 

[Titan24]

Irfan pathan 19 year old took out Steve waugh and Gilchrist at the SCG.

Good stuff but 3 wickets in a test match is hardly memorable stuff.

 

[Bewal Express]

There was some point during the first innings of this Test where the commentators were analysing some of the issues that might be hindering him in this aspect, one was the positioning of his feet.

Via 7Cricket - McGrath: "See his feet aren't quite aligned, which means it's hard for him to swing the ball into the right hander. But it's easier to hit the pitch and take it away from the right hander. That's what's making him so dangerous (to Labuschagne)."

If you look at this still, his action is more like a left arm spinners. Hips are far too open and obviously the wrist will push the ball across. But my point is that next year, it will not be any different as I don't see the work ethic or intelligence from our players.

 

[shariqnoor]

Looks like Hasnain is the flavour of the month.

Absolute rubbish bowler who shouldn't anywhere be near the international team. I thought he was the worst until Pakpassion's last flavour Musa Khan came up to bowl.

 

[Titan24]

Bro you’ve really gotta stop smoking that stuff you’re on!

This is no revival. This is not even close to being a flash in the pan. Flash in the pan performance I can live with. In 2000/2001 Sami in new Zealand and then against windies obliterated the opposition and outbowled waqar. You saw how that career went.
Shabbir had everything except a clean action yet around 2005/6 was one of the fastest to 50 wickets.
Umar Gul decimated a strong Indian lineup in Lahore in 2004 I think.
Amir destroyed England and Australia in 2010.
Junaid impressed everybody against Sri Lanka twice with his reverse swing once in uae and the other time I think it was kandy.

Now I don’t want to Be negative but with the passage of time we can look back and see these as flash in the pan performances. Bowlers who for one reason or another have failed to go on and provide consistent performances over 20 or so tests.

The reason is quite simply that at the time these guys were performing they were part of a relatively experienced attack ie you could point to somebody be it waqar, Shohaib, razzaq, saqlain asif, Kaneria anybody who could at least hold up an end when wickets were not coming giving a rookie license to express himself and practice his craft.

Now if we look at the bowlers operating today not only can they not take wickets they also are unable to dry up runs. So a flash in the pan performance is out of the question. It’s rather time to admit that the cupboard is completely bare. So bare in fact that we have to take teenagers still wet behind the ears for international tours. What this highlights is that potential is out of the question it’s player development that has failed consistently over the last decade or so and if we don’t polish our rough diamonds there is every chance that we will have another lost decade of bowling partnerships.

Eng and NZ are completely different places to debut all together. In England our pacers generally do well and I have no doubt Naseem and Shaheen will also if given an opportunity.

Australia has been historically the most difficult place for our bowlers with the exception of Wasim Akram.

You are right they are raw but again the title was the revival of the pace factory. Raw material is there after a long time, just need to create a well polished finished product.

 

[Junaids]

People are confusing white ball and red ball cricket.

At this stage only Shaheen Shah and Naseem Shah have shown any potential for Test cricket.

Musa clearly has zero potential, while Hasnain needs to show that he can take wickets in domestic cricket with a red ball and slip cordon, and that he can bowl 15 overs per day.

Sameen Gul seems fine to me, and should have been in the Test squad. If he is a Hazlewood, don’t expect him to perform in white ball cricket or in Asia.

 

[Mainul]

Test cricket is tough. Right now Pakistan has a good attack for LOI but not for tests. They are doing wrongs repeatedly over team selection. Musa isn't fit for any formet and doesn't seems to be a prospect, Naseem isnt ready for test cricket but he has potential for the future. Shaheen is the only one capable to go further.

 

[Mainul]

There was some point during the first innings of this Test where the commentators were analysing some of the issues that might be hindering him in this aspect, one was the positioning of his feet.

Via 7Cricket - McGrath: "See his feet aren't quite aligned, which means it's hard for him to swing the ball into the right hander. But it's easier to hit the pitch and take it away from the right hander. That's what's making him so dangerous (to Labuschagne)."

He has to rectify it and this is the time. He is still very young so anything he learns now will be embedded in his brain.

 

[Hyperion66]

Good stuff but 3 wickets in a test match is hardly memorable stuff.

But I see you are glorifying your lot for a far less memorable stuff.

 

[Mamoon]

Shaheen is nothing special. He is a decent bowler that’s it. The other bowlers mentioned in the OP are nothing.

You can find such bowlers in every nook and corner of the top teams. At this point they are just names.

Even Naseem is nothing. Just because he is quick and pretends to be 16 doesn’t mean he is a future star.

 

[Kaka4pope]

Shaheen is very good for his age, already established in LOIs as a top bower, including at the last WC. Had to do workhorse role in first Test, when really he is the one who, given his age/some experience, should be the one to let loose.

Haris Raufs non selection baffles me - on skill looks way ahead of Hasnain/Musa - and no sign of him in tests or odi.

Naseem looks a real find, bowls with menace.

Rauf Naseem Shaheen Abbas for SL series please, let them fight it out for the three spots.

 

[AFM]

His FC average is 37 and his T20 economy is 10.

He is not ready for international cricket in any format.

Misbah deserves the sack for this selection alone.

 

[Hyperion66]

Man if this is revival I wonder what downfall looks like, every season PP hypes few bowlers, they get exposed and fade away like bad wine in a few years, then come the new ones and the cycle continues. Worse thing is at least past 'Potentials' at least showed some promises at the beginning of their career while this lot is beyond hopeless, I wish I had Titan bhai's confidence and optimism in my life.

I have never seen Pakistani bowling in this dire condition before, truly darkar days ahead for your cricket.

 

[Khan12]

It doesn’t matter what he calls himself. PCB pretends that he is 16 and his fake age has made headlines.

If he was uncomfortable with the fake age he would have expressed his concern to the board and asked them to stop lying.

So yes he does pretend to be 16. That is all.

So from him pretending to PCB pretending. I rest my case. Just like how you can't say some of the rubbish you post here in public (which you admit yourself) i am sure it's the same for him too. Why don't you raise the concerns you have about Pakistan, army, people, religion etc in public?

 

[dildilpak]

Looks like Hasnain is the flavour of the month.

Absolute rubbish bowler who shouldn't anywhere be near the international team. I thought he was the worst until Pakpassion's last flavour Musa Khan came up to bowl.

Whoever is not playing is the flavour of the month, this has been the perennial case in the mind of an average Pak team fan. Fact is that the system is broken & to say in the words of Mr Boycott - they are all rubbish!

 

[Mamoon]

So from him pretending to PCB pretending. I rest my case. Just like how you can't say some of the rubbish you post here in public (which you admit yourself) i am sure it's the same for him too. Why don't you raise the concerns you have about Pakistan, army, people, religion etc in public?

You don’t have a case.

He is 18 years old, he is not 18 months old. He doesn’t call cars chuchu and he doesn’t suck his thumb.

He is an adult who is comfortable with his joke of a board calling him 16 when he is not. It is clear that it doesn’t bother him and he is happy to pretend that he is 16.

Don’t talk about me because I am not interested in discussing myself. If you don’t have something significant to say I won’t reply.

 

[dildilpak]

Shaheen is very good for his age, already established in LOIs as a top bower, including at the last WC. Had to do workhorse role in first Test, when really he is the one who, given his age/some experience, should be the one to let loose.

Haris Raufs non selection baffles me - on skill looks way ahead of Hasnain/Musa - and no sign of him in tests or odi.

Naseem looks a real find, bowls with menace.

Rauf Naseem Shaheen Abbas for SL series please, let them fight it out for the three spots.

While Shaheen is good, smh i cant see him yet as the main strike bowler for the team - he doesn’t inspire the same awe like Aamir in England before the whole controversy. If he was in any other good bowling lineup, he would have been a good supporting bowler. Naseem looked better, but again its too soon to comment about him.

 

[Usman Chadda]

It's going to take 3 or 4 years before Naseem, Hasnain and Shaheen will start to show their worth.

That's why I said in another thread we are asking a future generation to perform ahead of their time due to bad planning etc.

Well said.

An entire generation of bowlers has been wiped out because of poor domestic structure. The likes of Sadaf Hussain, Mir Hamza, Ehsan Adil, Anwar Ali, Bilawal Bhatti, Rahat Ali etc are literal duds, and are not good enough for international cricket. I was excited to see Naseem bowl, and he did deliver according to his skill-level.

With difficult pitches, expect better pace bowlers to come through the system.

 

[Khan12]

You don’t have a case.

He is 18 years old, he is not 18 months old. He doesn’t call cars chuchu and he doesn’t suck his thumb.

He is an adult who is comfortable with his joke of a board calling him 16 when he is not. It is clear that it doesn’t bother him and he is happy to pretend that he is 16.

Don’t talk about me because I am not interested in discussing myself. If you don’t have something significant to say I won’t reply.

Reason you can't answer the questions hence I rest my case. You say he pretends he 16. Lol what does that even mean then you say PCB pretends he's 16. When he himself said he 18. The fact is you can't answer the questions and now running away.

 

[geraltofrivia]

Man if this is revival I wonder what downfall looks like, every season PP hypes few bowlers, they get exposed and fade away like bad wine in a few years, then come the new ones and the cycle continues. Worse thing is at least past 'Potentials' at least showed some promises at the beginning of their career while this lot is beyond hopeless, I wish I had Titan bhai's confidence and optimism in my life.

I have never seen Pakistani bowling in this dire condition before, truly darkar days ahead for your cricket.

Amir, Junaid, Wahab, Hasan etc

Same with batsmen - Jamshed, Faqar, Sharjeel etc. Azhar and Asad to an extent although they have had ok careers but also did disappoint. Same can be said of Yasir.

The last Pakistani pacer to take 100+ wickets below 30 was Asif and he was banned nearly a decade ago. The last Pakistani batsman to average 45+ was Misbah who debuted in the 90s. Forget ATGs, Pakistan are not even producing ATVG (All Time Very Goods) like Shami, Pujara etc with bowling avg between 25-30 and batting average between 45-50.

 

[ak619]

He was wicketless in his first match and took 6 wickets in next 4 innings and averaged in high 50s. Its not a memorable performance at all other than a decent spell or two.

Correct me if I'm wrong but you're just reading the scorecard off Google, aren't you?

Because anyone who saw him bowl in that series will agree that he looked 10x the bowler than any bowler from Pak has looked in this series so far.

Ishant made Ponting dance to his tune in that series. Match after match. Not only in tests but in the ODIs as well. Got him out 4 times on that tour if I recall correctly.

 

[Mamoon]

Reason you can't answer the questions hence I rest my case. You say he pretends he 16. Lol what does that even mean then you say PCB pretends he's 16. When he himself said he 18. The fact is you can't answer the questions and now running away.

Why doesn’t he tell the board to not call him 16 when he isn’t?

 

[Shazzam]

This thread is hilarious. Haha

Its almost like the Op saw the ages than brought out the drums to say our pace factory is on a revival.

 

[MMHS]

I think, the biggest improvement area for PAK pacers is new ball bowling. No matter what else you do, there is nothing more important than conventional skills for a cricketer in any skill. It's really frustrating to see young pacers with good potential doing funky things with their grip, seem position, run up .... eventually fading away in couple of years time. Faking age is indeed an issue, but that's not the case for Hasan Ali, and it won't be an issue for Naseem or Shaeen - even with buffer, their age is perfectly acceptable for a 10-12 years career at highest level.

I am not comparing and don't want to hurt anyone, but to be honest I was impressed with the technical skills of Ebdat & Rahi in recent IND tour - they had proper grip, wrist position, delivery stride and release - didn't over step even bowling at their peak speed, didn't land on danger area and released from quite close to sticks - these are fundamentals upon which you can build on. They might not develop much because of lack of mentoring and competitive edge at domestics, but Saifuddin improved remarkably under Ramanayeke.

30-35 years back India started to nurture fast blowers in similar line - building on fundamentals and they are cashing on that. TA Shekhar or Bharat Arun are not sparkling names like Lillee, but they have done miracles with Indian pacers and each of them are very good with their new ball skills, disciplines, direction, control, intelligence and stamina - average speed has increased remarkably. When Streak was our coach, I saw our pacers improving considerably on the basics, but overall quality wasn't there. And, now Ramayanake and the Aussie guy (forgot name), is trying with U19 kids and their fundamentals are actually better than the national pacers few years back - we may see couple of good prospects in upcoming U19 WC.

In that regard, I think I have to say - PAK needs foreign coaching resources for the fast bowlers as well - for National team and NCA; these Aaquibs, Waquars, Mo Akrams or Azhar Mahmoods are not contributing much in further development - PAK need to step ahead from old ball and speed gun.

 

[geraltofrivia]

Umesh Yadav has more test wickets than any Pakistani pacer post Shoaib who retired more than a decade ago and debuted in the 90s. Pakistan's pace factory shut down a long time back.

West Indies with an even prouder tradition of fast bowling compared to Pakistan does not keep talking of "pace factory" even though they have had decent fast bowlers in their recent history like Kemar Roach (197 @ 27.13) and Jason Holder (106 @ 26.37). Pakistan's last pace bowler to have 100+ at below 30 was Asif.

 

[ethan hunt]

I think, the biggest improvement area for PAK pacers is new ball bowling. No matter what else you do, there is nothing more important than conventional skills for a cricketer in any skill. It's really frustrating to see young pacers with good potential doing funky things with their grip, seem position, run up .... eventually fading away in couple of years time. Faking age is indeed an issue, but that's not the case for Hasan Ali, and it won't be an issue for Naseem or Shaeen - even with buffer, their age is perfectly acceptable for a 10-12 years career at highest level.

I am not comparing and don't want to hurt anyone, but to be honest I was impressed with the technical skills of Ebdat & Rahi in recent IND tour - they had proper grip, wrist position, delivery stride and release - didn't over step even bowling at their peak speed, didn't land on danger area and released from quite close to sticks - these are fundamentals upon which you can build on. They might not develop much because of lack of mentoring and competitive edge at domestics, but Saifuddin improved remarkably under Ramanayeke.

30-35 years back India started to nurture fast blowers in similar line - building on fundamentals and they are cashing on that. TA Shekhar or Bharat Arun are not sparkling names like Lillee, but they have done miracles with Indian pacers and each of them are very good with their new ball skills, disciplines, direction, control, intelligence and stamina - average speed has increased remarkably. When Streak was our coach, I saw our pacers improving considerably on the basics, but overall quality wasn't there. And, now Ramayanake and the Aussie guy (forgot name), is trying with U19 kids and their fundamentals are actually better than the national pacers few years back - we may see couple of good prospects in upcoming U19 WC.

In that regard, I think I have to say - PAK needs foreign coaching resources for the fast bowlers as well - for National team and NCA; these Aaquibs, Waquars, Mo Akrams or Azhar Mahmoods are not contributing much in further development - PAK need to step ahead from old ball and speed gun.

Poor coaching is a concern at the Nca
The younger lot bar Naseem are all a bit too raw.

The Bangladeshi pacers at the emerging Asia cup were terrible though. Still a long way to go.

 

[ethan hunt]

Umesh Yadav has more test wickets than any Pakistani pacer post Shoaib who retired more than a decade ago and debuted in the 90s. Pakistan's pace factory shut down a long time back.

West Indies with an even prouder tradition of fast bowling compared to Pakistan does not keep talking of "pace factory" even though they have had decent fast bowlers in their recent history like Kemar Roach (197 @ 27.13) and Jason Holder (106 @ 26.37). Pakistan's last pace bowler to have 100+ at below 30 was Asif.

Ironically thats a term mostly used by the indian and british media.
Dont see what your point is.

 

[MMHS]

Poor coaching is a concern at the Nca
The younger lot bar Naseem are all a bit too raw.

The Bangladeshi pacers at the emerging Asia cup were terrible though. Still a long way to go.

Not Hasan Mahmud - he'll improve considerably, he uses new ball quite well, and I know he is genuine 21 (not 20 as listed). Other one was coach's pick to extract an all-rounder out of nobody - even I don't know him!!!!.

 

[Buffet]

Good prospect and pace factory revival are two different things. A lot has to go right.

 

[Chief Destroyer]

If Pakistan had two bowlers similar to Shaheen and Naseem, they would've taken 20 wickets.

 

[Titan24]

Correct me if I'm wrong but you're just reading the scorecard off Google, aren't you?

Because anyone who saw him bowl in that series will agree that he looked 10x the bowler than any bowler from Pak has looked in this series so far.

Ishant made Ponting dance to his tune in that series. Match after match. Not only in tests but in the ODIs as well. Got him out 4 times on that tour if I recall correctly.

He was exceptional in that little spell no doubt about that. My point was regarding leaving an impact or impression on the match which only happens with actually picking up wickets and having decent stats. Aus is one place where it has been difficult for most newbies to actually do that.

 

[Titan24]

If Pakistan had two bowlers similar to Shaheen and Naseem, they would've taken 20 wickets.

Agreed.

 

[Titan24]

I think, the biggest improvement area for PAK pacers is new ball bowling. No matter what else you do, there is nothing more important than conventional skills for a cricketer in any skill. It's really frustrating to see young pacers with good potential doing funky things with their grip, seem position, run up .... eventually fading away in couple of years time. Faking age is indeed an issue, but that's not the case for Hasan Ali, and it won't be an issue for Naseem or Shaeen - even with buffer, their age is perfectly acceptable for a 10-12 years career at highest level.

I am not comparing and don't want to hurt anyone, but to be honest I was impressed with the technical skills of Ebdat & Rahi in recent IND tour - they had proper grip, wrist position, delivery stride and release - didn't over step even bowling at their peak speed, didn't land on danger area and released from quite close to sticks - these are fundamentals upon which you can build on. They might not develop much because of lack of mentoring and competitive edge at domestics, but Saifuddin improved remarkably under Ramanayeke.

30-35 years back India started to nurture fast blowers in similar line - building on fundamentals and they are cashing on that. TA Shekhar or Bharat Arun are not sparkling names like Lillee, but they have done miracles with Indian pacers and each of them are very good with their new ball skills, disciplines, direction, control, intelligence and stamina - average speed has increased remarkably. When Streak was our coach, I saw our pacers improving considerably on the basics, but overall quality wasn't there. And, now Ramayanake and the Aussie guy (forgot name), is trying with U19 kids and their fundamentals are actually better than the national pacers few years back - we may see couple of good prospects in upcoming U19 WC.

In that regard, I think I have to say - PAK needs foreign coaching resources for the fast bowlers as well - for National team and NCA; these Aaquibs, Waquars, Mo Akrams or Azhar Mahmoods are not contributing much in further development - PAK need to step ahead from old ball and speed gun.

Well put. I agree about Ebadat as well doing the basics better and shows how important it is to have atleast some experience of domestic cricket before entering test arena. Pak needs to move towards the basics.

 

[Titan24]

Good prospect and pace factory revival are two different things. A lot has to go right.

Raw material is there so the factory can atleast be operative now though I agree the continuation will depend upon how well the final product turns out to be.

 

[Khan12]

If Pakistan had two bowlers similar to Shaheen and Naseem, they would've taken 20 wickets.

What do you make of Shaheen's development since his debut?

 

[Chief Destroyer]

What do you make of Shaheen's development since his debut?

He bowled as well as the Aussies in the little bit I watched.

 

[Khan12]

He bowled as well as the Aussies in the little bit I watched.

That's good to hear thanks a lot bro. I rate you and [MENTION=79064]MMHS[/MENTION] views very highly.

 

[TeamPak95]

Shaheen and Naseem have been very impressive and Musa has surprising pace on him, but he is not as talented overall as the other two. He needs to do some hard yards in QeA to better his consistency.

 

[Saj]

I think we were spoilt when producing freakish bowlers like Wasim and Waqar, but such bowlers are once in a lifetime bowlers and almost not normal.

Mere mortals have to do the hard yards before becoming international class bowlers.

 

[Savak]

I think we were spoilt when producing freakish bowlers like Wasim and Waqar, but such bowlers are once in a lifetime bowlers and almost not normal.

Mere mortals have to do the hard yards before becoming international class bowlers.

We were spoilt by Imran Khan giving things on a platter to Pakistan. Btw the great Waqar has a bowling average of 40 in Australia with not even a single 5 wicket haul and he mostly faced weak Australian teams and he is your bowling coach

 

[Majid Khan]

I think we were spoilt when producing freakish bowlers like Wasim and Waqar, but such bowlers are once in a lifetime bowlers and almost not normal.

Mere mortals have to do the hard yards before becoming international class bowlers.

Yes it feels like that now , those guys were truly special - but how remarkable was it that the likes of Wasim, Waqar, Shoaib, even Mushtaq, Saqlain played alongside each other as a bowling attack for most of their careers and despite having such competition among themselves for taking the opposition wickets , all these guys managed to take lots of 5fers in their careers.

And since they’ve gone , taking five wickets by Pakistani Bowlers is a rare sight these days.

 

[Bullet Drive]

Hasnain is brainless.

 

[MMHS]

We were spoilt by Imran Khan giving things on a platter to Pakistan. Btw the great Waqar has a bowling average of 40 in Australia with not even a single 5 wicket haul and he mostly faced weak Australian teams and he is your bowling coach

Any Aussie team, at home is not weak; teams between 1989 to 2010 were almost always among ATGs.

WY never toured Australia at his peak - he was raw in 1990, in 1995-6 recovering from injury and by 1999-00, he was biologically 35 years old; still set the Hobert game in almost one over, only for Aussie Umpires to cheat it. His peak was very short and in that period he mostly against WIN, NZ & England.

 

[Titan24]

So Shaheen and Naseem got their first fifers in tests and seem to be learning the test attitude, lines and lengths pretty well.

Haris Rauf is leaving an impression in BBL

On the other hand Hasnain is looking fitter and much more accurate with improved seam position as he showed in the emerging cup as well.

Akif Javed is selected as emerging player by IU.

 

[Titan24]

Musa still has a lot of work to do.

While I think Sameen Gul is ready for tests but he still needs to continue performing in domestics and remain in the eyes so when an opportunity comes in he is ready to grab.

Arshad Iqbal is another one to keep an eye on though I missed his name in the opening post. He is selected by KK in emerging category. Strongly built lad, with decent height and his accuracy was impressive in his U19 days and last time I saw him bowl he was bowling some really impressive yorkers in a T20 domestic match.

 

[Titan24]

So Naseem got his first fifer in his 3rd test and now a hatrick in 4th test.

 

[BreadPakoda]

From the original list, only Shaheen has somewhat proven himself so far. Musa seems to have lost the support from his fans. Look forward to watching Akif and Sameen.

 

[Savak]

Pakistan's pace attack has been brutally humbled on this tour, did not live up to the Hype at all. A grounding experience for this young lot who perhaps felt over confident and boastful before this tour.

 

[sweep_shot]

Pakistani pace bowling attack needs more work. It hasn't been revived yet (I thought it did).

Shaheen has lost form. Naseem seems raw.

 

[BreadPakoda]

In England our pacers generally do well and I have no doubt Naseem and Shaheen will also if given an opportunity.

I think this is where the expectation miss match was. Although the two youngsters didn’t perform badly for their age, having a lot of expectations usually leads to disappointment.

Guys like Naseem who are only 17 need to be given a longer rope and expectation should be reasonable. Allow them to be around the team, learn from seniors like Wahab and Imran in the dug out and unleash them every now and then - strategically.

 

[Titan24]

I think this is where the expectation miss match was. Although the two youngsters didn’t perform badly for their age, having a lot of expectations usually leads to disappointment.

Guys like Naseem who are only 17 need to be given a longer rope and expectation should be reasonable. Allow them to be around the team, learn from seniors like Wahab and Imran in the dug out and unleash them every now and then - strategically.

I still think they can be groomed into pretty good bowlers. Most would agree they underachieved on this tour and that inexperience definitely came into play. Lack of test level experience is one thing but lack of FC experience is completely another which was visible.

Even now I believe Shaheen, Naseem and some upcoming young bowlers can be developed into good international pacers.

As I explained few times in this thread it self that its the revival of the factory as Pak has got some raw material with these young bowlers but they need to be groomed into finished products. In last decade post Amir, Asif there wasnt even a raw material to convert into a product.

 

[Titan24]

Revival of production with raw material and finished products are different things as I have tried to explain throughout the history of this thread. There were gonna be ups and downs in each of these young pacers careers. Naseem and Shaheen at 17 and 20 years age are better than young pacer around that age group on the last decade.

Yes by the time they both and other mentioned in this thread are 23-25 they should be at the top of their game and if they arent then that would be a disappointment.

 

[hitthestump]

Some accountability needs to be put on the people responsible for developing these guys. What has Waqar done during this tour? Not a single pacer has done well despite some very bowler friendly conditions at times.

Rauf is now another pacer who's been tried and has clearly not made any improvement at all.

 

[shamaan]

Some accountability needs to be put on the people responsible for developing these guys. What has Waqar done during this tour? Not a single pacer has done well despite some very bowler friendly conditions at times.

Rauf is now another pacer who's been tried and has clearly not made any improvement at all.

Rauf did well yestedday proberly best bowler from both sides

 

[Nikhil_cric]

So how's the pace revival coming along now?

 

[Sunny_majoka]

So how's the pace revival coming along now?

No
Tabdeeli takes time, it can't come overtime

 

[Muddaser]

So how's the pace revival coming along now?

One swallow doesn't make a summer.

India was 36 All out a few days ago.

No batsmen in India. India batting legacy finished?

Unfortunately our fans expect instant results and performances every game from guys who have played little cricket.

Need to be patient.

 

[Titan24]

So how's the pace revival coming along now?

Factory was already revived (Talent pool of 6-7 years ago can easily be compared), revival of performances in international cricket was always going to take few years. Don’t remember the last pacer setting the world cricket on fire after coming into international cricket with experience of 1-5 FC matches. Management tried to force the revival at international stage but, unfortunately thats now how it works. Even if a farmer is having a bumper crop season, he can start cutting them before his crops have fully developed.

Have explained few times in the thread that revival of factory is different from production of finished products.

 

[Titan24]

Well, most experts, commies as well as fans agreed on the point that Pakistan had the best pace bowling in the WT20 2022. Numbers back that as well. Good to see some of the pacers shaping up well as was initially expected.

Hopefully same can be transitioned into other formats as too.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Pakistani bowlers make cricket fun. They made a game of a 138 score. That's just impeccable.

Rauf been my favourite

 

[Savak]

Wasim and Waqar played 19 and 14 years for Pakistan respectively. Other pacers have started their careers late and have not had that luxury.

 

[Savak]

Wasim and Waqar played 19 and 14 years for Pakistan respectively. Other pacers have started their careers late and have not had that luxury.

 

[pakfan54588]

They are good for t20i and odis but our test bowling lineup is in pretty bad situation

 

[Titan24]

They are good for t20i and odis but our test bowling lineup is in pretty bad situation

I agree. Thing is test is the most difficult format to master and requires experience as well as understanding of the game which again improves with experience. Most of our pacers who are currently impressing with their potential don't have much red ball cricket under their belt. Shaheen when fit is the only one currently who has found his feet in the format and that also took sometime as he came after just 1-3 FC games. There is potential in some other pacers but, their fitness and willingness to put in the hard yards will define their test careers.

 

[Bewal Express]

And we have another 2 in Ihsanullah and Zeeshan Bashir that with a fair wind will also make an impact. All these guys need to be managed and looked after.

 

[Fenrir]

They are good for t20i and odis but our test bowling lineup is in pretty bad situation

Pakistan should play Sameen Gul or Arshad Iqbal in SENA tours.They will be successful.Dahani needs a full season of FC cricket.He can also be good in SENA.
PCB selection and planning is poor.It lacks long term planning.

 

[pakfan54588]

Pakistan should play Sameen Gul or Arshad Iqbal in SENA tours.They will be successful.Dahani needs a full season of FC cricket.He can also be good in SENA.
PCB selection and planning is poor.It lacks long term planning.

Mir hamza is best available new ball bowler .He has limitations in middle overs but he is someone who deserves long run due his brilliant performances in first class cricket .Sameen gul is also very good option But realistically neither mir hamza ,arshad iqbal or sameen gul is in the plans of babar azam and co .Heard they are going to select abbas for england series

 

[Kianig89]

Yes Pakistan have come up after the mediocrity being served during Misbah era, who had a fascination for trundlers and kept ourselves dipped with dibbly dobbly seamers

Tanvir Ahmed Aizaz Cheema Ehsan Adil Muhammad Abbas all comes to mind.

What Pakistan must ensure now is longevity of this group its high time we had a pacer with 200+ wickets

 

[Markhor]

Mir hamza is best available new ball bowler .He has limitations in middle overs but he is someone who deserves long run due his brilliant performances in first class cricket .Sameen gul is also very good option But realistically neither mir hamza ,arshad iqbal or sameen gul is in the plans of babar azam and co .Heard they are going to select abbas for england series ������

Was impressed with Mir Hamza in this QEA Trophy. He swung the ball both ways and bowled good lines/lengths with new ball. We often waste the new ball so although he's not the quickest, I'd pick him and he provides experience to a fairly raw attack.

 

[shamaan]

Sameen Gull should be in contention for the test squad he can open the bowling has good control and can swing the ball.

 

[shamaan]

Is Irfanullah Shah injured ?

 

[Bewal Express]

Mir hamza is best available new ball bowler .He has limitations in middle overs but he is someone who deserves long run due his brilliant performances in first class cricket .Sameen gul is also very good option But realistically neither mir hamza ,arshad iqbal or sameen gul is in the plans of babar azam and co .Heard they are going to select abbas for england series ������

Any batsman worth their salt would fancy playing the likes of Mir Hamza- nice and tidy he is, but not international quality.

 

[Bewal Express]

Sameen Gull should be in contention for the test squad he can open the bowling has good control and can swing the ball.

He looks fitter than before but still lacks the extra fitness to allow him to shout loudly to the selectors

 

[Marooned]

Was impressed with Mir Hamza in this QEA Trophy. He swung the ball both ways and bowled good lines/lengths with new ball. We often waste the new ball so although he's not the quickest, I'd pick him and he provides experience to a fairly raw attack.

Muhammad Ali is better.

Statistically the best domestic seamer for last 2 years. Looks good too, and does more with the old ball.

 

[Titan24]

Is Irfanullah Shah injured ?

Struggling with form this season. Took just 2 wickets in 3 FC matches for KPK and then was sent to 2nd XI and picked 1 wicket in 2 matches.

 

[pakfan54588]

Any batsman worth their salt would fancy playing the likes of Mir Hamza- nice and tidy he is, but not international quality.

We don't have much options .Use of new ball will be vital in upcoming series against england also england have plenty of left handed batsmen which suit mir hamza who has brilliant record against left handed batsmen