Panamagate Case: Supreme Court disqualifies Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif in unanimous verdict

[WebGuru]

I Agree.

I think CJ saved his son in that case.

The news shared by brother [MENTION=3393]godzilla[/MENTION] above quoting unknown sources looks like a planted one by maryam bibi's media cell earlier today to portray that PMLN is also against commission and not comfortable. (maybe a trap for PTI?)

 

[WebGuru]

Only if this Court gives its verdict before the CJ retires only than I see Justice prevail.

I hope I am proved wrong.

Best chance for him to write his name in golden words of history book.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

I can smell another decision based on nazrya-e-zarurat by SC judges. Our history if full of these decisions based on nazrya-e-zarurat.
[MENTION=138980]TalentSpotterPk[/MENTION] [MENTION=138254]Syed1[/MENTION]

Yes history tells us this but still I have some hope as I have mentioned in my last post.

Asad Kharral informed us about a secret meeting which tool place at Khi on 22nd November. God forbid if it was a gov official with incoming CJ or his representative than it could be a MuqMuqqa. (Allah na keray)

I would want SC to give its verdict before CJ's retirement otherwise I do not want any commision to be formed as vommisiom will give clean chit to Sharif family and PML N will gain political mileage. So it would be better that the Case gets closed.

Also I am interested in what PTI is doing wrt Election Reforms (New ECP + electronic Voting). PTI only has chance of making a Coalition Punjab government or Coalition Federal government or both in 2018 if there is Fair Election otherwise there is zero chance.

Nothing has been done in last 3.5 years wrt Election reforms.

 

[WebGuru]

That would be very unfortunate. But I was under the impression that the nazrya-e-zarurat is dead and buried now..

Dead and buried? Check Asghar Khan case decision from 2012 where Nawaz and many others were found guilty of taking money from ISI to derail Bibi's goverment back in 1990. Decision in 2012 and next year Nawaz becomes your PM for the 3rd time...

PUNJAB: Nawaz Sharif received Rs3.5m, Lt-Gen (retd) Rafaqat Rs5.6m (for media), Jamaat-i-Islami Rs5m, Syeda Abida Hussain Rs1m, Altaf Hussain Qureshi and Mustafa Sadiq Rs0.5m and miscellaneous smaller groups Rs3.339m.

SINDH: Jatoi received Rs5m, former chief minister Jam Sadiq Rs5m, (Mohammad Khan) Junejo Rs2.5m, Pagara Rs2m, Maulana Salahuddin Rs0.3m and miscellaneous and smaller groups Rs5.4m.

BALOCHISTAN: Humayun Mari (son-in-law of Akbar Bugti) Rs1.5m, Jamali Rs4m, Kakar Rs1m, K. Baluch Rs0.5m, Jam Yousaf Rs0.75m, Bazinjo Rs0.50m and Nadeem Mengal Rs1m.

http://www.dawn.com/news/762723

 

[WebGuru]

Yes history tells us this but still I have some hope as I have mentioned in my last post.

Asad Kharral informed us about a secret meeting which tool place at Khi on 22nd November. God forbid if it was a gov official with incoming CJ or his representative than it could be a MuqMuqqa. (Allah na keray)

I would want SC to give its verdict before CJ's retirement otherwise I do not want any commision to be formed as vommisiom will give clean chit to Sharif family and PML N will gain political mileage. So it would be better that the Case gets closed.

Also I am interested in what PTI is doing wrt Election Reforms (New ECP + electronic Voting). PTI only has chance of making a Coalition Punjab government or Coalition Federal government or both in 2018 if there is Fair Election otherwise there is zero chance.

Nothing has been done in last 3.5 years wrt Election reforms.

We really need election reforms and census before next election but i don't think there is enough time left and status-quo will never allow it.

For those who don't know our upcoming CJ was Federal Law of Secretary when Nawaz Sharif and his govt attacked Supreme Court back in 1997 (i just hope he wasn't aware of PMLN master plan of attacking SC and beating judges and that happened without his knowledge)

 

[Mamoon]

If the SC forms a commission, the matter goes into the tall grass.

Based on the current evidences that have been presented to the SC, as well as the fact that the SC has asked the parties for their opinion on forming a commission, it seems that the SC is finding it difficult to find anyone guilty.

Thus, either way, PTI does not win. In this game if you are not a winner, you are a loser - a draw is not an option. Also, the SC does not want to get involved in a political conflict when the CJ is retiring. So assuredly, it's going to pass the buck to a commission. Allah Allah Khair Sallah.

Imran of course has left room for a U-Turn by rejecting the proposal.

 

[MRSN]

If the SC forms a commission, the matter goes into the tall grass.

Based on the current evidences that have been presented to the SC, as well as the fact that the SC has asked the parties for their opinion on forming a commission, it seems that the SC is finding it difficult to find anyone guilty.

Thus, either way, PTI does not win. In this game if you are not a winner, you are a loser - a draw is not an option. Also, the SC does not want to get involved in a political conflict when the CJ is retiring. So assuredly, it's going to pass the buck to a commission. Allah Allah Khair Sallah.

Imran of course has left room for a U-Turn by rejecting the proposal.

the hearings in SC have been a big moral win and a booster IK and PTI badly needed after his Isb lockdown claims. It may not be decided by SC but it validates all claims IK has been making. The system is not good enough which is not IK's fault. Any good democratic country and Nawaz Sharif would have been forced to resign after what we have seen in last few days. The family is corrupt just like Zardari but both rule in Punjab and Sindh.

 

[WebGuru]

Thus, either way, PTI does not win. In this game if you are not a winner, you are a loser - a draw is not an option.

Bro Mamoon i was expecting better from you if nazrya-e-zarurat comes into play here once again thn it's not a defeat of PTI and IK isn't the loser here whole nation is going to lose and people will lose faith in state institutions if there is any left.

SC is now asking same questions from Sharif family that IK was asking from 8 months and now SC is also exposing NAB, FIA and other institutions just like IK have been doing from years it's not a defeat for him.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

If the SC forms a commission, the matter goes into the tall grass.

Based on the current evidences that have been presented to the SC, as well as the fact that the SC has asked the parties for their opinion on forming a commission, it seems that the SC is finding it difficult to find anyone guilty.

Thus, either way, PTI does not win. In this game if you are not a winner, you are a loser - a draw is not an option. Also, the SC does not want to get involved in a political conflict when the CJ is retiring. So assuredly, it's going to pass the buck to a commission. Allah Allah Khair Sallah.

Imran of course has left room for a U-Turn by rejecting the proposal.

So Imran Khan, PTI and PTI's legal team needs to provide evidence of Sharif family's money trail of flats to Supreme Court ?

Or Court should Nab Sharif family incase it fails to provide evidence of Money trail ?

 

[Mamoon]

the hearings in SC have been a big moral win and a booster IK and PTI badly needed after his Isb lockdown claims. It may not be decided by SC but it validates all claims IK has been making. The system is not good enough which is not IK's fault. Any good democratic country and Nawaz Sharif would have been forced to resign after what we have seen in last few days. The family is corrupt just like Zardari but both rule in Punjab and Sindh.

There are no moral wins, at least not in politics. If Nawaz holds on till 2018, he wins.

 

[WebGuru]

So Imran Khan, PTI and PTI's legal team needs to provide evidence of Sharif family's money trail of flats to Supreme Court ?

Or Court should Nab Sharif family incase it fails to provide evidence of Money trail ?

Burden of proof is on Sharif family now those were the judges remarks after Sharif family accepted the ownership of flats. But when asked about money trail the answer was we can't provide it and NS lied in National Assembly about having all doc proofs.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Burden of proof is on Sharif family now those were the judges remarks after Sharif family accepted the ownership of flats. But when asked about money trail the answer was we can't provide it and NS lied in National Assembly about having all doc proofs.

Yes it is right but I wanted to ask Mamoon as I do not agree with the flavour and scent of his Post.

 

[Bewal Express]

Bro Mamoon i was expecting better from you if nazrya-e-zarurat comes into play here once again thn it's not a defeat of PTI and IK isn't the loser here whole nation is going to lose and people will lose faith in state institutions if there is any left.

SC is now asking same questions from Sharif family that IK was asking from 8 months and now SC is also exposing NAB, FIA and other institutions just like IK have been doing from years it's not a defeat for him.

Nooras still cant accept what has been exposed to them in black and white. Everything IK has said about the institutions has turned out to be a 100% correct and if somehow miraculously the verdict goes for IK, watch how the ECP looks to disqualify him next week.

 

[Mamoon]

Burden of proof is on Nawaz, but it seems like the SC does not want to be involved in this mess anymore since the CJ is retiring.

Nonetheless, I apologize if my comment appeared to be harsh. It is very good news and I'm actually happy; the torture will end soon and I hope both parties will accept the decision, whatever it is and there will be no agar magar from either side.

 

[waqar goraya]

If the SC forms a commission, the matter goes into the tall grass.

Based on the current evidences that have been presented to the SC, as well as the fact that the SC has asked the parties for their opinion on forming a commission, it seems that the SC is finding it difficult to find anyone guilty.

Thus, either way, PTI does not win. In this game if you are not a winner, you are a loser - a draw is not an option. Also, the SC does not want to get involved in a political conflict when the CJ is retiring. So assuredly, it's going to pass the buck to a commission. Allah Allah Khair Sallah.

Imran of course has left room for a U-Turn by rejecting the proposal.

Kabhi hath hola bhi rakha karo na IK par

Most of the times i already know what you are going to say in response to anything involving PTI/IK. It is getting boring now.

N's people are more worried about any negative media coverage which could harm goodwill of their sharif badshah salamat, in reality they don't give a damn about courts as they know that our justice system is not yet capable of disqualifying their powerful PM.
You might have noticed their impatience and anxiety after Dawn leaks which was way higher than this Panama thing.

 

[WebGuru]

Kabhi hath hola bhi rakha karo na IK par

Most of the times i already know what you are going to say in response to anything involving PTI/IK. It is getting boring now.

N's people are more worried about any negative media coverage which could harm goodwill of their sharif badshah salamat, in reality they don't give a damn about courts as they know that our justice system is not yet capable of disqualifying their powerful PM.
You might have noticed their impatience and anxiety after Dawn leaks which was way higher than this Panama thing.

They are winning the case on media thanks to 14 derbaris and billions of funds being thrown on media and anchors. Some time i wonder if the case is against NS or IK

 

[waqar goraya]

Burden of proof is on Sharif family now those were the judges remarks after Sharif family accepted the ownership of flats. But when asked about money trail the answer was we can't provide it and NS lied in National Assembly about having all doc proofs.

Only Nooras can term his blatant lie on the floor of the parliament political. He was supposed to present himself for accountability and was clarifying his source of income while denying allegations of corruption.

Only in some third world country like Pakistan you would do all this drama and still unable to face any real criticism/protest from political, public or judicial circles. In any other reasonable country the man would have himself resigned much before any court proceedings. But we are leading the list of unreasonable countries.
In truth, judiciary doesn't has the spine or the mass public backing to oust the mighty PM.

 

[WebGuru]

Only Nooras can term his blatant lie on the floor of the parliament political. He was supposed to present himself for accountability and was clarifying his source of income while denying allegations of corruption.

Only in some third world country like Pakistan you would do all this drama and still unable to face any real criticism/protest from political, public or judicial circles. In any other reasonable country the man would have himself resigned much before any court proceedings. But we are leading the list of unreasonable countries.
In truth, judiciary doesn't has the spine or the mass public backing to oust the mighty PM.

You know what's more sad thn Sharif family coming out clean in this case and institution failing once again? The sad truth is many people believe that this is going to be a defeat of IK and PTI. I guess the corruption is only hurting Imran Khan while the other 20 crores are living in some other country with no or little corruption. Maybe they think failure of state institutions is an issue of Imran Khan while other 20 crores are getting full insaf

 

[waqar goraya]

They are winning the case on media thanks to 14 derbaris and billions of funds being thrown on media and anchors. Some time i wonder if the case is against NS or IK

You won't believe when i say that these days Panama case news is at the top of my ignore list. I would rather read news about some far flung town in the country than waste my time on this farce.
Panama ka hangama as some media outlets call it. Although they have their own agendas but it actually sounds logical now. Initially, i would amuse on my thinking that i understand N league's plans to use media to trivialize this issue, later it became a nuisance that such a major scandal is being declared trivial but now i think i should stand and clap for shrewd N league and for commercial media's avarice.

 

[WebGuru]

Want to see what is a U-Turn? Read this. First statement is by PM inside parliament and the second statement is by his lawyer in Supreme Court. And please next time don't sell me the importance of parliament please?

 

[WebGuru]

You won't believe when i say that these days Panama case news is at the top of my ignore list. I would rather read news about some far flung town in the country than waste my time on this farce.
Panama ka hangama as some media outlets call it. Although they have their own agendas but it actually sounds logical now. Initially, i would amuse on my thinking that i understand N league's plans to use media to trivialize this issue, later it became a nuisance that such a major scandal is being declared trivial but now i think i should stand and clap for shrewd N league and for commercial media's avarice.

I actually laughed at some insafians for being involved in conspiracy theories back in 2013 when they were telling us how media specially geo is being used by PMLN to win elections. Now i have to admit i was wrong and PMLN is playing is very smartly in the media. Media is the biggest weapon of this era.

 

[waqar goraya]

You know what's more sad thn Sharif family coming out clean in this case and institution failing once again? The sad truth is many people believe that this is going to be a defeat of IK and PTI. I guess the corruption is only hurting Imran Khan while the other 20 crores are living in some other country with no or little corruption. Maybe they think failure of state institutions is an issue of Imran Khan while other 20 crores are getting full insaf

I don't mind Sharifs that much, it is the system which declines to move any further.

 

[last_knight]

Burden of proof is on Nawaz, but it seems like the SC does not want to be involved in this mess anymore since the CJ is retiring.

Nonetheless, I apologize if my comment appeared to be harsh. It is very good news and I'm actually happy; the torture will end soon and I hope both parties will accept the decision, whatever it is and there will be no agar magar from either side.

Facts should not be viewed through distorted medium of our likes/dislikes.

You voted for PTI. You, and for that matter everyone, have the right to criticise Imran Khan as IK claims to be a leader hence becomes accountable to public IN PUBLIC. But criticising one person should not be an argument to praise another person per say. It's like saying that Tiger is a beast so lets befriend Wolves or vice versa.

Nothing wrong in your comments if you want to criticise IK. Sometimes it gives the impression as if you were defending/praising Nawaz Sharif through criticising IK.

Coming to the second part of your post,
"Picture abhi baqi hay meray dost". And somewhere far from courts, waves are getting turbulent. Sharifs wanted a syasi shahadat but Raheel Sharif denied that. They are now inciting New Chief. Recent developments in Indian Spy case is just the tip of this iceberg.

Commission eases out Govt and Court.
No-commission is in favour of PTI and eases out establishment.

I am expecting another episode like News-Leaks scenario before the final verdict of Panama Case.

 

[WebGuru]

Imran Khan's Interview Today

Nawaz said they have all record of purchasing the properties. Now they have changed statements.

I also owned a flat in 1983. Like they say about their 1980s' companies that the record isn't there, I could also say the same

They Said No Record Of Last 40 Years, How Come I Have All Record Of My Property & I Will Be Giving Money Trail In SC?

Nawaz says money was obtained after Jeddah mills' sale. Kids say Qatari Prince gifted them. What kind of joke is this?

We had won the case in public's court. Public had realized when NS & kids' statements had contradictions.

The whole ordeal is to somehow separate Maryam Nawaz from this case.

But Maryam Nawaz can't be separated from Nawaz because she is "dependent" on Nawaz Sharif.

If Nawaz's statement was merely a political stunt, that means they were betraying the public & the parliament. Like someone said, the Arabs gift us dates & Aab e Zam zam only but Sharif family gets properties in Mayfair as gifts.

If Panama leaks case is sorted out immediately, for it's our job as opposition, I plan to visit all over Sindh incl. Khi. If I wasn't stuck in this Panama issue, I had many Sindh tours planned inc KHI, but still I will go soon. (finally something i wanted IK to do more often)

 

[Syed1]

If Panama leaks case is sorted out immediately, for it's our job as opposition, I plan to visit all over Sindh incl. Khi. If I wasn't stuck in this Panama issue, I had many Sindh tours planned inc KHI, but still I will go soon. (finally something i wanted IK to do more often)

Despite this Panama case, I'm very very sure PML-N will still manage to get majority in Punjab even if Nawaz is disqualified. That is an unfortunate fact. If Imran wants to gain sufficient seats he has to start by gaining more seats from KPK, getting a strong foothold in Sindh and aligning himself with the independents in Baluchistan. All of this coupled with a few more seats from Punjab would be needed to form a coalition government.

 

[WebGuru]

Despite this Panama case, I'm very very sure PML-N will still manage to get majority in Punjab even if Nawaz is disqualified. That is an unfortunate fact. If Imran wants to gain sufficient seats he has to start by gaining more seats from KPK, getting a strong foothold in Sindh and aligning himself with the independents in Baluchistan. All of this coupled with a few more seats from Punjab would be needed to form a coalition government.

There are only 35 NA seats in KP and 14 NA seats in Baluchistan. Now compare that with Punjab! Even Fata+KP+Sindh+Balochistan+Isb together got only 124 seats while 148 are in Punjab. There is a reason status-quo don't want to divide punjab and isn't in favor of census.

 

[Strike!]

Despite this Panama case, I'm very very sure PML-N will still manage to get majority in Punjab even if Nawaz is disqualified. That is an unfortunate fact.

I wouldn't be so sure on that, I recently did some research with the help of this website:

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/result.html

What did I find? Politics of electables is still king outside of cities in Punjab. A candidate's personal vote bank combined with N league's vote bank got them the victory in 2013 elections. And there were a lot of seats where PTI wasn't even at second place, especially rural areas. The difference between first place and second place was around 30-50k for these second place candidates.

Now what's changed? The vast majority of those second place candidates a.k.a electables are now in PTI. So what can give PTI victory in the next elections? The same strategy N league used. Candidates personal vote bank + 20-30k vote bank of PTI.

That's why PanamaGate is so important. The PPP was damaged with the constant media barrage of corruption allegations during their tenure. Thanks to almost daily coverage of Panama issue which won't die down, even people from rural areas know what it's all about.

I will concede though, that people have short term memories, If this issue dies tomorrow N league may end up winning again.

 

[WebGuru]

I wouldn't be so sure on that, I recently did some research with the help of this website:

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/result.html

What did I find? Politics of electables is still king outside of cities in Punjab. A candidate's personal vote bank combined with N league's vote bank got them the victory in 2013 elections. And there were a lot of seats where PTI wasn't even at second place, especially rural areas. The difference between first place and second place was around 30-50k for these second place candidates.

Now what's changed? The vast majority of those second place candidates a.k.a electables are now in PTI. So what can give PTI victory in the next elections? The same strategy N league used. Candidates personal vote bank + 20-30k vote bank of PTI.

That's why PanamaGate is so important. The PPP was damaged with the constant media barrage of corruption allegations during their tenure. Thanks to almost daily coverage of Panama issue which won't die down, even people from rural areas know what it's all about.

I will concede though, that people have short term memories, If this issue dies tomorrow N league may end up winning again.

Any research on By-Elections of Punjab? I personally think PTI gained votebank in by-elections even if they didn't win most of seats in By-Elections of Punjab. Just look at the result of Lahore, Jehlum and Bhurewala where PTI lost but margin wasn't that big after fighting against a sitting govt with all the resources in hand.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Imran Khan was robbed in Khi to a certain degree and significantly in Punjab in 2013. Voters are not to be blamed for that.

But IK should be blamed for ignoring Khi after 2013 and giving ground to new forces in Khi rather than replacing Mqm.

In last by election which PPP won significantly IK and PTI did zero effort.

 

[Bewal Express]

I wouldn't be so sure on that, I recently did some research with the help of this website:

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/result.html

What did I find? Politics of electables is still king outside of cities in Punjab. A candidate's personal vote bank combined with N league's vote bank got them the victory in 2013 elections. And there were a lot of seats where PTI wasn't even at second place, especially rural areas. The difference between first place and second place was around 30-50k for these second place candidates.

Now what's changed? The vast majority of those second place candidates a.k.a electables are now in PTI. So what can give PTI victory in the next elections? The same strategy N league used. Candidates personal vote bank + 20-30k vote bank of PTI.

That's why PanamaGate is so important. The PPP was damaged with the constant media barrage of corruption allegations during their tenure. Thanks to almost daily coverage of Panama issue which won't die down, even people from rural areas know what it's all about.

I will concede though, that people have short term memories, If this issue dies tomorrow N league may end up winning again.

Its a sad fact that the Sharifs could eat babies in broad daylight and they would still win in Punjab.

 

[Strike!]

Any research on By-Elections of Punjab? I personally think PTI gained votebank in by-elections even if they didn't win most of seats in By-Elections of Punjab. Just look at the result of Lahore, Jehlum and Bhurewala where PTI lost but margin wasn't that big after fighting against a sitting govt with all the resources in hand.

Yup, In all By-elections, PTI has gained significantly. Look at these two examples:

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/NA-63.htm
http://electionpakistani.com/ge2013/bye-elections/NA-63-Jhelum.htm

PTI lost by only 10k votes in 2016 whereas they lost by more than 50 thousand votes in 2013.

Similarly have a look at Gujranwala:

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/NA-101.htm
http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/bye-elections/NA-101-Gujranwala.htm

PTI was nowhere in 2013 only getting 11k votes and N league winning by nearly 100k votes.

In 2016 by-election N league only managed to win by a mere 1K votes!!

 

[Strike!]

There are only 35 NA seats in KP and 14 NA seats in Baluchistan. Now compare that with Punjab! Even Fata+KP+Sindh+Balochistan+Isb together got only 124 seats while 148 are in Punjab. There is a reason status-quo don't want to divide punjab and isn't in favor of census.

The good news is the fact that SC has now ordered the government to conduct a census and the government has given a date of March to May 2017.

The results of this census, if performed honestly would benefit PTI a lot. It's obvious now that the population in the country has moved even more so to urban centers. The consequences of this would be devastating to status quo parties, even to the PPP. The population of Karachi and Hyderabad means they might end up losing Sindh.

 

[WebGuru]

Yup, In all By-elections, PTI has gained significantly. Look at these two examples:

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/NA-63.htm
http://electionpakistani.com/ge2013/bye-elections/NA-63-Jhelum.htm

PTI lost by only 10k votes in 2016 whereas they lost by more than 50 thousand votes in 2013.

Similarly have a look at Gujranwala:

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/NA-101.htm
http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/bye-elections/NA-101-Gujranwala.htm

PTI was nowhere in 2013 only getting 11k votes and N league winning by nearly 100k votes.

In 2016 by-election N league only managed to win by a mere 1K votes!!

These are amazing results also take a look at Bhurewala result where that female on PTI ticket lost by around 1200 votes getting 50k+ votes on a MPA seat. In Pakistan ruling party mostly win by-elections by huge margins but this is the first time an opposition party is giving a tough fight to sitting govt on many seats and even winning some this is a new trend.

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/bye-elections/PP-232-Vehari.htm

 

[WebGuru]

The good news is the fact that SC has now ordered the government to conduct a census and the government has given a date of March to May 2017.

The results of this census, if performed honestly would benefit PTI a lot. It's obvious now that the population in the country has moved even more so to urban centers. The consequences of this would be devastating to status quo parties, even to the PPP. The population of Karachi and Hyderabad means they might end up losing Sindh.

I just hope there no more delaying tactics by govt when this date comes just like they delayed LB elections date for 4 or 5 times. I am not sure if they will be enough time left for new halqa bandyan and elections reforms before GE 2018 after the census next year? PTI should focus on this issue more and also org their party at ground level. PMLN with their elected UC chairmen and councilors in Punjab will make it hard for PTI in election campaign of 2018.

PTI should focus more on Karachi because the divide in MQM will divide their votebank that is an opportunity to cash.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Its a sad fact that the Sharifs could eat babies in broad daylight and they would still win in Punjab.

If Majority public of Punjab is Sharif's Mureed or deaf & dumb followers than at 10pm on Election Day 5 hours post voting to whom was Nawaz Sharif adressing and wanting what ?

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[Strike!]

I just hope there no more delaying tactics by govt when this date comes just like they delayed LB elections date for 4 or 5 times. I am not sure if they will be enough time left for new halqa bandyan and elections reforms before GE 2018 after the census next year? PTI should focus on this issue more and also org their party at ground level. PMLN with their elected UC chairmen and councilors in Punjab will make it hard for PTI in election campaign of 2018.

PTI should focus more on Karachi because the divide in MQM will divide their votebank that is an opportunity to cash.

No more delaying tactics, the SC has specifically instructed the government that the prime minister will be held in contempt of court if he delays the proceedings. The election commission will be bound to make new electoral constituencies after that.

Ali Muhammad Khan admitted in a TV show that PTI should have focused more on this issue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poCItzTEqhM

 

[WebGuru]

No more delaying tactics, the SC has specifically instructed the government that the prime minister will be held in contempt of court if he delays the proceedings. The election commission will be bound to make new electoral constituencies after that.

Ali Muhammad Khan admitted in a TV show that PTI should have focused more on this issue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poCItzTEqhM

That's a great news and a step toward breaking status-quo. Ali is a sensible guy with law degree if i am not wrong he is a lawyer of HC. The good thing about him is that he isn't like most of PTI leaders. Some of them are good at speaking on media and legislation (Arif Alvi, Sheereen Mazari etc) and some of them are good at working on ground but Ali like Asad Omar is good in both they remain in touch with their halkas and people while also doing the media work and other party stuff in and outside the parliament.

 

[WebGuru]

If Majority public of Punjab is Sharif's Mureed or deaf & dumb followers than at 10pm on Election Day 5 hours post voting to whom was Nawaz Sharif adressing and wanting what ?

<iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/x1sq3yh" allowfullscreen></iframe><br /><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1sq3yh_nawaz-shareef-ki-mashoor-speech_news" target="_blank">Nawaz Shareef Ki Mashoor Speech</a> <i>by <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/UNewsTv" target="_blank">UNewsTv</a></i><iframe frameborder="0" width="480" height="270" src="//www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/xzsw5z" allowfullscreen></iframe><br /><a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xzsw5z_nawaz-sharif-victory-speech_news" target="_blank">Nawaz Sharif Victory Speech</a> <i>by <a href="http://www.dailymotion.com/moremag" target="_blank">moremag</a></i>

And remember how JKT result was changed? That was a the biggest joke!!!

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

And remember how JKT result was changed? That was a the biggest joke!!!

Same happened in following seats :

1. Hamid Khan (Lahore)

2. Ayaz Sadiq (Lahore)

3. Saad Rafique (Lahore)

4. Abrar ul Haq

5. Usman Dar

Etc


PTI was shoulder to shoulder with PML N in Urban Punjab but PML N was ahead of PTI in Rural punjab yet Election results were engineered and PTI was robbed of 30 - 45 seats in Punjab and 5-10 Seats in Khi.


PTI is not JI wrt Jalsa's where other party people would come to JI for Jalsa but would vote for other parties.


If you refresh your memory and go back to 2013 Election Campaign than you will find that PTI's Jalsa's in Urban Punjab gathered more Public than PML N Jalsa's. There was huge Support for IK in whole of Urban Punjab. People especially New Voters and those who did not vote in last 2-3 elections voted in huge numbers for PTI but it did not show in the results.


Thanks to the Gov School teachers, Iftikhar Chaudhry's judicial officer's, DCO's, DPO's, presiding officers, returning officers and the Punjab election commisioner.

 

[Waseem]

These are amazing results also take a look at Bhurewala result where that female on PTI ticket lost by around 1200 votes getting 50k+ votes on a MPA seat. In Pakistan ruling party mostly win by-elections by huge margins but this is the first time an opposition party is giving a tough fight to sitting govt on many seats and even winning some this is a new trend.

http://www.electionpakistani.com/ge2013/bye-elections/PP-232-Vehari.htm

Agree with you and [MENTION=48408]Strike![/MENTION] about improved performance of PTI since the 2013 elections but don't forget that better performance is mainly due to ELECTABLE candidates who have their personal votebank.
Female candidate from Burewala (Ayesha Nazir Jutt) also has personal votebank (her father was ex MPA). Aleem Khan gave the whole government run for their money only because he has personal votebank as well and Tareen won with massive lead due to same reason.

I am not saying there is anything wrong with electable candidates, i think it is an unfortunate reality that you simply can't win in some rural areas even if you are an angel. PMLN propaganda machines made huge issue about PTI accepting PMLQ candidates and then ended up awarding 10 times more tickets to PMLQ candidates themselves and today most of them are on key posts.

Imran Khan rightly/wrongly awarded tickets to many new candidates, youth candidates and he turned away many electables who joined PMLN and won the seats so Imran has realised that he has no choice but going for popular well known names especially in rural areas (should stick to likes of Waleed Iqbal, Dr Murad, Shoaib Siddiqui etc)

 

[WebGuru]

Same happened in following seats :

1. Hamid Khan (Lahore)

2. Ayaz Sadiq (Lahore)

3. Saad Rafique (Lahore)

4. Abrar ul Haq

5. Usman Dar

Etc


PTI was shoulder to shoulder with PML N in Urban Punjab but PML N was ahead of PTI in Rural punjab yet Election results were engineered and PTI was robbed of 30 - 45 seats in Punjab and 5-10 Seats in Khi.


PTI is not JI wrt Jalsa's where other party people would come to JI for Jalsa but would vote for other parties.


If you refresh your memory and go back to 2013 Election Campaign than you will find that PTI's Jalsa's in Urban Punjab gathered more Public than PML N Jalsa's. There was huge Support for IK in whole of Urban Punjab. People especially New Voters and those who did not vote in last 2-3 elections voted in huge numbers for PTI but it did not show in the results.


Thanks to the Gov School teachers, Iftikhar Chaudhry's judicial officer's, DCO's, DPO's, presiding officers, returning officers and the Punjab election commisioner.

That is the sad reality of GE 2013

 

[WebGuru]

Agree with you and [MENTION=48408]Strike![/MENTION] about improved performance of PTI since the 2013 elections but don't forget that better performance is mainly due to ELECTABLE candidates who have their personal votebank.
Female candidate from Burewala (Ayesha Nazir Jutt) also has personal votebank (her father was ex MPA). Aleem Khan gave the whole government run for their money only because he has personal votebank as well and Tareen won with massive lead due to same reason.

I am not saying there is anything wrong with electable candidates, i think it is an unfortunate reality that you simply can't win in some rural areas even if you are an angel. PMLN propaganda machines made huge issue about PTI accepting PMLQ candidates and then ended up awarding 10 times more tickets to PMLQ candidates themselves and today most of them are on key posts.

Imran Khan rightly/wrongly awarded tickets to many new candidates, youth candidates and he turned away many electables who joined PMLN and won the seats so Imran has realised that he has no choice but going for popular well known names especially in rural areas (should stick to likes of Waleed Iqbal, Dr Murad, Shoaib Siddiqui etc)

Agree with you but even IK had to admit it in the end that i can't import angels se inhi se kaam chalana perega and see only a few new faces (mostly in KP) were able to win on PTI ticket while most winners were electable candidates. And yes PTI should focus more on urban areas with new faces like Hammad and Waleed. I think IK already handed both of them Lahore as a ground to play. One is a president lahore PTI and other one is GC

 

[Strike!]

Cowardice shown by CJ in the end by not giving a decision and deferring it to the new CJ.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Cowardice shown by CJ in the end by not giving a decision and deferring it to the new CJ.

So He did all those hearings for " Chaska Baazi " ?

 

[JaDed]

The case has been made too complicated for a below average voter to follow,the bling bling CPEC,occasional catastrophes(terror and accients) and border tensions are not helping the cause,PML will probably come back.

 

[saeedhk]

As I said on a number of occasions, the SC was just not in the mood of disqualifying the PM.

 

[Strike!]

The case has been made too complicated for a below average voter to follow,the bling bling CPEC,occasional catastrophes(terror and accients) and border tensions are not helping the cause,PML will probably come back.

Not really that complicated, when it's the biggest news story every evening in political talk shows, and has remained so for the past few months.

 

[WebGuru]

Adlia azaad hai...oh wait

As someone once said insaf nae dena to yeh jo insaf ka teraazu laga rakha he ismain 2 kilo aalo tol do bhai.

 

[WebGuru]

Our upcoming CJ's comments a few months:

کرمنل جسٹس سسٹم ناکام ہونیکی بات کرتےہیں،میں سارےجسٹس سسٹم سےناامید ہوں، جسٹس ثاقب نثار

So when your CJ is saying this about your justice system thn there is really something wrong...

 

[Waseem]

So chief justice sahab didn't have guts to resolve the case and chickened out just when people were expecting a decision (possibly after couple of more hearings).

Imran Khan was clearly disappointed but kept his cool showing complete confidence in new Chief Justice and Supreme court.

What's beyond ridiculous is if a new bench if formed and they start from scratch (as some suggested).

Anyway for some people, it's Imran Khan's personal loss but in reality Pakistani institutions and their weaknesses are getting exposed one by one. Parliament is being called a political speech platform by Prime minister himself and Supreme court seems too scared to take action against the powerful elite.

 

[WebGuru]

So chief justice sahab didn't have guts to resolve the case and chickened out just when people were expecting a decision (possibly after couple of more hearings).

Imran Khan was clearly disappointed but kept his cool showing complete confidence in new Chief Justice and Supreme court.

What's beyond ridiculous is if a new bench if formed and they start from scratch (as some suggested).

Anyway for some people, it's Imran Khan's personal loss but in reality Pakistani institutions and their weaknesses are getting exposed one by one. Parliament is being called a political speech platform by Prime minister himself and Supreme court seems too scared to take action against the powerful elite.

The system is failing and sending Imran back to roads again because there is no choice left when your institutions are so weak that they can't even decide what to do the only choice left is coming on roads.

 

[MRSN]

So these judges didn't have courage to call a spade a spade. This is the real picture of our courts. The moment there is a big fish to catch they find excuses to not catch them. Nawaz Sharif has been pretty much established as corrupt and liar. Should have been disqualified.

 

[WebGuru]

So these judges didn't have courage to call a spade a spade. This is the real picture of our courts. The moment there is a big fish to catch they find excuses to not catch them. Nawaz Sharif has been pretty much established as corrupt and liar. Should have been disqualified.

And now people people will ask IK to respect these so called institutions and don't come on roads because only that is bad everything else is fine.

PM can lie in Parliament and Parliament is being used for amendments to save ruling family.

NAB/FIA, FBR acting like slaves of the ruling family instead of state institutions.

SC don't have any courage to give a decision.

Every institution in the country is in mess.

and we are told respect this system? and give this democrazy a long run the same democracy that's acting like a dictatorship and not even able to show us a couple of steps in right direction after 9 years?

DEMOCRACY WITHOUT ACCOUNTABILITY IS A BIG JOKE

 

[Syed1]

Where are all those Mamoon types who were suggesting that Imran not go on the streets and instead help the institutions come to a decision?


These useless judges weren't even man enough to call a spade a spade.



Dafa karo yaar.. Kya umeed lagani is mulk se.

 

[Waseem]

Where are all those Mamoon types who were suggesting that Imran not go on the streets and instead help the institutions come to a decision?


These useless judges weren't even man enough to call a spade a spade.



Dafa karo yaar.. Kya umeed lagani is mulk se.

Naye chief justice sahab Nawaz Sharif k cases lar chukay hain, ab umeed lagao meray bhai

 

[WebGuru]

Naye chief justice sahab Nawaz Sharif k cases lar chukay hain, ab umeed lagao meray bhai

He was Federal Law Secretary when Mian Sahab attacked Supreme Court in 1997

 

[Bewal Express]

The SC court is every bit as corrupt as the people they are supposed to be judging. Judges didnt want brief cases they want suit cases of money. The PTI should not legitimise the whole facade.

 

[srh]

Another defeat to Imran Khan by Nawaz Sharif.

This was not a fight against corruption. Check this out: Both the people of accused party (PML-N) and the accuser party (PTI) have off shore companies. Honest people are sidelined in both PML-N and PTI and those who have self respect eventually left. Basically it was a fight between 2 corrupt entities: a big corrupt PML-N vs a small corrupt PTI. And the big corrupt PML-N win because the small corrupt PTI is incompetent.

We should not expect the leaders of Pakistan to be corruption free when the general public is largely corrupt. The leaders are representative of general public and they cannot exist in a vacuum. The change should happen from bottom to top. Once the general public is fairly corruption free then Pakistan will get better leaders. Until then you would get the likes of Zardari, Nawaz Sharif, Imran Khan etc.

 

[waqar goraya]

Another defeat to Imran Khan by Nawaz Sharif.

This was not a fight against corruption. Check this out: Both the people of accused party (PML-N) and the accuser party (PTI) have off shore companies. Honest people are sidelined in both PML-N and PTI and those who have self respect eventually left. Basically it was a fight between 2 corrupt entities: a big corrupt PML-N vs a small corrupt PTI. And the big corrupt PML-N win because the small corrupt PTI is incompetent.

We should not expect the leaders of Pakistan to be corruption free when the general public is largely corrupt. The leaders are representative of general public and they cannot exist in a vacuum. The change should happen from bottom to top. Once the general public is fairly corruption free then Pakistan will get better leaders. Until then you would get the likes of Zardari, Nawaz Sharif, Imran Khan etc.

You keep surprising here with your inconsistent and illogical observations.

What more could have pti done in court room that you are calling them incompetent?

The general public can't be fairly corruption free when the chain of corruption starts from the top.

 

[srh]

You keep surprising here with your inconsistent and illogical observations.

What more could have pti done in court room that you are calling them incompetent?

The general public can't be fairly corruption free when the chain of corruption starts from the top.

For each one are successive [angels] before and behind him who protect him by the decree of Allah . Indeed, Allah will not change the condition of a people until they change what is in themselves. And when Allah intends for a people ill, there is no repelling it. And there is not for them besides Him any patron.

The Holy Quran 13:11

Change has to come from bottom to top.

 

[Syed1]

For each one are successive [angels] before and behind him who protect him by the decree of Allah . Indeed, Allah will not change the condition of a people until they change what is in themselves. And when Allah intends for a people ill, there is no repelling it. And there is not for them besides Him any patron.

The Holy Quran 13:11

Change has to come from bottom to top.

Change can never come from bottom to top. Stop living in utopia. A peon will never stop cutting corners or a hawaldaar will never stop taking rishwat unless the person above him is clean and enforces the rules and regulations.


It is in Nooras favour for status quo to remain.

I'm surprised a person like you, who has experienced western democracy still favours gunday badmash like Nooras.

 

[Syed1]

Naye chief justice sahab Nawaz Sharif k cases lar chukay hain, ab umeed lagao meray bhai

Allah mian se hi faryaad kar saktay hain ab, aur tou koi hul nahi.

 

[Abdullah719]

Guys, some important news coming through...







Wait for it...

Let's applaud our fantastic media.

 

[WebGuru]

Guys, some important news coming through...







Wait for it...

Let's applaud our fantastic media.

and the anchors were asking questions like phr kia hua? kia wo nange paon thai? unhone ne bani gaala tak ka safar kese kya

Usman Dar was the one to come ahead and give his chappal to Kaptaan and traveled nange paon from court building to parking

 

[Muhammad10]

Guys, some important news coming through...







Wait for it...

Let's applaud our fantastic media.

Ain't no chappal like a "Kaptaan Chappal".

 

[waqar goraya]

For each one are successive [angels] before and behind him who protect him by the decree of Allah . Indeed, Allah will not change the condition of a people until they change what is in themselves. And when Allah intends for a people ill, there is no repelling it. And there is not for them besides Him any patron.

The Holy Quran 13:11

Change has to come from bottom to top.

Change has always came from minority to majority or from top to bottom. The verse itself does not describe the process to achieve the goal of goodness. It talks about the end but not about the process.

 

[Waseem]

and the anchors were asking questions like phr kia hua? kia wo nange paon thai? unhone ne bani gaala tak ka safar kese kya

Usman Dar was the one to come ahead and give his chappal to Kaptaan and traveled nange paon from court building to parking

Remember what i said bro, Nawaz Sharif's game is simple, you can steal billions and billions, all you need to do is accuse your opposition of corruption even though there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in their case against Imran but it is more than enough to keep typical patwari/noora happy (this thread is good example). They proudly say "hamara leader AALHAMDULILLAH ALHAMDULILLAH corrupt hai tou kuch doosra bhi shaid corrupt ho so this justifies my support for corrupt people but i will keep pretending i hate corruption

 

[Mamoon]

As expected, Imran threatens to take to the streets if justice is denied and his star lawyer says they will boycott any commission formed by the SC.

The problem is that justice would be what Imran thinks is justice, and justice to him is total surrender before his whims. He apparently does not understand that the SC will decide according to the law and not on his wishes.

This is not understandable specially when the SC has yet to decide on the case or the commission. Imran Khan is threatening the SC and there can be no two opinions about it. The SC is correct when it says that it has to tread carefully simply because once they decide there is no appeal facility available to either party.

As far as the commission is considered, again if they deem it necessary to make one to ensure that every detail is discussed then let them form one, what is the problem? If it goes against Nawaz he would be given ample opportunity to explain his case and will not be in a position to get into the agar mugars.

 

[saeedhk]

Another defeat to Imran Khan by Nawaz Sharif.

This was not a fight against corruption. Check this out: Both the people of accused party (PML-N) and the accuser party (PTI) have off shore companies. Honest people are sidelined in both PML-N and PTI and those who have self respect eventually left. Basically it was a fight between 2 corrupt entities: a big corrupt PML-N vs a small corrupt PTI. And the big corrupt PML-N win because the small corrupt PTI is incompetent.

We should not expect the leaders of Pakistan to be corruption free when the general public is largely corrupt. The leaders are representative of general public and they cannot exist in a vacuum. The change should happen from bottom to top. Once the general public is fairly corruption free then Pakistan will get better leaders. Until then you would get the likes of Zardari, Nawaz Sharif, Imran Khan etc.

This matter concerns the whole of Pakistan; illogical to portray it as being one party against the another. Even if we disregard everything else, the PM admitted that he lied to the public on the floor of the parliament. That should be enough for any sane headed person to see the light.

From what I have seen after being to Pakistan, people support the PML-N for two reasons; they are personally benefiting from corrupt and rotten system or their relatives are benefiting from it.

 

[Pakpak]

As expected, Imran threatens to take to the streets if justice is denied and his star lawyer says they will boycott any commission formed by the SC.

The problem is that justice would be what Imran thinks is justice, and justice to him is total surrender before his whims. He apparently does not understand that the SC will decide according to the law and not on his wishes.

This is not understandable specially when the SC has yet to decide on the case or the commission. Imran Khan is threatening the SC and there can be no two opinions about it. The SC is correct when it says that it has to tread carefully simply because once they decide there is no appeal facility available to either party.

As far as the commission is considered, again if they deem it necessary to make one to ensure that every detail is discussed then let them form one, what is the problem? If it goes against Nawaz he would be given ample opportunity to explain his case and will not be in a position to get into the agar mugars.

''According to the law'' he has no case, his own lawyer admitted they can't provide money trail, ANY of it. Its an open and shut case, unless someone is completely blinkered. Which, then again, you are.

 

[Mamoon]

''According to the law'' he has no case, his own lawyer admitted they can't provide money trail, ANY of it. Its an open and shut case, unless someone is completely blinkered. Which, then again, you are.

That is not for you, me or anyone but the SC to decide. If Imran does not accept the decision of the SC and takes to the streets again, he is effectively denouncing the constitution and if he is doing so, why doesn't he declare a revolution? If he does, I hope you will get off the Internet and join him in the streets.

However, we both know he doesn't have the cojones for that. It will simply be a repeat of his previous rallies, i.e. empty rhetoric, calls for the Army to intervene and a flurry of U-Turns. After a few months when nothing will come out of it, he will look for an exit strategy and things will fizzle out.

In the 2018 Elections, if he doesn't win the majority again, he will again take to the streets and demand his version of justice.

There are only two possible solutions to end this drama. He either declares a revolution, or he simply puts his ego aside and accepts the verdict of the SC. Otherwise if he continues to play the game he is currently playing, this drama will never end. He cannot pick and choose when to have faith in the system. He cannot call the NA fake, yet PTI members draw salaries and utilize its privileges.

It is simply really. Accept the system or denounce it, but don't beat around the bush which is what he has been doing since 2013. If he doesn't believe in the SC and wants to take matters into his own hands, then he should do it the proper way.

 

[Waseem]

Another defeat to Imran Khan by Nawaz Sharif.

So when this murderer wadera Shahrukh Jataoi was waving the VICTORY signs showing the middle finger to whole Pakistan after murdering an innocent Shahzaib Khan, we should have celebrated his victory as well hmmm.........WINNERS INDEED!

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

So when this murderer wadera Shahrukh Jataoi was waving the VICTORY signs showing the middle finger to whole Pakistan after murdering an innocent Shahzaib Khan, we should have celebrated his victory as well hmmm.........WINNERS INDEED!

View attachment 70902

Bhai how is this case going of Shahzaib Khan i have not followed it lately?

 

[Waseem]

Bhai how is this case going of Shahzaib Khan i have not followed it lately?

I think their parents pardoned the killer after wasting their time in courts for many years just like Zain's family who was murdered by Mustafa Kanju (also belongs to influencial family) in Lahore.

As per some people, Jatoi and Kanju are victorious and families of Shahzaib and Zain are losers.

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

I think their parents pardoned the killer after wasting their time in courts for many years just like Zain's family who was murdered by Mustafa Kanju (also belongs to influencial family) in Lahore.

As per some people, Jatoi and Kanju are victorious and families of Shahzaib and Zain are losers.

thanks i dont have much to say except that the systeem has to change in pakistan mayby some day in shaa allah

 

[Bewal Express]

I think their parents pardoned the killer after wasting their time in courts for many years just like Zain's family who was murdered by Mustafa Kanju (also belongs to influencial family) in Lahore.

As per some people, Jatoi and Kanju are victorious and families of Shahzaib and Zain are losers.

Well put bro, it shows the stupidity of Nooras and their logic, when they see getting away with theft and criminality as a victory. IK may have been cheated out of justice by a corrupt SC, where the CJ was more interested in his future earning potential than justice but remember Nooras, Allah is the best of planners.

 

[Bewal Express]

thanks i dont have much to say except that the systeem has to change in pakistan mayby some day in shaa allah

When you have criminals running the country and SC there to protect them, nothing short of a revolution will change this system.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

A particular segment of Society wants a Commision to be formed. They know the history of all the Commisions from 1947 to 2016 very very well.

What they intend is that the Commision as usual gets swayed away due to
" Doctrine of Necessity " or
" MuqMuqqa " or " Brief/Suit Cases " so that than


They can all ridicule Imran Khan and PTI and call him as guilty, liar, false accuser, hypocrite and someone who defamed nation democracy and Ashraafia of country.

 

[pakistan cricket fan]

When you have criminals running the country and SC there to protect them, nothing short of a revolution will change this system.

I agree with you bhai

 

[WebGuru]

Remember what i said bro, Nawaz Sharif's game is simple, you can steal billions and billions, all you need to do is accuse your opposition of corruption even though there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in their case against Imran but it is more than enough to keep typical patwari/noora happy (this thread is good example). They proudly say "hamara leader AALHAMDULILLAH ALHAMDULILLAH corrupt hai tou kuch doosra bhi shaid corrupt ho so this justifies my support for corrupt people but i will keep pretending i hate corruption

Ulta chor kotwal ko daante was probably said for sharifs and their supporters...