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Predict the outcome of the England versus India Test series in 2021

Last time it was 4-1 to England
But the series was so closer than what the scorecard tells.

India lost all 5 tosses.
England dominated the 2nd test
India dominated the 3rd test
And the rest of the matches could have gone either way.

This time I'm pretty sure India will win the series by 3-2 if they win a couple of toss.
 
4-1 in favor of India if we can dump Kohli as captain. 2-3 if Kohli is captain I think.
 
5-0 to England...all 5 matches are going to be over inside 2 or max 3 days...
 
Indian batting is aging and on last legs- mainly Pujara and Rahane. Will be changing of the guard moment
 
2-2 draw, or 3-1 India. The Indian fast bowlers will relish the conditions, whereas India's victory in Australia under duress will ensure that there's no lack of belief in the camp.
 
Eng should win it. It will be interesting if Ind wins most tosses.
 
Depends on the time of the year and availability of thakur and pandya
India missed b kumar a swing bowling allrounder last series . Now india does have few test all round bowling options -
Pant with thakur / pandya , jadeja/ ashwin Shami siraj bumrah and Ishant make a decent lower order . Addition of sundar and vihari will be great for the team . Rohit / gill / agrawal / rahul are decent openers . Pujara and Kohli will do well . Rahane does well abroad ..

All in all india stands to benifit from the new all rounders emerging as last series was won by England’s lower order . Feel india will win 3-2 .
 
I actually think India might surprise us just like Australia did in the last Ashes in England. I'm pessimistic about the WTC final but before this series starts, India would have played one test against a high quality opposition (New Zealand) and two 4 day practice matches ahead of the test series. And unlike the previous times, when India used to play some random teenagers in the Essex 2nd XI for warm up matches as counties used to refuse to release their top players for the practice matches so as to keep them fresh for the County championship, the Indian management has decided to play the two practice matches between India and India A, just like Australia did ahead of the Ashes in 2019.

India just need a few tosses to go their way badly as they have an absolute horrid record in tosses won against England in the last 10-15 tests. Last time India lost all the tosses in the 5 tests and ran England close in almost all tests. They could've won all the tests they lost except the one at Lords if they had batted a bit better. The Indian bowling will do very well like they did last time as well, but India's chances depends on if the Indian batting can adapt to the conditions well, which they failed to do last time. I don't think India's going to win the WTC final, but I wouldn't be surprised if the series that comes afterwards ends a 2-2 draw tbh.
 
I would say that there is liable to be a drawn match somewhere, except that neither of these teams can bat. So there will be low scoring victories.

At least the England management know what bowlers to pick in England.

This England side will be more robust that the one that faced India in 2018. Crawley will do well. They have identified the correct spinner in Leach.

If the sun shines I can see India putting up a good fight. If it’s murky and overcast, England will win.

I think 3-2 England.

Here is my test side:

Hameed
Sibley
Crawley
Root
Stokes
Lawrence
Buttler (though I would prefer Foakes)
Woakes / Curran
Leach
Stone
Anderson / Broad
 
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Robert said:
I would say that there is liable to be a drawn match somewhere, except that neither of these teams can bat. So there will be low scoring victories.

At least the England management know what bowlers to pick in England.

This England side will be more robust that the one that faced India in 2018. Crawley will do well. They have identified the correct spinner in Leach.

If the sun shines I can see India putting up a good fight. If it’s murky and overcast, England will win.

I think 3-2 England.

Here is my test side:

Hameed
Sibley
Crawley
Root
Stokes
Lawrence
Buttler (though I would prefer Foakes)
Woakes / Curran
Leach
Stone
Anderson / Broad
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No reason not to play Anderson and Broad together in England.
 
Would rather England play both Broad and Anderson and one of Archer/Stone.
 
Selection issues, poor captaincy, Designer seaming pitches, poor luck with tosses,, an ageing, declining batting lineup. Yeah I can 5-0 Engkand already.
 
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Long series so both teams but especially India, because they are the touring side, have to plan for attrition and battle casualties.

I see the following players featuring at some point in this series for India.

Gill, Brohit, KLR as openers

Kohli, Pujara, Rahane, Vihari, Pant in middle order

Sundar, Ashwin, Jadeja as spin A/Rs

Hardik, Shardul as pace A/Rs

Bumrah, Shami, Ishant, Siraj as quicks

Hopeful that India would draw the series.
 
3-1 England, very tough to beat England at home over 4/5 test matches. Can see some close games like last time but ultimately someone like Sam Curran will make a name for themselves again :ashwin:vk1
 
Nikhil_cric said:
Selection issues, poor captaincy, Designer seaming pitches, poor luck with tosses,, an ageing, declining batting lineup. Yeah I can 5-0 Engkand already.
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I can tell you that the wickets will be...

Trent Bridge - slow seamer
Lord’s - slow seamer
Headingley - shirt front
Oval - harder, taking spin later
Old Trafford - like the Oval.

England best chance will be to go 2-0 on the early seamers and then hang in. If there is a draw it will be at Headingley. India can come from behind on the last two tracks in dry September, particularly if the summer is hot.
 
Robert said:
I can tell you that the wickets will be...

Trent Bridge - slow seamer
Lord’s - slow seamer
Headingley - shirt front
Oval - harder, taking spin later
Old Trafford - like the Oval.

England best chance will be to go 2-0 on the early seamers and then hang in. If there is a draw it will be at Headingley. India can come from behind on the last two tracks in dry September, particularly if the summer is hot.
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What’s a shirt front?

I would be absolutely disappointed if England don’t roll out green damp and swinging conditions across all tests. Just do what india did... play to your strengths
 
Unlike previous tours , India will be well accustomed to English pitches due to the WTC final in June. They will have at least 1 month to prepare in England

So this has to be best chance for India to beat England in England since 2007

Key issues will be selection issues. On green seaming pitches like Trentbridge , Lords' , Shardul Thakur should be the allrounder not Ravindra Jadeja. Also hope Bumrah & Shami are fit for entire 5 test series

At Oval we should play 2 spinners
 
Robert said:
I can tell you that the wickets will be...

Trent Bridge - slow seamer
Lord’s - slow seamer
Headingley - shirt front
Oval - harder, taking spin later
Old Trafford - like the Oval.

England best chance will be to go 2-0 on the early seamers and then hang in. If there is a draw it will be at Headingley. India can come from behind on the last two tracks in dry September, particularly if the summer is hot.
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IMO Oval and Old Trafford are the best 2 wickets we see in England for batting in particular with the bounce staying true. I saw a picture someone which said that Old Trafford and the Oval are the 2 bounciest pitches in England. Shame there isn't a match in Edgbaston always a good watch there!
 
NoBallZombie said:
What’s a shirt front?

I would be absolutely disappointed if England don’t roll out green damp and swinging conditions across all tests. Just do what india did... play to your strengths
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They can’t control the weather. The two seamers will be early in the summer so there will be probably be rain about and the tracks will be soft and the seam will grip.

Shirt front means a track that is good for batting. It might swing there if the clouds march in, but there will not be much deviation off the seam and true bounce. YCCC have sorted out that variable bounce minefield they had in the eighties and nineties.
 
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NishanKonar said:
Unlike previous tours , India will be well accustomed to English pitches due to the WTC final in June. They will have at least 1 month to prepare in England

So this has to be best chance for India to beat England in England since 2007

Key issues will be selection issues. On green seaming pitches like Trentbridge , Lords' , Shardul Thakur should be the allrounder not Ravindra Jadeja. Also hope Bumrah & Shami are fit for entire 5 test series

At Oval we should play 2 spinners
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This will be a real dilemma. English batsmen are absolutely clueless vs Indian spinners.
It will be a real temptation to play spinners in all 5 test matches
 
sindhiboy said:
This will be a real dilemma. English batsmen are absolutely clueless vs Indian spinners.
It will be a real temptation to play spinners in all 5 test matches
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Playing 2 spinners on green seaming wickets will be disaster - like Lord's Test in 2018
 
Ideally our bowling attack should be :

Bumrah
Shami
Siraj / Ishant
Shardul / Pandya
Ashwin / Jadeja
 
Robert said:
I would say that there is liable to be a drawn match somewhere, except that neither of these teams can bat. So there will be low scoring victories.

At least the England management know what bowlers to pick in England.

This England side will be more robust that the one that faced India in 2018. Crawley will do well. They have identified the correct spinner in Leach.

If the sun shines I can see India putting up a good fight. If it’s murky and overcast, England will win.

I think 3-2 England.

Here is my test side:

Hameed
Sibley
Crawley
Root
Stokes
Lawrence
Buttler (though I would prefer Foakes)
Woakes / Curran
Leach
Stone
Anderson / Broad
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Surely Moeen should play considering his previous heroics against India and the fact that he has ~64 wickets at ~25, in his last 12 tests. His batting seems to have come back as well.

Additionally, Bairstow did not look terrible. He is a proven veteran and should do better in home conditions while Sibley looked shot.

Hameed
Crawley
Bairstow
Root
Stokes
Buttler
Moeen
Woakes
Leach/Archer
Stone/Broad
Anderson

India meanwhile, should line up like this:

Rahul
Gill
Pujara
Kohli
Rahane
Pant
Pandya/Ashwin
Jadeja/Axar
Shami/Ishant
Siraj
Bumrah
 
Robert said:
In India. Ashwin has just 14 wickets in six tests in England.

Quick bowlers are the way to go.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but the English pitches in June-August should assist the spinners on days 4 and 5.
 
5-0 England.

I will go with below team:-

Hitman
Gill/Vihari
Pujara
Kohli
Rahane
Pants(wkt) :inti
Jadeja
Ashwin
Ishant
Siraj
Bumrah

Rest of squad - Shami, Bhuvi, KL, Vihari(I really think he will do well there), Pandya, Sundar, Shardul.
 
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5-0 india. India just need to turn up, win the toss and will win all 5 tests.

From 1 to 11 india has greatest players world has ever seen in history of game.

England should just be proud to hosting such a team.

Kohli will out out captain root

Ashwin will take 10 wickets each test and 100 with bat in each match and will go down as worlds greatest all rounder.

England may even just forfeit the series after a few tests because they wont be able to compete.
 
Bilal7 said:
Surely Moeen should play considering his previous heroics against India and the fact that he has ~64 wickets at ~25, in his last 12 tests. His batting seems to have come back as well.

Additionally, Bairstow did not look terrible. He is a proven veteran and should do better in home conditions while Sibley looked shot.

Hameed
Crawley
Bairstow
Root
Stokes
Buttler
Moeen
Woakes
Leach/Archer
Stone/Broad
Anderson

India meanwhile, should line up like this:

Rahul
Gill
Pujara
Kohli
Rahane
Pant
Pandya/Ashwin
Jadeja/Axar
Shami/Ishant
Siraj
Bumrah
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Bairstow at 3?? His battings worse than a tail enders. Should never play test cricket again.
 
India will win the series if they keep their nerve. England's batting is just weak. For Ind to win in England,they will have to bat 1st, if they don't, England will be stronger
 
Amjid Javed said:
Bairstow at 3?? His battings worse than a tail enders. Should never play test cricket again.
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He's better than anything England have at the moment and is a world class batsman if he rediscovers his 2016 form.
 
As per usual the "excuse" of the toss being used by indian fans in this thread.

Sore loser mentality, if this teams that good they should be able to win games regardless of the toss.

Yet only reason india ever loses in uk is because of toss.

4-0, 3-1 and 4-1 would have all been india white wash wins instead if they had won tosses.
 
Bilal7 said:
He's better than anything England have at the moment and is a world class batsman if he rediscovers his 2016 form.
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Bairstow has never been world class in test cricket. His technic has got worse and worse in test cricket because of him playing more white ball cricket.

The number of times hes clean bowled or lbw is not acceptable for a so called top 6 batsmen in england team.
 
Amjid Javed said:
Bairstow has never been world class in test cricket. His technic has got worse and worse in test cricket because of him playing more white ball cricket.

The number of times hes clean bowled or lbw is not acceptable for a so called top 6 batsmen in england team.
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He was a world class batsman in the 2016 season. Go check the numbers he was putting up.
 
Bilal7 said:
He was a world class batsman in the 2016 season. Go check the numbers he was putting up.
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World class isnt about 1 good year with the bat. Its about consistant performance year after year.

Against all top sides. All bairstow did was have a good patch of scoring and otherwise has been poor.

I say this as a yorkshiremen and yorkshire fan hez never been world class in tests.
 
Bairstow averages 58 with bat in 2016 for that one year. Every other year hes averaged less than 35.

Average of 22/23 in last 22 tests is shameful.

Average player not even a good one.
 
Bilal7 said:
Correct me if I'm wrong but the English pitches in June-August should assist the spinners on days 4 and 5.
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I don’t think so, they will be damp seamers for the full five days, they won’t break up.

Ashwin’s best chance is in the September tests when the wickets may be baking and crumbling.
 
Amjid Javed said:
World class isnt about 1 good year with the bat. Its about consistant performance year after year.

Against all top sides. All bairstow did was have a good patch of scoring and otherwise has been poor.

I say this as a yorkshiremen and yorkshire fan hez never been world class in tests.
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Robert said:
I concur [MENTION=129948]Bilal7[/MENTION]. He’s a ODI specialist these days.
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Fair enough. I watched England play tests a lot in 2016 and Bairstow did very well that year. It is true that he hasn't come close to replicating that again.
 
The last series was pretty even in terms of the games were competative. The difference was players like curran and a few others stepped up at vital stages whereas indias players didnt.

Englands top order batting isnt great but they will have the likes of buttler, woakes, curran again who could do a rescue job again as i can see indian bowlers doing damage early on.

Big difference for india this time is there lower order pant, ashwin, sundar etc.. can also do a similar job. So this means that if they get into tight situations in this series they wont choke and there fans start crying like sore losers blaming the toss as per usual or because the weather was cloudy or player x y z was missing.
 
3-2 to England. And the games will be very tightly contested. Expect green pitches with collapses on both sides. India needs B Kumar. I don't think Shami is as good as BK on those pitches. I know BK is down in the pecking order and not sure if he's even in contention. Will be interesting to see if they pick Ashwin or Jadeja. Gill and Rohit can be walking wickets on swinging conditions. So burden will fall on Kohli, Pujara and Pant.
 
Bewal Express said:
India will win the series if they keep their nerve. England's batting is just weak. For Ind to win in England,they will have to bat 1st, if they don't, England will be stronger
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I think India should bat 2nd for a better chance. They can avoid Anderson on a fresh pitch and this team isn't bad chasing targets.
 
rhony said:
I think India should bat 2nd for a better chance. They can avoid Anderson on a fresh pitch and this team isn't bad chasing targets.
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England bat well in English conditions just like NZ do at home. This English team is there for the beating and I can't see anything but a comfortable Ind victory.
 
Amjid Javed said:
As per usual the "excuse" of the toss being used by indian fans in this thread.

Sore loser mentality, if this teams that good they should be able to win games regardless of the toss.

Yet only reason india ever loses in uk is because of toss.

4-0, 3-1 and 4-1 would have all been india white wash wins instead if they had won tosses.
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1. You should have just quoted my post.

2. India lost the Edgbaston test by 30 runs and Southampton test by 60 runs. Both tests were very even at all days and India even took a first innings lead at the Ageas Bowl. Ultimately though, the batting failed to chase a 200 odd total at Edgbaston and a 250 odd total at Southampton.

But if you had watched the series, it was a tale of two flawed batting sides and strong bowling sides. India were in with a very good chance of winning nearly all the tests they lost (except the 2nd test at Lords) on the final day of those tests. It is not out of the world to think that had England batted last in some tests, they could have failed to chase whatever total that India set them in their 3rd innings in at least some of the matches as the English batting struggled badly in that series too. Generally you expect to win at least 1-2 toss in a 5 match series and losing all the 5 tosses in a series is extreme bad luck by any measure (you're not acknowledging it only because it's India). In fact, had Root not been stupid enough to send India to bat first at Trent Bridge despite winning the toss, they could have whitewashed India, but they ended up losing that test by 200+ runs.

3. ATG teams like the great Australian side or the West Indian side take toss out of the equation and could win irrespective of the toss. The current Indian side is far from that status. The Indian batting is not consistent enough for the current Indian team to take the toss out of the equation. They did go on to win the series in Australia after losing the toss at Melbourne, Sydney and Brisbane, but I thought that was more of an inspired performance and I'm not sure if the team has moved up a notch in quality.

The current side is an ATG side in home conditions and would beat most sides at home irrespective of whether they win or lose the toss. But they're not yet at a level to take toss out of the equation outside asia. If they end up doing it, then they would rank up there with the great Australian and West Indian sides but they're far from that level at the moment.

4. No, India got absolutely clobbered in those 4-0 and 3-1 defeats in England in 2011 and 2014 and toss wouldn't have made a result in any of those tests because the gulf in quality was big in those two series. But if anyone reads just the scorelines, he would probably think the 3-1 loss in 2014 was much closer than the 4-1 defeat in 2018 but one couldn't be more wrong. The 4-1 defeat 3 years back was not at all reflective of the competitiveness of the series and if a few things had went India's way, India could have easily won the series 3-2.

Finally you seem to have an axe to grind against the Indian team, particularly after India's performance in Australia. Full marks for your patriotism, but pointing out India was unlucky with the toss in England does not mean England did not deserve to win the series. You would probably talk about the toss too if your captain kept losing the toss particularly in overseas tests when you badly need some luck to go your way to level the difference in conditions. I mean, Kohli (and Rahane) has lost 13 tosses in the last 18 tests outside Asia. India probably have the worst toss win percentage out of all teams in world cricket, so please forgive us Indian fans if we go on a rant about the unmatched panautiness of Kohli when he inevitably loses another toss in the next overseas test.
 
Bewal Express said:
England bat well in English conditions just like NZ do at home. This English team is there for the beating and I can't see anything but a comfortable Ind victory.
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What are you basing that on, given the difficulty modern Indian batters face against the moving ball?
 
street cricketer said:
1. You should have just quoted my post.

2. India lost the Edgbaston test by 30 runs and Southampton test by 60 runs. Both tests were very even at all days and India even took a first innings lead at the Ageas Bowl. Ultimately though, the batting failed to chase a 200 odd total at Edgbaston and a 250 odd total at Southampton.

But if you had watched the series, it was a tale of two flawed batting sides and strong bowling sides. India were in with a very good chance of winning nearly all the tests they lost (except the 2nd test at Lords) on the final day of those tests. It is not out of the world to think that had England batted last in some tests, they could have failed to chase whatever total that India set them in their 3rd innings in at least some of the matches as the English batting struggled badly in that series too. Generally you expect to win at least 1-2 toss in a 5 match series and losing all the 5 tosses in a series is extreme bad luck by any measure (you're not acknowledging it only because it's India). In fact, had Root not been stupid enough to send India to bat first at Trent Bridge despite winning the toss, they could have whitewashed India, but they ended up losing that test by 200+ runs.

3. ATG teams like the great Australian side or the West Indian side take toss out of the equation and could win irrespective of the toss. The current Indian side is far from that status. The Indian batting is not consistent enough for the current Indian team to take the toss out of the equation. They did go on to win the series in Australia after losing the toss at Melbourne, Sydney and Brisbane, but I thought that was more of an inspired performance and I'm not sure if the team has moved up a notch in quality.

The current side is an ATG side in home conditions and would beat most sides at home irrespective of whether they win or lose the toss. But they're not yet at a level to take toss out of the equation outside asia. If they end up doing it, then they would rank up there with the great Australian and West Indian sides but they're far from that level at the moment.

4. No, India got absolutely clobbered in those 4-0 and 3-1 defeats in England in 2011 and 2014 and toss wouldn't have made a result in any of those tests because the gulf in quality was big in those two series. But if anyone reads just the scorelines, he would probably think the 3-1 loss in 2014 was much closer than the 4-1 defeat in 2018 but one couldn't be more wrong. The 4-1 defeat 3 years back was not at all reflective of the competitiveness of the series and if a few things had went India's way, India could have easily won the series 3-2.

Finally you seem to have an axe to grind against the Indian team, particularly after India's performance in Australia. Full marks for your patriotism, but pointing out India was unlucky with the toss in England does not mean England did not deserve to win the series. You would probably talk about the toss too if your captain kept losing the toss particularly in overseas tests when you badly need some luck to go your way to level the difference in conditions. I mean, Kohli (and Rahane) has lost 13 tosses in the last 18 tests outside Asia. India probably have the worst toss win percentage out of all teams in world cricket, so please forgive us Indian fans if we go on a rant about the unmatched panautiness of Kohli when he inevitably loses another toss in the next overseas test.
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The difference between england and india in the last series was that england players stepped up at key intervals in the game.

1st test - indias batsmen at fault for failing to chase 194.

2nd test - pathetic effort with bat in both inns by india.

3rd test - india wins because there batsmen finally put some runs on the board in both inns.

4th test - india had england 86/6 yet let them get 250. 2nd inns england 122/5 yet got 270.

So on both occasions indias bowlers failure to kill england off in either inns. If they had done that in just 1 inns they would have won the game.

5th test - england 181/7 got up to 332 in 1st inns. So once again indias bowlers in ability to get through englands lower order.

England have players like stokes butler curran rashid woakes etc.. so they bailed the team out. Indias tail in comparision was pathetic.

Now with pant ashwin sundar etc.. they might actually be able to turn losses into wins.

Facts - india lost 1st two tests because of poor batting.

India lost last 2 tests because bowlers didnt do there jobs.

Nothing to do with the toss, weather, luck.

India failed to perform as a team combined in 4 put of the 5 tests. Either the batting or bowling didnt do the job.

So when indian fans stop crying like sore losers about toss, weather, luck etc.. opposition fans will give you some respect.

Now the so callef axe to grind. Go have a look at prediction thread for Aus vs india. I was one of few cricket fans to say dont write india off they will be competative in Australia.

I congratulated india when they won..yet fans go overboard with GOAT status based on just australia performances. The results in NZ SA and Eng at same time are nothing short of poor for a so called talented team.

Yet rather than acknowledge that all indian fans start making excuses, toss, luck. Facts are you werent gud enough to win those games.

When you start being humble in defeat, then ul get respect from all cricket fans. Its not a case of over hyping team when you win and then sore losers when you lose.

India have a good chance of winning in england if:-

They catch well
The lower order score runs
Score 300+ most inns scoreboard pressure
When it comes to crunch point in game the bowlers or batsmen do the job.

Facts - india failed to do most of the required things in 4 tests and thats why the lost. You can look at winning margins all you want end of day indian players are to blame.

Just like they were when you lost 2-0 to NZ recently.
 
3-1 to England and one very well fought draw.

India will lose games due to bad captaincy. There won't be 1st over spinner wickets. Jimmy will be a key factor.

I'm looking forward to Pant and Siraj's performances.
 
Robert said:
What are you basing that on, given the difficulty modern Indian batters face against the moving ball?
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They have their difficulties, but this English batting struggles under pressure. If Ind bat 1st and get around 300 on.the board, they will win.
 
Bewal Express said:
They have their difficulties, but this English batting struggles under pressure. If Ind bat 1st and get around 300 on.the board, they will win.
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Englands batting will have the like of woakes at 8, curran at 9 so if india fail run through englands entire batting they will struggle again.

Add to that indias tail will need to be alot better in these conditions.
 
Amjid Javed said:
Englands batting will have the like of woakes at 8, curran at 9 so if india fail run through englands entire batting they will struggle again.

Add to that indias tail will need to be alot better in these conditions.
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If I look at England's batting, I see little quality. I see good players in the likes of Root and Stokes but as the Ind seamers showed in Australia, they are very skilled and against this England batting they should have success. If the Inds batsman put runs on the board, they will win.
 
Bewal Express said:
If I look at England's batting, I see little quality. I see good players in the likes of Root and Stokes but as the Ind seamers showed in Australia, they are very skilled and against this England batting they should have success. If the Inds batsman put runs on the board, they will win.
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Indian seamers failed to do there job in last tour to england. Doing well in Australia doesnt coralate to doing well in england.

Yes india will get through englands top 3. But then you have root/stokes/???/butler/woakes/curtran

Thats not an easy line up to run through. India found that out last time. As did pakistan and WI last summer.

Englands strong lower order is reason they do well at home.

But yes if india get 300 all the time they have chance. Last tour batsmen failed 1st two tests and bowlers failed last 2 tests thats why u lost 4 tests.
 
Amjid Javed said:
Indian seamers failed to do there job in last tour to england. Doing well in Australia doesnt coralate to doing well in england.

Yes india will get through englands top 3. But then you have root/stokes/???/butler/woakes/curtran

Thats not an easy line up to run through. India found that out last time. As did pakistan and WI last summer.

Englands strong lower order is reason they do well at home.

But yes if india get 300 all the time they have chance. Last tour batsmen failed 1st two tests and bowlers failed last 2 tests thats why u lost 4 tests.
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The role of Pants will be crucial for Ind. His style is akin to Gilchrist. He will come in and play his game and if gets quick runs, the rest of the Ind batsman will feed off that. I rate the Ind seamers and their skills levels are very high, and they have added depth with Siraj. I agree England bat deep in English conditions but if the top order fail and Root is in at 30-2, then the lower order won't be able to bail them out every time. Remember we should have won but for that crazy hour when AA lost control with Buttler and Woakes.
 
Amjid Javed said:
The difference between england and india in the last series was that england players stepped up at key intervals in the game.

1st test - indias batsmen at fault for failing to chase 194.

2nd test - pathetic effort with bat in both inns by india.

3rd test - india wins because there batsmen finally put some runs on the board in both inns.

4th test - india had england 86/6 yet let them get 250. 2nd inns england 122/5 yet got 270.

So on both occasions indias bowlers failure to kill england off in either inns. If they had done that in just 1 inns they would have won the game.

5th test - england 181/7 got up to 332 in 1st inns. So once again indias bowlers in ability to get through englands lower order.

England have players like stokes butler curran rashid woakes etc.. so they bailed the team out. Indias tail in comparision was pathetic.

Now with pant ashwin sundar etc.. they might actually be able to turn losses into wins.

Facts - india lost 1st two tests because of poor batting.

India lost last 2 tests because bowlers didnt do there jobs.

Nothing to do with the toss, weather, luck.

India failed to perform as a team combined in 4 put of the 5 tests. Either the batting or bowling didnt do the job.

So when indian fans stop crying like sore losers about toss, weather, luck etc.. opposition fans will give you some respect.

Now the so callef axe to grind. Go have a look at prediction thread for Aus vs india. I was one of few cricket fans to say dont write india off they will be competative in Australia.

I congratulated india when they won..yet fans go overboard with GOAT status based on just australia performances. The results in NZ SA and Eng at same time are nothing short of poor for a so called talented team.

Yet rather than acknowledge that all indian fans start making excuses, toss, luck. Facts are you werent gud enough to win those games.

When you start being humble in defeat, then ul get respect from all cricket fans. Its not a case of over hyping team when you win and then sore losers when you lose.

India have a good chance of winning in england if:-

They catch well
The lower order score runs
Score 300+ most inns scoreboard pressure
When it comes to crunch point in game the bowlers or batsmen do the job.

Facts - india failed to do most of the required things in 4 tests and thats why the lost. You can look at winning margins all you want end of day indian players are to blame.

Just like they were when you lost 2-0 to NZ recently.
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Not sure why you're comparing the NZ series where the Indian team was never in the series to the England series where India was almost always in the series in nearly all the matches. India were comprehensively outplayed by New Zealand at home but England just had that one extra lower order partnership that pulled them across the line in the India - England series in 2018.

This is what Stuart Broad wrote in his column writing about the series:

We saw that the India-England series was 4-1 to England but it could have been 3-2 to India. It was great and inspiring to watch.
Click to expand...

Also you seem to be taking things like "respect" way too seriously. Let me tell you one thing. How much "respect" anonymous fans have matters little in defining the legacy of teams or players. India and Pakistan have an enmity that goes beyond sport and therefore both fans will always find a way to put down their rival team and players. It's like Barca fans calling Ronaldo overrated and Madrid fans calling Messi overrated.

But at the end of the day, what fans respect or think matters little. If your team is actually worth its salt, you wouldn't want to hear validation from random cricket fans. It will automatically come from well known cricket pundits worldwide. And by pundits, I mean ex players, commentators and renowned cricket writers all over the world, particularly neutral countries (like English and Australian pundits in India and Pakistan's case). I always place much more worth in the opinions of cricket pundits than fans in deciding the legacy of great players and teams of the past.
 
Bewal Express said:
They have their difficulties, but this English batting struggles under pressure. If Ind bat 1st and get around 300 on.the board, they will win.
Click to expand...

They have a couple of batters who get better under pressure. One of them gets a lot better under pressure.
 
street cricketer said:
Not sure why you're comparing the NZ series where the Indian team was never in the series to the England series where India was almost always in the series in nearly all the matches. India were comprehensively outplayed by New Zealand at home but England just had that one extra lower order partnership that pulled them across the line in the India - England series in 2018.

This is what Stuart Broad wrote in his column writing about the series:



Also you seem to be taking things like "respect" way too seriously. Let me tell you one thing. How much "respect" anonymous fans have matters little in defining the legacy of teams or players. India and Pakistan have an enmity that goes beyond sport and therefore both fans will always find a way to put down their rival team and players. It's like Barca fans calling Ronaldo overrated and Madrid fans calling Messi overrated.

But at the end of the day, what fans respect or think matters little. If your team is actually worth its salt, you wouldn't want to hear validation from random cricket fans. It will automatically come from well known cricket pundits worldwide. And by pundits, I mean ex players, commentators and renowned cricket writers all over the world, particularly neutral countries (like English and Australian pundits in India and Pakistan's case). I always place much more worth in the opinions of cricket pundits than fans in deciding the legacy of great players and teams of the past.
Click to expand...

I understand your point that india were competative in england. But still goes back to the batsmen failed in the 1st two tests.
- 2nd inns 1st test
- Both inns 2nd test

Also the 4th and 5th tests werent just ond long partnership or just 1 extra batsmen. Plain and simple on 3 occasions in 4 inns india failed to kill of england so again lets look at indias bowlers here not doing there jobs.

We call all do the what ifs, in 2016 pakistan should have beat england 2-1 or even 3-1 if "things had gone pakistans way".

1st test - pakistan win (batsmen do there job both inns as do bowlers)

2nd Pakistan - loss pathetic effort with bat both inns and bowling was awful. Deserved loss.

3rd test -
Bowlers did job 1st inns england all out 297.
Pakistan were 257/2 and should have got 500. Yet Azhar played a daft shot end of day 2 and pakistan collapsed on day 3.

Pakistan bowl badly 2nd inns. Then collapse in a session to lose on day 5.

Pakistan fans could blame all sorts of things luck etc.. and could have ended up with draw or a win.

4th test - pakistan easy win batsmen and bowlers do there job.

So similar to india where pakistan were poor with bat and ball they lost.

Where pakistan failed to go for kill at egbastion. Or the batsmen or bowlers didnt do full job in test they lost.

Yet you didnt see us pakistanis making excuses etc.. if this or that.

We simply went we got out played in 1 test and failed to kill off england in another.

Thats an honest assesment. How many indian fans on here do that?

All we here is oh if we won toss or england had luck.

Pakistan won at lords 2016 batting 1st and 2018 batting 2nd. So you domt see anyone seeing any issue when pakistan has to either bat 1st or 2nd in uk. Yet theres default excuse when india loses.

Yes the indias luck with toss is bad but its not the reason they lose games.
 
Amjid Javed said:
I understand your point that india were competative in england. But still goes back to the batsmen failed in the 1st two tests.
- 2nd inns 1st test
- Both inns 2nd test

Also the 4th and 5th tests werent just ond long partnership or just 1 extra batsmen. Plain and simple on 3 occasions in 4 inns india failed to kill of england so again lets look at indias bowlers here not doing there jobs.

We call all do the what ifs, in 2016 pakistan should have beat england 2-1 or even 3-1 if "things had gone pakistans way".

1st test - pakistan win (batsmen do there job both inns as do bowlers)

2nd Pakistan - loss pathetic effort with bat both inns and bowling was awful. Deserved loss.

3rd test -
Bowlers did job 1st inns england all out 297.
Pakistan were 257/2 and should have got 500. Yet Azhar played a daft shot end of day 2 and pakistan collapsed on day 3.

Pakistan bowl badly 2nd inns. Then collapse in a session to lose on day 5.

Pakistan fans could blame all sorts of things luck etc.. and could have ended up with draw or a win.

4th test - pakistan easy win batsmen and bowlers do there job.

So similar to india where pakistan were poor with bat and ball they lost.

Where pakistan failed to go for kill at egbastion. Or the batsmen or bowlers didnt do full job in test they lost.

Yet you didnt see us pakistanis making excuses etc.. if this or that.

We simply went we got out played in 1 test and failed to kill off england in another.

Thats an honest assesment. How many indian fans on here do that?

All we here is oh if we won toss or england had luck.

Pakistan won at lords 2016 batting 1st and 2018 batting 2nd. So you domt see anyone seeing any issue when pakistan has to either bat 1st or 2nd in uk. Yet theres default excuse when india loses.

Yes the indias luck with toss is bad but its not the reason they lose games.
Click to expand...

Oh bhai, it's not an Indian fan who said it was a very close series and that India could have won the series 3-2. It was actually a player who played in the opposition camp who said that. Perhaps write to Stuart Broad that his assessment of the series was wrong and that India could never have won the series as they got comprehensively outplayed.

P.S.: If you're talking about the 2016 series, I do remember Pakistan batsmen choking badly and throwing away a match in the 3rd test. So yes, Pak should have actually won that match or drew that match at the very least. Saying this is not giving excuses. Btw it's great that at least you won the toss for one time, I'd imagine it would be tough for Pakistan if it lost the toss every single time it toured England.
 
Bewal Express said:
I am not denying that Root and Stokes are excellent but the England top order offers little.
Click to expand...

I was referring to Stokes and Buttler.

Also, Woakes and Curran will come back and they are clutch with the bat. Woakes got a pressure century to defeat India and a pressure 80no to defeat Pakistan.

And don’t forget that Crawley has a test match 267. He had a bad tour, but clearly has a ton of ability and I am backing him to come good in the English summer and Ashes.
 
There are glaring holes in current Indian batting lineup. Gill will be a waking wicket in England and Rohit who was the most consistent bat in current series will also struggle. Pujara has always struggled in England even in county games. Rahane will score one dreamlike 100 but average 15 for remainder of the series. Kohli is in dismal form and it’s not likely that he will repeat his godly antics from last time. And we have no idea how Indian lower order including Pant will go against moving ball.


English batting is fragile too but they are at least better equipped than the opposition in their own conditions. I reckon weakness of Indian batting against moving ball will be completely exploited by English bowlers.
 
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Chrish said:
There are glaring holes in current Indian batting lineup. Gill will be a waking wicket in England and Rohit who was the most consistent bat in current series will also struggle. Pujara has always struggled in England even in county games. Rahane will score one dreamlike 100 but average 15 for remainder of the series. Kohli is in dismal form and it’s not likely that he will repeat his godly antics from last time. And we have no idea how Indian lower order including Pant will go against moving ball.


English batting is fragile too but they are at least better equipped than the opposition in their own conditions. I reckon weakness of Indian batting against moving ball will be completely exploited by English bowlers.
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Think it's also dependent on the conditions. If the conditions are drier, India has a much better chance. But if the ball is going to be moving all over the place like it happened last time, it's goodbye for India's chances and the series could get ugly. At least two guys have to stand up with the bat this time. Last time nobody could do that apart from Kohli, and he himself seems to be in a decline these days. Fear Anderson could have Kohli on toast once again like it happened in 2014.
 
Current Indian crop handles pace and bounce very well. But as soon as ball starts nipping around (Eng, NZ, SA), it’s all over.

It’s no surprise Indian batsmen have done well in Australia in recent years. Pace doesn’t bother them like it used to in the past to other Indian players.
 
Last edited:
Chrish said:
Current Indian crop handles pace and bounce very well. But as soon as ball starts nipping around (Eng, NZ, SA), it’s all over.

It’s no surprise Indian batsmen have done well in Australia in recent years. Pace doesn’t bother them like it used to in the past to other Indian players.
Click to expand...

That's the test isn't it. They conquered spin, they conquered pace and bounce. The swing is their final test. If they conquer that, they are undeniably the best team in this generation. If they don't, they are the only team that conquered 2 out of 3 and will the best test team in this generation with an asterisk.
 
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