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Rank the next tier of Pakistan pace bowlers (after the Wasim/Waqar era) in order of their achievements and legacy

DeadlyVenom

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i've seen a few posts where people have mentioned that bowler X was better than bowler Y or achieved more.

I'm mainly aiming these at the post Wasim, Waqar and Shoaib era, those three were probably the last batch of All format great bowlers we had. For a simple cut off we can call it bowlers who didn't play in 1999 WC.

These are the bowlers that have sprung to mind as the main characters since then and the next tier of bowlers after our best fast bowling era ( forgive me if I have missed any), memory is probably fresher for newer bowlers than older, some are in the list just because they had a memorable performance even though they didn't play much ( cheema and Rumman for eg)

  • Mohammad Asif
  • Mohammad Amir
  • Umar Gul
  • Wahab Riaz
  • Junaid Khan
  • Sohail Tanvir
  • Hasan Ali
  • Shaheen Shah Afridi
  • Naseem Shah
  • Mohammad Abbas
  • Mohammad Sami
  • Mohammad Irfan
  • Haris Rauf
  • Mohammad Hasnain
  • Rana Naved-ul-Hasan
  • Aizaz Cheema
  • Rumman Raees
    Imran Khan Sr
Here is my top picks from this list not just in terms of potential but also achievements too.

1. Umar Gul - his record in LOI speaks for himself and for a sustained patch he was our premier bowler than we had faith in to win us matches single handedly. It didn't translate into test as much as LOI but he had some commendable performances.
2.Mohammed Amir - banned, bitter, and a bad end to his career but he had some great moments. A real case of what might have been. He will always be remembered for two great peformances in ICC finals, alongside his very low points too.
3. Hassan Ali - He gets criticism, some deserved, but he pulled out the stops in our memorable champions trophy win
4. Junaid - he really should have played more and achieved more, who really knows what the reasons behind his downfall were.
5. Wahab - scattergun, but has some memorable performances across all formats.
6. Shaheen - Will likely move up the ranks as his career progresses but this is a fair reflection of where he is at the moment.
7. Asif - for poetry and artisty he be number 1 in my eyes but has not too muich to show for his career in terms of tangible achievements.

I could continue but there isnt much between the players.
 
i've seen a few posts where people have mentioned that bowler X was better than bowler Y or achieved more.

I'm mainly aiming these at the post Wasim, Waqar and Shoaib era, those three were probably the last batch of All format great bowlers we had. For a simple cut off we can call it bowlers who didn't play in 1999 WC.

These are the bowlers that have sprung to mind as the main characters since then and the next tier of bowlers after our best fast bowling era ( forgive me if I have missed any), memory is probably fresher for newer bowlers than older, some are in the list just because they had a memorable performance even though they didn't play much ( cheema and Rumman for eg)

  • Mohammad Asif
  • Mohammad Amir
  • Umar Gul
  • Wahab Riaz
  • Junaid Khan
  • Sohail Tanvir
  • Hasan Ali
  • Shaheen Shah Afridi
  • Naseem Shah
  • Mohammad Abbas
  • Mohammad Sami
  • Mohammad Irfan
  • Haris Rauf
  • Mohammad Hasnain
  • Rana Naved-ul-Hasan
  • Aizaz Cheema
  • Rumman Raees
    Imran Khan Sr
Here is my top picks from this list not just in terms of potential but also achievements too.

1. Umar Gul - his record in LOI speaks for himself and for a sustained patch he was our premier bowler than we had faith in to win us matches single handedly. It didn't translate into test as much as LOI but he had some commendable performances.
2.Mohammed Amir - banned, bitter, and a bad end to his career but he had some great moments. A real case of what might have been. He will always be remembered for two great peformances in ICC finals, alongside his very low points too.
3. Hassan Ali - He gets criticism, some deserved, but he pulled out the stops in our memorable champions trophy win
4. Junaid - he really should have played more and achieved more, who really knows what the reasons behind his downfall were.
5. Wahab - scattergun, but has some memorable performances across all formats.
6. Shaheen - Will likely move up the ranks as his career progresses but this is a fair reflection of where he is at the moment.
7. Asif - for poetry and artisty he be number 1 in my eyes but has not too muich to show for his career in terms of tangible achievements.

I could continue but there isnt much between the players.
Good list but imo Junaid > Hasan Ali and yes this includes prime 2017 hasan Ali.

Shaheen > Wahab

Asif umm idk, id rank him higher but idk where tbh
 
Good list but imo Junaid > Hasan Ali and yes this includes prime 2017 hasan Ali.

Shaheen > Wahab

Asif umm idk, id rank him higher but idk where tbh
Junaid had a good steady career but I think hassan's peaks were better than his peak.

Actually, are right about Shaheen and Wahab, I should have them the other way round. Shaheen will hopefully top the list when he is finished, I ranked him lower as he is still going, but should be ahead of Wahab and Junaid already.
 
Junaid had a good steady career but I think hassan's peaks were better than his peak.

Actually, are right about Shaheen and Wahab, I should have them the other way round. Shaheen will hopefully top the list when he is finished, I ranked him lower as he is still going, but should be ahead of Wahab and Junaid already.
Shaheen gets alot of flaxk but his 2019 self is honestly > Hasan, Junaid and Wahab but I can understand you putting him lower due to his recent form.

As for hasan, idk man junaid did get rid of Kohli 3 out of 3 times. Yes the 2012 indian side was ageing but kohli was the difference maker that jumaid got rid of, infact he kinda owned all of India minus Dhoni.

Hasan Ali had a great 2017 ct though.
 
1. Mohammad Asif
Test Matches: 23 | Wickets: 106 | Avg: 24.36

Why Ranked #1: Widely regarded as one of the most skillful swing bowlers Pakistan ever produced. Even ABD, Kevin Pietersen and Hashim Amla have praised his ability. His legacy is tarnished by the 2010 spot-fixing scandal, but his pure bowling talent puts him at the top of this tier.

Legacy Factor: "what could have been" story - had he stayed clean, he might have rivalled Wasim and Waqar in stature.

2. Umar Gul
Tests: 47| Wickets: 163
ODIs: 130 T Wickets: 179
T20ls: 60| Wickets: 85

Why Ranked #2: Key death bowler in the T20 era. Leading wicket-taker in two T20 World Cups and a vital part of Pakistan's 2009 T20 World Cup win.

Legacy Factor: Among the early pioneers of T20 fast bowling - lethal with the old ball.

3. Mohammad Amir
Tests: 36| Wickets: 119
ODIs: 61|Wickets: 81
T20Is: 62 | Wickets: 71

Why Ranked #3: Phenomenal prodigy who debuted at 17, drawing comparisons with Wasim. His 2010 scandal hurt his image, but his 2017 Champions Trophy final performance vs India was legendary.

Legacy Factor: Another what could have been"- still remembered for one of the best new-ball spells in modern cricket.
 
i've seen a few posts where people have mentioned that bowler X was better than bowler Y or achieved more.

I'm mainly aiming these at the post Wasim, Waqar and Shoaib era, those three were probably the last batch of All format great bowlers we had. For a simple cut off we can call it bowlers who didn't play in 1999 WC.

These are the bowlers that have sprung to mind as the main characters since then and the next tier of bowlers after our best fast bowling era ( forgive me if I have missed any), memory is probably fresher for newer bowlers than older, some are in the list just because they had a memorable performance even though they didn't play much ( cheema and Rumman for eg)

  • Mohammad Asif
  • Mohammad Amir
  • Umar Gul
  • Wahab Riaz
  • Junaid Khan
  • Sohail Tanvir
  • Hasan Ali
  • Shaheen Shah Afridi
  • Naseem Shah
  • Mohammad Abbas
  • Mohammad Sami
  • Mohammad Irfan
  • Haris Rauf
  • Mohammad Hasnain
  • Rana Naved-ul-Hasan
  • Aizaz Cheema
  • Rumman Raees
    Imran Khan Sr
Here is my top picks from this list not just in terms of potential but also achievements too.

1. Umar Gul - his record in LOI speaks for himself and for a sustained patch he was our premier bowler than we had faith in to win us matches single handedly. It didn't translate into test as much as LOI but he had some commendable performances.
2.Mohammed Amir - banned, bitter, and a bad end to his career but he had some great moments. A real case of what might have been. He will always be remembered for two great peformances in ICC finals, alongside his very low points too.
3. Hassan Ali - He gets criticism, some deserved, but he pulled out the stops in our memorable champions trophy win
4. Junaid - he really should have played more and achieved more, who really knows what the reasons behind his downfall were.
5. Wahab - scattergun, but has some memorable performances across all formats.
6. Shaheen - Will likely move up the ranks as his career progresses but this is a fair reflection of where he is at the moment.
7. Asif - for poetry and artisty he be number 1 in my eyes but has not too muich to show for his career in terms of tangible achievements.

I could continue but there isnt much between the players.
Junaid is easily higher than Hasan ali. Shaheen will go higher than Wahab.
Asif is higher than Wahab because of his test performance. Wahab barely did anything in his entire LOI career barring 4-5 matches. Taking wickets wasn't his forte. And without wickets, you slip farther down. Sohail Tanvir, Imran Khan and Hasnain should be at the very bottom. Rumman didn't play enough to be featured at all. Even Sohail Khan played more than him. Sami should be higher than Aizaz and Rana because he had a very good start to his career. Rana just had one good series in India under his career. Aizaz has that Asia cup final over to his achievements
 
1. Mohammad Asif
Test Matches: 23 | Wickets: 106 | Avg: 24.36

Why Ranked #1: Widely regarded as one of the most skillful swing bowlers Pakistan ever produced. Even ABD, Kevin Pietersen and Hashim Amla have praised his ability. His legacy is tarnished by the 2010 spot-fixing scandal, but his pure bowling talent puts him at the top of this tier.

Legacy Factor: "what could have been" story - had he stayed clean, he might have rivalled Wasim and Waqar in stature.

2. Umar Gul
Tests: 47| Wickets: 163
ODIs: 130 T Wickets: 179
T20ls: 60| Wickets: 85

Why Ranked #2: Key death bowler in the T20 era. Leading wicket-taker in two T20 World Cups and a vital part of Pakistan's 2009 T20 World Cup win.

Legacy Factor: Among the early pioneers of T20 fast bowling - lethal with the old ball.

3. Mohammad Amir
Tests: 36| Wickets: 119
ODIs: 61|Wickets: 81
T20Is: 62 | Wickets: 71

Why Ranked #3: Phenomenal prodigy who debuted at 17, drawing comparisons with Wasim. His 2010 scandal hurt his image, but his 2017 Champions Trophy final performance vs India was legendary.

Legacy Factor: Another what could have been"- still remembered for one of the best new-ball spells in modern cricket.
All these guys are not next tier of Pakistan but yeah, in last decade or 15 years, they will be the top 3 for sure... IN terms of spin department, Ajmal has crazy number (CHUCK or whatever).
 
All these guys are not next tier of Pakistan but yeah, in last decade or 15 years, they will be the top 3 for sure... IN terms of spin department, Ajmal has crazy number (CHUCK or whatever).
I know. Just mentioned these 3 as the OP has them in there so just put my thoughts down quickly. Will probably do some with other names too.
 
Depressing how barring Amir and Asif how awful the list is.

I can't remember a single Wahab moment apart from 2011 semi. Everytime else he's been a parody. The Smith mauling showed his bowling IQ.

Gul was great in 2009 but he became a total spray gun who was battered mercilessly at the death after that. I can't remember a single big game from home after that bowling wise.

Hasan Ali, great in 2017, just standard since.

Junaid agreed.

All these players barring Asif and Amir were "moment" players with no consistency or long term performances. Amir falls in the same category but his talent was totally above the other barring Asif.

Had high hopes from Shaheen and Naseem but they are also extremely on and off.
 
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