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Ravichandran Ashwin: A HTB?

London_Lahori

London_Lahori

Senior Test Player
Joined
Sep 16, 2012
Runs
29,683
Is ashwin a Home Track Bully? This pitch had something in it for him and to end up with how many wickets in the test, 0?
 
his figures are looking a tad skewed...


94 wickets@24 in india

9 wickets@75 away from home.


Just a slight difference :-o
 
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Never liked his bowling overseas. He is more suited to be a no.7 batsman who can bowl.
 
Apparently ICC ranks him as the best all-rounder in the world and by a distance. All the other spinners have taken 5 wicket hauls in SA pitches. In fact, the pitch was offering turn in that game that just concluded.
 
People were comparing him with Ajmal lols.

Ashwin is only a good batsman, his bowling is only bonus for India.
 
usless spinner outside side subcontinent.J P Duminy bowled better than him
 
IAJ said:
People were comparing him with Ajmal lols.

Ashwin is only a good batsman, his bowling is only bonus for India.
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Yes, during T20 WC last year, people were claiming he was better then Ajmal.
 
I rate Ashwin the batsmen more than Ashwin the bowler.
 
Yes but he is young so he will get better.

Sent from my LG-E988 using Tapatalk 2
 
Ashwin will be our key player at home for the next 7-8 years :sehwag

Outside India he has done nothing of note so far with the ball. He will be useful all over the world woth the bat though.
 
Energetic said:
Apparently ICC ranks him as the best all-rounder in the world and by a distance. All the other spinners have taken 5 wicket hauls in SA pitches. In fact, the pitch was offering turn in that game that just concluded.
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at Wanderers?do remind me when that happened.

btw Ajmal took 1 for 142 last time he bowled here
 
Saurav said:
at Wanderers?do remind me when that happened.

btw Ajmal took 1 for 142 last time he bowled here
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This pitch was a lot more responsive for the spinners, especially on the 5th day. Had Ajmal bowled on the 5th day you can be sure as hell his figures wouldn't be 0-83.
 
He should start concentrating on his batting and become a part time bowler
 
even his home bowling isn't as good. India can dream but they will never find a quality spinner. Ashwin's batting is probably better than his bowling
 
Saurav said:
at Wanderers?do remind me when that happened.

btw Ajmal took 1 for 142 last time he bowled here
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Majority of Ajmal bowling was done with a deficit of 200 runs on a day2-3 track. Ashwin bowled with 450 runs behind him on a dat4-5 track. Big difference.
 
This will be key to how much India will achieve especially overseas. He hasn't been threatening at all in all test matches that he has played away from India
 
South Africans are amongst the better players of spin. Ashwin bowled tight, and gave away just 2.3 per over. In fact, he was more valuable than Zaheer in the fourth innings, have your pick - 1/135 ( and this one wkt was a fluke) off 34 or 0/83 off 36. He was far better than Tahir who conceded 5 runs per over and allowed India to score freely. And whose wickets Tahir took? Ishant and Shami, at a time the batsmen were blindly swinging their bats. Ashwin will learn, he is not leaking runs at this time, and he will learn to get wickets.
 
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Breaking news

ashwin gets an oscar for ACTING as the frontline spinner in the indian team.
 
Outside home

Ashwin
Bowling Average: 39
Eco: 4.97

Harbhajan
Bowling Average: 32
Eco: 4.22

So yes, pretty much overrated.
 
Ashwin only needs to be a HTB he plays most of his cricket in India and most teams apart from SA and Eng struggle to play Spin especially on turning tracks he is not an ATG material or anything but he can be a decent spinner it took Kumble a decade to become effective outside India Ashwin needs time :UAkmal
 
Adil_94 said:
Ashwin only needs to be a HTB he plays most of his cricket in India and most teams apart from SA and Eng struggle to play Spin especially on turning tracks he is not an ATG material or anything but he can be a decent spinner it took Kumble a decade to become effective outside India Ashwin needs time :UAkmal
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Good lord!

Where did you get that from?
 
Adil_94 said:
In the 90s Kumble averaged 21 at home 38 away in the 2000s his average improved considerably to 31 away from home
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Which format are you talking about? Coz in ODIs for the first 5 years, Kumble averaged 27.66 (Eco: 3.76) away and 32.75 (Eco: 4.34) at home.
 
Statsman said:
Which format are you talking about? Coz in ODIs for the first 5 years, Kumble averaged 27.66 (Eco: 3.76) away and 32.75 (Eco: 4.34) at home.
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I was on about Test Cricket looks like we got our wires crossed :Ishant
 
Last 5 years

Outside home:
Harbhajan
Avg: 33.17
Eco: 4.76

Still better than Ashwin.
 
So while Ashwin is good at home and rubbish away, Harbhajan is consistently average.
 
harbhajan wouldn't pick wickets but I have never seen him getting thrashed like ashwyn... need to pick up ozha or Mishra for 10 - 15 matches.
 
badhmash_kaka said:
harbhajan wouldn't pick wickets but I have never seen him getting thrashed like ashwyn... need to pick up ozha or Mishra for 10 - 15 matches.
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Absolutely. If I remember correctly, Harbhajan has gone for over 60 runs in a match only 8 times. In a career spanning more than 200 ODIs, this is a massive achievement.
 
justarslan said:
Bring back Bhaji.
Click to expand...

No point bringing him back. His confidence has been shattered. Plus, he will need a very solid backing from the captain. Dhoni doesn't have a soft spot for a few players - Bhajji is one of them.
 
Statsman said:
Good lord!

Where did you get that from?
Click to expand...

In test matches that is true, he was pretty mediocre for a decade. Barring a successful tour against the reintroduced SA team in 92, Kumble was extremely mediocre in tests outside SC. During the 99 tour to Australia, Kumble averaged 90 at a s/r of 180 odd!!
 
Statsman said:
Absolutely. If I remember correctly, Harbhajan has gone for over 60 runs in a match only 8 times. In a career spanning more than 200 ODIs, this is a massive achievement.
Click to expand...

Teams are scoring more and more runs in ODIs (and even tests) with every passing year.
 
IndianWillow said:
In test matches that is true, he was pretty mediocre for a decade. Barring a successful tour against the reintroduced SA team in 92, Kumble was extremely mediocre in tests outside SC. During the 99 tour to Australia, Kumble averaged 90 at a s/r of 180 odd!!
Click to expand...

True. Primarily why we couldn't buy a away win in those years.
I was talking about ODIs though.
 
I liked Bhajji better

Even when he was not bowling well, he still looked OK to me.
 
Ashwin is a poor bowler. I rate Elias Sunny as a more dangerous spinner.
 
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Executioner said:
I liked Bhajji better

Even when he was not bowling well, he still looked OK to me.
Click to expand...

Well, Harbie was the last Indian spinner to quickly adapt to bowling outside the SC - even Kumble used to struggle in this department. Wish we still had Harbhajan of the early-mid noughties. He went downhill very quickly though.
 
Saurav said:
he did well in England and WI ODIs.so no home bully
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Ashwin has done well in India and England - he has been unimpressive else where, but it is in these places he has played the most number of matches. He could be the type of bowler who needs more matches to acclimatize. One problem with Ashwin is that when he does not do well, he looks terrible and unthreatening. Taking Ashwin any where he has no prior experience bowling is a gamble.
 
Ashwin looks unfit, fat belly, huge love handles, and players are figuring out his carrom ball. Aswhin should work on his fitness
 
To be honest, Ashwin's problem is not overseas.

Its his current bowling.

Right now, it won't trouble a domestic tailender leave alone an international batsman.

I want him thrown out of the team so that he gets the shock of his life and improves.

In 2010, Ashwin had way lesser skills as a bowler but could trouble most batsman. Averaged around 25 I guess in ODI's.

And no, it wasn't because of variations. it was because of his ability to bowl in the good length 80%+ of the time.

Now, he can't bowl anything.

Again, my opinion:

Its NOT about home vs away.

We all saw how pathetic he was vs England where he couldn't find his line and length and how things changed against Aussies (even though they are weaker players of spin).

Jadeja is useless too (for overseas but better than Ashwin).
 
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sensible-indian-fan said:
To be honest, Ashwin's problem is not overseas.

Its his current bowling.

Right now, it won't trouble a domestic tailender leave alone an international batsman.

I want him thrown out of the team so that he gets the shock of his life and improves.

In 2010, Ashwin had way lesser skills as a bowler but could trouble most batsman. Averaged around 25 I guess in ODI's.

And no, it wasn't because of variations. it was because of his ability to bowl in the good length 80%+ of the time.

Now, he can't bowl anything.

Again, my opinion:

Its NOT about home vs away.

We all saw how pathetic he was vs England where he couldn't find his line and length and how things changed against Aussies (even though they are weaker players of spin).

Jadeja is useless too (for overseas but better than Ashwin).
Click to expand...

Take Ashwin home and play a test series there. He will do well right now. He just has not figured out how to bowl overseas. He is lacking a few critical skills, like he needs to use his body more to generate speed and revs - he can get away with this in India due to the pitches, but not outside SC. This problem is not new to Indian spinners - they take their time to adjust, Harbhajan was the only Indian spinner of the past two decades who made a quick impression when we toured outside SC - others have either permanently struggled or took a long time to adapt.
 
IndianWillow said:
Take Ashwin home and play a test series there. He will do well right now. He just has not figured out how to bowl overseas. He is lacking a few critical skills, like he needs to use his body more to generate speed and revs - he can get away with this in India due to the pitches, but not outside SC. This problem is not new to Indian spinners - they take their time to adjust, Harbhajan was the only Indian spinner of the past two decades who made a quick impression when we toured outside SC - others have either permanently struggled or took a long time to adapt.
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This.

In the australia series, he worked on his glaring technical deficiencies and the results were there for all to see.

He is never going to be a 100% technically perfect off spinner but he had worked most of his issues in that series.

Now he is back to bowling rubbish.

A full form Ravi Ashwin is an amazing bowler (I know Pak fans will laugh) but its true.

But his bowling with all his technical flaws can't trouble a tailender now.

Here's a story:

Faf in 2010 felt that Ashwin was probably the best spinner (of course, its just his opinion).

Why?

He couldn't even TOUCH Ashwin's bowls in the nets.

The accuracy (good length), the proper release that got awkward bounce made it really tough.

Everyone says Ashwin can't bowl overseas. Then how come he was the highest wicketaker and the best bowler in Champion's League in 2010 (which CSK won).

He is a very good bowler. Probably ego issues is what his affecting him.

Someone needs to go and tell him:

"Dude, you are RUBBISH."
 
I think he'll be a successful batsman away from home. His bowling looks ineffective overseas.
 
He needs to adjust his pace, and give the ball a bit more air.
His bowling also sometimes looks as if it is lacking in effort, and he should not try many varieties.

Ashwin has it in him to be a good orthodox off spin bowler in all formats, the problem is when he tries to be unorthodox.

Obviously he also needs to work on his line and length but i believe that when he starts bowling with a more clearer mind it will help him maintain better line and lengths.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
This.

In the australia series, he worked on his glaring technical deficiencies and the results were there for all to see.

He is never going to be a 100% technically perfect off spinner but he had worked most of his issues in that series.

Now he is back to bowling rubbish.

A full form Ravi Ashwin is an amazing bowler (I know Pak fans will laugh) but its true.

But his bowling with all his technical flaws can't trouble a tailender now.

Here's a story:

Faf in 2010 felt that Ashwin was probably the best spinner (of course, its just his opinion).

Why?

He couldn't even TOUCH Ashwin's bowls in the nets.

The accuracy (good length), the proper release that got awkward bounce made it really tough.

Everyone says Ashwin can't bowl overseas. Then how come he was the highest wicketaker and the best bowler in Champion's League in 2010 (which CSK won).

He is a very good bowler. Probably ego issues is what his affecting him.

Someone needs to go and tell him:

"Dude, you are RUBBISH."
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In the Australia series he was playing on pitches which favoured spin bowling against Batsman who were clueless on those pitches but Ashwin still was impressive, and come on bowling well in the champions league doesn't mean he will bowl well in ODIS or Tests and Faf is a poor player of spin he struggled against our spinners all last year it's not exactly like SRT said Ashwin was unplayable in the Nets
 
Stating the obvious. The reason Ojha sits in the bench is not bcz of CSK links, but it is because the ones he competes against, ie. Jaddu and Ashwin are far more accomplished with bat. Add the fact that it's hard to drop a bowler when he performs so well at home.
As Ashwin keeps getting more and more exposed outside India, Dhoni will looks at other options like it happend in the 2nt Test against SA. Jadeja will be our first choice in this tour, pretty sure about that.
 
Electron said:
Stating the obvious. The reason Ojha sits in the bench is not bcz of CSK links, but it is because the ones he competes against, ie. Jaddu and Ashwin are far more accomplished with bat. Add the fact that it's hard to drop a bowler when he performs so well at home.
As Ashwin keeps getting more and more exposed outside India, Dhoni will looks at other options like it happend in the 2nt Test against SA. Jadeja will be our first choice in this tour, pretty sure about that.
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If the last two ODIs are any indication(1/61 off 9 and 1/46 off 8), I foresee Jadeja getting the stick in test matches too. Jadeja is as much unproven as Ashwin on foreign tracks, and he played the second test in SA under far more favorable conditions for spin bowling as compared to the first.

But the weakest link in the bowling line up is Ishant who is conceding 8+ an over on average - 1/72 off 9 and 1/46 off 6 isn't exactly going to help your team win matches.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
This.

In the australia series, he worked on his glaring technical deficiencies and the results were there for all to see.

He is never going to be a 100% technically perfect off spinner but he had worked most of his issues in that series.

Now he is back to bowling rubbish.

A full form Ravi Ashwin is an amazing bowler (I know Pak fans will laugh) but its true.

But his bowling with all his technical flaws can't trouble a tailender now.

Here's a story:

Faf in 2010 felt that Ashwin was probably the best spinner (of course, its just his opinion).

Why?

He couldn't even TOUCH Ashwin's bowls in the nets.

The accuracy (good length), the proper release that got awkward bounce made it really tough.

Everyone says Ashwin can't bowl overseas. Then how come he was the highest wicketaker and the best bowler in Champion's League in 2010 (which CSK won).

He is a very good bowler. Probably ego issues is what his affecting him.

Someone needs to go and tell him:

"Dude, you are RUBBISH."
Click to expand...

You could tell him that, and try another spinner, but historically Indian spinners have had very little success playing ODIs in Aus, Eng, SA and NZ. If we take these four nations with a minimum qualification of 20 wickets, you get only three bowlers, with best average of 40 odd.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/en...=wickets;team=6;template=results;type=bowling

Whoever is putting down Ashwin in isolation here probably has not followed the history of Indian spinners at all. Even after much experience of many tours, no Indian spinner of the past could average even 35 while playing under these conditions. I don't expect Ashwin, Jadeja, Ojha or whoever else to make an impression in ODIs under these conditions any time soon. Pacers and batters should win the games when we play in these countries, and if they suck we aren't going to win too many matches.
 
59903_654508894585340_2091333610_n.jpg
 
ODIs

Harbhajan

220 innings - conceded more than 60 - 8 times

Ashwin

71 innings - conceded more than 60 - 7 times already

Ashwin is not a wicket taker either, he still doesn't have even a 4 wicket haul, his best figures are 3/24! Amit Mishra has 2 4w and 1 5w in 20 matches lol...
 
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Statsman said:
ODIs

Harbhajan

220 innings - conceded more than 60 - 8 times

Ashwin

71 innings - conceded more than 60 - 7 times already

Ashwin is not a wicket taker either, he still doesn't have even a 4 wicket haul, his best figures are 3/24! Amit Mishra has 2 4w and 1 5w in 20 matches lol...
Click to expand...

Ashwin is a sh*t bowler. He's in the team just because of his IPL team.. It's shameful how Ojha or even Harbhajan are not ahead of him in the team..
 
Statsman said:
ODIs

Harbhajan

220 innings - conceded more than 60 - 8 times

Ashwin

71 innings - conceded more than 60 - 7 times already

Ashwin is not a wicket taker either, he still doesn't have even a 4 wicket haul, his best figures are 3/24! Amit Mishra has 2 4w and 1 5w in 20 matches lol...
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I know its an old post but this is a stupid comparison. Ashwin is playing in an era where 6 rpo is norm, Bhajji played most of his ODI Cricket when 4-5 rpo was the norm.
 
On topic

Well he is a very good bowler in SC condition, 2nd best atm to Herath. Away though he needs to have a match winning spell or 2 to shed this HTB tag. Not WI but either Eng/Aus/SA. These 3 have been tough places for Indian spinners always.
 
HTB or not, I really loved watching Ashwin bowling his proper off spin bowling in this test match. It was one of the saving grace of this rain interrupted match. Looking forward to Ashwin bowling to ABD and Amla later this year. Should be a one of the highpoints of the #IndvSA test seris
 
Cricfan4eva said:
I know its an old post but this is a stupid comparison. Ashwin is playing in an era where 6 rpo is norm, Bhajji played most of his ODI Cricket when 4-5 rpo was the norm.
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Although I agree that Bhajji is no where near Ashwin now, but the comparison wasn't "stupid" at that time. I had posted in another thread that even other bowlers from bhajji's era had conceded 60+ in almost every 10-12th game. Obviously the scoring rates have increased but Bhajji letting 60+ being scored off his bowling only 8 times in 220 games was and is still remarkable.
 
Statsman said:
Although I agree that Bhajji is no where near Ashwin now, but the comparison wasn't "stupid" at that time. I had posted in another thread that even other bowlers from bhajji's era had conceded 60+ in almost every 10-12th game. Obviously the scoring rates have increased but Bhajji letting 60+ being scored off his bowling only 8 times in 220 games was and is still remarkable.
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That was because Bhajji was an excellent darter. He was a selfish player who protected his figures and didn't go for wickets. It used to cost us as opposition had plenty of wickets in hand during slog overs to maul our pacers.

And I wasn't saying comparison between those 2 wasn't on. The criteria you chose was the wrong way to go about it though as they've played in different eras.
 
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