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Ravichandran Ashwin or Yasir Shah - Who is the better bowler?

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Saj

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ok guys, don't turn this into an India versus Pakistan slanging match.

Discuss their relative strengths and weaknesses as bowlers and add your reasons why you think one is better than the other.
 
Yasir

-- Day light --

Ashwin

Ashwin needs dust bowls to pick wickets whereas Yasir can get 10 fers even on dead UAE pitches. Only if Ashwin can pick a 10 fer against ENG/ AUS away from home and win a test match we can even think of comparing the two.

Any skipper would trade gold to have :yasir in their playing XI.

My 0.02 $
 
AamchiMumbaikar said:
Yasir

-- Day light --

Ashwin

Ashwin needs dust bowls to pick wickets whereas Yasir can get 10 fers even on dead UAE pitches. Only if Ashwin can pick a 10 fer against ENG/ AUS away from home and win a test match we can even think of comparing the two.

Any skipper would trade gold to have :yasir in their playing XI.

My 0.02 $
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Agreed.

Ashwin is ghar ka sher and a kitten on road.
 
Ashwin has benefited from more favorable spin bowling conditions, Indian pitches assist not only spin, but also spin at pace and bounce whereas the UAE pitches are slower with low bounce which makes bowling a lot harder.
 
Dont see much of ashwin. What yasir does in the UAE is just amazing. Even on day 5 the pitches are great for batting. For every single wicket you have to work so hard.

Yasir truly is a champ.
 
Both are about equal in tests. Maybe Yasir is slightly better. But in shorter formats, Ashwin is way ahead so overall he is better bowler than Yasir.
 
Most discussed topic here after SRT.

Ashwin >> overall.

Yasir > Tests.
 
Can only be decided when they go head to head.
 
Personally I think it's a bit unfair to compare a wrist spinner and finger spinner because it's two different styles and requires different thinking.

If I had to choose though I would go for Ashwin, just.
 
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Ashwin as an overall package

Great bowler in all three formats

More than a handy batsman
 
As MIG said this can only be decided if both get to face each other in the same conditions.

But as of now,

Yasir is alot more threatening and a bigger match winner for Pakistan, than Ashwin is for India. Ashwin needs help from Jaddu/Mishra/Shami/Yadav to close out an innings, Yasir on the other hand runs through batting lineups completely on his own.
 
I do not know much of Yasir's weaknesses because I haven't watched him bowl as much as I have watched Ashwin bowl.

Ashwin's advantages are I think his flight and accuracy. He turns the ball a lot as well. In comparison, Yasir is a skiddy type of bowler who bowls with subtle variations and isn't as big a turner of the ball as you generally expect with leggies. He generally is always at the stumps, so his skiddy pace sort of hurries on to the batsman even on flat tracks which is why I think he may do better on flat tracks than Ashwin.

Ashwin is a very intelligent bowler, he said in the presentation ceremony after his MoS award that he knew Boult was coming for the tour and that could make use of his footmarks. He is an astute student of the game who watches almost every cricket match that goes on around the world. He is a bowler who can take advantage of the slightest slowness in the track or rough patches around the crease. But I don't think he has that skiddy pace of Yasir, I'm not even sure whether finger spinners can have that quality. Yasir to me is more of a natural bowler who has been effective even with very little variations. Ashwin is like a student who keeps developing and acquiring different abilities and variations with experience.

As for their disadvantages, like I said above, Ashwin may struggle on unconducive tracks - he did take a 5fer on a batting track in the first innings at Indore, but I would want to see him do that against England which has a much more potent batting line up. Yasir atm doesn't have too many problems as he is picking truckloads of wickets even with minimal variations. If I'm being picky, I would say that he needs to work on his googly and also on his leg spinner more in terms of different line and lengths because he may struggle a bit if the batsmen decide to play him as an inswing bowler. Think he also needs to adopt a different line outside off and bring caught behind into play if plan A isn't working. He probably will find a way to deceive the batsmen even then using his guile.
 
street cricketer said:
I do not know much of Yasir's weaknesses because I haven't watched him bowl as much as I have watched Ashwin bowl.

Ashwin's advantages are I think his flight and accuracy. He turns the ball a lot as well. In comparison, Yasir is a skiddy type of bowler who bowls with subtle variations and isn't as big a turner of the ball as you generally expect with leggies. He generally is always at the stumps, so his skiddy pace sort of hurries on to the batsman even on flat tracks which is why I think he may do better on flat tracks than Ashwin.

Ashwin is a very intelligent bowler, he said in the presentation ceremony after his MoS award that he knew Boult was coming for the tour and that could make use of his footmarks. He is an astute student of the game who watches almost every cricket match that goes on around the world. He is a bowler who can take advantage of the slightest slowness in the track or rough patches around the crease. But I don't think he has that skiddy pace of Yasir, I'm not even sure whether finger spinners can have that quality. Yasir to me is more of a natural bowler who has been effective even with very little variations. Ashwin is like a student who keeps developing and acquiring different abilities and variations with experience.

As for their disadvantages, like I said above, Ashwin may struggle on unconducive tracks - he did take a 5fer on a batting track in the first innings at Indore, but I would want to see him do that against England which has a much more potent batting line up. Yasir atm doesn't have too many problems as he is picking truckloads of wickets even with minimal variations. If I'm being picky, I would say that he needs to work on his googly and also on his leg spinner more in terms of different line and lengths because he may struggle a bit if the batsmen decide to play him as an inswing bowler. Think he also needs to adopt a different line outside off and bring caught behind into play if plan A isn't working. He probably will find a way to deceive the batsmen even then using his guile.
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Brilliant post. POTW for me?

Who do you think has a higher ceiling?

I personally think Ashwin is developing every series whereas with Yasir he's operating at a very high level from the start but improvement from series to series is marginal.

And a thing that worries me is that Yasir doesn't have as many tricks though he has mastered his strengths and uses length brilliantly
 
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In Tests, Yasir Shah for the simple reason he's picking his wickets on relatively flatter wickets and those two big match winning performances in England.

Ashwin has also done well on flat wickets in India and WI but needs match winning performances in England/Aus/SA/NZ.

Plus a leg spinner is always a more attacking option in tests and provides you better variety against all kinds of batsmen.

In LOIs, Ashwin beats Yasir by a mile.

As a tests bowler, Yasir > Ashwin

In all other formats, Ashwin > Shah
 
If Yasir Bhai is successful in NWZ and AUS, he will be my number one bowler miles ahead of Ash"hometrack"win. Ashwin deserves respect here in PP, even though india has been producing extremely spin affective wickets but his strike rate is phenomenal reminds me of ajmal :(
 
Both are good.

If one has to compare them, only basis could be how they both fared against SL, similar team, similar kind of pitches and just months apart. Ashwin edged Yasir there.
 
Slog said:
Brilliant post. POTW for me?

Who do you think has a higher ceiling?
Click to expand...

I honestly can't predict much.

Yasir seems more naturally talented to me, Ashwin wasn't as good as Yasir when he first came onto the scene, infact nowhere near. He was raw and just another good off spinner. But Ashwin is that sort of a guy who keeps experimenting with different types of deliveries trying to acquire new abilities continuously. He is even trying to bowl the leg spinner but struggling to find accuracy. He probably would be studying through the footages of the English batsmen right now at his home. I think the 2nd tour of Australia was a turning point in his career and I saw a huge change in his game only after that series. He followed it up with a very good world cup in Australia and of course his excellent test exploits since then. I've noted a change in his game even in LOIs. He struggled a bit afterwards, fell out of favour with Dhoni in the WT20 and even in the IPL. But the way he bowled on the flattest of pattas at Florida against the rampaging Windies hacks and stifled the run rate especially in the 2nd T20 was very impressive to see. He bowled in great defensive lines when they were looking to launch anything and everything out of the park while attacked when his opportunity came.

I think Ashwin is pretty much at the peak of his powers now. But I feel Yasir can develop even more as a bowler (which is a scary prospect given his exploits already). However it is really tough to guage the true worth of both bowlers unless they play against a strong spin playing side. Which is a shame because an India v Pakistan series would've done just that but unfortunately it won't happen.
 
Im surprised indians here are not claiming ashwin to be a genuine alrounded like they do in other posts. Lol. Do they know what an alrounder is? If you can hold a bat ur an alrounder according to indian definition. Lol so sir imran khan, gary sobers, abdul razzaq, and kallis are in the same category as Ashwin as genuine alrounders. I mean in that case mcgrath was also a genuine alrounder.
 
Cricfan4eva said:
Both are good.

If one has to compare them, only basis could be how they both fared against SL, similar team, similar kind of pitches and just months apart. Ashwin edged Yasir there.
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England tour

And let's see how Yasir does in Aus
 
Slog said:
England tour

And let's see how Yasir does in Aus
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Ashwin bowled in only 2 innings in England. In his first innings he went 0/29 from 14 overs and got 3/72 in his second innings (in a different match).
 
Someguy said:
Im surprised indians here are not claiming ashwin to be a genuine alrounded like they do in other posts. Lol. Do they know what an alrounder is? If you can hold a bat ur an alrounder according to indian definition. Lol so sir imran khan, gary sobers, abdul razzaq, and kallis are in the same category as Ashwin as genuine alrounders. I mean in that case mcgrath was also a genuine alrounder.
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Yea when McGrath averages in the 30s then call him an all rounder

And it's funny Ashwin averages 7 runs more with the bat than Razzaq and averages 12 less with the ball than Razzaq but he's not the all rounder in this head to head

Ashwin has played 40 matches now so certainly sample set is not an issue
 
street cricketer said:
I honestly can't predict much.

Yasir seems more naturally talented to me, Ashwin wasn't as good as Yasir when he first came onto the scene, infact nowhere near. He was raw and just another good off spinner. But Ashwin is that sort of a guy who keeps experimenting with different types of deliveries trying to acquire new abilities continuously. He is even trying to bowl the leg spinner but struggling to find accuracy. He probably would be studying through the footages of the English batsmen right now at his home. I think the 2nd tour of Australia was a turning point in his career and I saw a huge change in his game only after that series. He followed it up with a very good world cup in Australia and of course his excellent test exploits since then. I've noted a change in his game even in LOIs. He struggled a bit afterwards, fell out of favour with Dhoni in the WT20 and even in the IPL. But the way he bowled on the flattest of pattas at Florida against the rampaging Windies hacks and stifled the run rate especially in the 2nd T20 was very impressive to see. He bowled in great defensive lines when they were looking to launch anything and everything out of the park while attacked when his opportunity came.

I think Ashwin is pretty much at the peak of his powers now. But I feel Yasir can develop even more as a bowler (which is a scary prospect given his exploits already). However it is really tough to guage the true worth of both bowlers unless they play against a strong spin playing side. Which is a shame because an India v Pakistan series would've done just that but unfortunately it won't happen.
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Great comment about ash win as a student..

He seems obsessed with cricket- like a kid almost and it's refreshing to see him perform as a result.

Stil think ya sir is ahead of him as a test bowler..

What does help ash win is that he's pretty much a gun bat.
 
Slog said:
England tour

And let's see how Yasir does in Aus
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Ashwin didn't play in all the tests in England, so hardly a fair comparison. Statwise he was better but again with such low sample size its not worth comparing.

Like I said, pick anyone you would probably not go wrong but if you take into account experience and how fast Ashwin has progressed, I'd give him the edge. He's had 2 MOS in last 2 tours away for India. Albeit they came against SL and WI.
 
Yas, as he has drawn a Test series for his team in Eng, out of which he won a match single handedly for hz team, vch z some achievement.

Ashwin z yet to perform well in Eng, let alone other countries.
 
Syed1 said:
As MIG said this can only be decided if both get to face each other in the same conditions.

But as of now,

Yasir is alot more threatening and a bigger match winner for Pakistan, than Ashwin is for India. Ashwin needs help from Jaddu/Mishra/Shami/Yadav to close out an innings, Yasir on the other hand runs through batting lineups completely on his own.
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Not sure if that is correct any longer. Ashwin in last 2 years has same number of wickets as Yasir (113 vs 112 in 18 tests), picking more 5-ers (12 vs 8) and 10-fers ( 4 vs 2). Aso, almost same number of wickets of batsmen # 8-11(tail) too - 37 for Ashwin vs 34 for Yasir!

Yasir has his nose ahead purely because of what he did in England and what he is doing on relatively flatter conditions
 
street cricketer said:
I honestly can't predict much.

Yasir seems more naturally talented to me, Ashwin wasn't as good as Yasir when he first came onto the scene, infact nowhere near. He was raw and just another good off spinner. But Ashwin is that sort of a guy who keeps experimenting with different types of deliveries trying to acquire new abilities continuously. He is even trying to bowl the leg spinner but struggling to find accuracy. He probably would be studying through the footages of the English batsmen right now at his home. I think the 2nd tour of Australia was a turning point in his career and I saw a huge change in his game only after that series. He followed it up with a very good world cup in Australia and of course his excellent test exploits since then. I've noted a change in his game even in LOIs. He struggled a bit afterwards, fell out of favour with Dhoni in the WT20 and even in the IPL. But the way he bowled on the flattest of pattas at Florida against the rampaging Windies hacks and stifled the run rate especially in the 2nd T20 was very impressive to see. He bowled in great defensive lines when they were looking to launch anything and everything out of the park while attacked when his opportunity came.

I think Ashwin is pretty much at the peak of his powers now. But I feel Yasir can develop even more as a bowler (which is a scary prospect given his exploits already). However it is really tough to guage the true worth of both bowlers unless they play against a strong spin playing side. Which is a shame because an India v Pakistan series would've done just that but unfortunately it won't happen.
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India are hardly a side that is good at playing quality spin. Just because we are better than rest doesn't mean we are good.

Ashwin on other hand would have a much tougher task, if India were to face up against Pakistan with YK and Misbah.
 
Cricfan4eva said:
India are hardly a side that is good at playing quality spin. Just because we are better than rest doesn't mean we are good.

Ashwin on other hand would have a much tougher task, if India were to face up against Pakistan with YK and Misbah.
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Yeah but India have always played leggies the best. It is offies we struggle against.
 
Better bowler? Comfortably , Ashwin because he can bowl well in all formats.
 
Slog said:
Yea when McGrath averages in the 30s then call him an all rounder

And it's funny Ashwin averages 7 runs more with the bat than Razzaq and averages 12 less with the ball than Razzaq but he's not the all rounder in this head to head

Ashwin has played 40 matches now so certainly sample set is not an issue
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So you actually think ashwin is a genuine alrounder? Do you know what genuine alrounder means? It means a player who makes the team even if he were to only do one of the 2 things. So ashwin can make the indian sqaud as a batsman alone according to you? Maybe they should drop kholi and keep ashwin. Razzaq at his peak made the team for either or, so did imran , sobers, and kallis, and according to you sir ashwin as well.
 
Someguy said:
So you actually think ashwin is a genuine alrounder? Do you know what genuine alrounder means? It means a player who makes the team even if he were to only do one of the 2 things. So ashwin can make the indian sqaud as a batsman alone according to you? Maybe they should drop kholi and keep ashwin. Razzaq at his peak made the team for either or, so did imran , sobers, and kallis, and according to you sir ashwin as well.
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No Razzaq never made the team as a batsman

Also in tests Razzaq never made the team in either discipline

He was a mediocre test player a few good performances notwithstanding

Ashwin is obviously not Sobers or Imran level but from current standards he is pretty good. It's laughable you're clubbing a mediocre test player like Razzaq with sobers and Imran btw
 
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I think OP is talking about tests.

Yasir Shah Strengths

1. Excellent control for a leggie.

2. Good flight, drift and dip

3. Ability to keep the ball in the good length areas, turn a few, skid a few and pose questions to batsmen relentlessly by targeting the stumps. Can run away with games when in zone.

4. Uses the rough against lefties marvelously.....usually leggies struggle against lefties but I feel Yasir is even more threatening against lefties as he keeps landing the balls on the rough and spin it back dangerously...doesn't need good spin tracks to do this as rough gets created in almost all tracks

5. Ability to bowl super long 20+ over spells without major reduction in effectiveness (this is one area he beats Ashwin by a country mile - I know Ashwin did bowl a good 17 over spell against NZ but those are rare stuff - Yasir can maintain quality during long spells consistently)

6. Releases the ball well so there is life and the ball does have the zip from the pitch

7. Very good action. Uses his body to impart spin. Very crucial aspect outside Asia.

Yasir Shah Weaknesses

1. Doesn't bring other kinds of dismissal a lot (slips, bat pads). It will matter in pitches where there is bounce and the ball won't stay low enough to get lbws and bowled. Batsmen can camp on the backfoot and play him well with a straight bat. Needs to attempt different lines for dismissal. Sometimes bowling at stumps will work. Sometimes outside off will work. Sometimes using the crease to create various angles will work. The more lines/avenues you have, the better you chance in different situations.

2. When under pressure, goes flat and fast.

3. Doesn't use the rough outside the righties like he does for lefties.....needs to flight the ball and get righties to drive to get caught behinds and slip catches which he doesn't seem to do

4. Some say he needs to spin the ball more on flattish surfaces.

5. Needs to work on his ability to control damage when opposition goes bonkers. Can't lose it and leak runs.

Note: I haven't watched Yasir as closely as I watch Indian games. I have had a decent look at him. Will keep tweaking my views as time goes by. :)

Ashwin Strengths

1. Good enough control for an offie (but not the best).

2. Excellent command over flight, drift and dip (the best spinner in the world reg this aspect). Quite a few crucial moment wickets in the recent NZ series were due to drift mainly.

3. Targets multiple avenues of dismissal. Can bowl off-middle stump line. Can toss it outside off (without a cover) and get batsmen out. Can go around the wicket to bring about lbws, short leg with the straighter lesser spinning ball targeting slips. Also uses the crease very well.

4. Excellent use of rough against righties (which he mastered recently - even in SA series he wasn't that good with that). Can toss it up and spin the ball back in sharply creating all sorts of trouble for batsmen.

5. Other variations like straight seam up, carrom (useful against tail). Plus his LOI bowling in tests helps at times when batsmen go bonkers.

6. Can work out batsmen like crazy (feel he got really good at this once Kumble became coach). You can feel the tension in the air as he plans things.

7. Releases the ball well and the ball does do a lot once pitching too.

8. Excellent student of his craft. Knows pretty much all the technical intricacies which is why he was able to transform himself as a bowler. There are articles out there where he explains what all he did to get better (better use of wrist, body). Seems to improve some aspect of his bowling pretty much every series these days.

Ashwin Weaknesses

1. The BIGGEST weakness which can potentially cancel all his strengths. Less body to impart spin. This needs a huge explanation by itself. Haha.

Body (& pivot) matters more outside asia as you need it to generate spin and zip out of less spin tracks. Asian spinners can do well just using their shoulders and fingers but only when you use body, can you get the ball to talk on tougher pitches. Back in the days, Ashwin used very less body to impart spin. Now he has improved his fitness and uses more body but I don't think its at an optimum level (watch Swann, Yasir, Herath and you feel they use it more). Swann is his idol when it comes to using body and pivot in a pitch perfect manner. Ashwin's results on flattish tracks are much better but overseas tours (Eng, NZ, Aus and SA) are overseas tours. Unless he tours them, you cannot guarantee it. So this is his BIGGEST make or break weakness.

2. Rhythm - Not a weakness per se but it can be one which can screw him up. The more you focus on flighting the ball, the more HARDER it becomes and the more important rhythm becomes. Its easier to maintain rhythm bowling a relatively flatter line. When you aim for more, the skill level needed to succeed rises. Ashwin has shown recent instances where he has lost rhythm and got played easily before coming back. In overseas tours, this aspect will get tested even more as margin of error in those pitches will be even lesser. Needs to work on this.

3. Just like Yasir, he also needs to spin the ball more on flattish surfaces. Needs more body, revs to do that.

Conclusion

Obviously Yasir has the bragging rights to be called the better spinner in tests due to his heroics in England.

Ashwin has to wait for his chance.

If you were to ask me who is better skill wise...till SA series end too, I would have said both are equal.

But right now on pure ability, I think Ashwin shades it. Has developed even more since Kumble came in and now all the weapons he needs plus has the brains to know how to use it.

Its a constant process. If any of these 2 develop or regress or get lazy, I will change my view.

My views have got nothing to do with stats and everything to do with how they are actually bowling.

As for stats, both of them have performed almost equally well in the common grounds they played (Bangladesh, SL, Oval).
 
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As for this thread, there is no right answer. Both these bowlers have proven that they can run through the opposition even if the pitch provides slight help.

At the same time, both these bowlers have had some forgettable dry spells on surfaces that offer nothing. The only reasonable comparison can happen when they have both completed a cycle of away tours and it will take some time.
 
Haven't seen Ashwin bowl in a test ages so don't want to comment on him, never rated him from what I had seen but by all accounts he's a totally different package now. He's leaps and bounds ahead of Yasir in pyjama cricket but I can't really give a proper opinion until I see him against England.
 
Someguy said:
So you actually think ashwin is a genuine alrounder? Do you know what genuine alrounder means? It means a player who makes the team even if he were to only do one of the 2 things. So ashwin can make the indian sqaud as a batsman alone according to you? Maybe they should drop kholi and keep ashwin. Razzaq at his peak made the team for either or, so did imran , sobers, and kallis, and according to you sir ashwin as well.
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Going by that definition, there have been very few "genuine allrounders" in cricket. Kallis, Razzaq, Kapil etc wouldn't get into their team if they only had their weaker skill.
 
Someguy said:
So you actually think ashwin is a genuine alrounder? Do you know what genuine alrounder means? It means a player who makes the team even if he were to only do one of the 2 things. So ashwin can make the indian sqaud as a batsman alone according to you? Maybe they should drop kholi and keep ashwin. Razzaq at his peak made the team for either or, so did imran , sobers, and kallis, and according to you sir ashwin as well.
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Ashwin averaged 33.55 with the bat and 24.29 with the ball. Any allrounder would dream of those stats. He is definetly an allrounder in test cricket.

Abdul Razzaq played 46 matches. Averaging 28.6 with bat and 36.94 with ball

Ashwin has more 220 wickets in 39 games. Razzaq only managed 100 wickets.

Ashwin also have more hundreds then Razzaq in test matches.

Razzaq scored 1946 in 46 games and Ashwin has so far in 39 games scored 1510 runs. Only a matter of time before he goes past Razzaq.

In terms of strike rate. Razzaq strike rate was 41 and Ashwin 55.

So Ashwin is much much superior Allrounder in test compared to Ashwin.
 
I would take Yasir in tests and Ashwin in T20 and ODI.

I think Ashwin numbers don't reflect his actual ability as spinner because of the rigged pitches in India. 150+ wickets at 20 or something like that. Yasir would easily get wickets even at better average.

Even a guy like Jadeja has his wickets at redicoulus average. 64 wickets at 17.54
 
Sachin136 said:
Going by that definition, there have been very few "genuine allrounders" in cricket. Kallis, Razzaq, Kapil etc wouldn't get into their team if they only had their weaker skill.
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Are you joking. Razzaq 1999 world cup could was 1 down in batting and sometimes opened bowling. He bowled tendulker on several occasions. Kapil could make the team as either and kallis more than a handy bowler. Imran doesnt even need to be discussed and to mentio. ASHWIN with these all time greats as if they are similiar is a shame. Kapil in diff league from ashwin so respect your greats
 
Someguy said:
Are you joking. Razzaq 1999 world cup could was 1 down in batting and sometimes opened bowling. He bowled tendulker on several occasions. Kapil could make the team as either and kallis more than a handy bowler. Imran doesnt even need to be discussed and to mentio. ASHWIN with these all time greats as if they are similiar is a shame. Kapil in diff league from ashwin so respect your greats
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I believe we're discussing Test cricket here?
 
Its a pointless debate. We cannot ever know until both play against each other. No point speculating
 
Abdullah719 said:
I believe we're discussing Test cricket here?
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Fair enough so In tests Ashwin a genuine alrounder? So he
would make team as a batsman or bowler like gary sobers and imran khan. Here is the list gary sobers, imran khan and sir ashwin. Lol
 
I think [MENTION=134809]sensible-indian-fan[/MENTION] has covered both bowlers' strengths and weaknesses perfectly.

If I've to choose one, I'd go for Yasir Shah. A genuine match-winner.

May he win us matches in NZ/Aus! Same way he did in England!

PS: Can we add a poll si vous plait?
 
2 things I wanted to add to previous post (can't edit):

1. I want to see Yasir bowl in a proper rank-turner. The kind India prepares...

2. Ashwin's action must be checked outside India. (Innocent until guilty and all that but I've got a feeling if Harbhajan wasn't ever reported, no umpire will dare reporting Ashwin)
 
Someguy said:
Fair enough so In tests Ashwin a genuine alrounder? So he
would make team as a batsman or bowler like gary sobers and imran khan. Here is the list gary sobers, imran khan and sir ashwin. Lol
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By this narrow definition of an all-rounder, i.e. players who can make a team for their batting or bowling only, we would have only a handful of proper all-rounders.

If you want to be rigid, you can classify him as a bowling all-rounder.

Now can we get the discussion back on track, which is Ashwin vs Yasir as bowlers please?
 
FreakCricket said:
If Yasir Bhai is successful in NWZ and AUS, he will be my number one bowler miles ahead of Ash"hometrack"win. Ashwin deserves respect here in PP, even though india has been producing extremely spin affective wickets but his strike rate is phenomenal reminds me of ajmal :(
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Agreed, if Yasir can perform in NZ and Aus( which I don't think he can), he would have proved me wrong and done something which Ashwin will find it difficult to do. ATM, Ashwin is a much better bowler even though he bowls in more favourable conditions.
 
WhenSultansBowled said:
2 things I wanted to add to previous post (can't edit):

1. I want to see Yasir bowl in a proper rank-turner. The kind India prepares...

2. Ashwin's action must be checked outside India. (Innocent until guilty and all that but I've got a feeling if Harbhajan wasn't ever reported, no umpire will dare reporting Ashwin)
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Great points. There is an obvious jerk in his action that no umpire has dared to cover while pakistani spinnerd especially if they are successful are reported.
 
Hopefully people stop talking about Ashwin's batting, his LOI bowling, etc.

Firstly, it defeats the purpose of this thread. Everyone knows Ashwin is better in that.

Secondly, its unfair on Yasir cos this thread wasn't started with that goal.

This is like starting an Ashwin vs Andre Russell thread and people talking about Russell's hitting ability. :))

Apples to oranges really.

Is it possible to change the name of this thread to Ravi Ashwin vs Yasir Shah (As TEST Bowlers).
 
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Regarding the question in the thread title:

Indians: Ashwin

Pakistanis: Yasir

Neutrals: It depends on the balance of the team and conditions
 
Someguy said:
Are you joking. Razzaq 1999 world cup could was 1 down in batting and sometimes opened bowling. He bowled tendulker on several occasions. Kapil could make the team as either and kallis more than a handy bowler. Imran doesnt even need to be discussed and to mentio. ASHWIN with these all time greats as if they are similiar is a shame. Kapil in diff league from ashwin so respect your greats
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Kapil wouldn't make the team as a batsmen. Being a "handy" bowler is not enough to get in an ATG SA side.

I'm not comparing Kapil and Ashwin as allrounders.
 
Abdullah719 said:
By this narrow definition of an all-rounder, i.e. players who can make a team for their batting or bowling only, we would have only a handful of proper all-rounders.

If you want to be rigid, you can classify him as a bowling all-rounder.

Now can we get the discussion back on track, which is Ashwin vs Yasir as bowlers please?
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You are absolutely correct sir. There have only been a handful of cricketers in history who can be called genuine alrounnders, therefore, indians using the term so freely takes away from the prestige of the title, especially someone saying Ashwin is a genuine alrounder. Thats all im saying.
 
Someguy said:
Fair enough so In tests Ashwin a genuine alrounder? So he
would make team as a batsman or bowler like gary sobers and imran khan. Here is the list gary sobers, imran khan and sir ashwin. Lol
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May be not for his batting, but he would make any team right now for his off spin, easily the best off spinner since Murali if you consider him to be a bowler.
 
Sachin136 said:
Kapil wouldn't make the team as a batsmen. Being a "handy" bowler is not enough to get in an ATG SA side.

I'm not comparing Kapil and Ashwin as allrounders.
Click to expand...

I think it depends on the time periods too - in the 80s, Kapil may very well have deserved a spot as a batsman alone at 6 but now in the 2010s, where 6 is a specialist spot, he may not deserve selection.
 
Haroon786 said:
May be not for his batting, but he would make any team right now for his off spin, easily the best off spinner since Murali if you consider him to be a bowler.
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Best off spinner since murli? Ever heard of a little fellow nick named saqi, invented his own ball? Anyone know who im talking about?
 
Ashwin

Daylight

Yasir >/= Amit Mishra.

Yasir is a good bowler but currently Ashwin is on a whole new level.
 
Yeah they played the same time as well so it goes back to their debut rather than retirement genius.
 
Mr. Lion said:
Ashwin

Daylight

Yasir >/= Amit Mishra.

Yasir is a good bowler but currently Ashwin is on a whole new level.
Click to expand...

Amit Mishra ain't even in the same planet as Yasir mate.

Bowls too slow. Doesn't get much purchase off the flatter pitches.
 
Shows how balanced our indian friends are, comparing mishra to yasir and saying there is daylight between ashwin and yasir when all ashwin has done is get wicketd vs the weakest teams vs spin (nz) that too on dust bowl pitches. Delusional at best.
 
Someguy said:
Shows how balanced our indian friends are, comparing mishra to yasir and saying there is daylight between ashwin and yasir when all ashwin has done is get wicketd vs the weakest teams vs spin (nz) that too on dust bowl pitches. Delusional at best.
Click to expand...


R we talking about the same newzealand team which comprehensively beat Pakistan in ODI series and drew the test series the last time they Vist UAE? And for ur kind information they actually scored a mammoth 600+ in the third test and won the last test by an innings. :yk


So if they were so bad against spin how did they actually manage to do that. Or do u believe that players suddenly become legendary players of spin when they visit UAE and strangely the same players can't even hold the bat properly against spinners when they visit India. :uakmal
 
street cricketer said:
I do not know much of Yasir's weaknesses because I haven't watched him bowl as much as I have watched Ashwin bowl.

Ashwin's advantages are I think his flight and accuracy. He turns the ball a lot as well. In comparison, Yasir is a skiddy type of bowler who bowls with subtle variations and isn't as big a turner of the ball as you generally expect with leggies. He generally is always at the stumps, so his skiddy pace sort of hurries on to the batsman even on flat tracks which is why I think he may do better on flat tracks than Ashwin.

Ashwin is a very intelligent bowler, he said in the presentation ceremony after his MoS award that he knew Boult was coming for the tour and that could make use of his footmarks. He is an astute student of the game who watches almost every cricket match that goes on around the world. He is a bowler who can take advantage of the slightest slowness in the track or rough patches around the crease. But I don't think he has that skiddy pace of Yasir, I'm not even sure whether finger spinners can have that quality. Yasir to me is more of a natural bowler who has been effective even with very little variations. Ashwin is like a student who keeps developing and acquiring different abilities and variations with experience.

As for their disadvantages, like I said above, Ashwin may struggle on unconducive tracks - he did take a 5fer on a batting track in the first innings at Indore, but I would want to see him do that against England which has a much more potent batting line up. Yasir atm doesn't have too many problems as he is picking truckloads of wickets even with minimal variations. If I'm being picky, I would say that he needs to work on his googly and also on his leg spinner more in terms of different line and lengths because he may struggle a bit if the batsmen decide to play him as an inswing bowler. Think he also needs to adopt a different line outside off and bring caught behind into play if plan A isn't working. He probably will find a way to deceive the batsmen even then using his guile.
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I missed this post but what you said about skiddiness is so true. Keeps at the stumps and asks a lot of questions. He just needs a touch turn and grip to cause problems.

That's a weapon Yasir has which Ashwin will probably never have.

Its a HUGE HUGE weapon in flatter tracks.

Imagine Yasir flighting the ball more and bringing in other forms of dismissal into the game. Can be a monster really.
 
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sensible-indian-fan said:
Amit Mishra ain't even in the same planet as Yasir mate.

Bowls too slow. Doesn't get much purchase off the flatter pitches.
Click to expand...

Yes, at the moment yasir is definitely better in tests, but u can't say that there's much difference between them in Odis. Actually Amit is ahead in this format to be completely honest.


I was really impressed after watching amit's performance in the 3rd odi against NZ. The only problem he has is that he tries too many things instead of focusing on his stock deliveries.
 
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Mr. Lion said:
Yes, at the moment yasir is definitely better in tests, but u can't say that there's much difference between them in Odis. Actually Amit is ahead in this format to be completely honest.


I was really impressed after watching amit's performance in the 3rd odi against NZ. The only problem he has is that he tries too many things instead of focusing on his stock deliveries.
Click to expand...

We are talking about tests. I don't think the thread is about ODIs or overall cos Yasir in LOI isn't a good bowler.

Amit Mishra is a far superior ODI bowler to Yasir. Lots of bowlers are.

But he crumbles when attacked.

Not a reliable ODI bowler for the long run. Will flatter to deceive just like in the past. He debuted for India in 2003. :(
 
Someguy said:
Shows how balanced our indian friends are, comparing mishra to yasir and saying there is daylight between ashwin and yasir when all ashwin has done is get wicketd vs the weakest teams vs spin (nz) that too on dust bowl pitches. Delusional at best.
Click to expand...

Not a single pitch in the recent Ind-NZ series was a dust bowl. Watch the match before commenting please.
 
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