Russia invades Ukraine

[Abel Reames]

This notion that Democracy is the best model of government is at worst a hoax, and at best a myth.

Democracy is the West is a sham, choice between 2 leaders, and years and years of bickering with no progress. This is why UK and USA (examples) have steadily declined socially, politically, and economically. Oh, liberals then try to overturn democratic results they don't like.

UAE, China, Russia, no democracy but my word, economically these countries are flying high.

You have a point democracies seem to be hamstrung by the fact that they need to be voted back in and therefore have to make shorter term policies whereas the like of China can make plans for the next 20, 25 years. But again I ask would you rather live here or Russia/China?

 

[Technics 1210]

You have a point democracies seem to be hamstrung by the fact that they need to be voted back in and therefore have to make shorter term policies whereas the like of China can make plans for the next 20, 25 years. But again I ask would you rather live here or Russia/China?

Why have you missed out UAE from the list of places I would rather live?

Russia and China have progressed, Though I wouldn’t live in any of these countries because of the cultural/language barrier, not because I cannot protest or speak up against governments because none of that even matters in the UK. No protest in the UK has ever lead to change, our voices and critisim never amount to anything, and they only way to enforce change is to run as a politician, but even this is a mug’s game. As for privacy, we have none in the UK, not anymore.

To answer you previous post, liberalism is not just about rights. Libya was light years ahead in terms of rights; free education, women’s education, jobs, free housing, water, electricity etc. Afghanistan in the 50s and 60s could be mistaken for the West, again equal rights for men and women, Iran too, the list goes on, but no, Western Liberal democracies have a better idea, to bomb the living daylights out of a nation which doesn’t adopt Western values, such as Homosexual marriages, parading women as sexual objects, debt based economies, etc etc.

Western Liberalism has killed Millions; through war, through economic sanctions, and through regime change. This idea of speaking out against governments with useless rights to protest isn’t the beacon of civilisation same claim it to be. Many just want to live their lives with their families, work, have food on the table etc - the simple things in life.

 

[Robert]

Hi Robert, indeed it is like a gang mentality with overriding masculinity and patriarchy.

Hello [MENTION=154981]Abel Reames[/MENTION]. I would add the xenophobia, cronyism, anti-intellectualism, and personality cult.

 

[Technics 1210]

Ukraine has labelled Russia a "terrorist state" after Moscow's UK embassy tweeted that Ukrainian Azov battalion soldiers deserved a "humiliating death" by hanging.

Twitter acknowledged that the post from the Russian embassy violated the social media company's "rules about hateful conduct" - but added that it may be in the public interest to keep it accessible.

------

Even Twitter is on the act, a tweet violates its rules, but lets leave the tweet online because its in the public's interest to view Russia as the bogeyman.

Pathetic hypocrisy from Twitter.

 

[bones]

Have you seen the videos of these little glide bombs that have been used by the Ukrainian forces on Donetsk? These are child killers pellet bombs that are spread all over.

You won’t hear a peep about it from western mainstream media.

 

[Robert]

Have you seen the videos of these little glide bombs that have been used by the Ukrainian forces on Donetsk? These are child killers pellet bombs that are spread all over.

You won’t hear a peep about it from western mainstream media.

Sounds like a regular area denial weapon to me. You forget who is the aggressor here. Putin invaded. He alone is the cause of all the suffering. Ukrainians are just defending their land from hm.

 

[Robert]

The thing you hate Liberalism gave you the liberties that you sit on and allow you to breathe comfortably. Race Relation Act(s), welfare safety net are the fruits of liberalism not conservatism. The fact that females can go to work, have a bank account not be raped in marriage are the results of liberalism.

The end of slavery
The right to choose your own leaders
The right to a fair trial
Free speech
Free press
Habeus corpus
Pension so you don’t have to work until death
The end of child labour
Votes for women
Work for women
Anti corruption laws
Welfare state
Equality legislation for all races, religions, disabled people, LGBTQ+
Abortion rights

Has liberalism ever caused a war? Capitalism has caused plenty.

For example:

Lincoln: I am going to abolish slavery.
Southern slave owners: You can’t take our property, we are seceding and prepared to go to war with you.
Lincoln: (humming Battle Hymn of the Republic) Ok, we are prepared to die to make men free. We are not going to profit from this, quite the reverse, but liberty is more important to us than money.
Slavers, Come and rob us then! See how far you get!

Hundreds of thousands of Americans then died in a war. Was it worth it to free the slaves? The liberals say yes, a terrible price was placed on the altar of freedom. They and others like them forged out the peace, freedom and harmony that we in the West enjoy today.

Is it perfect? No. Does it make awful mistakes? Yes, sometimes.

But the alternative is far, far worse.

The alternative is to let some despot take over. You could live out a pleasant life under the despot, enjoying family and work and video games and music and a decent standard of living; turning a blind eye when your brother or wife or father or child or best mate disappears off the street for criticism of the despot, and never speaking of them again to ensure that you don’t disappear too. Ok, if all you want is to live a safe, craven life on your knees.

This is slowly starting to happen in UK. Civil
liberties eroded. Rampant cronyism. Who is to blame? Not us. Blame those Others for it all. You know the ones we mean. Those immigrants. Those intellectuals. Those dark skinned ones. Those Europeans. Those Irish. Those Muslims. They’re not like us. They have a different god. They think differently. Those are the ones whose fault it is for the food banks and the NHS crumbling. Those over there. They are to blame. Those different ones. Not us. We look like you. We’re on your side. Vote for us and we’ll protect you from those Others.

Some of us see it happening, some of us see the liberal protections built up over centuries being taken away by stealth, and are working to try to stop it.

 

[bones]

Sounds like a regular area denial weapon to me. You forget who is the aggressor here. Putin invaded. He alone is the cause of all the suffering. Ukrainians are just defending their land from hm.

Not at all. If this was used and aimed at troops on the frontline understandable but in a city where kids and animals and other civilians could accidentally step on them is evil. What makes it even worse is that they do no damage to tanks or heavy equipment. They are targeting just people.

The root cause of the suffering is not putin it is America. Why couldn’t they just leave Ukraine alone? Had Ukraine not amassed nato trained forces in the northern Donbas area then there would have been no invasion.

The Americans are perhaps try to pick another fight with china over Taiwan.

It’s America. It’s always America who are picking fights and poking their nose everywhere. The sad part is they fool everyone into thinking that the other side is to blame.

 

[Abel Reames]

Why have you missed out UAE from the list of places I would rather live?

I will ask now why don't you use your free will and move there? Language and culture barriers are not so high.

Russia and China have progressed, Though I wouldn’t live in any of these countries because of the cultural/language barrier, not because I cannot protest or speak up against governments because none of that even matters in the UK. No protest in the UK has ever lead to change, our voices and critisim never amount to anything, and they only way to enforce change is to run as a politician, but even this is a mug’s game. As for privacy, we have none in the UK, not anymore.

What do you mean by protests? Protests take many forms, as well as boots on the ground there is government lobbying and letters to MP's. I see that Robert has written a far more extensive list than I was going to muster, my contribution was going to be how else do you think women got the vote? How else did we get union rights, how else did we get gay rights? How else did we get minorities right, how else was the poll tax dismissed? New laws are enacted all the time, change is constant. These are due to protests and lobbying. Local groups can change the routes and make up of dangerous roads. Our local Asian community blocked the main thouroughfare of our town and got a community centre.

To answer you previous post, liberalism is not just about rights. Libya was light years ahead in terms of rights; free education, women’s education, jobs, free housing, water, electricity etc. Afghanistan in the 50s and 60s could be mistaken for the West, again equal rights for men and women, Iran too, the list goes on, but no, Western Liberal democracies have a better idea, to bomb the living daylights out of a nation which doesn’t adopt Western values, such as Homosexual marriages, parading women as sexual objects, debt based economies, etc etc.

There is so much to unpick here, you are all over the place. Clearly you don't understand geopolitics, it is not about beliefs and ideologies the way you think it is about, it is the about geopoloitics and the great chessboard and the seeking of power and resources. You can't blame liberalism per se even if that is used by the aggressors to rationalise their actions. If the aggressors are liberal democracies they have to rationalise to appease their masses. Dictators don't need to appease their masses, Sadaam Hussain did not need any rationalisation to invade Kuwait.

Western Liberalism has killed Millions; through war, through economic sanctions, and through regime change. This idea of speaking out against governments with useless rights to protest isn’t the beacon of civilisation same claim it to be. Many just want to live their lives with their families, work, have food on the table etc - the simple things in life.

I put it to you that religion and totalitarianism is killed far more than western liberalisation.

 

[Abel Reames]

The end of slavery
The right to choose your own leaders
The right to a fair trial
Free speech
Free press
Habeus corpus
Pension so you don’t have to work until death
The end of child labour
Votes for women
Work for women
Anti corruption laws
Welfare state
Equality legislation for all races, religions, disabled people, LGBTQ+
Abortion rights

Has liberalism ever caused a war? Capitalism has caused plenty.

For example:

Lincoln: I am going to abolish slavery.
Southern slave owners: You can’t take our property, we are seceding and prepared to go to war with you.
Lincoln: (humming Battle Hymn of the Republic) Ok, we are prepared to die to make men free. We are not going to profit from this, quite the reverse, but liberty is more important to us than money.
Slavers, Come and rob us then! See how far you get!

Hundreds of thousands of Americans then died in a war. Was it worth it to free the slaves? The liberals say yes, a terrible price was placed on the altar of freedom. They and others like them forged out the peace, freedom and harmony that we in the West enjoy today.

Is it perfect? No. Does it make awful mistakes? Yes, sometimes.

But the alternative is far, far worse.

The alternative is to let some despot take over. You could live out a pleasant life under the despot, enjoying family and work and video games and music and a decent standard of living; turning a blind eye when your brother or wife or father or child or best mate disappears off the street for criticism of the despot, and never speaking of them again to ensure that you don’t disappear too. Ok, if all you want is to live a safe, craven life on your knees.

This is slowly starting to happen in UK. Civil
liberties eroded. Rampant cronyism. Who is to blame? Not us. Blame those Others for it all. You know the ones we mean. Those immigrants. Those intellectuals. Those dark skinned ones. Those Europeans. Those Irish. Those Muslims. They’re not like us. They have a different god. They think differently. Those are the ones whose fault it is for the food banks and the NHS crumbling. Those over there. They are to blame. Those different ones. Not us. We look like you. We’re on your side. Vote for us and we’ll protect you from those Others.

Some of us see it happening, some of us see the liberal protections built up over centuries being taken away by stealth, and are working to try to stop it.

Hi Robert. potw.

 

[Technics 1210]

I will ask now why don't you use your free will and move there? Language and culture barriers are not so high.



What do you mean by protests? Protests take many forms, as well as boots on the ground there is government lobbying and letters to MP's. I see that Robert has written a far more extensive list than I was going to muster, my contribution was going to be how else do you think women got the vote? How else did we get union rights, how else did we get gay rights? How else did we get minorities right, how else was the poll tax dismissed? New laws are enacted all the time, change is constant. These are due to protests and lobbying. Local groups can change the routes and make up of dangerous roads. Our local Asian community blocked the main thouroughfare of our town and got a community centre.



There is so much to unpick here, you are all over the place. Clearly you don't understand geopolitics, it is not about beliefs and ideologies the way you think it is about, it is the about geopoloitics and the great chessboard and the seeking of power and resources. You can't blame liberalism per se even if that is used by the aggressors to rationalise their actions. If the aggressors are liberal democracies they have to rationalise to appease their masses. Dictators don't need to appease their masses, Sadaam Hussain did not need any rationalisation to invade Kuwait.



I put it to you that religion and totalitarianism is killed far more than western liberalisation.

You haven’t answered any of my points. You have ignored the fact that liberalism is not about rights or equality (your claim) given the rights you boast about existed in the ME long before the West bombed the region.

You have not addressed the point of protest, here’s a clue, name me one protest that has lead to change in the UK? Iraq war protest should be another clue.

Your example of woman’s rights, is a simple case of the West playing catch-up with the ME, or rather, was. Gay rights you say? Who said claimed Gay rights is progression? The West? Naaah, it doesn’t work like that. Just cos the West say so, doesn’t make it so - this is in away dictatorship.

 

[bones]

Remember several weeks ago when some our friends on PakPassion in this thread claimed the Russians were running out of missiles? Mikolaiv was hit with more missile today than at any point in the war so far. Will those members say they were wrong and they underestimatedthe Russian military industrial production?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62367356

 

[Abel Reames]

You haven’t answered any of my points. You have ignored the fact that liberalism is not about rights or equality (your claim) given the rights you boast about existed in the ME long before the West bombed the region.

You have not addressed the point of protest, here’s a clue, name me one protest that has lead to change in the UK? Iraq war protest should be another clue.

Your example of woman’s rights, is a simple case of the West playing catch-up with the ME, or rather, was. Gay rights you say? Who said claimed Gay rights is progression? The West? Naaah, it doesn’t work like that. Just cos the West say so, doesn’t make it so - this is in away dictatorship.

It was not my claim I gave you the definition of liberalism, it is not the fault of liberalism that it is used by capitalistic powers in geopolitics to secure power and resources. You ask for one protest I asked you for your definition of protest, I assume with your example of Iraq it is a demonstration on the streets rather than a movement or lobbying behind the scenes. If that is the case I give you the Poll Tax Riots of 1990.

The west has caught up and surpassed the ME in terms of women's right. And you havent addressed my rebuttal to your point about liberalism being the most destructive ideology, I would say religion and totalitarianism have been.

 

[Technics 1210]

Remember several weeks ago when some our friends on PakPassion in this thread claimed the Russians were running out of missiles? Mikolaiv was hit with more missile today than at any point in the war so far. Will those members say they were wrong and they underestimatedthe Russian military industrial production?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62367356

The MSM apologists have been silent of late and reality is settling in. MSM now admitting Russia is winning the economic war and Putin has Europe by the crown jewels.

Russia is winning this war, nations outside of the West (NA, Europe, Australia, New Zealand, and Japan), support Putin, whether publicly or privately, but the MSM can only report so much, in the UK the Tory leadership is frontoage news, and in the USA, Biden’s incompetence.

 

[Technics 1210]

It was not my claim I gave you the definition of liberalism, it is not the fault of liberalism that it is used by capitalistic powers in geopolitics to secure power and resources. You ask for one protest I asked you for your definition of protest, I assume with your example of Iraq it is a demonstration on the streets rather than a movement or lobbying behind the scenes. If that is the case I give you the Poll Tax Riots of 1990.

The west has caught up and surpassed the ME in terms of women's right. And you havent addressed my rebuttal to your point about liberalism being the most destructive ideology, I would say religion and totalitarianism have been.

I answered why Liberalism is the most destructive ideology. You cannot answer a question with a question.

Yes easy for the West to catch up with the ME, I means 80 years of relentless and indiscriminate bombing would set any region back.

Your definition of liberalism is wrong, I used examples in the ME of equality and rights as an example given liberalism and democracy do not exist in the ME, yet equality, rights did under authoritarianism and totalitarianism.

Poll tax riots? Wrong again, poll tax was never repealed, but transformed into council tax under John Major.

 

[Abel Reames]

I answered why Liberalism is the most destructive ideology. You cannot answer a question with a question.

What was my question? To me destructive would mean most deaths and religion and totalitarianism has caused far more deaths, do you disagree?

Yes easy for the West to catch up with the ME, I means 80 years of relentless and indiscriminate bombing would set any region back.

The catching up was in regards to women's rights. How does bombing lead to denying women education?

Your definition of liberalism is wrong, I used examples in the ME of equality and rights as an example given liberalism and democracy do not exist in the ME, yet equality, rights did under authoritarianism and totalitarianism.

Freedom of religion? Criticism of religion?

Poll tax riots? Wrong again, poll tax was never repealed, but transformed into council tax under John Major.

The council tax was not the poll tax under a different name tho I guess you admit it was 'transformed' which wouldn't have happened if not for the protests.

 

[Technics 1210]

What was my question? To me destructive would mean most deaths and religion and totalitarianism has caused far more deaths, do you disagree?



The catching up was in regards to women's rights. How does bombing lead to denying women education?



Freedom of religion? Criticism of religion?



The council tax was not the poll tax under a different name tho I guess you admit it was 'transformed' which wouldn't have happened if not for the protests.

The protests for Poll tax were to ABOLISH the tax, it didn't happen, instead the government rebranded the tax and citizens still had to pay the tax regardless of the name change. Do you live in the UK or are you relying on Wiki? In either case, Protest and Democracy are an illusion in the West.

Decades of Weatern liberal bombing in the ME has lead to the rise of right-wing extremists running the countries now. Mission accomplished by the West! Power vacuums filled. You seem to be ignoring the fact that prior to Western Liberal intervention, women had equal rights in the ME and access to all education.

Look, it is clear you have nothing to say on matter pertaining this thread, that is, the battle of ideological values between the West and Russia. You confuse Empires with Ideologies, and you certainly have a bee in the bonnet over religion.

 

[Manunited18]

The protests for Poll tax were to ABOLISH the tax, it didn't happen, instead the government rebranded the tax and citizens still had to pay the tax regardless of the name change. Do you live in the UK or are you relying on Wiki? In either case, Protest and Democracy are an illusion in the West.

Decades of Weatern liberal bombing in the ME has lead to the rise of right-wing extremists running the countries now. Mission accomplished by the West! Power vacuums filled. You seem to be ignoring the fact that prior to Western Liberal intervention, women had equal rights in the ME and access to all education.

Look, it is clear you have nothing to say on matter pertaining this thread, that is, the battle of ideological values between the West and Russia. You confuse Empires with Ideologies, and you certainly have a bee in the bonnet over religion.

Wasting your time bro. Your schooling seems to be falling on deaf ears.

 

[Robert]

Hi Robert. potw.

Thanks.

Have a read of Ian Dunt's book How to be a Liberal. It explains the historical development of the philosophy of liberalism and the legal developments underpinning our society in an entertaining way. It is a clarion call, desperately needed in these times where the freedoms which Britons take for granted are under threat by an authoritarian hard right government with its big business and Kremlin cronies.

 

[Technics 1210]

Western liberals should just keep quiet about freedom and their hypocrisy. How dare these liberal fascists and racists profess freedom when the West invoked regime change in Iran during the 50s after Iran elected a a President DEMOCRATICALLY. Iran had democracy, had equal rights, freedoms, but the Zionist controlled West were not content. Indeed, the aim of Judeo-Christian alliance is to attack Islam, even when democracy is the ME was alive and well.

Now the same religious alliance is trapped in a corner vs Russia. West cannot invoke regime change in Russia. Cannot (dare not) bomb Russia, and will now pay the price. Fools think this will end when Putin is dead.

Russia is winning the war, politically, economically, and ideologically, and the cherry on the cake will be when Iran tests its first nuclear warhead. Then these Western bullies will cry all the way home, if they aren't already.

 

[Junaids]

Western liberals should just keep quiet about freedom and their hypocrisy. How dare these liberal fascists and racists profess freedom when the West invoked regime change in Iran during the 50s after Iran elected a a President DEMOCRATICALLY. Iran had democracy, had equal rights, freedoms, but the Zionist controlled West were not content. Indeed, the aim of Judeo-Christian alliance is to attack Islam, even when democracy is the ME was alive and well.

Another sensational example of you spectacularly failing to comprehend simple history.

You think that a "Zionist-controlled West" overthrew the Iranian government in 1953.

Seriously? I mean, seriously?

I do not dispute for a second that the US and UK conspired to do this, although they actually just strengthened the position of the existing Iranian monarch, the Shah.

But to see the hand of Israel in this is absolute historical clownery.

Israel was the west's ENEMY in 1953. It had achieved independence 5 years earlier by a campaign of terrorism against the UK, and had gone down a path of left-wing government and kibbutzism, which was a fairly pure version of communism.

The British Foreign Office and the American State Department made absolutely no secret of being on the Arabs' side at that point in history.

In fact, the reason why the Suez Conflict of late 1956 ended up with the USA ordering Britain and France to withdraw was because the Americans could not stomach the idea of key allies being in bed with Israel.

The Suez campaign by Britain, France and Israel in November 1956 was a total military success. But the Americans finished it off because they would not tolerate us getting into bed with Israel, and indeed President Eisenhower sought economic sanctions AGAINST ISRAEL.

So please save us your drivel about Zionist conspiracies in 1953. Israel was an enemy of the USA then - not an ally.

 

[Junaids]

Western liberals should just keep quiet about freedom and their hypocrisy. How dare these liberal fascists and racists profess freedom when the West invoked regime change in Iran during the 50s after Iran elected a a President DEMOCRATICALLY. Iran had democracy, had equal rights, freedoms, but the Zionist controlled West were not content. Indeed, the aim of Judeo-Christian alliance is to attack Islam, even when democracy is the ME was alive and well.

Now the same religious alliance is trapped in a corner vs Russia. West cannot invoke regime change in Russia. Cannot (dare not) bomb Russia, and will now pay the price. Fools think this will end when Putin is dead.

Russia is winning the war, politically, economically, and ideologically, and the cherry on the cake will be when Iran tests its first nuclear warhead. Then these Western bullies will cry all the way home, if they aren't already.

You should watch the classic British comedy "Yes Prime Minister", and specifically the episode "A Victory for Democracy".

You will see that it is universally accepted in the UK that the government's Foreign Office is entirely on the side of the Arabs. And nothing has changed!

 

[Technics 1210]

Israel was an enemy of the USA then - not an ally.

Save the pendantry and go get a refund on your history classes.

Nothing to do with Isreal being an ally of USA; it was mainly the MI6 with the help of CIA at the behest of Zionists that overturned the democratically elected President of Iran. Zionists aim was to destabilise the region, and this goal continues today.

Amreeka supported the creation of a Jewish homeland in 1948; best not forget how Zionist were funding Amreeka during WW1 and the subsequent Balfour declaration with UK government.

Stop pretending Zionists had no influence on the West pre WW2, or even a relationship with Amreeka/UK before the 50s, it makes you liberals more desperate than you already are.

 

[Technics 1210]

In other news......

President Abdelmadjid Tebboune has suggested that the North African country largely meets the requirements for joining the group

Algerian President Abdelmadjid Tebboune has reportedly said that his country is interested in joining the BRICS and is close to qualifying for membership in the group.

Algeria largely meets the conditions for joining BRICS already, Tebboune said on Sunday in an interview with a state-owned broadcaster. The group is named for its member states – Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa – and it plans to consider adding Saudi Arabia, Turkey and Egypt at its summit next year.

---------

BRICS+ alliance in full swing. Yay!

 

[Technics 1210]

You should watch the classic British comedy "Yes Prime Minister", and specifically the episode "A Victory for Democracy".

You will see that it is universally accepted in the UK that the government's Foreign Office is entirely on the side of the Arabs. And nothing has changed!

Has the penny dropped yet? Yes it is a joke the UK's government FO is entirely on the side of Arabs, that's why Yes Prime Minister is a comedy/satire show! LOL!

 

[Junaids]

Save the pendantry and go get a refund on your history classes.

Nothing to do with Isreal being an ally of USA; it was mainly the MI6 with the help of CIA at the behest of Zionists that overturned the democratically elected President of Iran. Zionists aim was to destabilise the region, and this goal continues today.
.

So you think that in 1953 the British, whose troops and civilians in Palestine had been murdered by Zionist terrorists as recently as 1948, were acting in concert with the same Zionists who had been murdering them?

All this while Britain was still for another decade the sovereign power in Aden, which is now South Yemen, trying to maintain British rule over a population which was 90% Arab.

So we were in bed with the people who had been killing us? Undermining our own Arab colonies?

 

[Junaids]

Has the penny dropped yet? Yes it is a joke the UK's government FO is entirely on the side of Arabs, that's why Yes Prime Minister is a comedy/satire show! LOL!

Have you ever paid attention to the UK's closeness to Jordan? The King of Jordan is actually English! Or our arms sales to Saudi Arabia, from the Tornado to the Typhoon?

 

[MenInG]

Thread needs to center around Ukraine war.

All other topics for other threads

 

[Robert]

So you think that in 1953 the British, whose troops and civilians in Palestine had been murdered by Zionist terrorists as recently as 1948, were acting in concert with the same Zionists who had been murdering them?

All this while Britain was still for another decade the sovereign power in Aden, which is now South Yemen, trying to maintain British rule over a population which was 90% Arab.

So we were in bed with the people who had been killing us? Undermining our own Arab colonies?

[MENTION=132916]Junaids[/MENTION], many on PP seem to believe in a kind of Schrödinger’s Zionist - controlling all governments while simultaneously being slaughtered in pogroms down history. Influencing Hitler while simultaneously dying in Nazi death factories.

There is no reasoning with conspiracy thinkers - at best you have been “brainwashed” by the “MSM” while at worst you become woven into the conspiracy.

All you can do is politely disengage.

 

[Abel Reames]

Shrodinger's Zionist - Elements of Ukrainians are simultaneously Zionist and Nazis. And Zionists also support Russia. It is like McCarthy finding reds under every bed.

 

[Robert]

Shrodinger's Zionist - Elements of Ukrainians are simultaneously Zionist and Nazis. And Zionists also support Russia. It is like McCarthy finding reds under every bed.

Yep, another iteration of this strange quantum beast that is all things at once in a political superposition....

 

[Technics 1210]

I feel so sorry for the Liberals who champion freedom and choice but in reality are slaves to the Zionist controlled MSM, and subservient to Zionist propaganda, actually I do not feel sorry.

Maybe one day these so called *free thinking* liberals will break free of the Zionist shackles and speak their own mind, because right now they dare not speak against Zionism in fear of being labelled anti-Semitic by their masters, despite the litany of empirical evidence of Zionists funding wars via US Congress, US Senate, AIPAC, NATO, UK Government, and of course, Ukraine.

Russia, the rest of the world is with you, defeat the Zionists, and defeat Liberalism!

 

[Junaids]

Russia, the rest of the world is with you, defeat the Zionists, and defeat Liberalism!

Make your mind up.

Are the Ukrainians Nazis or Zionists? Because the two are pretty much mutually exclusive.

Next you will be blaming the Black Lives Matter division of the Ku Klux Klan.

 

[Technics 1210]

Make your mind up.

Are the Ukrainians Nazis or Zionists? Because the two are pretty much mutually exclusive.

Zionists are funding Nazis in Ukraine. If you cannot understand the difference then I cannot help you.

Let me be clear, Zionists are COMPLICT, and Russia shall defeat them, Inshallah!

 

[KingKhanWC]

By definition, liberal people are more opposed to war.

But you listed four places:

1. The Falklands voted by a margin of 99.8% against two (literally 2 votes) to stay British in 2013. And both the two voting no wanted joint sovereignty. Literally 0 people wanted to be forced to become Argentinian.

2. Saddam Hussein was an evil dictator who gassed his own people.

3. Muammar Gaddafi was an evil clown who sponsored terrorism.

4. Israel is the only democracy in the entire Middle East, and its Arab population lives a massively better life than any Arab people in Arab countries. (I’m talking Israel, where 20% of the citizens are Arabs, not the occupied territories which are mismanaged by evil Hamas and corrupt Fatah).

I’m no fan of Likud, but from now on I’m going to challenge anti-Semitic content on this forum.

The falklands is a colonised land with all white Brits, of course they will want to remain. What a daft argument. lol.

Saddam and Gaddafi didnt do 1% of the evil the Brits and Yanks did, besides its a pathetic and morally disgusting excuse after destroying two countries and killing so many.

Israel is not a democracy, its an occupying apartheid state.

Criticising Israel is not anti-semitic. You have little basic knowledge, so I'll inform you Arabs are also semitic.

Big deal. Try getting into India.

)

Why would I want to? I dont support India, as you support the terrorist state of Israel. Go Israel, they will abuse you on arrival, because of your name and colour of your skin but even if they beat you, im sure you will still say sorry to them?

Russia is liberating the east of Ukraine and no matter how much rant and use idiotic arguments, they have won and are changing history, turning Europe into a broke continent. The days of looting for Europe are no longer present, they must learn to live with Russia. They simply dont have the power to do anything else.

 

[Technics 1210]

Ukraines's comedy President had time for a photo-shoot with his wife for Vogue magazine while his people are alledgly fighting for Western values. What a berk.

What a comedian! Pretends he cares about his people when in reality he is funded by Zionists, armed by NATO, and photoshopped by Vogue!

https://www.newsweek.com/zelensky-v...ublic-russia-conflict-annie-leibovitz-1728470

Pathetic excuse of a leader, that to of an Amreekan puppet.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Ukraines's comedy President had time for a photo-shoot with his wife for Vogue magazine while his people are alledgly fighting for Western values. What a berk.

What a comedian! Pretends he cares about his people when in reality he is funded by Zionists, armed by NATO, and photoshopped by Vogue!

https://www.newsweek.com/zelensky-v...ublic-russia-conflict-annie-leibovitz-1728470

Pathetic excuse of a leader, that to of an Amreekan puppet.

)

But apparently his country is on the brink of and is fighting the greatest fight in history to save the world from evil Putin. .....But take a couple of hours for vogue.

The stupidity of anti-Russians to support this Nato proxy war.

 

[cpleigh]

The nukes UK have are from USA, and USA authorise the use of the nukes - welcome to Trident program. The reduction in military and defence spending in the UK (and Europe), is purely down to the reliance on NATO, or better put, Amreeka will come help save the day when Europe is under attack, and Europe pays an annual subscription for this service at a tune of 2% GDP.

Alas! Amreekan foreign policy is dictated, and funded, by Zionists (via AIPAC), who have pulled a blinder. On one hand they have convinced Europe to reduce spending on military/defence through a false promise, and on the other hand, have weakened Europe in terms of military thus increasing the reliance on Amreeka. The result is what you see now, a helpless Europe now at the mercy of Russia, with Amreeka negotiating a prisoner swap instead of peace.

Syria and Afghanistan wars were nothing to do with liberation, but more to do with regime change (classic Amreekan tactic), which only benefits Isreal as its neighbours are weakened and economically destroyed. The sad part is the Western liberals have lapped up the MSM propaganda - liberation, democracy, and change! The irony being Liberalism is all about freedom and choice, yet Western Liberal Democracies are enforcing their values on others.

Amreeka has no responsibility to the world. Not a single country in the ME, or around the world, that has been at the receiving end of Western bombings, laid a finger on Western soil. The West does not control the world, time to get off this high horse that is nothing but a racist and fascist endeavour underpinned by the Judeo-Christian alliance. (Yup, Zimbabwe was not liberated from a brutal dictator because you guessed it, Zimbabwe is a Christian country).

The UK doesn't need any approval from thr US to use it nukes. That's a lie. More lies from you.

Also Europe doesn't need America to bail them out. The UK and France together would take care of Russia

 

[Technics 1210]

The UK doesn't need any approval from thr US to use it nukes. That's a lie. More lies from you.

Also Europe doesn't need America to bail them out. The UK and France together would take care of Russia

https://cnduk.org/resources/trident-us-connection/

I do not apologise for destroying your belief.

UK is finished.

:

 

[Technics 1210]

BP has reported a second-quarter profit of $8.45bn (£6.9bn) - its highest in 14 years - at a time when consumer fuel prices have been at record highs.

Lets not pretend oil giants are against this war, they're not, they love it, cos they are laughing all the way to the bank, and to think liberals believe the UK government cares for its citizens!

War is money, except Russia is profiting more!

 

[cpleigh]

https://cnduk.org/resources/trident-us-connection/

I do not apologise for destroying your belief.

UK is finished.

:

Thats an opinion piece that's wrong. "It's inconceivable to think"... the UK doesn't even use activation codes like the US does

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/no-america-doesnt-control-britains-nuclear-weapons/

 

[Technics 1210]

Thats an opinion piece that's wrong. "It's inconceivable to think"... the UK doesn't even use activation codes like the US does

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/no-america-doesnt-control-britains-nuclear-weapons/

So you counter an opinion piece with another opinion piece. Oh my. The link I cited has links to UK.GOV site.

Try these on for size:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...t/uk-nuclear-deterrence-what-you-need-to-know

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-7353/

UK is now reliant on USA even to defend itself. You dream of UK and France wiping Russia, before you do, count the number of nukes UK and France have combined vs. Russia.

Let me help you.

Russia has about 3000.
France about 300
UK about 250

By the time Amreeka activates Trident warheads, UK would be evaporated, and in best case scenario, UK doesn't have a second strike capability. Plus, Russia just needs 2 nukes to evaporate the UK.

This is precisely why UK is bricking it and dare not go toe to toe with Russia, neither will NATO. West only bully the weak, never the strong.

 

[Technics 1210]

I should add, you, like many, are only learning the fact that Trident uses Amreekan warheads, not British warheads.

Truth always runs a marathon.

 

[cpleigh]

You are all over the place as per usual. The UK doesn't need any US approval to use its nukes. The US doesn't even have that ability. Each UK sub commander has the right to fire, by just turning a key.

You are now expanding on this idiotic rant about the amount of Nukes everyone has

 

[Technics 1210]

You are all over the place as per usual. The UK doesn't need any US approval to use its nukes. The US doesn't even have that ability. Each UK sub commander has the right to fire, by just turning a key.

You are now expanding on this idiotic rant about the amount of Nukes everyone has

What ever helps you sleep at night, certainly will not be UK’s nuclear deterrent that is in the hands of Uncle SAM.

You have been corrected so many time in this thread that it’s not even funny anymore.

Speaking of which, are the MSM feeds on Ukraine war silent of late? Haven’t seen you regurgitate the MSM lies for a while now.

 

[Robert]

You are all over the place as per usual. The UK doesn't need any US approval to use its nukes. The US doesn't even have that ability. Each UK sub commander has the right to fire, by just turning a key.

You are now expanding on this idiotic rant about the amount of Nukes everyone has

Even the Yank SSBNs don’t need “firing codes”. If the skipper and XO agree, they can launch. The “firing codes” are a protocol confirming a decision by the Pentagon to launch.

Should the Pentagon / COMSUBLANT / Looking Glass plane be destroyed, the USN SSBNs will not have access to the “firing codes”, assume that the USA had been devastated, and launch on their own authority.

 

[cpleigh]

What ever helps you sleep at night, certainly will not be UK’s nuclear deterrent that is in the hands of Uncle SAM.

You have been corrected so many time in this thread that it’s not even funny anymore.

Speaking of which, are the MSM feeds on Ukraine war silent of late? Haven’t seen you regurgitate the MSM lies for a while now.

You have been proven wrong on this. You are now trying to engage in a dick waving contest about how many nukes etc. Like that actually matters in the event of nuclear war.

The MSM aren't silent, just nothing is happening. It's a stalemate

 

[Technics 1210]

You have been proven wrong on this. You are now trying to engage in a dick waving contest about how many nukes etc. Like that actually matters in the event of nuclear war.

The MSM aren't silent, just nothing is happening. It's a stalemate

You were the one talking about how UK and France would be enough to deal with Russia, I guess you verified the number of nukes and realised how wrong you were, yet again.

As for stalemate - LOL. Russia is winning on fronts.

 

[cpleigh]

https://cnduk.org/resources/trident-us-connection/

I do not apologise for destroying your belief.

UK is finished.

:

You were the one talking about how UK and France would be enough to deal with Russia, I guess you verified the number of nukes and realised how wrong you were, yet again.

As for stalemate - LOL. Russia is winning on fronts.

What has nukes got to do with anything? The uk and France has enough to turn Russia into the world's biggest nature reserve. NoBODY wins in a nuclear war.

In a conventional war... France and UK could take care of Russia, especially now they have de armed themselves.

Oh.... Russia has today accused the US of directly being involved in the war. What they mean is HIMARS are now seriously destroying them and they don't like it. Expect a good will gesture soon from them when they retreat from kherson

 

[Technics 1210]

What has nukes got to do with anything? The uk and France has enough to turn Russia into the world's biggest nature reserve. NoBODY wins in a nuclear war.

In a conventional war... France and UK could take care of Russia, especially now they have de armed themselves.

Oh.... Russia has today accused the US of directly being involved in the war. What they mean is HIMARS are now seriously destroying them and they don't like it. Expect a good will gesture soon from them when they retreat from kherson

If you think France and UK could take care of Russia, then you are even more brainwashed and hypnotized that I thought. The reason YOU mentioned UK and France is because these are the only 2 countries in Europe which have a nuclear arsenal in response to the fact I highlighted that UK needs authorisation from USA to activate Trident warheads.

Here in case you missed YOUR post above in this thread:

The UK doesn't need any approval from thr US to use it nukes. That's a lie. More lies from you.

Also Europe doesn't need America to bail them out. The UK and France together would take care of Russia

Caught fibbing again.

You can also go compare military sizes between UK/France and Russia, but again, you will be saddened by the reality of numbers.

You are right on one point, no wants a nuclear war, which is why NATO wouldn't even impose a no-fly zone over Ukraine. Just goes to prove West/NATO are just bullies and will never fight a nation with nukes, but rather spend TRILLIONS fighting cave dwellers.

Now snap out of the spell that has been casted upon you by the Zionist MSM; it will lead to intellectual freedom.

 

[cpleigh]

I honestly have no idea what u are even saying now. I mentioned uk and France ad they are the 2 military powers in Europe. Nothing to do with nukes.

Russia is struggling with Ukraine, a country it shares a land border with.

I won't be saddened at all. Russia may have 10 x the planes etc but its mostly old junk. It doesn't compare.

That's the reality. There is a reason why Russian state propaganda constantly paint the US and the UK as the big baddies....

 

[KingKhanWC]

Ukrainian forces have destroyed the Ukrainian battalion of the 56th Brigade via artillery.

These clowns recently hit a POW camp where their own people were being held and now this.

Its ok, Zelensky is in vogue.

 

[Technics 1210]

I honestly have no idea what u are even saying now. I mentioned uk and France ad they are the 2 military powers in Europe. Nothing to do with nukes.

Russia is struggling with Ukraine, a country it shares a land border with.

I won't be saddened at all. Russia may have 10 x the planes etc but its mostly old junk. It doesn't compare.

That's the reality. There is a reason why Russian state propaganda constantly paint the US and the UK as the big baddies....

If you say so. Why just single out UK and France when you have your beloved NATO? Nukes. You just will not admit it even though you were responding to my point on nukes.

Anyway....US and UK are the big baddies, outside of the West this is an opinion shared by the majority of countries.

How do you feel about Ukraine's President having a photoshoot with Vogue? Will you buy the special edition and have his poster on your teenager bedroom wall? Just imagine, you can see your hero in full gloss every day, even after he flees Ukraine!

 

[cpleigh]

Flip flopping again I see.... you purposely ignored when I said the UK and France are the 2 biggest militaries in Europe, explaining why I picked them. Nothing to do with Nukes.

Couldn't care less if they did a vogue photo shoot. That's up to them. They have a free choice..

 

[Technics 1210]

Flip flopping again I see.... you purposely ignored when I said the UK and France are the 2 biggest militaries in Europe, explaining why I picked them. Nothing to do with Nukes.

Couldn't care less if they did a vogue photo shoot. That's up to them. They have a free choice..

No I did not ignore your point, I falsified it and exposed your fibs by stating you have been rambling on about NATO, now at the mere mention of nukes, you pick the only 2 countries in Europe with Nuclear arms, UK and France. I would follow up by asking why you chose to ignore NATO, by I already have the answer.

As for vogue, oh please, when British leaders are on family holidays and emergency hits the UK, you liberals are the first to complain how leaders should be focusing on resolving a crisis. Your hero, Zelensky chose a photoshoot with Vogue while his country is hopelessly defending itself after NATO let Ukraine down, he even opted for the family package!

Perhaps the photoshoot was a way to launder money to the Zelenskys? You know providing funds to flee the country? I cannot recall any leader since being alive who was posing for a glossy magazine while his country was at war. Something doesn’t add up. Even his own people are beginning to question his motives.

I guess he found the funny side to it, once a comedian, always a joke.

 

[cpleigh]

I picked the 2 biggest militaries. WHAT don't u understand?!? You brought NUKES into it.

Zelensky is trying to keep the worlds eyes on Ukraine, what's wrong with that?

 

[Technics 1210]

I picked the 2 biggest militaries. WHAT don't u understand?!? You brought NUKES into it.

Zelensky is trying to keep the worlds eyes on Ukraine, what's wrong with that?

You picked the only 2 nuclear nations in Europe after I mention nukes.

Causation.

As for Zelensky, trying to keep the world’s eyes on Ukraine, or himself and his wife in Vogue magazine?

 

[KingKhanWC]

I picked the 2 biggest militaries. WHAT don't u understand?!? You brought NUKES into it.

Zelensky is trying to keep the worlds eyes on Ukraine, what's wrong with that?

How does posing in Vogue with his Mrs help his cause?

 

[cpleigh]

How does posing in Vogue with his Mrs help his cause?

It keeps Ukraine on any front page.

 

[Technics 1210]

It keeps Ukraine on any front page.

On a fashion magazine?

 

[Technics 1210]

This is one of the best quotes I have read regarding Zelensky since the war started.

“Somehow Zelenskyy finds the time to shoot Vogue covers, attend Bono concerts and hang out with Ben Stiller. Some “war” he’s got going on over there!”

Brutal!

 

[cpleigh]

Leaflets being handed out in kherson advising citizens what to do when the Ukrainians army arrives.

I didn't realise the land lease us scheme only comes into effect from the 1st September.... Ukraine going ro get shed loads of weapons soon

 

[Technics 1210]

Incorrect, leaflets are not being handed out, the new edition of Vogue magazines are.

Ukraine will be receiving bumper Vogue subscription offers on the 1st September as an incentive.

 

[bones]

Leaflets being handed out in kherson advising citizens what to do when the Ukrainians army arrives.

I didn't realise the land lease us scheme only comes into effect from the 1st September.... Ukraine going ro get shed loads of weapons soon

The Russians have just re-deployed 30BTGs to the Kherson region. The Ukrainian counter-offensive is not happening any time soon. In fact have they made a single move forward in the region?

 

[cpleigh]

The Russians have just re-deployed 30BTGs to the Kherson region. The Ukrainian counter-offensive is not happening any time soon. In fact have they made a single move forward in the region?

Yeah they've taken 57 settlements back. 30BTGS.... that leaves the Donbas very open...

 

[cpleigh]

Ukraine has tak3n back Svyatohirsk, that's very cl9se to izyum..... certainly within HIMAR range.

 

[WhenSultansBowled]

This is one of the best quotes I have read regarding Zelensky since the war started.

“Somehow Zelenskyy finds the time to shoot Vogue covers, attend Bono concerts and hang out with Ben Stiller. Some “war” he’s got going on over there!”

Brutal!

His mission is complete. He is enjoying the perks of serving his evil Zionist masters.

By their nature all these Zionists and their minions are evil. And this is not just my opinion, this is what all prominent Rabbis of past ( https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/einstein/1948/12/02.htm ) and present ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUppu2OHVTY ) , politicians or even arguably the most intelligent man of last century: Albert Einstein ( https://www.palestineremembered.com/images/Einistein-attachment.jpg ), all of them have recognized Zionists a threat to the Jews and consequently the whole world's peace.

Wherever these Zionists go, they create rivers of blood.

Unfortunately, now it is Ukraine's turn.

Again, I must write: Do I support Putin? No. But am I against useless bloodshed of Ukrainians? Yes.

The week this pointless war started, I wrote (maybe in this very thread): Ukrainians will have a lot of time to ponder whether selecting the bloodthirsty Zionist Zelenskyy was the right decision....

Future orphans of Ukraine are the real victims here.

 

[Technics 1210]

The former Labour leader has warned that pouring weapons into the conflict will only prolong it

The West should stop arming Kiev forces as it will only serve to exaggerate the ongoing conflict with Russia, former UK Labour Party leader Jeremy Corbyn stated in a TV interview on Tuesday. He also criticized Western leaders for hardly ever talking about peace.

----------

I guess Corbyn is an extremist under UK law?

 

[Junaids]

The former Labour leader has warned that pouring weapons into the conflict will only prolong it

I guess Corbyn is an extremist under UK law?

Corbyn has always been an extremist.

He only got the Labour leadership because the other three candidates were all Oxford University graduates.

Prolonging the Ukraine War is absolutely a good thing.

A short war only ever meant Russia would get to keep the land it stole and face no justice for the rape and looting and murder its armed forces have perpetrated on Ukrainian civilians.

An extended war means Russia being driven out of Kherson and Donbas and hopefully Crimea too. Plus every extra day the war lasts, Russia's conventional military strength reduces by around 1%.

We are slowly reaching the point at which Russia will have degraded its own conventional military power so badly that Georgia and Moldova will be able to liberate their occupied territories too.

 

[Robert]

Corbyn has always been an extremist.

He only got the Labour leadership because the other three candidates were all Oxford University graduates.

Prolonging the Ukraine War is absolutely a good thing.

A short war only ever meant Russia would get to keep the land it stole and face no justice for the rape and looting and murder its armed forces have perpetrated on Ukrainian civilians.

An extended war means Russia being driven out of Kherson and Donbas and hopefully Crimea too. Plus every extra day the war lasts, Russia's conventional military strength reduces by around 1%.

We are slowly reaching the point at which Russia will have degraded its own conventional military power so badly that Georgia and Moldova will be able to liberate their occupied territories too.

I wouldn’t call Corbyn extreme. I’d call him a highly dogmatic lifelong contrarian with a sixth-form understanding, and bad judgement regarding who he shares platforms with. His way would see Donbas fall to Putin, probably more. But with this hard right authoritarian government gradually eroding our rights, who knows if he will be arrested?

(Don’t forget the Finns - I am sure they would like to recover their territory that Stalin pinched in 1939.)

 

[bones]

Yeah they've taken 57 settlements back. 30BTGS.... that leaves the Donbas very open...

The Russians aren't trying to capture territory. Their aim is to destroy the Ukranian military. The Ukranians haven't taken any settlements back, unless you mean perhaps the odd farm here or there. Even the western military maps can't hide the grim reality any more.

 

[the Great Khan]

Ukraine has tak3n back Svyatohirsk, that's very cl9se to izyum..... certainly within HIMAR range.

Look I know it's hard to grasp. Ukraine is not going to win this war on the battlefield. The sooner they realise the better it will be. They need to get around a table and leverage their allies soft power. This is where they can get something.

They are currently falling for the west's rhetoric. I don't understand why their leader is continuing with this nonsense.

The Russians are systematically evicerating the Ukrainian military. They need to fall back and give up territory to the Russians and hold the line at a strategic fall back position. Then start negotiations. The West has left them to die..

 

[Reddy]

Why The West Is Easing Its Sanctions On Russia

"The UK's Express called it caving in to Putin. Bloomberg dubbed it "corrections to previous sanctions." Whatever it is called, it comes down to the same thing: the EU is loosening the noose. And it's not just the EU, either.

For starters, the European Union decided to add exemptions to Russian sanctions, which would allow countries from outside the bloc to deal with sanctioned Russian entities, including banks and state companies such as Rosneft. Per the Bloomberg report, these exemptions are for entities "deemed essential to shipments of food, agricultural goods and oil to third countries outside the EU".

The EU appears to be putting a lot of effort into convincing whoever is listening that their sanctions against Russia have absolutely nothing to do with either food or energy supply disruptions or, at the very least, they did not aim for them to happen.

There's more, too. While the EU tweaks its sanctions to allow the trade of more Russian oil in order to avoid another spike in oil prices, the UK is hesitant to join the block in its oil insurance ban on Russian vessels. The UK's participation in the insurance squeeze is essential because of the market share British-based insurers hold in shipping insurance and yet they are stalling.

A recent Financial Times report on the topic suggests this might have something to do with the UK's big geopolitical brother and its concern about oil prices.

India buys Russian oil, runs it through its refineries, and sells 'Indian refined products' where? To the EU. Ditto for other cargos. Ditto for Saudi Arabia. Those vessels' bills of lading won't mention Russia as they arrive at their EU destination.

"In short, the EU is quietly facilitating the bypass of its own proclaimed 'crushing' sanctions regime," according to Alastair Crooke, director of Lebanon-based nonprofit Conflicts Forum.

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-General/Why-The-West-Is-Easing-Its-Sanctions-On-Russia.html

 

[Technics 1210]

The West has realised it had made a grave mistake with an uncalculated move by imposing sanctions on Russia. Russia isn't a poor country, it is loaded to the brim with natural resources and nukes.

Problem for the West is now it has an optic problem. Biden already bailed from Afghanistan, leave Amreeka red faced, and now if sanctions are reversed, Amreeka will be left humiliated, or Europeans face a dark winter with high rates, high cost of energy, economic recession, and rationing.

Lets see now if Amreeka cares for Europeans, or its political clout

Catch 22.

 

[cpleigh]

The Russians aren't trying to capture territory. Their aim is to destroy the Ukranian military. The Ukranians haven't taken any settlements back, unless you mean perhaps the odd farm here or there. Even the western military maps can't hide the grim reality any more.

Ah... so the russians have stopped?
They still haven't taken the donbas region.... w6 months in... their number 1 aim still not complete.

Ukraine have liberated 2 more towns near donetsk today. If anything in now looks like Ukraine and fighting back and the russians are struggling

 

[bones]

Ah... so the russians have stopped? ��
They still haven't taken the donbas region.... w6 months in... their number 1 aim still not complete.

Ukraine have liberated 2 more towns near donetsk today. If anything in now looks like Ukraine and fighting back and the russians are struggling

What are those towns? Are they as big as Lysychansk, Mariupol, Severodonestk, Popasnaya or Kherson?

 

[Technics 1210]

The European Council added former Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovich and his son Aleksandr to its sanctions list on Thursday. They accused the former Ukrainian leader, ousted during the 2014 coup, of playing a role in “undermining or threatening the territorial integrity, sovereignty and independence of Ukraine” as well as its “stability and security.”

 

[Technics 1210]

Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky has accused Amnesty International of siding with “terrorists” after the organization condemned the Ukrainian military for placing weapons in civilian areas in violation of humanitarian law.

“Today we saw a report by Amnesty International, which unfortunately tries to amnesty the terrorist state and shift responsibility from the aggressor to the victim,” Zelensky said in a video address on Thursday evening.

“If someone makes a report that puts the aggressor and the victim on the same level, this cannot be tolerated,” he said, repeating three times that “Ukraine is a victim,” and adding that “anyone who doubts this is an accomplice of Russia – a terrorist country – and a terrorist themselves and a participant in the killings.”'

The report in question was published earlier on Thursday, and detailed 22 cases of Ukrainian forces launching strikes from schools and five examples of troops using hospitals as bases. Amnesty said that it was “not aware” that Ukraine tried to evacuate civilians before occupying these non-military locations.

-------

The truth is starting to seep through.

 

[Robert]

The Russians aren't trying to capture territory. Their aim is to destroy the Ukranian military. The Ukranians haven't taken any settlements back, unless you mean perhaps the odd farm here or there. Even the western military maps can't hide the grim reality any more.

They captured plenty of territory in 2014.

Putin is an imperialist. He sees Ukraine as part of Russia. He would have grabbed the Baltic states already, were they not NATO members.

 

[bones]

They captured plenty of territory in 2014.

Putin is an imperialist. He sees Ukraine as part of Russia. He would have grabbed the Baltic states already, were they not NATO members.

They will capture a lot of territory once the fortifications in the Donbas are destroyed along with the armies defending them. Notice that tune of the western media has changed. It’s dawning on them they lied like crazy for months and now they will have to tell the people the truth.