Scrapping Article 370 - We have been looted

[cricketjoshila]

India were protected with the shimla agreement. Once they made the move on the articles they were happy intially but bjp has realized that they made a huge mistake.

After scrapping article 370 kashmir has been talked at un.

West may not place sanctions, but there is a possibility that UN will bring in a nee mediator again to solve this.

Pakistan didn't adhere to any of the agreements on Kashmir and so Simla Agreement was of no use as pakistan blatantly violated it.

Pakistan always brought up Kashmir at the UN. It meant nothing.

UNSC will need to pass a resolution to force any mediation on Kashmir. I don't see US UK France Russia all voting in favour of such a resolution.

 

[PakLFC]

UN won't do anything on Kashmir when they are partly responsible for causing this problem. A final war is the only way to sort it out.

 

[cric_man]

Pakistan didn't adhere to any of the agreements on Kashmir and so Simla Agreement was of no use as pakistan blatantly violated it.

Pakistan always brought up Kashmir at the UN. It meant nothing.

UNSC will need to pass a resolution to force any mediation on Kashmir. I don't see US UK France Russia all voting in favour of such a resolution.

Curious how did Pakistan "blatantly" violate the Simla agreement. Did India not initiate the violation by occupying the Siachen Glacier? What measures were taken by India 72-89 to solve Kashmir as a bilateral matter (which they told everyone it was)

 

[Romali_rotti]

India then asks Pak what do you want us to do that will bring peace? Pak answers demanding a plebiscite which India refuses. .

Pakistan asked for a plebiscite ? When ? I didnt know this.. Can you show me the evidence ?

 

[cricketjoshila]

Curious how did Pakistan "blatantly" violate the Simla agreement. Did India not initiate the violation by occupying the Siachen Glacier? What measures were taken by India 72-89 to solve Kashmir as a bilateral matter (which they told everyone it was)

Pakistan continued to support armed terrorists in Kashmir.esp the support to JKLF.

Siachen was not marked on the LoC demarcation. Was pakistan not planning to occupy Siachen and Indis only pre empted pakistan because pakistan had ordered winter clothing from the same manufacturer and they leaked it to India?

Pakistan kept supporting and interfering in J and K.

 

[saeedhk]

The fact that despite Imran Khan running from pillar to post in the last year has yielded zero result with regards to Kashmir shows that nobody takes Pakistan seriously! No nation stood with Pakistan because Pakistan is a very weak and irrelevant nation coupled with its poor economic status and security situation and allegations of terror financing. It is high time we forget Kashmir because whenever we bring up this issue, we face nothing but humiliation.

I am sure in 3021, Pakistanis would still be harping on about Kashmir and how they are about to seize Kashmir and free its inhabitants.

 

[Major]

The fact that despite Imran Khan running from pillar to post in the last year has yielded zero result with regards to Kashmir shows that nobody takes Pakistan seriously! No nation stood with Pakistan because Pakistan is a very weak and irrelevant nation coupled with its poor economic status and security situation and allegations of terror financing. It is high time we forget Kashmir because whenever we bring up this issue, we face nothing but humiliation.

I am sure in 3021, Pakistanis would still be harping on about Kashmir and how they are about to seize Kashmir and free its inhabitants.

Sorry you are wrong bro.

Ik has actually done well on the kashmir front.

 

[Major]

Pakistan didn't adhere to any of the agreements on Kashmir and so Simla Agreement was of no use as pakistan blatantly violated it.

Pakistan always brought up Kashmir at the UN. It meant nothing.

UNSC will need to pass a resolution to force any mediation on Kashmir. I don't see US UK France Russia all voting in favour of such a resolution.

Again, pqkistan did not violate shomla agreement, even if thry got another country involved or un they would not listen due to this agreement.

After bjp indian did a clear violation with the scraping of articles countries have actually started to listen to pakistan please on kashmir.

Also, we can still use the old resolution and thats what pakistan is trying to do. China will have issue with that resolution but pakistan is trying to do backdoor deals with them do that they dont veto it.

 

[Major]

Has UNGA or UNSC formally discussed Kashmir in last few years?

Which countries have pressurized India to talk to Pakistan?

Who told you that the Public Security Act has been scrapped?

KPL? You mean the league where most of the foreigners except Gibbs pulled out?

Pakistan doesn't have the military, economic or diplomatic means to put pressure on India with respect to Kashmir.

Plz Read news and you will know that psa was finished and replaced

Pakistan is rallying for kashmir with countries and even making moves at un.

Un becomes involved when it becomes eveident that india cant find a solution for this with Pakistan

 

[Major]

Lets be realistic, had Pakistan agreed to Shimla agreement, Kargil wouldn't have happened in the first place and that too after Lahore yatra.

KargiL happened because of india going after siachen. They claimed siachen while we also claimed it.

And india captured siachen after shimla agreement. So if you mention shimla agreement on kargil than also mention it when india captured siachen.

Kargil war was for siachen

 

[saeedhk]

Sorry you are wrong bro.

Ik has actually done well on the kashmir front.

He has bombarded the world with words such as Modi-Hitler, BJP-Nazi and Kashmir genocide but to zero effect. Nobody takes us seriously.

 

[Itachi]

Sorry you are wrong bro.

Ik has actually done well on the kashmir front.

To be honest, international forum has moved on from kashmir long ago. There will be some statements here and there but overall, it has become, "its a conflict between you two, sort it out! Don't drag us."

 

[Itachi]

KargiL happened because of india going after siachen. They claimed siachen while we also claimed it.

And india captured siachen after shimla agreement. So if you mention shimla agreement on kargil than also mention it when india captured siachen.

Kargil war was for siachen

What was the primary clause of shimla agreement?

 

[PakLFC]

Pakistan asked for a plebiscite ? When ? I didnt know this.. Can you show me the evidence ?

Read again. How many times has Pak spoken of a plebiscite at the UN?

 

[Romali_rotti]

Read again. How many times has Pak spoken of a plebiscite at the UN?

Speaking and demanding for 1 is 2 different things.

Can you show me where Pakistan has spoken out for a plebiscite in the UN forum ? As I wasnt aware of this either..

 

[PakLFC]

Speaking and demanding for 1 is 2 different things.

Can you show me where Pakistan has spoken out for a plebiscite in the UN forum ? As I wasnt aware of this either..

Speaking about it it demanding it otherwise Pak wouldn't even mention it. You can search Pak's previous speeches and answers to India on the youtube yourself.

 

[Itachi]

Speaking about it it demanding it otherwise Pak wouldn't even mention it. You can search Pak's previous speeches and answers to India on the youtube yourself.

IK never demands. He begs. There's a difference. All his speeches (as pm) points towards begging be it aid or money or kashmir or any other issues.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Speaking about it it demanding it otherwise Pak wouldn't even mention it. You can search Pak's previous speeches and answers to India on the youtube yourself.

I have looked and cant find any instances where Pakistan spoke for or demanded for the Plebiscite at UN, since you made the claim, can you please put up a link please.

 

[PakLFC]

IK never demands. He begs. There's a difference. All his speeches (as pm) points towards begging be it aid or money or kashmir or any other issues.

How do you differentiate begging from speaking? He has never asked for money rather the opposite. See the Indian media who are always crying about how Pak are China are hammering them.

 

[PakLFC]

I have looked and cant find any instances where Pakistan spoke for or demanded for the Plebiscite at UN, since you made the claim, can you please put up a link please.

From 4:55. Now don't play any more silly word games.

 

[Romali_rotti]

From 4:55. Now don't play any more silly word games.

Ok thanks for clarifying.

In order for the plebiscite should take place, as per the plebiscite conditions, I believe there are some conditions like below?:

Pakistan must vacate all troops from POK while India gets to keep a minimum troop presence.

A new factor which comes into the picture must also be taken into account which is; China vacating the section of Kashmir which Pakistan traded/exchanged land with as it is a disputed territory and what Pakistan has done is illegal, the dealing with China.

And the Plebiscite can take place.


I am all for it.

 

[PakLFC]

Ok thanks for clarifying.

In order for the plebiscite should take place, as per the plebiscite conditions, I believe there are some conditions like below?:

Pakistan must vacate all troops from POK while India gets to keep a minimum troop presence.

A new factor which comes into the picture must also be taken into account which is; China vacating the section of Kashmir which Pakistan traded/exchanged land with as it is a disputed territory and what Pakistan has done is illegal, the dealing with China.

And the Plebiscite can take place.


I am all for it.

Was it not Nehru who took this case to the UN in the first place? I agree that both Pak and India must vacate Kashmir altogether providing it is what people of both this divided region want. Pak is also willing to give access to the UN to AJK where as India will not allow the UN inside IoK. Why not? What is India afraid off?

Allow UN troops to be deployed in entire Kashmir whilst the whole thing is sorted according to the wish of the people. One thing that is certain is Kashmiris if given a choice will never choose India and you know it. Pak does not trust India to maintain a presence in Kashmir where as I don't think China is part of the deal.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Was it not Nehru who took this case to the UN in the first place?

Yes it was Papa Nehru, I find it very very strange why Nehru's photo is not hanging on Pakistan's parliament. Wasnt for our Pseudo Secular Nehru POK wouldnt have been with Pakistan right now. I honestly feel Pappa should be hailed as one of the hero's of Pakistan.


I agree that both Pak and India must vacate Kashmir altogether providing it is what people of both this divided region want. Pak is also willing to give access to the UN to AJK where as India will not allow the UN inside IoK. Why not? What is India afraid off?


Incorrect. Per the Plebiscite conditions of the UN, Only Pakistan must vacate all of the Kashmir area, while India gets to keep a minimum troop presence.

Pak is willing to do everything except the Plebiscite as it would mean they would have to exit completely from Kashmir and now China also (Goodluck getting China to exit from the disputed area of Kashmir). So in other words it is not in Pakistan's interest for UN to conduct the plebiscite.

Allow UN troops to be deployed in entire Kashmir whilst the whole thing is sorted according to the wish of the people. One thing that is certain is Kashmiris if given a choice will never choose India and you know it. Pak does not trust India to maintain a presence in Kashmir where as I don't think China is part of the deal.


As above, China is part of the deal, now as Pakistan illegally swapped a small section of the Kashmir area with them.

Yes I do agree due to the muslim population in Kashmir, they will choose Pakistan over India, not even going to argue it.

Part of me wants Indian Kashmir to go to Pakistan, because then I know China will eventually build infrastructure there and absolutely destroy these Kashmiris if they show any disapproval to how China use their land.

Bold & Either way Kashmiris are dumb, they always will be used and abused by Pakistan and the Indians.....

 

[Romali_rotti]

@ Pak FLC, please watch from 0:37 onwards:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/GYmMikj_jLI" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>


Pakistan must demilitarize to the satisfaction of UN for the Plebiscite to take place, so this could mean I was wrong when I said Pakistan cannot have any troop presence.

 

[PakLFC]

@ Pak FLC, please watch from 0:37 onwards:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/GYmMikj_jLI" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>


Pakistan must demilitarize to the satisfaction of UN for the Plebiscite to take place, so this could mean I was wrong when I said Pakistan cannot have any troop presence.

Roti saheb the video you provided is what the Indian stance is. Thing is India took the case to the UN and also Pak does not trust India at all. "Bold & Either way Kashmiris are dumb, they always will be used and abused by Pakistan and the Indians" not sure what this means?.

It is Indian not Pak soldiers who are being murdered in IoK?. India after revoking Kashmir's special status is also against the UN resolution.

 

[PakLFC]

India will not allowed to run away from what Nehru promised.

 

[Itachi]

India will not allowed to run away from what Nehru promised.
View attachment 112358

Selective quote.

Post what was in those "...."

 

[PakLFC]

Selective quote.

Post what was in those "...."

So he didn't say that?

 

[Itachi]

So he didn't say that?

Try harder. Post the full quote so that we can have a constructive discussion about it.

 

[PakLFC]

Try harder. Post the full quote so that we can have a constructive discussion about it.

I posted the most important part.

 

[Itachi]

I posted the most important part.

While explaining/discussing the verse of Quran, taking words out of context could represent Islam as a violent religion.

That's where the fallacy of the selective quotes resides.

I will just ask one more time, can you post the full quote so that we can have a constructive discussion about it?

 

[Romali_rotti]

Roti saheb the video you provided is what the Indian stance is.

Ahhh Nooo brathhaarr, What Christine Fair said there is what is stated by the UN....

 

[PakLFC]

While explaining/discussing the verse of Quran, taking words out of context could represent Islam as a violent religion.

That's where the fallacy of the selective quotes resides.

I will just ask one more time, can you post the full quote so that we can have a constructive discussion about it?

Stop displaying your ignorance by comparing the Holy Qur'an to what Nehru said! Next you will ask me to upload the entire book. This is how quotes are mentioned by a few crucial sentences.

 

[PakLFC]

Ahhh Nooo brathhaarr, What Christine Fair said there is what is stated by the UN....

As explained Roti bhai that after revoking 370 the entire game has changed. Now we are back to 1947.

 

[Romali_rotti]

As explained Roti bhai that after revoking 370 the entire game has changed. Now we are back to 1947.

Article 370 was an Indian initiative, it is not connected to UN..

 

[PakLFC]

Article 370 was an Indian initiative, it is not connected to UN..

Of course it is connected when Kashmir is disputed territory.

 

[daytrader]

PM In J&K Today, 1st Formal Event After Special Status Scrapped: 10 Facts

PM Modi J&K Visit:Today's event would be PM Modi's first formal public appearance in Jammu and Kashmir since August 2019, although PM Modi has made informal visits to celebrate festivals with troops stationed along the Line of Control.

Srinagar: Prime Minister Narendra Modi will today hold his first public event in Jammu and Kashmir, over two years after the centre scrapped special status to the state and divided it into two Union Territories.
Here are the top 10 points in this big story:

1. Tight security is being put in place for PM Modi's visit. A big welcome is expected in Palli, with tens of thousands waiting to welcome him at an event organised by the BJP in Jammu region.
2. PM Modi will preside over a ceremony to mark Panchayati Raj -- a day that commemorates grassroots democracy.
3. Today's event will see PM Modi lead the region "into a new era of development", Lieutenant Governor Manoj Sinha told reporters.
4. Today's event would be PM Modi's first formal public appearance in Jammu and Kashmir since August 2019, although PM Modi has made informal visits to celebrate festivals with troops stationed along the Line of Control.
5. The Prime Minister will inaugurate and lay the foundation stones of development projects worth over ₹ 20,000 crore, including the opening of Banihal-Qazigund road tunnel for all-weather connectivity between the two regions of the Union Territory.
6. He will celebrate National Panchayati Raj Day and address gram sabhas across the country, the Prime Minister's Office, or PMO, said in a statement.
7. Seeking to develop and rejuvenate 75 water bodies in every district of the country, PM Modi will launch an initiative named 'Amrit Sarovar', the PMO said.
8. The Banihal-Qazigund road tunnel, built at a cost of over ₹ 3,100 crore, is 8.45-km-long and it will reduce the road distance between Banihal and Qazigund by 16 km, and cut travel time by around one-and-a-half hours.
9. It is a twin-tube tunnel, one for each direction of travel, and the tubes are interconnected by a cross passage every 500 metres for maintenance and emergency evacuation.
10. Among other projects, PM Modi will lay the foundation stone of Ratle and Kwar hydroelectric projects, a 850 megawatt facility to be constructed on the Chenab river in Kishtwar at a cost of around ₹ 5,300 crore. He will also lay the foundation stone for the 540 megawatt Kwar hydroelectric project, to be build on the same river at a cost of over ₹ 4,500 crore. Interestingly, it's second time foundation stone of Ratle project is being laid. In 2013, then PM Manmohan Singh had laid foundation stone of the project.

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/pm-...ed-10-facts-2914700#pfrom=home-ndtv_topscroll

 

[MenInG]

Indian Illegally Occupied Jammu and Kashmir (IIOJK) witnessed a complete shutdown as a sign of protest on Sunday, ahead of Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to the region.

According to the Kashmir Media Service (KMS), the call for a strike was ordered by the All Parties Hurriyat Conference (APHC). The strike aims to convey the message to the Indian PM that Kashmiris reject India’s illegal occupation of their homeland as they continue their struggle until their inalienable right to self-determination is achieved.

The APHC has appealed to the populace of Azad Kashmir and the Kashmiri diaspora to hold anti-India demonstrations locally and in the major capitals of the world against the crimes committed in IIOJK.
However, according to reports, the occupation authorities have deployed mass troops and police personnel across the occupied territory, particularly in the Jammu region, for ‘security measures’ ahead of Narendra Modi’s visit.

The forces’ personnel are conducting random checking of vehicles and frisking passengers at check-points which have mushroomed on the roads of all major cities and towns, including the Srinagar-Jammu highway.

Furthermore, police and troops are monitoring CCTV cameras to keep watch on the movement of people and sharpshooters have been deployed at high-rise buildings while drone cameras and sniffer dogs have been pressed into service. Indian police have also seized scores of bikes from different areas of Srinagar.

Express Tribune

 

[Romali_rotti]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Em_e_U4B8ls" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Wow, the Indian government is about invest close to 70,000 crores in Jammu and Kashmir.... Danggg....

 

[Romali_rotti]

Of course it is connected when Kashmir is disputed territory.

how ? do tell..

 

[Extra_Cover]

One can't help notice some uncanny co-incidences. Modi visiting occupied territory almost 3 years after scrapping their status. Its uncanny why now? Also I know that this has nothing to do with Pakistan but timing of this can't be more co-incidental when you have an Indian friendly government in Pakistan.

From Pakistan's perspective the current stooges will not raise a word on Modi's visit to Kashmir. Our inhouse supporters will support that by terming it as 'diplomacy'.

Soon we would see a bilateral meet in a 3rd country between stooges and Modi's men where talks of bilateral trade would be given space whilst Kashmir issue would take the backseat. This would again be termed as diplomacy as Pakistan doesn't want itself isolated. Alas one should not expect self-respect from stooges when there wasn't even an ounce of respect to start with.

 

[Itachi]

One can't help notice some uncanny co-incidences. Modi visiting occupied territory almost 3 years after scrapping their status. Its uncanny why now? Also I know that this has nothing to do with Pakistan but timing of this can't be more co-incidental when you have an Indian friendly government in Pakistan.

From Pakistan's perspective the current stooges will not raise a word on Modi's visit to Kashmir. Our inhouse supporters will support that by terming it as 'diplomacy'.

Soon we would see a bilateral meet in a 3rd country between stooges and Modi's men where talks of bilateral trade would be given space whilst Kashmir issue would take the backseat. This would again be termed as diplomacy as Pakistan doesn't want itself isolated. Alas one should not expect self-respect from stooges when there wasn't even an ounce of respect to start with.

These visits are decided months prior.

Looks like PTI fans are finding conspiracy everywhere.

 

[Cover Drive Six]

Indian Government's big infra push in J&K, PM Modi launches infrastructure projects

PM meets UAE delegations; says investment proposals in J&K has reached Rs 38,000 cr.

J&K | PM Modi has given a new industrial scheme in J&K. Since independence till now there was just Rs 15,000 cr investment, now we've proposal of Rs 52,000 cr while projects of Rs 38,000 cr will be inaugurated by the PM. We expect investment to cross Rs 70,000 cr

 

[Cover Drive Six]

UAE firms are expected to propose investments amounting to over Rs 3,000 crore in Kashmir. Good news, and also interesting trajectory for Abu Dhabi. It does come with some risk for them also. Also interesting that Qatar studying investing in J&K.

 

[Romali_rotti]

One can't help notice some uncanny co-incidences. Modi visiting occupied territory almost 3 years after scrapping their status. Its uncanny why now? Also I know that this has nothing to do with Pakistan but timing of this can't be more co-incidental when you have an Indian friendly government in Pakistan.

From Pakistan's perspective the current stooges will not raise a word on Modi's visit to Kashmir. Our inhouse supporters will support that by terming it as 'diplomacy'.

Soon we would see a bilateral meet in a 3rd country between stooges and Modi's men where talks of bilateral trade would be given space whilst Kashmir issue would take the backseat. This would again be termed as diplomacy as Pakistan doesn't want itself isolated. Alas one should not expect self-respect from stooges when there wasn't even an ounce of respect to start with.

Yeah I agree, Imran was pretty close to capturing Kashmir from India, had he stayed a month more the entire Kashmir region would have been Pakistan's...

 

[Romali_rotti]

UAE firms are expected to propose investments amounting to over Rs 3,000 crore in Kashmir. Good news, and also interesting trajectory for Abu Dhabi. It does come with some risk for them also. Also interesting that Qatar studying investing in J&K.

Kashmir will develop well in the coming decade...

70,000 Crore funding is insane, when during the 2021 Federal budget a Pseudo Secular state like Kerala only received what 2000 crores ? Yikes.

Looks like PM Modi really wants to develop Kashmir and turn it into one of the best states in India, good on him...

 

[daytrader]

Kashmir will develop well in the coming decade...

70,000 Crore funding is insane, when during the 2021 Federal budget a Pseudo Secular state like Kerala only received what 2000 crores ? Yikes.

Looks like PM Modi really wants to develop Kashmir and turn it into one of the best states in India, good on him...

Yea he's serious about displacing the locals. A lot of these are road and highway projects. Probably to get Indian forces and occupiers in there faster

 

[Romali_rotti]

Yea he's serious about displacing the locals. A lot of these are road and highway projects. Probably to get Indian forces and occupiers in there faster

Yeah exactly like how the Chinese are doing in POK and displacing the locals there especially the disputed Kashmiri Land which Pakistan swapped with the Chinese.

 

[daytrader]

Yeah exactly like how the Chinese are doing in POK and displacing the locals there especially the disputed Kashmiri Land which Pakistan swapped with the Chinese.

Wow you guys are really fed a diet of lying rottis lol
Chinese are not displacing the locals. The Diamer Bhasha dam is a joint project that will benefit Pakistanis. Chinese are helping with building it, not taking over the territory. Way to spin it though

 

[Itachi]

Wow you guys are really fed a diet of lying rottis lol
Chinese are not displacing the locals. The Diamer Bhasha dam is a joint project that will benefit Pakistanis. Chinese are helping with building it, not taking over the territory. Way to spin it though

So if China is building, it's helping Pakistan.

If India is helping, then it's displacement.

You have been fed enough hypocritic rottis it seems.

 

[daytrader]

So if China is building, it's helping Pakistan.

If India is helping, then it's displacement.

You have been fed enough hypocritic rottis it seems.

You can spin it how you like, I was merely pointing out the fact that Chinese are not taking over Pakistani territory like your compatriot was trying to convey. As for the merits of the projects, that is a different discussion.

If IOK didn't have a million + occupying Indian soldiers and Modi announced these projects, that would be a fair game. Unfortunately for you guys until those occupying forces remain, any development you do to 'help' the locals will only be seen as a way of taking over the land and displacing the locals.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Wow you guys are really fed a diet of lying rottis lol
Chinese are not displacing the locals. The Diamer Bhasha dam is a joint project that will benefit Pakistanis. Chinese are helping with building it, not taking over the territory. Way to spin it though

Wait so, are you saying Pakistan didnt swap Kashmiri territory with China ?

 

[Itachi]

You can spin it how you like, I was merely pointing out the fact that Chinese are not taking over Pakistani territory like your compatriot was trying to convey. As for the merits of the projects, that is a different discussion.

If IOK didn't have a million + occupying Indian soldiers and Modi announced these projects, that would be a fair game. Unfortunately for you guys until those occupying forces remain, any development you do to 'help' the locals will only be seen as a way of taking over the land and displacing the locals.

Chinese didn't take over. Pakistan handed to them. You have a lot to learn about Kashmir it seems.

 

[daytrader]

Wait so, are you saying Pakistan didnt swap Kashmiri territory with China ?

Not in the recent context you're referring to - there hasn't been any land swapping in the development of Diamer Basha dam. If you're referring to the past, we have settled our border disputes with China long ago.

 

[daytrader]

Chinese didn't take over. Pakistan handed to them. You have a lot to learn about Kashmir it seems.

Yes Indians are in a great position to teach me Please focus on the attrocities your government is committing in IOK rather than giving half-knowledged history lessons to others

 

[Romali_rotti]

Not in the recent context you're referring to - there hasn't been any land swapping in the development of Diamer Basha dam. If you're referring to the past, we have settled our border disputes with China long ago.

My question was pretty specific in the context of Pakistan/China land swap.

I didn't ask if the land swap happened a 100 years ago or a week ago.

Did Pakistan swap disputed Kashmiri territory which the Chinese now control ? Yes or no would suffice.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Yes Indians are in a great position to teach me Please focus on the attrocities your government is committing in IOK rather than giving half-knowledged history lessons to others

Best Pak/India focus on their own development, in India's case a 70,000 crore investment in Kashmir is quite a serious step forward and that too mostly funded with the help of Arabs.

If the top dawg Arabs are not going to raise any issue with the Indians on Kashmir barring maybe a meaningless Arab country like Kuwait, it is best Pakistan let it go as they have zero chance....

 

[daytrader]

My question was pretty specific in the context of Pakistan/China land swap.

I didn't ask if the land swap happened a 100 years ago or a week ago.

Did Pakistan swap disputed Kashmiri territory which the Chinese now control ? Yes or no would suffice.

Your question became specific after you were called out for lying, you said "Chinese are doing" meaning in the present. I see switching goal posts is a common characteristic between you and your compatriot

 

[Romali_rotti]

Your question became specific after you were called out for lying, you said "Chinese are doing" meaning in the present. I see switching goal posts is a common characteristic between you and your compatriot

But Chinese do have the infrastructure projects going through the Shaksgam valley though.

These infrastructure projects have helped China consolidate its control over PoK and the strategic Shaksgam Valley, to tie India down in the region. The Chinese road network through Shaksgam, which also connects the KKH with the Tibet-Xinjiang Highway has led to encirclement of J&K from three sides.[55] While the feeder roads connect crucial military complexes based in China and Pakistan, Gilgit provides the natural cover to military facilities like missile bases and tunnels – enhancing their joint capacity – and making it possible for them to launch pincer movements against India.[

https://www.orfonline.org/research/revisiting-chinas-kashmir-policy-58128/

 

[Itachi]

Yes Indians are in a great position to teach me Please focus on the attrocities your government is committing in IOK rather than giving half-knowledged history lessons to others

Then clarify the inaccuracies in my statement. Simply saying it wrong doesn't make it valid.

 

[daytrader]

But Chinese do have the infrastructure projects going through the Shaksgam valley though.

These infrastructure projects have helped China consolidate its control over PoK and the strategic Shaksgam Valley, to tie India down in the region. The Chinese road network through Shaksgam, which also connects the KKH with the Tibet-Xinjiang Highway has led to encirclement of J&K from three sides.[55] While the feeder roads connect crucial military complexes based in China and Pakistan, Gilgit provides the natural cover to military facilities like missile bases and tunnels – enhancing their joint capacity – and making it possible for them to launch pincer movements against India.[

https://www.orfonline.org/research/revisiting-chinas-kashmir-policy-58128/

Oh boy, if these are the scholarly articles that are fed to you then I can't really blame you for your views. These authors have a blatant bias and they don't care to hide it. I guess it's Indian government strategy to spread propoganda because in all honestly there's not much else India can do in matters of Azad Kashmir, Shaksgam valley and Aksai Chin.

Shaksgam valley belongs to China, they had a claim on it even before partition. We were at risk of going to war with them but we peacefuly settled those border issues and gained much more.

In fact China at that time tried to peacefully solve border claims with all its neighbours. Pakistan, Bhutan and Nepal went the peaceful route.
India on the other hand, in it's arrogance, decided that rather than negotiating they can bully their way in Aksai Chin. This arrogance was shattered in the India China war of 1962, when it begged USA to intervene. To this day, India hasn't been able to gain anything in Aksai Chin while Pakistan is enjoying a secure northern border.

 

[MenInG]

India has rejected Pakistan’s statement on Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s visit to Jammu and Kashmir, saying the “terror state” has no business to comment on the issue.

Top government sources told CNN-News18 that Pakistan is a terror state and “it has been proven again and again”. “In recent days, before PM’s visit, terror activists were increased by Pakistani handlers and all killed terrorists were Pakistanis. Kashmiris also understand that all support offered by Pakistan is only to increase terror activities,” they said.

Earlier, Pakistan had rejected PM Modi’s visit on April 24 as “yet another ploy to project fake normalcy in the occupied territory”.

Pakistan also “strongly condemned” the laying of foundation stones for the construction of the Ratle and Kwar Hydroelectric Projects (HEP) on Chenab River.

“The construction of Ratle hydroelectric plant, as designed by India, has been disputed by Pakistan, and for Kwar Hydroelectric Plant India has so far not fulfilled its Treaty obligation of sharing information with Pakistan,” it said.

In his first visit to the region since his government scrapped the special status in August 2019, PM Modi interacted with the people and gram sabhas and flagged off numerous key projects. Top business leaders from the UAE also accompanied the PM on his visit, underlining the backing of industrialists and investors from a leading Islamic bloc as the BJP government pitched a new phase for J&K post-Article 370.

PM Narendra Modi laid the foundation stones for the 850 MW Ratle Hydroelectric Project and 540 MW Kwar Hydroelectric Project that is to be constructed on the Chenab river in Kishtwar district.

He also inaugurated the Banihal-Qazigund Road Tunnel, built at a cost of over Rs 3,100 crore. The 8.45 km long tunnel will reduce the road distance between Banihal and Qazigund by 16 km, and reduce journey time by around one and a half hours.

In addition, the PM laid the foundation stone of the Delhi-Amritsar-Katra Expressway and also inaugurated the 500KW Solar Power Plant at Palli village in Samba.

“I am here with a message of development. To give speed to development in J&K, projects worth over Rs 20,000 crore have been inaugurated today. This year Panchayati Raj Day is being celebrated in J&K. This signals a new development. Democracy has reached the grassroots level. The people of J&K were deprived of a 3-tier Panchayati Raj system for many years," PM Modi was quoted as saying.

April 24 marked Modi’s first major visit to J&K since August 5, 2019. The prime minister had briefly visited J&K to celebrate Diwali with the armed forces in the Nowshera district on November 4, 2021. Before that, he had visited J&K in April 2019.

https://www.news18.com/news/india/i...slams-increased-terror-footprint-5045791.html

 

[Romali_rotti]

Oh boy, if these are the scholarly articles that are fed to you then I can't really blame you for your views. These authors have a blatant bias and they don't care to hide it. I guess it's Indian government strategy to spread propoganda because in all honestly there's not much else India can do in matters of Azad Kashmir, Shaksgam valley and Aksai Chin.

Shaksgam valley belongs to China, they had a claim on it even before partition. We were at risk of going to war with them but we peacefuly settled those border issues and gained much more.

In fact China at that time tried to peacefully solve border claims with all its neighbours. Pakistan, Bhutan and Nepal went the peaceful route.
India on the other hand, in it's arrogance, decided that rather than negotiating they can bully their way in Aksai Chin. This arrogance was shattered in the India China war of 1962, when it begged USA to intervene. To this day, India hasn't been able to gain anything in Aksai Chin while Pakistan is enjoying a secure northern border.

You do realize that Shaksgam valley is part of Kashmir and it was considered 'disputed' region when you made the deal with the Chinese...

I am just flabbergasted why the moralistic Pakistanis that care so much for the Kashmiris would trade the Kashmiri land to China..

Puzzling...

 

[Romali_rotti]

India on the other hand, in it's arrogance, decided that rather than negotiating they can bully their way in Aksai Chin. This arrogance was shattered in the India China war of 1962, when it begged USA to intervene. To this day, India hasn't been able to gain anything in Aksai Chin while Pakistan is enjoying a secure northern border.

Agreed, Grand Pappa Nehru got his pants taken down and was given a beating by China, the same China to which he once said something along these lines; Give the UN Security council seat to China as their need is bigger than ours.

The extreme beating by the Chinese forced Grandpappa Nehru in 62 to drop his 'neutral' stance and went begging to Kennedy to help him from the humiliation of his lifetime...

 

[daytrader]

Agreed, Grand Pappa Nehru got his pants taken down and was given a beating by China, the same China to which he once said something along these lines; Give the UN Security council seat to China as their need is bigger than ours.

The extreme beating by the Chinese forced Grandpappa Nehru in 62 to drop his 'neutral' stance and went begging to Kennedy to help him from the humiliation of his lifetime...

Thanks for agreeing. I'm glad we see eye to eye on something

 

[daytrader]

You do realize that Shaksgam valley is part of Kashmir and it was considered 'disputed' region when you made the deal with the Chinese...

I am just flabbergasted why the moralistic Pakistanis that care so much for the Kashmiris would trade the Kashmiri land to China..

Puzzling...

Most Pakistanis and Indians overlook the fact that China had claims to part of Kashmir even before partition, making it a genuine stakeholder in the dispute.

At that time, China had issued maps which showed a lot of Pakistani areas on their side. Bear in mind this was at the time of cold war and Pakistan was in the US camp. Pakistan actually asked China to do a demarcation fearing that there might be another unsecure border. It turned out to be a great move though because not only were we able to secure the northern border, we were able to get China on our side. Also there's a clause in the treaty that in the event the Kashmir dispute is resolved between Pakistan and India, both sides will reopen talks on boundaries. So really, the onus is on India to come to the table and resolve all issues related to Kashmir. Ignoring Pakistan is in no one's favour and with this agreement Pakistan has demonstrated that it's more than willing to solve border issues in a diplomatic peaceful manner. If only India sees the same

 

[Itachi]

Most Pakistanis and Indians overlook the fact that China had claims to part of Kashmir even before partition, making it a genuine stakeholder in the dispute.

At that time, China had issued maps which showed a lot of Pakistani areas on their side. Bear in mind this was at the time of cold war and Pakistan was in the US camp. Pakistan actually asked China to do a demarcation fearing that there might be another unsecure border. It turned out to be a great move though because not only were we able to secure the northern border, we were able to get China on our side. Also there's a clause in the treaty that in the event the Kashmir dispute is resolved between Pakistan and India, both sides will reopen talks on boundaries. So really, the onus is on India to come to the table and resolve all issues related to Kashmir. Ignoring Pakistan is in no one's favour and with this agreement Pakistan has demonstrated that it's more than willing to solve border issues in a diplomatic peaceful manner. If only India sees the same

Source?

 

[daytrader]

Source?

For which part... actually let me take a page out of your book, prove me wrong

 

[Itachi]

For which part... actually let me take a page out of your book, prove me wrong

This was a very disappointing post from you considering the post that you hold here. This wasn't expected from you to be honest.

 

[daytrader]

This was a very disappointing post from you considering the post that you hold here. This wasn't expected from you to be honest.

Hmmm you posted a one word post, I asked you to clarify with a bit of the same banter that you dish out. Nothing personal about it.

 

[Clueless]

Explained: Wheel moves on J&K-Article 370 petitions before SC, what’s under challenge in these cases?

The Supreme Court has said it will consider listing for hearing petitions challenging the abrogation of Article 370 in erstwhile Jammu and Kashmir. How many pleas are pending before the court? Who has filed them? What is under challenge?

Earlier this week, the Supreme Court said that it will consider listing for hearing petitions challenging the August 2019 decision of the central government to make changes to Article 370 that gave special status to Jammu and Kashmir, and to reconstitute the erstwhile state into two Union Territories of Jammu and Kashmir and Ladakh.

So how many petitions are pending before the court on this issue?

As many as 23 petitions on this issue are currently before the Supreme Court.

Who has filed these petitions?

A wide range of lawyers, activists, politicians and retired civil servants are among the petitioners.

They include advocates M L Sharma, Soayib Qureshi, Muzzafar Iqbal Khan, Rifat Ara Butt and Shakir Shabir; National Conference Lok Sabha MPs Mohammad Akbar Lone and Hasnain Masoodi, CPI(M) leader Mohammed Yousuf Tarigami, the Jammu and Kashmir Peoples Conference, Kashmiri artist Inder Salim, and journalist Satish Jacob.

Also among the petitioners are Radha Kumar, a former member of the Home Ministry’s Group of Interlocutors for J&K, Hindal Haidar Tyabji, a former Chief Secretary of J&K, retired Air Vice Marshal Kapil Kak, retired Major General Ashok Kumar Mehta, Amitabha Pande, a former Secretary to the Inter State Council of the Government of India, and Gopal Pillai, a former Union Home Secretary.

Former IAS officer Shah Faesal, activist Shehla Rashid, the People’s Union for Civil Liberties, and the Jammu and Kashmir Bar Association have also petitioned the Supreme Court.

What is under challenge in these petitions?

The petitions challenge the Presidential Orders of August 5 and 6, 2019, as well as The Jammu and Kashmir Reorganisation Act, 2019.

The August 5 order — Constitution (Application to Jammu and Kashmir) Order, 2019 — passed in exercise of the power under Article 370(1)(d) of the Constitution, superseded the 1954 Presidential Order that introduced Article 35A (which empowers the state of Jammu and Kashmir to define who is a permanent resident and make special laws for them) into the Constitution.

The Order, which said the provisions of the Constitution of India shall apply to J&K, added that references to the Sadar-i-Riyasat and the Government of J&K shall be construed as including references to the Governor of J&K acting on the advice of his Council of Ministers, and reference to Constituent Assembly of J&K shall be construed as reference to Legislative Assembly of J&K.

The August 6 Presidential Order revoked the special status granted to J&K under Article 370.

The Jammu and Kashmir Reorganisation Act, 2019 reorganised the state of J&K into the UT of Jammu and Kashmir and UT of Ladakh.

A few petitions also challenge the constitutional validity of Article 370 and Article 35A.

One petition challenges the delimitation exercise being carried out in J&K, saying it violates the right to equality.

What is the status of these petitions?

Some of the petitioners were of the opinion that the petitions should be referred to a seven-judge Bench citing conflict of opinion between the decisions of the SC in two cases — ‘Prem Nath Kaul versus Jammu and Kashmir’ in 1959 and ‘Sampat Prakash versus Jammu and Kashmir’ in 1970 — about the nature and extent of Article 370. Both these cases were decided by five-judge Benches of the court.

A five-judge Bench of the SC, which heard the prayer, however, rejected it on March 2, 2019. The court did not agree with the argument that there is a direct conflict between the two judgments, and said the petitions would be taken up by the five-judge Bench.

The matter has not come up for hearing after this.

https://indianexpress.com/article/e...-article-370-supreme-court-petitions-7891313/

 

[Thala]

Most Pakistanis and Indians overlook the fact that China had claims to part of Kashmir even before partition, making it a genuine stakeholder in the dispute.

At that time, China had issued maps which showed a lot of Pakistani areas on their side. Bear in mind this was at the time of cold war and Pakistan was in the US camp. Pakistan actually asked China to do a demarcation fearing that there might be another unsecure border. It turned out to be a great move though because not only were we able to secure the northern border, we were able to get China on our side. Also there's a clause in the treaty that in the event the Kashmir dispute is resolved between Pakistan and India, both sides will reopen talks on boundaries. So really, the onus is on India to come to the table and resolve all issues related to Kashmir. Ignoring Pakistan is in no one's favour and with this agreement Pakistan has demonstrated that it's more than willing to solve border issues in a diplomatic peaceful manner. If only India sees the same

What Nonsense!!!

Pakistan had no business to hand over 'disputed' land to China as you guys cry day and night about the dispute, just to please China and secure its borders.

Pakistan acted in its interest and didn't care about their side of Kashmir. Same way India scrapped article 370 from Indian side of Kashmir in its interest.

I see no monkey business here even going by your own logic, don't you agree?

 

[Thala]

Also did Pakistan involve India as a party while they were signing this agreement and handing over Kasmiri territory to Chinese as it was disputed land back then too?

If No then why the hell India should involve Pakistan or care about what they think in any decision related to Kashmir?

 

[Thala]

Only solution is to make LOC the international border and be done with this. Having nuclear capabilities ensure that neither party is getting an inch other than whatever they control currently. Sooner common folks realise this the better. Otherwise politicians (in Indian case) and Army(In Pakistan's case) will continue milking this issue and making fool of all of us.

 

[daytrader]

What Nonsense!!!

Pakistan had no business to hand over 'disputed' land to China as you guys cry day and night about the dispute, just to please China and secure its borders.

Pakistan acted in its interest and didn't care about their side of Kashmir. Same way India scrapped article 370 from Indian side of Kashmir in its interest.

I see no monkey business here even going by your own logic, don't you agree?

It's not my logic, it's history. You can't make it up.

Again China had claims to the area prior to partition. The British Raj left a lot of unsolved disputes including defining clear borders with China. It's a different story that China didn't come calling for their claim until they resolved their internal issues and had a strong government.

Another aspect to the land swap was genuine fear that if Pakistan didn't comply to China's demands, India might. We played a smart move at that time, securing our border with room to renegotiate.

 

[Thala]

It's not my logic, it's history. You can't make it up.

Again China had claims to the area prior to partition. The British Raj left a lot of unsolved disputes including defining clear borders with China. It's a different story that China didn't come calling for their claim until they resolved their internal issues and had a strong government.

Another aspect to the land swap was genuine fear that if Pakistan didn't comply to China's demands, India might. We played a smart move at that time, securing our border with room to renegotiate.

I agree that Pakistan played a smart move in its self interest and did what they had to do.

But they didn't include India in this process, a party in 'disputed' J&K region. Same way why you have problems if India scrapped article 370, a move in India's self interest.

 

[PakLFC]

how ? do tell..

How what?

 

[The Bald Eagle]

New Delhi: In a separate ruling during the hearing of the scrapping of Article 370 in Jammu and Kashmir, Justice Sanjay Kishan Kaul called for an impartial investigation into human rights abuses in Jammu and Kashmir since the 1980s.

"I recommend the setting up of an impartial Truth and Reconciliation committee to investigate and report on the violations of human rights both by the state and non-state actors at least since the 1980s and recommend measures for reconciliation," Justice Kaul said.

"To move forward, wounds require healing. Inter-generational trauma is felt by people. The first step towards healing the wounds is the acknowledgment of the acts of violations done by the state and its actors," he added.

Justice Kaul emphasised the original intent of Article 370, stating its aim was to gradually integrate Jammu and Kashmir into India.

"The purpose of Article 370 was to slowly bring Jammu and Kashmir on par with the other states of India. The requirement of recommendation of Jammu and Kashmir Constituent Assembly cannot be read in a manner that makes the larger intention redundant," he said.

While acknowledging the need for gradual integration, Justice Kaul raised concerns about the use of "backdoor amendments" to bypass established procedures.He stressed that when a specific method for amendment is prescribed, such as the one.

The Supreme Court today, validated the government's to scrap Article 370, a constitutional provision that bestowed special status upon the erstwhile state of Jammu and Kashmir.

A five-judge bench, led by Chief Justice of India DY Chandrachud, directed the government to facilitate the conduct.

Source : NDTV

 

[Romali_rotti]

Its finally over, Kashmir will forever be part of India.

BJP Government is the only government that has made any impactful decisions for India since the time of Vajpayee..

Finally some of the damage done by Grandpappa retard Nehru has been undone... BJP needs to keep the momentum going, crush the Gandhi family once and for all, put a forever nail in that leftist pseudo secular coffin and end them...

 

[The Bald Eagle]

India's top court upholds end of special status for Kashmir, orders polls

India's Supreme Court upheld on Monday a 2019 decision by the government of Prime Minister Narendra Modi to revoke special status for the state of Jammu and Kashmir and set a deadline of Sept. 30 next year for local polls to be held.

India's only Muslim-majority. region Jammu and Kashmir has been at the heart of more than 75 years of animosity with neighbouring Pakistan since the birth of the two nations in 1947 at independence from colonial rule by Britain.

India's Supreme Court upheld on Monday a 2019 decision by the government of Prime Minister Narendra Modi to revoke special status for the state of Jammu and Kashmir and set a deadline of Sept. 30 next year for local polls to be held.

India's only Muslim-majority area, Jammu and Kashmir has been at the heart of more than 75 years of animosity with neighbouring Pakistan since the birth of the two nations in 1947 at independence from colonial rule by Britain.

The unanimous order by a panel of five judges followed more than a dozen petitions challenging the revocation and a subsequent decision to split the region into two federally administered territories - Jammu and Kashmir, and the Buddhist territory of Ladakh.

It sets the stage for elections in Jammu and Kashmir, which was more closely integrated with India after the government's move, taken in line with a longstanding promise of Prime Minister Narendra Modi's nationalist Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP).

The decision is a shot in the arm for the government before a general election due by May.

The challengers maintained that only the constituent assembly of Jammu and Kashmir could decide on the special status of the mountain region, and contested whether parliament had the power to revoke it.

The court said special status was a temporary constitutional provision that could be revoked. It ordered that Jammu and Kashmir should return to being a state at the earliest opportunity.

Source : Reuters