T20 makeshift keeper: The best way to utilise high risk batters?

[Rana]

This is a current trend we are seeing in franchise deals+ international cricket too.

It seems that some teams are not valuing the keeping position as a vital clog to championship/glory and are willing to compromise on skills in order to adjust and best utilise high risk yet potentially match winner players.

Finn Allen in the past couple of seasons has not been trusted by any IPL franchise to take on the role of overseas opener, regardless of the X factor and threat he carries with his immense batting firepower and skill. It was very odd to see him keep innings for Perth Scorchers and it is now reported that KKR have gone in for him as their keeper/batter. This is their way of playing it safe as they can potentially play another home player with him as the keeper.

Pakistan have also been advising Khwaja Nafay, another potentially devastating player on his day to take up the gloves as this could be their method to best utilise him too.

Is this the correct way to utilise the keeper spot in T20?

Or would you prefer the questionable method of adding a below par T20 batter in the shape of Rizwan, Ghazi Ghouri or Tom Latham only to mask their incompetence with the bat through good keeping skills?

 

[Raja Ishtiaq]

Need a specialist keeper

Can't have behind the stumps dropping dollies and losing us games!

 

[Kianig89]

Lo g, another attempt this time indirectly , keeper is a specialist job from club level to international level keeper has a designated role. Makeshift keepers can work for a couple of games but not permanently.

Or are you implying this because Rizwan is a safe keeper compared to Haris Azam and Usman ??

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

You can get away with playing average wicketkeepers in T20 provided they offer something meaningful with the bat. But at the same time, it shouldn't be someone with little to no experience of keeping wickets, or what you might call a 'makeshift wicketkeeper.' At the end of the day, he still has to take catches and affect stumpings and runouts. And you need to have a somewhat of skillset for wicketkeeping to be able to do that.

In test cricket, I would always value wicketkeeping ability over batting ability.

 

[Ball Blazer]

teams that underplay the specialist wicketkeeper often pay the price through missed chances that outweigh occasional batting upside

 

[daytrader]

@rana sb KKR had Gurbaaz who by your own admission has the ability to hit 6x6. How much more high risk does a batter get

 

[cricfan432]

Nafay is proper keeper.

 

[Rana]

Lo g, another attempt this time indirectly

I have no issues in directly wiping the floor with Rizwan.

I have not made a stupid claim like you have by saying Rizwan is Gilchrist and Boucher put together.

 

[Kianig89]

Does a makeshift keeper compensate for a drop catch where the batter goes on to score 50 or a century, yes drops happen in games but with a makeshift keeper you're inviting for a fumble.

 

[daytrader]

Does a makeshift keeper compensate for a drop catch where the batter goes on to score 50 or a century, yes drops happen in games but with a makeshift keeper you're inviting for a fumble.

Imagine if it was a keeper that dropped Wade's catch in 2021 instead of Hasan Ali.

What our hate mongering friend doesn't understand is that T20s are a game of fine margins. 1 delivery can change the game. And if a catch is dropped of a set batter, that could be game losing.

Besides the approach he's suggesting might work for teams that have strong fielding but for a weak fielding team like Pakistan, it's equal to shooting yourself in the foot.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

It depends from team to team.
I have no issues with Usman Khan level of keeper, he is serviceable for T20s. Anything like than that is not worth it no matter how good the batting.

 

[Rana]

Need a specialist keeper

Can't have behind the stumps dropping dollies and losing us games!

Are you saying Nafay and Finn Allen are this in T20 but Rizwan isn’t?

 

[daytrader]

Yeah I’m pretty sure your youthia majority fans would overlook Rizwan’s lapse because it didn’t fit the narrative at the time.

He was 3rd highest run scorer in the tournament brother and hit 12 sixes in 6 games. Got 3 fifties. Of course his lapse would've been overlooked.

Canadian cricket fans should abstain from hypothetical scenarios in cricket. That’s well above your domain,

You're the one making up hypothetical scenarios and talking about makeshift keepers. Whereas the reality is that PCT has tried full time alternatives like Haris and Usman who have a reputation of being risky batters yet they've proven to be worse.

 

[khyberlion]

Nafay is proper keeper.

He's a rubbish keeper.

 

[GudduBadmash]

Are you saying Nafay and Finn Allen are lallus in T20 but Rizwan isn’t?

Allen is a good fielder and the difference here is that New Zealand as a cricket nation has produced good fielders whereas Pakistan has consistently produced some of the worst. In those countries even if you are a good batsman and a good bowler, if your fielding is subpar you will never make the national team which is precisely why only in Pakistan can an Obese guy make his international Debut.

Rizwan is possibly one of the safest Wicket Keepers in world cricket and if we want to go beyond he is easily one of the best fielders in the country too or will you take that attribute away from him too due to your intrinsic hatred of him

 

[Rana]

Allen is a good fielder and the difference here is that New Zealand as a cricket nation has produced good fielders whereas Pakistan has consistently produced some of the worst. In those countries even if you are a good batsman and a good bowler, if your fielding is subpar you will never make the national team which is precisely why only in Pakistan can an Obese guy make his international Debut.

Rizwan is possibly one of the safest Wicket Keepers in world cricket and if we want to go beyond he is easily one of the best fielders in the country too or will you take that attribute away from him too due to your intrinsic hatred of him

Not once have I ever bashed Rizwan for Keeping or fielding

He just isn’t a T20 batter.

 

[Kianig89]

Makeshift keepers , who exactly are they in Pakistan???
Or the OP is losing faith in Usman Khan and wants Sahibzada to be a Makeshift keeper.

Or the OP is wary of the fact that Sahibzada purple patch might be over soon, thereby disguising him in the name of Makeshift keeper.

 

[gazza619]

Makeshift keepers , who exactly are they in Pakistan???
Or the OP is losing faith in Usman Khan and wants Sahibzada to be a Makeshift keeper.

Or the OP is wary of the fact that Sahibzada purple patch might be over soon, thereby disguising him in the name of Makeshift keeper.

Though Riz is not in the Pakistan T20 team and his chances of a comeback are looking slim at present, but Riz still rules the mind of @Rana

Such is the dehshat of our Mujahid-e-Pakistan

 

[CricVet]

As mentioned above, it depends on the team. Some teams have stronger batting unit and a mediocre batting cameo would be suffice from that specialist keeper in that team. However, a team like Pak which is known to collapse, cannot afford to have a ball eating specialist wk-bat. As of now, Usman any day over Rizwan unless Rizwan improves his SR in the lower order. If he was so passionate, he would have done it already though.

 

[daytrader]

Makeshift keepers , who exactly are they in Pakistan???
Or the OP is losing faith in Usman Khan and wants Sahibzada to be a Makeshift keeper.

Or the OP is wary of the fact that Sahibzada purple patch might be over soon, thereby disguising him in the name of Makeshift keeper.

Ah so this is the ploy! Thanks for the reveal

 

[sweep_shot]

Pakistan used to have Umar Akmal as the T20 keeper.

In T20, you can get away without a regular keeper.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Farhan can keep wickets and should keep wickets so we can adjust a good hitter in the lower order instead of Usman hacker

 

[Major]

Rana jee suffers from the the fox, the chicken and the grain dillema, where the farmer has to cross the river carrying only one thing per trip on the boat while retrieving the other 2 in next trip.

Now he knows there is no keeper in Pakistan better than Rizwan, so he makes these scenarios.

First it was sacrificing fitness and bad keeping to get Azam in place of Rizwan. That failed

Than it was sacrificing poor batting form and bring in a keeper back based of 2017 glory to get Sarfraz in, and that failed

Than it was bringing in Harris with low scores but high strike rate, but that failed soo badly that harris not only failed with the bat but also with the gloves

Than it was bringing in a guy who is a part time keeper and sucks as a batter and his name is Usman Khan. He ends up also failing badly as he is not only a garbage batter, his keeping also sucks.

Than he had hopes that someone like Khwaja Nafay would take up the gloves and become his savior that can get rid of Rizwan. Turns out Nafay is stuggling as a batter.

Lol, the desperation to keep Rizwan out and to come out with these little schemes.

Bhai ke aek scheme nahi chalti

 

[Major]

I actually hope one of rana jees schemes succeed, or else next scheme would be to make a keeper from a test tube.

The threat of rizwans comeback lingers

 

[Kianig89]

Another one of threads made by OP , which is just above to leave him eggfaced

Makeshift keepers like hacks can only last a couple of games after that they are found out and hushed away

 

[Rana]

Jamie Smith, full time keeper+batter ignored

Finn Allen, selected as make shift keeper by KKR

 

[daytrader]

Jamie Smith, full time keeper+batter ignored

Finn Allen, selected as make shift keeper by KKR

Just in time to watch Babar eh

 

[TheSultan]

I think semi competent makeshift keepers are the way to go in T20s. It may force the more cowardly keeper-bats to grow a pair.

Gone are the days where the keeper is “the quirky guy” like Alan Knott, Jack Russell, Ian Healey with an unorthodox technique and weird mannerisms. In T20s he needs to be a powerhouse.

 

[Rana]

Farhan can keep wickets and should keep wickets so we can adjust a good hitter in the lower order instead of Usman hacker

Or we can simply remove Babar and have Hasan Nawaz bat at 3.

 

[BouncerGuy]

Or we can simply remove Babar and have Hasan Nawaz bat at 3.

Talk to salman to move himself down to make things work... selfishness of next level

 

[Rana]

Talk to salman to move himself down to make things work... selfishness of next level

That is only possible once Babar is out of the team

 

[DeadlyVenom]

I think semi competent makeshift keepers are the way to go in T20s. It may force the more cowardly keeper-bats to grow a pair.

Gone are the days where the keeper is “the quirky guy” like Alan Knott, Jack Russell, Ian Healey with an unorthodox technique and weird mannerisms. In T20s he needs to be a powerhouse.

Those days are also gone in Test Cricket too batting has to be a high standard and then the keeping is factored in.

In T20 you can get away with it even more.

 

[Rana]

Jamie Smith v Finn Allen’s selection for KKR is a prime example of why this thread was created

Unfortunately, guys like @Kianig89 @Major @gazza619 who historically have displayed a very poor understanding of white ball cricket seem to be triggered because they are desperate to shove Rizwan into the T20i side of Pakistan and hinder Pakistan’s chances to progress as usual.

 

[Kianig89]

Nobody is triggered, there should be personnel for strategy, who are the makeshift keepers , since Azam Harris Usman all count them as specialist keeper.
So Sahizada Farhan will he be the makeshift keeper, so where does that leaves Usman shall the mgmt axe Usman to include Hassan Nawaz .
The argument to drop Babar dies immediately as he is playing as batsman and not as wicketkeeper.

What's the rationale ?

 

[Rana]

Nobody is triggered, there should be personnel for strategy, who are the makeshift keepers , since Azam Harris Usman all count them as specialist keeper.
So Sahizada Farhan will he be the makeshift keeper, so where does that leaves Usman shall the mgmt axe Usman to include Hassan Nawaz .
The argument to drop Babar dies immediately as he is playing as batsman and not as wicketkeeper.

What's the rationale ?

The rationale is Babar will handle McGrath, Lee and Gillespie..

 

[Kianig89]

At present Pakistan should stick with Usman as keeper in t20s and Bury this idea of makeshift Jack thing.

Another makeshift keeper can be OBY, but he was also a hack

 

[Rana]

On top of the debate between Jamie Smith v Finn Allen…

Smith isn’t even a poor T20 batting option. He is a solid keeper, and is actually a very strong and powerful batsman.

I rate him as a better T20 batter than someone like Daryl Mitchell even.

So this is a serious question. Which direction is T20 cricket heading?

 

[BouncerGuy]

That is only possible once Babar is out of the team

This is possible once Salman is out of T20 team..

 

[Rana]

This is possible once Salman is out of T20 team..

I don’t think it’s possible like that

If Salman is moved out of the team, Babar will get an absolute free run with his PR and journalists going all out to preserve him as the “safety” batsman.

You would know this too.

 

[BouncerGuy]

I don’t think it’s possible like that

If Salman is moved out of the team, Babar will get an absolute free run with his PR and journalists going all out to preserve him as the “safety” batsman.

You would know this too.

Not to make babar the captain again... Captain should have been Shaheen in the first place.. Salman could have been used in ODIs... But yeah... Clueless PCB

 

[DeadlyVenom]

I don’t think it’s possible like that

If Salman is moved out of the team, Babar will get an absolute free run with his PR and journalists going all out to preserve him as the “safety” batsman.

You would know this too.

Babar is going to be finished after this BBL. He is horribly out of nick and this isn't the place to bat slow and get back into form.

RIzwan has an outside shot to come back into the team as the other candidates to replace him haven't done too well. Usman started to grow in confidence without him.

If this series v Sri Lanka happens and Rizwan Babar are still in BBL they can be frozen out for good if the replacements take their chance.s

 

[Rana]

Babar is going to be finished after this BBL. He is horribly out of nick and this isn't the place to bat slow and get back into form.

RIzwan has an outside shot to come back into the team as the other candidates to replace him haven't done too well. Usman started to grow in confidence without him.

If this series v Sri Lanka happens and Rizwan Babar are still in BBL they can be frozen out for good if the replacements take their chance.s

The Australian chief announced that the Pakistan players are fully available so that means Pakistan are announcing a squad for SL without Babar.

If I were Babar or his management right now, I would be extremely anxious and look for some way to get out of the BBL.

 

[shamaan]

The Australian chief announced that the Pakistan players are fully available so that means Pakistan are announcing a squad for SL without Babar.

If I were Babar or his management right now, I would be extremely anxious and look for some way to get out of the BBL.

Hopefully Shamyl Hussain and Maaz Sadaqat are in the squad.

 

[Rana]

Hopefully Shamyl Hussain and Maaz Sadaqat are in the squad.

I think Maaz Sadaqat, Hassan Nawaz and Khwaja Nafay

I’m happy for Pakistan to try this with Agha sitting out too.

 

[topspin]

This is possible once Salman is out of T20 team..

Getting touchy over Babar again, I see. Truth be told, neither him nor Salman should be in the T20 team.

 

[Rana]

Getting touchy over Babar again, I see. Truth be told, neither him nor Salman should be in the T20 team.

But Babar first. Aint no way Babar survives with Agha out of the picture

 

[shamaan]

I think Maaz Sadaqat, Hassan Nawaz and Khwaja Nafay

I’m happy for Pakistan to try this with Agha sitting out too.

I doubt Agha will sit out tbh.Maaz should 100% be in the xi.

 

[topspin]

But Babar first. Aint no way Babar survives with Agha out of the picture

Agreed. Babar has been playing on reputation. Agha has at least done a respectable job as a leader of the side.

 

[Rana]

I doubt Agha will sit out tbh.Maaz should 100% be in the xi.

Agha actually will sit out if he knows he has no business

He’s not like Babar and Rizwan.

 

[shamaan]

Agha actually will sit out if he knows he has no business

He’s not a dumb@ss like Babar and Rizwan.

He wont sit out and if he does then solute to him

 

[topspin]

He wont sit out and if he does then solute to him

Imam-ul-Haq for T20 cricket?

 

[shamaan]

Imam-ul-Haq for T20 cricket?

no Saud Shakeel for T20 cricket.