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"Target is to win ICC World Test Championship and ICC Champions Trophy": Jay Shah

India to Play at least one practice match in Dubai before the Start of their competition in the champions trophy. against which team to be finalised soon.
 
BouncerGuy said:
A dream about WTC that failed to turn to reality for the 3rd consecutive time...LOL

CT could meet the same fate
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It is good to have these set of goals. India is a top ranked team and should be setting out to win these tournaments. These expectations should be communication to fans, coach and players. There is nothing wrong with this.

Over the next cycle Pakistan should aim for a top 4 finish in WTC, and knockouts of CT and WT20. This suits our teams standard of play at the moment.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
It is good to have these set of goals. India is a top ranked team and should be setting out to win these tournaments. These expectations should be communication to fans, coach and players. There is nothing wrong with this.

Over the next cycle Pakistan should aim for a top 4 finish in WTC, and knockouts of CT and WT20. This suits our teams standard of play at the moment.
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That defeat against Australia is still hurting you I think.
 
Lol hahah first dream has been washed and same will happen to his second one as well.

He looks like someone on spectrum.Looks super weird.
 
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DeadlyVenom said:
It is good to have these set of goals. India is a top ranked team and should be setting out to win these tournaments. These expectations should be communication to fans, coach and players. There is nothing wrong with this.

Over the next cycle Pakistan should aim for a top 4 finish in WTC, and knockouts of CT and WT20. This suits our teams standard of play at the moment.
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Aiming for the knockouts of a limited-overs tournament is minnow-mentality. I can understand for WTC because there is a clear skill gap that you can't taper over in test cricket. But there is no reason why a team that has won every white-ball ICC tournament should aim for the knockouts, especially when so much is predicated on momentum and how you do on the day.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
Aiming for the knockouts of a limited-overs tournament is minnow-mentality. I can understand for WTC because there is a clear skill gap that you can't taper over in test cricket. But there is no reason why a team that has won every white-ball ICC trophy should aim for the knockouts., especially when so much is predicated on momentum and how you do on the day.
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Yup ,Aim should be winning the trophy. Pakistan is not a minnows team like Bangladesh to just think about reaching at the knockout stages only .

:kp
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
Aiming for the knockouts of a limited-overs tournament is minnow-mentality. I can understand for WTC because there is a clear skill gap that you can't taper over in test cricket. But there is no reason why a team that has won every white-ball ICC tournament should aim for the knockouts, especially when so much is predicated on momentum and how you do on the day.
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We are close to a minnow in ODI and T20 based on the results of the last world cups.

The problem is our fans don't accept it and our board doesn't either so we end up sacking the coach, captain, selectors if we don't win. Our long term plan should absolutely be to win tournaments but in the short-medium term we should be aiming to improve and at least reach knockouts.

Hand on heart can you look at our champions trophy group and say we are favorites to qualify for the next stage?
 
DeadlyVenom said:
oh bhai jaan I am just being realistic lol

We can't have the same targets as India. Ours should be more of a long term focus to climb up the test rankings and build some stability in short formats.
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LOL... whatever brother... jay shah's dreams were broken.. I am just being sympathetic. that's all
 
DeadlyVenom said:
We are close to a minnow in ODI and T20 based on the results of the last world cups.

The problem is our fans don't accept it and our board doesn't either so we end up sacking the coach, captain, selectors if we don't win. Our long term plan should absolutely be to win tournaments but in the short-medium term we should be aiming to improve and at least reach knockouts.

Hand on heart can you look at our champions trophy group and say we are favorites to qualify for the next stage?
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ODI is best formats for pakistan team . They had already beaten Australia and South Africa in overseas conditions .

Pakistan ODI team is well settled and inform . Babar, Rizwan, Agha, and Saud etc are liability in T20 cricket but Best possible line up for the ODI cricket .
 
Devadwal said:
ODI is best formats for pakistan team . They had already beaten Australia and South Africa in overseas conditions .

Pakistan ODI team is well settled and inform . Babar, Rizwan, Agha, and Saud etc are liability in T20 cricket but Best possible line up for the ODI cricket .
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If pitches have help for bowlers we are one of the best teams.

If there is nothing for the bowlers and it is phata or unhelpful then we get hammered and our batting cannot cope. We are more pitch dependent than other sides.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
We are close to a minnow in ODI and T20 based on the results of the last world cups.

The problem is our fans don't accept it and our board doesn't either so we end up sacking the coach, captain, selectors if we don't win. Our long term plan should absolutely be to win tournaments but in the short-medium term we should be aiming to improve and at least reach knockouts.

Hand on heart can you look at our champions trophy group and say we are favorites to qualify for the next stage?
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We are a mediocre cricketing nation, but minnow is a bit of a stretch. Currently, Pakistan has a pretty good ODI side and I don't think anyone disputes that. I would say that yes, we are favorites to qualify for the next stage at this point.

And even if you are doing poorly that doesn't mean that you just accept that and decide you never want to aspire to be something better. True mediocrity is accepting that you are medicore, rather than trying to make an attempt to better yourself. In test cricket there are no short-term fixes, and how your domestic system is reflects greatly on the type of team you have. But in white-ball cricket, sometimes all it takes is a couple of players who can completely change the fortunes of a team.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
If pitches have help for bowlers we are one of the best teams
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That's like saying "If the wickets are rank turners, Bangladesh are one of the best Teams".

The statement is somewhat true but it doesn't mean much. LOI surfaces around the world are batting friendly or have been for more than two decades. Only on bowling friendly surfaces does the gap between top sides and average sides narrows down.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
We are a mediocre cricketing nation, but minnow is a bit of a stretch. Currently, Pakistan has a pretty good ODI side and I don't think anyone disputes that. I would say that yes, we are favorites to qualify for the next stage at this point.

And even if you are doing poorly that doesn't mean that you just accept that and decide you never want to aspire to be something better. True mediocrity is accepting that you are medicore, rather than trying to make an attempt to better yourself. In test cricket there are no short-term fixes, and how your domestic system is reflects greatly on the type of team you have. But in white-ball cricket, sometimes all it takes is a couple of players who can completely change the fortunes of a team.
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I think Pakistan is among top 4 in ODI format. Strong ODI side.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
We are a mediocre cricketing nation, but minnow is a bit of a stretch. Currently, Pakistan has a pretty good ODI side and I don't think anyone disputes that. I would say that yes, we are favorites to qualify for the next stage at this point.

And even if you are doing poorly that doesn't mean that you just accept that and decide you never want to aspire to be something better. True mediocrity is accepting that you are medicore, rather than trying to make an attempt to better yourself. In test cricket there are no short-term fixes, and how your domestic system is reflects greatly on the type of team you have. But in white-ball cricket, sometimes all it takes is a couple of players who can completely change the fortunes of a team.
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It is not about being mediocre but setting reasonable goals for the players. Absolutely, they should be trying to win, but we should set the expectation that they are expected to qualify for knockouts and judge them accordingly, treating it as a project until the team is ready to compete at the top again. That doesn't mean they get complacent.

We aren't on the Australia or India level at the moment where the expectation is to win and anything else is a failure.
 
Mesozoic said:
That's like saying "If the wickets are rank turners, Bangladesh are one of the best Teams".

The statement is somewhat true but it doesn't mean much. LOI surfaces around the world are batting friendly or have been for more than two decades. Only on bowling friendly surfaces does the gap between top sides and average sides narrows down.
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It's important that we are realistic about the current teams capabilities. We don't have the firepower to win on flat tracks consistently.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
We are close to a minnow in ODI and T20 based on the results of the last world cups.

The problem is our fans don't accept it and our board doesn't either so we end up sacking the coach, captain, selectors if we don't win. Our long term plan should absolutely be to win tournaments but in the short-medium term we should be aiming to improve and at least reach knockouts.

Hand on heart can you look at our champions trophy group and say we are favorites to qualify for the next stage?
Click to expand...

How are PAK minnows in ODI's while being ranked 3 in the ICC rankings ?

They've been a poor Test and T20 side for some time but this PAK side is as good as it gets in ODI's currently
 
I am not in favour of bumping these old threads for personal recreation. Jay shah said this as BCCI head to motivate the team further just after winning the WT20. He also said after WC2023 final that we will lift the WT20 trophy in NY and we did. No one called him panauti then?

I take great offence on this disrespect shown to ICC supremo Mr Jay Shah.
 
Rajdeep said:
I am not in favour of bumping these old threads for personal recreation. Jay shah said this as BCCI head to motivate the team further just after winning the WT20. He also said after WC2023 final that we will lift the WT20 trophy in NY and we did. No one called him panauti then?

I take great offence on this disrespect shown to ICC supremo Mr Jay Shah.
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No need to disrespect Jay. He has done a good job that any desi will be proud of. Taking over the family business and expanding it the dream for any desi dad and Jay is the role model son that all fathers compare their kids against.
 
Nikhil_cric said:
How are PAK minnows in ODI's while being ranked 3 in the ICC rankings ?

They've been a poor Test and T20 side for some time but this PAK side is as good as it gets in ODI's currently
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Our team hasn't changed too much from the previous world cup where we crashed out. We have done well in bowling friendly pitches and thats why we jumped up the rankings a bit. I did say we are a good side when the pitches are helpful.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
It is not about being mediocre but setting reasonable goals for the players. Absolutely, they should be trying to win, but we should set the expectation that they are expected to qualify for knockouts and judge them accordingly, treating it as a project until the team is ready to compete at the top again. That doesn't mean they get complacent.

We aren't on the Australia or India level at the moment where the expectation is to win and anything else is a failure.
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Last I checked, we were the defending champions. And winning an ICC tournament isn't as improbable as you are making it out to be. There have been some remarkable upsets in the past such as India winning the WC in 1983 and Sri Lanka winning in 1996. Even Pakistan winning the CT was a pretty big upset because they were nowhere near as good as India or England coming into that tournament. Pakistan right now is a top-tier side in ODIs and have every reason to be confident about their chances going into a tournament that is taking place in their own backyard.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
Our team hasn't changed too much from the previous world cup where we crashed out. We have done well in bowling friendly pitches and thats why we jumped up the rankings a bit. I did say we are a good side when the pitches are helpful.
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I don't think Pakistan's performance in the last World Cup represented the team they are capable of being. And I would say that they have changed in all the right ways. Babar is no longer captain and his replacement is actually good at the job. Saim has added a breath of fresh air to the top-order. The thing that cost Pakistan most in the WC: their spin attack has been completely rebranded by the addition of two wily mystery spinners, and Naseem Shah coming back has added balance to the pace attack as well. You also gotten rid of the fake finisher Ifti Chacha and replaced him with someone who can contribute in all areas: Salman Ali Agha.
 
Jay Shah may want to take his statements back lol Rohit sharma is older than Jay shah. His reflexes are completely shot. He was late against even 130 k balls in Australia. It is a mistake not retiring him out. It will hurt Jay Shah and co badly.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
Our team hasn't changed too much from the previous world cup where we crashed out. We have done well in bowling friendly pitches and thats why we jumped up the rankings a bit. I did say we are a good side when the pitches are helpful.
Click to expand...

The problem for Pakistan is that the core of their first XI is very, very good. But apart from that, it's mediocrity all around.

It was clear that there was not even a half decent back up for Naseem in 2023. With a fit and firing Naseem , you could've probably got into the KO's..

And if Saim and Fakhar are unfit and out of form/finished respectively , then a formidable side will suddenly look like a side struggling to even qualify.

Very dependent on 6-7 players to pull them all the way through.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
It's important that we are realistic about the current teams capabilities. We don't have the firepower to win on flat tracks consistently.
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I wasn't disagreeing to that. There's a certain way white ball cricket is being played today. And it has been the case ever since the 2003 world cup.

You can't be the "one of the best teams" if you do not have the batting firepower to match the top 4 or 5 sides.
 
Rajdeep said:
I am not in favour of bumping these old threads for personal recreation. Jay shah said this as BCCI head to motivate the team further just after winning the WT20. He also said after WC2023 final that we will lift the WT20 trophy in NY and we did. No one called him panauti then?

I take great offence on this disrespect shown to ICC supremo Mr Jay Shah.
Click to expand...
To be fair...if Jay Shah even as Head of ICC made this statement it wouldn't be that surprising :ROFLMAO:
 
Nikhil_cric said:
The problem for Pakistan is that the core of their first XI is very, very good. But apart from that, it's mediocrity all around.

It was clear that there was not even a half decent back up for Naseem in 2023. With a fit and firing Naseem , you could've probably got into the KO's..

And if Saim and Fakhar are unfit and out of form/finished respectively , then a formidable side will suddenly look like a side struggling to even qualify.

Very dependent on 6-7 players to pull them all the way through.
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Pakistan is never team that won anything due to their batting. I can't recall a pakistani topping the batting charts ina n ICC tournament. WHenever they win something it is due to their bowling.
 
Rajdeep said:
I am not in favour of bumping these old threads for personal recreation. Jay shah said this as BCCI head to motivate the team further just after winning the WT20. He also said after WC2023 final that we will lift the WT20 trophy in NY and we did. No one called him panauti then?

I take great offence on this disrespect shown to ICC supremo Mr Jay Shah.
Click to expand...
Don't care so much for him man, he is just Indian version of Naqvi
 
Nikhil_cric said:
The problem for Pakistan is that the core of their first XI is very, very good. But apart from that, it's mediocrity all around.

It was clear that there was not even a half decent back up for Naseem in 2023. With a fit and firing Naseem , you could've probably got into the KO's..

And if Saim and Fakhar are unfit and out of form/finished respectively , then a formidable side will suddenly look like a side struggling to even qualify.

Very dependent on 6-7 players to pull them all the way through.
Click to expand...
Pakistan were awful at the 2023 World Cup, but the only mitigation apart from Naseem's injury is that none of the players had ever toured India.

Venues like Kolkata, Chennai or Bengaluru have their unique characteristics, ground dimensions, micro-climate etc. If anything, the SENA teams with years of IPL experience and regular tours were more at home in India than ourselves.

This time we've no such excuse playing at home.
 
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