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Unimpressed with batting talent so far in PSL 3

PSL continues to expose how rubbish our batting stocks are. People talking about how PSL has given us Fakhar and Sharjeel etc. need to realize that these two would not have made the Indian team. They are nowhere near the likes of Rohit and Dhawan.

Hasan would make the Indian team, but Shadab will not either. India have better leg-spinners than him.

IPL has given India better talents than the PSL, but since India is leagues above Pakistan, getting into the Indian team is a much tougher ask.

IPL is just one platform for Indians.. India is generally very conservative on blooding new talent. Pakistan is much better that htey gamble on youngsters.. Most of the IPL superstars are already pretty accomplished FC/List A/T20 players.. Even after shining in IPL, usually players will need to perform in domestics before they will get selected. One exception is Hardik Pandya for obvious reasons (lack of pace bowling all-rounders) but his brother Krunal is finding it difficult to break in even after having good IPLs. So nobody should be expecting that India will hand out debut just because of few good IPL matches
 
Once again.. do you think the best batsmen in Pakistan have been selected in the PSL/or getting games?

i don't understand this argument. do you mean to say some keyboard warriors are better than all those professional talent scouters, coaches, and peers? sure there will always be some good players who might get unlucky but majority are not. There will always be nepotism in any setup (look at Marsh brothers), injustice will happen. It might be more in third world countries like sub continent. But overall most of them are there because they are the best that the teams could bring together. PSL teams are for profit teams, and why will they not choose the right talent if they are available? Looks like Pakistan's best XI is always playing in some gully mohallas according to PPrs.
 
i don't understand this argument. do you mean to say some keyboard warriors are better than all those professional talent scouters, coaches, and peers? sure there will always be some good players who might get unlucky but majority are not. There will always be nepotism in any setup (look at Marsh brothers), injustice will happen. It might be more in third world countries like sub continent. But overall most of them are there because they are the best that the teams could bring together. PSL teams are for profit teams, and why will they not choose the right talent if they are available? Looks like Pakistan's best XI is always playing in some gully mohallas according to PPrs.

When you select Iftikhar Ahmed, Gulraiz Sadaf and Shan Masood instead of guys like Zeeshan Malik, Umair Masood, Mukhtar Ahmed, Nauman Anwar etc there’s a problem.
 
Once again.. do you think the best batsmen in Pakistan have been selected in the PSL/or getting games?

As usual, the best players in Pakistan are the ones that are not in the team and have not been given an opportunity.

Every player that is out of the team is supposed to be the solution to our woes, until we select them and they become part of the problem.

Let’s get real and accept the reality. Apart from maybe 1-2 batsmen, the ones that are playing - or have been selected for the Pakistan team - is all that we have.

There are no modern, world class batsmen that are get wasted due to lack of opportunities. Talat is good, but he is nothing special. He is not going to transform our fortunes in Limited Overs.

Batsmen like him are worth dime a dozen in any major cricket nation, but we are so desperate for quality batsmen that we hype every Tom, Dick and Harry to the moon.

Sahibzada Farhan seems to be the last flavor of the month, but it is 99% likely that he too is not good enough to compete with the best that the other teams have to offer.

It is not about individuals or lack of talent. Any country that invests pretty much all of its resources in one sport and has a heritage of 60+ years will always have “talent” for that sport.

The lack of quality, modern batsmen is a systematic issue. We are just not capable of producing top drawer batsmen.

We can feel good about ourselves by blaming everything on the selectors and accusing them for not selecting the right players, but the “right” players simply do not exist.

Our young batsmen are awful and we need to accept that. Like the first two seasons, you will not see any new face dominating the batting charts.

It will be the usual Kamran, Shehzad, Hafeez etc. scoring the bulk of runs, which means that these players are actually better than the young batting talents.
 
When you select Iftikhar Ahmed, Gulraiz Sadaf and Shan Masood instead of guys like Zeeshan Malik, Umair Masood, Mukhtar Ahmed, Nauman Anwar etc there’s a problem.

None of these names are anything special. Put them in the team now, and within a few months, people will be calling for their heads because they will be part of the problem and not the solution.

There are no batsmen in Pakistan who can average 50+ in ODIs at a strike rate of 90+ against the top opposition, or bat at a consistently high strike rate in T20s.

The closest that we have are Fakhar and Babar: the former is hit and miss because of his playing style and will thus never be consistent, while the latter does not have the caliber to make an impact against the top teams.
 
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

Why are you even expecting 50+ at 90+ SR?

There’s only 1 batsman who is averaging 50+ at over 90SR consistently against top sides and his name is Virat Kohli.

He’s a GOAT candidate and clearly you need to lower your expectations. At times India is a one man team.

What we need are batsmen who can average around 35-45 at a strike rate of over 90 against top teams to be competitive. Pretty much like England - Roy, Morgan, Bairstow etc.
 
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

Why are you even expecting 50+ at 90+ SR?

There’s only 1 batsman who is averaging 50+ at over 90SR consistently against top sides and his name is Virat Kohli.

He’s a GOAT candidate and clearly you need to lower your expectations. At times India is a one man team.

What we need are batsmen who can average around 35-45 at a strike rate of over 90 against top teams to be competitive. Pretty much like England - Roy, Morgan, Bairstow etc.

Kohli is not the only one, but he is obviously the best of the lot. However, the likes of Root, Smith, de Villiers, Rohit, Dhawan, Taylor, Guptill etc. play a similar role.

Not all of them average 50 at a strike rate of 90, but they score consistently against the top teams at a good strike rate.

50 @90 is an arbitrary number - the point is that we do not have batsmen who score against the big teams regularly. The young batsmen who are coming through are simply not exposed to that level of cricket.

They face mediocre bowlers in domestic cricket and some rubbish expired players in the PSL. Not a single contemporary world class fast bowler plays in the PSL.
 
As these young batsmen play against the top teams they will improve. Even exposure in the PSL will do a lot. You just have to get the right kinds of players with potential to grow e.g. Talat in the side, not hope for the likes of Umar Akmal and Ahmed Shehzad to “come good”.

Unfortunately as our domestic scene is so terrible and there are no A tours our players have to learn the ropes in international cricket.

But there are definitely candidates who can score consistently against top teams at good strike rates.
 
Hahahahhaha ok bro your saffron is showing :)))

Not just saffron bro, there’s white and green as well 🇮🇳 :)
Raina has played so many match winning knocks for India and CSK. He has great temperament and the right set of shots for limited overs cricket. He’s the perfect no.4 for India.
 
Raina is far better than Babar. He is a high impact player and a pure match-winner. In fact throughout Pakistan's history, there are only a handful of batsman that can be considered better than Raina in Limited Overs.

India have a huge batting legacy due to which brilliant players like Raina etc. are often underrated. If he was a Pakistani, he would have been a Limited Overs legend for us.

Yeah Babar may not be better than Raina currently in some ways but I think he will be. That’s the feeling I get when I watch him bat. There is a nice flow to his batting which comes from timing and balance coming from his technique. And he’s still very young. I’m pretty sure he’ll reach greater heights if continues to progress.
 
So far only overseas player have made good runs except Talat in one match. Let's see what happens in the upcoming matches. One thing is sure however, Umar Akmal is a trash.

He is just a slogger with no ability to anchor an innings.

A good batsman is one who can adjust his play according to the situation.

After a good start from Bazz and fakhar , Lahore needed to take only singles but it's too tough to understand for Umar.
 
Another match where so far the Pakistani batsmen have looked inept.

Asad Shafiq looked out of his depth. Asif Ali what was he doing?
 
Yet again a match that displayed tried and tested Pakistani batting failures.

Seems like most of the young batsmen are there just to carry drinks.
 
Yet again a match that displayed tried and tested Pakistani batting failures.

Seems like most of the young batsmen are there just to carry drinks.

Why haven't the likes of Saud Shakeel, Sahibzada Farhan, Said Badar and Khushdil Shah been given opportunities?
 
None of the paskistani batsmen are good enough. Theee is pattern to their weakness, they cannot play pace or short pitch. They don’t know how to pull or cut. When ever they have to play shots, they end up slogging like tailenders, nobody is going to give them half volleys, specially when they know you cannot cut/pull. Sharjeel was exception to the rule.

Looking at bowling stock, it’s clear pace bowling is not a requirement in domestic. If Bowlers like Hammad and Abbas have low 20s average, wickets are most probably wet and green. When wickets are phatta, they are so low in bounce that they don’t have to pull and cut either. Wahab has best stats in PSL, because he bowls short at pace, that take care of 80% of all Pakistani batsmen 🙄🙄

Talent is secondary issue, Pakistan used to have well rounded batsmen and bowlers. Main reason was ground quality, now since nobody comes to Pakistan, grounds are not maintain to international standards. PCB is forced to spend that money in UAE. Side benefit of those test quality grounds were that domestic players were playing in better conditions. Now you see a 40 year old guy with 120 speed breaking domestic records, if that is no wake up call, what is 👹👹👹
 
You slumped to 60 all out againist india u19 team in wc semis and then say why are we playing hafeez,umar akmal etc....
TBH they are the best you have got
 
Yet again a match that displayed tried and tested Pakistani batting failures.

Seems like most of the young batsmen are there just to carry drinks.

its really dissapointing as well as shocking to see zero contribution from Pakistani batsmen .
foreign players who have little to no experience at all in these conditions they seems to adapt much quicker.
 
None of the paskistani batsmen are good enough. Theee is pattern to their weakness, they cannot play pace or short pitch. They don’t know how to pull or cut. When ever they have to play shots, they end up slogging like tailenders, nobody is going to give them half volleys, specially when they know you cannot cut/pull. Sharjeel was exception to the rule.

Looking at bowling stock, it’s clear pace bowling is not a requirement in domestic. If Bowlers like Hammad and Abbas have low 20s average, wickets are most probably wet and green. When wickets are phatta, they are so low in bounce that they don’t have to pull and cut either. Wahab has best stats in PSL, because he bowls short at pace, that take care of 80% of all Pakistani batsmen 🙄🙄

Talent is secondary issue, Pakistan used to have well rounded batsmen and bowlers. Main reason was ground quality, now since nobody comes to Pakistan, grounds are not maintain to international standards. PCB is forced to spend that money in UAE. Side benefit of those test quality grounds were that domestic players were playing in better conditions. Now you see a 40 year old guy with 120 speed breaking domestic records, if that is no wake up call, what is 👹👹👹

I as a optimistic Pak fan do have a delusion that maybe one day we are going to find great attacking all-round batsman who can play any shot according to match situation and or bowling length, not one dimensional cow corner hacks that we have now but.......

When I read factual posts like these which bring me back to reality, it really pains me to admit that the way things are going not just our batting but bowling is going down hill. The domestic pitches that we get in QEA TROPHY etc are much worse then the ones you get on Sunday league park matches in UK. Like alot of posters mentioned here. Bowlers and batsman are made at first class and list a matches not PSL. I cannot fathom how the PCB heirarchy the people in charge who claim to love the game that can make a difference turn a blind eye yet simple keyboard fans like us can see the shortcomings in our domestic set up.

Also they need to get rid of all TTFS in PSL play young players with raw talent, move the PSL fully hosted in Pak regardless if they lose loads of foreign players, create fast bouncy batting friendly pitches, similar to New Zealand pitches for limited overs. Hopefully with top tier coaching we can improve these naturally gifted youngsters.

Unless any of that happens any time soon Future looks very bleak I'm afraid....
 
PCB/Inzamam-ul-Haq should have some say in team selection. These franchises don’t give a damn of unearth young players.
 
Yet again a match that displayed tried and tested Pakistani batting failures.

Seems like most of the young batsmen are there just to carry drinks.

They are simply not given an opportunity to flourish. Hussain Talat has been impressive! Sahibzada Farhan needs to be given more chances. Even if we manage to attain one, two batsman from this PSL; its a big thing! I have my eyes on these both :)
 
i don't understand this argument. do you mean to say some keyboard warriors are better than all those professional talent scouters, coaches, and peers? .

Yes. Stats and number guys are much much better at identifying good players than old-school coaches who go by their subjective perceptions. That's why franchises that are using data anlaytics are doing better than others.
 
PCB/Inzamam-ul-Haq should have some say in team selection. These franchises don’t give a damn of unearth young players.

Lol.

How is it even real competitive cricket if people outside the team decide who will play.

People need to learn to respect the game. PSL will be a laughing stock if it's treated as a talent hunt rather than a competition.
 
Kohli is not the only one, but he is obviously the best of the lot. However, the likes of Root, Smith, de Villiers, Rohit, Dhawan, Taylor, Guptill etc. play a similar role.

Not all of them average 50 at a strike rate of 90, but they score consistently against the top teams at a good strike rate.

50 @90 is an arbitrary number - the point is that we do not have batsmen who score against the big teams regularly. The young batsmen who are coming through are simply not exposed to that level of cricket.

They face mediocre bowlers in domestic cricket and some rubbish expired players in the PSL. Not a single contemporary world class fast bowler plays in the PSL.

Robin Uthappa, Dinesh Karthik, Ambati Rayudu, Manish Pandey - if a batsman at their level of ability was Pakistani, he would have been sitting pretty on a 10 year career by now, probably would be captain.
 
Robin Uthappa, Dinesh Karthik, Ambati Rayudu, Manish Pandey - if a batsman at their level of ability was Pakistani, he would have been sitting pretty on a 10 year career by now, probably would be captain.

Yes Pakistan has failed to produce a batsman of Robin Uttappa or Dinesh Karthik's caliber with ODI averages of beastly 25 and 30, respectively. Or even Manish Pandey with an ODI average of 39. The only one with an actually good record is Ambati Rayudu.
 
Yes Pakistan has failed to produce a batsman of Robin Uttappa or Dinesh Karthik's caliber with ODI averages of beastly 25 and 30, respectively. Or even Manish Pandey with an ODI average of 39. The only one with an actually good record is Ambati Rayudu.

Man , Ambati Rayudu has played 30 odd ODIs ??? I haven't seen any one of them . Surprised that he has a good record.
 
Yes Pakistan has failed to produce a batsman of Robin Uttappa or Dinesh Karthik's caliber with ODI averages of beastly 25 and 30, respectively. Or even Manish Pandey with an ODI average of 39. The only one with an actually good record is Ambati Rayudu.

And that just goes to show how records can be misleading. In that list of 4 batsmen, Rayudu would come a solid 4th. Its just that the others haven't gotten the opportunities and platform to succeed.

Look, I totally understand that my post would raise your hackles. But ask any non pakistani to pick a batsman in ODI cricket - anyone of those 4, or a Mohammed Hafeez, and you will have your answer.
 
And that just goes to show how records can be misleading. In that list of 4 batsmen, Rayudu would come a solid 4th. Its just that the others haven't gotten the opportunities and platform to succeed.

Look, I totally understand that my post would raise your hackles. But ask any non pakistani to pick a batsman in ODI cricket - anyone of those 4, or a Mohammed Hafeez, and you will have your answer.

Why bring in Muhammad Hafeez. You said these no name batsmen would have 10 year careers and would be captains too. So you are telling me these gully mohallah batsmen are better than Anwar, Inzi, Yousuf, Maindad heck even Misbah or Malik?


Now don't go back on your word. This kind of chest thumping might work on other forums but be prepared to find more informed posters on here.
 
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Unimpressed with Sahibzada Farhan so far.

Seems to be a big hit or nothing at the moment from him.
 
The truth is that we are simply incapable of producing high quality batsmen. 99% of our batsmen are rubbish, and the 1% "good" batsmen e.g. Babar, Haris, Fakhar, perhaps Talat etc. are not in the same league as the best batsmen that other countries produce.
 
Batting talents are so outdated. Sahibzada Farhan doesn't seem to have the power game.
 
Agha Salman looks the best of what so far can only be described as a very mediocre bunch of Pakistani batsmen.
 
Poor excuse that.

The best batsmen score runs on all surfaces and in all conditions.

Any batsmen need some kind of rhythm and momentum to carry on their stroke play...these pitches are so bad that the batsmen are circumspect most of the time and thus remaining in a shell...
 
Agha Salman looks the best of what so far can only be described as a very mediocre bunch of Pakistani batsmen.

The only “emerging” Pakistani batsmen to have played in this tournament so far have been:

Agha Salman
Hussain Talat
Sahibzada Farhan
Saif Badar

That’s not a lot. Can’t really judge Pakistani batting stocks can we?
 
The only “emerging” Pakistani batsmen to have played in this tournament so far have been:

Agha Salman
Hussain Talat
Sahibzada Farhan
Saif Badar

That’s not a lot. Can’t really judge Pakistani batting stocks can we?

Badar has barely played.
 
PCB/Inzamam-ul-Haq should have some say in team selection. These franchises don’t give a damn of unearth young players.

good point. For example Quetta should be playing Saad Ali instead of Asad Shafiq on merit but it is not happening :facepalm: There should be some sort of punishment to force teams to be fair.
 
Why bring in Muhammad Hafeez. You said these no name batsmen would have 10 year careers and would be captains too. So you are telling me these gully mohallah batsmen are better than Anwar, Inzi, Yousuf, Maindad heck even Misbah or Malik?


Now don't go back on your word. This kind of chest thumping might work on other forums but be prepared to find more informed posters on here.

Yes, I would say that anyone of those four would have outdone Misbah as an ODI batsman. Malik is an allrounder so let's leave him out of this. The rest of those names are relics of the 90s and early 2000s. I'm talking about 2005 2006 onwards.
 
All the young talents are carrying drinks for the joke TTF's who always get in ahead. Main reason why I'm not even bothering with the PSL at the moment.
 
Hussain Talat and Agha Salman are as good rookies as anybody else in the world. Title of thread should be changed to "Impressed with batting talent so far in PSL 3". :misbah
 
Fair point by those saying that many of the youngsters aren't getting a match yet tried and tested failures are being picked despite being awful.
 
When you have the likes of Hussain Talat coming in at 8 you cannot expect to unearth new talent.
 
Same logic, talented batsmen are not in team. When Pak win, they are the best team.
When they lose, correct players were not selected.
 
Rameez Raja jr today - I mean really. Did anyone see his shot and that was off the second ball he was facing.
 
The only “emerging” Pakistani batsmen to have played in this tournament so far have been:

Agha Salman
Hussain Talat
Sahibzada Farhan
Saif Badar

That’s not a lot. Can’t really judge Pakistani batting stocks can we?

This. People think the tournament is full of new players.
 
Rameez Raja jr today - I mean really. Did anyone see his shot and that was off the second ball he was facing.

But he is much better then Saud and Saad ali according to sarfraz and the team managment. Pathetic that these sort of Batsmen are selected. I think they played him knowing he will flop so they can bring Asad back into the team.
 
The only “emerging” Pakistani batsmen to have played in this tournament so far have been:

Agha Salman
Hussain Talat
Sahibzada Farhan
Saif Badar

That’s not a lot. Can’t really judge Pakistani batting stocks can we?

That's a great point. I wish people took this into account. Most of the local batsmen we have seen are 25+ and already TTF domestic players.

The two/three emerging players we have seen have looked really good! If only we could see Saud Shakeel and Saadi Ali as well + Hasan Mohsin/Abdullah Shakeel.

People dramatize the situation but things are not that bad. If a few 25+ domestic tried and tested failures have failed in the PSL then that does not mean that there is no batting talent left in Pakistan.
 
Rameez Raja jr today - I mean really. Did anyone see his shot and that was off the second ball he was facing.
Agreed. This guy is not even a youngster anymore. He was part of the 2006 under 19 world cup and has much more 1st class experience than these emerging players. Saying that we havent found a single player consistent this psl. All that hype surrounding the emerging players seems to be going down. This league needs a fair share of high scoring games too.
 
Pretty ordinary innings from Ahmed Shehzad also today. Scratched around before playing a lousy shot to get out.
 
Commentators raving about Babar Azam's 50 today.

I thought it was awful. Looked like he was struggling, played and missed, mis-timing the ball and missing out on four-balls.
 
Khurram Manzoor showing today that the future of Pakistan batting is in safe hands :)

Those saying the poor batting is down to the pitches, watch Ronchi's innings today.
 
Commentators raving about Babar Azam's 50 today.

I thought it was awful. Looked like he was struggling, played and missed, mis-timing the ball and missing out on four-balls.

Every time either of Umar Akmal of Babar Azam hit a boundary or two the commentator start raving about their "talent" and "potential".
 
God Babar and Khurram did damage to Karachi. T20 is not for players like Babar & Khurram. On one hand you had Duminy who played a similar style to the two but was supporting Ronchi and Asif Ali who were attacking the bowlers.
 
What talent? Only tried and tested failures are playing, youngesters are simply warming the benches.
 
even though the kid looks nerdy/weak, but ibtisam was doing fine, how do they drop him... (he is emerging, dawson is international player)....
 
PSL continues to expose how rubbish our batting stocks are. People talking about how PSL has given us Fakhar and Sharjeel etc. need to realize that these two would not have made the Indian team. They are nowhere near the likes of Rohit and Dhawan.

Hasan would make the Indian team, but Shadab will not either. India have better leg-spinners than him.

IPL has given India better talents than the PSL, but since India is leagues above Pakistan, getting into the Indian team is a much tougher ask.

I would take Fakhar and Sharjeel over Rohit in a heart beat. Yes Rohit has more shots in his armory and overall better batsman if you were to check him out in the nets but he is mentally weak and often bats very slow in the first PP (overs 1 - 10) - this is evident by the stat where India have the worst powerplay run rate as highlighted by the thread below. We know Dhawan is the aggressor and more dynamic of the 2 when it comes to the PP so we cannot attribute this stat to him.

Rohit performs very well in Indian conditions particularly when the bounce is even, on small grounds and where there is no lateral movement from the surface but when the equation isn't perfect, he isn't the same player and in such conditions he gets found out against better quality bowlers especially in big ICC matches (apart from Bangladesh) where he goes missing.

He failed miserably against Pakistan and Aus in the 2015 WC and although scored 91 against Pakistan in the opening game of last year's CT it came at a SR of 76 (and lingering at 50-60 SR for most of the innings). He was Amir's bunny yet again in the final later in the tournament which proved his inability to handle quality pace bowlers particularly overseas.

Other than the tri series that India played in Aus before the 2015 WC he has been unconvincing away from home to say the least and in chases he's liability putting all the pressure on his partner Dhawan to lift the innings.

If you follow ODIs in India you may be aware of Rohit's immense record in Kolkata and speaking of this venue it has become more pace friendly so when Australia played an ODI there 6 months ago he was found out easily by Coulter-Nile with a bit of shape outside his off stump.

I won't speak much of Sharjeel since after all he was banned but you could see his talent and ability to attack pace from the Aus series. He was like a powerful, left handed version of Sehwag who also shared great hand eye coordination.

Dhawan I rate the most highly out of the 4 names you've mentioned as he has been consistent and dependable in all conditions with an outstanding record in ICC tournaments. But Fakhar was literally a one man army in Pakistan's batting line up and every one of his knocks were clutch. For these reasons even Agarkar and Dravid on cricinfo acknowledged he was the best batsman in the tournament.






http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...lay-run-rate-in-ODIs-since-the-2015-World-Cup
 
Pakistan is not a batsmen producing nation. We get some good batsmen in every era - and sometimes very good ones too. Batting greats have only been a couple. It will be a dream to get another one.

That said, it's not shame. Our strength is bowling and may I say 'jazba' when the team plays bigger than the sum of its parts.

Unfortunately, that means we will remain inconsistent but will occasionally stun - hence mercurial, unpredictable etc.

A complete overhaul of system can make this situation change - but it is safe to say that is also a dream.
 
Every time either of Umar Akmal of Babar Azam hit a boundary or two the commentator start raving about their "talent" and "potential".

Commentators are being paid to hype everything up.

Run a ball innings are being described as great batting.
 
Maqsood deserves credit for his innings today. Superb hitting, I just wish he would do it more often.
 
I would take Fakhar and Sharjeel over Rohit in a heart beat. Yes Rohit has more shots in his armory and overall better batsman if you were to check him out in the nets but he is mentally weak and often bats very slow in the first PP (overs 1 - 10) - this is evident by the stat where India have the worst powerplay run rate as highlighted by the thread below. We know Dhawan is the aggressor and more dynamic of the 2 when it comes to the PP so we cannot attribute this stat to him.

Rohit performs very well in Indian conditions particularly when the bounce is even, on small grounds and where there is no lateral movement from the surface but when the equation isn't perfect, he isn't the same player and in such conditions he gets found out against better quality bowlers especially in big ICC matches (apart from Bangladesh) where he goes missing.

He failed miserably against Pakistan and Aus in the 2015 WC and although scored 91 against Pakistan in the opening game of last year's CT it came at a SR of 76 (and lingering at 50-60 SR for most of the innings). He was Amir's bunny yet again in the final later in the tournament which proved his inability to handle quality pace bowlers particularly overseas.

Other than the tri series that India played in Aus before the 2015 WC he has been unconvincing away from home to say the least and in chases he's liability putting all the pressure on his partner Dhawan to lift the innings.

If you follow ODIs in India you may be aware of Rohit's immense record in Kolkata and speaking of this venue it has become more pace friendly so when Australia played an ODI there 6 months ago he was found out easily by Coulter-Nile with a bit of shape outside his off stump.

I won't speak much of Sharjeel since after all he was banned but you could see his talent and ability to attack pace from the Aus series. He was like a powerful, left handed version of Sehwag who also shared great hand eye coordination.

Dhawan I rate the most highly out of the 4 names you've mentioned as he has been consistent and dependable in all conditions with an outstanding record in ICC tournaments. But Fakhar was literally a one man army in Pakistan's batting line up and every one of his knocks were clutch. For these reasons even Agarkar and Dravid on cricinfo acknowledged he was the best batsman in the tournament.






http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...lay-run-rate-in-ODIs-since-the-2015-World-Cup

It is quite a ridiculous argument. Rohit is a fantastic Limited Overs opener, and the likes of Fakhar and Sharjeel are not fit to tie his shoelaces. Yes he is not the best against lateral movement, but there is no evidence to suggest that Fakhar and Sharjeel are adept against the moving ball either.

Sharjeel's only claim to fame is a couple of half-centuries in Australia, a place where Rohit has been fantastic. In fact, he has 170+ score against Australia in Australia.

Most of the ODI wickets are flat anyway, and a set Rohit is as dangerous as any batsman in history. You cannot look beyond a batsman who has three double-hundreds in ODIs. Not a single team in history would pick Sharjeel or Fakhar over Rohit, it is as bad as comparing Umar Akmal to Kohli.
 
Why does Asad Shafiq keep getting picked:
A. For the PSL.
B. For the QG starting XI.
 
I think Asad himself stated that he had a brilliant domestic LO season. So I guess that was the basis of selection.
 
It is quite a ridiculous argument. Rohit is a fantastic Limited Overs opener, and the likes of Fakhar and Sharjeel are not fit to tie his shoelaces. Yes he is not the best against lateral movement, but there is no evidence to suggest that Fakhar and Sharjeel are adept against the moving ball either.

Sharjeel's only claim to fame is a couple of half-centuries in Australia, a place where Rohit has been fantastic. In fact, he has 170+ score against Australia in Australia.

Most of the ODI wickets are flat anyway, and a set Rohit is as dangerous as any batsman in history. You cannot look beyond a batsman who has three double-hundreds in ODIs. Not a single team in history would pick Sharjeel or Fakhar over Rohit, it is as bad as comparing Umar Akmal to Kohli.

If my argument is ridiculous I'm sorry Mamoon but you haven't made a single convincing argument for Rohit's case here - without going into Sharjeel because it's unlikely he'll ever play for Pakistan again, so let's keep this Fakhar v Rohit.

You do realise that the 170+ knock that Rohit made is one of the most overrated and useless 150+ innings that you'll find? His SR was just slightly above run a ball and the wicket was a perfect batting surface where India could only manage 309 from 50 overs even though they only lost 3 wickets. No surprise that Australia chased it easily after seeing off the new ball.

As for "Most of the ODI wickets are flat anyway", yes but there is a fine line between a 300 score batting surface and a perfect batting wicket where you can score 350+. All of Rohit's double tons have come on the flattest and truest of wickets which all happen to be in India.

Apart from his tons against Bangladesh, he has only managed 4 (out of a grand total of 17) altogether in Aus, SA, NZ and England combined where the wickets are a bit faster. Out of those 4 - only 1 of those came in a winning outcome.

You failed to address the following points of my argument which I will condense:

1. Rohit Sharma's powerplay strike rate in the first 10 overs - which correlates with India's worst PP run rate since the 2015 WC

2. Liability in run chases particularly outside Asia

3. Poor record in ICC 50 over tournaments against top 6 sides

4. Mentally he can't handle the big occasions - evident from 2015 semi, 2017 CT Final and see his record against Pakistan since 2015 WC.

5. Struggles against quality pacers outside Asia

Even when he gets past his the PP, his strike rate when he reaches his ton is around 80 if you go by all the ODI centuries he's made, if more people have this kind of knowledge they would realise he's been a bad investment.

But India are just hoping it will pay off next year but I guarantee he will flop in the WC next year as he can't handle the big stage, can't chase and can't handle even the slightest amount of lateral movement.

Now I'm not saying Fakhar will be a hit but he has the resilience and mental attributes to suceed, so I would rather take my chances on him. You can ridicule this comparison but the fact of the matter is Fakhar was miles better than Rohit in last year's CT. You criticise Amla for scoring useless tons and for not performing when stakes are high - so I have to say I'm disappointed why the same standard cannot be applied in the case of Rohit or shall we say as once named by shamed Indians - "no.hit".

Like yourself I find a lot of the cricketers Pakistan producing to be embarrassing and substandard but Rohit is the most overrated cricketer out there. He needs to take a leaf from Dhawan's book.
 
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If my argument is ridiculous I'm sorry Mamoon but you haven't made a single convincing argument for Rohit's case here - without going into Sharjeel because it's unlikely he'll ever play for Pakistan again, so let's keep this Fakhar v Rohit.

You do realise that the 170+ knock that Rohit made is one of the most overrated and useless 150+ innings that you'll find? His SR was just slightly above run a ball and the wicket was a perfect batting surface where India could only manage 309 from 50 overs even though they only lost 3 wickets. No surprise that Australia chased it easily after seeing off the new ball.

As for "Most of the ODI wickets are flat anyway", yes but there is a fine line between a 300 score batting surface and a perfect batting wicket where you can score 350+. All of Rohit's double tons have come on the flattest and truest of wickets which all happen to be in India.

Apart from his tons against Bangladesh, he has only managed 4 (out of a grand total of 17) altogether in Aus, SA, NZ and England combined where the wickets are a bit faster. Out of those 4 - only 1 of those came in a winning outcome.

You failed to address the following points of my argument which I will condense:

1. Rohit Sharma's powerplay strike rate in the first 10 overs - which correlates with India's worst PP run rate since the 2015 WC

2. Liability in run chases particularly outside Asia

3. Poor record in ICC 50 over tournaments against top 6 sides

4. Mentally he can't handle the big occasions - evident from 2015 semi, 2017 CT Final and see his record against Pakistan since 2015 WC.

5. Struggles against quality pacers outside Asia

Even when he gets past his the PP, his strike rate when he reaches his ton is around 80 if you go by all the ODI centuries he's made, if more people have this kind of knowledge they would realise he's been a bad investment.

But India are just hoping it will pay off next year but I guarantee he will flop in the WC next year as he can't handle the big stage, can't chase and can't handle even the slightest amount of lateral movement.

Now I'm not saying Fakhar will be a hit but he has the resilience and mental attributes to suceed, so I would rather take my chances on him. You can ridicule this comparison but the fact of the matter is Fakhar was miles better than Rohit in last year's CT. You criticise Amla for scoring useless tons and for not performing when stakes are high - so I have to say I'm disappointed why the same standard cannot be applied in the case of Rohit or shall we say as once named by shamed Indians - "no.hit".

Like yourself I find a lot of the cricketers Pakistan producing to be embarrassing and substandard but Rohit is the most overrated cricketer out there. He needs to take a leaf from Dhawan's book.
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

I should also clarify that I agree with your views of Amla in LOIs but just way off the mark with Rohit.
 
It is quite a ridiculous argument. Rohit is a fantastic Limited Overs opener, and the likes of Fakhar and Sharjeel are not fit to tie his shoelaces. Yes he is not the best against lateral movement, but there is no evidence to suggest that Fakhar and Sharjeel are adept against the moving ball either.

Sharjeel's only claim to fame is a couple of half-centuries in Australia, a place where Rohit has been fantastic. In fact, he has 170+ score against Australia in Australia.

Most of the ODI wickets are flat anyway, and a set Rohit is as dangerous as any batsman in history. You cannot look beyond a batsman who has three double-hundreds in ODIs. Not a single team in history would pick Sharjeel or Fakhar over Rohit, it is as bad as comparing Umar Akmal to Kohli.

Rohit has extremely high peaks followed by inconsistent and lazy attitude.

Personally, his peaks are even higher than Kohli on a certain day but would u rate Rohit better than Kohli?

Now Fakhar and Sharjeel might not be as good as Rohit (an open assumption now) but Fakhar might eclipse Rohit because of consistency.

To have high peaks followed by deep valleys doesnt really mean you are amazing.

It means height of inconsistency.

Just my opinion.
 
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