[VIDEOS] Imran Khan is the greatest cricketer ever

[saadsahabjee]

No one can match Imran khan as an all rounder or as a cricketer not even sobers. He excelled at his secondary skill i.e batting in a completely bowlers dominated era . Just have a look at his record from 1980 to 1992

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...;type=allround

Batting Avg :49.50 [ 5 100s 16 50s ]
Bowling Avg : 19.18 [ 234 wickets in 55 matches ]


There are no extraordinary all rounders playing in this era but lets take an example of AB devillers who is among the best batsman currently and bowls occasionally . His secondary skill is bowling in a batsman dominated era , what if he suddenly starts bowling so well that his bowling avg can be compared with the best in the bowling department e.g steyn, we would start calling him the greatest player ever .This is what Imran khan was able to achieve which nobody could and never will while keeping his bowling stats at almost same level.

 

[Slog]

No

 

[Stallion__]

We are catching up on insecurity level.....

 

[OS_89]

Not quite. But one of the greatest for sure.

 

[zabalestmsm]

Havent seen him play but stats wise he is!

Don't think any other all rounder averaged under 23 with the ball!

He also averaged above 50 as a batsman (as a captain)!

Also a WC winner!

 

[saadsahabjee]

We are catching up on insecurity level.....

Why? show me one cricketer who has performed with bat and ball like Imran at the time time for such a long period of time , not to forget he was playing Odis as well.

 

[Haroon786]

Yes he is.

 

[leg-side-flick]

Have seen him play... Like him a lot but there are better players than him....

Also your stat on batting average suggests that he was a bloody good batsmen, he was not and i would never pick him in top 4 of any test team....

Also if he averaged almost 50 in 80's then how much was Javed averaging ?

 

[saadsahabjee]

Int + Domestic bowling stats

Odis 182 wickets at 26
Tests 367 wickets at 22
List A 507 wickets at 22
First class 1287 wickets at 22

 

[Anik Sharma]

No.

 

[saadsahabjee]

Have seen him play... Like him a lot but there are better players than him....

Also your stat on batting average suggests that he was a bloody good batsmen, he was not and i would never pick him in top 4 of any test team....

Also if he averaged almost 50 in 80's then how much was Javed averaging ?

Javed never avrgd less than 50 his entire career.

 

[zabalestmsm]

Have seen him play... Like him a lot but there are better players than him....

Also your stat on batting average suggests that he was a bloody good batsmen, he was not and i would never pick him in top 4 of any test team....

Also if he averaged almost 50 in 80's then how much was Javed averaging ?

He must be picked as an all rounder though!

 

[Haroon786]

Have seen him play... Like him a lot but there are better players than him....

Also your stat on batting average suggests that he was a bloody good batsmen, he was not and i would never pick him in top 4 of any test team....

Also if he averaged almost 50 in 80's then how much was Javed averaging ?

Would still be good enough to make the team as a specialist batsman in the top 7 - the only cricketer you can say for his weaker discipline.

 

[Acricketfan]

I'm the president of World Bank and Emma Watson is my wife.

 

[saadsahabjee]

Imran averages above 33 as a batman in all the Odis ,Tests , List A and First Class statistics.

 

[leg-side-flick]

He must be picked as an all rounder though!

Yes, you can select him as a all rounder but Gary sobers will be selected first...i have not seen him but the whole world assumes he is the best like Bradman...

Also Most of the times Imran won the match with his bowling, captaincy and team selection... He was very good there

Imran as a batsman never really worried the opposition... He was not a big boundary hitter, he could smack it alright but i don't know how to put it, he never bothered me as a batsman in tests...Botham and Kapil were better batsmen ( i don't know their averages but it won't be close to 50, as OP put it for Imran ).... But i think Imran definitely was a better bowler..

 

[saadsahabjee]

I'm the president of World Bank and Emma Watson is my wife.

Good , Now go help your countrymen and give me your wife's number.

 

[leg-side-flick]

Would still be good enough to make the team as a specialist batsman in the top 7 - the only cricketer you can say for his weaker discipline.

Yup at 6/7 easily... No issues there but the OP put his average as 50 which is like gold standard for batsmen of 70/80's

 

[OS_89]

Sober's ability to simultaneously deliver performances with both bat and ball and ability to win matches and series with his secondary discipline makes him the best imo (Imran while a good batsman never won series with his weaker discipline like Sobers did in England in 1966 for example)

 

[OS_89]

Would still be good enough to make the team as a specialist batsman in the top 7 - the only cricketer you can say for his weaker discipline.

Only cricketer? Now ay. Botham,Kapil and Miller would easily warrant a spot in top 7. None of them except MMiller are good enough to consistently bat above 7 imo.

 

[leg-side-flick]

Sober's ability to simultaneously deliver performances with both bat and ball and ability to win matches and series with his secondary discipline makes him the best imo (Imran while a good batsman never won series with the ball like Sobers did in England in 1966 for example)

Imran won countless series with ball but i think you mean did not win much with bat

 

[OS_89]

????

I meant with weaker discipline. (ie) Imran winning series with the bat like Sobers did with his bowling

 

[OS_89]

Imran won countless series with ball but i think you mean did not win much with bat

Yeah. Typo

 

[saadsahabjee]

Yeah. Typo

He won the worldcup for his team as a batsman , what more do you want ??

 

[OS_89]

He won the worldcup for his team as a batsman , what more do you want ??

Huh are we talking about tests or ODIs here?

 

[OS_89]

And anyway, Imran's greatness in 92 world cup was more in his inspirational captaincy and leadership to bring the team back from a crisis. He barely played 1-2 good innings with the bat.

 

[saadsahabjee]

Huh are we talking about tests or ODIs here?

we are talking about every format he played as a cricketer.

 

[IndianWillow]

No one can match Imran khan as an all rounder or as a cricketer not even sobers. He excelled at his secondary skill i.e batting in a completely bowlers dominated era . Just have a look at his record from 1980 to 1992

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...;type=allround

Batting Avg :49.50 [ 5 100s 16 50s ]
Bowling Avg : 19.18 [ 234 wickets in 55 matches ]


There are no extraordinary all rounders playing in this era but lets take an example of AB devillers who is among the best batsman currently and bowls occasionally . His secondary skill is bowling in a batsman dominated era , what if he suddenly starts bowling so well that his bowling avg can be compared with the best in the bowling department e.g steyn, we would start calling him the greatest player ever .This is what Imran khan was able to achieve which nobody could and never will while keeping his bowling stats at almost same level.

The record is very good. But one thing - Except for a couple of years during that period, Imran's work load was quite low compared to other top players of his era. Between 1981 and 1992 that you mention, he played just 55 tests in 12 years (Ponting played that many tests over a 4 year span) - at approximately 4.5 tests per year. If you have the luxury to pick and choose matches at will, as an experienced player you can certainly perform well in every match you play.

A 50 averaging batsman in the 80s must be capable of staking a claim in an All time XI as a pure batsman alone. Does it really apply to Imran? Does Imran's batting average really reflect his batting ability? He made just six test hundreds in his career and that average must be interpreted in accordance with this fact.

 

[Enforcer]

It is difficult for me to determine who are more obnoxious - sachinistas or imranistas?

 

[saadsahabjee]

The record is very good. But one thing - Except for a couple of years during that period, Imran's work load was quite low compared to other top players of his era. Between 1981 and 1992 that you mention, he played just 55 tests in 12 years (Ponting played that many tests over a 4 year span) - at approximately 4.5 tests per year. If you have the luxury to pick and choose matches at will, as an experienced player you can certainly perform well in every match you play.

A 50 averaging batsman in the 80s must be capable of staking a claim in an All time XI as a pure batsman alone. Does it really apply to Imran? Does Imran's batting average really reflect his batting ability? He made just six test hundreds in his career and that average must be interpreted in accordance with this fact.

Why are you comparing his workload with Ponting's who made his debut in the late 90s . If you have to compare then show us the stats of other allrounders of his era , also not to forget he was playing odis as well at that time unlike sobers who just played test matches...

 

[OS_89]

Why are you comparing his workload with Ponting's who made his debut in the late 90s . If you have to compare then show us the stats of other allrounders of his era , also not to forget he was playing odis as well at that time unlike sobers who just played test matches...

Compare his workload with Sobers, who did tons of bowling.

And by this logic of Imran being better than Sobers because he had to play ODIs, why not say Kallis is better than both sicne he had to play ODI, t20 and tests?

 

[leg-side-flick]

we are talking about every format he played as a cricketer.

Buddy, if you are taking odi's then his batting ability is even lesser....

He, i think should figure in top 3 test match all rounders....

I also think he does not get as much credit as a bowler, he was bloody good there... Much better than Akram to be honest....

 

[saadsahabjee]

The record is very good. But one thing - Except for a couple of years during that period, Imran's work load was quite low compared to other top players of his era. Between 1981 and 1992 that you mention, he played just 55 tests in 12 years (Ponting played that many tests over a 4 year span) - at approximately 4.5 tests per year. If you have the luxury to pick and choose matches at will, as an experienced player you can certainly perform well in every match you play.

A 50 averaging batsman in the 80s must be capable of staking a claim in an All time XI as a pure batsman alone. Does it really apply to Imran? Does Imran's batting average really reflect his batting ability? He made just six test hundreds in his career and that average must be interpreted in accordance with this fact.

Also i never said he warrant a place in the world 11 as a pure batsman , what i was clarifying is while bowling so well at an avg of 22 he was able to increase his skills and stats as a batsman as well which till today no other cricketer has achieved also his performances in Odis were also more than average and sometimes extraordinary. Even Many modern batsman today do not have an avg of 34 as a batsman in odis .

 

[ChachaCricket]

Yes he is the greatest but we don't need to brag about it every day.

 

[saadsahabjee]

Compare his workload with Sobers, who did tons of bowling.

And by this logic of Imran being better than Sobers because he had to play ODIs, why not say Kallis is better than both sicne he had to play ODI, t20 and tests?

Did kallis ever average 20 or less as a bowler in any format for a longer period while maintaining his fantastic batting average ?

 

[as-95]

he is indeed the greatest cricketer of all time. Not sure we need a thread for it though...

 

[saadsahabjee]

Compare his workload with Sobers, who did tons of bowling.

See both their profiles on cricinfo and compare whose workload was more ....

http://www.espncricinfo.com/pakistan/content/player/40560.html

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/52946.html

 

[Lurker_Ind]

He is one of the greatest all rounders and a Top 10 Greatest players of all time at his best.

To call him the best ever is stretching it.

 

[Robert]

He has to be considered one of the best fast bowlers in history.

I would put him at joint #2 all-rounder with Miller, behind Sobers only.

As for best ever cricketer, Sir Donald Bradman is the colossus.

 

[Hitman]

For Pak fans, he indeed is. Just like how Sachin is the greatest ever cricketer according to a lot of Indian fans. In the real practical word, neither one of them is the greatest cricketer of all time.

 

[tempus123]

Lol at the thread.. he was one of the best cricketers of all time, but outside Pakistan you will not find many experts rating him as the best ever.

ESPNCricinfo didn't include him in their first choice world XI which was chosen by 20 world known experts. Wisden didn't have him as the 5 cricketers of the century. Bradman didn't include him in his XI either.

For the greatest ever cricketer, these many misses are something to make a note of.. not saying these lists are the word of God, but they hold some value and the greatest cricketers usually acknowledged world over like Bradman, Sobers, Warne etc. all feature in these lists.

There is no expert worth his salt who hasn't rated Bradman or Sobers as among the top-3 cricketers of all time, not sure about Imran.

 

[OS_89]

See both their profiles on cricinfo and compare whose workload was more ....

http://www.espncricinfo.com/pakistan/content/player/40560.html

http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/player/52946.html

Thank you very much for proving my point.

Imran Khan: 19458 balls in 88 tests = 221 balls per match
Sobers: 21599 balls in 93 tests = 232 balls per match

This is despite the fact that Sobers's bowling was hi weaker discipline. He still did more bowling in tests than Imran

Add to this Sobers was a top/middle order batsman and key slip/closein fielder and he was always involved in the game. In terms of workload, there is no contest. Sobers was a complete machine. A true workhorse.

 

[saadsahabjee]

Thank you very much for proving my point.

Imran Khan: 19458 balls in 88 tests = 221 balls per match
Sobers: 21599 balls in 93 tests = 232 balls per match

This is despite the fact that Sobers's bowling was hi weaker discipline. He still did more bowling in tests than Imran

Add to this Sobers was a top/middle order batsman and key slip/closein fielder and he was always involved in the game. In terms of workload, there is no contest. Sobers was a complete machine. A true workhorse.

very clever , you did not add the workload of odis which imran had to bear .

 

[OS_89]

very clever , you did not add the workload of odis which imran had to bear .

Do you concede then, that Sobers had to shoulder much heavier burden in tests.?

 

[ChachaCricket]

To top it off, he was a ball tamperer and regularly used to tamper with the ball, openly accepted it.

Everybody tampers with the ball. Why do you think his contemporaries didn't make a big deal out of it when he revealed those comments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=2212&v=MZYwQKbBvwI

Watch this to the end. It'll answer everything.

 

[tempus123]

Everybody tampers with the ball. Why do you think his contemporaries didn't make a big deal out of it when he revealed those comments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=2212&v=MZYwQKbBvwI

Watch this to the end. It'll answer everything.

Yes then it should have been legalized since everyone does it.

 

[#GreenRoars]

Yes then it should have been legalized since everyone does it.

Sachin was involved too in tampering if i remember correctly

 

[tempus123]

Sachin was involved too in tampering if i remember correctly

One off incident.. not admitted to guilt and had no reason to tamper the ball. He was neither captain, nor the premier bowler to have any chance of benefit.

You do realize the difference b/w honest mistakes and deliberate consistent intentional attempts to break the law, don't you ?

 

[#GreenRoars]

One off incident.. not admitted to guilt and had no reason to tamper the ball. He was neither captain, nor the premier bowler to have any chance of benefit.

You do realize the difference b/w honest mistakes and deliberate consistent intentional attempts to break the law, don't you ?

But wasn't he slapped with one match ban? Sounds interesting that he wasn't guilty but still he got punishment )

 

[saadsahabjee]

Do you concede then, that Sobers had to shoulder much heavier burden in tests.?

11 balls per inning is not much burden especially when you are bowling spin...

 

[Sachin136]

11 balls per inning is not much burden especially when you are bowling spin...

But this was Sobers' weaker discipline. So his workload in his weaker discipline was more than Imran's workload in his main job. That means a lot with respect to workload.

 

[tempus123]

But wasn't he slapped with one match ban? Sounds interesting that he wasn't guilty but still he got punishment )

Yes.. why are you laughing about it ? People are banned for one match for a number of reasons.. not all of them are intentional cheaters.

 

[TheNightWatchman]

He might not be...but he is my favourite.
If I want to define the term "cricketer" or "captain" I would use the example of Imran Khan

 

[TheNightWatchman]

Also he was a fast bowler. One of the first from Pakistan. Who can't love a fast bowler

 

[tempus123]

He might not be...but he is my favourite.
If I want to define the term "cricketer" or "captain" I would use the example of Imran Khan

Everyone has a right to have favourites, You can have Shahid Afridi as one too..

 

[Haroon786]

Only cricketer? Now ay. Botham,Kapil and Miller would easily warrant a spot in top 7. None of them except MMiller are good enough to consistently bat above 7 imo.

Miller only played 55 Tests and Botham and Kapil wouldn't make an all time eleven with their bowling.

 

[cricketAXEpert]

You only mentioned his batting and bowling. He was a great leader, Selector, Coach and Captain as well. He literally send his own team to selectors to select. He coached Wasim Akram, Waqar and Aaqib & Also discovered them. Abdul Qadir and Inzamam had their careers because of Imran. Because Imran insisted on playing them. In fact Inzamam didnt even wanted to play WC semi final Imran Pressured him into. I don't know another cricketer who was that influential. Stats are just what he did as player, he did way much more than that.

 

[Hitman]

Also he was a fast bowler. One of the first from Pakistan. Who can't love a fast bowler

The best fast bowler from the subcontinent, even better than than the 2 W's.

 

[leg-side-flick]

He has to be considered one of the best fast bowlers in history.

This point gets lost in rubbish discussions over workload, aura, odi, etc etc....in plain simple words, " He was a brilliant fast bowler who developed his batting as well and was a very good selector and motivator of cricketers"...

 

[miandadrules]

Thank you very much for proving my point.

Imran Khan: 19458 balls in 88 tests = 221 balls per match
Sobers: 21599 balls in 93 tests = 232 balls per match

This is despite the fact that Sobers's bowling was hi weaker discipline. He still did more bowling in tests than Imran

Add to this Sobers was a top/middle order batsman and key slip/closein fielder and he was always involved in the game. In terms of workload, there is no contest. Sobers was a complete machine. A true workhorse.

I certainly don't agree that Imran is the best ever. He is top 10, maybe top 5.

However, with regards to the workload of the two how many of the balls bowled by sobers were spin?

 

[Belawal2014]

Greatest Pakistani cricketer ever.

 

[ExplicitAI]

For me he's the best Pakistan cricketer in history. In the world? No.

 

[Sadevdesai]

More chest thumping and self gratification .... just like the frog in the well !!!!!

 

[Bilal7]

One of the best of all time.

 

[Mamoon]

One of the best of all time.

You have been calling him the best of all time till now. Who changed your mind and why?

 

[Hawkeye]

A case can be made for it, just like most will say he's the best Asian cricketer. It's not illogical and someone believing this shouldn't be attacked.

Not THE best, but he's certainly one of the best, IMO.

 

[Bilal7]

You have been calling him the best of all time till now. Who changed your mind and why?

I believe that he is the best cricketer to emerge from the sub-continent. He has stiff competition from the non-Asian legends, so I wouldn't be comfortable calling him the GOAT.

 

[larkykid]

The best fast bowler from the subcontinent, even better than than the 2 W's.

That accolade goes to Ishant Sharma.

 

[Mamoon]

I belive that he is the best cricketer ever to emerge from the sub-continent. He has stiff competition from the non-Asian legends, so I wouldn't be comfortable calling him the GOAT.

Okay. His status as Asia's best is unquestionable indeed.

 

[Bilal7]

Okay. His status as Asia's best is unquestionable indeed.

Can't say if this is genuine praise or sarcastic mocking.

 

[Hawkeye]

Okay. His status as Asia's best is unquestionable indeed.

You're saying that?

 

[Mamoon]

Can't say if this is genuine praise or sarcastic mocking.

You're saying that?

I have said this many times, but Imran the cricketer and Imran the politician are totally different entities for me.

 

[Hitman]

That accolade goes to Ishant Sharma.

Venkatesh Prasad would be a better example

Prasad has frustrated me as an Indian cricket fan like no other Indian cricketer ever has. The way Jayasuriya humiliated him in the process humiliating Indian cricket, I'll never forget.

 

[Sachin136]

A case can be made for it, just like most will say he's the best Asian cricketer. It's not illogical and someone believing this shouldn't be attacked.

Not THE best, but he's certainly one of the best, IMO.

Pretty much this. One of the top 3 cricketers from Asia along with Sachin and Muralitharan (probably the best out of those 3, but not sure) and one of the best ever. Definitely not undisputed as the best cricketer ever but then again no one is.

 

[Hitman]

Imran is one of the finest cricketers of his time and of all time. But calling him the greatest cricketer of all time would be exaggerating it. Sobers is widely regarded as the greatest cricketer to have ever lived.

 

[Stallion__]

Okay. His status as Asia's best is unquestionable indeed.

That could serve as an open invitation to [MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION], to reproduce Wisden, ESPN best players' lists as well as All Time XI's, top 50 or 100 great players lists of different former cricketers/experts along with Imran's 4th innings record, the things he may well have bookmarked for situations like this.

 

[Abdullah719]

Looks like IK threads are the flavour of the month in the absence of any real cricket.

The Zim tour can't come soon enough.

 

[Hitman]

That could serve as an open invitation to [MENTION=133315]Hitman[/MENTION], to reproduce Wisden, ESPN best players' lists as well as All Time XI's, top 50 or 100 great players lists of different former cricketers/experts along with Imran's 4th innings record, the things he may well have bookmarked for situations like this.

It's all about opinions. The things that you referred to, they rate Sachin higher. But then again, not everyone has to agree with those rankings. Fans are free to believe what they want to. Rating Imran ahead of Sachin is not a blasphemy. I've heard a lot of Indian fans rating Kapil Dev a better all rounder than Imran Khan. Those are their opinions, and they are entitled to that.

 

[ChachaCricket]

It's all about opinions. The things that you referred to, they rate Sachin higher. But then again, not everyone has to agree with those rankings. Fans are free to believe what they want to. Rating Imran ahead of Sachin is not a blasphemy. I've heard a lot of Indian fans rating Kapil Dev a better all rounder than Imran Khan. Those are their opinions, and they are entitled to that.

That is blasphemy.

 

[Mamoon]

Kapil was the better ODI all-rounder, but it is not even debatable when it comes to Test cricket.