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Wagah border ceremony should end

KingKhanWC

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Jan 2, 2010
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Surely its time to stop this now?

Due to the seriousness of the current issues, Pakistan should refuse to participate in this. There should be no shaking hands with Indians from now on.

@mods please add a poll.
 
Interesting video.
I think the indian soldier came across as the better of the two, with the firm leg swings and swagger while marching back and forth. The clear alpha male here.

I don't mind this fun routine, don't know why you want to end it.
 
People have livelihoods tied to this tourist spot, there are vendors, restaurants and transportation services that would lose money and most of them are poor people.
 
People have livelihoods tied to this tourist spot, there are vendors, restaurants and transportation services that would lose money and most of them are poor people.

Fair pont. Perhaps turn into a museum or some other type of tourist spot.

This ceremony seems all fun and games with a hand shake after. Its time to tell Indians we are no longer friends or even rivals but genuine enemies while your oppression continues in Kashmir and while you have a fascist government in charge.
 
Cringes worthy stomping of feet and acting cheesy. Those soldiers will have major foot issues in their old age.
 
@mods please add a poll.

Pakistan should have cut all ties completely a long long time ago and kept it that way until Kashmir issue is solved.

Cancel all treaties excluding those that would breach international regulations.

I'd say block all Indian flights but not sure this can be done without blocking all airlines. [MENTION=132715]Varun[/MENTION] might know more.
 
Pakistan should have cut all ties completely a long long time ago and kept it that way until Kashmir issue is solved.

Cancel all treaties excluding those that would breach international regulations.

I'd say block all Indian flights but not sure this can be done without blocking all airlines. [MENTION=132715]Varun[/MENTION] might know more.

Agree, no need to interact in any way with far right extremists.

This ceremony and cross border firing need to end. A message of we dont like you with the current government in power. If you fire at us, we will launch missiles on your bases in Kashmir. They will soon stop.
 
I don't see the point. A country changing its clause in its own constitution shouldn't impact a foreign country. If it's between non kashmiri Indians and kashmiri Indians, then there could have been a case but here we are talking about India and Pakistan where Pakistan shouldn't have any issue.

If I am throwing out a CRT TV and buying a LED TV, this shouldn't upset my neighbors.
 
I don't see the point. A country changing its clause in its own constitution shouldn't impact a foreign country. If it's between non kashmiri Indians and kashmiri Indians, then there could have been a case but here we are talking about India and Pakistan where Pakistan shouldn't have any issue.

If I am throwing out a CRT TV and buying a LED TV, this shouldn't upset my neighbors.

Except when your neighbor wanted the same exact TV.
 
People have livelihoods tied to this tourist spot, there are vendors, restaurants and transportation services that would lose money and most of them are poor people.

Fair point, I think you are right here. With the ever so growing unemployment, saner minds should prevail and let small business owners keep their livelihood here.
 
I don't see the point. A country changing its clause in its own constitution shouldn't impact a foreign country. If it's between non kashmiri Indians and kashmiri Indians, then there could have been a case but here we are talking about India and Pakistan where Pakistan shouldn't have any issue.

If I am throwing out a CRT TV and buying a LED TV, this shouldn't upset my neighbors.

This highlights your lack of understanding on the topic. A country changing its constitution does not matter at all. However, in this case the change in constitution is impacting a region which is disputed and therefor due to this dispute regarding the region between the two countries it impacts Pakistan as well.

If you're throwing out a CRT TV that doesn't belong to you but is a matter of an on going dispute between you and your neighbor then it will upset your neighbors.
 
This highlights your lack of understanding on the topic. A country changing its constitution does not matter at all. However, in this case the change in constitution is impacting a region which is disputed and therefor due to this dispute regarding the region between the two countries it impacts Pakistan as well.

If you're throwing out a CRT TV that doesn't belong to you but is a matter of an on going dispute between you and your neighbor then it will upset your neighbors.

Pakistan should never have been part of this dispute, past wrong decisions of Pakistani army generals is the reason why they are involved in this mess.

However, is is not 70+ years and now it has become an ego war. So you can't expect anyone to back down now. Unfortunate for the people of Kashmir but they are just pawns in this game of chess.
 
Pakistan should never have been part of this dispute, past wrong decisions of Pakistani army generals is the reason why they are involved in this mess.

However, is is not 70+ years and now it has become an ego war. So you can't expect anyone to back down now. Unfortunate for the people of Kashmir but they are just pawns in this game of chess.

Why should Pakistan not have been part of this dispute? India should not have interefered and taken over Junagadh by force but they did. As Junagadh was an issue for India, Kashmir is an issue for Pakistan
 
Why should Pakistan not have been part of this dispute? India should not have interefered and taken over Junagadh by force but they did. As Junagadh was an issue for India, Kashmir is an issue for Pakistan

That is the exact reason why this issue happened. If your neighbor kills a person does not give you a right to kill another person.

Pakistan committed the same wrong doing as India did. If Pakistan had not intervened in Kashmir they would have had a moral high ground. However, they got involved and this whole mess started. Now it is an ego war.

End of the day during that time it was all about land, both countries wanted as much land as possible and Pakistan committed same mistake by trying to annex Kashmir by force. It backfired spectacularly and now 72 years down the line we are still in this mess and will continue to be for next few decades, at the very minimum.
 
LAHORE: Pakistan Railways (PR) on Saturday launched Lahore-Wagah shuttle train, reviving its daily operation after 22 years.

The service, which was earlier planned to begin from Dec 7, would provide hassle-free travel facility to hundreds of visitors intending to witness flag hoisting and lowering ceremony at Wagah or visiting Jallo Park.

“We want to start or revive connection of Lahore metropolitan city with its suburbs through rail routes. And Lahore-Wagah is a first step that would be followed by another train from Lahore to Raiwind within next 15 days. And in January, we will launch Lahore-Gujranwala train that would be inaugurated by Prime Minister Imran Khan,” Minister for Railways Sheikh Rashid said while talking to media after he inaugurated Lahore-Wagah shuttle train operation.

The train would take an hour to reach Wagah railway station by observing stoppages at Jallo and other local stations. It would complete three round trips daily and provide travelling facility to over 1,000 passengers [in three trips]. The PR refurbished three passenger coaches inscribed with outer pictures of Minar-i-Pakistan, Rangers parade at Wagah border etc. The PR has fixed a fare of Rs30 per passenger.

The minister said the core objective behind running shuttle trains was not to earn revenue but to provide hassle-free travelling to a number of people on a daily basis. “We are presently running 138 trains. And soon we will also inaugurate work on ML-1 (main line) project from Karachi to Peshawar.”

Responding to media queries on the prevailing political situation, Rashid said departure of Nawaz Sharif to London and acceptance of Asif Zardari’s bail petition is temporary. “The release of both Nawaz and Zardari is not permanent,” he added.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1522298/lahore-wagah-shuttle-train-revived-after-22-years
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Breathtaking experience at the Wagah Border..We are such a patriotic Nation <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GooseBumps?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#GooseBumps</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MustWatch?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MustWatch</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PakistanZindabad?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PakistanZindabad</a>&#55356;&#56821;&#55356;&#56816; <a href="https://t.co/LX9SMs3bmf">pic.twitter.com/LX9SMs3bmf</a></p>— Waqar Younis (@waqyounis99) <a href="https://twitter.com/waqyounis99/status/1222203038389149702?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 28, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Before the sunset at the Wagah border — the only crossing point between India and Pakistan, young men of the Punjab Rangers and the Indian Border Security Forces lower their national flags with honour. But missing from this nightly ritual are the heart-warming, skycracking slogans that are no longer heard, nor are the soldiers of the two nations seen performing the high-kicking to the sounds of trumpets, which was religiously followed by a deep stare into each other’s fiery eyes.

With the Covid-19 pandemic raging on both sides of the fence, those symbolic actions have been suspended and are now part of the nostalgically remembered past. The elaborately choreographed display of nationalism between the two nuclear neighbors at the Wagah border no longer takes place and no one can predict its resumption. While hope appears to be in short supply around the area -- where not too long-ago goose-stepping in front of the famous crossing-point, captivated the attention of people from all over the world, spectators, and even locals are eager to see the ceremonial ritual return to its former glory.

Muhammad Shakeel, a Wagah village resident is one of them. When asked about the pre-Covid event at the border, he immediately began to reminisce. “Earlier, spectators started gathering in the afternoon. There were long queues of local and foreign visitors. During the parade, slogans of ‘Allahu Akbar’ meaning God is great and ‘Pakistan Zindabad’ meaning long live Pakistan would instantly raise the energy levels,” said Shakeel.

The audience, he recalled, was mesmerized by the performance of the heavily mustachioed soldiers from both sides. “Visitors performed bhangras as the troops marched to the sounds of trumpets. For Shakeel, the parade and the subsequent lowering of the national flags is not just an event, it is the identity of Wagah. “It puts us on the map,” the resident said. Ayesha Ahmed, a Gulberg resident, who looks more reminiscent whenever she is asked about the parade said she and her family religiously witnessed the March 23 and August 14 parades, but not anymore.

“There were no dull moments and no empty spots. We used to leave the house several hours before the parades commenced. But now it’s been more than 12 months since we watched this ceremony.

https://tribune.com.pk/story/2300045/covid-mutes-ceremonial-ritual-at-wagah
 
It should stop, it's a waste of time and corny show of patriotism.
 
It should begin once safe from Covid-19. It is a crowd puller.
 
The last year-and-a-half of Covid-19 has been a tough row to hoe for many working along the Wagah frontier, and those in nearby villages.

With the closure of the India-Pakistan border, many businesses that once thrived on either sides of the borderline, have now been deserted. The sight of vacant motels, forlorn dhabbas and unfrequented streets, tells how the new-normal may have blanched a place once vibrant.

Many who contributed to the frontier economy, in absence of business, had to turn elsewhere in search of alternative sources of income. While there still are a few who trudge to the border every morning, half hoping that the light of a new dawn will resurrect their quelled businesses.

One such hopeful is 42-year old Muhammad Sultan, who hails from a village not too far from the Wagah border, where he had been working as a porter for the last decade-and-a-half.

But ever since the two neighboring countries shut their borders last year, there has been no work for the Sultan, pushing the middle-aged man to take up welding in his hometown.

“Those were good old days. We’d reach the border at nine in the morning, have tea with our friends and then begin work. Some of them were tattle-tales, so there’d always be some gossip and lots of laughter, which made work a lot more engaging,” recalled Sultan.

“The sight of a passenger from either sides of the border would bring us so much joy; they were our sources of income after all. We’d help them clear their luggage through customs and immigration and pass goods from one end of the zero line to another. Although the official rate per turn has been fixed for pandits, but in Pakistan and India it all works on demand and barter. That way, we used to earn up to Rs1,500 to Rs2,000 per day,” he added.

According to Muhammad Rafiq, another porter who once operated along the India-Pakistan corridor, travelers crossing Wagah also offered a great many opportunities for cultural exchange between the two countries.

“We would lift their bags and ask about conditions in their country, and funnily enough, people on both sides appear to be equally fed up of their governments. Some Indian travelers would also be quite surprised to see Pakistan markedly different from what they’d grown up seeing in Bollywood movies. All of that would result in some of the most wonderful conversations with travelers, during the brief walk from the border to their vehicles,” shared Rafiq, who yearns for the borders to reopen.

A tea shop by the Wagah border, had for many years, been the favorite haunt of all travelers moving between the two countries.

On most days, it would be abuzz with guests discussing all things from cross-border relations, to politics and culture, over a cup of piping hot tea.

This would be the place estranged neighbours would bond over their shared love for chai; a place where travelers would bid adieu to their hosts, friends and drivers, before crossing over to the other side.

However, for the last year-and-a-half, there have been barely any guests at the once popular tea shop, while the chatter of travelers has been quelled by the haunting silence of a pandemic-plagued world.

“There was a time when we’d have so many guests that we’d utilize almost two mounds of milk just for tea, but now we barely eight to ten litres. All of us who work on the border dream of a day when the two countries will once again open their hearts and borders for each other. But even if we move past the pandemic, the Pakistan government has made it very clear that our trade relations cannot be resolved unless the special status of Kashmir is restored,” the tea stall owner lamentingly told The Express Tribune.
 
LAHORE: Pakistan recently allowed a limited number of spectators to come witness its traditional Beating Retreat ceremony at the Attari-Wagah border.

The joint parade, which would amass tens and thousands of watchers every day, had been on a prolonged hiatus ever since the two countries closed their borders to curb the pandemic’s spread.

The military practice however continued to take place separately on either sides of the border, even during the coronavirus-induced lockdowns, but remain closed to the public.

Following Pakistan’s decision to open public places amid drop in Covid-19 cases, masses have returned to zealously cheer the Wagah border guards. Yet, silence continues to haunts the Indian side of the border— no roaring crowd, no spectators, no zeal.

Occasionally, a few youths on the Indian side can be seen saluting their flag as its lowered down, the stadium at large still remains empty.

On the Pakistani side, the stadium although has the capacity to seat over 5,000 spectators at a time, crowds of only 150-200 people gather to witness the ceremony on weekends, while the number is much lower on week days.

All guests are expected to adhere to strict coronavirus protocols: spectators undergo temperature checks at two points, their hands are sanatised and they are made to wear a face mask upon entrance.

Stadium seating is switched with special guest chairs placed on either side of the parade enclosure and a four-chair gap is to be maintained between every seated individual at all times.

Despite pandemic restrictions and limited spectators, the people however have welcomed the reopening of the ceremony with great enthusiasm. For Sheikh Mohammad Ramzan, who had come to witness the parade from Faisalabad, the ceremony holds great emotional significance.

“My ancestors had migrated to Pakistan via the same route in summer of 1947, so seeing the ceremony take place is a sentimental moment for me. I am glad people are now allowed to attend the parade, but I do miss the deafening cheers of hundreds and thousands on either sides of the border. I’d get an adrenaline rush every time the crowd roared,” he told.

Saima Sheikh, another attendant at the parade appreciated the decision of the Punjab Rangers to ease into resuming the age-old ceremony.

“The cheers and slogans are not as loud as they used to be, but I hope we can soon go back to witnessing the same fervor that we did before Covid-19. The experience is incomplete without the Indian crowd and I pray both countries soon defeat the pandemic and resume normalcy,” she told The Express Tribune.
 
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Pakistani and Indian forces on Saturday exchanged sweets at the Wagah Border on the occasion of Pakistan's 75th Independence Day.

The goodwill gesture was made by officials from the Punjab Rangers and India's Border Security Force (BSF).

It is a tradition for Indian and Pakistani soldiers to exchange sweets on days of national importance for the two countries and on the occasion of major festivals every year.

The practice is a confidence-building measure and an attempt to establish peace between the nuclear-armed neighbours.

The eastern border between Pakistan and India had been closed due to Covid-19, while relations had also been strained between the two countries since the revocation of Indian Illegally Occupied Jammu and Kashmir’s (IIOJK) special status by India. As a result, the tradition was put on hold for some time.

However, today’s ceremony witnessed the exchange of greetings by the two forces whereas the BSF officials congratulated Pakistan Rangers and wished them well.

Previously, sweets were exchanged between the two forces on the occasion of Eidul Azha.

On June 21, Pakistan allowed a limited number of spectators to come to witness its traditional Beating Retreat ceremony at the Attari-Wagah border.

The joint parade, which would amass tens and thousands of watchers every day, had been on a prolonged hiatus ever since the two countries closed their borders to curb the pandemic’s spread.

The military practice however continued to take place separately on either sides of the border, even during the coronavirus-induced lockdowns, but remain closed to the public.
 
It should be mellowed down. All this stamping of the ground to express your disgust of the other doesn't do any favours to anyone.
 
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