Waqar gave no proofs of "disciplinary issues" by U Akmal and Shehzad: Former Chief Selector H Rashid

[MRSN]

Waqar gave no proofs of "disciplinary issues" by U Akmal and Shehzad: Former Chief Selector H Rashid

I was watching his detailed interview on TV a day ago where one of the question he was asked was about Waqar Younis writing Umar Akmal and Shehzad to be not selected for national team for any format for two years due to what Waqar said were disciplinary issues.

In reply, Haroon Rashid said when we further inquired Waqar Younis of what were the actual actions that were not pleasing you and you want us take such a big step and Waqar's response was ,these two player consider themselves bigger player than they are and that they are not humble and that their attitude is different. Haroon Rashid added, we have long investment on these two players and it's not right to ban them just for these issues.

may be this was the reason why Umar akmal and Shehzad were out of the team for a long time.

I always wondered what the crime Umar and Shehzad must have committed for such a treatment. may be Waqar and Misbah were just looking for scapegoats and none were better than Umar and Shehzad at time being.

 

[Slog]

Well you're clearly lying here because even your post doesn't directly support the title.

 

[AlphaFighter]

Not surprising. Clearly in line with Waqar's history

 

[Saj]

So according to Haroon Rasheed, Waqar was a liar, Shahryar Khan was a liar and so was Inzamam-ul-Haq.

 

[GullyCricketFlop]

I was watching his detailed interview on TV a day ago where one of the question he was asked was about Waqar Younis writing Umar Akmal and Shehzad to be not selected for national team for any format for two years due to what Waqar said were disciplinary issues.

In reply, Haroon Rashid said when we further inquired Waqar Younis of what were the actual actions that were not pleasing you and you want us take such a big step and Waqar's response was ,these two player consider themselves bigger player than they are and that they are not humble and that their attitude is different. Haroon Rashid added, we have long investment on these two players and it's not right to ban them just for these issues.

may be this was the reason why Umar akmal and Shehzad were out of the team for a long time.

I always wondered what the crime Umar and Shehzad must have committed for such a treatment. may be Waqar and Misbah were just looking for scapegoats and none were better than Umar and Shehzad at time being.

Ah yes,blame it on Misbah.

 

[Cosmic]

Isn't a Surprise U.Akmal is in the team ? And Why Not Ahmed Shezad ...

Waqar younus was worst Coach happened to Pakistan... he might be good bowling coach; but Not a good manhandling person.

Ahmed shezad could have done better then sami aslam and other opener in the team;Team is suffering from Group Mafia..

Mohammed Asif, Ahmed Shezad deserve chance...

 

[GullyCricketFlop]

Isn't a Surprise U.Akmal is in the team ? And Why Not Ahmed Shezad ...

Waqar younus was worst Coach happened to Pakistan... he might be good bowling coach; but Not a good manhandling person.

Ahmed shezad could have done better then sami aslam and other opener in the team;Team is suffering from Group Mafia..

Mohammed Asif, Ahmed Shezad deserve chance...

Don't fool yourself,Shehzad and Umar Akmal were dropped because of their disciplinary issues and their rubbish,selfish,performances(remember the NZ match in the WT20?)

Shehzad could only dream of playing the innings Sami played at Edgbaston and Hamilton.

 

[Gabbar Singh]

So why did Akmal and Shehzad apologise for their attitude and behaviour?

 

[Cosmic]

Don't fool yourself,Shehzad and Umar Akmal were dropped because of their disciplinary issues and their rubbish,selfish,performances(remember the NZ match in the WT20?)

Shehzad could only dream of playing the innings Sami played at Edgbaston and Hamilton.

ok what's is the big issue if they underperform; who doesn't in Pakistan Cricket History.. But they are the best i and you got... Check how misbah now change his stance on retirement, which edgabston innings you are speaking of ? did he won MOM ? Did Pakistan won the match ?

Ahmed Shezad and U.Akmal deserve to be in team... if you heard the stories of Waqar younus , Wasim Akram, Saqlain, Saeed and S.Akhtar you will be surprised..

No body is doodh ka Dhoola hota hai... Those Player are part of society.. some player are humble and dumb such as misbah, Azhar, Younus.... they are elegant and stylish but performance are not that worthy of winning..just the players..

 

[in_cutter]

It's always somebody elses fault. How dare anybody question these two angels.

 

[MRSN]

Well you're clearly lying here because even your post doesn't directly support the title.

than please tell me why the request of Waqar to ban UA and Shehzad from all formats of cricket was challenged by Haroon Rashid? Why did Haroon Rashid that time's chief selector didn't feel Waqar's claims to be legit enough and why did he challenge it?

I'm not making this all up. You can go and read Waqar Younis report where he named those two and you can also watch Haroon Rashid's detailed interview on TV if its available on youtube.

The thing is I find Waqar Younis highly incompetent coach. This is why you cannot give such a high position to people with temper issues who himself can't control their egoes. It's absolutely shocking for me to see him stay coach of our team after watching Haroon Rashid's interview because till now I had given Waqar benefit of doubt but today I realize how his incompetency to handle players lead him to make such a big claim of asking for their two years ban. How come a guy with so much anger and ego issues become a coach? That's itself pretty shocking for me.

 

[MRSN]

Ah yes,blame it on Misbah.

I'm not blaming anyone. I'm just saying how they made false claims just to have some scapegoats for people and media to hide their incompetency. I'm really grateful to Haroon Rashid for coming on the media and speaking the truth. It's very rare in Pakistan cricket where people speak truth like he has done.

In culture like Pakistan if a player doesn't bow down to coach and captain he must have some issues. It's a fundamental truth. Every person on this earth has different psyche and thinking. Just because they think differently does not mean you should punish them. What's job of a coach and captain?Pathetic.

 

[MRSN]

It's always somebody elses fault. How dare anybody question these two angels.

I believe player like Kohli would never have played longer with the attitude he has especially with misbah and Waqar as captain and coach.

 

[shaz619]

Waqar fans vs non-Waqar fans

Haroon Rashid fans, Akmal fans, Shehzad fans vs Waqar fans

Misbah ul haq haters vs Waqar fans

The extent of objectivity certain posters have been limited to these days

 

[Black Zero]

So according to Haroon Rasheed, Waqar was a liar, Shahryar Khan was a liar and so was Inzamam-ul-Haq.

No, as per HR, only waqar is liar.
Chief selector and chairman accepted waqar's lies.

 

[TalentSpotterPk]

Waqar fans vs non-Waqar fans

Haroon Rashid fans, Akmal fans, Shehzad fans vs Waqar fans

Misbah ul haq haters vs Waqar fans

The extent of objectivity certain posters have been limited to these days

I love some of Akmal's breath taking shots and innings. But this does not mean that I should become deaf, dumb and blind.


Let's say that Umar & Shehzad have attitude problem. Which actually is a fact, than Waqar does not need to give audio or video evidence to Haroon Rashid. He just has to mention it and that's it.


It's not like an act of robbery for which Waqar has to provide CCTV footage to Haroon Rashid.


Without naming the player. Isn't it zubaan zadd e aam that a player beame Baby of ex coach, manager and selector and used to say today I won't train or i ll train less ? And the coach, manager, selector agreed and said ok meray laadlay kaakay aaraam kero.

Than everyone knows that players were told plans during meeting and they said Yes Sir Yes Sir and than repeatedly they made same mistakes in match situations. Either they were not good listeners or they did not understand or they did not want to implement what they were told and thought that they themselves know better than what they were fed. These are attitude problems and they do not require any evidence.

 

[Black Zero]

I love some of Akmal's breath taking shots and innings. But this does not mean that I should become deaf, dumb and blind.


Let's say that Umar & Shehzad have attitude problem. Which actually is a fact, than Waqar does not need to give audio or video evidence to Haroon Rashid. He just has to mention it and that's it.


It's not like an act of robbery for which Waqar has to provide CCTV footage to Haroon Rashid.


Without naming the player. Isn't it zubaan zadd e aam that a player beame Baby of ex coach, manager and selector and used to say today I won't train or i ll train less ? And the coach, manager, selector agreed and said ok meray laadlay kaakay aaraam kero.

Than everyone knows that players were told plans during meeting and they said Yes Sir Yes Sir and than repeatedly they made same mistakes in match situations. Either they were not good listeners or they did not understand or they did not want to implement what they were told and thought that they themselves know better than what they were fed. These are attitude problems and they do not require any evidence.

Did UA, AS missed training sessions, went out without prior permission. .if yes, then players are guilty ...otherwise, so called attitude problem means zilch.

Maybe they have hurt Waqar's ego.

Anyway, it was clear that waqar wanted to punish them. He is no better than Ijaz butt ... misusing powers.

 

[HussainRx8]

I was watching his detailed interview on TV a day ago where one of the question he was asked was about Waqar Younis writing Umar Akmal and Shehzad to be not selected for national team for any format for two years due to what Waqar said were disciplinary issues.

In reply, Haroon Rashid said when we further inquired Waqar Younis of what were the actual actions that were not pleasing you and you want us take such a big step and Waqar's response was ,these two player consider themselves bigger player than they are and that they are not humble and that their attitude is different. Haroon Rashid added, we have long investment on these two players and it's not right to ban them just for these issues.

may be this was the reason why Umar akmal and Shehzad were out of the team for a long time.

I always wondered what the crime Umar and Shehzad must have committed for such a treatment. may be Waqar and Misbah were just looking for scapegoats and none were better than Umar and Shehzad at time being.

Lol. Please read through Waqar's post WC report. It will stifle your curiousity on what they actually did.

 

[Black Zero]

Lol. Please read through Waqar's post WC report. It will stifle your curiousity on what they actually did.

Please post for the benefit of all.

 

[HussainRx8]

Please post for the benefit of all.

Saj posted it in a thread on PP. You can find it with some digging.

 

[Black Zero]

Saj posted it in a thread on PP. You can find it with some digging.

Please provide the link of that thread.

As if I recall correctly, on another thread, dealing with this topic, I asked specifically for evidence, and no one provided anything similar to evidence.

If we both are talking about same thread, then you might see my requests in posts.

Ps: if players are accused publically then accusers need to back them with evidence.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

I'm not blaming anyone. I'm just saying how they made false claims just to have some scapegoats for people and media to hide their incompetency. I'm really grateful to Haroon Rashid for coming on the media and speaking the truth. It's very rare in Pakistan cricket where people speak truth like he has done.

In culture like Pakistan if a player doesn't bow down to coach and captain he must have some issues. It's a fundamental truth. Every person on this earth has different psyche and thinking. Just because they think differently does not mean you should punish them. What's job of a coach and captain?Pathetic.

Ah yes.

It is the truth because Umar Akmal was wrongfully thrown out of the team.

Anything that is related to wrongs doled out to Umar Akmal is universal truth. Anything that points out his failures is "problem with not knowing how to manage special stars".

Does that make sense?

 

[Varun]

Ah lookie here the media machine is slowly grinding into gear and laying the groundwork for these two to return to the team again.

 

[Slog]

The simple fact is just based on performance, the 2 champs deserved to be dropped

 

[Indiafan]

What "proof" do you give for such things? Even one or two harsh words in other teams and people are suspended/thrown out. What proof was there against Symond? Do you need tape records now? Why is the word of the coach and captain not enough?

 

[HussainRx8]

Please provide the link of that thread.

As if I recall correctly, on another thread, dealing with this topic, I asked specifically for evidence, and no one provided anything similar to evidence.

If we both are talking about same thread, then you might see my requests in posts.

Ps: if players are accused publically then accusers need to back them with evidence.

I resent that you have attributed something to me that I did not state. I never accused Umar Akmal or Ahmed Shehzad.

I do believe in what Waqar has to say about them. You can have a different opinion, but that doesn't make me accountable to you.

Now, you can do some digging and find the report. Or, contact Saj for its existence and veracity.

 

[Couch Cricketer]

I believe player like Kohli would never have played longer with the attitude he has especially with misbah and Waqar as captain and coach.

Sorry Kohli despite the attitude he showed when he entered into the international he had a very hard work ethic which both Shehzad and Akmal failed to show. Plus Kohli had his performances to compensate for his attitude. Akmal and Shehzad didnt.

 

[Drreddymd]

Now according to pak fans asif,butt,shazad,umar akmal are suddenly looking like saviours of pak cricket again which they couldnt do inspite of numerous chances given to them

 

[Mamoon]

I believe player like Kohli would never have played longer with the attitude he has especially with misbah and Waqar as captain and coach.

Kohli would've recieved plenty of 'show cause' notices, but his performance would have made him undroppable. He is a better batsman than anyone in Pakistan's history.

 

[Drreddymd]

Misbah and waqar haters are slowly crawling out of their dens again and making their presence felt.it looks like misbah haters are waiting and rubbing their hands in glee for him to fail and pounce on to him big time

 

[Cricfan4eva]

I was watching his detailed interview on TV a day ago where one of the question he was asked was about Waqar Younis writing Umar Akmal and Shehzad to be not selected for national team for any format for two years due to what Waqar said were disciplinary issues.

In reply, Haroon Rashid said when we further inquired Waqar Younis of what were the actual actions that were not pleasing you and you want us take such a big step and Waqar's response was ,these two player consider themselves bigger player than they are and that they are not humble and that their attitude is different. Haroon Rashid added, we have long investment on these two players and it's not right to ban them just for these issues.

may be this was the reason why Umar akmal and Shehzad were out of the team for a long time.

I always wondered what the crime Umar and Shehzad must have committed for such a treatment. may be Waqar and Misbah were just looking for scapegoats and none were better than Umar and Shehzad at time being.

Haroon Rasheed not finding discipline a serious enough issue to warrant a ban doesn't mean Waqar didn't provide proof.

In fact your thread title seems like a made up fantasy to target Waqar even more.

The dangerous Warner that you see today went through something similar but he went back and fixed his attitude and is now one of the top players in world. Similar story with Kohli.

What are Shehzad and U Akmal still doing? Crying about they were made scapegoats and keep finding fault with everything else but their own attitude.

One doesn't need Waqar's word to know how these 2 players are really. One look at their interviews and twitter is enough to know Waqar was is in the right.

 

[Drreddymd]

Kohli had attitude problems during his early ipl days .many players spoked about it bit when he became a regular member of oneday side his attitude changed remarkably on fitness and to the game itself.losing his father made him work even hardet

 

[saabir]

I always hate Waqar due to his arrogance & his attitude problems.he only want yes man in his team even when he was captain or coach. Those who dont fall under the line become's indisciplined. Ahmed was dropped from the test side & Akmal could not get a chance to bat at no.3 or open under Waqar tenure. Azhar Ali is also a yes man like Misbah . Pak need a honest & brave leader may be Sarfraz at the moment. Ahmed is also doing a very good captaincy in domestics matches as per some legend like Yk. But problem is Ahmed is not a good ODI or t20 player. He block's too many balls. He may be a good choice for test captaincy in future if he perform's.

 

[Indiafan]

I believe player like Kohli would never have played longer with the attitude he has especially with misbah and Waqar as captain and coach.

Kohli has never disrespected a single Indian player ever and has only had praise for them. He has never had a single discipline issue outside of the field (twitter, road rage, etc). You are confusing for competitiveness on the field with ill discipline off the field. He is the most hard worker and never missed a practice session. Never whined in the media when he was dropped.

Kohli's attitude and hunger to win are not the same as the attitude issues of Akmal or Shehzad. Can you show me when Kohli went against his captain and coach? Abusing opposition on the field is not the same thing as your own coach thinking you should not be in the team

 

[Black Zero]

I resent that you have attributed something to me that I did not state. I never accused Umar Akmal or Ahmed Shehzad.

I do believe in what Waqar has to say about them. You can have a different opinion, but that doesn't make me accountable to you.

Now, you can do some digging and find the report. Or, contact Saj for its existence and veracity.

why do not you provide the link of "that" thread as you originally suggested.

give us something to dig about. as so far we have "he said/reported" etc...

i am not saying these players are angels, i am saying that we still waiting to see any evidence for all those accusations.

i am not asking you to believe or not believe the Waqar, point of this thread, whether waqar had and provided any evidence to back those accusations.

 

[MRSN]

Haroon Rasheed not finding discipline a serious enough issue to warrant a ban doesn't mean Waqar didn't provide proof.

In fact your thread title seems like a made up fantasy to target Waqar even more.

The dangerous Warner that you see today went through something similar but he went back and fixed his attitude and is now one of the top players in world. Similar story with Kohli.

What are Shehzad and U Akmal still doing? Crying about they were made scapegoats and keep finding fault with everything else but their own attitude.

One doesn't need Waqar's word to know how these 2 players are really. One look at their interviews and twitter is enough to know Waqar was is in the right.

you can assume all you want but reality is what's in the OP is all what Waqar told PCB about disciplinary issues regarding Umar and Shehzad. if the chief selector of the team didn't find Waqar's claims as good enough to punish both players then Waqar should have himself resigned.

The question still stands, what exactly did Umar and Shehzad did that Waqar wanted them two years ban? Who is going to define how much a player is great? Waqar would have asked for whole West Indies team to be banned for eternity because of how they think about themselves..

What exactly is a coach's job? His job is manage different set of individuals if he can't then why take the job?

 

[Blistering Barnacle]

Thank God Waqar is not the coach anymore.

 

[Markhor]

Firstly, let me be clear both players deserved to be dropped on performance alone. Here's their ODI records against the top sides (including Bangladesh/excluding Zimbabwe and teams below) from Jan 2014 till their final match before being dropped:

Ahmed Shehzad played 29 matches and averages 33.
Umar Akmal played 18 matches and averaged 21.

Secondly, both men have had discipline issues reported. Umar Akmal faked a back injury in protest of his brother's dropping after the disasterous Sydney Test on the 09/10 tour of Australia according to PCB report. Mudassar Nazar also spoke of how he had to throw Akmal out of the NCA in a PakPassion interview because he was easily giving his wicket away. Now I have my issues with Waqar Younis but I'll discuss them later. However I do not believe he is lying when he states in his 2015 WC report:

"Umar Akmal was asked by Haroon Rasheed (former chief selector) to come the following day for a fitness test to join the team in Sri Lanka for ODIs. Instead, he chose to catch a flight to the Caribbean for a lucrative league without informing anyone. A few months later, after he was caught in the Hyderabad incident and for misbehaving with his domestic team coach, he still managed to retain his place in the team. Is this the criteria we are setting for the selection of new players?" Waqar asked.

He also said in his report Umar Akmal was skipping training sessions during the 2015 WC. As for Ahmed Shehzad - surely everybody by now is aware of a long litany of disciplinary incidents dating back from his NCA days. Only recently he was seen showing dissent to an umpire. Haroon Rashid must be living in a cave if he thinks there's no disciplinary issues with Shehzad.

(1/2)

 

[Markhor]

As for Waqar, whilst I agree fitness and discipline should be paramount for any cricket team, his man management skills have always been poor. In sports sometimes you have to deal with difficult personalities and handle egos which has never been his strong suit.

As a captain he was unpopular as he had a schoolmasterly approach that rubbed players the wrong way. He also lacked the ability to identify talent and for all the talk of aggressive cricket - Waqar was a reactive and defensive captain. He had no tactical aptitude and the years 2001-03 saw some of the most atrocious cricket I've ever seen from Pakistan.

Waqar has a long list of failures as captain from the 2001 Natwest Trophy Final, the dreadful 2002 PSO Trophy, the 2002 Morocco tri-series, 2002/03 South Africa tour, the 2002 series with Australia in UAE and culminating in the 2003 World Cup group stage exit. There was zero stability in team selection and no real leadership. Waqar has to take some responsibility for that disasterous era, hence why I was deeply skeptical he'd make a good national team coach.

His selections as coach were utterly baffling. To name a few examples, we had Bilal Asif opening, Iftikhar Ahmed being given a run despite clearly looking a fish out of water at international level, Mohammad Hafeez and Shan Masood opening for us in Tests despite their glaring technical weaknesses, and who can forget giving debut to 39 year old Rifatullah Mohmand despite Waqar's claims in public that he wanted a younger side !

Waqar insisted that he was working in a poor system but after being Pakistan coach for 4 out of the last 6 years he was part of that system ! The likes of Bob Woolmer also had to reckon with the same system but still was an effective coach. Unlike Waqar, he had a terrific CV as coach with success with Warwickshire and South Africa, and was able to maximise his team's potential because he had fantastic eye for talent and deep understanding of the game.

Woolmer had a much more difficult dressing room to deal with than Waqar - yet he still kept that team together. So whilst I maintain Akmal and Shehzad should prove themselves in domestic before being granted a recall, and must grow up as human beings, Waqar too must assess his own failings.

(2/2)

 

[Black Zero]

"Umar Akmal was asked by Haroon Rasheed (former chief selector) to come the following day for a fitness test to join the team in Sri Lanka for ODIs. Instead, he chose to catch a flight to the Caribbean for a lucrative league without informing anyone. A few months later, after he was caught in the Hyderabad incident and for misbehaving with his domestic team coach, he still managed to retain his place in the team. Is this the criteria we are setting for the selection of new players?" Waqar asked. (1/2)

1- How can any current player play premier league without his board's NOC?
2- For Hyderabad incident, Akmal had acquired the permission.

 

[ask_analyse_act]

it was clearly communicated that their attitude towards the game and the team is the issue which was clearly evident to all with shehzad's actions in social media and UA getting caught here and there for being mischievous doesn't give a good look about them outside and off the field.

The above attitude problem was also clearly stated by Rashid and the OP. A player thinking himself bigger than the game and the team is very unhealthy for the team and rightly discarded for good. Shehzad is still the same at least UA has improved a considerable amount for which he has earned a recall in LOIs recently and yet to play a game.

 

[Black Zero]

Best solution to avoid these situations, not to give any retired players any role in PCB.

Too much baggage...Too big Egos...and Living in the Past.

Waqar should not have been picked as a coach...(look at what levels of teams he coached apart from Pakistani team and we would know his coaching credentials)

If UA and AS do not consider Waqar a legendary bowler, nothing wrong in that. Waqar was a coach and nothing more.

Personally, I consider Waqar >> Wasim (which is reflects by they respective peak ratings) as a bowler and I am happy that he brought back Malik to tests.