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What is the reason for David Warner not participating in PSL4?

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

Oh God, I love decoding the non-sense you serve up when it comes to insulting Pakistan cricket out of pure hate rather than rational thinking.

You mean non-sense like "Warner would rather play easier tournaments than PSL"? Same PSL where Luke Ronchi was batting like Sir Viv last season? And where the likes of Kamran morph into Gilchrist? If you want to decode nonsense, don't look further than your own green-tinted posts.
What brand are you talking about mate? When we had Wasim, Waqar, Afridi, Anwar, Inzimam, Yousuf, Saqlain etc. These are guys who built a name for themselves and Pakistan by playing regularly at home and dominating so many other weaker sides such as India, New Zealand and all the rest. The issue is that those weaker sides have overtaken Pakistan and they are mediocre currently but they are still a better side than quite a few others. Even Australian cricket is no longer a brand the way it was 10 years ago. Transition and changes are the name of the game. Yesterday it was the West Indies, a decade later it was Australia and a couple of decades later it is India. Who knows who could be the 'brand' tomorrow? To say that only brands have bargaining power is an absolute lie. what does have bargaining power is the Almighty dollar and whoever has it. If Afghanistan cricket board have a budget of £10m to host a premier tournament and they decide to use £8m to hire Virat Kohli to play in the tournament from that budget, thats all that will matter at the end of the day.

Pakistan cricket is not the same brand anymore because we have stopped produce superstars and box-office players. The last big superstars in Pakistan cricket are still the 90's generation. I am not talking about performance here - the 90's generation greatly underperformed in both formats, but that team still had superstars.

Pakistan has stopped producing players who are household names, players who are idolised not only in Pakistan but also greatly admired by cricket fans in other countries. Yes other teams also go through these phases and it can change in the future, but we. can only look at the present scenario.

I am not sure why you are so offended with the notion that Pakistan cricket does not have the same star quality that it did 15 odd years ago.

Right, so thats why the world of cricket is crying/worrying about the future of the sport itself? Test cricket is a dying art in countries such as England. I know, have seen first hand how the ECB is laying so much emphasis on providing cricket to any child no matter what financial background they are from to be introduced to the sport. Australian cricket has been on a downslide since the legends retired and now this Sandpaper scandal has brought them to an all time low. How much cricket will New Zealand produce with a population of 4M?? To think that one of the biggest markets for cricket is yet to be tapped into is shocking just because that country is terror stricken but is working very hard to restore cricket at home. You say it like if there was no Pakistan in the world of cricket, the sport will still go on. It will, but it will not expand, its not expanding and you have no statistic to prove otherwise.

You are arguing on a different wavelength. You are talking about the future of Test cricket which has nothing to do with the point that I am making. Yes Test cricket does not have a future simply because in today's modern world, people do not have the time to sit through a game that is contested over 5 days. It has nothing to do with Pakistan or any particular country.

What I was trying to convey is that in spite of Pakistan not hosting any international cricket for over a decade, it has not hampered the game. However, if India, England or Australia were to stop hosting matches, it will most likely have a negative impact. This shows that the prestige of Pakistan cricket today is not the same as it was before. Pakistan not hosting cricket would have had a bigger impact in the 70s, 80, 90s than it does today.

The English Premier league is a bigger brand than Real Madrid and Barcelona. Going by your logic, the IPL is a bigger brand than most countries, if not all of them. BCCI will not be able to sustain its expensive domestic and international wage bill without IPL money. IPL is a bigger brand than Australian, English and South African cricket? Why are you singling out Pakistan only? PSL is probably a bigger brand than the PCB and most boards also. I would rather have the owners of PSL franchises running the PCB with their financial and business resources. What a pathetic argument!

You are right that the IPL is a bigger brand than quite a few international teams, but the reason I "singled out" Pakistan is because it is the only major Test nation with zero representation in IPL since 2009. However, that has not prevented IPL from becoming the biggest league in the world by a country mile.

Without international stars, the IPL would not have become the giant that it is today, and the fact that the absence of Pakistani players had no impact on their growth clearly shows that Pakistani players are no longer hotshots in world cricket.

Furthermore, you are wrong that the Premier League is bigger than Real Madrid or Barcelona. I will prove it to you with a hypothetical example. Let's say that Real Madrid or Barcelona or PSG or Juventus etc. decide to join the Premier League. What do you think will happen?

The Premier League brand will receive a major boost because of the inclusion of players like Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Mbappe, Dybala, Suarez, Modric, Bale etc. etc. On the contrary, their respective leagues will greatly suffer because of the loss of star quality.

The elite clubs in football are bigger than their respective leagues. The leagues have global viewership because of these major teams. People in India and Pakistan are not exactly fans of Sunderland and Everton. Take Man United, Arsenal and Chelsea out of the Premier League and watch what happens to the brand of English football.

However, if Pakistan joins the IPL as a 9th franchise, it will only have a minimal impact on IPL's global brand. Apart from increased viewership in Pakistan, it is not going to change much. People who don't watch the IPL in India, Australia, England, South Africa and New Zealand etc. are not going to turn up because legends like Faheem, Shadab, Shinwari, Hafeez, Sarfraz, Fakhar, Amir, Hasan, Malik, Imad etc. etc. are now honouring the IPL with their presence, and people in the said countries who are watching the IPL are doing so in spite of the fact that Pakistani players have been banished.

I don't disagree with this, but what you fail to overlook is the fact that cricket is not the reason for Terror and poor international relations, yet cricket has to become a casualty of war in this instance. Do you think the PCB and cricket lovers in Pakistan are not trying their best to prove that this is a country where 99% of the population are respectful, loving human beings who love the game of cricket?

At what point did I imply that the security problems in Pakistan are because of PCB? I have repeatedly stated numerous, numerous times that it is a major constraint for the PCB, and considering the circumstances, they couldn't have done a better job with the PSL. However, that does not mean that the PSL is great. It very clearly is not.
Its a fresh new league. AB played cricket for SA during this period and played IPL the following month, he was clearly unavailable. He also must have had doubts about Pakistan's security arrangements hence didnt tour with the World XI boys out of which 5-6 gun SA players were a part of (Miller, Du Plesis, Amla, Tahir, Duminy, Morkel) This perception must have changed after his mates have told him that you are pretty much protected from the moment you set foot on the flight to Pakistan.

Lesser players than de Villiers have bullied the PSL over the past few seasons. Apart from the notable Pietersen example, there are other international players who played in the UAE but refused to play in the Pakistan leg of the tournament. De Villiers is a bigger deal than all of them and he could have done the same.

As far as international commitments are concerned, he did not have to take part in the whole tournament. Last year, Morgan made a mockery of PSL. After playing in the T20 tri-series in Australia, he joined Karachi for two dead-rubbers in Sharjah, captained both games, refused to play in Pakistan and left with a hefty pay-check.

Do you think de Villiers could not have pulled a stunt like this? Do you think PSL was and is in a position to say no to a player like him?

It is very obvious why de Villiers did not play in the first three editions. At that point of his career, he did not consider it to be worthy of his presence. His priority was to do well for South Africa and preserve himself for IPL. Now at 35, he does not have to worry about international cricket and he is at the end of his career. He no longer is in a position where can turn down contracts worth millions.

As for Warner, same issue when it came to International duty, but he has gone on to prove that it really doesn't matter what situation Pakistan finds itself in. He is from an old school of Aussies that would not tour Pakistan even if it were the 90s or early 2000s.

I am certain that if the PSL was not scheduled right before the IPL, he would have participated this year. There is too much cricket coming up for him to play after the PSL. From his perspective, the risk is greater than the reward.
 
What is rationale about ripping Pakistan cricket or whatever it tries to do all the time? You may be happy to be subjected to constant unnecessary demoralisation on this forum by the same few but I am not. And if I smell ** I would call it out. The same knowledgeable poster claimed that Shubman Gill is already better than all batsmen that are playing for Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. His tints are sprayed wit the permanent blue colour to the point of no return!

So now you change your line of attack by saying that claiming PSL is a tough league is wrong on my part....What?? Why???? The Pakistan cricket team is the number one side in the world in T20. I have proven on this forum that it possesses players that are worth top dollar in the current IPL market. Most certainly the PSL provides a challenge otherwise the 'retiring superstars' would be the ones that are topping the lists via a country mile.

I don't think I have the energy to explain and justify every comment over and over again. I have said everything I have to say on this matter, and if you think I am imprisoned by my "love" for India, that is your prerogative. I have great admiration for Indian cricket and that is it. I am a Pakistani and I will always support my team, but that does not mean that I have to be biased. That is not something I believe in.

One final comment on Gill before I quit this thread:

India is a batting powerhouse with intense competition. You have to be bloody good to not only break into the Indian team in your teens, but also attract the hype and adulation that he has. Indian batting standards are not normal - players like Karun Nair have been axed from the team after scoring a triple-hundred in only his second Test, and the likes of Rohit with a higher Test average than Shafiq and Babar is considered a mediocre Test player.

An opener like Wasim Jaffer has not played a Test in 10 years. If he was in Pakistan, he would be closing in on 10k runs. There are many other examples as well. Give Gill the same number of games as any batsman in Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh right now, and he will show why India has earmarked him as their next great batsman.
 
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I don't think I have the energy to explain and justify every comment over and over again. I have said everything I have to say on this matter, and if you think I am imprisoned by my "love" for India, that is your prerogative. I have great admiration for Indian cricket and that is it. I am a Pakistani and I will always support my team, but that does not mean that I have to be biased. That is not something I believe in.

One final comment on Gill before I quit this thread:

India is a batting powerhouse with intense competition. You have to be bloody good to not only break into the Indian team in your teens, but also attract the hype and adulation that he has. Indian batting standards are not normal - players like Karun Nair have been axed from the team after scoring a triple-hundred in only his second Test, and the likes of Rohit with a higher Test average than Shafiq and Babar is considered a mediocre Test player.

An opener like Wasim Jaffer has not played a Test in 10 years. If he was in Pakistan, he would be closing in on 10k runs. There are many other examples as well. Give Gill the same number of games as any batsman in Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh right now, and he will show why India has earmarked him as their next great batsman.

A batting powerhouse who can't find a replacement for kartick.
 
I don't think I have the energy to explain and justify every comment over and over again. I have said everything I have to say on this matter, and if you think I am imprisoned by my "love" for India, that is your prerogative. I have great admiration for Indian cricket and that is it. I am a Pakistani and I will always support my team, but that does not mean that I have to be biased. That is not something I believe in.

One final comment on Gill before I quit this thread:

India is a batting powerhouse with intense competition. You have to be bloody good to not only break into the Indian team in your teens, but also attract the hype and adulation that he has. Indian batting standards are not normal - players like Karun Nair have been axed from the team after scoring a triple-hundred in only his second Test, and the likes of Rohit with a higher Test average than Shafiq and Babar is considered a mediocre Test player.

An opener like Wasim Jaffer has not played a Test in 10 years. If he was in Pakistan, he would be closing in on 10k runs. There are many other examples as well. Give Gill the same number of games as any batsman in Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh right now, and he will show why India has earmarked him as their next great batsman.

Wasim jaffar who averages lower then hafeez
 
What is rationale about ripping Pakistan cricket or whatever it tries to do all the time? You may be happy to be subjected to constant unnecessary demoralisation on this forum by the same few but I am not. And if I smell ** I would call it out. The same knowledgeable poster claimed that Shubman Gill is already better than all batsmen that are playing for Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. His tints are sprayed wit the permanent blue colour to the point of no return!

So now you change your line of attack by saying that claiming PSL is a tough league is wrong on my part....What?? Why???? The Pakistan cricket team is the number one side in the world in T20. I have proven on this forum that it possesses players that are worth top dollar in the current IPL market. Most certainly the PSL provides a challenge otherwise the 'retiring superstars' would be the ones that are topping the lists via a country mile.

It's not about ripping Pakistan cricket, it's about accepting the reality check that awaits this team as opposed to your glorification and bhangra of Pakistan's no.1 T20I ranking which is as bogus as it gets especially when they can't even beat such a poor SA side. Another reason why I wouldn't read too much into the ranking is because Pakistan's batting in the shortest format is far inferior to Aus (even without Warner and Smith), SA, NZ, England and India. You will see this first hand come the next WT20.

The side has reached no.1 because they are the only team that plays their full strength side and doing so even against the likes of Scotland, Ireland and Zimbabwe. Wouldn't be surprised if we were to see PCB organise a 5 x T20I series against Nepal.

It's time we keep our expectations modest and stop all this "our players are worth top dollar in IPL" nonsense.
 
PSL is still a young league. Let it develop further, continue to grow and become more competitive. Let the financial rewards become larger and then more big names will come.
 
[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION]

1. "You mean non-sense like "Warner would rather play easier tournaments than PSL"? Same PSL where Luke Ronchi was batting like Sir Viv last season? And where the likes of Kamran morph into Gilchrist? If you want to decode nonsense, don't look further than your own green-tinted posts. "

Thats not a non-sense thought, I wouldn't be surprised if he was advised not to participate in a league that could expose some kind of weakness against spin on difficult tracks such as Dubai and Sharjah which would lead him into a poor IPL, especially considering he needs to be making a comeback here. Chris Gayle is not the only example of a T20 juggernaut failing in the PSL, what exactly has Brendon McCullum done of note? These guys were still fit enough to represent their countries, they chose to leave early to utilise their fitness for the last few years doubling up their earnings, not because they are past it. As I asked earlier, how about you share with me your cricket playing experience and I will be able to determine your line of thought when it comes to understanding player psychology. Just because Kamran Akmal and Ronchi have done well and even Sami as a bowler has done well does not mean that the league is poor! There are plenty of top names that are representing their countries who are playing the league that have been granted equal opportunity to do better. Don't act like like Ronchi and Kamran are the big names of the PSL, they are not, they are those that have performed. Did Pakistan accept Kamran back into its set up or did they reconsider Sami for one last time?? No, so stop behaving like these are the stars of Pakistan who are killing all the others.


2. Furthermore, you are wrong that the Premier League is bigger than Real Madrid or Barcelona. I will prove it to you with a hypothetical example. Let's say that Real Madrid or Barcelona or PSG or Juventus etc. decide to join the Premier League. What do you think will happen? The Premier League brand will receive a major boost because of the inclusion of players like Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Mbappe, Dybala, Suarez, Modric, Bale etc. etc. On the contrary, their respective leagues will greatly suffer because of the loss of star quality.

You seem to have an answer for everything. Shubman Gill is already a better batsman than Babar Azam and Real Madrid and Barcelona are bigger brands than the English Premier league. Ive heard it all now! How can I even argue with someone that would just say anything to prove he is right? You say if xyz teams enter the premier league, or do you casually deny the oil business tycoons that are funding these teams??? Why dont you argue that if the same owners at PSG take over at Huddersfield town, you may see Mbappe and Neymar playing in the premier league for Huddersfield. Oh yeah, as if Neymar or Mbappe are going to question the history of the club once they see the £500K a week on their contracts!

3. India is a batting powerhouse with intense competition. You have to be bloody good to not only break into the Indian team in your teens, but also attract the hype and adulation that he has. Indian batting standards are not normal - players like Karun Nair have been axed from the team after scoring a triple-hundred in only his second Test, and the likes of Rohit with a higher Test average than Shafiq and Babar is considered a mediocre Test player. An opener like Wasim Jaffer has not played a Test in 10 years. If he was in Pakistan, he would be closing in on 10k runs. There are many other examples as well. Give Gill the same number of games as any batsman in Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh right now, and he will show why India has earmarked him as their next great batsman.

Right. LOL at the Waseem Jaffer quote first....LOL again.....LOL more!

Knowing the way the PCB works and how players have held this board to ransom more often than not, what is your proof that an honest hard worker like Waseem Jaffer would even play enough Test matches to match the International Test Product of Inzimam and Miandad (Both who neared 10K runs) and then Mohammad Yousuf (one of the finest batsmen to come out of Asia in the Test arena, bonafide run scorer all over the world!)? How do you know that he would not be axed after a poor series against England or Australia and then lost in the abyss of the Pakistani domestic scene, and then some new kid takes over for a few years or an oldie like Taufeeq Umar is recalled for a stint? Once again, you fail to overlook the many factors that are in play when it comes to Pakistan cricket and doing well to keep your spot for this side considering how poor the standards and benchmark for acceptance has been. I am sure we would like to see transparency and consistency with the selection, but this is not the board where you can just put the likes of Tendulkar into the frame and know that he would be handled in the right way enabling him to score 30K international runs.

As for Gill, no doubt he is from the line of batting prodigy's and I fully expect him to become better than all of Pakistan's greatest. No doubt it is near impossible to break into the batting scene of India as they have extremely high standards, but they are not immortals. Not all of them are going to tear up the house the way Kohli does, or Tendulkar did before him. It takes years for those names to get to that point where they become the key factor. Gill is not the finished product and yes he has been identified by the Indian selectors to become it, but he has years of cricket to go. Away tours against England, Australia, South Africa. Home tours to inflate your stats against West Indies and Sri Lanka, there is a long long way to go mate!
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">David Warner asks, "when can I play in the Pakistan Super League"<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PSL8?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PSL8</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://t.co/WIuznwwbUp">pic.twitter.com/WIuznwwbUp</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@SajSadiqCricket) <a href="https://twitter.com/SajSadiqCricket/status/1631684678737444865?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 3, 2023</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">David Warner asks, "when can I play in the Pakistan Super League"<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PSL8?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PSL8</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://t.co/WIuznwwbUp">pic.twitter.com/WIuznwwbUp</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@SajSadiqCricket) <a href="https://twitter.com/SajSadiqCricket/status/1631684678737444865?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 3, 2023</a></blockquote>
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Good time for Warner.

PSL is a good gig for mid 30 Aussies.
 
Karachi Kings already looking to sign him up for PSL9 no doubt :)
 
Mathew Wade was a good Australia first team player signing, and TD also eventually became an Australian first teamer.

This would naturally open some doors for the others
 
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