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Which cricketers would make both Test and ODI all-time XIs?

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Harsh Thakor

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My certainties to be part of all-time test and ODI XI?

1.Sachin Tendulkar
2.Wasim Akram
3.Shane Warne
4.Adam Gilchrist



Tendulkar is the king with his incomparable record aggregating 100 centuries proportionately to be the outstanding player in both forms of cricket.Wasim Akram took cricketing genius or skill to it's ultimate zenith championing the cause in both forms of the game.In both forms of the game great batsmen found him the most difficult bowler to tackle.Warne could win or turn both an ODI or a tset match equally playing a major role in taking Australia to the top of the pedestal in bot h form sof the game.Gilchrist could cause a boomerang out there in the middle to turn or win tests and ODI's like none else could taking attacking agression to regions in the sublime.



The likes of Viv Richards,Brian lara,Malcolm Marshal,Dennis Lillee,Glen Mcgrath or Imran Khan miss out by just a whisker.Marshall would make the all-time test xi as well as Lara while Viv is a certainty for the ODI team.Arguably Imran is not a certainty in both the test or ODI team being pipped by Sobers in tests or Kapil Dev in ODI's..Bradman and Sobers did not play ODI cricket so are excluded.Mcgrath was champion but had strong contention with Lillee or Hadlee in test matches .
 
Shane Warne is not a certainty in either format. Muralitharan was just as great while Saqlain was arguably superior in ODIs. Gilly is not a given in ODIs since there are better openers and better keeper-batsmen, although no better keeper-batsman who was an opener.

My picks would be:

1) Wasim
2) Imran
3) Sachin
4) McGrath
 
Imran in every ODI ATG XI :))

When in fact he doesn't even make it to most Test All Time XI.
 
Last edited:
Harsh Thakor said:
My certainties to be part of all-time test and ODI XI?

1.Sachin Tendulkar
2.Wasim Akram
3.Shane Warne
4.Adam Gilchrist
Click to expand...

I'll add:

Ponting
Lara
McGrath
Muralidharan


Even Anil Kumble is both a test and ODI ATG. But he wouldn't be in the XI before Warne and Murali.

Same with Sangakkara. ODI & Test ATG but won't be in the 11 before Gilchrist.
 
Bilal7 said:
Don't be ridiculous. He does not make the ATG ODI XI ahead of Ponting and de Villiers just yet, and is not among the top 100 test cricketers, let alone top XI.
Click to expand...

Devilliers? The same guy that ran away from internationals just 12 months before WC leaving his team in disarray for tamasha leagues? No thanks. You can hv that mediocraty but I prefer class :kohli

Kohli is the top 3 LOI batsman of all time along with Viv and Sachin.
 
Bilal7 said:
Don't be ridiculous. He does not make the ATG ODI XI ahead of Ponting and de Villiers just yet, and is not among the top 100 test cricketers, let alone top XI.
Click to expand...

Back again with your bias against Kohli.

Explain on what grounds is Kohli not in the XI but ABD is.

Kohli has more runs, more runs in wins, more centuries and is also a WC winner.

There is not a single reason - except blind hatred - to have ABD in the ODI XI but not Kohli. Kohli is not just an ODI ATG. He is an ODI GOAT.
 
Bilal7 said:
Shane Warne is not a certainty in either format. Muralitharan was just as great while Saqlain was arguably superior in ODIs. Gilly is not a given in ODIs since there are better openers and better keeper-batsmen, although no better keeper-batsman who was an opener.

My picks would be:

1) Wasim
2) Imran
3) Sachin
4) McGrath
Click to expand...

Bhai, how is Imran in ODI eleven?
 
Canford Cliffs said:
Devilliers? The same guy that ran away from internationals just 12 months before WC leaving his team in disarray for tamasha leagues? No thanks. You can hv that mediocraty but I prefer class :kohli

Kohli is the top 3 LOI batsman of all time along with Viv and Sachin.
Click to expand...

the_outsider said:
Back again with your bias against Kohli.

Explain on what grounds is Kohli not in the XI but ABD is.

Kohli has more runs, more runs in wins, more centuries and is also a WC winner.

There is not a single reason - except blind hatred - to have ABD in the ODI XI but not Kohli. Kohli is not just an ODI ATG. He is an ODI GOAT.
Click to expand...

ABD may not have heart but you cannot deny the ability he had. ABD was arguably better than Kohli in bilaterals, at one point averaging nearly 55 with a SR of 100. What sets him apart though is that Kohli is a WC choker while ABD is not. If Kohli has an excellent World Cup next year, he can edge both Ponting and be a certain in an ODI all-time XI.

This "more x" argument is hollow when this is simply because Kohli has played more games.
 
These players have more chance than any one else when it comes to make it to both all time XIs.

Viv
SRT
Wasim
Hadlee
McGrath


Gilly may be another name, but he is much below other 5 names. I can't think of another name which will have the same chance.
 
Buffet said:
These players have more chance than any one else when it comes to make it to both all time XIs.

Viv
SRT
Wasim
Hadlee
McGrath


Gilly may be another name, but he is much below other 5 names. I can't think of another name which will have the same chance.
Click to expand...

Kallis, maybe?
 
Bilal7 said:
ABD may not have heart but you cannot deny the ability he had. ABD was arguably better than Kohli in bilaterals, at one point averaging nearly 55 with a SR of 100. What sets him apart though is that Kohli is a WC choker while ABD is not. If Kohli has an excellent World Cup next year, he can edge both Ponting and be a certain in an ODI all-time XI.

This "more x" argument is hollow when this is simply because Kohli has played more games.
Click to expand...


According to you Inzi is better than Sachin because of one good innings in the SF in '92, regardless of Sachin's overall superiority. But when it comes to ABD and Kohli suddenly bi-laterals become more important.

Fine. Go check bilateral stats. In bilaterals, Virat averages 60 with 33 centuries while ABD averages 52 with 21 centuries.

So even in bilaterals Kohli is miles ahead of ABD.

And it's rich that you call Kohli a WC choker when he won the WC in his first attempt and ABD couldn't even take his team to a final after 3 attempts.

First time I've seen this logic of calling a WC winner with almost 600 runs in WC, avg of 42 and 2 hundreds being called a "choker". Only you are capable of this. :salute
 
Bilal7 said:
This "more x" argument is hollow when this is simply because Kohli has played more games.
Click to expand...

I know you have to somehow justify your bias but at least check the stats beforehand.

Matches played by Kohli: 211. Innings: 203
Matches played by ABD: 228. Innings: 218
 
Bilal7 said:
Don't be ridiculous. He does not make the ATG ODI XI ahead of Ponting and de Villiers just yet, and is not among the top 100 test cricketers, let alone top XI.
Click to expand...

Lol. ABD is a nobody compared to Kohli. No ICC wins and quit before a WC.
 
Bilal7 said:
He's the best all-round option.
Click to expand...
He will have to play at no. 7 in an atg x1, and he isn't the best pick for no. 7.
He wasn't a big hitter (str rate 73),imo klusener is more fit for this role. (str rate90).
Also kapil has similar bowling stats and str rate of 95,so imran isn't a certainty.
 
I can only think of 3 players
Sachin
Viv
Mcgrath


Wasim isn't a regular pick in tests. So he isn't a certainty.
Marshall, mcgrath, hadlee, ambrose, dale steyn are usually preferred over him in tests.
 
Sachin
Viv
McGrath

Even for my test XI - I have included players only from the 70s onwards.

Test XI

S Gavaskar
G Smith
V Richards
S Tendulkar
B Lara
A Gilchrist
I Khan (c)
S Warne
M Marshall
D Steyn
M Muralidharan

ODI XI

S Tendulkar
S Jayasuriya
V Kohli
V Richards
R Ponting
MS Dhoni (C)
L Klusener
K Dev
W Akram
S Mushtaq
G McGrath
 
Sidilicious said:
Sachin
Viv
McGrath

Even for my test XI - I have included players only from the 70s onwards.

Test XI

S Gavaskar
G Smith
V Richards
S Tendulkar
B Lara
A Gilchrist
I Khan (c)
S Warne
M Marshall
D Steyn
M Muralidharan

ODI XI

S Tendulkar
S Jayasuriya
V Kohli
V Richards
R Ponting
MS Dhoni (C)
L Klusener
K Dev
W Akram
S Mushtaq
G McGrath
Click to expand...

Solid teams.
 
For me the players who can make strong claim to be in Both XI are following:

Tendulkar , Pointing , MaCGRath , Warne , Javed Miandad , Wasim Akram , waqar Younis , gary Kirsten , Kallis , Klusner , Chris Cairns , Viv Richards , brian Lara , Marshall , Ambrose ,
 
Justcrazy said:
No way , Imran in Test would be strong contender , but in OD there is no chance. Razzak is better than him .
Click to expand...

While IK was not the best ODI all rounder during his playing days, he is certainly not behind Razzaq.
 
Good list by OP but add McGrath as well.

Sachin
McGrath
Wasim
Gilly
Warne

An argument for Viv can be made as well. He is rated among the top 3-4 cricketers of all-time.
 
For me it is and Ill try and go in batting order:

1. Viv Richards
2. Sachin Tendulkar
3. Ricky Ponting
4. Gary Sobers
5. Adam Gilchrist
6. Wasim Akram

I know Sobers didnt really have an ODI career but with his striking ability and bowling adaptability, he'd be a very modern ODI cricketer.

I think Tendulkar and Akram are self explanatory while Viv was an ODI batsman before ODI batting is what it is today.

Gilly for me is simply the bets keeper bat ever so no point in not having him.

None of the all time great spinners are assured (Warne possibly in tests, Murali definitely in ODIs), while in the wings, Saqlain, Qadir and Kumble are biding their time.

Ponting, people tend to forget, had the most remarkable peak. ODI and test runs just about everywhere, a complete range of strokes and someone bowlers absolutely hated.
 
Lol at people saying Akram in a test XI. He wasn't even as good as Imran in tests, and Imran himself doesn't make the test XI. Akram would probably be a in tier 3 ATG XI. Only reason he's overrated here because it's PP. Akram was not a legendary test bowler.
 
No way would Wasim get into an all time XI in tests over Marshall, McGrath, Hadlee, Ambrose, Garner, Steyn, Donald and Imran in that order. Only in PP would you hear such a thing.
 
Only sachin and viv makes 90% of times in both format.
Gilchrist can miss out to dhoni in ODIs.
Warne can miss due to murali.

Among fast bowlers there has been numerous ATGs lindwall, snow, trueman, statham, marshall, lillee, holding, garner, roberts, Willis, imran, waqar, Donald, steyn, mcgrath, anderson, etc.
But there is no standout sachin/viv among them. If picking a left armer is mandatory then wasim is first choice.
 
Tendulkar is the only certainty and that is why he is called the GOAT.
 
the_outsider said:
According to you Inzi is better than Sachin because of one good innings in the SF in '92, regardless of Sachin's overall superiority. But when it comes to ABD and Kohli suddenly bi-laterals become more important.

Fine. Go check bilateral stats. In bilaterals, Virat averages 60 with 33 centuries while ABD averages 52 with 21 centuries.

So even in bilaterals Kohli is miles ahead of ABD.

And it's rich that you call Kohli a WC choker when he won the WC in his first attempt and ABD couldn't even take his team to a final after 3 attempts.

First time I've seen this logic of calling a WC winner with almost 600 runs in WC, avg of 42 and 2 hundreds being called a "choker". Only you are capable of this. :salute
Click to expand...

Wow, I don't think anyone has misinterpreted a post quite like this. Let me explain:

Firstly, I consider Sachin to be a better batsman than Inzamam in all formats. I don't know where this came from. Inzamam was arguably the better match-winner but that does not make him the better batsman overall.

Additionally, I know Kohli has been fantastic in bilaterals, I simply stated that ABD has been just as great. You're committing a mistake in comparing the stats of a player who has retired and one who is still playing. ABD averaged around 55 with a SR of 100 at his best. The fewer number of centuries is because ABD used to bat at #4 and #5.

A World Cup winner who was carried the whole way. Choked against Pakistan in the semis, choked against Lanka in the finals (a team he has dominated in bilaterals) and then when the seniors had retired and he came the main man; he choked throughout the 2015 edition of the World Cup. His innings of 1 (13) while chasing 300 was an embarassment.

You're new here and clearly did not see how much Kohli was derided for his semi-final "innings". ABD, on the other hand, did all he personally could to help South Africa win a World Cup in 2015 but was let down by the bowlers in the other semi-final. :steyn

jeeteshssaxena said:
He will have to play at no. 7 in an atg x1, and he isn't the best pick for no. 7.
He wasn't a big hitter (str rate 73),imo klusener is more fit for this role. (str rate90).
Also kapil has similar bowling stats and str rate of 95,so imran isn't a certainty.
Click to expand...

He's the best pick for #7. Imran could hit it big when needed, people don't realize this. Besides, an all-time ODI XI won't require much batting from their #7. However, a side with four champion bowlers will still require a proper fifth bowler and Imran was a much better bowler than both Kapil and Klusenar.

the_outsider said:
I know you have to somehow justify your bias but at least check the stats beforehand.

Matches played by Kohli: 211. Innings: 203
Matches played by ABD: 228. Innings: 218
Click to expand...

More matches higher up the batting order.

GLORY OF '92 said:
Lol. ABD is a nobody compared to Kohli. No ICC wins and quit before a WC.
Click to expand...

Is Griezman a better player than Messi?
 
Justcrazy said:
No way , Imran in Test would be strong contender , but in OD there is no chance. Razzak is better than him .
Click to expand...

the_outsider said:
Also no.

Kapil, Klusener, Flintoff are all better ODI all-arounders than Imran.

Imran's legacy lies in his captaincy and achievements in tests.
Click to expand...

Simply saying "no" is not the argument anyone over the age of three makes. Please explain how Kapil, who averaged 25 with the bat and 32 with the ball in World Cup matches, excluding Zimababwe, is better than Imran who averaged 35 with the bat and 19 with the ball?

Of course, this is considering that both Imran and Kapil were equal in bilaterals, whereas there exists a strong argument that Imran was the superior cricketer in bilaterals as well, due to the small matter of having a better bowling and batting average, as well as being a superior captain.
 
Ugh, another thread ruined by Kohli fanatics.

On topic, Kallis was awesome in ODIs back in the day and played a massive role in our only ICC trophy win. Apart from him, the only Saffers I can honestly say would be great in both formats XI is Donald, and MAYBE Steyn.
 
Bilal7 said:
Wow, I don't think anyone has misinterpreted a post quite like this. Let me explain:

Firstly, I consider Sachin to be a better batsman than Inzamam in all formats. I don't know where this came from. Inzamam was arguably the better match-winner but that does not make him the better batsman overall.

Additionally, I know Kohli has been fantastic in bilaterals, I simply stated that ABD has been just as great. You're committing a mistake in comparing the stats of a player who has retired and one who is still playing. ABD averaged around 55 with a SR of 100 at his best. The fewer number of centuries is because ABD used to bat at #4 and #5.

A World Cup winner who was carried the whole way. Choked against Pakistan in the semis, choked against Lanka in the finals (a team he has dominated in bilaterals) and then when the seniors had retired and he came the main man; he choked throughout the 2015 edition of the World Cup. His innings of 1 (13) while chasing 300 was an embarassment.

You're new here and clearly did not see how much Kohli was derided for his semi-final "innings". ABD, on the other hand, did all he personally could to help South Africa win a World Cup in 2015 but was let down by the bowlers in the other semi-final. :steyn



He's the best pick for #7. Imran could hit it big when needed, people don't realize this. Besides, an all-time ODI XI won't require much batting from their #7. However, a side with four champion bowlers will still require a proper fifth bowler and Imran was a much better bowler than both Kapil and Klusenar.



More matches higher up the batting order.



Is Griezman a better player than Messi?
Click to expand...

Wow. It's crazy how often you shift your posts just so that you don't have to give credit to Indian cricketers.

Batting higher number this that all kinds of nonsense. It hasn't even been 6 months since ABD retired so let's not use that as another lame excuse either. :)))

You had no way to justify having ABD over Kohli as an ODI ATG and you're failure to do so exposes nothing but your bias against Kohli.
 
Bilal7 said:
Simply saying "no" is not the argument anyone over the age of three makes. Please explain how Kapil, who averaged 25 with the bat and 32 with the ball in World Cup matches, excluding Zimababwe, is better than Imran who averaged 35 with the bat and 19 with the ball?

Of course, this is considering that both Imran and Kapil were equal in bilaterals, whereas there exists a strong argument that Imran was the superior cricketer in bilaterals as well, due to the small matter of having a better bowling and batting average, as well as being a superior captain.
Click to expand...

Believe what you want to believe. It's obvious to everyone that you can never see the world without your green-tinted glasses on.

Doesn't change the fact that Kapil, Klusener and Flintoff are all better ODI ARs than Imran.
 
Only certainties for me are Sachin Tendulkar , Wasim Akram and Muralitharan

My All Time Test XI
Gavaskar
Hammond
Bradman
Tendulkar
Lara
Sobers
Gilchrist
Marshall
Akram
Warne
Muralitharan

My All Time ODI XI
Tendulkar
Amla
Richards
DeVilliars
Dhoni
Bevan
Flintoff
Akram
Saqlain
Garner
Muralitharan

Strong Contender - Mcgrath narrowly missed out on both team (second choice in both)
Viv - (narrowly missed out to Lara in tests)
Hadlee - strong contender for both.
Gilchrist - missed out on ODI because of Dhoni
Warne - Saqlain was better spinner in ODI's

Future Contenders Not considered because they still have long career ahead.
Steve Smith - Can replace Lara/Tendulkar in tests provided he maintain form next few years.
Kohli - Should replace Devilliars in ODI.
 
Tendulkar, Wasim, McGrath, Warne and Gilchrist. Kohli in 2-3 years time.
 
the_outsider said:
Wow. It's crazy how often you shift your posts just so that you don't have to give credit to Indian cricketers.

Batting higher number this that all kinds of nonsense. It hasn't even been 6 months since ABD retired so let's not use that as another lame excuse either. :)))

You had no way to justify having ABD over Kohli as an ODI ATG and you're failure to do so exposes nothing but your bias against Kohli.
Click to expand...

He has written a pretty detailed post and highlighted some good points. I would add AB has a better range of strokes and was a much better big match player.

Your counter argument is non existent.
 
Justcrazy said:
Razzak is ahead by Imran .
Click to expand...

ICC long term rating trend is an objective criterion. If difference is small enough, you can argue many points, but IK's was above Razzaq's peak rating for majority of career. Difference is too huge.

razzaq.jpg
 
barah_admi said:
He has written a pretty detailed post and highlighted some good points. I would add AB has a better range of strokes and was a much better big match player.

Your counter argument is non existent.
Click to expand...

Yeah big match player with zero ICC trophies! What a deduction!

Kohli on the other hand won the WC at age 23 where we scored a crucial 35 in an very important partnership with Gambhir after India had lost both Sachin and Sehwag inside 10 overs.

Then he won the CT in 2013 where he was the highest scorer in the match.

Let's not forget the century he scored against Pak in the WC - which is one of the biggest matches in the career of an Indian/Pakistani cricketer.

But ABD was a better big match player. :salute
 
Joseph Gomes said:
Lol at people saying Akram in a test XI. He wasn't even as good as Imran in tests, and Imran himself doesn't make the test XI. Akram would probably be a in tier 3 ATG XI. Only reason he's overrated here because it's PP. Akram was not a legendary test bowler.
Click to expand...

Wasim was certainly an inferior bowler than McGrath, Ambrose, Hadlee, Marshall etc... But world XI is not an assembly of best 4-5 bowlers. You want different kind of bowlers and him being left handed helps.
 
WengerOut said:
Kallis, maybe?
Click to expand...

LOL. A person who's questioning Imran's place and then end up suggesting KALLIS out of all people,

Have some neutral sense, don't be so shamelessly biased.

Imran is a far superior universally acclaimed allrounder.
 
the_outsider said:
Wow. It's crazy how often you shift your posts just so that you don't have to give credit to Indian cricketers.

Batting higher number this that all kinds of nonsense. It hasn't even been 6 months since ABD retired so let's not use that as another lame excuse either. :)))

You had no way to justify having ABD over Kohli as an ODI ATG and you're failure to do so exposes nothing but your bias against Kohli.
Click to expand...

1) ABD is not a World Cup choker, Kohli is.
2) ABD averaged 55 with a SR of 100.
3) ABD is a superior #5 batsman than anyone else in history while Kohli is not a superior #3 batsman to Ponting (See: Kohli is a choker, Ponting isn't).

Those are the three reasons why I rate ABD higher than Kohli and why ABD would make an all-time ODI XI while Kohli would not. What were your arguments exactly? Oh yeah, that Kohli was carried to a World Cup title win and has more hundreds and runs, batting positions and team-mates be damned. Don't bother replying, it'll be nothing I haven't already seen from any other Kohli-fan.

the_outsider said:
Believe what you want to believe. It's obvious to everyone that you can never see the world without your green-tinted glasses on.

Doesn't change the fact that Kapil, Klusener and Flintoff are all better ODI ARs than Imran.
Click to expand...

Yes, I will continue believing that the "all-rounder" who averaged 25 with the bat and 32 with the ball in World Cup matches against teams other than Zimbabwe is an inferior player to an all-rounder who averaged 35 with the bat and 19 with the ball in World Cup matches against teams other than Zimbabwe.

I hope the pretty colors are able to succeed where statistics failed.
 
Buffet said:
Wasim was certainly an inferior bowler than McGrath, Ambrose, Hadlee, Marshall etc... But world XI is not an assembly of best 4-5 bowlers. You want different kind of bowlers and him being left handed helps.
Click to expand...

I have no issues in anyone picking Wasim in any format. He is a top bowler but i am just wondering why would one look out for a bowler on the basis of their bowling type (i..e, left arm fats bowling in Wasim's case) when you have the luxury of hand picking the best ever bowlers in the business?

So a team of Marshall, Ambrose, Warne, Murali, Kallis/Sobers for example - Why do you need Wasim specifically because he bowls left arm? Not reflecting a lot of confidence in that bowling line up.

I would pick Warne and Murali for instance simply because they are by far THE two best spinners ever, period. Not because i want a leggie-offie combo in particular. If they were both leggies they'd both be in on merit.

Wasim is terrific. He'd probably make many XIs on merit not because he is by far the best left arm pacer.
 
Buffet said:
Wasim was certainly an inferior bowler than McGrath, Ambrose, Hadlee, Marshall etc... But world XI is not an assembly of best 4-5 bowlers. You want different kind of bowlers and him being left handed helps.
Click to expand...

Why would it be necessary to have a left arm pacer in a all time XI? GOAT WI and Aus team didn't have one.
 
richards viv
saeed anwar
kohli
tendulkar
lara

chris cairns
wasim bhai

gilchrist
dhoni backup

saqlain
kumble
vettori
bumrah
anderson james
ambrose
walsh
 
docteurmanish said:
richards viv
saeed anwar
kohli
tendulkar
lara

chris cairns
wasim bhai

gilchrist
dhoni backup

saqlain
kumble
vettori
bumrah
anderson james
ambrose
walsh
Click to expand...

Pretty safe to say that you've completely misunderstood the thread
 
Viv is the only absolute lock.
Others are obviously in contention - SRT, Akram, McGrath, Lillee, Imran, Hadlee, Gilly (test lock) etc etc.
 
freelance_cricketer said:
I have no issues in anyone picking Wasim in any format. He is a top bowler but i am just wondering why would one look out for a bowler on the basis of their bowling type (i..e, left arm fats bowling in Wasim's case) when you have the luxury of hand picking the best ever bowlers in the business?

So a team of Marshall, Ambrose, Warne, Murali, Kallis/Sobers for example - Why do you need Wasim specifically because he bowls left arm? Not reflecting a lot of confidence in that bowling line up.

I would pick Warne and Murali for instance simply because they are by far THE two best spinners ever, period. Not because i want a leggie-offie combo in particular. If they were both leggies they'd both be in on merit.

Wasim is terrific. He'd probably make many XIs on merit not because he is by far the best left arm pacer.
Click to expand...

He made the cricinfo AT Test XI. Southpaw adds variation.
 
Buffet said:
Wasim was certainly an inferior bowler than McGrath, Ambrose, Hadlee, Marshall etc... But world XI is not an assembly of best 4-5 bowlers. You want different kind of bowlers and him being left handed helps.
Click to expand...

What next, ensure there is a left handed batsmen or two for variation?
 
bujhee kom said:
Viv is the only absolute lock.
Others are obviously in contention - SRT, Akram, McGrath, Lillee, Imran, Hadlee, Gilly (test lock) etc etc.
Click to expand...

Viv isn't absolute lock . No one is. Anyone can prefer a middle order of ponting, srt, lara or ponting Kallis Lara or some other combinations
 
Some posters gotta understand we are comparing Wasim to Steyn, Imran, Hadlee etc, not Chaminda Vaas or Zaheer Khan to those three names.

So, there is minimal difference between Wasim and those three names as a bowler alone and Waz brings that extra with his variation and versatility as well. He definitely makes a strong case in an all-time XI.
 
anoop said:
Viv isn't absolute lock . No one is. Anyone can prefer a middle order of ponting, srt, lara or ponting Kallis Lara or some other combinations
Click to expand...

There are not 4 better batsman than Viv. In tests or ODIs. He is thus an absolute lock.
 
Ab Fan said:
Some posters gotta understand we are comparing Wasim to Steyn, Imran, Hadlee etc, not Chaminda Vaas or Zaheer Khan to those three names.

So, there is minimal difference between Wasim and those three names as a bowler alone and Waz brings that extra with his variation and versatility as well. He definitely makes a strong case in an all-time XI.
Click to expand...

Nope.
 
WhenSultansBowled said:
Nope.
Click to expand...

HE does have a point though.

If I had to pick top 2 pacers and top fast bowling AR in tests, I would go for Marshall, Steyn and Imran Khan.

Talking purely in tests, I'd even say McGrath and Ambrose are also better than Wasim in tests.

But if you have a bowling line up of Imran, Steyn/Marshall, Warne and Murali, who would you chose as the 3rd bowler - Wasim, Mc Grath, Ambrose or Marshall/Steyn.

now, Steyn and Imran provide me excellent right hand bowling with conventional and reverse swing. But Wasim offers additional variety as a leftie.

My initial XI had the following bowlers Imran, Warne, Steyn, Marshall, Murali.

But I am tempted to replace one of Marshall or Steyn with Waz.

WAz though, would be the first name on my ODI bowling.
 
Joseph Gomes said:
Why would it be necessary to have a left arm pacer in a all time XI? GOAT WI and Aus team didn't have one.
Click to expand...

jaf348 said:
What next, ensure there is a left handed batsmen or two for variation?
Click to expand...

Not to attack [MENTION=97523]Buffet[/MENTION] bhai

Like i said before, if anyone picks Wasim in any format i am completely fine. He is a top bowler.

But like these 2 guys also mentioned, why would you favour Wasim over bowlers on the basis of being a left arm pacer when we are talking about hand picked ATG XIs.
 
anoop said:
Viv isn't absolute lock . No one is. Anyone can prefer a middle order of ponting, srt, lara or ponting Kallis Lara or some other combinations
Click to expand...

He is not.

Viv's overall stature is exaggerated by his aggressive batting that best suited ODI cricket.

In tests his achievements pale in comparison to many batsmen.

Viv had a freakish reign in 1976. Post that he averaged 45 as a test batsman during 15 years till he retired in 1991. That's not extra ordinary.
 
Bilal7 said:
Shane Warne is not a certainty in either format. Muralitharan was just as great while Saqlain was arguably superior in ODIs. Gilly is not a given in ODIs since there are better openers and better keeper-batsmen, although no better keeper-batsman who was an opener.

My picks would be:

1) Wasim
2) Imran
3) Sachin
4) McGrath
Click to expand...

Warne is regarded as the best spinner of all time by 80-90% of ex-players, writers, statisticians, analysts and etc.

In ODIs he is one of the 3 best spinners of all time along with Murali and Saqlain. Australia won 1999 WC because of him.

But as usual you like shifting goal posts to suit your narrative since Virat Kohli isn't worthy of making a WC XI because he is a "world cup choker". His innings in the 2011 WC final was a crucial knock when India were reeling from Malinga's two quick dismissals of Sehwag and Tendulkar.

The only batsmen ahead of Kohli in ODIs are Tendulkar, Viv and Ponting because they have played major roles in winning a WC for their teams.

Highly likely Kohli will win India at least a WC, so by the end of his career he will jump ahead of those three because his overall consistency during his playing career is just on another level.
 
Buffet said:
Wasim was certainly an inferior bowler than McGrath, Ambrose, Hadlee, Marshall etc... But world XI is not an assembly of best 4-5 bowlers. You want different kind of bowlers and him being left handed helps.
Click to expand...

There is nothing certain about that. Wasim was arguably better than Ambrose and McGrath and the only four three bowlers ahead of him were Marshall, Imran and Hadlee.

People forget that Wasim bowled more than 50% of his matches in Pakistan. That is a far harder prospect than bowling an equivalent amount on the lush, juicy pitches of South Africa and even Australia and West Indies, which were perfect for bowlers who utilized bounce.

Wasim being left-handed is part of his arsenal, just like McGrath being tall or Waqar having that slingy action. It is what made him Wasim. We have no way of telling if he would have been just as effective if he was a right-handed bowler.
 
freelance_cricketer said:
I have no issues in anyone picking Wasim in any format. He is a top bowler but i am just wondering why would one look out for a bowler on the basis of their bowling type (i..e, left arm fats bowling in Wasim's case) when you have the luxury of hand picking the best ever bowlers in the business?
Click to expand...

You will always take leg spinner and off spinner combination if both are in same class vs two off spinner or two leg spinner even though two leg/off spinner may have a better career.

Simple reason is that with variety you are covered against different conditions and left hand+ right hand batsmen. Many gun bowlers have lot more better record vs one kind. With variety you average it out and outcome can be guaranteed consistently.
 
jaf348 said:
What next, ensure there is a left handed batsmen or two for variation?
Click to expand...

Yes, You can do that if they are in same class despite slightly inferior record. best team for all conditions are not often collection of best 11 players.
 
jeetu said:
Only certainties for me are Sachin Tendulkar , Wasim Akram and Muralitharan

My All Time Test XI
Gavaskar
Hammond
Bradman
Tendulkar
Lara
Sobers
Gilchrist
Marshall
Akram
Warne
Muralitharan

My All Time ODI XI
Tendulkar
Amla
Richards
DeVilliars
Dhoni
Bevan
Flintoff
Akram
Saqlain
Garner
Muralitharan

Strong Contender - Mcgrath narrowly missed out on both team (second choice in both)
Viv - (narrowly missed out to Lara in tests)
Hadlee - strong contender for both.
Gilchrist - missed out on ODI because of Dhoni
Warne - Saqlain was better spinner in ODI's

Future Contenders Not considered because they still have long career ahead.
Steve Smith - Can replace Lara/Tendulkar in tests provided he maintain form next few years.
Kohli - Should replace Devilliars in ODI.
Click to expand...

Good teams. My only issue would be that lack of a truly great third pacer/fifth bowler. Sobers and Flintoff might lose you some matches.
 
Bilal7 said:
There is nothing certain about that. Wasim was arguably better than Ambrose and McGrath
Click to expand...

It's very hard to argue that point. ICC rating trend for entire career when both players played at same time is a very good indicator of where they stand with each other.

ICC rating takes account of opposition, contrubution of players relative ot peers in each match and many other context. It's not biased, it's not subjective. It;s pure objective. It may not be perrfect at any one point, but for entire career we have,

MCgrath's majority of career had higher rating than peak rating of Wasim. Both played at the same time. You can nitpick ranting all you want, but when difference is so huge for both players playing at same time, it's futile to argue that Wasim was a better bowler than McGrath.

wasim.jpg
 
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