Which outstanding talents were denied an opportunity by Misbah's inclusion in the team?

[MenInG]

Just wondering which players would we have found in the team today and what outstanding talents would have been doing well today?

Faisal Iqbal comes to mind....

 

[Gotham Cronie]

Who knows if he has any sustainable talent at the international level but it's disappointing that Hammad Azam wasn't given a go.

 

[Syed1]

In the last 12 months Misbah has played 11 test matches and batted in 20 innings. In those 20 innings he has scored 599 runs while remaining not out once. He has one century, four fifties and two ducks. His highest score was 114. Misbah's overall batting average in the last 12 months was 31.52.

Surely he deserves to be dropped on the basis of that performance alone.


We are not going to find his replacement if we are not going to select a replacement in the first place.

 

[pakistanigoneaussie]

Who knows if he has any sustainable talent at the international level but it's disappointing that Hammad Azam wasn't given a go.

Especially considering he was dropped after doing fairly well in what chance he got in the Asia cup

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Question should have been 'which outstanding talents denied Misbah an opportunity to be included in the team for so long?'

 

[Syed1]

Question should have been 'which outstanding talents denied Misbah an opportunity to be included in the team for so long?'

Misbah was good but not good enough to break into a middle order comprising Inzi, Younis and Yousuf.

Despite debuting at a later age Misbah has had a long and fulfilling career. However, now his performances have taken a nose-dive and it is in his own best interest to call it a day.

 

[Hasan123]

Harris sohail is one. He was discarded after a few games in the West Indies. He should have been a regular after the 2011 World Cup in place of Asad and Younis who were given multiple games.

 

[coy0607]

Faisal Iqbal?! what a troll post, but I'll bite...

Fakhar Zaman, Fawad Alam, Imam-ul-Haq, Usman Salahuddin, Imran Butt

 

[Officer Barbrady]

Don't understand the question. He performed in the domestic leagues and fully deserved a go. He did very well when he got a consistent run.

Is your point that he should continue playing because there are no replacements available? That's an entirely different issue - he's 43 now, has struggled in recent away tours, the hand-eye coordination seems to be giving way and there are younger players that are worth trying out (Harris, rizwan).

 

[Bewal Express]

The reality is that there is dearth of talent and people in the team are average and the ones not in the team are not very good.

 

[MRSN]

The reality is that there is dearth of talent and people in the team are average and the ones not in the team are not very good.

yeah Baber Azam was an average player who couldn't impress Misbah enough to prefer him over the likes of Azhar,Shafiq,YK even in ODIs.

My question for Misbah is why was Umar Amin discarded after giving him one game against Australia in the UAE especially after a lot of hard work he had done in the domestic cricket to earn a recall?

The way Umar Akmal was omitted from the test side when he had wonderful series in WI on his comeback, was incredibly shocking.

and some poster has already mentioned unfair treatment Harris Sohail got on his first selection in the squad.

 

[MRSN]

Don't understand the question. He performed in the domestic leagues and fully deserved a go. He did very well when he got a consistent run.

Is your point that he should continue playing because there are no replacements available? That's an entirely different issue - he's 43 now, has struggled in recent away tours, the hand-eye coordination seems to be giving way and there are younger players that are worth trying out (Harris, rizwan).

OP is trying to justify Misbah's faith in Asad Shafiq,Yk in ODIs in 2014 despite these players came with worst stats possible in ODIs for last few years. I'm sure he could have tried better than bringing his buddies back again and again in a bid to settle them permanently in ODIs.

 

[Kamil1979]

Fawad Alam in Test
Umar akmal in test and ODI
Asad shafiq in ODI
Salman Butt in test (one year only)
Faisal Iqbal in test
Khurram Manzoor in test
Also he always play with his qabila bowlers like rahat ali so we can say junaid Khan also in the list
Come on Misbah pls pls pls stay away from Pakistan cricket

 

[MRSN]

Question should have been 'which outstanding talents denied Misbah an opportunity to be included in the team for so long?'

even today Misbah is an average batsman at best and there was no chance for Misbah to be picked when we had 3 quality batsmen in the middle order.

 

[MMHS]

It's a philosophical discussion - I won't go by player to player. OP added spice in his post by bringing Faisal Iqbal - I can only reply with Asad Shafiq in ODI for 50+ matches. Discussion shouldn't end that way.

What I can say is, it's not about individuals, rather it's about the philosophy - Misbah had been extremely rigid to promote any youngster. A cricket mad country of 200mn, exactly 2 years before the next WC played an ODI XI in J'burg of Farhat, MoHa, YK, Misbah, Malik, KAkmal, Afridi, Ajmal, JK, Wahab, Irfan - in March 2013 - that's officially 9 players over 30, one at 29 & 4 of them over 35.

In ENG/AUS of 2016-17, PAK went to a 4 bowler strategy - 3 of them pacers. And Misbah's team had Wahab, Imran, Rahat, Sohail - I don't know what talent is available but it can't be that PAK didn't have a single pacer around 25 who could run whole day & reach 140Ks.

To answer OP on specific players - Zulfiqar Babar is having a free party for at least 2 years now, when there are 3 excellent options available.

PAK's average age for ODI team is around 31, Test team is around 33 - which is at least 3-5 years more than ideal, even if I take it on official age AND every credit should go to Misbah for this. Don't know whose who or what talent available - but you can't lead an ODI team in SAF with 3 office & a top spinning leggi in playing XI - youngest of them being 33 officially - that's Misbah for you.

 

[MenInG]

Just wondering which players would we have found in the team today and what outstanding talents would have been doing well today?

Faisal Iqbal comes to mind....

Sorry the reason I mentioned Faisal was because of his recent tweets. It seems he is the only one with "guts" to say what he feels in so many words.

I am sure Asim Kamal probably feels the same

 

[MenInG]

OP is trying to justify Misbah's faith in Asad Shafiq,Yk in ODIs in 2014 despite these players came with worst stats possible in ODIs for last few years. I'm sure he could have tried better than bringing his buddies back again and again in a bid to settle them permanently in ODIs.

OP is not doing that. You are inventing that in your head. Read that post again and answer what has been asked there.

 

[MenInG]

Faisal Iqbal?! what a troll post, but I'll bite...

Fakhar Zaman, Fawad Alam, Imam-ul-Haq, Usman Salahuddin, Imran Butt

You did not mention Asim Kamal so I am disappointed.

 

[Bewal Express]

yeah Baber Azam was an average player who couldn't impress Misbah enough to prefer him over the likes of Azhar,Shafiq,YK even in ODIs.

My question for Misbah is why was Umar Amin discarded after giving him one game against Australia in the UAE especially after a lot of hard work he had done in the domestic cricket to earn a recall?

The way Umar Akmal was omitted from the test side when he had wonderful series in WI on his comeback, was incredibly shocking.

and some poster has already mentioned unfair treatment Harris Sohail got on his first selection in the squad.

Umer Amin was so bad that he struggled in the Bham league. One of their players told me that he was on the verge of being dropped from the 1st team.

 

[Justcrazy]

Misbah has left behind no legacy that he will be remembered.

Its a harsh truth.

 

[Saj]

Harris sohail is one. He was discarded after a few games in the West Indies. He should have been a regular after the 2011 World Cup in place of Asad and Younis who were given multiple games.

The man who has been injured for large parts of the past couple of years?

 

[Hasan123]

The man who has been injured for large parts of the past couple of years?

Was he injured at the time I think he should have been in the team? He got injured in 2015. So let's assume he was given a chance and remained healthy, you don't believe in them 4 years he would have done better than the likes of Younis, Asad,Amin,Imran Farhat,Kamran Akmal, Malik, just to name of the trash that was selected ahead of him for all those years.

I am Misbah fan but he has faults so I don't see why you need to defend him for everything. He has literally left us no youngsters in our LO teams. I refuse to believe in a country of 200 million there is no talent that if given a consistent run could prosper. Misbah making out as though there is no talent is something I refuse to believe.

 

[Kitchlew]

Faisal Iqbal ????
Self proclaimed legend..Never was good enough to be a part of intl team.. Scored heavily in couple of seasons, failed badly in tests(averging 26 in 44 innings).. All in all, a loud mouth and a **** batsman.
Umer Amin
Has everything, but for some reason just cant perform well enough even in domestic. Hopefully he can do something in psl

 

[Saj]

Was he injured at the time I think he should have been in the team? He got injured in 2015. So let's assume he was given a chance and remained healthy, you don't believe in them 4 years he would have done better than the likes of Younis, Asad,Amin,Imran Farhat,Kamran Akmal, Malik, just to name of the trash that was selected ahead of him for all those years.

I am Misbah fan but he has faults so I don't see why you need to defend him for everything. He has literally left us no youngsters in our LO teams. I refuse to believe in a country of 200 million there is no talent that if given a consistent run could prosper. Misbah making out as though there is no talent is something I refuse to believe.

Haris Sohail made his international debut in 2013, at the age of 24, 4 years ago. He wasn't exactly setting the world alight in his first few years in domestic cricket.

I don't need to defend Misbah. I criticise him when he deserves it. However what makes me chuckle is when people start criticising his selections and then you see the names of the possible replacements they are mentioning

 

[Hasan123]

Haris Sohail made his international debut in 201, at the age of 24, 3 - 4 years ago. He wasn't exactly setting the world alight in his first few years in domestic cricket.

I don't need to defend Misbah. I criticise him when he deserves it. However what makes me chuckle is when people start criticising his selections and then you see the names of the possible replacements they are mentioning

He made his international debut in 2013, this is 2 later than I think he should have. Even when he made his debut he was given 3/4 games than he dropped. How can you judge a player that quickly?

Harris sohail first class average is 51, so I don't get the thinking "he wasn't exactly setting the world alight" from.

He is 42 years old, how much longer can we stick by him? If you don't rate the players touted as replacements that's fine but soon or later Misbah is going to retire so we will have to relay on them. What's the use in sticking with Misbah? These overseas tours have exposed him as a batsmen. At least with a younger player there is a chance of improvement. A younger player will benefit more from international cricket than playing in our domestic cricket in which you don't improve on.

So laugh at the names being mentioned but it's what we have and it's time for Misbah to move on . There was a time when people thought Misbah wasn't good enough, when he got a consistent run in the side he performed well. Why can't the same happen for someone else?

 

[Seamer]

Asim Kamal and Ayub Dogar in tests

 

[Saj]

Harris sohail first class average is 51, so I don't get the thinking "he wasn't exactly setting the world alight" from.

First-class averages in Pakistan mean nothing. If they are that relevant we would have many world-class batsmen waiting in the wings. As I say Haris came to prominence close to 2013.

He is 42 years old, how much longer can we stick by him? If you don't rate the players touted as replacements that's fine but soon or later Misbah is going to retire so we will have to relay on them. What's the use in sticking with Misbah? These overseas tours have exposed him as a batsmen. At least with a younger player there is a chance of improvement. A younger player will benefit more from international cricket than playing in our domestic cricket in which you don't improve on.

So laugh at the names being mentioned but it's what we have and it's time for Misbah to move on . There was a time when people thought Misbah wasn't good enough, when he got a consistent run in the side he performed well. Why can't the same happen for someone else?

And show me where I have said Misbah shouldn't retire?

As I say, what makes me laugh are some of the names that are being mentioned here as players who were allegedly mistreated by Misbah and deliberately left out.

 

[Hasan123]

First-class averages in Pakistan mean nothing. If they are that relevant we would have many world-class batsmen waiting in the wings. As I say Haris came to prominence close to 2013.



And show me where I have said Misbah shouldn't retire?

As I say, what makes me laugh are some of the names that are being mentioned here as players who were allegedly mistreated by Misbah and deliberately left out.

I don't rate our domestic cricket at all, but what shall we judge our players off if there is no A tour? Why wa she dropped after 3 games than? Can you answer me that?


Okay that's fair enough, I think Harris Sohail was harshly treated. Not sure on others mentioned.

 

[Saj]

I don't rate our domestic cricket at all, but what shall we judge our players off if there is no A tour? Why wa she dropped after 3 games than? Can you answer me that?


Okay that's fair enough, I think Harris Sohail was harshly treated. Not sure on others mentioned.

I'm not a selector but it could have something to do with him scoring 26, 17, 1, 2, 11 and 3 in his first 6 innings for Pakistan.

Next I'll be hearing that Faisal Iqbal was mistreated!

 

[Rayyman]

The annoying part is him giving chances to his buddies: Hafeez, Tanvir, Zulfi, Ifti and co.

 

[Big Mac]

Talent in Pakistan is a bit like Schrödinger's Cat. Just like we have to treat the cat as being simultaneously alive and dead until the box is opened, we have to treat everyone in Pakistan's domestic circuit as being potentially world class until they are observed playing international cricket.

In this way, we can treat everyone who is out of the team as another one of the hundreds of potential ATG talents being wasted by Misbah.

Until they finally get an international cap and inevitably turn out to be rubbish, in which case the PP vocal minority dumps their golden boy faster than you can blink and moves onto the next Schrödinger's world class talent.

Umer Amin was so bad that he struggled in the Bham league. One of their players told me that he was on the verge of being dropped from the 1st team.

If MRSN is bigging him up then you can be fairly sure that he's not that good.

Poor Umar found out the hard way that we don't play around here in Birmingham, better bring your A game if you don't want to get exposed. [MENTION=46929]shaz619[/MENTION]

In 18 innings for Walsall, Umar Amin averaged 19.22 with the bat and just one fifty. He averaged 42.43 with the ball at a strike rate of 57.00.

Shame on Misbah for ignoring such a talent.

 

[Hasan123]

I'm not a selector but it could have something to do with him scoring 26, 17, 1, 2, 11 and 3 in his first 6 innings for Pakistan.

Next I'll be hearing that Faisal Iqbal was mistreated!

He made his debut vs West Indies in the 3rd odi, he scored 26 which isn't great but not exactly bad. In the next game which he played he didn't even bat, afridi was sent ahead of him. . Can you tell me how is that fair on a young batsmen that a all rounder who has nothing to prove is sent ahead of a player who needs international exposure and experience.

The score of 2 came against Zimbabwe when he was sent at 7 in the 41st over. He isn't a finisher so why was he sent in this position? He don't play the remaining 2 Odis, so how is that fair treatment that a new player is dropped after a low score in a position he doesn't bat in.

He didn't play any games vs Sri Lanka and South Africa, so how is this fair treatment. He has basically been given 2 chances at most so far.


He returned vs New Zealand in 2014 so after a year away he starts in a t20 game,That 11 came in a t20 game. Bit unfair to judge a player off a t20 game after a year away especially when it's not his strongest format. Also that 3 was in the next t20 so harsh to be critical.

Now after that we saw the Harris sohail that were all desperate to see back. Once he got a regular run in the side he started scoring and looking good at the crease. Only injury has halted his progress.


It's easy to post scores but you need to look at the context and situation. So can you tell me if he has been treated fairly or not?

After seeing all this, this is why I believe he has been treated harshly and unfairly by both Misbah and the selectors during this period. Once he got a consistent run in the side and a settled position he showed what he can do and has made Misbah and the selectors look stupid. Look at the trash that was selected in the period he wasn't. It takes more than 6 innings for young batsmen to learn and understand international cricket when they are coming from a rubbish domestic system like ours. Harris should have been given a run but for me he should have been our number 3 or 4 after the 2011 World Cup.

 

[Bewal Express]

Talent in Pakistan is a bit like Schrödinger's Cat. Just like we have to treat the cat as being simultaneously alive and dead until the box is opened, we have to treat everyone in Pakistan's domestic circuit as being potentially world class until they are observed playing international cricket.

In this way, we can treat everyone who is out of the team as another one of the hundreds of potential ATG talents being wasted by Misbah.

Until they finally get an international cap and inevitably turn out to be rubbish, in which case the PP vocal minority dumps their golden boy faster than you can blink and moves onto the next Schrödinger's world class talent.



If MRSN is bigging him up then you can be fairly sure that he's not that good.

Poor Umar found out the hard way that we don't play around here in Birmingham, better bring your A game if you don't want to get exposed. [MENTION=46929]shaz619[/MENTION]

In 18 innings for Walsall, Umar Amin averaged 19.22 with the bat and just one fifty. He averaged 42.43 with the ball at a strike rate of 57.00.

Shame on Misbah for ignoring such a talent.

I knew he was bad for Walsall but those stats are horrific. The funny thing was that their player told me he was ok at the start but he went to PK in the middle of the season and when he came back, he was awful and many players joked that he had sent his brother over and he stayed at home.

 

[Saj]

He made his debut vs West Indies in the 3rd odi, he scored 26 which isn't great but not exactly bad. In the next game which he played he didn't even bat, afridi was sent ahead of him. . Can you tell me how is that fair on a young batsmen that a all rounder who has nothing to prove is sent ahead of a player who needs international exposure and experience.

The score of 2 came against Zimbabwe when he was sent at 7 in the 41st over. He isn't a finisher so why was he sent in this position? He don't play the remaining 2 Odis, so how is that fair treatment that a new player is dropped after a low score in a position he doesn't bat in.

He didn't play any games vs Sri Lanka and South Africa, so how is this fair treatment. He has basically been given 2 chances at most so far.


He returned vs New Zealand in 2014 so after a year away he starts in a t20 game,That 11 came in a t20 game. Bit unfair to judge a player off a t20 game after a year away especially when it's not his strongest format. Also that 3 was in the next t20 so harsh to be critical.

Now after that we saw the Harris sohail that were all desperate to see back. Once he got a regular run in the side he started scoring and looking good at the crease. Only injury has halted his progress.


It's easy to post scores but you need to look at the context and situation. So can you tell me if he has been treated fairly or not?

After seeing all this, this is why I believe he has been treated harshly and unfairly by both Misbah and the selectors during this period. Once he got a consistent run in the side and a settled position he showed what he can do and has made Misbah and the selectors look stupid. Look at the trash that was selected in the period he wasn't. It takes more than 6 innings for young batsmen to learn and understand international cricket when they are coming from a rubbish domestic system like ours. Harris should have been given a run but for me he should have been our number 3 or 4 after the 2011 World Cup.

That's an awful lot of excuses.

 

[Hasan123]

That's an awful lot of excuses.

So if a player is asked to bat at 7 and scores 2 than is dropped, is that fair?

You are extremely harsh

 

[Officer Barbrady]

First-class averages in Pakistan mean nothing. If they are that relevant we would have many world-class batsmen waiting in the wings. As I say Haris came to prominence close to 2013.
.

Actually that's not true at all. FC batting averages are meaningful and perhaps the only averages that do mean something. Very few batsmen have averaged in the 50s and that average should almost automatically be reason to get opportunities in test cricket. The only players I can remember averaging in the 50s over a sustained period in pak domestic cricket in recent history are younis khan, misbah, fawad and haris.

It's bowling averages that are deflated and difficult to interpret.

 

[ask_analyse_act]

Harris sohail is one. He was discarded after a few games in the West Indies. He should have been a regular after the 2011 World Cup in place of Asad and Younis who were given multiple games.

Wonderful thread.. MISBAH in his tenure made many youngsters to make debuts and wash away..The list is very long.

• Umar Amin

He replaced out of form Jamshed and opened in SA for only 1 ODI did well too, then he never opened again. that was the famous series Pak won 2-1. I still remember his six on Philander's bouncer with excellent timing.. Also, he did avg 43 in that famous CT2013 debacle, but he is dropped in the next series..

• Hammad Azam

on his debut inns in WI when he was only 19 years old, came in at a tough time when half the batsmen are gone for less than 50 on board chasing only 170... Made a good promising partnership with MISBAH and steadied the ship and there was only 40 runs to score when he got out.. after this series, check when he next played and how many games did he lose, or is he even in the squad. You will find an answer.

• Asad Shafiq

as stated above on hammad azam, the same series from where u can see for how many matches shafiq get the no.3 spot. After this WI series, MISBAH tried MYK, his friend Azhar moving shafiq to open or no.4 brought shafiq's form down and he hit a complete low in ODIs and still not able to find his feet in LOIs, that is why still MOYO is still furious abt MISBAH messing up shafiq's batting.

• Maqsood

Yes Maqsood, made 2 fifties in his first 2 ODIs against a quality SA attack, he never batted at no.3 after that. Why? Yes for hafeez being steyn's bunny.

• Haris Sohail

Next is Haris Sohail. Hafeez getting banned for his bowling got us the emergence of Haris Sohail as a consistent selection and he proved his worth in one series (5 matches on the trot). If hafeez was not banned pak wouldnt have seen the brilliance of Haris Sohail at all, and he would have made the squad only after the 2015 CWC...

Many of them on MISBAH's tenure debuted showed good account of themselves. Has potential, showed promise, worthy of selection and always stayed above the rest (TTFs) who are already consistently playing in the team, but soon one after another were dropped down the batting order or dropped from squad to accommodate seniors in the team and to keep his captaincy from any threat...

 

[Hasan123]

Wonderful thread.. MISBAH in his tenure made many youngsters to make debuts and wash away..The list is very long.

• Umar Amin

He replaced out of form Jamshed and opened in SA for only 1 ODI did well too, then he never opened again. that was the famous series Pak won 2-1. I still remember his six on Philander's bouncer with excellent timing.. Also, he did avg 43 in that famous CT2013 debacle, but he is dropped in the next series..

• Hammad Azam

on his debut inns in WI when he was only 19 years old, came in at a tough time when half the batsmen are gone for less than 50 on board chasing only 170... Made a good promising partnership with MISBAH and steadied the ship and there was only 40 runs to score when he got out.. after this series, check when he next played and how many games did he lose, or is he even in the squad. You will find an answer.

• Asad Shafiq

as stated above on hammad azam, the same series from where u can see for how many matches shafiq get the no.3 spot. After this WI series, MISBAH tried MYK, his friend Azhar moving shafiq to open or no.4 brought shafiq's form down and he hit a complete low in ODIs and still not able to find his feet in LOIs, that is why still MOYO is still furious abt MISBAH messing up shafiq's batting.

• Maqsood

Yes Maqsood, made 2 fifties in his first 2 ODIs against a quality SA attack, he never batted at no.3 after that. Why? Yes for hafeez being steyn's bunny.

• Haris Sohail

Next is Haris Sohail. Hafeez getting banned for his bowling got us the emergence of Haris Sohail as a consistent selection and he proved his worth in one series (5 matches on the trot). If hafeez was not banned pak wouldnt have seen the brilliance of Haris Sohail at all, and he would have made the squad only after the 2015 CWC...

Many of them on MISBAH's tenure debuted showed good account of themselves. Has potential, showed promise, worthy of selection and always stayed above the rest (TTFs) who are already consistently playing in the team, but soon one after another were dropped down the batting order or dropped from squad to accommodate seniors in the team and to keep his captaincy from any threat...

Good list, forgot about Hammad was definitely treated very harshly

 

[ask_analyse_act]

Good list, forgot about Hammad was definitely treated very harshly

MISBAH never identify talents, groom them, giving chances.. Morever he has been a hinderance to any good performing youngster talent.. When he retire the team was in complete shambles..

India identify , pick, groom all their u19 wonders starting from Kaif, Yuvraj, Irfan, Kohli, Jadeja, etc..

But in the other hand Pak destroy players like Hammad, UA, shehzad, Umar Amin.. Hope they stop it otherwise Babar and Sami will fall into the same category... Only Sarfraz has been still in the line, dont forget how many times he was also in & out the squad, in & out of playing 11, didnt played in the CWC initially, then he was the century breaker for pak....

 

[Rayyman]

MISBAH never identify talents, groom them, giving chances.. Morever he has been a hinderance to any good performing youngster talent.. When he retire the team was in complete shambles..

India identify , pick, groom all their u19 wonders starting from Kaif, Yuvraj, Irfan, Kohli, Jadeja, etc..

But in the other hand Pak destroy players like Hammad, UA, shehzad, Umar Amin.. Hope they stop it otherwise Babar and Sami will fall into the same category... Only Sarfraz has been still in the line, dont forget how many times he was also in & out the squad, in & out of playing 11, didnt played in the CWC initially, then he was the century breaker for pak....

India, Australia, South Africa, Bangladesh, England, and Sri Lanka are always trying youngsters. But we on the other hand are always playing oldies. That's why those teams are going to be better than us. Because they are planning and thinking.

 

[Hasan123]

MISBAH never identify talents, groom them, giving chances.. Morever he has been a hinderance to any good performing youngster talent.. When he retire the team was in complete shambles..

India identify , pick, groom all their u19 wonders starting from Kaif, Yuvraj, Irfan, Kohli, Jadeja, etc..

But in the other hand Pak destroy players like Hammad, UA, shehzad, Umar Amin.. Hope they stop it otherwise Babar and Sami will fall into the same category... Only Sarfraz has been still in the line, dont forget how many times he was also in & out the squad, in & out of playing 11, didnt played in the CWC initially, then he was the century breaker for pak....

Misbah likes the stability model and sticking with a combination that is working. A young team won't win instantly and would mean taking a risk. Something which Misbah won't do, he prefers safety 1st option

 

[MMHS]

Wonderful thread.. MISBAH in his tenure made many youngsters to make debuts and wash away..The list is very long.

• Umar Amin

He replaced out of form Jamshed and opened in SA for only 1 ODI did well too, then he never opened again. that was the famous series Pak won 2-1. I still remember his six on Philander's bouncer with excellent timing.. Also, he did avg 43 in that famous CT2013 debacle, but he is dropped in the next series..

• Hammad Azam

on his debut inns in WI when he was only 19 years old, came in at a tough time when half the batsmen are gone for less than 50 on board chasing only 170... Made a good promising partnership with MISBAH and steadied the ship and there was only 40 runs to score when he got out.. after this series, check when he next played and how many games did he lose, or is he even in the squad. You will find an answer.

• Asad Shafiq

as stated above on hammad azam, the same series from where u can see for how many matches shafiq get the no.3 spot. After this WI series, MISBAH tried MYK, his friend Azhar moving shafiq to open or no.4 brought shafiq's form down and he hit a complete low in ODIs and still not able to find his feet in LOIs, that is why still MOYO is still furious abt MISBAH messing up shafiq's batting.

• Maqsood

Yes Maqsood, made 2 fifties in his first 2 ODIs against a quality SA attack, he never batted at no.3 after that. Why? Yes for hafeez being steyn's bunny.

• Haris Sohail

Next is Haris Sohail. Hafeez getting banned for his bowling got us the emergence of Haris Sohail as a consistent selection and he proved his worth in one series (5 matches on the trot). If hafeez was not banned pak wouldnt have seen the brilliance of Haris Sohail at all, and he would have made the squad only after the 2015 CWC...

Many of them on MISBAH's tenure debuted showed good account of themselves. Has potential, showed promise, worthy of selection and always stayed above the rest (TTFs) who are already consistently playing in the team, but soon one after another were dropped down the batting order or dropped from squad to accommodate seniors in the team and to keep his captaincy from any threat...

This is just batting list - real damage was done to young bowlers. More or less average age of Misbah's attack in any random match is close to 35. I can name at least half a dozen young bowlers not given chance or dropped prematurely for 12-15 years seniors - Sadaf, Pasha, Raja Hasan, Gohar, Sohail (given chance 5 years later), Adil, Zia, Yasir, Shahzaib ... - more discomforting is that during this period PAK called Cheema, Sami, Rauf, Tanvir (Ahmed), Zulfi .....

 

[msb314]

Just wondering which players would we have found in the team today and what outstanding talents would have been doing well today?

Faisal Iqbal comes to mind....

Fawad Alam, Haris Sohail (pre-2015), Umar Amin, Umar Akmal (tests), Asim Kamal, Khalid Latif (ODI's) and Maqsood.

 

[Sub-Zero]

I really hope Fawad Alam gets a chance in the test squad this year, Asif Zakir and Usman Salahuddin too

 

[Finisher]

could add Nasir Jamshed to the list.

I remember Misbah openly shifting the blame on Jamshed after the loss against windies.

Jamshed Was also dropped from the test team after he Had scored a decent 46 against Steyn and Co. whilst Hafeez was kept for his bowling when he couldn't even buy a run.

Umar Akmal for all his attitude problems etc got dropped at the wrong time in his test career.

 

[Junaids]

It's clearly Umar Akmal.

He was 21 years and and 2 months old when he played his last Test.

Yet he averaged 35.82 having played 15 of his 16 Tests outside Asia.

And his last 5 Test innings were not exactly disasters:

15
30
56
47
33

All in all, the expulsion of Umar Akmal from the squad has been a disaster. At the age of 21 he was a far more serious batsman than David Warner or Steve Smith or Virat Kohli, for example.

But 6 years of only being considered for selection in the shorter formats has made a perfectly good Test batsman evolve into a slogger like Afridi.

I have always found the exclusion of Umar Akmal to be an example of stupid self-harm based more on social class-based snobbery than anything else. And I still do.

 

[Junaids]

Umar Akmal's 5 most recent Test innings: 181 runs @ 36.20
Misbah's 5 most recent Test innings: 72 runs @ 14.40
Mohammad Hafeez's 5 most recent Test innings: 62 runs @ 12.40

If either the 42 year old averaging 14.40 or the 36 year old averaging 12.40 gets selected for the West Indies tour, you will know that the treatment of Umar Akmal - who scored a century in his last First Class innings - is a joke.

 

[Big Mac]

I knew he was bad for Walsall but those stats are horrific. The funny thing was that their player told me he was ok at the start but he went to PK in the middle of the season and when he came back, he was awful and many players joked that he had sent his brother over and he stayed at home.

Yeah. I'd have to double check but I think MoYo averaged in the twenties when he played here? Brum is not a place for bottlers

I think Shoaib Akhtar had a better batting average than MoYo and Umar Amin

 

[Syed1]

MISBAH never identify talents, groom them, giving chances.. Morever he has been a hinderance to any good performing youngster talent.. When he retire the team was in complete shambles..

India identify , pick, groom all their u19 wonders starting from Kaif, Yuvraj, Irfan, Kohli, Jadeja, etc..

But in the other hand Pak destroy players like Hammad, UA, shehzad, Umar Amin.. Hope they stop it otherwise Babar and Sami will fall into the same category... Only Sarfraz has been still in the line, dont forget how many times he was also in & out the squad, in & out of playing 11, didnt played in the CWC initially, then he was the century breaker for pak....

Don't forget Sarfaraz was made to bat at number 7 and 8 when he clearly wasn't a slogger while the likes of YK and Hafeez continued to occupy top order positions

 

[Junaids]

I really hope Fawad Alam gets a chance in the test squad this year, Asif Zakir and Usman Salahuddin too

I don't.

He's just far too old. You don't fix the problem of an elderly team by replacing very, very old batsmen with very old batsmen. Then you just make the same problem go on forever.

More to the point, Fawad Alam is in obvious decline. He fell to 22nd in this season's QEA batting records.

And lastly, you don't need a sixth batsman who can't bowl pace. You need to convert Misbah's position into one for a batsman who can bowl 10 overs pace per day - probably Hammad Azam.

 

[Speedster777]

Misbah, Hafeez, Azhar are mediocre players and highly insecure they have never allowed any young batsman with potential to settle in the top order. We're already at the bottom because of these guys. Until these guys are kicked out, no improvement is possible.

 

[Ellipsism]

Misbah, Hafeez, Azhar are mediocre players and highly insecure they have never allowed any young batsman with potential to settle in the top order. We're already at the bottom because of these guys. Until these guys are kicked out, no improvement is possible.

Which Rising Star were Misbah and Hafeez blocking? Care to mention any names?

Azhar is by a considerable margin our best test batsman and here your calling him mediocre

 

[marlonbrowndo]

It's clearly Umar Akmal.

He was 21 years and and 2 months old when he played his last Test.

Yet he averaged 35.82 having played 15 of his 16 Tests outside Asia.

And his last 5 Test innings were not exactly disasters:

15
30
56
47
33

All in all, the expulsion of Umar Akmal from the squad has been a disaster. At the age of 21 he was a far more serious batsman than David Warner or Steve Smith or Virat Kohli, for example.

But 6 years of only being considered for selection in the shorter formats has made a perfectly good Test batsman evolve into a slogger like Afridi.

I have always found the exclusion of Umar Akmal to be an example of stupid self-harm based more on social class-based snobbery than anything else. And I still do.

Agree with this. Why was he kept in the lower middle order despite an excellent start to his career in ODIs as well? Haris Sohail should've been given a consistent run much earlier as well

 

[MRSN]

OP is not doing that. You are inventing that in your head. Read that post again and answer what has been asked there.

you know what your OP is ironic since it was Haris Sohail who was dropped from the squad for recall of Faisal without even getting a game.
http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/s...opped-from-Test-side-without-getting-a-chance

 

[MRSN]

I'm not a selector but it could have something to do with him scoring 26, 17, 1, 2, 11 and 3 in his first 6 innings for Pakistan.

Next I'll be hearing that Faisal Iqbal was mistreated!

Did you even watch those series? you are doing no better than Pakistani selectors who judge players based on cricinfo stats rather than watching the games. I don't think you even remember the kind of situations was Harris Sohail was made to bat in West Indies.

 

[MRSN]

Umer Amin was so bad that he struggled in the Bham league. One of their players told me that he was on the verge of being dropped from the 1st team.

so Bham league is the criteria now. Not that the poor guy worked hard and was among top leading run scorer in the Pakistan's biggest fc tournament. Still baffled by how he got benched for two games against Australia. Got one game and was out of the team so all his hard work had come to an end after just one game against Australia series in which other Pakistani batsmen failed too.

 

[Dr_Bassim]

The biggest delusion I find in this thread not unsurprisingly comes from people who blame external factors CONSISTENTLY for Umar Akmal's stupidness.

Next I'll be hearing that Umar Akmal would have been close to Tendulkar had he been given a fair run.

These fantasies need to stop.

 

[Khan12]

The biggest delusion I find in this thread not unsurprisingly comes from people who blame external factors CONSISTENTLY for Umar Akmal's stupidness.

Next I'll be hearing that Umar Akmal would have been close to Tendulkar had he been given a fair run.

These fantasies need to stop.

Don't like umer akmal what so ever but it was unfair to drop at that time.

 

[omorst7]

OUTSTANDING TALENT!!!!!! It would be fair, if the word TATALENTED was used!!! Because if one have real outstanding talent!!! It will be flourish!!! No matter how small opportunity he got!! Samething can't be said for the average taleneted people!!!

 

[Syed1]

The biggest delusion I find in this thread not unsurprisingly comes from people who blame external factors CONSISTENTLY for Umar Akmal's stupidness.

Next I'll be hearing that Umar Akmal would have been close to Tendulkar had he been given a fair run.

These fantasies need to stop.

Not talking about Umar Akmal but in general. Misbah the saviour often made young talented batsman bat at numbers 6-7 so that his buddies could have top order positions.

You might be the best doctor out there but if you are asked to be a car mechanic you may fail and fail consistently.

This is sort of what happened when Maqsood, Sohail etc were made to bat at 7 and below by Misbah the great.

 

[Asim2Good]

In Umar akmal case, ppl forgetting that he himself came into bad books of PCB at that time.
When there were calls of Kamran Akmal to be dropped, but Umar was pushing was his brother selection otherwise he ll not play ( something like that)

 

[MRSN]

In Umar akmal case, ppl forgetting that he himself came into bad books of PCB at that time.
When there were calls of Kamran Akmal to be dropped, but Umar was pushing was his brother selection otherwise he ll not play ( something like that)

myths and there are plenty of them when ti comes to Umar Akmal.

 

[Asim2Good]

myths and there are plenty of them when ti comes to Umar Akmal.

I was able to find something on that issue.

Brothers Kamran and Umar Akmal have appealed against punishments imposed by the Pakistan Cricket Board (PCB).

The PCB had fined Kamran, 28, three million rupees (£23,590) and Umar, 19, two million rupees (£15,720), and also put them on six months' probation.

The charges related to their conduct on Pakistan's tour of Australia, in which the team lost all nine matches.

"The Akmals have filed appeals, so an independent arbitrator will deal with this," said the PCB's Tafazzul Rizvi.

The Akmal brothers were penalised along with several other members of the Pakistani squad, following the PCB's inquiry into the poor performance in Australia.

The Akmals' punishments centre upon the third Test in Hobart, a match wicketkeeper Kamran publicly insisted he would be selected for, despite being previously dropped from the side.

Umar meanwhile, was alleged to have feigned an injury to skip the Test in protest at his brother's withdrawal - though he did in fact play.

Twenty20 captain Shahid Afridi, who was also fined three million rupees and put on six months probation for "bringing the game and the country into disrepute" over ball-tampering, will not appeal against the decision.

"Afridi did not appeal but wrote a letter to PCB chairman Ijaz Butt to review the fine," said Tafazzul Rizvi, legal adviser to the Pakistan Cricket Board.

Former captains Mohammad Yousuf and Younus Khan, who were banned indefinitely from representing their country following infighting on a preceding tour of the United Arab Emirates, have not appealed against the PCB's decision. Younus however did ask for "clarification on his punishment".

Batsman Shoaib Malik and bowler Rana Naved-ul-Hasan, banned for one year and fined two million rupees each for their conduct, also failed to appeal.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/cricket/other_international/pakistan/8607507.stm

 

[MRSN]

Umar Akmal is not the only player that was affected by Misbah own cooked ODI batting strategy. Sharjeel,Shahzaib,Maqsood suffered the same fate. Shehzad also only stayed in the team when he started playing more dots than hitting more shots.

 

[ask_analyse_act]

Don't forget Sarfaraz was made to bat at number 7 and 8 when he clearly wasn't a slogger while the likes of YK and Hafeez continued to occupy top order positions

Of course, he failed to build a team even after 4 years of captaincy with his constant logic of supporting players who are seniors and play his style/brand of cricket which are, see off the new-ball, occupying the crease without making any runs...

with his style of play few times pak were well placed at 150/3 in 35 overs and 190/4 in 44 overs, MISBAH would be batting with 53(85) but still cant make 250 as he would get out at 64(90)....he was lucky to have the ajmal, afridi, hafeez as spin trio and the UAE tours, if not his stats would be even worse...

 

[ask_analyse_act]

This is just batting list - real damage was done to young bowlers. More or less average age of Misbah's attack in any random match is close to 35. I can name at least half a dozen young bowlers not given chance or dropped prematurely for 12-15 years seniors - Sadaf, Pasha, Raja Hasan, Gohar, Sohail (given chance 5 years later), Adil, Zia, Yasir, Shahzaib ... - more discomforting is that during this period PAK called Cheema, Sami, Rauf, Tanvir (Ahmed), Zulfi .....

not really the bowling, he had the spin web of ajmal, afridi and hafeez to control the bowling... later Irfan and Junaid gave good support especially during M.akram as bowling coach....batting , dot-balls , SR has always been the issue.... with pakistan's bowling they dont need 300+ and 350+ scores to defend... 260-270 is always enough for them when they had the good backing of their bowling... With MISBAH pak always 30-40 runs short, as they avg between 220-235 is too much to ask from the bowlers to defend in this modern day game as it is dominated by bats, power hitting and batsmen..

 

[ask_analyse_act]

Misbah likes the stability model and sticking with a combination that is working. A young team won't win instantly and would mean taking a risk. Something which Misbah won't do, he prefers safety 1st option

it is delusional that he stuck with a combo that is working... this ideology thrived from tests where he had time to bat... In ODIs he never stick with a combo, he always looked for a permanent spots to fix for seniors moving around the newbies, even if they outperform the seniors.. MISBAH and his no.3 we can write a book...

MISBAH sticking with a combo , let me list down who all he played at no.3 except himself in ODIs....

asad shafiq
MYK
ASAD again
azhar ali
MYK again
asad again
Maqsood
Hafeez
Haris

he constantly chopped the no.3 nearly every 2 series, I'm saying this without even looking at the statistics...

 

[ask_analyse_act]

India, Australia, South Africa, Bangladesh, England, and Sri Lanka are always trying youngsters. But we on the other hand are always playing oldies. That's why those teams are going to be better than us. Because they are planning and thinking.

Impatient fans are also a reason for this... They want the youngster beauties to bat like Clarke and KP from day one and expand their game in 1 or 2 series and play like sachin and ponting from their 3rd series...

 

[MMHS]

Misbah as batsman of ODI team actually made the team on merit - he left ODI team, when he could have merited a spot in that line-up that lost 3-0 & 3-2 in UAE, won 1 meaningful match in WC & then lost 3-0 in BD by innings margin in an ODI .... He was easily among the best ODI batsmen in 2012-13 period & his record outside Asia defies every batting logic that we can discuss here.

My only objection for his ODI team (apart from his Captaincy, which to be honest since Wasim Akram had been more or less same - may be for few matches Malik & YK were different), is that he made that ODI team almost obsolete in any context of any era. At one point PAK had MoHa, Ahmed, Asad, Misbah, Fawad .... in top 5 or at least 4 of those 5 & sometimes Azhar, Malik as well - this team won't work even in 1960s, when they started Gillette Cup in Counties.

He liked players with steady approach & play for a respectable score (which will result in respectable defeat) & categorically started to drop players with flair & aggressive game. There are very few in history who can bat aggressively & still won't get out to rash shots - therefore, Umar, Maqsood, Jamshed, Nazir, Amin ... were a bit hard done by - particularly Umar, who didn't deserve that treatment. I can recall an ODI against Poms (when they won 4-0), when Umar played a fantastic 60+ & almost won a match from extremely tight corner - then he got out trying to clear point on a squire cut of a widish ball - both Misbah & Mohsin were upset & Umar was made to sit at a corner (probably got dropped next match) - this is absolutely wrong treatment to a natural stroke-maker, which'll make him confused & insecure. It's like asking Sehwag - don't get out (rather than asking him to score runs). This is just one example - I don't have the time to analyze match by match, but the pattern is very much similar.

To a certain extent, I do believe that Misbah deliberately picked teams/players that justified his own game - it covered his limitations. I heard him once to say that, I come at 20/2 & then if I leave at 220 - team is all out for 240 ... something like that; which was true to a certain extent, BUT that didn't make him to change his squad - he was happy to play same team & continue his own game, which justified his batting strategy perfectly - Misbah the savior of a pathetic batting unit. I wonder, why he didn't come to No. 3 & take things at own hand or drop down to No. 6 & allow players like Maqsood, Umar, Amin or Haris to try (& fail, if so) from No. 3/4?

Advocating Azhar for ODI Captaincy is a perfect example of his limited vision - he never thought of ODI game beyond his model & in that regard, he wanted his successor as a mirror image of himself - it's like every father wants his son to represent him once he leaves the world. Which tells me that, he thought what he was doing (or his strategy) was right for PAK team & should continue - from there I can tell that without Arthur; SK, Babar, Imad, Umar won't have been part of PAK ODI team for long.

 

[Rayyman]

Misbah as batsman of ODI team actually made the team on merit - he left ODI team, when he could have merited a spot in that line-up that lost 3-0 & 3-2 in UAE, won 1 meaningful match in WC & then lost 3-0 in BD by innings margin in an ODI .... He was easily among the best ODI batsmen in 2012-13 period & his record outside Asia defies every batting logic that we can discuss here.

My only objection for his ODI team (apart from his Captaincy, which to be honest since Wasim Akram had been more or less same - may be for few matches Malik & YK were different), is that he made that ODI team almost obsolete in any context of any era. At one point PAK had MoHa, Ahmed, Asad, Misbah, Fawad .... in top 5 or at least 4 of those 5 & sometimes Azhar, Malik as well - this team won't work even in 1960s, when they started Gillette Cup in Counties.

He liked players with steady approach & play for a respectable score (which will result in respectable defeat) & categorically started to drop players with flair & aggressive game. There are very few in history who can bat aggressively & still won't get out to rash shots - therefore, Umar, Maqsood, Jamshed, Nazir, Amin ... were a bit hard done by - particularly Umar, who didn't deserve that treatment. I can recall an ODI against Poms (when they won 4-0), when Umar played a fantastic 60+ & almost won a match from extremely tight corner - then he got out trying to clear point on a squire cut of a widish ball - both Misbah & Mohsin were upset & Umar was made to sit at a corner (probably got dropped next match) - this is absolutely wrong treatment to a natural stroke-maker, which'll make him confused & insecure. It's like asking Sehwag - don't get out (rather than asking him to score runs). This is just one example - I don't have the time to analyze match by match, but the pattern is very much similar.

To a certain extent, I do believe that Misbah deliberately picked teams/players that justified his own game - it covered his limitations. I heard him once to say that, I come at 20/2 & then if I leave at 220 - team is all out for 240 ... something like that; which was true to a certain extent, BUT that didn't make him to change his squad - he was happy to play same team & continue his own game, which justified his batting strategy perfectly - Misbah the savior of a pathetic batting unit. I wonder, why he didn't come to No. 3 & take things at own hand or drop down to No. 6 & allow players like Maqsood, Umar, Amin or Haris to try (& fail, if so) from No. 3/4?

Advocating Azhar for ODI Captaincy is a perfect example of his limited vision - he never thought of ODI game beyond his model & in that regard, he wanted his successor as a mirror image of himself - it's like every father wants his son to represent him once he leaves the world. Which tells me that, he thought what he was doing (or his strategy) was right for PAK team & should continue - from there I can tell that without Arthur; SK, Babar, Imad, Umar won't have been part of PAK ODI team for long.

This never happened.

 

[MMHS]

This never happened.

I can recall the incident, but may be not against ENG, may be against SRL or SAF - but, it was in UAE & when Mohsin was in charge - may be as Coach or CS.

 

[MMHS]

not really the bowling, he had the spin web of ajmal, afridi and hafeez to control the bowling... later Irfan and Junaid gave good support especially during M.akram as bowling coach....batting , dot-balls , SR has always been the issue.... with pakistan's bowling they dont need 300+ and 350+ scores to defend... 260-270 is always enough for them when they had the good backing of their bowling... With MISBAH pak always 30-40 runs short, as they avg between 220-235 is too much to ask from the bowlers to defend in this modern day game as it is dominated by bats, power hitting and batsmen..

Then why batting is the problem? His batsmen were scoring runs in Test & ODI as well. 30-40 short fall is just the context - same bowlers are conceding 50/60 more - so what was 260 now is 310 (check the average economy of PAK team then & now). PAK was just about 30-40 short in AUS recently & barring one ODI, in ENG as well - just about 30-40. Modern ODI game is nothing much different than 40 years back - just the KPI's have changed. People can't compare relative stats with the changing context hence thinks that Azhar Ali would have been successful in 80s - when Allen Border had 30/65 stats & Gordon Grineedge had a SR of 60. This 38/75 stats of Azhar would have been 25/50 then - same, obsolete in a game that's limited by balls - because, then his first 35 balls would have earned 12 (instead of 23 like now). Just one example of Misbah's batting philosophy.

More than batting, Misbah's regime has cost PAK bowling more - you have to look it beyond obvious. It has done -

1. Taken average age of the bowlers by 5+ years. In UAE, there are half a dozen bowlers (spinners) in PAK that'll will take loads of wickets against non Asian sides - that doesn't mean one will keep backing 2 spinners in their 40s, when there are younger & fitter options available. Mockery is that, same guy thinks he should keep playing till his 50s as long as fitness is there - but that didn't apply for Ajmal & Babar. This guy Sohail Khan should have been PAK starter in 2011 & there are many other younger options - Hasan Ali would have been same case had he been 6 years older.

2. It had taken the core, the life out of PAK cricket. Just about 10 years back, if you have asked anyone that PAK team is planing 35 overs of spin in an ODI or opening with spinners in a Test or ODI ......

3. The batting short-fall is self created - he never promoted all-rounders, who could replace his specialist bowlers & increase hitting ability. I don't know where could have Hammad or Yamin could have ended, but this guy Imad is lucky that his number came when Misbah had retired.

 

[Rayyman]

I can recall the incident, but may be not against ENG, may be against SRL or SAF - but, it was in UAE & when Mohsin was in charge - may be as Coach or CS.

Never got caught at point.

 

[MMHS]

Never got caught at point.

Or mid off, can't recall, but it was in inner circle trying to clear the fielder after hitting few boundaries. The fact remains same - discouraging aggressive batting - we all know that, pushing singles are the key or ODI, but that attempt should not end in 4/5 dots.

 

[Rayyman]

Or mid off, can't recall, but it was in inner circle trying to clear the fielder after hitting few boundaries. The fact remains same - discouraging aggressive batting - we all know that, pushing singles are the key or ODI, but that attempt should not end in 4/5 dots.

Misbah's mentality worked back then. Once in a while.

 

[MMHS]

Misbah's mentality worked back then. Once in a while.

It never worked, I explained that in my earlier post - it looked the only way, because PAK never tried something else. What we see is only one side of the coin, always - that Asia Cup Final at Dhaka (Against SRL) is just an example of how flawed it was.

Win in IND, SAF & WI are out comes - it could have been better as well with a different strategy & combination, you never know. But, what it evident is constant decline in ranking from top 3 to bottom 3 over a 5 years period.

 

[Haroon786]

Or mid off, can't recall, but it was in inner circle trying to clear the fielder after hitting few boundaries. The fact remains same - discouraging aggressive batting - we all know that, pushing singles are the key or ODI, but that attempt should not end in 4/5 dots.

Think it was vs SL in late 2011 in UAE, he made like 90 or 91 and had scored 3 consecutive boundaries and tried to clear mid off but got caught instead. As we all know Afridi the best batsman under pressure was next and then proceeded to win the match for the Lankans with a collapse of the tail.

 

[Hasan123]

it is delusional that he stuck with a combo that is working... this ideology thrived from tests where he had time to bat... In ODIs he never stick with a combo, he always looked for a permanent spots to fix for seniors moving around the newbies, even if they outperform the seniors.. MISBAH and his no.3 we can write a book...

MISBAH sticking with a combo , let me list down who all he played at no.3 except himself in ODIs....

asad shafiq
MYK
ASAD again
azhar ali
MYK again
asad again
Maqsood
Hafeez
Haris

he constantly chopped the no.3 nearly every 2 series, I'm saying this without even looking at the statistics...

Hafeez,Malik , Younis, and Asad got long roped. The bowling attack was hardly changed though. Irfan, ajmal,Wahab, junaid we're persisted with. A young spinner and all rounder should have been groomed.

 

[Junaids]

The biggest delusion I find in this thread not unsurprisingly comes from people who blame external factors CONSISTENTLY for Umar Akmal's stupidness.

Next I'll be hearing that Umar Akmal would have been close to Tendulkar had he been given a fair run.

These fantasies need to stop.

He was 21 years and and 2 months old when he played his last Test.

Yet he averaged 35.82 having played 15 of his 16 Tests outside Asia.

And his last 5 Test innings were not exactly disasters:

15
30
56
47
33

Sure, Umar Akmal is not Einstein. But Dave Warner is not the sharpest tool in the shed either.

The bottom line is that in Umar Akmal's final five Tests before being dropped, he had scores of:

6 & 79 not out
4 & did not bat (his only Test innings in Asia ever)
33 & 47
56 & 30
15 and Did Not Bat

So Umar Akmal was dropped after the following output in his last five Tests:


5 Tests
8 Innings, 1 not out
270 runs at an average of 38.57

Why are you not scandalized by the dropping of a 21 year old who averaged 38.57 in his last 5 Tests, 4 of which were outside Asia?

It's outrageous.

 

[Junaids]

I would add - has Umar Akmal even "lost it?

UMAR AKMAL IN AUSTRALIA 2009-10
5 matches
5 innings, no Not Out
187 runs @ 37.40
Strike Rate 71.37

UMAR AKMAL IN AUSTRALIA 2016-17
5 matches
5 innings, 1 not out
131 runs @ 32.75
Strike Rate 82.38

I'm not even convinced that Umar Akmal is in decline. I think he has had years of exclusion and marginalization, but he and Babar Azam are the most promising batsmen you have had for years.

And he is still 3 years younger than Mike Hussey was when he made his Test debut.