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Who is the best player of swing/seam bowling?

Wasim Akram rated Martin Crowe, Jacques Kallis and Sunil Gavaskar as among the best batsmen he has ever bowled to.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Can you tell me someone who was clearly better than Dravid once he debuted?
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Smith, Gibbs, MoYo and SRT comes in my mind but I think Dravid was probably better than them in swinging conditions.

Also, this better or worse depends on how you look at it. If you are looking for players who can attack and defend both then SRT is simply better than anyone else in swinging conditions. I won't read too much into his last tour of Eng. I have seen enough of his batting in swinging conditions before his decline.
 
Scrolln said:
While Dravid did exceedingly well against Anderson, he was all at sea against Wasim (arguably the greatest swing bowler ever) . So i don't think you can call him the greatest ever against swing.

This is the first video that pops up when you search 'Dravid swing' on youtube -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlILHkJakv8
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Every batsman has found himself at sea some time or the other against great bowlers. Other wise every great batsman would make a 100 or 200 every time he goes to bat. This is why we assess the entire career of batsmen, not assess their worth based on 3 minute clippings.
 
It's a lousy field, and Kohli, Smith and Williamson are especially poor in this area.

I would say Joe Root and AB De Villiers. Chris Rogers was pretty good too until he retired.
 
One of: Renshaw, Latham, Elgar, Raval, Azhar, Vijay, Sami, and Brathwaite.
 
Hashim Amla, before age caught up with him, was outstanding against lateral movement of any kind. Every great spinner of his era had been neutralized at one point or another at their home venue and his game against the pacers was ever better.

Kane Williamson is the best against swing and seam at the moment.
 
Rahane,Rahul and R. Ashwin from India.
Rahane along with Smith the best in the world.
 
Bilal7 said:
Hashim Amla, before age caught up with him, was outstanding against lateral movement of any kind. Every great spinner of his era had been neutralized at one point or another at their home venue and his game against the pacers was ever better.

Kane Williamson is the best against swing and seam at the moment.
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Sorry, but Williamson is horrible against lateral movement.

He plays with hard hands and little footwork.
 
Probably Amla from the current lot I would say, before the recent struggles that is. Gets right behind it and most importantly knows when to leave the ball.
 
Dravid has to be the best ever . Just watch his 3 hundreds in the last 2011 tour of England .
 
Ellipsism said:
Renshaw, Latham, Elgar, Raval and Brathwaite... is this some joke.
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Elgar and Latham are really good. That much should be obvious.

Renshaw and Raval were pretty good v.s. Pak. It remains to be seen how they perform against others.

Brathwaite is overlooked as he plays for a poor team.
 
Rayyman said:
Elgar and Latham are really good. That much should be obvious.

Renshaw and Raval were pretty good v.s. Pak. It remains to be seen how they perform against others.

Brathwaite is overlooked as he plays for a poor team.
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Latham is decent again seam/swing, but by no means is he any where near the best. The same applies for Elgar.

Ans since when is performing against Pakistan a parameter to show how good a player is against lateral movement? Pakistan currently has one of the worst Test attacks in world cricket.
 
Haz95 said:
People are always saying 'the real test is vs SA in SA' and other nonsense like that but when something like facing Rehman And Ajmal in UAE isn't(for a non subcontinental batsman). So swing lovers, who's the best player of swing you've ever seen and who is currently? :wasim :asif
out of any of the test playing nations...
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Azhar Ali is certainly the best batsman in difficult seaming and swing conditions
 
lol old threads being bumped. There's no clear cut winner here so honourable mentions to Root, Williamson, Latham, Smith, Sami Aslam, Cook, Rahane and Azhar Ali.


I also see how highly Pujara was rated...if he continued how he did when I made this thread, I'd struggle to see how he wouldn't be the best batsman in the world.
 
Joe root currently.

Dravid in the recent past but neither face fast pitches or really great bowling attacks.

By far the best play against swing/seam at pace, left hand right hand, orthodox swing and reverse swing against the best attack of it's time in conditions to suit that attack were by....

Alec Stuart against Pakistani pace masters in 1992 and 1996. Made god knows how many half centuries on the trot when the likes of gower, gooch and botham looked liked rookies.
 
We use to say The big man Inzimam ul Haq is the best player against Pace bowling along with him i think Amla did well.

When we talk about swing and seam bowling then we must compare openers or one down batsman because the lower order batsman didn't face much of swing and seam in current era.
 
Abid Z said:
Joe root currently.

Dravid in the recent past but neither face fast pitches or really great bowling attacks.

By far the best play against swing/seam at pace, left hand right hand, orthodox swing and reverse swing against the best attack of it's time in conditions to suit that attack were by....

Alec Stuart against Pakistani pace masters in 1992 and 1996. Made god knows how many half centuries on the trot when the likes of gower, gooch and botham looked liked rookies.
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Yes i remember it. He is on top at that time.
 
khurram39 said:
We use to say The big man Inzimam ul Haq is the best player against Pace bowling along with him i think Amla did well.

When we talk about swing and seam bowling then we must compare openers or one down batsman because the lower order batsman didn't face much of swing and seam in current era.
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Really? I mean you're serious?
 
England and South African players in general.

Gibbs, Trescothick, Robin Smith, Stewart, Cronje, are were good. Trott was excellent before 2013.

Root is the best at the moment but he doesn't score big too often. Amla and Cook were probably even better at their peaks.

Graeme Smith and Dravid have been the preeminent players of swing since 2000. Yousuf is the best among Pakistanis while Atapattu among Sri Lankans. Chris Rogers looked ugly but he had a workable and effective way of playing. Similar to Langer. Mark Taylor was probably most comfortable against lateral movement among Australians.
 
jusarrived said:
it should not in Tests . Shewag is twice as good as any other batsmen in that case .
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Yes its not. A Pujara 200 (500 balls) was worth more than Sehwag 150 (100) for the sole reason Pujara can control the innings better and stitch up partnerships unlike a swashbuckling player who can thrash everyone and then get out leaving the others to carry it forward (SR does have its tremendous uses at times).

But when comparing against complete players who can match Dravid in any conditions and can also take charge, lack of dominance counts against him.

I feel Dravid was India's best when it came to pure swing.
 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Yes its not. A Pujara 200 (500 balls) was worth more than Sehwag 150 (100) for the sole reason Pujara can control the innings better and stitch up partnerships unlike a swashbuckling player who can thrash everyone and then get out leaving the others to carry it forward (SR does have its tremendous uses at times).

But when comparing against complete players who can match Dravid in any conditions and can also take charge, lack of dominance counts against him.

I feel Dravid was India's best when it came to pure swing.
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You are back! Where were you these 12-14 days? I can tell you that your posts were missed a lot given how entertaining the current home series is going on.
 
Ab Fan said:
You are back! Where were you these 12-14 days? I can tell you that your posts were missed a lot given how entertaining the current home series is going on.
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Thanks for the kind words man. Have been really busy.

May not post in the upcoming days too. Or maybe I will try to. :D
 
Tendulkar was the best Asian batsman on such pitches.

Overall, it will be someone from Australia, England, or SA.
 
It's hard to name one, but some batsman that looked quite confortable: Trott, Ricky Ponting, Kallis, Amla.
Cook also very good against medium pace swing bowling, not that good when it's swinging In the 140's.
 
Every batsman struggles against swing bowling. No batsman mastered by art of playing swing bowling

 
sensible-indian-fan said:
Yes its not. A Pujara 200 (500 balls) was worth more than Sehwag 150 (100) for the sole reason Pujara can control the innings better and stitch up partnerships unlike a swashbuckling player who can thrash everyone and then get out leaving the others to carry it forward (SR does have its tremendous uses at times).

But when comparing against complete players who can match Dravid in any conditions and can also take charge, lack of dominance counts against him.

I feel Dravid was India's best when it came to pure swing.
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And that player is ? The 2011 series the way Dravid handled extreme swinging conditions , you are tellimg me there are players who can do that as well and score at a faster rate ? Thats just a theory . I know there are players who can score faster than Dravid , but not when it swings .
 
Mobashir said:
It's hard to name one, but some batsman that looked quite confortable: Trott, Ricky Ponting, Kallis, Amla.
Cook also very good against medium pace swing bowling, not that good when it's swinging In the 140's.
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Some times I wonder you ever watch a match live ? Ponting was extremely weak against swing . Amla isnt exactly top tier , neither was trott or cook . Kallis was good .
 
jusarrived said:
And that player is ? The 2011 series the way Dravid handled extreme swinging conditions , you are tellimg me there are players who can do that as well and score at a faster rate ? Thats just a theory . I know there are players who can score faster than Dravid , but not when it swings .
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Players like Sachin, Lara can match Dravid in any conditions and score faster.

Check out the rate of scoring of theirs in countries like Aus, SA and NZ compared to Dravid. Even in England, they should be having higher SR. Players like Ponting, Pietersen, Clarke, Laxman can play swing/seam bowling and score quickly too as and when the situation demands it.

Dravid's style of batting was precisely why he couldn't make it count as much against ATG attacks cos he was too slow and the attacks were too good to let him get away with it.

I really don't understand what we are debating here. I have said Dravid is our best bat against pure swing but against complete swing/seam bowling, his inability to dominate does go against him at times.
 
jusarrived said:
Some times I wonder you ever watch a match live ? Ponting was extremely weak against swing . Amla isnt exactly top tier , neither was trott or cook . Kallis was good .
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Lol. Amla has been a better batsman against swing and seam than Dravid. What's Dravid's average in South Africa?
 
For seam and swing:

Kane Williamson right now
before him Hashim Amla (especially swing)
and before him Rahul Dravid
 
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