Why do IPL products excel in Test cricket, whereas PSL products struggle in the format?

[FearlessRoar]

Have you noticed how India has been consistently producing players who excel in both T20s and Test cricket, while Pakistan seems to fall short when it comes to the longer format?

Take players like Yashasvi Jaiswal, Shubman Gill, and Rishabh Pant as examples. These players have shone in the IPL and transitioned beautifully to Test cricket. One of the biggest reasons for this is India’s strong domestic structure. The Ranji Trophy provides a tough platform where players develop the temperament and skills needed for the red-ball game. This is supported by the IPL, which isn’t just about entertainment but also a training ground where young talent learns to handle pressure, face world-class bowlers, and improve their fitness and adaptability—qualities that are invaluable in Test cricket. On top of that, Indian players benefit from excellent mentorship, with coaches like Rahul Dravid and Ravi Shastri guiding them to evolve from T20 stars into Test performers.

In contrast, Pakistan struggles to replicate this success. While players like Shaheen Shah Afridi, Saim Ayub, and Haider Ali have performed well in the PSL, they’ve been inconsistent in Test cricket. A weak domestic structure is one of the major reasons for this. The Quaid-e-Azam Trophy lacks the competitiveness needed to prepare players for the challenges of Test cricket. For example, in the ongoing Quaid-e-Azam Trophy 2024, most games have finished before Day 4, which means Pakistani players miss out on crucial red-ball experience. To make things worse, frequent changes in the coaching staff disrupt continuity and deny young players the steady mentorship they need to develop. Adding to these challenges is Pakistan’s over-reliance on the PSL, which overshadows red-ball cricket and leaves players unprepared for the patience and technical demands of Test cricket.

What do you think Pakistan should prioritize to fix this issue—domestic cricket, coaching, or a new approach to red-ball cricket? Do you feel that the PSL’s popularity is overshadowing other formats in Pakistan? And is the gap between the two countries’ cricket systems becoming too wide to close?

 

[FearlessRoar]

Polls added

 

[big_gamer007]

IPL products grind in domestics as well.
Indian domestic season is probably the toughest on par with county if not better.

Pakistani domestic circuit isn’t any good and never has been. Even the old greats of Pakistan cricket all honed their skills in county.
Now money is in T20 leagues and not in county so Pakistani players go and play random leagues for big bucks instead of grinding season after season in county circuit. That’s why they will always struggle in tests.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

They didn't transition from IPL to test lol look at their FC stats and how much they play.

 

[The Bald Eagle]

IPL products grind in domestics as well.
Indian domestic season is probably the toughest on par with county if not better.

Pakistani domestic circuit isn’t any good and never has been. Even the old greats of Pakistan cricket all honed their skills in county.
Now money is in T20 leagues and not in county so Pakistani players go and play random leagues for big bucks instead of grinding season after season in county circuit. That’s why they will always struggle in tests.

Pakistani products once get selected for the national side, feel embarrassed to even feature in domestic circuit

 

[Rajdeep]

As mentioned in another thread, Indian main players only play in IPL for money but most takes pride in test cricket. There are exceptions like Pandya, Dhoni etc but most love performing in test matches. Also, BCCI is very strict about performance in red ball cricket.

PSL boys, bcoz they get paid less, want to maximise their earnings by playing leagues all around the world. So they don't want the hardships of test cricket and want to keep their body fit for pyjama leagues.

 

[gani999]

The BCCI puts a very big emphasis on participation and performance in first class leagues like the Ranji and Duleep trophies. No way any Indian player can stick only to T20s and IPL if he wants a cricketing career in India. Everyone is expected to play all formats. It is this policy that has yielded dividends.

BCCI has shown what local leagues can do if they have the support and encouragement of the powers that be.

 

[Farhan The Man]

Difference is self-confidence vs. belief in divine miracles to make something happen.

When you repeatedly pay homage to god on a sports field both verbally and physically, you create a false sense in your own mind of somehow cheating your way to the top. You don't then put in the grueling effort that others do.

pakistani cricketer mindset works against worldly nature of this sport.

 

[Kianig89]

Ravi Shastri 's commentary seems to be the reason. He really motivates the players and push them unlike the mundane and monotonous Pakistani commentators who have no clue on domestic players

 

[Farabi]

Have you noticed how India has been consistently producing players who excel in both T20s and Test cricket, while Pakistan seems to fall short when it comes to the longer format?

Take players like Yashasvi Jaiswal, Shubman Gill, and Rishabh Pant as examples. These players have shone in the IPL and transitioned beautifully to Test cricket. One of the biggest reasons for this is India’s strong domestic structure. The Ranji Trophy provides a tough platform where players develop the temperament and skills needed for the red-ball game. This is supported by the IPL, which isn’t just about entertainment but also a training ground where young talent learns to handle pressure, face world-class bowlers, and improve their fitness and adaptability—qualities that are invaluable in Test cricket. On top of that, Indian players benefit from excellent mentorship, with coaches like Rahul Dravid and Ravi Shastri guiding them to evolve from T20 stars into Test performers.

In contrast, Pakistan struggles to replicate this success. While players like Shaheen Shah Afridi, Saim Ayub, and Haider Ali have performed well in the PSL, they’ve been inconsistent in Test cricket. A weak domestic structure is one of the major reasons for this. The Quaid-e-Azam Trophy lacks the competitiveness needed to prepare players for the challenges of Test cricket. For example, in the ongoing Quaid-e-Azam Trophy 2024, most games have finished before Day 4, which means Pakistani players miss out on crucial red-ball experience. To make things worse, frequent changes in the coaching staff disrupt continuity and deny young players the steady mentorship they need to develop. Adding to these challenges is Pakistan’s over-reliance on the PSL, which overshadows red-ball cricket and leaves players unprepared for the patience and technical demands of Test cricket.

What do you think Pakistan should prioritize to fix this issue—domestic cricket, coaching, or a new approach to red-ball cricket? Do you feel that the PSL’s popularity is overshadowing other formats in Pakistan? And is the gap between the two countries’ cricket systems becoming too wide to close?

Neither. It’s not just the Ranji Trophy or IPL behind India’s success.

The real driver of highly skilled player development is India’s focus on age-group coaching and grassroots development. Players like Shubman Gill and Yashasvi Jaiswal averaged over 60 in the Ranji Trophy upon arrival at this level. This means they were ready to go on arrival and first class was just a finishing school. Both also dominated the Under-19 circuit, topping the charts there as well.

For Pakistan to compete at the same level, investing in grassroots coaching is essential, particularly at the club cricket level. The PCB should consider bringing in foreign coaches to train domestic coaches, create structured batting manuals, and establish clear development pathways for young talent.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Jaiswal is an under-19 product. I think it is unfair to give credit to IPL. IPL is good at exposing some hidden talents and fringe players. Generational talents comes from domestic. under-19 etc. Check Jaiswal's First class career. It is impeccable.

 

[Savak]

BCCI is perhaps the only board which can reward their players for exclusitivity. It is an almost impossible decision for an Indian player to defy the BCCI and opt out of the domestic cricket system and let go of the opportunity to play in the IPL. Umukht Chand made that decision when he lost all hope of ever playing for India or the IPL again when even domestic sides made it clear to him that he was not in their plans.

BCCI has a clear cut policy which they enforce to the tilt i.e. you cannot play in the IPL if you don't play the Ranji trophy.

PCB could try issuing the same policy but they cannot pay the players for the same kind of exclusitivity. You will most likely face a scenario of mass resignations where Pakistani players will become free lancers and will move to Canada, USA e.t.c.

 

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

Jaiswal is an under-19 product. I think it is unfair to give credit to IPL. IPL is good at exposing some hidden talents and fringe players. Generational talents comes from domestic. under-19 etc. Check Jaiswal's First class career. It is impeccable.

I heard of Jaiswal when he was in his early teens. He was scoring big runs from a very early age. Same with Shubman Gill and Prithvi Shaw.

 

[Savak]

Neither. It’s not just the Ranji Trophy or IPL behind India’s success.

The real driver of highly skilled player development is India’s focus on age-group coaching and grassroots development. Players like Shubman Gill and Yashasvi Jaiswal averaged over 60 in the Ranji Trophy upon arrival at this level. This means they were ready to go on arrival and first class was just a finishing school. Both also dominated the Under-19 circuit, topping the charts there as well.

For Pakistan to compete at the same level, investing in grassroots coaching is essential, particularly at the club cricket level. The PCB should consider bringing in foreign coaches to train domestic coaches, create structured batting manuals, and establish clear development pathways for young talent.

I thought the PCB asking the likes of Misbah, Waqar, Saqlain, Sarfaraz, Shoaib Malik to become mentors for the Champions Sides was a step in the right direction where they will all be given a high performance centre, they will over see the coaches, staff, 40-50 domestic players under their wings, U-19 and Female Cricketers under their wings for the next 3 years in exchange for the Rs 5 million the PCB will be paying them every month.

However reporters are now reporting that these mentors are not really devoting their 24/7 energies into the roles, they are taking time out for their other commitments i.e. travelling overseas, commentatory assignments, T-10 & T-20 leagues. Someone like Dravid or Laxman in comparison have the integrity and professionalism to devote themselves 100% to the BCCI, U19, A teams, Academies when the BCCI is paying them heaven and earth but Pakistani cricketers in comparison just want everything everywhere.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I heard of Jaiswal when he was in his early teens. He was scoring big runs from a very early age. Same with Shubman Gill and Prithvi Shaw.

Number of under-19 products

Yuvraj singh - 1998 batch
SHikar dhawan - 2004 batch
Rohit sharma, Pujara, Dinesh karthik - 2006 batch
Virat kohli, Jadeja - 2008 batch
KL Rahul, Agarwal, Netravalkar- 2010 batch
Sanju samson, - 2014 batch Samson top run getter
Pant, Kishan , Sundar, Sarfraz - 2016 batch
Gill, Prithvi shaw, Abhishek sharma, Arshdeep - 2018 batch Gill top run getter
Jaiswal, Jhurel, Tilak Varma, Bishnoi - 2020 Jaiswal top run getter


From 2022 batch we have plenty of talents, same with 2024 batch couple of talents coming through.

Same goes for other countries.

Kane williamson, Root, Brook, Travis head.. all under-19 products. When was the last time Pakistan has produced a great batsman from U19 batch. Most recent prominent ones are Imam, Babar, Abdulla shafique. The next gen talent was supposed to be Rohail Nazir.

 

[Bhaijaan]

We don’t pick anyone in test cricket on the basis of IPL. First class cricket remains the criteria as it should be.

 

[Bhaijaan]

Ravi Shastri 's commentary seems to be the reason. He really motivates the players and push them unlike the mundane and monotonous Pakistani commentators who have no clue on domestic players

He’s such a positive and gutsy fellow. I have always been a fan of his motivational ability. He’s been around the Bharatiya team in every test tour literally since i started watching cricket. Players love to interact with him and trust his advise. He also takes care of the opposition media camp and keeps the negative media campaign in check.

 

[sweep_shot]

I feel like PSL should have more teams. Get 10-12 teams. That can mean more competition and more revenues.

Also, get more venues maybe.

 

[Rajdeep]

I feel like PSL should have more teams. Get 10-12 teams. That can mean more competition and more revenues.

Also, get more venues maybe.

Not necessarily. More teams meaning saturating your product and many mediocre players getting a chance to play to fill up the spot. I was also against IPL adding 2 extra teams and strongly believe quality was much better when we had 8 teams competing.

 

[Buffet]

This notion that Indian players are transitioning from IPL to test is not correct.

Based on what I hear, first class cricket is very good in India and not so good in Pakistan. That's the difference and not IPL or PSL.

 

[Hellion]

IPL has definitely helped. Scouts of teams like MI and CSK are very good at identifying players and have often found players who were not highly rated by states etc and developed them

Bumrah and Ashwin were not FC legends by any stretch of the imagination before they played Test cricket.

IPL is very good at identifying guys with a high ceiling . The grassroots system improves a lot slower.

Ranji is overrated.

Sure , playing red ball cricket generally helps but you can't gauge how good a player is based on domestic averages alone.

You have to see how they handle high pace, big turn etc.

You can't get any of that from Ranji. A lot of that analysis is done at the NCA etc.

 

[chinaman00]

Over the past 15 years, India has produced professional athletes whereas Pakistan has only produced T20 mercenaries. In fact, these T20 mercenaries aren’t even good at being T20 mercenaries evidenced by their spectacular loss to the US in the World Cup.

The ungoverned T20 marketplace and the PCB’s failure to regulate its players has created a situation where cricket is not the primary concern of Pakistani players. Not to mention a dysfunctional domestic structure and governance.

At the current rate, it won’t be a shock to see India, Afghanistan and Sri Lanka as the top 3 Asian cricket teams with Pakistan competing with the perennial newcomers Bangladesh.

 

[Savak]

Not necessarily. More teams meaning saturating your product and many mediocre players getting a chance to play to fill up the spot. I was also against IPL adding 2 extra teams and strongly believe quality was much better when we had 8 teams competing.

A league should have atleast 8-10 teams. There should be more competition for places in the Semi Finals and Finals. With fewer teams the pressure for qualifying only falls on the last 2 teams. Also countries with larger populations have a lot of talented players on the bench who will only add value to the league.

 

[Barragan]

Who are these PSL and IPL players?

Can you list them, so we can compare their FC records

 

[jnaveen1980]

Who are these PSL and IPL players?

Can you list them, so we can compare their FC records

Azam khan
Usman khan lol A 25 ball stay in a T20 game won't make someone a great Test player unless they know how to build an innings in domestic.

 

[Barragan]

Azam khan
Usman khan lol A 25 ball stay in a T20 game won't make someone a great Test player unless they know how to build an innings in domestic.

None of those two are anywhere near the Test team.

OP specifically mentions PSL performances related to Test cricket.

 

[Farabi]

I thought the PCB asking the likes of Misbah, Waqar, Saqlain, Sarfaraz, Shoaib Malik to become mentors for the Champions Sides was a step in the right direction where they will all be given a high performance centre, they will over see the coaches, staff, 40-50 domestic players under their wings, U-19 and Female Cricketers under their wings for the next 3 years in exchange for the Rs 5 million the PCB will be paying them every month.

However reporters are now reporting that these mentors are not really devoting their 24/7 energies into the roles, they are taking time out for their other commitments i.e. travelling overseas, commentatory assignments, T-10 & T-20 leagues. Someone like Dravid or Laxman in comparison have the integrity and professionalism to devote themselves 100% to the BCCI, U19, A teams, Academies when the BCCI is paying them heaven and earth but Pakistani cricketers in comparison just want everything everywhere.

In general, it’s baffling why a culture of reinventing the wheel persists.

Too much time is wasted debating the "perfect" number of teams, launching entirely new T20 junior leagues, or introducing initiatives like the mentorship plan. The reality is, there’s no magic number of teams—different countries have thrived with varying structures.

What truly matters is consistency. Successful cricketing nations maintain stable systems that don’t shift every few years due to directives from above, so they should pick X number of teams and just stick with that. It won’t matter. Their setups are decentralized, with each state or county operating independently and self-sufficiently.
In simple terms, the functions performed by departments for Pakistani players are handled by state or regional teams in other countries.

These regional teams:
- Provide jobs for players and coaches.
- Select and coach their own teams.
- Manage their operations sustainably.

Club cricket also plays a key role, driving outcomes independently without relying heavily on central boards.

All the PCB needs to do is emulate these proven models. Focus on decentralizing cricket administration, empowering regional/state/club teams, and creating the right incentives for them to succeed.

 

[Farabi]

IPL has definitely helped. Scouts of teams like MI and CSK are very good at identifying players and have often found players who were not highly rated by states etc and developed them

Bumrah and Ashwin were not FC legends by any stretch of the imagination before they played Test cricket.

IPL is very good at identifying guys with a high ceiling . The grassroots system improves a lot slower.

Ranji is overrated.

Sure , playing red ball cricket generally helps but you can't gauge how good a player is based on domestic averages alone.

You have to see how they handle high pace, big turn etc.

You can't get any of that from Ranji. A lot of that analysis is done at the NCA etc.

Name a few successful Indian batters who didn’t play Ranji.

 

[Farabi]

Over the past 15 years, India has produced professional athletes whereas Pakistan has only produced T20 mercenaries. In fact, these T20 mercenaries aren’t even good at being T20 mercenaries evidenced by their spectacular loss to the US in the World Cup.

The ungoverned T20 marketplace and the PCB’s failure to regulate its players has created a situation where cricket is not the primary concern of Pakistani players. Not to mention a dysfunctional domestic structure and governance.

At the current rate, it won’t be a shock to see India, Afghanistan and Sri Lanka as the top 3 Asian cricket teams with Pakistan competing with the perennial newcomers Bangladesh.

The issue of T20 mercenaries is not unique to Pakistan; it’s a global phenomenon, with the exception of India and, to some extent, Australia.

The IPL and the BCCI have the financial resources to pay their players generously and enforce exclusivity, a luxury most other boards cannot afford without comparable funding.

It’s true that Pakistan is currently in a downturn, with recent losses to Afghanistan and Bangladesh. However, outside of Indian trolls, no one seriously believes these teams are better than Pakistan overall. Over time, this will become evident as form and results stabilize.

 

[Farabi]

Number of under-19 products

Yuvraj singh - 1998 batch
SHikar dhawan - 2004 batch
Rohit sharma, Pujara, Dinesh karthik - 2006 batch
Virat kohli, Jadeja - 2008 batch
KL Rahul, Agarwal, Netravalkar- 2010 batch
Sanju samson, - 2014 batch Samson top run getter
Pant, Kishan , Sundar, Sarfraz - 2016 batch
Gill, Prithvi shaw, Abhishek sharma, Arshdeep - 2018 batch Gill top run getter
Jaiswal, Jhurel, Tilak Varma, Bishnoi - 2020 Jaiswal top run getter


From 2022 batch we have plenty of talents, same with 2024 batch couple of talents coming through.

Same goes for other countries.

Kane williamson, Root, Brook, Travis head.. all under-19 products. When was the last time Pakistan has produced a great batsman from U19 batch. Most recent prominent ones are Imam, Babar, Abdulla shafique. The next gen talent was supposed to be Rohail Nazir.

This pretty much proves that it’s the grass-roots development in India that’s driving their success.

 

[Mesozoic]

They're Ranji products nor IPL's.

 

[jnaveen1980]

They're Ranji products nor IPL's.

You have to go further below that level. Junior cricket level. Nitish kumar reddy made 442 runs at Junior cricket level.

 

[Savak]

I heard one Indian analyst mention that the school cricket system is very robust and competitive, you cannot even think about breaking into the Indian U-19, Ranji Side, A Team and even the IPL if you haven't impressed at the school level. Indian U-19 players are exposed to 3 day, 4 day cricket at a very young age and they have to impress in these 3 day and 4 day tournaments like how Tendulkar and Kambli did.

In contrast Pakistani youngsters are focusing purely on 20-20 Cricket and there is very little opportunity, respect or desire to play in 3 day, 4 day cricket. I don't think PCB has a policy where you cannot play U-19, domestic cricket, PSL without significant exposure to 3 day, 4 day cricket.

 

[Farabi]

I heard one Indian analyst mention that the school cricket system is very robust and competitive, you cannot even think about breaking into the Indian U-19, Ranji Side, A Team and even the IPL if you haven't impressed at the school level. Indian U-19 players are exposed to 3 day, 4 day cricket at a very young age and they have to impress in these 3 day and 4 day tournaments like how Tendulkar and Kambli did.

In contrast Pakistani youngsters are focusing purely on 20-20 Cricket and there is very little opportunity, respect or desire to play in 3 day, 4 day cricket. I don't think PCB has a policy where you cannot play U-19, domestic cricket, PSL without significant exposure to 3 day, 4 day cricket.

This is probably the biggest insight PCB is missing.

 

[Farabi]

Number of under-19 products

Yuvraj singh - 1998 batch
SHikar dhawan - 2004 batch
Rohit sharma, Pujara, Dinesh karthik - 2006 batch
Virat kohli, Jadeja - 2008 batch
KL Rahul, Agarwal, Netravalkar- 2010 batch
Sanju samson, - 2014 batch Samson top run getter
Pant, Kishan , Sundar, Sarfraz - 2016 batch
Gill, Prithvi shaw, Abhishek sharma, Arshdeep - 2018 batch Gill top run getter
Jaiswal, Jhurel, Tilak Varma, Bishnoi - 2020 Jaiswal top run getter


From 2022 batch we have plenty of talents, same with 2024 batch couple of talents coming through.

Same goes for other countries.

Kane williamson, Root, Brook, Travis head.. all under-19 products. When was the last time Pakistan has produced a great batsman from U19 batch. Most recent prominent ones are Imam, Babar, Abdulla shafique. The next gen talent was supposed to be Rohail Nazir.

Just fact checked. Lots of U19 talent coming through in the form of Hasebullah Khan, Shahzaib Khan, Qasim Akram, all were top 5 or 10 run getters in recent years.
Other batters who did well
Haider Ali, Azam Awais, Arafat Minhas, Shamyl Hussain, Rohail Nazir, Mohd Haris, Sami Aslam (who was wasted)

Pakistan Under-19s (Young Cricketers) Youth ODI matches batting most runs series | ESPNcricinfo

Find Pakistan Under-19s (Young Cricketers) cricket Youth ODI matches batting most runs series at ESPNcricinfo. Records and stats of Pakistan Under-19s (Young Cricketers) Youth ODI matches batting most runs series.

www.espncricinfo.com

Pakistan’s problem is not so much talent pipeline but talent induction and management.

 

[Vikram1989]

Jaiswal is an under-19 product. I think it is unfair to give credit to IPL. IPL is good at exposing some hidden talents and fringe players. Generational talents comes from domestic. under-19 etc. Check Jaiswal's First class career. It is impeccable.

No it's not complete truth.jaiswal got the hitting ability from Ipl.in his first 3 ipl seasons,he was a failure till 2022. He worked hard in gym and proved himself. Infact all quality bowlers such as boult had his number.Even his Sr and avg were pretty low.once he got his hitting range, rohit enquired about him in presentation (2023)

 

[jnaveen1980]

No it's not complete truth.jaiswal got the hitting ability from Ipl.in his first 3 ipl seasons,he was a failure till 2022. He worked hard in gym and proved himself. Infact all quality bowlers such as boult had his number.Even his Sr and avg were pretty low.once he got his hitting range, rohit enquired about him in presentation (2023)

WHy is hitting ability needed in Tests. One of the main reason everyone appreciated him in under-19 was for his technique. He was throwing numbers left/right/center in domestic. If anything he should have made debut much earlier. BCCI was not willing let go of sponsors favorites. Sarfraz never had any decent IPL numbers. Yet he played. If BCCI uses IPL to pick test players then that is their stupidity. SKY is one guy who came into side like that. Patidar was picked only after he scored runs in A game.

This was 4 years back.

 

[BouncerGuy]

The IPL products are not just IPL products. Gotta see their domestic game as well. These guys have been groomed from School days. Many examples out there. Jaiswal is the most recent one, Nitish kumar reddy etc. These guys are not just IPL bullies. They are seasoned players.

 

[Vikram1989]

WHy is hitting ability needed in Tests. One of the main reason everyone appreciated him in under-19 was for his technique. He was throwing numbers left/right/center in domestic. If anything he should have made debut much earlier. BCCI was not willing let go of sponsors favorites. Sarfraz never had any decent IPL numbers. Yet he played. If BCCI uses IPL to pick test players then that is their stupidity. SKY is one guy who came into side like that. Patidar was picked only after he scored runs in A game.

This was 4 years back.

am not saying ipl made him .ipl made him better after playing Boult,Hazlewood etc quality bowlers in the nets,matches .He has got a very good technique right from the start but hitting ability made him more dangerous. Its polishing a diamond.It's the difference between Pujare,Rahane,Cook vs Kp,Hayden. Bowlers know they can't dictate terms all the times to an aggressive batsmen and stick to one line.Already jaiswal had most sixes in this year. Am not saying he cant hit sixes before he joined ipl but he improved tremendously. Sanga ,Butler,Rr management made him team player than another Gill.You can see every player of rr is team oriented (Samson,Aswin,Butler,Shane,Root etc)

 

[big_gamer007]

IPL has definitely helped. Scouts of teams like MI and CSK are very good at identifying players and have often found players who were not highly rated by states etc and developed them

Bumrah and Ashwin were not FC legends by any stretch of the imagination before they played Test cricket.

IPL is very good at identifying guys with a high ceiling . The grassroots system improves a lot slower.

Ranji is overrated.

Sure , playing red ball cricket generally helps but you can't gauge how good a player is based on domestic averages alone.

You have to see how they handle high pace, big turn etc.

You can't get any of that from Ranji. A lot of that analysis is done at the NCA etc.

For most players Everything is connected and it’s not just this OR that.

Ranji, Grassroots, school, under age, coaching, NCA, IPL etc are all involved In a players growth.

Dismissing Ranji as being overrated shows you don’t have any knowledge of cricket or sports in general. Ranji is a key part in player development and the grind is one of the most important skills required for a player to grow into an international star.

Without hard work and toil you can’t succeed at international level and Ranji is one of the best ways to instil that value in youngsters.

 

[jnaveen1980]

am not saying ipl made him .ipl made him better after playing Boult,Hazlewood etc quality bowlers in the nets,matches .He has got a very good technique right from the start but hitting ability made him more dangerous. Its polishing a diamond.It's the difference between Pujare,Rahane,Cook vs Kp,Hayden. Bowlers know they can't dictate terms all the times to an aggressive batsmen and stick to one line.Already jaiswal had most sixes in this year. Am not saying he cant hit sixes before he joined ipl but he improved tremendously. Sanga ,Butler,Rr management made him team player than another Gill.You can see every player of rr is team oriented (Samson,Aswin,Butler,Shane,Root etc)

His technique has not changed. Playing the ball right under his eye was there even as an 18 year old kid. If you look at guys like Gill , Prithvi shaw they had the habit of playing away from the body. Gill still has that issue. THis is the reason why Jaiswal is able to play long innings. His only problem was he started playing some impatient shots in the NZ series. Bad habits he picked from T20 internationals.

U-19 semi final against pakistan. He hit 4 sixes in his century. You don't see people hitting that many sixes at this level. Unmukt chand hit 7 in the ifnal. Other than that i don't recall many u19 players hitting sixes at that level.

IND19 vs PAK19 Cricket Scorecard, Semi-Final at Potchefstroom, February 04, 2020

Live Cricket Scoreboard: Get India Under-19s vs Pakistan Under-19s Semi-Final, cricket scorecard, Under-19 World Cup 2019/20 dated February 04, 2020.

www.espncricinfo.com

 

[Vikram1989]

His technique has not changed. Playing the ball right under his eye was there even as an 18 year old kid. If you look at guys like Gill , Prithvi shaw they had the habit of playing away from the body. Gill still has that issue. THis is the reason why Jaiswal is able to play long innings. His only problem was he started playing some impatient shots in the NZ series. Bad habits he picked from T20 internationals.

U-19 semi final against pakistan. He hit 4 sixes in his century. You don't see people hitting that many sixes at this level. Unmukt chand hit 7 in the ifnal. Other than that i don't recall many u19 players hitting sixes at that level.

IND19 vs PAK19 Cricket Scorecard, Semi-Final at Potchefstroom, February 04, 2020

Live Cricket Scoreboard: Get India Under-19s vs Pakistan Under-19s Semi-Final, cricket scorecard, Under-19 World Cup 2019/20 dated February 04, 2020.

www.espncricinfo.com

See this was the moment rohit recognised jaiswal has became a beast.Even rohit was asking him the difference when compared to last year.Jaiwall had it always but he improved.

Rohit Sharma praise on Yashasvi Jaiswal and Happy with Mumbai Indians win | Cricket News - Times of India

Cricket News: Mumbai Indians skipper Rohit Sharma praised Yashasvi Jaiswal, saying he was surprised with the power the youngster packed in his strokes, while also a

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

 

[jnaveen1980]

See this was the moment rohit recognised jaiswal has became a beast.Even rohit was asking him the difference when compared to last year.Jaiwall had it always but he improved.

Rohit Sharma praise on Yashasvi Jaiswal and Happy with Mumbai Indians win | Cricket News - Times of India

Cricket News: Mumbai Indians skipper Rohit Sharma praised Yashasvi Jaiswal, saying he was surprised with the power the youngster packed in his strokes, while also a

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

Rohit himself is not a test legend to certify another guy lol Jaiswal has much higher ceiling as a test batsman than Rohit. He made twin centuries in Irani Trophy final. As I said BCCI is a crapy organization who don't induct players into the national side at the right time. He should have played Tests an year earlier.

 

[Hellion]

Name a few successful Indian batters who didn’t play Ranji.

For most players Everything is connected and it’s not just this OR that.

Ranji, Grassroots, school, under age, coaching, NCA, IPL etc are all involved In a players growth.

Dismissing Ranji as being overrated shows you don’t have any knowledge of cricket or sports in general. Ranji is a key part in player development and the grind is one of the most important skills required for a player to grow into an international star.

Without hard work and toil you can’t succeed at international level and Ranji is one of the best ways to instil that value in youngsters.

I did not dismiss Ranji at all. I said its importance is exaggerated and overrated.

Players are not picked on their performance in Ranji. They are picked on the basis of underlying metrics , A tours and simulations. The Duleep Trophy is actually even more important.

If you go by Ranji l, Jaydev Unadkat was one of the best bowlers in the tournament not too long ago.

Even a casual fan would know that he'd flop at the international level.

Other than building workload , it's importance is extremely overrated.

 

[Vikram1989]

Rohit himself is not a test legend to certify another guy lol Jaiswal has much higher ceiling as a test batsman than Rohit. He made twin centuries in Irani Trophy final. As I said BCCI is a crapy organization who don't induct players into the national side at the right time. He should have played Tests an year earlier.

Rohit was commenting about hitting ability not about test match technique. I agree jaiswal should have been i. Earlier in test matches than ever struggling gill at opening. More than test matches ,I think jaiswal at 4 instead of iyer must have given us a good chance in odi wc.Iyer was dumbfounded by cummins due to fear of short ball.Even jaiswal playing with in himself should have given us a good score.He is superseded by seniority than talent or form

 

[The Bald Eagle]

The Reddy guy is really impressive, appears to be younger version of Hardik Pandya

 

[jnaveen1980]

The Reddy guy is really impressive, appears to be younger version of Hardik Pandya

It is a surprise for everyone. When india lost a lot of people in 2021 tour due to injuries they just picked the guys from T20 squad and played Test. Natrajan, Sundar, Thakur etc. Turned out Sundar and Thakur were very good in Tests. Without much exposure to first class he did very well there. Mostly heavy scorers are in domestic are likely to do better at interntaional level. Occasionally average domestic players can do better in internationals. Case in point lauscagne, Sundar now this Reddy who averages 21 in first class. Over here he was the highest scorer in 3 of the 4 innings.

 

[Ball Blazer]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2047966017767215199

 

[ElRaja]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2047966017767215199

look at this guys body, naturally athletic, but has probably been in a strength and conditioning program since he was 16 or 17. our shpeedsters either look like shaheen, scaffolding body type, or ghittai bilawal bhatti types. most pakistani first class pacers wouldnt even have been playing grade-II thirty years ago. shocking fall from grace.

 

[Cric1234]

How many IPL products average 50 in test cricket?

 

[nish_mate]

How many IPL products average 50 in test cricket?

About as many if not more PSL products have been in a WTC final.....

 

[Hitman]

How many IPL products average 50 in test cricket?

You don't have to necessarily average 50 with the bat to be a successful Test cricketer.

 

[RizwanT20Champ]

How many test greats from IPL? Please name one in last 5 years. @Bhaag Viru Bhaag @Hitman @Rajdeep

 

[U$ofA]

How many test greats from IPL? Please name one in last 5 years.

Ashwin, Jadeja, Bumrah, Jaiswal are players that come off the top of my head. These are all IPL products. All fairly successful test cricketers. Though not greats, these players I would say were/are genuinely talented and qualified to play test cricket.

Having said that, not sure if any current or future players will or should be training themselves to play tests. I mean, what is the purpose? There is just no demand for it. Neither is there money in it.

On the other hand, IPL has demand, has the $$$ and is thriving. As a player, you would want to market yourself to be picked in the IPL. Not some format that is on or close to it's demise.

 

[U$ofA]

How many IPL products average 50 in test cricket?

Not sure if any of the current or future IPL players will even want to play test. Let alone average 50.

Why would anyone put themselves through a training process for format that is dying/dead?

The format is pretty much dead and burried in WI, SL, Pak., BD. Heck even in SA and NZ. BCCI, CA and ECB are still at it. Even there, BCCI has quietly reduced everthing that they play to two test "series". Except for BGT and ATT.

Even with BGT and ATT, not sure how long that will last. It is on for the near future. But once BCCI gets tired of it or Indian fans move away from it, got help test cricket.

ECB and CA cannot just survive on Ashes $$$. They need BGT and ATT $$$ as well to build and grow their cricket universe.

 

[jeeteshssaxena]

How many test greats from IPL? Please name one in last 5 years. @Bhaag Viru Bhaag @Hitman @Rajdeep

How can a player who started his career in last 5 years become a great?

Use your brain for once.

 

[BouncerGuy]

It is not about IPL or PSL. it is about the system and the hard work these guys are putting in... Indian cricket system is just too good... This league cricket is not merit.

 

[Josh]

look at this guys body, naturally athletic, but has probably been in a strength and conditioning program since he was 16 or 17. our shpeedsters either look like shaheen, scaffolding body type, or ghittai bilawal bhatti types. most pakistani first class pacers wouldnt even have been playing grade-II thirty years ago. shocking fall from grace.

Rabada has very strong glutes..fast bowlers need to have developed strong glutes and derriere to remain injury free. Pelvic stability for accuracy, hip extension for Speed and a real good strong buttocks for saving the bowler from lower back strain. Modern Pakistani Fast bowlers or any other fast bowlers need to have a good strong a r s e /buttocks to succeed in international arena.

 

[chinaman00]

Because PSL is not a real professional league. It’s a league where Shadab Khan comes 1 or 2 down and makes quick fire 50s, Saud Shakeel consistently makes good scores, where Steve smith appears to be a legitimate T20 prospect.

The legends league where Wasim akram, Shoaib akhtar and other retired players compete occasionally, is more competitive more than PSL. PSL is just an entertainment league where some players can get bonus salary and socialize. Not a competitive league.

You can’t expect an entertainment league to produce test players or even professional players.

 

[RahulBose]

Difference is self-confidence vs. belief in divine miracles to make something happen.

When you repeatedly pay homage to god on a sports field both verbally and physically, you create a false sense in your own mind of somehow cheating your way to the top. You don't then put in the grueling effort that others do.

pakistani cricketer mindset works against worldly nature of this sport.

That is definitely part of the problem, faith is good when exercised as a foundation of morality. But to use it as a way to replace performance is just stupidity.

God, if there is one, would be least bothered by trivial things as earth , let alone some pak cricketer invoking his power to help him win a cricket match.

 

[big_gamer007]

How many test greats from IPL? Please name one in last 5 years. @Bhaag Viru Bhaag @Hitman @Rajdeep

This has to be one of the dumbest takes I’ve seen on PP, and it perfectly sums up how low-quality discussions have become thanks to low-IQ posting.


A good player’s career typically spans ~15 years. The IPL started in 2008, and guys like Kohli, Sharma, Pujara, Rahane, Jadeja, Ashwin, etc. were mainstays for well over a decade. Only now, as that core group phases out, are the so-called “IPL generation” players actually getting a sustained run.

So how exactly are you expecting them to average 50 already, when most of them have only been regulars for a couple of years?

Whether this generation ends up matching the success of the 90s/2000s/2010s Test greats is something only time will tell. But comparing them prematurely to past legends is just a lazy, low-effort take—and honestly a big reason why a lot of quality posters don’t bother with PP anymore.


Also, let’s not ignore the irony: the “IPL generation” has already produced one of India’s greatest bowlers, and arguably Asia’s second-greatest fast bowler.

 

[RidiculousMan]

I don't remember a recent Indian Test player who was successful in Test Cricket solely because of his IPL performances and not because of his FC performances.

 

[BunnyRabbit]

Gill, jaiswal, pant are product of indian domestic cricket and ipl is part of it. They have invested heavily in their domestic and age cricket infrastructure. There isn't any successful test player who got plucked from ipl without having played fc or la and succeeded. Same is the case for every other successful cricket country.
T20 leagues are entertainment, easy money and provides time to spend with foreign players and coaches to pick up some good pointers.

 

[pakistani pride]

Indian players actually play FC cricket or have some experience playing RED BALL cricket.
Our fake super starts never play FC/ Red ball cricket. Its the poor mindset.

 

[sweep_shot]

I don't remember a recent Indian Test player who was successful in Test Cricket solely because of his IPL performances and not because of his FC performances.

Correct.

As a matter of fact, India are now #4 in Test. They are declining in Test.

India recently got whitewashed by South Africa and NZ in home Test series.

 

[U$ofA]

Gill, jaiswal, pant are product of indian domestic cricket and ipl is part of it. They have invested heavily in their domestic and age cricket infrastructure. There isn't any successful test player who got plucked from ipl without having played fc or la and succeeded. Same is the case for every other successful cricket country.
T20 leagues are entertainment, easy money and provides time to spend with foreign players and coaches to pick up some good pointers.

Ashwin and Bumrah are two prime examples of players plucked right from IPL. They are both 100% IPL products. You can go back and google this.

I would contend that both these players have been very successful in test cricket.

 

[U$ofA]

I don't remember a recent Indian Test player who was successful in Test Cricket solely because of his IPL performances and not because of his FC performances.

Ashwin, Bumrah. 100% IPL products. I would say both have been fairly succesful in test cricket.

 

[Mesozoic]

Because PSL is a garbage league with mediocre standards ?

 

[sithb]

Ashwin, Bumrah. 100% IPL products. I would say both have been fairly succesful in test cricket.

Ashwin played ranji before playing in IPL.

Bumrah played domestic T20 before he played in IPL. But he made his first class debut after playing in the IPL

Both came through the Indian system.

 

[U$ofA]

Ashwin played ranji before playing in IPL.

Bumrah played domestic T20 before he played in IPL. But he made his first class debut after playing in the IPL

Both came through the Indian system.

Of course they came through the BCCI system. But they made their name in the IPL. They were brought into the test system based on that. Not based on FC performances.

 

[RidiculousMan]

Ashwin, Bumrah. 100% IPL products. I would say both have been fairly succesful in test cricket.

Bumrah had quite many FC games before he played Test regularly.

He is also an exception because of his exceptional action as a bowler.

 

[U$ofA]

Bumrah had quite many FC games before he played Test regularly.

He is also an exception because of his exceptional action as a bowler.

He made his name in the IPL. He was picked in the test side based on IPL performances. Not FC matches.

 

[sithb]

Of course they came through the BCCI system. But they made their name in the IPL. They were brought into the test system based on that. Not based on FC performances.

Ashwin was already a known force in ranjis by then. He gained limelight because of his IPL performances. But he probably would have gotten picked for tests nevertheless

 

[RidiculousMan]

He made his name in the IPL. He was picked in the test side based on IPL performances. Not FC matches.

He's an exception and an anomaly. No other player unlike him would've been able to survive Test Cricket without FC experience.

 

[sithb]

He made his name in the IPL. He was picked in the test side based on IPL performances. Not FC matches.

He wasn't picked for tests for a long time. He made his first class debut in 2013 and was only picked for tests in 2018.

 

[sithb]

You aren't entirely wrong on Bumrah but it took 5 years of him bowling in first class before he made his debut in tests.

The fact still remains that he was picked in IPL team before he made his first class debut. But it's his consistent performances in FC cricket that earned him his test cap.

 

[U$ofA]

You aren't entirely wrong on Bumrah but it took 5 years of him bowling in first class before he made his debut in tests.

The fact still remains that he was picked in IPL team before he made his first class debut. But it's his consistent performances in FC cricket that earned him his test cap.

Reality of the situation is, it does not matter.

None of the new crop of players and up and coming ones will not care about test cricket. Why would they? No point.

 

[sithb]

Anyway on topic, there's a wide difference in the cricketing infrastructure in India and Pakistan now. The sheer amount of money invested in the game and the cricketers makes it only natural that the gap is increasing by the day.

 

[sithb]

Reality of the situation is, it does not matter.

None of the new crop of players and up and coming ones will not care about test cricket. Why would they? No point.

BCCI needs to do a lot more on that front. They should incentivise cricketers to make test cricket their main format. I do think they are taking steps to address that. Let's see.

It's going to become a problem for various countries though as well. Except England and Australia who have their ashes trophies to think of to some extent.

 

[sithb]

And equally concerning for India is that our spinners aren't really good at the moment.

Absolutely no one who can replace Ashwin