Why has Pakistan not won more ICC ODI World Cups?

[MenInG]

Here is a comprehensive list of performances by teams in World Cups

Whilst Pakistan has been there and thereabouts in many of these, the Trophy cupboard seems rather empty (barring 2 times)

So what are the reasons for this?

1. Lack of talent
2. Bad captaincy
3. Bad luck

 

[Hitman]

They had the opportunity in 1987, 1999 and 2011. Bottled them.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

They never won enough matches going into these World Cups. History shows that after batting strike rates, the most important metric to look at is the W/L ratio of teams for two years prior to the World Cup. PAK was good at the former but rarely as good at the latter metric.

They kept coming across teams that consistently won for longer periods. This matters because World Cups can have 10, 11 games. PAK, in the past, looked a million dollars in the first round and then looked iffy by Super Six/Quarters - when you need players who are battle-hardened and have high fitness standards, and can maintain their performance over 10 matches.

1999 is the perfect example of this. Shoaib's pace, Wasim's reverse swing, terrific lower-order hitting, etc. just got Pakistan across the line against WI and OZ in the group stage.

But BD game onwards, the standards started slipping. Shoaib got wayward against SA and got hammered by Klusener at crucial moments. Shoaib once again failed against India and on a slowing pitch, the lower-order hitters failed, exposing the batting lineup as a whole.

And in the final, they collapsed on a perfectly reasonable pitch which only had some pace and bounce. OZ on the other hand was spot on. Mark Waugh taking screamers, Mcgrath bowling some of his fastest stuff while still being accurate, Warne spinning it big and Gilchrist attacking the ball with murderous intent.

The difference was night and day.

 

[pratiktc]

Pak was among the better ODI teams in 80s and 90s thanks to reverse swing, gun bowlers and some pioneering late hitters.

As game evolved with more focus on consistent power hitting, cameras preventing tampering, jerky actions being called out and two new balls eliminating conventional reverse, Pakistan white ball cricket got left by wayside over the last 20 years.

Pakistan has suffered due to not having as many big gun talents as they used to, but also because selection thought processes are still stuck in bygone eras. Pakistan board and team managements rarely have term outlook for the kind of team they want to build and thus are incapable of developing players accordingly. The few talented players - Babar, Shaheen are ground down by being played in every inconsequential series and format.

Rather than being process driven, it is more of throw some ideas together and hope for the best.

 

[Rana]

Should have won the 1999 World Cup

Iconic team. Our strongest ever ODI XI for a World Cup

 

[gibsyhesperis]

Should have won the 1999 World Cup

Iconic team. Our strongest ever ODI XI for a World Cup

Spot on
Extraordinarily bad decision to bat first,under overcast conditions on a seaming wicket annd getting bundled out for 130 odd.
All because it was thought that the batsmen would bottle under the pressure of a chase.

 

[MenInG]

Should have won the 1999 World Cup

Iconic team. Our strongest ever ODI XI for a World Cup

Why did we lose that, bad captaincy, bad luck etc?

 

[Rana]

Why did we lose that, bad captaincy, bad luck etc?

Just didn’t turn up when it mattered on the last day.

Australia had the momentum after that iconic win against South Africa in the Semi final. They did a Pakistan on Pakistan

 

[Rana]

Spot on
Extraordinarily bad decision to bat first,under overcast conditions on a seaming wicket annd getting bundled out for 130 odd.
All because it was thought that the batsmen would bottle under the pressure of a chase.

Batting first in a final is never a bad decision

But you have to bat and get the runs on the board. A 250 score would feel like a 280 in the final at Lords.

Pakistan just didn’t turn up. It’s as simple as that. They had a massive reprieve when Anwar was dropped by McGrath (I think), and they didn’t make the most of it.

Inzimam and Saeed Anwar were two players who had to deliver that day. They didn’t unfortunately

 

[Rana]

Why did we lose that, bad captaincy, bad luck etc?

One more thing I noted. Looking back at it now. I was 9 years old and hardly understood cricket whilst watching it live…but upon reflection of the scorecard, there are some questions..

Pakistan should have played Saleem Malik in the middle. Abdul Razzaq at 3 seems like a cool Akram thing to do backing a youngster, but you need a proper player in that position. Malik in general was good against the Aussies, and he played Warne with a lot more comfort as compared to the other names to feature. Not saying Razzaq should have been dropped but not playing Saleem Malik might have been the only tactical blunder by Wasim Akram which cost him big time.

 

[SalimBhai]

Pakistan should have won the World Cup in 87 and 96 and 99

 

[Kroll]

Pakistan should have won the World Cup in 87 and 96 and 99

Something fishy about that 96 QF.

 

[sweep_shot]

They were not very strong after 2003. They could've won 1996 and 1999 ones.

 

[AAli98]

Should have would have could have.. to win a 50 over World Cup you have to be on your A game.

 

[NishanKonar]

1996 was actually Pakistan's best chance

Many people say 1999 but in that tournament Pakistan peaked early and clearly ran out of steam during the Super Six and knock outs. Both Australia and South Africa wud have beaten that Pakistan team in the final

In 1996 Pakistan had best team in the tournament for subcontinental conditions but choked badly in the quarter final

 

[Ab Fan]

It's down to poor performance from one of their ATGs in World Cup.

90s was the decade when Pakistan had :

1992- Imran, Wasim, Miandad, Inzy, Anwar( Waqar got injured)

1996- Wasim, Waqar, Saqlain, Miandad, Inzy, Anwar

1999- Wasim, Shoaib, Inzy,Anwar, Saqlain( Waqar got dropped due to poor form)

They clearly should have done better. Even 1987, they were better team than India and WC was played in subcontinent but they lost to England in semis who weren't even winners in finals.

 

[MP2011]

It's down to poor performance from one of their ATGs in World Cup.

90s was the decade when Pakistan had :

1992- Imran, Wasim, Miandad, Inzy, Anwar( Waqar got injured)

1996- Wasim, Waqar, Saqlain, Miandad, Inzy, Anwar

1999- Wasim, Shoaib, Inzy,Anwar, Saqlain( Waqar got dropped due to poor form)

They clearly should have done better. Even 1987, they were better team than India and WC was played in subcontinent but they lost to England in semis who weren't even winners in finals.

Correction: Pakistan lost to Australia in the WC '87 SF and not England. We lost to England in the other SF.

 

[Stewie]

If we had more cricket at home and our fair share of world cup games at home including a final, things would be different.

 

[NishanKonar]

It's down to poor performance from one of their ATGs in World Cup.

90s was the decade when Pakistan had :

1992- Imran, Wasim, Miandad, Inzy, Anwar( Waqar got injured)

1996- Wasim, Waqar, Saqlain, Miandad, Inzy, Anwar

1999- Wasim, Shoaib, Inzy,Anwar, Saqlain( Waqar got dropped due to poor form)

They clearly should have done better. Even 1987, they were better team than India and WC was played in subcontinent but they lost to England in semis who weren't even winners in finals.

Saqlain was a nobody in that 1996 WC

He actually started making an impact after the WC - starting with a match winning performance in the final of the Singapore tri series just after the WC

 

[Bhaijaan]

Weren’t good enough to win more.

Every other World Cup winner was better just like the 1992 team was arguably the best back then even though it did get lucky during its journey to the semi finals.

The biggest reason is the batting which has been very ordinary in the big moments. All the major batting stars have a mediocre World Cup record.

 

[umerz]

Lack of discipline and poor talent management

 

[ads101]

Pakistan has won a lot for a team that has never truly been the dominant team.

India and SA records are worse because there were large periods where they were dominant.

I think we do fine in tournaments on the whole. What I would like is to do better outside of tournaments and turn up as favourites for these tournaments not underdogs. You can’t really accrue a record like Australia as underdogs.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

If we had more cricket at home and our fair share of world cup games at home including a final, things would be different.

This is true. Fans from other countries always take this for granted.

 

[sam_ahm]

I think Pakistan had the team to win in 1999 and 2011. 1999 in particular was their huge chance and it all went wrong in the finals.

Winning the WC is not so easy, teams like South Africa and New Zealand have never won one and England only managed one after 12 attempts. It's a very difficult thing to do.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Batting is traditional weak for Pakistan. If you combine all the world cups Pakistan's batting average is above Bangladesh/Zimbabwe/Ireland. That's it. They were well below South Afriac/Austarlia/India in terms of batting. They always even dreamed about winning due to their bowling. Infact 1992 world cup was won due to Akram's magical spell. T20 win was due to bowling as well Ajmal/Gul/Afridi/Amer combo. Remember AAAG threads Three subcontinent teams lost to Australia in there world cups. Pakistan folded for 120 odd runs.

 

[topspin]

Because of Misbah's innings in Mohali

 

[jnaveen1980]

Lack of big runs from batsmen. 16 centuries in their world cup history



Bowling wise third best in world cup history for average. ER is decent. But all teams are more or less equal there. But for Pakistan there is an imbalance between batting and bowling always.



I don't know about all time world cup record for catch drops. In 2019 after first half this was the stat

 

[hitthestump]

1996 was actually Pakistan's best chance

Many people say 1999 but in that tournament Pakistan peaked early and clearly ran out of steam during the Super Six and knock outs. Both Australia and South Africa wud have beaten that Pakistan team in the final

In 1996 Pakistan had best team in the tournament for subcontinental conditions but choked badly in the quarter final

Pretty much this. That being said there was a lot of competition in '96, several teams had matchwinners in their sides. Pakistan had the most but infighting, politics and maybe even match fixing kept a leash on it.

The most talented side Pakistan have ever had on paper was in 2003. All the big guns were there. But it was a team well past it's sell by date and absolutely no match for the Aussies.

 

[Executioner]

Captaincy, toss, luck are not the primarily reasons for Pakistan not ultimately winning enough WC in the 90s (barring 1992) an 2003 WC, especially the 1999 edition. I think it was ultimately down to the pressure of expectations which kind of also haunts India - I mean India with their massive cricket crazy population have gone on to win only 2 CWCs. Subcontinental people are a bit more fickle when it comes to dealing with big games - that why is you will see NZ somehow turning it up in the CWC although they don't ultimately win.

Post 2003 CWC, Pakistan has had too many mediocre players in their outfit. There really weren't too any inform "World Class" cricketers in Pakistan side in 2011 2015 2019. Right now, I would argue that Babar and Shaheen are world class, and Imam - regardless of whether you consider him or not, statistically is very excellent.

 

[Mp812]

1999 team kost to SA,India, BD before loosing final to Aus. Thats hardly performance that suggests team was great.

 

[Jazx]

They came very close in 87, 99 and 2011 and it was their mediocre batting that let them down in all three knockouts.

 

[heddie19]

Choking I'd say. Especially in '87, '96 and '11.

 

[sweep_shot]

Pakistan also missed a great chance in 2011 World Cup. They should've won that Mohali game; they were chasing a modest target. Had they won that, they would've been favorites against Sri Lanka in the final.

 

[Bewal Express]

1999 team kost to SA,India, BD before loosing final to Aus. Thats hardly performance that suggests team was great.

It was the most complete of our teams. It had all basis covered and the loss to Ind was and still remains one of our worst defeats. I watched it live at OT, Our batting, especially from Inzi makes me suspicious to this day, just awful, truly awful. He decided that he was going to make Robin Singh, Sachin Tendulkar and Jadeja akin to Garner, Marshall and Holding. In 2003, it was an old team poorly led, 2007 we were poor and 2011, played well until the usual freezing against Ind, 2015 was just as poor team and 2019, slightly unlucky but again froze against Ind.

 

[Bewal Express]

Choking I'd say. Especially in '87, '96 and '11.

Its not often you can criticise IKS captaincy but in 1987, he made a massive error by not bowling himself and bowling Saleem Jaffar in the last over, which S Waugh smashed and handed the momentum back to Aus. There were some umpiring errors but Aus deserved to win

 

[heddie19]

Its not often you can criticise IKS captaincy but in 1987, he made a massive error by not bowling himself and bowling Saleem Jaffar in the last over, which S Waugh smashed and handed the momentum back to Aus. There were some umpiring errors but Aus deserved to win

I wasn't even born back then so I'd agree with you

 

[Bewal Express]

I wasn't even born back then so I'd agree with you

I Remember it well. PK had played really well and the Aussies ambushed with a great performance in Lahore.

 

[heddie19]

I Remember it well. PK had played really well and the Aussies ambushed with a great performance in Lahore.

Must have been a painful site, that day in LHR.

 

[controversial_man]

I wonder a strong team like Pakistan in 1999 world cup easily surrundered in the final was beyond belief.

Something was really fishy to be honest.

Hoping for the best for this world cup.

 

[Bhaag Viru Bhaag]

Nope they were against a top class Australian team. Australia did the same to India in the 2003 World Cup final.

 

[Hitman]

I wonder a strong team like Pakistan in 1999 world cup easily surrundered in the final was beyond belief.

Something was really fishy to be honest.

Hoping for the best for this world cup.

No shame losing to that Australian side. Pakistan lost to India, Bangladesh and South Africa in that 1999 WC as well.

 

[Suleiman]

Too much infighting, politics in PCB from top to bottom all the way down to the team in a good chunk of our WC campaigns where we were proper contenders to lift the title.

How will you compete for world titles when you’re too busy fighting each other- saying this to the 90s team primarily.

But since 2007, just not being good enough despite having team unity.

 

[AAli98]

Odi cricket died decades ago it’s on life support no World Cup is scheduled after 2027

Just watch how many retirements happen after this years.

 

[Major]

In hindsight, our batting sucked.

In 2011 we had the likes of Umar Akmal and Younis Khan in the middle order. Misbah was the only good batter in 2011 and 2015 world. Even the 1999 team's batting was never special.
2007 and 2003, same story. Yousuf was the only good batter back than.

Inzamam was an overated batter, he sucked in ICC tournaments and in overseas games. Younis was terrible in ODIs all together. Yousuf was good but than didnt work hard. Misbah was great. From the past Javed Miandad was great but by 1996 he was probably too old. Our batting has always had alot of holes.

This is why when people critisize the likes of Imam, Babar and Rizwan, I wonder if they remember how terrible our batting was in the past.

 

[shamaan]

In hindsight, our batting sucked.

In 2011 we had the likes of Umar Akmal and Younis Khan in the middle order. Misbah was the only good batter in 2011 and 2015 world. Even the 1999 team's batting was never special.
2007 and 2003, same story. Yousuf was the only good batter back than.

Inzamam was an overated batter, he sucked in ICC tournaments and in overseas games. Younis was terrible in ODIs all together. Yousuf was good but than didnt work hard. Misbah was great. From the past Javed Miandad was great but by 1996 he was probably too old. Our batting has always had alot of holes.

This is why when people critisize the likes of Imam, Babar and Rizwan, I wonder if they remember how terrible our batting was in the past.

Imaam is decently good atleast we can expect him not to give his wicket away and we actually get 300+ now.

 

[Cric1234]

In hindsight, our batting sucked.

In 2011 we had the likes of Umar Akmal and Younis Khan in the middle order. Misbah was the only good batter in 2011 and 2015 world. Even the 1999 team's batting was never special.
2007 and 2003, same story. Yousuf was the only good batter back than.

Inzamam was an overated batter, he sucked in ICC tournaments and in overseas games. Younis was terrible in ODIs all together. Yousuf was good but than didnt work hard. Misbah was great. From the past Javed Miandad was great but by 1996 he was probably too old. Our batting has always had alot of holes.

This is why when people critisize the likes of Imam, Babar and Rizwan, I wonder if they remember how terrible our batting was in the past.

Misbah strike rate in world cups was 74 Umar Akmals strike rate was 84 indeed Misbah was a great batter and Umar a poor one.

Check the scoreboard of the World Cup Semi Final and Asia Cup final to measure Misbahs greatness to Umar both times Umar had to bat at over 100 strike rate to make up for Misbahs great strike rate which messed up any chance Pakistan had of winning.

 

[Rana]

In hindsight, our batting sucked.

In 2011 we had the likes of Umar Akmal and Younis Khan in the middle order. Misbah was the only good batter in 2011 and 2015 world. Even the 1999 team's batting was never special.
2007 and 2003, same story. Yousuf was the only good batter back than.

Inzamam was an overated batter, he sucked in ICC tournaments and in overseas games. Younis was terrible in ODIs all together. Yousuf was good but than didnt work hard. Misbah was great. From the past Javed Miandad was great but by 1996 he was probably too old. Our batting has always had alot of holes.

This is why when people critisize the likes of Imam, Babar and Rizwan, I wonder if they remember how terrible our batting was in the past.

Babar had a great World Cup last time and his team finished 5th

What does that tell you? He’s just not that guy!

Inzimam is that guy. He can make 8x 0s on the way to the World Cup final, and he will still be in the side. Misbah thought he was that guy too according to you, but he did become that guy who played the most pointless knock in the history of world cups in the biggest game of all time

 

[Rana]

Babar had a great World Cup last time and his team finished 5th

What does that tell you? He’s just not that guy!

Inzimam is that guy. He can make 8x 0s on the way to the World Cup final, and he will still be in the side. Misbah thought he was that guy too according to you, but he did become that guy who played the most pointless knock in the history of world cups in the biggest game of all time

Babar always has great tournaments

But his team are always well short

He’s just not that guy im afraid

 

[Major]

Imaam is decently good atleast we can expect him not to give his wicket away and we actually get 300+ now.

The current pakistani team is massively talented when it comes to batting. Infact they are better than all other teams of the past in terms of batting. Thr top 4 is great. If shadab can develop as a middle order batter and ifti can be consisstent this team can win the world cup.

Batting alone can win you a world cup but bowling alone cannot.

 

[Justcrazy]

Pakistan strongest team was in 1987. Abdul qadir was batting at number 10. Pakistan lost by 18 runs , Main WK salim Yusuf got injured and Miandad Had to keep , and he gave away some legbyes and thus Pakistan could not chase this game.

1996 , Pakistan made a tactical mistake by playing Miandad who was well past prime. If they had common sense , they should have played a Batting spin all rounder instead and strengthened the batting.

1999 , another golden opportunity. Big mistake by batting first , they paid the price.

2003 , team was good on paper , but most players past prime.

2007 , Razzak and Afridi not available cost them , because Woolmer had bulit up a team based on these two gun all rounders .
2011 pakistan dropping too many catches , and again Poor batting line up. Should have promoted Razzak and Afridi up the order , instead of wasting them down the order.

 

[Justcrazy]

1996 was actually Pakistan's best chance

Many people say 1999 but in that tournament Pakistan peaked early and clearly ran out of steam during the Super Six and knock outs. Both Australia and South Africa wud have beaten that Pakistan team in the final

In 1996 Pakistan had best team in the tournament for subcontinental conditions but choked badly in the quarter final

It would have been , had they replaced Miandad with someone like Asif mujtaba

Then the Team would have been

Anwar , Sohail , Ijaz , Inzamam, Malik , Rashid , Mujtaba , Wasim , Waqar , MushTaq , Saqlain.

 

[Justcrazy]

Its not often you can criticise IKS captaincy but in 1987, he made a massive error by not bowling himself and bowling Saleem Jaffar in the last over, which S Waugh smashed and handed the momentum back to Aus. There were some umpiring errors but Aus deserved to win

Salim Yusuf regular WK got injured , Misndad was keeping

 

[Hitman]

1996 , Pakistan made a tactical mistake by playing Miandad who was well past prime. If they had common sense , they should have played a Batting spin all rounder instead and strengthened the batting.

It's been said by Miandad's own team mates like Basit Ali how he played that World Cup just on reputation, and just to make the record of playing in 6 World Cups. His performance in that World Cup was a joke! Nothing could be more selfish than what Miandad did by playing that World Cup.

 

[Bewal Express]

Salim Yusuf regular WK got injured , Misndad was keeping

It wasn't the reason we lost. Mistake by IK, losing 3 quick wickets and Aus just being better on the day

 

[Major]

Pakistan strongest team was in 1987. Abdul qadir was batting at number 10. Pakistan lost by 18 runs , Main WK salim Yusuf got injured and Miandad Had to keep , and he gave away some legbyes and thus Pakistan could not chase this game.

1996 , Pakistan made a tactical mistake by playing Miandad who was well past prime. If they had common sense , they should have played a Batting spin all rounder instead and strengthened the batting.

1999 , another golden opportunity. Big mistake by batting first , they paid the price.

2003 , team was good on paper , but most players past prime.

2007 , Razzak and Afridi not available cost them , because Woolmer had bulit up a team based on these two gun all rounders .
2011 pakistan dropping too many catches , and again Poor batting line up. Should have promoted Razzak and Afridi up the order , instead of wasting them down the order.

Razzaq and Afridi were mainly bowling allrounders not batters. 2007 world was lost due to poor batting, because as always Inzi flopped in an ICC tournament.

2011 had nothing to do with drop catches. India scored its lowest total in that world cup and it was against Pakistan. It was chaseable, but our batting got exposed. Younis Khan and Umar Akmal were terrible batters. Razzaq and Afridi would had done nothing. It was an odi world cup not t20.

Razzaq was a dud. Ever since he made that 100 against South Africa and won us that game, he went to play 15 odi games and had no performance with the bat to show for.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Razzaq and Afridi were mainly bowling allrounders not batters. 2007 world was lost due to poor batting, because as always Inzi flopped in an ICC tournament.

2011 had nothing to do with drop catches. India scored its lowest total in that world cup and it was against Pakistan. It was chaseable, but our batting got exposed. Younis Khan and Umar Akmal were terrible batters. Razzaq and Afridi would had done nothing. It was an odi world cup not t20.

Razzaq was a dud. Ever since he made that 100 against South Africa and won us that game, he went to play 15 odi games and had no performance with the bat to show for.

Misbah was a bigger dud than Umar Akmal in that World Cup. The biggest predictor of World Cup success is batting strike rate and Misbah, Shafiq, Shehzad, Kamran and YK were all terrible. SR in early 70's in 2011 was an absolute crime.

//ly, in 1999, Inzi, Ijaz, Wajahat, Afridi, and Malik were absolutely useless on those wickets. That batting lineup was being carried by Moin(MVP), Wasim, Anwar, and MoYo.

 

[Major]

Misbah was a bigger dud than Umar Akmal in that World Cup. The biggest predictor of World Cup success is batting strike rate and Misbah, Shafiq, Shehzad, Kamran and YK were all terrible. SR in early 70's in 2011 was an absolute crime.

//ly, in 1999, Inzi, Ijaz, Wajahat, Afridi, and Malik were absolutely useless on those wickets. That batting lineup was being carried by Moin(MVP), Wasim, Anwar, and MoYo.

Umm no.

 

[Bhaijaan]

They might win one this year. I can sense something about this team.

 

[Cric1234]

Misbah was a bigger dud than Umar Akmal in that World Cup. The biggest predictor of World Cup success is batting strike rate and Misbah, Shafiq, Shehzad, Kamran and YK were all terrible. SR in early 70's in 2011 was an absolute crime.

//ly, in 1999, Inzi, Ijaz, Wajahat, Afridi, and Malik were absolutely useless on those wickets. That batting lineup was being carried by Moin(MVP), Wasim, Anwar, and MoYo.

Misbah saved his best for the last World Cup match he played 34 of 59 balls against Australia in 2015 a strike rate of 57 he had to beat his previous records and decided to go lower this time.

It seems like one poster is not looking at the scoreboards but making stats up from air to make a batsman look great somehow when it’s the exact opposite in any big knockout match he played.

 

[Justcrazy]

It's been said by Miandad's own team mates like Basit Ali how he played that World Cup just on reputation, and just to make the record of playing in 6 World Cups. His performance in that World Cup was a joke! Nothing could be more selfish than what Miandad did by playing that World Cup.

You cannot play games to make records , Miandad was absolutely over the hill at that point of time , if he had not played and instead a batting all rounder included , Pakistan chances would have increased.

 

[Justcrazy]

It wasn't the reason we lost. Mistake by IK, losing 3 quick wickets and Aus just being better on the day

That was one of the mistakes.

 

[Justcrazy]

Razzaq and Afridi were mainly bowling allrounders not batters. 2007 world was lost due to poor batting, because as always Inzi flopped in an ICC tournament.

2011 had nothing to do with drop catches. India scored its lowest total in that world cup and it was against Pakistan. It was chaseable, but our batting got exposed. Younis Khan and Umar Akmal were terrible batters. Razzaq and Afridi would had done nothing. It was an odi world cup not t20.

Razzaq was a dud. Ever since he made that 100 against South Africa and won us that game, he went to play 15 odi games and had no performance with the bat to show for.

Yes it was poor batting , but the team formation what Woolmer build relied heavily on Razzak and Afridi for lower order hitting , suddenly injury to them made it difficult to make a good playing XI.

Look I am not saying that Afridi or Razzak would have won the game , but they should have been utilized when the power play was on , to give them maximum chance. A quick cameo by one of them would have reduced the pressure.

 

[gazza619]

Considering Pakistan’s resources and political turmoil in last 15 years, i think they have done pretty well in ICC tournaments.

Our current batch is good and I expect at least 2 trophies in the next decade.

 

[VForVendetta]

Because they weren't good(best) enough most of the times. Let's examine the editions where Pakistani fans/media believe they should've won or atleast had chance.
87 : Yes, this one was truly dropped. The mighty Windies had lost most of their fast bowling attack & while they were still incredible they simply weren't invincible anymore. Aussies were going through a tough transition period & English weren't expected to topple the subcontinent giants. That leaves Pak & India, the true favorites. The reality is they played poorly against an average Aus. Their chasing method was as usual pretty one dimensional & unimaginative.Leaving too many runs at the end & hoping one of their top guys(Javed,Imran, Malik) will somehow finish it. This predictable strategy was not always going to work specially against a shrewd tactician like AB who knew how to get the job done with his limited resources. Pak got away with this exact approach in 92 simply because they had guys like Inzy,Moin & much improved Akram at the back end.

96 : They were hot favorites but come knockouts it had been proven they were not as good as they thought (still think) they were. They couldn't handle the Proteas & I don't think they could've handled the Aussies. Most importantly I don't believe they could've stopped the Srilankan juggernauts even with their almighty bowling attack. They underperformed certainly, but I don't see them surpassing both Sri & Aus. Simply put they didn't have the skill of the former & willpower of the latter.

99 : Without a shadow of doubt the most balanced & strongest white ball unit they ever have had. But again no way they were better than Aus & SA(the true dog of the era). Fitness,fielding,discipline,strategy & most importantly aggression they were lacking in all of this behind Aus & SA.Inconsistent Great bowling with gun lower order power hittning was never going to be good enough to win the title against such teams. Specially considering all had witnessed this exact formula in 1992. Pak needed to lift their fielding & ofcourse their so called great batters (other than Anwar) had to perform. I don't think Pak's loss was injustice. The real injustice happened with SA. Pak were good enough for semis & they actually bettered it.

03 : It's ludicrous even to suggest they had even the faintest of chances to win. But you have clueless ex-cricketers like Amir Sohel claiming they were one of the contenders! On paper, the team looked like million bucks. But on reality they were resembling beggars. Forget Aus/SA, the reality was they were easily the worst of the 8 traditional sides. At one side you had aging legends who were still bitter about past & wouldn't admit their best days were long gone. At other end you had guys who were supposed to be at their prime(Afridi, Akhtar, Razzak, Yousuf) having no clue or plan how to uplift the team. The captain & the vice captain being the worst performers of the side with ball & bat respectively really had shown their true worth at the time.

11 : The reality is they weren't exactly at great form. They had basically lost every bilateral & tournament in previous two years. Just before the world cup they managed to defeat a poor struggling NZ side. But somehow against all odds they defeated the favorites Aus,Sri & actually managed to topple the group. That Indian side was better than them in all departments on any given day regardless of conditions. Still they had them within their grasp only to choke for the thousandth time. Apart from Wahab, Hafeez & Junior Akmal rest of them had either no clue or they thought it was still the good old 90's! That's what their body language suggested. I don't want to talk about that precious Misbah knock as there is nothing left to talk. I'll say this though, it was really unfortunate for them that their main strike bowler chose this day to lose form. Gul was breathing fire upto that point. Much like Waqar's 96 mauling, he was never the same after this. Afridi,Younus & Misbah never should have played another 50 over game after this, the fact that not only they played but went to next world cup shows you how clueless Pak cricket system is.

All in all, I would say they have achieved more or less according to their talent & vision. As for this world cup, I predict semifinal at best & don't think they can defeat any of the big 3 at knockout stages.

 

[VForVendetta]

Because they weren't good(best) enough most of the times. Let's examine the editions where Pakistani fans/media believe they should've won or atleast had chance.
87 : Yes, this one was truly dropped. The mighty Windies had lost most of their fast bowling attack & while they were still incredible they simply weren't invincible anymore. Aussies were going through a tough transition period & English weren't expected to topple the subcontinent giants. That leaves Pak & India, the true favorites. The reality is they played poorly against an average Aus. Their chasing method was as usual pretty one dimensional & unimaginative.Leaving too many runs at the end & hoping one of their top guys(Javed,Imran, Malik) will somehow finish it. This predictable strategy was not always going to work specially against a shrewd tactician like AB who knew how to get the job done with his limited resources. Pak got away with this exact approach in 92 simply because they had guys like Inzy,Moin & much improved Akram at the back end.

96 : They were hot favorites but come knockouts it had been proven they were not as good as they thought (still think) they were. They couldn't handle the Proteas & I don't think they could've handled the Aussies. Most importantly I don't believe they could've stopped the Srilankan juggernauts even with their almighty bowling attack. They underperformed certainly, but I don't see them surpassing both Sri & Aus. Simply put they didn't have the skill of the former & willpower of the latter.

99 : Without a shadow of doubt the most balanced & strongest white ball unit they ever have had. But again no way they were better than Aus & SA(the true top dog of the era). Fitness,fielding,discipline,strategy & most importantly aggression they were lacking in all of this behind Aus & SA.Inconsistent great bowling with gun lower order power hitting was never going to be good enough to win the title against such teams. Specially considering all had witnessed this exact formula in 1992. Pak needed to lift their fielding & ofcourse their so called great batters (other than Anwar) had to perform. I don't think Pak's loss was injustice. The real injustice happened with SA. Pak were good enough for semis & they actually bettered it.

03 : It's ludicrous even to suggest they had even the faintest of chances to win. But you have clueless ex-cricketers like Amir Sohel claiming they were one of the contenders! On paper, the team looked like million bucks. But on reality they were resembling beggars. Forget Aus/SA, the reality was they were easily the worst of the 8 traditional sides. At one side you had aging legends who were still bitter about past & wouldn't admit their best days were long gone. At other end you had guys who were supposed to be at their prime(Afridi, Akhtar, Razzak, Yousuf) having no clue or plan how to uplift the team. The captain & the vice captain being the worst performers of the side with ball & bat respectively really had shown their true worth at the time.

11 : The reality is they weren't exactly at great form. They had basically lost every bilateral & tournament in previous two years. Just before the world cup they managed to defeat a poor struggling NZ side. But somehow against all odds they defeated the favorites Aus,Sri & actually managed to topple the group. That Indian side was better than them in all departments on any given day regardless of conditions. Still they had them within their grasp only to choke for the thousandth time. Apart from Wahab, Hafeez & Junior Akmal rest of them had either no clue or they thought it was still the good old 90's! That's what their body language suggested. I don't want to talk about that precious Misbah knock as there is nothing left to talk. I'll say this though, it was really unfortunate for them that their main strike bowler chose this day to lose form. Gul was breathing fire upto that point. Much like Waqar's 96 mauling, he was never the same after this. Afridi,Younus & Misbah never should have played another 50 over game after this, the fact that not only they played but went to next world cup shows you how clueless Pak cricket system is.

All in all, I would say they have achieved more or less according to their talent & vision. As for this world cup, I predict semifinal at best & don't think they can defeat any of the big 3 at knockout stages.

 

[Ab Fan]

Waqar Younis bottled in World Cups which is why in 90s, inspite of being a strong team throughout the decade, they failed to win the trophy whether it was 1996 or 1999. When he didn't played in 1992, Pakistan won the tournament.

 

[VForVendetta]

Waqar Younis bottled in World Cups which is why in 90s, inspite of being a strong team throughout the decade, they failed to win the trophy whether it was 1996 or 1999. When he didn't played in 1992, Pakistan won the tournament.

Are you serious? How can you blame that guy who played only one match in 99? Which btw happened to be the most inconsequential match of the tournament. As for 96 Miandad & Sohel are equally responsible. Miandad basically played the same knock that 15 years later Misbah had replicated. Sohel on an absurd attempt to bully the trundler got humiliated & exposed their aging middle order.

 

[Ab Fan]

Are you serious? How can you blame that guy who played only one match in 99? Which btw happened to be the most inconsequential match of the tournament. As for 96 Miandad & Sohel are equally responsible. Miandad basically played the same knock that 15 years later Misbah had replicated. Sohel on an absurd attempt to bully the trundler got humiliated & exposed their aging middle order.

Yes. Both Miandad and Waqar bottled in the must win knockout game in '96. Can't blame Sohail, he played a top knock at good rate. Rest didn't took the responsibility. Waqar was also poor with bowl ended up leaking 67 runs in 10 overs.

Miandad also played a poor knock in 1992 World Cup Final where he scored 58 of 98 at strike rate of 59 but thankfully Wasim bailed him with his quickfire knock and his spell with bowl. Imran also played a top knock at a SR over 65.

For Pakistan, Imran and Wasim were always their prized players in big games while Waqar and Miandad generally disappointed in World Cups which is why Pakistan failed to win more than one World Cup inspite of being a dominant force in 1990s and 1980s.

 

[VForVendetta]

Yes. Both Miandad and Waqar bottled in the must win knockout game in '96. Can't blame Sohail, he played a top knock at good rate. Rest didn't took the responsibility. Waqar was also poor with bowl ended up leaking 67 runs in 10 overs.

Miandad also played a poor knock in 1992 World Cup Final where he scored 58 of 98 at strike rate of 59 but thankfully Wasim bailed him with his quickfire knock and his spell with bowl. Imran also played a top knock at a SR over 65.

For Pakistan, Imran and Wasim were always their prized players in big games while Waqar and Miandad generally disappointed in World Cups which is why Pakistan failed to win more than one World Cup inspite of being a dominant force in 1990s and 1980s.

You can absolutely blame Sohel. Yes he played a top knock, but he should have used his brain instead of guts. He was the captain, after such a magnificent start he should have played more maturely & guide his team to victory. Instead what does he do? He tries to humiliate Prasad for absolutely zero reason. There was no provocation from Indian side, he pulled that stunt simply to satisfy his ego because he underestimated his opponents. That top knock could have been a legendary knock if only he could have controlled his emotion.
As for Imran / Miandad debate, well Imran played a far far worse knock in semifinal. Thank goodness for Inzy & Moin,otherwise Imran's legacy would have been tarnished that day. The reality is both Imran & Miandad are guilty of taking things easy & playing some truly pathetic knocks over the years. Remember that knock Miandad played against India at that same edition? In my opinion that is the worst knock ever from a Pakistani in world cup. Far worse than Misbah(11) or Inzy(99). Imran & Miandad don't really get called out for their various failures in ODI's due to their unparalleled GOAT stature in Pak cricket.
Objectively speaking, only Akram & Anwar have been the two guys who generally have performed consistently & on crunch occasions in ICC tournaments. Rest of the legends have been either one hit wonders or mostly average.

 

[Markhor]

They never won enough matches going into these World Cups. History shows that after batting strike rates, the most important metric to look at is the W/L ratio of teams for two years prior to the World Cup. PAK was good at the former but rarely as good at the latter metric.

They kept coming across teams that consistently won for longer periods. This matters because World Cups can have 10, 11 games. PAK, in the past, looked a million dollars in the first round and then looked iffy by Super Six/Quarters - when you need players who are battle-hardened and have high fitness standards, and can maintain their performance over 10 matches.

1999 is the perfect example of this. Shoaib's pace, Wasim's reverse swing, terrific lower-order hitting, etc. just got Pakistan across the line against WI and OZ in the group stage.

But BD game onwards, the standards started slipping. Shoaib got wayward against SA and got hammered by Klusener at crucial moments. Shoaib once again failed against India and on a slowing pitch, the lower-order hitters failed, exposing the batting lineup as a whole.

And in the final, they collapsed on a perfectly reasonable pitch which only had some pace and bounce. OZ on the other hand was spot on. Mark Waugh taking screamers, Mcgrath bowling some of his fastest stuff while still being accurate, Warne spinning it big and Gilchrist attacking the ball with murderous intent.

The difference was night and day.

That's why I'm optimistic about our chances this year. Our ODI W/L ratio since the last World Cup is the best in the world by a distance at 2.375.

The other likely predictors of World Cup success as outlined in Hitting Against the Spin, the excellent book written by the analysts at CricViz, are experience and batting performances.

Well this ODI team has been settled for a long time. We can already name the vast majority of the starting XI. Our batting average (38.79) is 3rd best and our RPO of 5.75 is 4th best. So the key metrics are looking good.

We just need everyone to stay fit. I hope our pacers aren't killing themselves playing this useless Hundred competition.

 

[Cric1234]

That's why I'm optimistic about our chances this year. Our ODI W/L ratio since the last World Cup is the best in the world by a distance at 2.375.

The other likely predictors of World Cup success as outlined in Hitting Against the Spin, the excellent book written by the analysts at CricViz, are experience and batting performances.

Well this ODI team has been settled for a long time. We can already name the vast majority of the starting XI. Our batting average (38.79) is 3rd best and our RPO of 5.75 is 4th best. So the key metrics are looking good.

We just need everyone to stay fit. I hope our pacers aren't killing themselves playing this useless Hundred competition.

It could because we’ve played mostly B teams on flat wickets the only series against a full strength New Zealand team in recent times was a 2-1 loss in Pakistan.

Past teams had weaker batting line ups but were always up against full strength teams in varied conditions that means playing the best fast bowlers and spinners in helpful conditions for bowling which you hardly see now it’s all flat wickets.

It remains to be seen whether our batsmen can outscore the best teams on likely flat wickets in India.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

It could because we’ve played mostly B teams on flat wickets the only series against a full strength New Zealand team in recent times was a 2-1 loss in Pakistan.

Past teams had weaker batting line ups but were always up against full strength teams in varied conditions that means playing the best fast bowlers and spinners in helpful conditions for bowling which you hardly see now it’s all flat wickets.

It remains to be seen whether our batsmen can outscore the best teams on likely flat wickets in India.

On a flat batting track, Pakistan's dynamic batting lineup can transforms into an unstoppable force... Its a perfect combination going into the worldcup.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

That's why I'm optimistic about our chances this year. Our ODI W/L ratio since the last World Cup is the best in the world by a distance at 2.375.

The other likely predictors of World Cup success as outlined in Hitting Against the Spin, the excellent book written by the analysts at CricViz, are experience and batting performances.

Well this ODI team has been settled for a long time. We can already name the vast majority of the starting XI. Our batting average (38.79) is 3rd best and our RPO of 5.75 is 4th best. So the key metrics are looking good.

We just need everyone to stay fit. I hope our pacers aren't killing themselves playing this useless Hundred competition.

The only limiting factor is the sample size this time around. Thanks to the diminishing number of ODIs and the impact of Covid, has any team played enough matches to come to a conclusion ?

But Pakistan are certainly in with a genuine chance this time. No doubt about it. They have put up and chased upto 340 + and they have won consistently.

Also Grant Bradburn and Mickey Arthur are determined to get the team to score quicker in the middle overs so they have truly identified what needs to be done and kudos for that

 

[Cric1234]

The only limiting factor is the sample size this time around. Thanks to the diminishing number of ODIs and the impact of Covid, has any team played enough matches to come to a conclusion ?

But Pakistan are certainly in with a genuine chance this time. No doubt about it. They have put up and chased upto 340 + and they have won consistently.

Also Grant Bradburn and Mickey Arthur are determined to get the team to score quicker in the middle overs so they have truly identified what needs to be done and kudos for that

Those chases were against B teams where the main fast bowlers were being rested it doesn’t indicate Pakistan chasing big scores against the best teams consistently we saw that when New Zealand beat Pakistan 2-1 with a full strength team.

 

[Cricket Warrior]

Those chases were against B teams where the main fast bowlers were being rested it doesn’t indicate Pakistan chasing big scores against the best teams consistently we saw that when New Zealand beat Pakistan 2-1 with a full strength team.

B teams doesnt throw Under arm balls.. Bowlers typically come into international cricket through a combination of talent, performance, hard work, and opportunities so its now about B or C team, its all about the talent.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Those chases were against B teams where the main fast bowlers were being rested it doesn’t indicate Pakistan chasing big scores against the best teams consistently we saw that when New Zealand beat Pakistan 2-1 with a full strength team.

Doesn't matter that much. England beat a lot of B sides in the run to the World Cup last time. Australia did not have a lot of main players in 2018 and they beat India without Bumrah and Shami etc. Whereas got whitewashed by B, C Australian and English sides.

Last time, Pakistan was going to the PAK v ENG World Cup match with a 3 wins 22 losses record against top sides since 2017 CT. This time, they are loads better. And last time, they nearly qualified for semis.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Doesn't matter that much. England beat a lot of B sides in the run to the World Cup last time. Australia did not have a lot of main players in 2018 and they beat India without Bumrah and Shami etc. Whereas got whitewashed by B, C Australian and English sides.

Last time, Pakistan was going to the PAK v ENG World Cup match with a 3 wins 22 losses record against top sides since 2017 CT. This time, they are loads better. And last time, they nearly qualified for semis.

*Whereas Pakistan

 

[Cric1234]

B teams doesnt throw Under arm balls.. Bowlers typically come into international cricket through a combination of talent, performance, hard work, and opportunities so its now about B or C team, its all about the talent.

Well chasing against Starc Cummins and Hazlewood is different to the inexperienced reserve fast bowlers don’t you think also Australia were missing Smith Warner Maxwell and others in that series.

 

[Hitman]

Waqar Younis bottled in World Cups which is why in 90s, inspite of being a strong team throughout the decade, they failed to win the trophy whether it was 1996 or 1999. When he didn't played in 1992, Pakistan won the tournament.

He was born to choke.

 

[owenhcricket]

Hi guys, my first post here. Great to see the forum back! (I would have joined but the forum section ended). Hey ho, here now and just in time for the Asia Cup and World Cup.

So to the question at hand and just skimming some of the responses they fail to take into account the fact that...you know, other teams could have just been better even if Pakistan were very good.

1996 Pakistan were a decent side but in transition.

In 1999 Pakistan were either the best or second best ODI side around with the right mix of experience and youth and won 4 straight games in the group stages, including a win over eventual winners Australia, a very good kiwi side and a still decent Windies team. The loss to SA was close and a loss to India was by now standard in WC games. Getting through to the final, they came up against a side that included Warne, McGrath, Ponting, Waugh and Gilly, all of whom would usher in the greatest ODI nation in the games history which would go on to win the next two world cups with relative ease.

Pakistan not winning in 03, or 07 is meaningless because everyone else was competing for second best anyway.

2011 is probably the biggest blunder and the one time you could say a class team choked by letting India off the hook several times in the semi.

By 2015 Pakistan were a middling team and getting to the QF was not a bad result, losing to eventual winners...you guessed it, Australia.

In 2019 we all know the story, bad results to begin with but exceptional performances to get back in the picture and to lose out on run rate.