What's new

Why have we not been able to convert our T20I dominance into ODI success?

msb314

ODI Debutant
Joined
Oct 29, 2014
Runs
10,776
Post of the Week
2
Food for thought for the PP’ers! 🍔

After all - ODI’s are now merely considered an extension of the T20 format.

So why haven’t we been as successful in ODI’s as we are in T20’s?
 
We only have one batsman who can play an odi knock :ba
But i am hopefull that odi success is not far away
 
Because most teams don't care about T20s and turn up better prepared in ODIs.

Also, Pakistan has a decent ODI team. The flawed strategy at Asia Cup made it look bad.
 
Food for thought for the PP’ers! 🍔

After all - ODI’s are now merely considered an extension of the T20 format.

So why haven’t we been as successful in ODI’s as we are in T20’s?

A few reasons.

Because we have an excellent T20 captain who's manic style is tailor made for the format, however mixed a bag he otherwise is.

Because we are a mediocre batting side, as evidenced by our middling scores, but in T20 the failure of batsmen to score is masked.

Because in T20 bowling is more critical than batting, and we have good T20 bowlers.
 
Because we can only play 20 overs with top 5-6 batsman, not 40
 
Pakistan put in too much effort in T20Is unlike most other teams. Most nations really care about T20Is only during T20WC

I feel Pakistan should put in more resources in ODIs and tests.

Looking at Pakistan side, there are hardly any dynamic batsman in the middle order sans Malik. You need someone who can bat sensibly at 30-4 and also someone to take risks when team is 150-4
 
Heh, good thread. One of the reasons is we glorify T20s more than others and do OTT celebrations.

Every other team in the world, except west Indies takes other formats more seriously.

We do not have the quality to be high ranked in the other formats. Right now we're just good for 10-20 runs from each batsman.

Requires both physical and mental expertise to bat 50+ overs.
 
In T20Is you can get away with cameos from subpar batsmen. In ODIs you need batsman who know how to bat long at a decent click.
 
Lack of batting quality. Even in T20s pakistan doesn't rake up huge scores. It is bowling that saves them. Not even a single batsman in the mold of rohit, dhawan, butler, bairstow, ross taylor.. (forget kohli, root types). Fakhar is hit and miss. Babar takes time to settle in.
 
Too much emphasis on T20...an absolute waste of space.

T20 is only for domestic leagues...

Hey, we dont even have the world cup anymore every 2 years.

Pakistan's Achillies Heal is clearly masked in T20s...

As someone pointed out earlier in odis you need proper batsmen with the ability to rotate strike which we dont have nor do we have proven explosive hitters yet...here is hoping for Asif and Faheem...!
 
T20 is not a joke format. It's a format where the wheat is separated from chaff after the grind of a league like structure. Sporadic T20 internationals reduce this format to a lottery, one reason why most international teams don't take it seriously.
 
What I find surprising is how in T20 we take more wickets than any other team ( I think Pakistan has the best record of bowling sides out). But, somehow in ODI we just cant take those wickets upfront. Maybe in ODI our game plan is different, or maybe t20 we get wickets only because the batsman is trying ti hit out and our bowlers keep on bowling the wicket-to-wicket lines. As soon as we start taking wickets upfront in ODI things will change. Having Abbas might help. Also, Asif Ali really needs to go from the ODI team. Hafeez is a much better option.
 
Pakistan focuses on T20I way more than other teams. For most nations, T20 is all about leagues, T20Is are basically picnic matches apart from the WC.

Teams like India, South Africa don't play even play half of their regular ODI members in T20Is, it's mostly used to test bench strength. T20 leagues are the real deal.

Pakistan should focus more on ODIs and PSL. T20Is should be left to test new players and reserve players.
 
What dominance? There is nothing to look into it other then our fans forgetting their “aukat” as usual.

This is a mediocre team that has been made to look good because of some buffet fixtures.

A team where trash batsmen like Asif Ali, Sarfraz, Faheem and Shadab are occupying important positions in the batting lineup cannot be the best T20 team in the world. Furthermore, you have two anchors in the top three and one of them is nearly 40 years old.

The bowling attack itself is nothing special.

Everyone is doing victory lapping over the 10 consecutive series that we have won, but let’s break them down:

1-0 in England - very good isolated win, but it was only 1 match. It does not tell us much - considering England’s batting power, they would beat us more often than not.

Back to back series wins vs West Indies - yes they have won the WT20 twice, but not all of their 2016 winning players played in that series, and besides, they struggle on the slow Caribbean and UAE wickets.

World XI - seriously? Are people actually counting that joke series as part of the winning streak? May as well count the gully mohallay matches that these players might have played and won during off-season.

Sri Lanka - they have become very weak in Limited Overs, and get bashed by everyone 9/10 times.

New Zealand - impressive series win, but their most dangerous T20 player was not available for the decider and the short boundaries bridged the gap between the two batting sides. However, the team deserves credit for the win.

West Indies in Pakistan - this was more impressive than the wins over them in the Caribbean and in the UAE, since the pitches in Pakistan are flat and conductive for big hitting.

Scotland - nothing needs to be said.

Wins against Australia in the tri-series and in the ongoing series - again, impressive, but let’s not forget the fact that Australia did not have Warner and Smith (pretty good T20 player over the last couple of years, especially on Asian pitches).

The only truly impressive wins were against Australia and in New Zealand. Our fixtures have not been balanced either - we have only played 1 match against England, none against India, none against South Africa and 10 against the West Indies.

Such an imbalanced ratio of games against different opponents hide more than they show.

India would smash us everywhere, but if we were to face them in the UAE, it will be as big a humiliation as the Asia Cup. Bangladesh will also probably beat us, and even Afghanistan will take the game to the 40th over in the UAE.

We have been marginally better in T20s compared to ODIs because the weaknesses of this team are less exposed over 40 overs compared to 100 overs, but much like our ODI and Test squads, our T20 squad also stinks of mediocrity and we are by no means the best T20 team in the world, and if there is a World T20 today, we will not win it.

The 10 consecutive series wins and the number one ranking look impressive, but it is important not to lose perception either.

However, I guess our fans deserve some breathing space - they have been jolted by the humiliation and the cruel reality check in the Asia Cup, and the subsequent realization that even a Kohli-less India is three levels above us.

Moreover, not to forget getting owned by Bangladesh after taking cheap shots and making fun of them for years based on nothing but hollow, cheap arrogance. That loss in the Asia Cup was some sweet, sweet justice, and our fans had it coming.

I actually respect the Bangladeshi fans for not rubbing it in as much as they should have. They exhibited a lot of class and dignity which we probably would not have showed in the same situation.

Hence, I do not blame our fans for their over the top celebrations and for turning a blind eye to the weaknesses of this T20 team. They get upset when I say this, but whenever our fans get their heads in the clouds, a reality check follows to bring them back to earth. Well, at least they cannot say that I do not warn them.

The Asia Cup was a timely reality check to blow up the myth that we are a much improved ODI outfit and can beat any team, and it was a brutal reality check. We already got one in New Zealand early in the year, but our fans paid no heed, and the Asia Cup was its result.

This myth of Pakistan being the rightful number one T20 team will blow up into smithereens as well, but unfortunately we do not get to play India and the next World T20 is two years ago. A World T20 in 2018 would have been a very timely reality check.
 
Teams like India, South Africa don't play even play half of their regular ODI members in T20Is

Yes thats why India selected full strength t20 squad for upcoming Aus series?

Matlab kuch bhi?

Tired of getting these lame excuses by Indians and pseudo Pakistani fans.
 
Yes thats why India selected full strength t20 squad for upcoming Aus series?

Matlab kuch bhi?

Tired of getting these lame excuses by Indians and pseudo Pakistani fans.

They do it some times, not always. Players like Washinton Sundar can only make debut in T20Is to be assesed before draft into ODI squad. T20Is are still mostly experimentation.
 
Because just one batsman can win you a T20. But 1 batsman alone cannot win you an ODI. PCT is often short on quality batsmen in ODIs and tests. That flaw is covered in T20s because of the shortened length of the game.
 
What dominance? There is nothing to look into it other then our fans forgetting their “aukat” as usual.

This is a mediocre team that has been made to look good because of some buffet fixtures.

A team where trash batsmen like Asif Ali, Sarfraz, Faheem and Shadab are occupying important positions in the batting lineup cannot be the best T20 team in the world. Furthermore, you have two anchors in the top three and one of them is nearly 40 years old.

The bowling attack itself is nothing special.

Everyone is doing victory lapping over the 10 consecutive series that we have won, but let’s break them down:

1-0 in England - very good isolated win, but it was only 1 match. It does not tell us much - considering England’s batting power, they would beat us more often than not.

Back to back series wins vs West Indies - yes they have won the WT20 twice, but not all of their 2016 winning players played in that series, and besides, they struggle on the slow Caribbean and UAE wickets.

World XI - seriously? Are people actually counting that joke series as part of the winning streak? May as well count the gully mohallay matches that these players might have played and won during off-season.

Sri Lanka - they have become very weak in Limited Overs, and get bashed by everyone 9/10 times.

New Zealand - impressive series win, but their most dangerous T20 player was not available for the decider and the short boundaries bridged the gap between the two batting sides. However, the team deserves credit for the win.

West Indies in Pakistan - this was more impressive than the wins over them in the Caribbean and in the UAE, since the pitches in Pakistan are flat and conductive for big hitting.

Scotland - nothing needs to be said.

Wins against Australia in the tri-series and in the ongoing series - again, impressive, but let’s not forget the fact that Australia did not have Warner and Smith (pretty good T20 player over the last couple of years, especially on Asian pitches).

The only truly impressive wins were against Australia and in New Zealand. Our fixtures have not been balanced either - we have only played 1 match against England, none against India, none against South Africa and 10 against the West Indies.

Such an imbalanced ratio of games against different opponents hide more than they show.

India would smash us everywhere, but if we were to face them in the UAE, it will be as big a humiliation as the Asia Cup. Bangladesh will also probably beat us, and even Afghanistan will take the game to the 40th over in the UAE.

We have been marginally better in T20s compared to ODIs because the weaknesses of this team are less exposed over 40 overs compared to 100 overs, but much like our ODI and Test squads, our T20 squad also stinks of mediocrity and we are by no means the best T20 team in the world, and if there is a World T20 today, we will not win it.

The 10 consecutive series wins and the number one ranking look impressive, but it is important not to lose perception either.

However, I guess our fans deserve some breathing space - they have been jolted by the humiliation and the cruel reality check in the Asia Cup, and the subsequent realization that even a Kohli-less India is three levels above us.

Moreover, not to forget getting owned by Bangladesh after taking cheap shots and making fun of them for years based on nothing but hollow, cheap arrogance. That loss in the Asia Cup was some sweet, sweet justice, and our fans had it coming.

I actually respect the Bangladeshi fans for not rubbing it in as much as they should have. They exhibited a lot of class and dignity which we probably would not have showed in the same situation.

Hence, I do not blame our fans for their over the top celebrations and for turning a blind eye to the weaknesses of this T20 team. They get upset when I say this, but whenever our fans get their heads in the clouds, a reality check follows to bring them back to earth. Well, at least they cannot say that I do not warn them.

The Asia Cup was a timely reality check to blow up the myth that we are a much improved ODI outfit and can beat any team, and it was a brutal reality check. We already got one in New Zealand early in the year, but our fans paid no heed, and the Asia Cup was its result.

This myth of Pakistan being the rightful number one T20 team will blow up into smithereens as well, but unfortunately we do not get to play India and the next World T20 is two years ago. A World T20 in 2018 would have been a very timely reality check.

Although we played terribly in Asia Cup due to bad selections and indifferent captaincy combined with lack of form from Fakhar and Sarfraz, my question is, is India really that much better than Pak considering they are struggling to beat West Indies - the same team we always dominate against?
You should also consider the lack of international games Pak players get against quality opponents as oppose to team like India and the fact we do not get to play at home. UAE is nothing like home. All things considered I am happy with Pak progress. At UAE we wins all series except the last Sri Lanka series and away from home no teams are head and shoulders ahead of us when playing on unfamiliar pitches.
So I am really enjoying the T20 series against a quality Aus team .
 
Last edited:
What dominance? There is nothing to look into it other then our fans forgetting their “aukat” as usual.

This is a mediocre team that has been made to look good because of some buffet fixtures.

A team where trash batsmen like Asif Ali, Sarfraz, Faheem and Shadab are occupying important positions in the batting lineup cannot be the best T20 team in the world. Furthermore, you have two anchors in the top three and one of them is nearly 40 years old.

The bowling attack itself is nothing special.

Everyone is doing victory lapping over the 10 consecutive series that we have won, but let’s break them down:

1-0 in England - very good isolated win, but it was only 1 match. It does not tell us much - considering England’s batting power, they would beat us more often than not.

Back to back series wins vs West Indies - yes they have won the WT20 twice, but not all of their 2016 winning players played in that series, and besides, they struggle on the slow Caribbean and UAE wickets.

World XI - seriously? Are people actually counting that joke series as part of the winning streak? May as well count the gully mohallay matches that these players might have played and won during off-season.

Sri Lanka - they have become very weak in Limited Overs, and get bashed by everyone 9/10 times.

New Zealand - impressive series win, but their most dangerous T20 player was not available for the decider and the short boundaries bridged the gap between the two batting sides. However, the team deserves credit for the win.

West Indies in Pakistan - this was more impressive than the wins over them in the Caribbean and in the UAE, since the pitches in Pakistan are flat and conductive for big hitting.

Scotland - nothing needs to be said.

Wins against Australia in the tri-series and in the ongoing series - again, impressive, but let’s not forget the fact that Australia did not have Warner and Smith (pretty good T20 player over the last couple of years, especially on Asian pitches).

The only truly impressive wins were against Australia and in New Zealand. Our fixtures have not been balanced either - we have only played 1 match against England, none against India, none against South Africa and 10 against the West Indies.

Such an imbalanced ratio of games against different opponents hide more than they show.

India would smash us everywhere, but if we were to face them in the UAE, it will be as big a humiliation as the Asia Cup. Bangladesh will also probably beat us, and even Afghanistan will take the game to the 40th over in the UAE.

We have been marginally better in T20s compared to ODIs because the weaknesses of this team are less exposed over 40 overs compared to 100 overs, but much like our ODI and Test squads, our T20 squad also stinks of mediocrity and we are by no means the best T20 team in the world, and if there is a World T20 today, we will not win it.

The 10 consecutive series wins and the number one ranking look impressive, but it is important not to lose perception either.

However, I guess our fans deserve some breathing space - they have been jolted by the humiliation and the cruel reality check in the Asia Cup, and the subsequent realization that even a Kohli-less India is three levels above us.

Moreover, not to forget getting owned by Bangladesh after taking cheap shots and making fun of them for years based on nothing but hollow, cheap arrogance. That loss in the Asia Cup was some sweet, sweet justice, and our fans had it coming.

I actually respect the Bangladeshi fans for not rubbing it in as much as they should have. They exhibited a lot of class and dignity which we probably would not have showed in the same situation.

Hence, I do not blame our fans for their over the top celebrations and for turning a blind eye to the weaknesses of this T20 team. They get upset when I say this, but whenever our fans get their heads in the clouds, a reality check follows to bring them back to earth. Well, at least they cannot say that I do not warn them.

The Asia Cup was a timely reality check to blow up the myth that we are a much improved ODI outfit and can beat any team, and it was a brutal reality check. We already got one in New Zealand early in the year, but our fans paid no heed, and the Asia Cup was its result.

This myth of Pakistan being the rightful number one T20 team will blow up into smithereens as well, but unfortunately we do not get to play India and the next World T20 is two years ago. A World T20 in 2018 would have been a very timely reality check.

I cant believe u just posted this.
10 series wins in a row and still you are able to put it down to unavailability of couple of opposition players.
Talking about bans, we too have lost salman sharjeel khalid asif amir.
But u'll never mention that
 
Narcissistic people talee out to show their importance in the thread trying to prove 10 series win Re fluke oh My God.
 
In t20s 2-3 20-30s can win you games

In Odis you need batters than can bat 30-40 overs and score big hundreds Pakistan batters just aren’t capable of scoring big often
 
I think, apart from skills, ODI is the most tactical game, which often gets better of PAK players. Skill is obviously a factor, because in ODI one has to build an innings, has to pace up properly with partnerships & strike rotation, while in bowling one has to set up batsmen.

T20I is instant cricket - you go in the middle & release your load; but the toughest part in a game of cricket is mental endurance, which is hardly stressed in T20. Test matches are also extremely stressful (mentally as well), but Test has lot more other factors (like diversity in wickets, climate, condition of ball, toss, spin/swing play by opponents.....), and one can regroup in 15 sessions, 4 innings. ODIs need the longest span of concentration at one go, and it’s extremely tactical, because in 3.5 hours, the game takes several twists and one has to response instantly.

I think, PAK loses most close ODI games because of the mental aspect of the game. They are always missing to hold on to themselves at the few key moments of an ODI game, which doesn’t get exposed against similar (mentally) teams, but better planned teams with mentally more conditioned players will catch PAK most times.
 
Because T20 cricket is a joke, and a format most teams and players care the least about.
 
Ill tell you why, because all other teams are approaching 50 over cricket in the exact same way as they would approach T20 cricket. Why is it that Hafeez, Babar and most of the others can strike it 100-120 in T20 cricket but they fall down to a sill 60-80 in ODIs??

They just need to play ODI cricket with the same approach and not worry about averages, which I really think is the bigger issue here. I dont know what incentives PCB offers in player contracts for milestones, but a lot of the time I get the impression that some of the players really do slow down when they are nearing a milestone and they are very careful in ensuring they get there.
 
Because T20 cricket is a joke, and a format most teams and players care the least about.

You mean T20I - I think, franchise T20s are well fought out there (unless, you know ....), but T20Is are just a mental relaxation for players in between serious cricket.
 
You mean T20I - I think, franchise T20s are well fought out there (unless, you know ....), but T20Is are just a mental relaxation for players in between serious cricket.

The entire format is a joke, and meant purely for entertainment.
 
T20s dominance for such a long period shows that raw ingredients are there. There is a reason we are doing better than other teams by a big margin.

All those saying Pak plays full strength need to do their research rather the misrepresenting facts. Over the last two years Pak have tried, Shinwari, Shadab, Fakhar, Talat, Asif Ali, Shaheen and now maqsood in T20s first. So Pak is also trying new faces but winning at the same time bcz new comers are good enough.

I believe Its not too far that we will improve in the ODIs as well.

Team is young with none of the players having played even 50 matches except 6 in the last squad. Top 3 havent event played 100 matches combined. Give them more experience and we will see the results as ODIs require maintaining intensity for a long period of times and experience plays a huge role to do it consistently.
 
Last edited:
Lmao so much burn on Pakistan's success. :D

For Bangladeshis and Indians may be franchise t20 matters more but for Pakistanis (not pseudo Pakistanis) international cricket where players represent their country matter more!
 
And just to mention that whatever the format is, whenever its an international game and the name of the country is involved, it can never be a joke.

If your players take any format lightly and relaxing while playing an international game which will tell whether your country won or lost, then I think you guys need more patriotic players in national teams.
 
I think, apart from skills, ODI is the most tactical game, which often gets better of PAK players. Skill is obviously a factor, because in ODI one has to build an innings, has to pace up properly with partnerships & strike rotation, while in bowling one has to set up batsmen.

T20I is instant cricket - you go in the middle & release your load; but the toughest part in a game of cricket is mental endurance, which is hardly stressed in T20. Test matches are also extremely stressful (mentally as well), but Test has lot more other factors (like diversity in wickets, climate, condition of ball, toss, spin/swing play by opponents.....), and one can regroup in 15 sessions, 4 innings. ODIs need the longest span of concentration at one go, and it’s extremely tactical, because in 3.5 hours, the game takes several twists and one has to response instantly.

I think, PAK loses most close ODI games because of the mental aspect of the game. They are always missing to hold on to themselves at the few key moments of an ODI game, which doesn’t get exposed against similar (mentally) teams, but better planned teams with mentally more conditioned players will catch PAK most times.

Well what happened in the CT then?
 
Maybe it's because we don't pick the same players/strategy for ODIs.

We have a right-left combo in T20s where Babar opens. In ODIs we have left-left. So we could try Babar opening.

We played a 2nd spinner in Imad in T20s and in the past have often played multiple spinners. Yet in ODIs we play only one in Shadab.

Amir tends to get things right in T20s, and even bowls a bit quicker. Sometimes you watch him in T20s and really question why he doesn't do the same in ODIs.

Ironically for all the above things, we did all this in champions trophy (just a different right handed opener). We didn't do it outside that though.

Though it's also down to the fact ODIs is the most batting dominated format. T20s is the least, then tests. As others said, Pak don't really post huge totals in T20s, they post average ones and their bowlers ensure they win.
 
Lmao so much burn on Pakistan's success. :D

For Bangladeshis and Indians may be franchise t20 matters more but for Pakistanis (not pseudo Pakistanis) international cricket where players represent their country matter more!

Maxwell was on the verge of tears yesterday but experts on here "no other team apart from Pakistan takes T20s seriously" :)))
 
Maybe it's because we don't pick the same players/strategy for ODIs.

We have a right-left combo in T20s where Babar opens. In ODIs we have left-left. So we could try Babar opening.

We played a 2nd spinner in Imad in T20s and in the past have often played multiple spinners. Yet in ODIs we play only one in Shadab.

Amir tends to get things right in T20s, and even bowls a bit quicker. Sometimes you watch him in T20s and really question why he doesn't do the same in ODIs.

Ironically for all the above things, we did all this in champions trophy (just a different right handed opener). We didn't do it outside that though.

Though it's also down to the fact ODIs is the most batting dominated format. T20s is the least, then tests. As others said, Pak don't really post huge totals in T20s, they post average ones and their bowlers ensure they win.
Deserves to be POTW.
 
The problem is weak batting which is holding us back in ODIs. In 80s & 90s we had a strong batting which made us a very good ODI side. If we can somehow develop good attacking batsmen, there is no reason why we can't be a force again in ODIs.
 
In t20s you can get away with hacking and slogging But in Odis our block block slog mentality doesn’t work

You need to show urgency in rotating the strike and pick gaps limit8ng the dot balls but that’s where Pakistanis struggle as they have one of the highest dot ball percentages going
 
T20s dominance for such a long period shows that raw ingredients are there. There is a reason we are doing better than other teams by a big margin.

All those saying Pak plays full strength need to do their research rather the misrepresenting facts. Over the last two years Pak have tried, Shinwari, Shadab, Fakhar, Talat, Asif Ali, Shaheen and now maqsood in T20s first. So Pak is also trying new faces but winning at the same time bcz new comers are good enough.

I believe Its not too far that we will improve in the ODIs as well.

Team is young with none of the players having played even 50 matches except 6 in the last squad. Top 3 havent event played 100 matches combined. Give them more experience and we will see the results as ODIs require maintaining intensity for a long period of times and experience plays a huge role to do it consistently.

Yes we will get experience by playing Hafeez in odi IA.
 
Maxwell was on the verge of tears yesterday but experts on here "no other team apart from Pakistan takes T20s seriously" :)))

Haha true bro!

First choice Aus, SA and Ind teams are selected in upcoming Aus-Ind and Sa-Aus t20 series but people wont say anything on that as that doesn't fit their agenda (downplaying Pakistan at any cost).
 
For the same reason BD can't convert their success in ODI to Test format/T-20.

Skill set required for Tests, ODIs and T-20s are not exactly the same even though they overlap.
 
Because Pakistan never last till 50 overs while batting.. Mediocre batsmen playing these days in team who don't have strokes and temperament.. I guess except Babar nobody deserves a place among batters.. The remedy shall be to identify batters and select them in A squad and send them to tours to South Africa, Australia and Sri Lanka and then draft best lot in national team.. This is what India did and rohit and virat made entry in national team..make A squad like
Imam ul haq
Nauman anwar/zeeshan malik
Umar amin /sami aslam
M. Rizwan
Saud shakeel
 
I think, apart from skills, ODI is the most tactical game, which often gets better of PAK players. Skill is obviously a factor, because in ODI one has to build an innings, has to pace up properly with partnerships & strike rotation, while in bowling one has to set up batsmen.

T20I is instant cricket - you go in the middle & release your load; but the toughest part in a game of cricket is mental endurance, which is hardly stressed in T20. Test matches are also extremely stressful (mentally as well), but Test has lot more other factors (like diversity in wickets, climate, condition of ball, toss, spin/swing play by opponents.....), and one can regroup in 15 sessions, 4 innings. ODIs need the longest span of concentration at one go, and it’s extremely tactical, because in 3.5 hours, the game takes several twists and one has to response instantly.

I think, PAK loses most close ODI games because of the mental aspect of the game. They are always missing to hold on to themselves at the few key moments of an ODI game, which doesn’t get exposed against similar (mentally) teams, but better planned teams with mentally more conditioned players will catch PAK most times.

Agree with this. Was going to post something similar to this.
 
Because of our flawed strategy mostly, lack of quality batting is also a factor, albeit not a big one..

We were always free flowing and hard hitting. When you try to curb that nstural way, it doesnt work.

It didnt work under Miandad, (just see off overs, keep wickets in hand and then go dor broke), as captain an coach.. it didnt work under misbah who more or less stuck to the same strategy. If you observe our history, ODI success was mostly achieved in eras where we had free flowing stules of saeed anwar, aamer sohail, afridi, razzaq, etc.. you need this mentality not just at the top but also in the middle and lower order. Let one or two blokes who accumulate play their natural game and automatically the rest play around them.. if you tell them all to just block and protect wickets, well we get the pandemonium we have now.

Since there is no such “urgency” or need to protect wickets in T20s, naturally they all play their natural game and do well.

Look, i have long believed you let them do it, more often that not they will score 270 plus runs, but they way we ask them to play, against top sides, we will get bowled out within 50 for 200-250 (250 if we are lucky)

Its better to burn out than fade away.. should be our mantra.. go for broke
 
Because of our flawed strategy mostly, lack of quality batting is also a factor, albeit not a big one..

We were always free flowing and hard hitting. When you try to curb that nstural way, it doesnt work.

It didnt work under Miandad, (just see off overs, keep wickets in hand and then go dor broke), as captain an coach.. it didnt work under misbah who more or less stuck to the same strategy. If you observe our history, ODI success was mostly achieved in eras where we had free flowing stules of saeed anwar, aamer sohail, afridi, razzaq, etc.. you need this mentality not just at the top but also in the middle and lower order. Let one or two blokes who accumulate play their natural game and automatically the rest play around them.. if you tell them all to just block and protect wickets, well we get the pandemonium we have now.

Since there is no such “urgency” or need to protect wickets in T20s, naturally they all play their natural game and do well.

Look, i have long believed you let them do it, more often that not they will score 270 plus runs, but they way we ask them to play, against top sides, we will get bowled out within 50 for 200-250 (250 if we are lucky)

Its better to burn out than fade away.. should be our mantra.. go for broke

Don't agree with the critical point here - you are putting it as "lack of intent", rather than "lack of capability"; unless this misconception is cleared, I don't think the issue can be explained or solved. Saeed, Sohail, A Razzak, Inzi (before that Zaheer, Mazid, Javed, Asif) could do that not because they had the willingness to burn (or fade), rather they had the capability; otherwise no International team would bat "to burn out" and "fade" at 105-6 in 15 overs, rather they'll try to keep it at 55-1 which recent PAK team tries, while that Saeed-Sohail team could take it to 88-1.

I don't think fundamentals of ODI batting philosophy has changed from even 1975. Today days, we are playing with 2 machine stitched balls, on absolute belters with lightning out field, on short boundaries and with compact, machine pressed bats - hence average scores have moved from 200 to 300, and we see lots of hundreds from top 3-4, lots of boundaries as well. But, ODI batting fundamental has been similar through-out, that's proper shot selection to attack loose balls keeping good ones in check, rotate singles by placing in gaps, run hard to add one extra, and most importantly - build a partnership so that scoring rate improves with overs.

That PAK side had players like Moin, Wasim, ARazzak, Qadir, Mahmood, Elahi .... in between 6 to 9, hence they could accelerate exponentially - that was capability, not intent. Those days, you'll see some of the biggest partnerships of the game (that time 150 partnership is like 250 now), were built by PAK players - a 100 run partnership was almost match winning in 80s/90s, now that 100 has gone to 200+, and PAK's big partnership has come down to celebrate at 50 level.

It's about resource (wicket) management - scoring 35-40 runs in quick time is very good in T20, couple of those and you are putting a fighting score for 20 overs game; but for 50 overs duration, that is not sufficient, most times you'll be short of 10-15% from per score - be the per is 200 or 350 depending on context, doesn't matter. To do that (put or chase above per score), one has to convert that 35-40 into 125, which is not about intention, rather it's the biggest skill of the batting game; you be on top of bowling & dominate for couple of hours - once set, batsmen should be the king.

I see, every time PAK loses, most of the posts are targeting selection errors/bias and who is not there. One thing be sure about ODI - selection blunders happen in terms of combination, more than in individual players. I bashed everyone for picking 1 spinner against SRL (& 6 pacers for Asia Cup), but hardly for the 6 batsmen picks, because not much is available outside the obvious names, and it doesn't matter that much. Whoever is picked has a defined role to play - selectors can make minor blunders, but that shouldn't cover everything that's wrong.

In Asia Cup, when Shakib & Tamim left, I still said whoever plays doesn't matter, as one has to manage within that and players have to perform their role profile - that's why there is a squad of 16. JK & Afridi were back-up pacers to start, may be that was a selection blunder - but does that explains BD reaching 150-3 from 12-3 at 4.5+ rate on that wicket? You can put the same example in batting context - is this only selection blunder or lack of intent to reach 18-3 chasing 239, or take the asking to 8+, from<5 in course of 40 overs?

Think again, which one comes first - intention or capability?
 
Another thing I would like to add is that this Pakistan team absolutely crumbles under pressure. I don’t believe they are as bad as they have shown themselves to be against NZ earlier in the year and the Asia Cup. I mean when you are struggling to beat Afghanistan and lose a knockout to Bangladesh, you know there was something horribly wrong with the mindset of the boys. If that Pakistan was playing the T20s right now against Australia, they would get mauled by Finch and co.

I guess you have to take the good and the bad from this highly inconsistent team. We can easily get thrashed like no tomorrow against NZ in the upcoming T20s, and end up beating the living daylights out of NZ in the ODIs. Unfortunately, no matter how much we don’t like to hear it, we are quite possibly the most unpredictable team right now.
 
Every format is important when playing for your country. Pakistan has a very good combination in T20s when it comes to bowling. As we saw the other day, an over from Hafeez or an over from Malik can be accommodated if one bowler has a bad day. Can't do that in ODIs. As far as batting goes, I don't see any difference between Pak ODI or T20 batting. The loss in ODIs recently is because of lack of penetration in the bowling in the initial overs. Amir stopped picking up wickets and Hasan is out of form.
 
I was reading thru the thread, and read so much wrong stuff about PCT's t20 performance. Degrading the performance by saying that other teams were weak or in transition.

What about your own team, who is the player who has played 40 50 60 t20s? You have been trying different openers, now you have babar who played 22 matches only, you tried different options at 3, you had hussain talat who hasnt even played 10 matches yet, Asif Ali is a newcomer, shaheen is a newcomer, hasan faheem and shadab are young to this t20i team too. So who is the experienced one here? the only experienced player we had was shoaib malik.

Coming back to the main thread, I dont think we are a bad ODI side, in asia cup it was mismanagement and wrong selection. These players have all the basis to perform in 50 overs cricket. The selection needs to be based on the conditions only. You cant just go with 4 pacers in your XI in UAE.
 
If there is a consistent run of dominance in T20s then eventually some of the dominance will get converted to ODIs. For this Pak needs to strengthen the T20 skills in real terms and not win matches through bowling. Further in ODIS opposition can afford to see through some good overs by top bowler and wait to milk others. In T20 one needs to score through out and that's how pak Bowlers get wickets. Right now capt Sarfarad has better handle of captaincy in T20s. Untill captaincy skills are improved in ODI it will take time! Persist with Sarfarz as captain in ODIs and T20 for another two years and Pak will get better ODI side.
 
Because in a t20 game, a score is expected between 130 to 200. And we have enough batsmen in the team to reach these kind of scores. In a 50 over game good scores these days range from 275 to 325 and we cannot consistently score these amount of runs. If you collapse in t20 a whole team can still contribute to a score of 150, if you collapse in odis then you're going to struggle to get to 300.
 
most of our batsmen seem to have a single gear: they are either good for quick 20s and 30s, or play out multiple sessions without scoring many runs

Other than Babar (who himself is pretty slow in ODIs), we don't have other batsmen who can build a proper ODI inning
 
In ODI's our batsmen play too many dot balls under the comfort there are 50 overs available. In 20-20's you have to push the pace.
 
Guess what? That's what all sports are for, entertainment. Tests and ODIs aren't some intellectual pursuit either.

Well said. Pulling down one format over others - especially one which is bread & butter of cricket these days is simply not done. Regular people who actually pay for these guys to go out & play, watch sports for entertainment. Only wonks & armchair critics have to do a technical analysis & nitpick fault with everything.
 
Don't agree with the critical point here - you are putting it as "lack of intent", rather than "lack of capability"; unless this misconception is cleared, I don't think the issue can be explained or solved. Saeed, Sohail, A Razzak, Inzi (before that Zaheer, Mazid, Javed, Asif) could do that not because they had the willingness to burn (or fade), rather they had the capability; otherwise no International team would bat "to burn out" and "fade" at 105-6 in 15 overs, rather they'll try to keep it at 55-1 which recent PAK team tries, while that Saeed-Sohail team could take it to 88-1.

I don't think fundamentals of ODI batting philosophy has changed from even 1975. Today days, we are playing with 2 machine stitched balls, on absolute belters with lightning out field, on short boundaries and with compact, machine pressed bats - hence average scores have moved from 200 to 300, and we see lots of hundreds from top 3-4, lots of boundaries as well. But, ODI batting fundamental has been similar through-out, that's proper shot selection to attack loose balls keeping good ones in check, rotate singles by placing in gaps, run hard to add one extra, and most importantly - build a partnership so that scoring rate improves with overs.

That PAK side had players like Moin, Wasim, ARazzak, Qadir, Mahmood, Elahi .... in between 6 to 9, hence they could accelerate exponentially - that was capability, not intent. Those days, you'll see some of the biggest partnerships of the game (that time 150 partnership is like 250 now), were built by PAK players - a 100 run partnership was almost match winning in 80s/90s, now that 100 has gone to 200+, and PAK's big partnership has come down to celebrate at 50 level.

It's about resource (wicket) management - scoring 35-40 runs in quick time is very good in T20, couple of those and you are putting a fighting score for 20 overs game; but for 50 overs duration, that is not sufficient, most times you'll be short of 10-15% from per score - be the per is 200 or 350 depending on context, doesn't matter. To do that (put or chase above per score), one has to convert that 35-40 into 125, which is not about intention, rather it's the biggest skill of the batting game; you be on top of bowling & dominate for couple of hours - once set, batsmen should be the king.

I see, every time PAK loses, most of the posts are targeting selection errors/bias and who is not there. One thing be sure about ODI - selection blunders happen in terms of combination, more than in individual players. I bashed everyone for picking 1 spinner against SRL (& 6 pacers for Asia Cup), but hardly for the 6 batsmen picks, because not much is available outside the obvious names, and it doesn't matter that much. Whoever is picked has a defined role to play - selectors can make minor blunders, but that shouldn't cover everything that's wrong.

In Asia Cup, when Shakib & Tamim left, I still said whoever plays doesn't matter, as one has to manage within that and players have to perform their role profile - that's why there is a squad of 16. JK & Afridi were back-up pacers to start, may be that was a selection blunder - but does that explains BD reaching 150-3 from 12-3 at 4.5+ rate on that wicket? You can put the same example in batting context - is this only selection blunder or lack of intent to reach 18-3 chasing 239, or take the asking to 8+, from<5 in course of 40 overs?

Think again, which one comes first - intention or capability?

To be honest, we glorify the 90's and early 2000's too much, Cricket has changed dramatically now. There is a chance they would have struggled with the defensive death bowling that bowlers do today like Yorkers, slower ball bouncers, intelligent field placings.
 
To be honest, we glorify the 90's and early 2000's too much, Cricket has changed dramatically now. There is a chance they would have struggled with the defensive death bowling that bowlers do today like Yorkers, slower ball bouncers, intelligent field placings.

I think, that team is less praised here because most posters haven’t seen what is cricket of highest order & what is “championship mind” beyond wrist band. In PP, the way this famous ZIM tour is glorified, I wonder what these kids would have done after 2002 AUS series or 1997 WSC.

Adaptation is the nature of survivors - but, you can only adopt if you have the ingredients & will power. We left two of the most flourishing careers back home to start from scratch in Canada, but still surviving because we tried to do so with heart & soul, and had the ingredients to fight it out in a 1st world country, competing against global market, starting with a D2D sales job for 2 weeks (& she working as a call agent) - and I can tell you, “itni bematlabi ka zindegi vi nahin”. Easiest was to quit and go back - my previous employer kept it open for 2 years; and still had enough left in tank.

That team had the ingredients & the self respect not to quit - they would have found a way to restore their dignity. Your current lot & their ring leader can’t even stare at Indians, Kohli ke saat compete keya karega?
 
Last edited:
Don't think Pak is truly a number one team in T20s. India, England and SA are still ahead and Pak is yet to face these teams in this format.
 
Don't agree with the critical point here - you are putting it as "lack of intent", rather than "lack of capability"; unless this misconception is cleared, I don't think the issue can be explained or solved. Saeed, Sohail, A Razzak, Inzi (before that Zaheer, Mazid, Javed, Asif) could do that not because they had the willingness to burn (or fade), rather they had the capability; otherwise no International team would bat "to burn out" and "fade" at 105-6 in 15 overs, rather they'll try to keep it at 55-1 which recent PAK team tries, while that Saeed-Sohail team could take it to 88-1.

I don't think fundamentals of ODI batting philosophy has changed from even 1975. Today days, we are playing with 2 machine stitched balls, on absolute belters with lightning out field, on short boundaries and with compact, machine pressed bats - hence average scores have moved from 200 to 300, and we see lots of hundreds from top 3-4, lots of boundaries as well. But, ODI batting fundamental has been similar through-out, that's proper shot selection to attack loose balls keeping good ones in check, rotate singles by placing in gaps, run hard to add one extra, and most importantly - build a partnership so that scoring rate improves with overs.

That PAK side had players like Moin, Wasim, ARazzak, Qadir, Mahmood, Elahi .... in between 6 to 9, hence they could accelerate exponentially - that was capability, not intent. Those days, you'll see some of the biggest partnerships of the game (that time 150 partnership is like 250 now), were built by PAK players - a 100 run partnership was almost match winning in 80s/90s, now that 100 has gone to 200+, and PAK's big partnership has come down to celebrate at 50 level.

It's about resource (wicket) management - scoring 35-40 runs in quick time is very good in T20, couple of those and you are putting a fighting score for 20 overs game; but for 50 overs duration, that is not sufficient, most times you'll be short of 10-15% from per score - be the per is 200 or 350 depending on context, doesn't matter. To do that (put or chase above per score), one has to convert that 35-40 into 125, which is not about intention, rather it's the biggest skill of the batting game; you be on top of bowling & dominate for couple of hours - once set, batsmen should be the king.

I see, every time PAK loses, most of the posts are targeting selection errors/bias and who is not there. One thing be sure about ODI - selection blunders happen in terms of combination, more than in individual players. I bashed everyone for picking 1 spinner against SRL (& 6 pacers for Asia Cup), but hardly for the 6 batsmen picks, because not much is available outside the obvious names, and it doesn't matter that much. Whoever is picked has a defined role to play - selectors can make minor blunders, but that shouldn't cover everything that's wrong.

In Asia Cup, when Shakib & Tamim left, I still said whoever plays doesn't matter, as one has to manage within that and players have to perform their role profile - that's why there is a squad of 16. JK & Afridi were back-up pacers to start, may be that was a selection blunder - but does that explains BD reaching 150-3 from 12-3 at 4.5+ rate on that wicket? You can put the same example in batting context - is this only selection blunder or lack of intent to reach 18-3 chasing 239, or take the asking to 8+, from<5 in course of 40 overs?

Think again, which one comes first - intention or capability?

you have answered it yourself. these guys are capable. they wouldnt be number 1 t20 side if they were not.

pakistans problems are mental and strategic, nothin to do with the ability..

ability is different from the skill of resding the situation, handling pressure and knowing how to win... this kills needs to be learnt and it comes in time if u invest in the right players
 
I think, that team is less praised here because most posters haven’t seen what is cricket of highest order & what is “championship mind” beyond wrist band. In PP, the way this famous ZIM tour is glorified, I wonder what these kids would have done after 2002 AUS series or 1997 WSC.

Adaptation is the nature of survivors - but, you can only adopt if you have the ingredients & will power. We left two of the most flourishing careers back home to start from scratch in Canada, but still surviving because we tried to do so with heart & soul, and had the ingredients to fight it out in a 1st world country, competing against global market, starting with a D2D sales job for 2 weeks (& she working as a call agent) - and I can tell you, “itni bematlabi ka zindegi vi nahin”. Easiest was to quit and go back - my previous employer kept it open for 2 years; and still had enough left in tank.

That team had the ingredients & the self respect not to quit - they would have found a way to restore their dignity. Your current lot & their ring leader can’t even stare at Indians, Kohli ke saat compete keya karega?
I lived through that era, and that team was as unreliable as they come. Yes, we hammered weak teams like India and New Zealand consistently. But we got our butts handed to us by Australia, South Africa and even Sri Lanka in a consistent manner too. What's the point of having so many match-winners in a team when you are still hoping against hope that they woke up at the right side of the bed today to effect a win?
 
you have answered it yourself. these guys are capable. they wouldnt be number 1 t20 side if they were not.

pakistans problems are mental and strategic, nothin to do with the ability..

ability is different from the skill of resding the situation, handling pressure and knowing how to win... this kills needs to be learnt and it comes in time if u invest in the right players

I would have taken that, if we consider skill set of T20 & ODI are same. Unfortunately it’s not, hence there is a big gap in the rankings.

I try to explain it from another sports - athletics. Have you ever seen a 110 hurdler running for a 4X100 relay (might be for lower ranked teams, not for USA, Jamaica or GB)? He is basically running almost at same speed like a 100-200 metre sprinter (WR is like 12.90 for 110 metres with 10 hurdles to jump). Or have you ever seen 3000 metre steeplechaser running for 5000 metre or 1500 metre (again not for Kenya, Ethiopia, Algeria or Morocco)? I have seen same athlete winning 5000 & 10000 (latest Mo Farah); I have seen 1500 & 800 metre by same guy, even winning both (?Wilson Kipkater, ?Lord Coe)

The skill set for T20 & ODI is completely different, though both game looks same as limited overs game. But, effectively, ODI is much closer to Test than T20. From ranking table, you’ll see teams are close bonded in Test & ODI ranks, rather than ODI & T20.

Mental & tactical issues are definitely there (actually that was my point also), but do you think T20 doesn’t need strategic intents or mental toughness? You can only empliment any strategy or tactics if you have the skills to accomplish, similarly you are mentally tougher/confident if you are top of your game. Do you think Kohli is born with his mental strength or Sharmaji hit 3 doubles for his strategy (of hitting six) only?

I put it in a positive way - PAK is mentally stronger in T20s, because their skill set keeps them on top of their T20 game; and their tactics is spot on (much better at least) for T20. I give another unpopular example - at 12-3 what Sarfraz did was brilliant tactics for T20 - he got 3 down quickly, got the RR down, now just get some cheap overs out and restrict BD for 120 in 20 overs - 10 out of 10 times, he would have won that game in T20s. But, that 26th SEP game was one of the worst tactical game I had ever seen by a bowling side/Captain - they literally allowed only batsman left to run away with the game. Apart from that unplayable ball, Mushi would have taken the score to 293, from 12-3!!!!

Investing in right players is not a tactics, it’s minimum requirement - Argentina has 5/6 of world’s best forwards, but not so in back line - should they start with 2-3-5 formation? I’ll again go back to that game (no, not to rub salt, it’s a brilliant case study) - everyone is hell bent that 2 genuine spinners would have won that game for PAK. I say no - 12-3 start by pacers is enough to cover even for 2 part-timers bowling in middle; and 239 is easy enough target under dew against an attack missing 2 bowlers. It’s absolutely lack of ability, then comes tactics and mental aspect. Unless, there is focus on developing in these 3 aspects, it’s impossible to change the fortunes of an ODI side just by selection mantra.

ODI is the most tactical game & needs multiple gears within one game - first you need skill set, then find a strategy to usher best of your available skills at hand - a successful blend of the two should make you mentally tougher & confident - there is your winning formula.
 
I lived through that era, and that team was as unreliable as they come. Yes, we hammered weak teams like India and New Zealand consistently. But we got our butts handed to us by Australia, South Africa and even Sri Lanka in a consistent manner too. What's the point of having so many match-winners in a team when you are still hoping against hope that they woke up at the right side of the bed today to effect a win?

They sold their soul to devil even for club games, which made them shallow & timid under pressure - I won’t write more here.
 
Fans are getting overboard by misleading stats once again. Pakistan T20 team is not that special in many ways. We are still winning mostly because of our bowling, batting is a big mess, reason why we are so far behind in ODIs...

If T20 WC happen tomorrow, WI with all their stars and fire power will still be favorite above us. Even AUS Warner/Smith/Hazelwood/Pat back will be better favorite...

Pakistanis have to understand one basic thing about LOIs, you win on batting mostly, wins only in tournaments matters. Without decent batting, you got very little chance. Pakistani batting is worse than BD, in LOIs, how can we be satisfied with that and open silly threads every now and then 🙄🙄🙄
 
Pakistan has gone the Windies way. Giants in T20s but below par in ODIs.

True.

Fans are getting overboard by misleading stats once again. Pakistan T20 team is not that special in many ways. We are still winning mostly because of our bowling, batting is a big mess, reason why we are so far behind in ODIs...

If T20 WC happen tomorrow, WI with all their stars and fire power will still be favorite above us. Even AUS Warner/Smith/Hazelwood/Pat back will be better favorite...

Pakistanis have to understand one basic thing about LOIs, you win on batting mostly, wins only in tournaments matters. Without decent batting, you got very little chance. Pakistani batting is worse than BD, in LOIs, how can we be satisfied with that and open silly threads every now and then &#55357;&#56900;&#55357;&#56900;&#55357;&#56900;


Again, very true.

Sarfraz lovers should understand this.
 
True.




Again, very true.

Sarfraz lovers should understand this.

Sarfraz took us from no.9 in ODI's, where Misbah left us. to no.5. Also won us a major ODI tournament after 1992 WC. Misbah lovers should understand this.
 
What dominance? There is nothing to look into it other then our fans forgetting their “aukat” as usual.

This is a mediocre team that has been made to look good because of some buffet fixtures.

A team where trash batsmen like Asif Ali, Sarfraz, Faheem and Shadab are occupying important positions in the batting lineup cannot be the best T20 team in the world. Furthermore, you have two anchors in the top three and one of them is nearly 40 years old.

The bowling attack itself is nothing special.

Everyone is doing victory lapping over the 10 consecutive series that we have won, but let’s break them down:

1-0 in England - very good isolated win, but it was only 1 match. It does not tell us much - considering England’s batting power, they would beat us more often than not.

Back to back series wins vs West Indies - yes they have won the WT20 twice, but not all of their 2016 winning players played in that series, and besides, they struggle on the slow Caribbean and UAE wickets.

World XI - seriously? Are people actually counting that joke series as part of the winning streak? May as well count the gully mohallay matches that these players might have played and won during off-season.

Sri Lanka - they have become very weak in Limited Overs, and get bashed by everyone 9/10 times.

New Zealand - impressive series win, but their most dangerous T20 player was not available for the decider and the short boundaries bridged the gap between the two batting sides. However, the team deserves credit for the win.

West Indies in Pakistan - this was more impressive than the wins over them in the Caribbean and in the UAE, since the pitches in Pakistan are flat and conductive for big hitting.

Scotland - nothing needs to be said.

Wins against Australia in the tri-series and in the ongoing series - again, impressive, but let’s not forget the fact that Australia did not have Warner and Smith (pretty good T20 player over the last couple of years, especially on Asian pitches).

The only truly impressive wins were against Australia and in New Zealand. Our fixtures have not been balanced either - we have only played 1 match against England, none against India, none against South Africa and 10 against the West Indies.

Such an imbalanced ratio of games against different opponents hide more than they show.

India would smash us everywhere, but if we were to face them in the UAE, it will be as big a humiliation as the Asia Cup. Bangladesh will also probably beat us, and even Afghanistan will take the game to the 40th over in the UAE.

We have been marginally better in T20s compared to ODIs because the weaknesses of this team are less exposed over 40 overs compared to 100 overs, but much like our ODI and Test squads, our T20 squad also stinks of mediocrity and we are by no means the best T20 team in the world, and if there is a World T20 today, we will not win it.

The 10 consecutive series wins and the number one ranking look impressive, but it is important not to lose perception either.

However, I guess our fans deserve some breathing space - they have been jolted by the humiliation and the cruel reality check in the Asia Cup, and the subsequent realization that even a Kohli-less India is three levels above us.

Moreover, not to forget getting owned by Bangladesh after taking cheap shots and making fun of them for years based on nothing but hollow, cheap arrogance. That loss in the Asia Cup was some sweet, sweet justice, and our fans had it coming.

I actually respect the Bangladeshi fans for not rubbing it in as much as they should have. They exhibited a lot of class and dignity which we probably would not have showed in the same situation.

Hence, I do not blame our fans for their over the top celebrations and for turning a blind eye to the weaknesses of this T20 team. They get upset when I say this, but whenever our fans get their heads in the clouds, a reality check follows to bring them back to earth. Well, at least they cannot say that I do not warn them.

The Asia Cup was a timely reality check to blow up the myth that we are a much improved ODI outfit and can beat any team, and it was a brutal reality check. We already got one in New Zealand early in the year, but our fans paid no heed, and the Asia Cup was its result.

This myth of Pakistan being the rightful number one T20 team will blow up into smithereens as well, but unfortunately we do not get to play India and the next World T20 is two years ago. A World T20 in 2018 would have been a very timely reality check.

This was heading towards POTW until you mentioned that.

You do realise Bangladesh got destroyed at home by Afghanistan couple of months back? It's not for the first time either.

Bangladesh's T20I team is minnow standard if we're brutally honest but their fans on here act like they're the second best side in Asia and on their way to becoming a powerhouse of cricket, which is why they get trolled on here.

Bringing up Bangladesh and their fans has no relevance whatsoever to the OP.
 
i think, apart from skills, odi is the most tactical game, which often gets better of pak players. Skill is obviously a factor, because in odi one has to build an innings, has to pace up properly with partnerships & strike rotation, while in bowling one has to set up batsmen.

T20i is instant cricket - you go in the middle & release your load; but the toughest part in a game of cricket is mental endurance, which is hardly stressed in t20. Test matches are also extremely stressful (mentally as well), but test has lot more other factors (like diversity in wickets, climate, condition of ball, toss, spin/swing play by opponents.....), and one can regroup in 15 sessions, 4 innings. Odis need the longest span of concentration at one go, and it’s extremely tactical, because in 3.5 hours, the game takes several twists and one has to response instantly.

I think, pak loses most close odi games because of the mental aspect of the game. They are always missing to hold on to themselves at the few key moments of an odi game, which doesn’t get exposed against similar (mentally) teams, but better planned teams with mentally more conditioned players will catch pak most times.

potw
 
Food for thought for the PP’ers! &#55356;&#57172;

After all - ODI’s are now merely considered an extension of the T20 format.

So why haven’t we been as successful in ODI’s as we are in T20’s?

Because we as a nation has 2 gears only, 1st or 5th. We may win some ODIs or cups but cant be consistent.
 
Like always people (Pakistanis and a wanna be Pakistani) are getting OTT emotional :yk

I'd say the same thing even if it were India or WI winning straight 10 series. T20 is a joke format and only the T20 world cup should be taken seriously.

Credit to Pakisani team for winning 10 consecutive series. It ain't that we show up and win the series. But the fact remains: it is a joke format. Instant cricket. Nothing more, nothing less.
 
I feel like we are a better ODI team than what we showed in the Asia Cup, however will wait until the NZ series to decide how good we are in ODI's as I can not judge our team off the Asia Cup performance as that just seemed like an anomaly everything felt off with PCT in that tournament. We are a much better side than we showed in that tourney.
 
Yes, we hammered weak teams like India and New Zealand consistently.

Your memory of the India Pakistan rivalry is very flawed. India first beat Pakistan in a Test series way back in 1952/53.

India was ranked #1 in Test cricket in the early 1970s long before Pakistan had a decent Test team. The Indian team was stronger 1960s to mid-1970s, but the two countries did not play during this period (mainly due to the wars).

It took the arrival of Imran Khan for Pakistan to be finally able to beat India in a Test series in 1978/79. And India won the Test series against Pakistan the very next year.

As for ODIs, the 12-0 record in WCs began in 1992.
 
This was heading towards POTW until you mentioned that.

You do realise Bangladesh got destroyed at home by Afghanistan couple of months back? It's not for the first time either.

Bangladesh's T20I team is minnow standard if we're brutally honest but their fans on here act like they're the second best side in Asia and on their way to becoming a powerhouse of cricket, which is why they get trolled on here.

Bringing up Bangladesh and their fans has no relevance whatsoever to the OP.

Transitivity does not work in cricket, not always. Afghanistan have found a way to dominate Bangladesh in recent times but we haven’t. They fail to cope with their big hitters and also their brilliant spinners.

However, our style of play seems to be suit them more. They do not have a good record in T20Is, but there is a reason why they have won two out of three T20Is since 2016.

About time Pakistani fans drop their arrogance with respect to Bangladesh. They have a very good chance of beating Pakistan in both ODIs and T20s anywhere in Asia. They know how to play against us.
 
Also Pakistan needs to win a couple of T20 World Cups to prove any sort of "dominance".
 
Transitivity does not work in cricket, not always. Afghanistan have found a way to dominate Bangladesh in recent times but we haven’t. They fail to cope with their big hitters and also their brilliant spinners.

However, our style of play seems to be suit them more. They do not have a good record in T20Is, but there is a reason why they have won two out of three T20Is since 2016.

About time Pakistani fans drop their arrogance with respect to Bangladesh. They have a very good chance of beating Pakistan in both ODIs and T20s anywhere in Asia. They know how to play against us.

That's a big statement. Based on your logic Bangladesh is the 2nd best T20 side after India. So if the World T20 played in Asia Bangladesh will certainly play in final.
 
Back
Top