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'Will erase from map, won't exercise restraint': Indian army chief

the Great Khan said:
Bro nothing changes on here. Its the same arguments. We could wipe out their whole airforce and they'll still deny it. We could level every s400 battery and they'll say it was fake news. The constant back and forth is such a waste of time. I think in this case we should just be the bigger men and let them bark. Everybody who analyses this stuff knows what happened. There is a reason the geopolitical landscape has changed so dramatically. Its not a coincidence. The sheer panic in the French aerospace industry just tells you enough. So let them say what they want. They know what happened to them.
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How many s400 have America managed to hit that paf wil obliterate entire s400 battery of India?



Fyi india also operates israeli ad like barak 8 that’s enough to obliterate pAf
 
There are some serious talk of Indians trying to act out again and trying to capture some land as something like that would be worth bragging over no matter how many planes they lose. I follow a few accounts (Zionist scum that they are) but they are very accurate during the previous conflict as well.

The Taliban's FM is also visiting India.

Now I don't know how the US will react, Trump probably will be livid but India generally has faced humiliation since May. Their best friend in the neighborhood are the Taliban, is proof enough. Our military is better prepared and with the Saudi deal atleast should not have any financial issues.

Modi really is a scrouge.
 
uppercut said:
thats not how it works in the modern world. Even rag-tag outfits like Hamas and Hezbollah have existed for decades despite regular pounding by Israel which is pretty much a US proxy in the middle east. So going by your simplistic logic of "the victor not being able to impose his will on the conquered" Israel has been losing the war or atleast not able to accomplish their objective then ? Heck they couldn't even get all of their hostages freed. The same will happen to Russia. The same happened to the US in Afg where they had set out to eradicate the Taliban ... how did that work out after 20 yrs of trying ? lol

The point is modern geo-politics is extremely complicated business than the simplistic "winner takes all" nonsense that you are trying to peddle. Doesn't work like that.
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Good thing now that you bring out Modern Geo politics , Conflicts and Mention of Israel which i did in my Earlier comments which you ignored. Yes Israel is not agreeing to ceasfire despite prrssure of western nations . They want hamas to concede somethinh before agreeing to CF and this is what lacked from Indian Side in May. I never said winner should take all but at least some concession should have happened or any agenda put forward by Indian Government in exchange for CF since according to you , Indian Military gains were deciscive. you are not makig much sense here , Rather saying same thing what Im trying to make you understand
uppercut said:
Consequences for who ? So at this point it comes down to what YOU believe to have happened in May. Perhaps explain your take on the events.
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no i explicitly told you we are talking about Indian claims and im holding you accountable on those lines . what i believe happened is nt matter of discussion. We are checking logic of your claims. Im not delving into what Pakistan says or believe . you cant understand this simple argument?

uppercut said:
The same is true for Pak army as well. Every single General including the current one keeps parroting that "Indian Kashmir is our jugular vein". so what happened to that objective ? You didnt think thru that ehh ? lol
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Here again. according to you India had decisive victory so Indian Military objectives will come into question. Pak did nt win according to you. so why should we talk about what Pak military needed to do?

uppercut said:
This is the problem ... wherein you assume things in your mind, believe that to be actual reality and start projecting that on to me and keep pretending that I said those things. The fact is NOBODY in the Indian Military has claimed that your Nuclear weapons have all been neutralized.

The reality is this: On May 10th India targeted one of your many Nuke storage facility at Kirana Hills with pin-point precision ... and the aim was to send a clear message that we are not deterred by your nukes and will infact take them out if needed. Thats a big fat red-line that was crossed and Pakistan did nothing in response. Let me know if YOU believe that this event at Kirana Hills did not happen.
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LOL

i also never assumed it that you took our nukes

your claim - Nuclear bluff called out

Thats a broader term which means Pak wont use nukes in response to whatever military gains Indian military achieve. so whether you neutralize those nukes or not.. we aing using them according to you..so where are consrquences of such huge achievment ? they are absent
 
the Great Khan said:
Bro nothing changes on here. Its the same arguments. We could wipe out their whole airforce and they'll still deny it. We could level every s400 battery and they'll say it was fake news. The constant back and forth is such a waste of time. I think in this case we should just be the bigger men and let them bark. Everybody who analyses this stuff knows what happened. There is a reason the geopolitical landscape has changed so dramatically. Its not a coincidence. The sheer panic in the French aerospace industry just tells you enough. So let them say what they want. They know what happened to them.
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French aero space industry is in panic because of Pakistan?

The delusions pakistanis have is astonishing.

Tommorow you will say Russia is scared of you guys
 
Wasim Ghulam said:
Good thing now that you bring out Modern Geo politics , Conflicts and Mention of Israel which i did in my Earlier comments which you ignored. Yes Israel is not agreeing to ceasfire despite prrssure of western nations . They want hamas to concede somethinh before agreeing to CF and this is what lacked from Indian Side in May.
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So you are equating Pakistani Army with Hamas (and worse India to US+Israel) ? And then you claim to be logical ? Like kuchi bhi ?

And BTW Trump has just issued a warning to Hamas that they will be obliterated if they don't listen to him. So according to your logic since this Hamas vs Israel conflict is going on for many decades and yet there is no CLEAR CUT Winner and surrender from Hamas what is YOUR Sum-total assessment of the situation ?​

I am asking because I want to understand YOUR logic because quite frankly I cannot ... so please elaborate and then once we are on the same page and agree on the logic we can then address the Ind-Pak situation. Fair ?
 
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For the first time in India’s history, the military is being openly politicized in favor of a single political party.
 
Paf a total of 240pL 15 E missiles and with that they will destroy iaf ans all s400

Delusions
 
uppercut said:
So you are equating Pakistani Army with Hamas ( and worse India to US+Israel ) ? And then you claim to be logical ? Like kuchi bhi ?

And BTW Trump has just issued a warning to Hamas that they will be obliterated if they don't listen to him. So according to your logic since this Hamas vs Israel conflict is going on for many decades and yet there is no CLEAR CUT Winner and surrender from Hamas what is YOUR Sum-total assessment of the situation ?​

I am asking because I want to understand YOUR logic because quite frankly I cannot ... so please elaborate and then once we are on the same page and agree on the logic we can then address the Ind-Pak situation. Fair ?
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Im not Equating anyone to another. is that your assumption?

Isreal / Hamas conflict that started in October 2023 and on going. you are talking about broader conflict over decades.

Even if we talk about Russia / Ukraine Conflict .. it's on going . Russia has not claimed decicisve victory over Ukraine unlike Indians like you who are claiming sweeping victories in May 2025. The extent of victories that Indians claims they achieved in May 2025 is so high that it's a natural question to ask for End result and what did India achieve because of those victories. Russia being bigger power militarily has not been able to bend Ukraine to its will. But then again Russia never said they broke Ukraine Militarily unlike Indians who by some magic did so in 4 days which Russia has bot been able to do since 2022 or Israel to Hamas since decades

and then you tried to talk about USA Vis Taliban and how USA was not able eliminate Taliban in Afghan

First of all there is no analogy between USA/Taliban Conflict and Ind / Pak conflict. USA invaded Afg to eliminate Al Qaida , which they did. They toppled Taliban Govt when they needed to and remained in Afg until USA itself wanted to. Taliban did nt raise costs for US to run away from AFG. 20 years of occupation is long time and USA exited the region when they needed not because Taliban made them exit. How many 9/11s happened after USA eliminated Al Qaida on US soil ? Rest of geo politics is side quest USA indluged in for 2 decades which has no analogy with Ind pak conflict

Im asking about your Logic, you need to stop asking about my logic .. you made following claims

1. Destroyed our Air bases completely
2. Destroyed our Aircrafts in huge Numbers
3. Destroyed our ability to defend our airspace
4. Attacked our Nuclear facility in Kirana Hills , doing so risked a nuclear war . If you attack someone's nuclear facility directly , you can't predict a response before attacking so in that sense India risked its population to Nuclear holocaust.

So what did India gain by risking to push this region into nuclear conflict? once India took the risk and called out nuclear bluff , why did India stop without even getting own territory that's defined into Indian constitution ? Indian Army chief said now they are fully prepared ? what does that mean? were they not prepared in May 2025?

there are logical inconsistencies in Indian claims

When your constitution itself defines reclaiming all of Kashmir as core duty then any war or operation that ends with zero territorial change can't be called strategic victory. Tactical success perhaps but strategically its status quo and status quo has not changed . The side that's claiming to have called Bluffs and crossed big fat red lines should have concrete to show or it , but it does not . After all the noise , the map has not moved and inch. India's declared goal has always been to take back remaining part of Kashmir and supposed removal of Pakistan's nuclear shield should have made that easier yet the ground reality has not changed which means deterrence still worked . You can't claim to have called a bluff and still accept same status quo. that's contradiction in your claims
 
Pakpak said:
There are some serious talk of Indians trying to act out again and trying to capture some land as something like that would be worth bragging over no matter how many planes they lose. I follow a few accounts (Zionist scum that they are) but they are very accurate during the previous conflict as well.

The Taliban's FM is also visiting India.

Now I don't know how the US will react, Trump probably will be livid but India generally has faced humiliation since May. Their best friend in the neighborhood are the Taliban, is proof enough. Our military is better prepared and with the Saudi deal atleast should not have any financial issues.

Modi really is a scrouge.
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India cannot act. They are paralysed militarily, relying on fake news to pump up the image of their PM and army internally.

There is a major rift between army and government. Army admitted its losses but blamed the government. Government blamed the army.

You can see here comment from BJP minister after the devestation that was inflicted on Udamphur.

“Everyone knows what happened at the Air Force station during Operation Sindoor. They must be incompetent, they were sleeping, we are not at fault. We have given the Indian Army a lot of respect.”

The opposition went crazy.

“It's shameful that leaders from BJP, whether ministers, MPs, or MLAs, are making repeated statements against the Indian Army. The Army stands as a pillar of national security. If we sleep peacefully today, it's because of their sacrifice. They’re also fighting for rightful demands like pensions, which I’ve raised in Parliament. There’s a serious shortage of personnel, and the government must act. Instead of supporting the Army, BJP leaders are criticising it; this is deeply unfortunate,” Saroj said.

Modi was then forced to go on back foot and the BJP went into overdrive and pumped fake news. Even the MLA who made the statement about the Army being asleep had to retract it and pretend it was fake. This is what he said:
Bharatiya Janata Party MLA Ranbir Singh Pathania, released a video late Wednesday night trying to douse the flames he created after he called the Indian Air Force personnel stationed at the Udhampur airbase incompetent and accused them of sleeping during Operation Sindoor.


“Bharat Mata Ki Jai, Indian Air Force Ki Jai. Our forces have always brought pride to the country. Our army has won against Pakistan in a few days,” the BJP MLA said, saying that the viral clip had been edited.

all quotes taken from here https://www.telegraphindia.com/indi...operation-sindoor-then-backtracks/cid/2104204

Indians are still unable to detail why they agreed to a ceasefire and use all sorts of gymnastics to deflect. They have been relegated to nobodys.

It is more likely the next operation will be conducted by Pakistan, as Asim Munir hinted, from the east.
 
No evidence of India hitting Pakistani nuclear storage facilities. India and Pakistan have exchanged nuclear storage site data, so they know what not to target, even accidentally. Kirana hills was decommissioned as a nuclear storage facility in the 90’s.

Even the Indian military has denied it and the IAEA has said there is no radiation leak.

Btw, according to Modi, the US was not involved in the ceasefire. If that’s the case, why did India agree to one since it was winning? Here was your chance to destroy all Pakistani nuclear sites and take Kashmir once and for all.
 
Patriot said:
No evidence of India hitting Pakistani nuclear storage facilities.
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I have linked the exact timestamp to the video of the Kirana hills strike in the link below:



Patriot said:
India and Pakistan have exchanged nuclear storage site data, so they know what not to target, even accidentally. Kirana hills was decommissioned as a nuclear storage facility in the 90’s.
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Except that this particular site is not on that list ... it was a secret storage facility.


Patriot said:
Even the Indian military has denied it and the IAEA has said there is no radiation leak.
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Yes ... its called plausible deniability. This ( and Nur Khan direct hit ) is what spooked Amreeca as it has small number of boots on ground. They did not estimate that India would escalate it this far.

Patriot said:
Btw, according to Modi, the US was not involved in the ceasefire. If that’s the case, why did India agree to one since it was winning? Here was your chance to destroy all Pakistani nuclear sites and take Kashmir once and for all.
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Because at that time they believed Pakistan had learnt a costly lesson as it asked India to stop. Now they might have been naive but we will only find out in the near future if Pakistan goes back to its usual methods.

Conversely if you think India was forced to the table due to Pakistan's military inflicting detrimental damage on India where is the evidence for that ?
 
DeadlyVenom said:
India cannot act. They are paralysed militarily, relying on fake news to pump up the image of their PM and army internally.

There is a major rift between army and government. Army admitted its losses but blamed the government. Government blamed the army.

You can see here comment from BJP minister after the devestation that was inflicted on Udamphur.

“Everyone knows what happened at the Air Force station during Operation Sindoor. They must be incompetent, they were sleeping, we are not at fault. We have given the Indian Army a lot of respect.”

The opposition went crazy.

“It's shameful that leaders from BJP, whether ministers, MPs, or MLAs, are making repeated statements against the Indian Army. The Army stands as a pillar of national security. If we sleep peacefully today, it's because of their sacrifice. They’re also fighting for rightful demands like pensions, which I’ve raised in Parliament. There’s a serious shortage of personnel, and the government must act. Instead of supporting the Army, BJP leaders are criticising it; this is deeply unfortunate,” Saroj said.

Modi was then forced to go on back foot and the BJP went into overdrive and pumped fake news. Even the MLA who made the statement about the Army being asleep had to retract it and pretend it was fake. This is what he said:
Bharatiya Janata Party MLA Ranbir Singh Pathania, released a video late Wednesday night trying to douse the flames he created after he called the Indian Air Force personnel stationed at the Udhampur airbase incompetent and accused them of sleeping during Operation Sindoor.


“Bharat Mata Ki Jai, Indian Air Force Ki Jai. Our forces have always brought pride to the country. Our army has won against Pakistan in a few days,” the BJP MLA said, saying that the viral clip had been edited.

all quotes taken from here https://www.telegraphindia.com/indi...operation-sindoor-then-backtracks/cid/2104204

Indians are still unable to detail why they agreed to a ceasefire and use all sorts of gymnastics to deflect. They have been relegated to nobodys.

It is more likely the next operation will be conducted by Pakistan, as Asim Munir hinted, from the east.
Click to expand...
I totally disagree I am afraid.

Modi and the entire Indian establishment is desperate to restore some sort of superior balance. It's why May had to happen to wash away the 2019 humiliation but now in May they ended up being humiliated too, their entire political structure revolves around Pakistan. Sir Creek, it's dispute, is all over the Indian media the last 24-48 hours, and it's for a reason. India desperately needs something to restore parity.

Pakistan will never ever conduct any pre-emptive operation. For the simple reason which is that Pakistan has no political or diplomatic capital to survive such a scenario. The only nations which conduct such actions have massive diplomatic backing (Israel), massive economies (India) or are part of NATO (NATO itself or Turkey attacking a Western enemy state in Syria) otherwise the result is the heavily sanctioned Russia. The entire reason Pakistan has had such backing internationally especially in May (aside from shooting down Indian planes) was the fact India attacked first and we retaliated. You have to also understand what justification does a pre-emptive strike require? For India it has always been 'terror camps'. For us, there is no target which we can dress up as an excuse. The only target is IOK but it is absolutely heavily fortified with the Indians there armed to the teeth with troop size exceeding our entire active standing army. The only other target would be to take Indian land elsewhere, and while we have done well with the US, there is absolutely no appetite in the US or Europe to see Pakistan land hammer blows against India in the form of terrirtorial losses nor would any nation except such land thefts as justifiable (especially in the case of a Muslim nation attacking one of the largest economies in the world) and to add the only way even this flimsy action would succeed is if, after taking land, the world puts enormous pressure on India to come to the table. Which will never ever happen, the entire Indian nation would lynch Modi if India did not launch a massive attack on Pakistan.

To add, the US is moving huge amount of military goods (planes, air tankers, attack helis) the last week via massive airlifts to airbases near Iranian borders. Hezbollah, Syria and the Houthis are all by and large neutered. There is a big chance the US conducts another attack (with Israel) versus Iran, providing any other country a well needed distraction.

There are also many sources saying the US has put huge pressure on Munir to join the Abraham accords and any goodwill from the US to us is dependent on this. Which is why you saw SS and our entire political circle on their knees praising Trump's plan on Gaza and why SS has met very prominent Jewish and AIPAC members in the US (all on pictures) for such a scenario. And there is a real chance any diplomatic cover against India is depedent on this in the future. PTV has been taking shows off air recently at the mere mention of Netanyahu.

Pakistan's huge mistake was not landing sizeable blows when they had grounded their air force (their own admission) for two days.

Noone wants war but the world is moving towards a large event I fear.
 
uppercut said:
I have linked the exact timestamp to the video of the Kirana hills strike in the link below:





Except that this particular site is not on that list ... it was a secret storage facility.




Yes ... its called plausible deniability. This ( and Nur Khan direct hit ) is what spooked Amreeca as it has small number of boots on ground. They did not estimate that India would escalate it this far.



Because at that time they believed Pakistan had learnt a costly lesson as it asked India to stop. Now they might have been naive but we will only find out in the near future if Pakistan goes back to its usual methods.

Conversely if you think India was forced to the table due to Pakistan's military inflicting detrimental damage on India where is the evidence for that ?
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It was decommissioned in the 90s. Provide evidence that it had nuclear warheads. Your timestamped video doesn’t show that.

Also provide evidence that it was a secret storage facility.
 
If India is admitting it did not hit Pakistani nuclear storage facilities, where is Uppercut the super secret agent getting his info from?
 
uppercut said:
I have linked the exact timestamp to the video of the Kirana hills strike in the link below:





Except that this particular site is not on that list ... it was a secret storage facility.




Yes ... its called plausible deniability. This ( and Nur Khan direct hit ) is what spooked Amreeca as it has small number of boots on ground. They did not estimate that India would escalate it this far.



Because at that time they believed Pakistan had learnt a costly lesson as it asked India to stop. Now they might have been naive but we will only find out in the near future if Pakistan goes back to its usual methods.

Conversely if you think India was forced to the table due to Pakistan's military inflicting detrimental damage on India where is the evidence for that ?
Click to expand...
Oh so your logic is that India naively agreed to the ceasefire because it thought Pakistan had learnt it lesson but at the same time, it hit a Pakistani nuclear facility, which is a grave escalation. Hitting a nuclear facility is an enormous escalation enough to give a legitimate reason for a retaliatory nuclear attack.

The two don’t compute. If india was only trying to teach Pakistan a lesson, it would not have risked hitting a nuclear storage facility.
 
Wasim Ghulam said:
Im not Equating anyone to another. is that your assumption? Isreal / Hamas conflict that started in October 2023 and on going. you are talking about broader conflict over decades.
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thats what is implied when you use the Israel vs Hamas conflict to explain the concept of "the victor imposing its will" Can you tell why Israel has failed to annihilate Hamas after more than 3 decades ? Yes I am talking about the entire conflict from Day1. What has Israel accomplished with all its military might and the unlimited funding that it receives from its Western allies ?

Once you get to the answer of that question you will realize that the same logic is applicable to the India vs Pak situation ( albeit far more serious as Nukes are involved and therefore the entire who's who of the world order gets involved )

I can guarantee you that the next time the US and other world powers will not be as flippant as they were on May 7th when the VP said that the conflict was none of their business
​

Wasim Ghulam said:
Even if we talk about Russia / Ukraine Conflict .. it's on going . Russia has not claimed decicisve victory over Ukraine unlike Indians like you who are claiming sweeping victories in May 2025. The extent of victories that Indians claims they achieved in May 2025 is so high that it's a natural question to ask for End result and what did India achieve because of those victories. Russia being bigger power militarily has not been able to bend Ukraine to its will. But then again Russia never said they broke Ukraine Militarily unlike Indians who by some magic did so in 4 days which Russia has bot been able to do since 2022 or Israel to Hamas since decades

and then you tried to talk about USA Vis Taliban and how USA was not able eliminate Taliban in Afghan

First of all there is no analogy between USA/Taliban Conflict and Ind / Pak conflict. USA invaded Afg to eliminate Al Qaida , which they did. They toppled Taliban Govt when they needed to and remained in Afg until USA itself wanted to. Taliban did nt raise costs for US to run away from AFG. 20 years of occupation is long time and USA exited the region when they needed not because Taliban made them exit. How many 9/11s happened after USA eliminated Al Qaida on US soil ? Rest of geo politics is side quest USA indluged in for 2 decades which has no analogy with Ind pak conflict

Im asking about your Logic, you need to stop asking about my logic .. you made following claims

1. Destroyed our Air bases completely
2. Destroyed our Aircrafts in huge Numbers
3. Destroyed our ability to defend our airspace
4. Attacked our Nuclear facility in Kirana Hills , doing so risked a nuclear war . If you attack someone's nuclear facility directly , you can't predict a response before attacking so in that sense India risked its population to Nuclear holocaust.

So what did India gain by risking to push this region into nuclear conflict? once India took the risk and called out nuclear bluff , why did India stop without even getting own territory that's defined into Indian constitution ? Indian Army chief said now they are fully prepared ? what does that mean? were they not prepared in May 2025?

there are logical inconsistencies in Indian claims

When your constitution itself defines reclaiming all of Kashmir as core duty then any war or operation that ends with zero territorial change can't be called strategic victory. Tactical success perhaps but strategically its status quo and status quo has not changed . The side that's claiming to have called Bluffs and crossed big fat red lines should have concrete to show or it , but it does not . After all the noise , the map has not moved and inch. India's declared goal has always been to take back remaining part of Kashmir and supposed removal of Pakistan's nuclear shield should have made that easier yet the ground reality has not changed which means deterrence still worked .
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Nobody claimed that Pakistan's entire Nuclear deterrence has been neutralized( I have said this before also). Nor did I claim that your airbases were completely destroyed. And remember that both the Navy's were never involved. Also not true is the fact that capturing Kashmir was the end goal. So try again.

You can't claim to have called a bluff and still accept same status quo. that's contradiction in your claims
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Thats because in your simplistic world War won = Territory won. Doesn't work like that. this is not a situation with binary outcomes.
 
I don’t know why both countries agreed to a ceasefire but it wasn’t the US’s doing as per Modi’s comments and I highly doubt India is so naive to stop when it’s supposed to be winning.

Maybe both countries had losses such as the Pakistani bases being hit and maybe Indian jets being hit and they realised if this continues, more costly damage could occur.

India is not the only country with cruise missile capabilities. Pakistan also has cruise missiles which maybe be subsonic unlike the supersonic Brahmos, but the cruise missiles are pinpoint accurate to 5m, have a range of 500km plus and are terrain hugging, which makes it difficult to identify their launch and intercept. Pakistan did not use its cruise missiles unlike India, which decided to use Brahmos and could have loaded it with a nuclear warhead making the whole situation extremely dangerous. Why did India escalate the situation by using a cruise missile when Pakistan did not?
 
Patriot said:
Oh so your logic is that India naively agreed to the ceasefire because it thought Pakistan had learnt it lesson but at the same time, it hit a Pakistani nuclear facility, which is a grave escalation. Hitting a nuclear facility is an enormous escalation enough to give a legitimate reason for a retaliatory nuclear attack.
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Not at the same time but soon AFTER hitting Kirana and making your DGMO wait for a few hours before picking up his call. Yes I agree that its a significant escalation and the only logical explanation is that they had calculated all eventualities and assessed that Pakistan was not in a position to retaliate.​

Patriot said:
The two don’t compute. If india was only trying to teach Pakistan a lesson, it would not have risked hitting a nuclear storage facility.
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they don't compute for you because you are perhaps assuming that the strike caused nuclear cook-off. It was only a warning shot which was meant to convey the message to Pakistan that we know where your stash is and we have the precise tech capability to deal with that.
 
Patriot said:
I don’t know why both countries agreed to a ceasefire but it wasn’t the US’s doing as per Modi’s comments and I highly doubt India is so naive to stop when it’s supposed to be winning.
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The simple answer is that India is a responsible military power and any protracted war is costly and not in its best economic interests. There is nothing to be gained other than pain by conquering Pakistan.


Patriot said:
Maybe both countries had losses such as the Pakistani bases being hit and maybe Indian jets being hit and they realised if this continues, more costly damage could occur.

India is not the only country with cruise missile capabilities. Pakistan also has cruise missiles which maybe be subsonic unlike the supersonic Brahmos, but the cruise missiles are pinpoint accurate to 5m, have a range of 500km plus and are terrain hugging, which makes it difficult to identify their launch and intercept. Pakistan did not use its cruise missiles unlike India, which decided to use Brahmos and could have loaded it with a nuclear warhead making the whole situation extremely dangerous. Why did India escalate the situation by using a cruise missile when Pakistan did not?
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It is well known ( and now proven) that Pakistani missiles are nowhere as accurate and lethal as the missiles that India has ... the evidence is in the form of ZERO satellite images to backup the claims by your DGISPR that 26 Airbases were hit.
 
uppercut said:
thats what is implied when you use the Israel vs Hamas conflict to explain the concept of "the victor imposing its will" Can you tell why Israel has failed to annihilate Hamas after more than 3 decades ? Yes I am talking about the entire conflict from Day1. What has Israel accomplished with all its military might and the unlimited funding that it receives from its Western allies ?
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Israel is occupying force in West Bank , despite UN resolutions , world can't make Israel de occupy West Bank and recognize Palestinian state. Conflict between Hamas and Israel can go on but Isreal remains dominant and occupying force between two. Should I teach you more about world affairs?

uppercut said:
Nobody claimed that Pakistan's entire Nuclear deterrence has been neutralized( I have said this before also). Nor did I claim that your airbases were completely destroyed. And remember that both the Navy's were never involved. Also not true is the fact that capturing Kashmir was the end goal. So try again.
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you either called out bluff and there was never a nuclear deterrent to begin with or deterrent is in tact . both can't be true at same time. when you use word " Bluff " it means Pakistan was bluffing to have Nuclear deterrence without actually having one. You need to try again

uppercut said:
Thats because in your simplistic world War won = Territory won. Doesn't work like that. this is not a situation with binary outcomes.
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when your claims are unrealistic then question arises , what did change on ground against those victories? I can assure you by the time Ukraine / Russia conflict ends there will be some secession from Ukraine or else war will continue. It is all about outcomes and India have nothing to show for except some sat images of damaged bases . Im glad you conceded that India did not completely destroy Pakistan's Airbases. Pakistan also never claimed that its air bases are fool proof to incoming missiles. So even if there is damage to the bases that's same thing when AK Bharti said losses are part of the combat.


Why did Pak Agree to Ceasefire ? Because Pak is smaller country and its military doctrine and posture is defensive . it maintains credible minimum deterrence which means that if Pak did not loose its territory against Bigger enemy like India which maintains claim over our land , then same should be considered a relative victory

on the other hand , if India goes as far as attacking our nuclear facility and then stops the war without having any of its demands accepted , not even 1 , forget about taking back territory , India could not even ask for return of Political prisoners or Military prisoners like Kulbushan back , then there is only one logical conclusion that India did nt deter or damage Pak enough
 
Patriot said:
It was decommissioned in the 90s. Provide evidence that it had nuclear warheads. Your timestamped video doesn’t show that.

Also provide evidence that it was a secret storage facility.
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evidence is circumstantial in the form of a cargo plane with Boron and other OSINT analysis by Damien Symon and other military enthusiasts. Also the White-house declined to comment on whether the DOE had sent in their radiation detection aircraft to Pakistan ... a tell tale sign. There is no other reason why the US would suddenly make a u-turn after saying that this War was none of their business only to get deeply involved and start hurling trade penalties soon after.​
 
Pakpak said:
I totally disagree I am afraid.

Modi and the entire Indian establishment is desperate to restore some sort of superior balance. It's why May had to happen to wash away the 2019 humiliation but now in May they ended up being humiliated too, their entire political structure revolves around Pakistan. Sir Creek, it's dispute, is all over the Indian media the last 24-48 hours, and it's for a reason. India desperately needs something to restore parity.

Pakistan will never ever conduct any pre-emptive operation. For the simple reason which is that Pakistan has no political or diplomatic capital to survive such a scenario. The only nations which conduct such actions have massive diplomatic backing (Israel), massive economies (India) or are part of NATO (NATO itself or Turkey attacking a Western enemy state in Syria) otherwise the result is the heavily sanctioned Russia. The entire reason Pakistan has had such backing internationally especially in May (aside from shooting down Indian planes) was the fact India attacked first and we retaliated. You have to also understand what justification does a pre-emptive strike require? For India it has always been 'terror camps'. For us, there is no target which we can dress up as an excuse. The only target is IOK but it is absolutely heavily fortified with the Indians there armed to the teeth with troop size exceeding our entire active standing army. The only other target would be to take Indian land elsewhere, and while we have done well with the US, there is absolutely no appetite in the US or Europe to see Pakistan land hammer blows against India in the form of terrirtorial losses nor would any nation except such land thefts as justifiable (especially in the case of a Muslim nation attacking one of the largest economies in the world) and to add the only way even this flimsy action would succeed is if, after taking land, the world puts enormous pressure on India to come to the table. Which will never ever happen, the entire Indian nation would lynch Modi if India did not launch a massive attack on Pakistan.

To add, the US is moving huge amount of military goods (planes, air tankers, attack helis) the last week via massive airlifts to airbases near Iranian borders. Hezbollah, Syria and the Houthis are all by and large neutered. There is a big chance the US conducts another attack (with Israel) versus Iran, providing any other country a well needed distraction.

There are also many sources saying the US has put huge pressure on Munir to join the Abraham accords and any goodwill from the US to us is dependent on this. Which is why you saw SS and our entire political circle on their knees praising Trump's plan on Gaza and why SS has met very prominent Jewish and AIPAC members in the US (all on pictures) for such a scenario. And there is a real chance any diplomatic cover against India is depedent on this in the future. PTV has been taking shows off air recently at the mere mention of Netanyahu.

Pakistan's huge mistake was not landing sizeable blows when they had grounded their air force (their own admission) for two days.

Noone wants war but the world is moving towards a large event I fear.
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I concur with you, they should have destroyed a lot more when IAF was grounded for two days.

Also, with the spectre of Chinese stealth fighter coming to PAF, it incentives them to go for round 2 now rather than later.

What do you do with Afghanistan (Taliban) as they are seemingly the second front against Pakistan. I never understood why Pakistan ever abandoned the Tajiks, they were the natural allies and generally tend to be more educated and nuanced.

I hope Pakistan is prepared as India will be better prepared this time. Destruction will be off the scale this time if territorial integrity is threatened for either side.
 
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Wasim Ghulam said:
Israel is occupying force in West Bank , despite UN resolutions , world can't make Israel de occupy West Bank and recognize Palestinian state. Conflict between Hamas and Israel can go on but Isreal remains dominant and occupying force between two. Should I teach you more about world affairs?



you either called out bluff and there was never a nuclear deterrent to begin with or deterrent is in tact . both can't be true at same time. when you use word " Bluff " it means Pakistan was bluffing to have Nuclear deterrence without actually having one. You need to try again



when your claims are unrealistic then question arises , what did change on ground against those victories? I can assure you by the time Ukraine / Russia conflict ends there will be some secession from Ukraine or else war will continue. It is all about outcomes and India have nothing to show for except some sat images of damaged bases . Im glad you conceded that India did not completely destroy Pakistan's Airbases. Pakistan also never claimed that its air bases are fool proof to incoming missiles. So even if there is damage to the bases that's same thing when AK Bharti said losses are part of the combat.

Why did Pak Agree to Ceasefire ? Because Pak is smaller country and its military doctrine and posture is defensive . it maintains credible minimum deterrence which means that if Pak did not loose its territory against Bigger enemy like India which maintains claim over our land , then same should be considered a relative victory

on the other hand , if India goes as far as attacking our nuclear facility and then stops the war without having any of its demands accepted , not even 1 , forget about taking back territory , India could not even ask for return of Political prisoners or Military prisoners like Kulbushan back , then there is only one logical conclusion that India did nt deter or damage Pak enough
Click to expand...


Here is the thing that you do not understand or deliberately pretending otherwise ... There was no "demand" to begin with. There was only a promise to inflict disproportionate damage on Pakistan by completely disregarding its openly stated first use of Nuclear weapons by striking deep and across the length and breadth of your mainland ( including Lahore and Nur Khan which is pretty much Islamabad ) . This obviously means crossing not just the LOC but the IB and is one of your red-lines. Just to ensure that the message was recieved loud and clear the IAF added Kirana Hills + Sargodha as their last signature message which is why your generals ran to their masters to save them from more pain. That in a nutshell is what I mean by calling the Nuclear bluff. Because in the past we have been very careful to not cause too much damage lest it spiral into a Nuclear war. No more. What did Pakistan do ? Absolutely nothing other than ranting and raving. These are the indisputable facts

Now the only question that remains un-answered is whether you think the damage was disproportionate to the original crime at Pehalgam and if you think Pakistan will do another Pehalgam considering you feel that India did not explicitly extract anything at the table. Let me know.





​
 
uppercut said:

Here is the thing that you do not understand or deliberately pretending otherwise ... There was no "demand" to begin with. There was only a promise to inflict disproportionate damage on Pakistan by completely disregarding its openly stated first use of Nuclear weapons by striking deep and across the length and breadth of your mainland ( including Lahore and Nur Khan which is pretty much Islamabad ) . This obviously means crossing not just the LOC but the IB and is one of your red-lines. Just to ensure that the message was recieved loud and clear the IAF added Kirana Hills + Sargodha as their last signature message which is why your generals ran to their masters to save them from more pain. That in a nutshell is what I mean by calling the Nuclear bluff. Because in the past we have been very careful to not cause too much damage lest it spiral into a Nuclear war. No more. What did Pakistan do ? Absolutely nothing other than ranting and raving. These are the indisputable facts

Now the only question that remains un-answered is whether you think the damage was disproportionate to the original crime at Pehalgam and if you think Pakistan will do another Pehalgam considering you feel that India did not explicitly extract anything at the table. Let me know.





​
Click to expand...

Indians like you will not decide what are our red lines are and then pretend that you crossed it haha

You will have a nuclear response when Pak will feel the need to respond to you with nuclear Weapons not because you provoked us and sent us some imaginary warning shots in Kirana Hills which your military does not even have guts to admit that they did it. Spare me Plausible deniability Bs. you were brave enough to strike our N site but not brave enough to admit it. stop peddling conspiracy theories. If there was ever a radiation leak , World would have known and talked about it.

You tested our nuclear resolve , it was hollow yet you accepted a ceasefire. and then did nt even get to announce it. We Ran to our Masters , fair enough. What was India's compulsion to agree on it? Now your chief is making threats again. Why agree to ceasefire in first place.. out of all Indian posters here you make least sense
 
Wasim Ghulam said:
Indians like you will not decide what are our red lines are and then pretend that you crossed it haha
Click to expand...

Not mine. Those are your own stated red-lines. Infact I forgot to mention that one of your ministers confessing their inability to decide if the next incoming missile at Nur Khan was Nuclear tipped or not and they had about a minute to decide. Thats as vulnerable as you can get and not be able to do anything about it other than pray.​

Wasim Ghulam said:
You will have a nuclear response when Pak will feel the need to respond to you with nuclear Weapons not because you provoked us and sent us some imaginary warning shots in Kirana Hills which your military does not even have guts to admit that they did it. Spare me Plausible deniability Bs. you were brave enough to strike our N site but not brave enough to admit it. stop peddling conspiracy theories. If there was ever a radiation leak , World would have known and talked about it.
Click to expand...

Nothing to do about bravery. Its just smart thinking because claiming to deliberately target a nuclear facility has consequences except for Israel and US. But its a step in the right direction.

Wasim Ghulam said:
You tested our nuclear resolve , it was hollow yet you accepted a ceasefire.
Click to expand...

Yup I agree with you there ... we should not have and continued the Military strikes. Infact there is quite a bit of resentment amongst vast majority of Indians who wanted to inflict faar more damage on Pakistan.


Wasim Ghulam said:
and then did nt even get to announce it. We Ran to our Masters , fair enough. What was India's compulsion to agree on it?
Click to expand...

ohh very simple answer: America ... same story as in Kargil. Only this time your DGMO was forced to make the call ( twice ).

Wasim Ghulam said:
Now your chief is making threats again. Why agree to ceasefire in first place.. out of all Indian posters here you make least sense
Click to expand...

First of all Op Sindoor is only paused secondly the General is letting your Generals know that their recent chumminess with Amreeca does not change our policies. Lets see if Pakistan decides to escalate the Sir Creek dispute.
 
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uppercut said:
ot mine. Those are your own stated red-lines.
Click to expand...

Crossing LOC and IB is our red line according to you. My response to this joke is not needed other than hahahaha. do care to mention where it is stated ?

uppercut said:
Nothing to do about bravery. Its just smart thinking because claiming to deliberately target a nuclear facility has consequences except for Israel and US. But its a step in the right direction.
Click to expand...
its nice to know that Indians know their limitations about consequences but still does not prove anything. its feel good theory though

uppercut said:
Yup I agree with you there ... we should not have and continued the Military strikes. Infact there is quite a bit of resentment amongst vast majority of Indians who wanted to inflict faar more damage on Pakistan.
Click to expand...

so its time to admit that you were not able to continue . Not because India chose to but if you want to feel good about this too be my guest

uppercut said:
First of all Op Sindoor is only paused secondly the General is letting your Generals know that their recent chumminess with Amreeca does not change our policies. Lets see if Pakistan decides to escalate the Sir Creek dispute.
Click to expand...

Why would Pak escalate Sir Creek ? there is no evidence of that. Just Because Indian Media is talking about it as pretext for another sparring round with Pak , does not mean its True
 
uppercut said:
Only this time your DGMO was forced to make the call ( twice ).
Click to expand...

forgot to answer this gibberish

USA never said our DGMO called once or twice. Neither any Pakistani official ever said that Pak requested ceasefire. so who asked for ceasefire is still unknown. We do not believe Indians and their media and same way Indians can choose not to believe us .
 
uppercut said:
The simple answer is that India is a responsible military power and any protracted war is costly and not in its best economic interests. There is nothing to be gained other than pain by conquering Pakistan.




It is well known ( and now proven) that Pakistani missiles are nowhere as accurate and lethal as the missiles that India has ... the evidence is in the form of ZERO satellite images to backup the claims by your DGISPR that 26 Airbases were hit.
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As I have said, Pakistan did not use cruise missiles!!!

We do have accurate ones that can hit within 5m of the target. Unlike India, Pakistan did not escalate.
 
uppercut said:
evidence is circumstantial in the form of a cargo plane with Boron and other OSINT analysis by Damien Symon and other military enthusiasts. Also the White-house declined to comment on whether the DOE had sent in their radiation detection aircraft to Pakistan ... a tell tale sign. There is no other reason why the US would suddenly make a u-turn after saying that this War was none of their business only to get deeply involved and start hurling trade penalties soon after.​
Click to expand...
You are just dabbling in conspiracy theories now.
 
uppercut said:

Here is the thing that you do not understand or deliberately pretending otherwise ... There was no "demand" to begin with. There was only a promise to inflict disproportionate damage on Pakistan by completely disregarding its openly stated first use of Nuclear weapons by striking deep and across the length and breadth of your mainland ( including Lahore and Nur Khan which is pretty much Islamabad ) . This obviously means crossing not just the LOC but the IB and is one of your red-lines. Just to ensure that the message was recieved loud and clear the IAF added Kirana Hills + Sargodha as their last signature message which is why your generals ran to their masters to save them from more pain. That in a nutshell is what I mean by calling the Nuclear bluff. Because in the past we have been very careful to not cause too much damage lest it spiral into a Nuclear war. No more. What did Pakistan do ? Absolutely nothing other than ranting and raving. These are the indisputable facts

Now the only question that remains un-answered is whether you think the damage was disproportionate to the original crime at Pehalgam and if you think Pakistan will do another Pehalgam considering you feel that India did not explicitly extract anything at the table. Let me know.





​
Click to expand...
Countries don’t just start chucking nukes because they are being hit. They may make threats but that’s all they are. Even Putin isn’t stupid enough to nuke Ukraine despite the West supplying weapons. I guarantee you that in a hypothetical situation if for some reason Pakistan destroys all your fighters, India won’t launch a nuke.
 
uppercut said:
Not mine. Those are your own stated red-lines. Infact I forgot to mention that one of your ministers confessing their inability to decide if the next incoming missile at Nur Khan was Nuclear tipped or not and they had about a minute to decide. Thats as vulnerable as you can get and not be able to do anything about it other than pray.​



Nothing to do about bravery. Its just smart thinking because claiming to deliberately target a nuclear facility has consequences except for Israel and US. But its a step in the right direction.



Yup I agree with you there ... we should not have and continued the Military strikes. Infact there is quite a bit of resentment amongst vast majority of Indians who wanted to inflict faar more damage on Pakistan.




ohh very simple answer: America ... same story as in Kargil. Only this time your DGMO was forced to make the call ( twice ).



First of all Op Sindoor is only paused secondly the General is letting your Generals know that their recent chumminess with Amreeca does not change our policies. Lets see if Pakistan decides to escalate the Sir Creek dispute.
Click to expand...
How many times do I have to tell you that no military on the planet has the ability to tell if a missile has a nuclear warhead or not. The only way to tell is either to let it hit and face the consequences or to intercept it and examine it. Please tell us how any country would know if India decides to switch a conventional warhead with a nuclear one?
 
uppercut said:
evidence is circumstantial in the form of a cargo plane with Boron and other OSINT analysis by Damien Symon and other military enthusiasts. Also the White-house declined to comment on whether the DOE had sent in their radiation detection aircraft to Pakistan ... a tell tale sign. There is no other reason why the US would suddenly make a u-turn after saying that this War was none of their business only to get deeply involved and start hurling trade penalties soon after.​
Click to expand...
I missed this.

So you are saying a cargo plane with Boron landed in Pakistan?

Are you mad? Boron is used to contain radioactive fallout. Are you suggesting there was a radioactive leak? Why isn’t this news now, months after the event? Surely if there has been a radioactive leak, it would be top news and a leak can’t be covered up. When Chernobyl happened, the radiation was detected in Europe. And the IAEA has said there was no radioactive leak.

Seriously, you are peddling rubbish.
 
Patriot said:
I missed this.

So you are saying a cargo plane with Boron landed in Pakistan?

Are you mad? Boron is used to contain radioactive fallout. Are you suggesting there was a radioactive leak? Why isn’t this news now, months after the event? Surely if there has been a radioactive leak, it would be top news and a leak can’t be covered up. When Chernobyl happened, the radiation was detected in Europe. And the IAEA has said there was no radioactive leak.

Seriously, you are peddling rubbish.
Click to expand...

Modi probably farted. His leaks are radioactive.
 
Patriot said:
I missed this.

So you are saying a cargo plane with Boron landed in Pakistan?

Are you mad? Boron is used to contain radioactive fallout. Are you suggesting there was a radioactive leak? Why isn’t this news now, months after the event? Surely if there has been a radioactive leak, it would be top news and a leak can’t be covered up. When Chernobyl happened, the radiation was detected in Europe. And the IAEA has said there was no radioactive leak.

Seriously, you are peddling rubbish.
Click to expand...

here you go. One of these days I will find that whitehouse Press conference where this question was brought up and the Press secretary refused to answer it. But in the meanwhile check this out:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1923372525716992321
 
The images in the tweets are all in relation to some Egyptian transport plane. No evidence of what it contains. All rubbish about Boron. Why on earth would Boron be delivered when there has been no leak. We would know by now months after the incident. No evidence of a US energy aircraft either.

I’m done with this nonsense.
 
Look, you guys hit our bases. Let’s stick to that fact and not add conspiracy theories to it. Be happy India won.
 
Patriot said:
I missed this.

So you are saying a cargo plane with Boron landed in Pakistan?

Are you mad? Boron is used to contain radioactive fallout. Are you suggesting there was a radioactive leak? Why isn’t this news now, months after the event? Surely if there has been a radioactive leak, it would be top news and a leak can’t be covered up. When Chernobyl happened, the radiation was detected in Europe. And the IAEA has said there was no radioactive leak.

Seriously, you are peddling rubbish.
Click to expand...

From Grok:

Q: Is it true that there was a radiation detection plane sent by the US DOE to Kirana Hills earlier this year in the month of May ?

Yes, multiple credible reports from May 2025 indicate that the United States Department of Energy (DOE), through its National Nuclear Security Administration (NNSA), deployed a specialized radiation detection aircraft—a Beechcraft B350 AMS (Aerial Measuring System)—to the vicinity of Kirana Hills in Pakistan's Punjab province. This occurred amid heightened India-Pakistan military tensions, following Indian airstrikes under "Operation Sindoor" on May 10, 2025, which targeted several Pakistani airbases, including Mushaf (near Sargodha and Kirana Hills). Kirana Hills is a long-suspected underground nuclear storage and testing site for Pakistan's arsenal.

Q: Is it true that a Egyptian plane carrying Boron landed in Pakistan earlier this year in the month of May ?

Yes, reports from multiple sources confirm that an Egyptian Air Force transport plane (identified as an IL-76 with call sign EGY1916) landed in Pakistan on or around May 11, 2025, carrying a shipment of boron (specifically Boron-10, a neutron-absorbing isotope sourced from Egypt's Nile Delta region). The landing occurred at Bhurban Airport in Pakistan's Murree district, near Islamabad, amid heightened India-Pakistan tensions following Indian airstrikes (Operation Sindoor) on Pakistani military sites, including areas near suspected nuclear facilities like Sargodha and Kirana Hills.
 
Hitman said:
India has issued a fierce warning to Pakistan: stop supporting terrorism or lose your geographical presence. If Pakistan wants to retain its place on the map, it must stop state-sponsored terrorism, Army chief General Upendra Dwivedi has said, warning the western neighbour known for its deep-state backing of terror masters.

Speaking at an Army post in Rajasthan's Anupgarh, General Dwivedi said the Indian forces won't show any restraint this time, hinting that a second version of 'Operation Sindoor' wouldn't be far away if Islamabad refuses to stop exporting terror.

"This time we will not maintain the restraint that we had in Operation Sindoor 1.0. This time we will do something that will make Pakistan think whether it wants to retain its place in geography or not. If Pakistan wants to retain its place in geography, then it must stop state-sponsored terrorism," he said at an army post in Rajasthan.

He also asked the soldiers to stay prepared. "If God wills, you'll get an opportunity soon. All the best," the Chief of Army Staff said.

Gen Dwivedi's warning follows Air Chief Marshal AP Singh's remark earlier in the day that the Indian forces had downed four to five Pakistani fighter jets, including US-made F-16s and Chinese JF-17s, during Operation Sindoor in May.

The mega military operation was undertaken by India to give a fitting reply in the aftermath of the Pahalgam terror attack. Nine terror camps were hit in Pakistan and PoK (Pakistan-occupied Kashmir) by Indian forces using long-range precision weapons on May 7.

The attack on terror camps had brought the two countries to a near-war situation, during which the Indian air chief had claimed that Pakistan lost five of its fighter jets and a 'big bird', likely an airborne early warning and control aircraft.

A ceasefire followed on May 10 after the Pakistani commanders pleaded with their Indian counterparts to stop the offensive.

During Operation Sindoor, India resolved that no innocent lives would be harmed and no military targets would be destroyed, said the Army chief, adding that the focus was on eliminating terrorist hideouts, training centres and their masterminds.

He further said that India presented evidence to the world about the terrorist hideouts destroyed during Operation Sindoor. Had India not done so, Pakistan would have hidden the truth, he said.

The Army chief also honoured three officers for their exceptional work during Operation Sindoor. At the event, BSF 140th Battalion Commandant Prabhakar Singh, Rajputana Rifles Major Ritesh Kumar, and Havildar Mohit Gaira received special recognition.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Link: https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/wil...e-restraint-army-chief-warns-pakistan-9389206​
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images
 
Cpt. Rishwat said:
I have said many times that India is too cowardly to erase Pakistan from the map. I challenge even ONE Indian on these boards to dispute that, bearing in mind I have given the many reasons why this can never happen in any foreseeable future.

Take up the challenge hindutvas. Here I am.
Click to expand...

They ran to Trump for a ceasefire in less than 5 days. :yk

They are indeed pretty cowardly.
 
I marvel at the lack of intelligence of the average Indian posters. Pakistan can see through their govt’s narrative and admit their flaws and deception but Indians believe their govt craps gold and pisses honey and milk and can never be wrong. They are shooting themselves in their own foot. They are being sold lies even worse than the oak estsblshment is trying to sell the Pakistanis. And their people are lapping it all up as hungrily as the BJP lapdogs (minus the benefits)
 
Wasim Ghulam said:
forgot to answer this gibberish

USA never said our DGMO called once or twice. Neither any Pakistani official ever said that Pak requested ceasefire. so who asked for ceasefire is still unknown. We do not believe Indians and their media and same way Indians can choose not to believe us .
Click to expand...

Why would DT give credit to anyone else considering how desperate he is for a Nobel. But he has slipped atleast once when he said words to the effect that "I wouldnt say I did but .... "

Also Ishaq Dar has slipped more than once on this topic. Here in this interview to Al-Jazeera he admitted that India does not believe in 3rd party mediation ( this is in reference to the Ceasefire ) ... so that clearly tells you what really happened considering how thankful Pakistan has been to the US for stopping the war.


​
 
Stewie said:
I marvel at the lack of intelligence of the average Indian posters. Pakistan can see through their govt’s narrative and admit their flaws and deception but Indians believe their govt craps gold and pisses honey and milk and can never be wrong. They are shooting themselves in their own foot. They are being sold lies even worse than the oak estsblshment is trying to sell the Pakistanis. And their people are lapping it all up as hungrily as the BJP lapdogs (minus the benefits)
Click to expand...

Show me where I have used any Indian Govt narrative on this topic. Everything that I have posted on the Ind-Pak war is all neutral or Pakistani sources. I religiously avoid using Indian sources.
 
Stewie said:
I marvel at the lack of intelligence of the average Indian posters. Pakistan can see through their govt’s narrative and admit their flaws and deception but Indians believe their govt craps gold and pisses honey and milk and can never be wrong. They are shooting themselves in their own foot. They are being sold lies even worse than the oak estsblshment is trying to sell the Pakistanis. And their people are lapping it all up as hungrily as the BJP lapdogs (minus the benefits)
Click to expand...
Pretty much every country does this, except India. There's something unique about India in this regard. Ties into the thread about Indians disliking any and all criticism of India.
 
uppercut said:
Why would DT give credit to anyone else considering how desperate he is for a Nobel. But he has slipped atleast once when he said words to the effect that "I wouldnt say I did but .... "

Also Ishaq Dar has slipped more than once on this topic. Here in this interview to Al-Jazeera he admitted that India does not believe in 3rd party mediation ( this is in reference to the Ceasefire ) ... so that clearly tells you what really happened considering how thankful Pakistan has been to the US for stopping the war.


​
Click to expand...
no it does nt clearly tell what happened. you have taken liberty to imply based on General stance of India regarding 3rd Party Mediation in past disputes It does nt mean India refused mediation from US during war

India agreeing to Ceasfire after Pak launched attack on 10th may clearly tells you India did nt want to continue and accepted mediation . Col Sofia briefing on morning of 10th may Indicate that Pakistan's attack did damage
 
Pakistan's growing irrelevance makes them a regional featherweight and a global nobody. That's hardly an enemy to worry about.

Bhartiya army needs to sit quiet and let Modi Ji do the talking.
 
Patriot said:
I missed this.

So you are saying a cargo plane with Boron landed in Pakistan?

Are you mad? Boron is used to contain radioactive fallout. Are you suggesting there was a radioactive leak? Why isn’t this news now, months after the event? Surely if there has been a radioactive leak, it would be top news and a leak can’t be covered up. When Chernobyl happened, the radiation was detected in Europe. And the IAEA has said there was no radioactive leak.

Seriously, you are peddling rubbish.
Click to expand...
lol

This guy is asking Grok about it . Grok is saying there are multiple reports. Same reports that Indian accounts spam which Grok picks up 😀😀
 
Looks like all those thousands of illegal Indian immigrants which were sent back slapped and shackled from Canada and USA are now joining the BJP. And therefore, spewing the verbal diarrhea against Pakistan.
 
Stewie said:
I marvel at the lack of intelligence of the average Indian posters. Pakistan can see through their govt’s narrative and admit their flaws and deception but Indians believe their govt craps gold and pisses honey and milk and can never be wrong. They are shooting themselves in their own foot. They are being sold lies even worse than the oak estsblshment is trying to sell the Pakistanis. And their people are lapping it all up as hungrily as the BJP lapdogs (minus the benefits)
Click to expand...

Modi-era hallucinations are rather new and somewhat combatable through independent media, personalities or opposition.

Nothing compares to the mass delusions that (a lot of) people of Pakistan suffer from. You literally have a subject in school curriculum called Pakistan Sudies that brainwashes you about your country's roots and achievements. And nobody in your media or poltiics dare criticize the army. The last one who tried, that hunky cricket player, is sitting in a cell eating maggot-infested chaat. :facepalm:
 
Pakpak said:
There are some serious talk of Indians trying to act out again and trying to capture some land as something like that would be worth bragging over no matter how many planes they lose. I follow a few accounts (Zionist scum that they are) but they are very accurate during the previous conflict as well.

The Taliban's FM is also visiting India.

Now I don't know how the US will react, Trump probably will be livid but India generally has faced humiliation since May. Their best friend in the neighborhood are the Taliban, is proof enough. Our military is better prepared and with the Saudi deal atleast should not have any financial issues.

Modi really is a scrouge.
Click to expand...


The Indian army chief bragged they would erase Pakistan from the map. No Indian poster has taken up my challenge to back their army General in this hollow boast and I am happy to explain once again in unequivocal terms why this is impossible.

But the challenge still stands. Will one of them show some spine and take take it up? I doubt it.
 
RexRex said:
Modi-era hallucinations are rather new and somewhat combatable through independent media, personalities or opposition.

Nothing compares to the mass delusions that (a lot of) people of Pakistan suffer from. You literally have a subject in school curriculum called Pakistan Sudies that brainwashes you about your country's roots and achievements. And nobody in your media or poltiics dare criticize the army. The last one who tried, that hunky cricket player, is sitting in a cell eating maggot-infested chaat. :facepalm:
Click to expand...
Mass delusions do not result in a massive overwhelming anti establishment sentiment and election result, which was thwarted by them in ridiculous ways, which has been my point in my previous posts here. If you start looking at the trends of the two countries, it seems Pakistanis are now actually waking up to the nefarious designs of their traditional overlords whereas India has gone the Pakistan way and is turning into state easily controlled and manipulated by extremist ideologies.

We are trying to turn the ship around and you guys are trying to be like us, in a nutshell. Please tell me you dont find that alarming.
 
Stewie said:
If you start looking at the trends of the two countries, it seems Pakistanis are now actually waking up to the nefarious designs of their traditional overlords ..
Click to expand...

Pakistanis are waking up to the nefarious designs of their 'traditional overlords' with regards to the country's India policy or domestic politics ? Because I couldn't care less about the latter. Even on the domestic front, it had to take Imran's imprisonment for you to realise it.

There's no change to their views on India.
 
RexRex said:
Pakistanis are waking up to the nefarious designs of their 'traditional overlords' with regards to the country's India policy or domestic politics ? Because I couldn't care less about the latter. Even on the domestic front, it had to take Imran's imprisonment for you to realise it.

There's no change to their views on India.
Click to expand...
India has not done much for Pakistanis to change their views either. Name one thing that has changed?
but regardless this is so tpical of indian to deflect and pivot and completely ignore their own inadequacies and issues. extremism and demagoguery is on the rise in india and they find easy refuge in blaming everything on pakistan.
 
For the educated Indians here: how much sense does it make to threaten a nuclear state from existence? during the pahalgam incident there were several offers made by pakistan to investigate the issue using a neutral or third party. india always insists on bilateral discussion because they dont want the world to know how unrealistic and ridiculous their demands are regarding each and every aspect of pak-india conflicts. besides if they truly wanted these issues to be resolved peacefully, how will the ruling party leverage the hatred for votes?

once again, all these recent claims are nothing but flexing for the upcoming elections. they will make the hate and anti pakistan sentiment for as long as possible.
 
RexRex said:
Pakistanis are waking up to the nefarious designs of their 'traditional overlords' with regards to the country's India policy or domestic politics ? Because I couldn't care less about the latter. Even on the domestic front, it had to take Imran's imprisonment for you to realise it.

There's no change to their views on India.
Click to expand...


This is the thing though. You can understand why the Pakistan establishment focuses on the India/Pakistan warmongering, it deflects from their own issues at home, and in a way justifies the importance of the military. But don't you find it more troubling that India is doing the same with Pakistan? Should an aspirational superpower really spend so much of it's time and effort talking about a small time neighbouring country which is often described as a failed state by Indian media?
 
Stewie said:
India has not done much for Pakistanis to change their views either. Name one thing that has changed?
but regardless this is so tpical of indian to deflect and pivot and completely ignore their own inadequacies and issues. extremism and demagoguery is on the rise in india and they find easy refuge in blaming everything on pakistan.
Click to expand...

Extremism and demogoguery in India are India's domestic problems, it has nothing to do with Indo-Pak relations.

Just last week I asked @HalBass9 if the 1965 war (initiated by a Pak military dictator) was wrong after 18 years of Indo-Pak peace on the border and he said he saw nothing wrong with it. You probably don't either.
 
RexRex said:
Extremism and demogoguery in India are India's domestic problems, it has nothing to do with Indo-Pak relations.

Just last week I asked @HalBass9 if the 1965 war (initiated by a Pak military dictator) was wrong after 18 years of Indo-Pak peace on the border and he said he saw nothing wrong with it. You probably don't either.
Click to expand...
Are you stupid or just pretending to be one? It has absolutely a lot to do with the cross border relations. Every time a critical election is around the corner in India, something happens and the relationship sours with Pakistan. Or are you saying the Pakistani establishment is so wise as to pick such times to actually fan the popularity of the ruling party in india and starts such misadventures to give them the much needed wind?

You are really living with your heads buried in the sand if you are only going to focus on "oh so evil Pakistan and Pakistanis" and not see the reality of your own domestic menace of a government that has been milking the hatred and war wongering for years to their benefit.
 
Stewie said:
Or are you saying the Pakistani establishment is so wise as to pick such times to actually fan the popularity of the ruling party in india and starts such misadventures to give them the much needed wind?
Click to expand...

Yes, given the history of your army .. and the number of wars it started with India, I have zero problem in believing all these 'misadventures', as you call it, were started by your beloved khakis. Your country ended up on the FATF grey list mutiple times because of it.

I mean .. why on earth would an army that has no problem in conducting mutiple military coups on its own people have any hesitation in engaging in cross-border attacks ? Come out of cuckoo-land.
 
Cpt. Rishwat said:
You can understand why the Pakistan establishment focuses on the India/Pakistan warmongering, it deflects from their own issues at home, and in a way justifies the importance of the military.
Click to expand...

Hmm I thought you described Pahalgam as a false-flag operation a few days ago. Hard to know when people actually believe the stuff they spout on here or are just trolling.
 
RexRex said:
Hmm I thought you described Pahalgam as a false-flag operation a few days ago. Hard to know when people actually believe the stuff they spout on here or are just trolling.
Click to expand...

In all likelihood it was a false flag attack, Pakistan is mired in debt and war is a costly business. They only lose from launching terror attacks, both financially and reputationally.

Indian govt has no achievements or progress to present to their public, so bigging up the terror threat from Pakistan (always Pakistan) is a good vote booster for a party which is rooted in hindutva militancy.
 
RexRex said:
Yes, given the history of your army .. and the number of wars it started with India, I have zero problem in believing all these 'misadventures', as you call it, were started by your beloved khakis. Your country ended up on the FATF grey list mutiple times because of it.

I mean .. why on earth would an army that has no problem in conducting mutiple military coups on its own people have any hesitation in engaging in cross-border attacks ? Come out of cuckoo-land.
Click to expand...
.. sure, and your beloved extremists are saints who are just defending the country out of deepest sincerity and zero connection to the bihar elections with their latest war mongering. Keep telling yourself that :facepalm
 
RexRex said:
Pakistanis are waking up to the nefarious designs of their 'traditional overlords' with regards to the country's India policy or domestic politics ? Because I couldn't care less about the latter. Even on the domestic front, it had to take Imran's imprisonment for you to realise it.

There's no change to their views on India.
Click to expand...
Wait, so being skeptical of the establishment is only relevant as long as they change their views on India. Got it. So if one were to be consistent, then how would you describe Indians on this topic?
 
Pakpak said:
I totally disagree I am afraid.

Modi and the entire Indian establishment is desperate to restore some sort of superior balance. It's why May had to happen to wash away the 2019 humiliation but now in May they ended up being humiliated too, their entire political structure revolves around Pakistan. Sir Creek, it's dispute, is all over the Indian media the last 24-48 hours, and it's for a reason. India desperately needs something to restore parity.

Pakistan will never ever conduct any pre-emptive operation. For the simple reason which is that Pakistan has no political or diplomatic capital to survive such a scenario. The only nations which conduct such actions have massive diplomatic backing (Israel), massive economies (India) or are part of NATO (NATO itself or Turkey attacking a Western enemy state in Syria) otherwise the result is the heavily sanctioned Russia. The entire reason Pakistan has had such backing internationally especially in May (aside from shooting down Indian planes) was the fact India attacked first and we retaliated. You have to also understand what justification does a pre-emptive strike require? For India it has always been 'terror camps'. For us, there is no target which we can dress up as an excuse. The only target is IOK but it is absolutely heavily fortified with the Indians there armed to the teeth with troop size exceeding our entire active standing army. The only other target would be to take Indian land elsewhere, and while we have done well with the US, there is absolutely no appetite in the US or Europe to see Pakistan land hammer blows against India in the form of terrirtorial losses nor would any nation except such land thefts as justifiable (especially in the case of a Muslim nation attacking one of the largest economies in the world) and to add the only way even this flimsy action would succeed is if, after taking land, the world puts enormous pressure on India to come to the table. Which will never ever happen, the entire Indian nation would lynch Modi if India did not launch a massive attack on Pakistan.

To add, the US is moving huge amount of military goods (planes, air tankers, attack helis) the last week via massive airlifts to airbases near Iranian borders. Hezbollah, Syria and the Houthis are all by and large neutered. There is a big chance the US conducts another attack (with Israel) versus Iran, providing any other country a well needed distraction.

There are also many sources saying the US has put huge pressure on Munir to join the Abraham accords and any goodwill from the US to us is dependent on this. Which is why you saw SS and our entire political circle on their knees praising Trump's plan on Gaza and why SS has met very prominent Jewish and AIPAC members in the US (all on pictures) for such a scenario. And there is a real chance any diplomatic cover against India is depedent on this in the future. PTV has been taking shows off air recently at the mere mention of Netanyahu.

Pakistan's huge mistake was not landing sizeable blows when they had grounded their air force (their own admission) for two days.

Noone wants war but the world is moving towards a large event I fear.
Click to expand...

Just curious but haven’t we done a few pre-emotive air strikes in Afghanistan in the last few years?
 
Country that sanctioned mass rape...: India blasts Pak over Kashmiri women remark​


India blasted Pakistan at the United Nations over its dismal record on women's rights and called out the country over its campaign of genocidal mass rape of 400,000 women during Operation Searchlight in 1971 as Islamabad attempted to highlight the "plight" of Kashmiri women at the forum.

In a fiery speech during the UN Security Council debate on women and security, India's permanent representative Parvathaneni Harish slammed Pakistan of continuing its "delusional tirades", particularly regarding Jammu and Kashmir.

"Our pioneering record on women, peace and security agenda is unblemished and unscathed. A country that bombs its own people, conducts systematic genocide can only attempt to distract the world with misdirection and hyperbole," Harish said.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Link: https://www.indiatoday.in/world/sto...an-kashmiri-women-security-2798903-2025-10-07​
 
msb314 said:
Just curious but haven’t we done a few pre-emotive air strikes in Afghanistan in the last few years?
Click to expand...
I think I said noone cares about strikes on broken countries devestated by war. I gave an example of Syria.
 
ahsan17 said:
Wait, so being skeptical of the establishment is only relevant as long as they change their views on India. Got it. So if one were to be consistent, then how would you describe Indians on this topic?
Click to expand...

why Should Pakistanis change their views on India? it does nt matter if we hate our establiahment or Army because they steal our electons and Imprison our popular leaders like Imran

Here is a country that continues of threaten our existence and showed young Generation of Pak that India can attack our Civillians and Mosques in May , But hey we are supppsed to love them otherwise we are delusional to back our army against such aggression. we are supposed to welcome them like Modi was expecting but he got surprised that Pak responded back.
 
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cricketjoshila said:
How many s400 have America managed to hit that paf wil obliterate entire s400 battery of India?



Fyi india also operates israeli ad like barak 8 that’s enough to obliterate pAf
Click to expand...
Brother please. How long have I been on here and been wrong about these things? I told you a few years ago that your Su30 had massive problems. I was proven right. Im telling you now, the IAF is a force that cannot , at this current moment in time, fight a modern war. End of. Your systems are riddled with corruption and incompetence. Why would an indian pilot waste his time in these useless crony riddled organisations when he can go and become a commercial.pilot and earn much much more...plus see the world and have fun?? Why?

You cant even buy anything adequate anymore..The Raphael has been a complete dude. You wasted billions on it and it failed in its primary role. The russian aircraft you have are out of date. We are about to get stealth aircraft what yu think is gonna happen..? Your only hope is your missile force...
 
Wasim Ghulam said:
l


why Should Pakistanis change their views on India? it does nt matter if we hate our establiahment or Army because they steal our electons and Imprison our popular leaders like Imran

Here is a country that continues of threaten our existence and showed young Generation of Pak that India can attack our Civillians and Mosques in May , But hey we are supppsed to love them otherwise we are delusional to back our army against such aggression. we are supposed to welcome them like Modi was expecting but he got surprised that Pak responded back.
Click to expand...
Yeah, that post made no sense. By his own logic then, Indians are brainwashed as hell. But I am sure there's justification for not liking Pakistan, but no justification for not liking India.
 
Wasim Ghulam said:
why Should Pakistanis change their views on India? it does nt matter if we hate our establiahment or Army because they steal our electons and Imprison our popular leaders like Imran

Here is a country that continues of threaten our existence and showed young Generation of Pak that India can attack our Civillians and Mosques in May , But hey we are supppsed to love them otherwise we are delusional to back our army against such aggression. we are supposed to welcome them like Modi was expecting but he got surprised that Pak responded back.
Click to expand...


India's plan will never be to threaten Pakistan's existence, they need Pakistan more than Pakistanis do.

Their plan is to keep bleeding Pakistan financially and low level ongoing war is a good way to do it. Unfortunately that also fits the Pakistan military agenda, it justifies large budgets being set aside for military hardware and army personnel importance.
 
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Cpt. Rishwat said:
India's plan will never be to threaten Pakistan's existence, they need Pakistan more than Pakistanis do.

Their plan is to keep bleeding Pakistan financially and low level ongoing war is a good way to do it. Unfortunately that also fits the Pakistan military agenda, it justifies large budgets being set aside for military hardware and army personnel importance.
Click to expand...
Pakistanis will always back army against Indian aggression or any attempted aggression despite having corrupt Generals. Unfortunately we have a bad neigbour and it provides fuel to those corrupt
 
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