Will the next 5-10 years be a golden period for Pakistan cricket?

[idrizzy]

After winning the CT, it seems like the sky is the limit for this side with comprehensive victories over SA (debatable), England and India. However, cricket can be a funny game and we've seen despite WC wins or CT wins, sides do go into a bit of a downfall - with Australia and New Zealand being the recent culprits from being in the WC15 finals, to being knocked out of the group stages in the CT (although it was unfortunate). But none of these two teams looked completely threatening.

In ODIs and T20s I'm slightly optimistic for our future, and hope we can reach at least the SF of WC19. For Tests - well it's hard to say as we haven't played post Misbah-Younis.

It's weird because this time last year our Test record was sublime, yet our LOIs was in disarray. How times have changed.

What are your thoughts?

 

[MenInG]

Looking at the current talent, it has to be!

 

[Sarwar89]

Pakistan needs to win Test Series in South Africa or Australia alongwith winning either 2019 wc or 2020 t20 wc.

 

[zyrus]

Whats next? We'll be superpowers of earth?

A single tourney win in suitable conditions against out of sorts opponent doesnt make you a great team. Go and beat Aus in Aus if you're good enough.

 

[indianpanacea]

I don't think so.. Opening is unsettled.. There was s no hard hitter down the order. And fielding is pathetic... Only bowling looks settled without wahab

 

[idrizzy]

Whats next? We'll be superpowers of earth?

A single tourney win in suitable conditions against out of sorts opponent doesnt make you a great team. Go and beat Aus in Aus if you're good enough.

So beating 'out of sorts' favourites England isn't impressive? Nor beating the 'out of sorts' "best ODI side" India isn't good enough?

Beating Aus in Aus/beating SA in SA is really the only criteria which makes you a great side? Is that really the case?

 

[Rayyman]

Why not 25-30 years? Why not forever?

 

[Square Drive]

Of course.

I've been saying it.

Just took you all a little longer to realize, but that's okay; better late than never.

 

[Sarwar89]

Beating Australia in Australia is not a huge feat at all, Proteas have won 3 straight Test Series in Australia 2008,2012 and 2016. However failures in ICC tournaments have really unsettled ABD and many more senior players in their dressing room.

 

[sali]

People need to wake up and not take this ODI success as a new world beaters.
Amir has not shows the same caliber in 2016-17 AUS-NZ-ENG series as he did in 2010. He needs to take wkts.
At test level, Pakistan is going to be a very weak team. Batting and penetrative bowling are both going to be an issue.
If Sharjeel returns then Pak could have a strong T20 team. ODI team is good but still need more consistency and a strong batting specialist to replace Shoib Malik. This guy has been getting out on scoops for last 12 years and still managed to do it in the final.

 

[idrizzy]

Of course.

I've been saying it.

Just took you all a little longer to realize, but that's okay; better late than never.

Didn't wanna jinx it

 

[idrizzy]

Beating Australia in Australia is not a huge feat at all, Proteas have won 3 straight Test Series in Australia 2008,2012 and 2016. However failures in ICC tournaments have really unsettled ABD and many more senior players in their dressing room.

Beating Aus in Aus or winning a trophy?

I know which ABDV and I would choose

 

[SarfiBabarHaris]

Yes as long as Sarfraz is the captain.
I am a strong believer of: A good captain can make even a mediocre side world class.

I am keenly observing the next potential captain of Pakistan but haven't found anyone close to the level of Sarfraz yet. Still lot of time. Maybe someone will emerge under Sarfi's captaincy. Hope so!

 

[zarar]

Things are always going to get worse before they get better.

We've gone through the worst and darkest phase in Pakistan cricket history where controversy after controversy was normal. Still had some fair share of success along the way after 2010. Semi finals of the 2011 World Cup, Whitewashing at the time No.1 test side in England, Winning the Asia cup in 2012, Defeating India 2-1 in the ODI Series in 2012/2013, Being the first Asian team to win an ODI series in South Africa, Finally defeating Australia in a test series after being butchered by them since I was born, Ranked No.1 in test cricket despite a short time.

I'm not saying it'll be a golden generation but hopefully it can be as most of the demons of the past have been buried and the young players are the shining light on what we hope for is a path of success. Not only the players but the PCB and the rest of the administration of our cricket have to ensure that.

 

[gani999]

The bowling is already quite a formidable outfit with Amir, Junaid, Hasan, Shadab.

As far as batting is concerned, if Fakhar and Babar come good with Azhar and Sarfraz to back them, then Pakistan would be my favourites for WC 2019.

 

[Pakistani_Legend]

Well, given our recent mediocrity, I am certainly much more excited with this batch.

 

[QalandarFan]

We are not going into the 2019 WC as pushovers this time we are going to head in as favourites!

 

[Hasan123]

We are definitely in for exciting times. Inshallah we ditch the deadwood in all formats and go with some of the younger players.

Give Arthur a team with an average age of 27 and under and I'm sure we'll have a special era. Mark this post.

 

[Syed1]

Maybe not for 5-10 years because that is a long time and several players come and go, but for the next 2 years we will be very competitive and may rapidly rise through the rankings. However, this period is coincided with a period of very low cricketing activity

 

[Poutine]

Whats next? We'll be superpowers of earth?

A single tourney win in suitable conditions against out of sorts opponent doesnt make you a great team. Go and beat Aus in Aus if you're good enough.

So top teams like SA, England and India were all out of sorts?

 

[zyrus]

So beating 'out of sorts' favourites England isn't impressive? Nor beating the 'out of sorts' "best ODI side" India isn't good enough?

Beating Aus in Aus/beating SA in SA is really the only criteria which makes you a great side? Is that really the case?

Yes, it does. India has done that with their ATG players, we can only dream of such stuff (and ODI WC too )

So top teams like SA, England and India were all out of sorts?

Yes! Except for England (where we were saved by track), all of them had bundle of problems to handle while we were at our best.

 

[Arham_PakFan]

Hopefully,but you can't say anything.

 

[Billy1999]

Yes it will be,And should be,try and win the World Cup then I swear I don't care if you loose to PNG

 

[PakLFC]

It can be if we can produce two top quality batsmen and a few fast bowlers. The answer as we currently don't have them is no.

 

[todfod 11]

So beating 'out of sorts' favourites England isn't impressive? Nor beating the 'out of sorts' "best ODI side" India isn't good enough?

Beating Aus in Aus/beating SA in SA is really the only criteria which makes you a great side? Is that really the case?

its funny man.. tell Aus or SA to beat pak in the desert fort. world tourneys are real measure and not bilaterals. For your thread at the moment i can see Pakistan doing well for couple years cant say 5 years or 10 years

 

[todfod 11]

It can be if we can produce two top quality batsmen and a few fast bowlers. The answer as we currently don't have them is no.

Name one out and out fast bowler please. except for starc I cant see any. Amir is one of the best and hassan and junaid compliments him well. batting needs a fix though

 

[ads101]

I don't know but it's clear that the ODI team is on the up. Too much talent coming through, Fakhar, Sharjeel (if he comes back), Babar, Haris, Sarfraz, Junaid, Hasan, Amir, Raees, shadab. There's even some outliers who could come good like umar akmal. That's a lot of talent which has already experienced some international success, all of them won't fail. At least on talent alone, that's a lot more than we've had for decades. Doesn't mean we'll dominate, but our ODI fortunes as a whole should improve.

Tests not sure, we've lost middle order players like Misbah and YK and a lot of talent seems more suited for LOI.

 

[PakLFC]

Name one out and out fast bowler please. except for starc I cant see any. Amir is one of the best and hassan and junaid compliments him well. batting needs a fix though

We should not be concerned what other teams are producing when we have a rich history of producing great fast bowlers. To be a truly world class outfit we need one or better still two great ones.

 

[Surf]

Whats next? We'll be superpowers of earth?

A single tourney win in suitable conditions against out of sorts opponent doesnt make you a great team. Go and beat Aus in Aus if you're good enough.

England and South Africa both played in these conditions coming into the Champions Trophy and their home conditions are known to be helpful for the pacers so by your logic Pakistan should have lost against them. And they have a far better system and selectors than Pak. Pakistan restricted every team they faced under 300. So this wasn't any fluke we dominated every team in the knockout stages including the reigning champions.

India had 3 batsmen in the top 5 run scorers this CT as they did in the previous edition so no excuses that India was weak this time around. "Or were out of sorts"

How is it when we win we have suitable conditions so when India wins they win it out of sheer brilliance and can't be questioned but when Pakistan wins its always out of luck or the opposition wasn't at their best. Guess you're still at the first stage of grief.
You sound very bitter.

So India winning by just 5 runs in the 2013 Champions Trophy final as opposed to Pakistan winning the final by 180 runs within 30 over is a more humiliating win?

 

[todfod 11]

We should not be concerned what other teams are producing when we have a rich history of producing great fast bowlers. To be a truly world class outfit we need one or better still two great ones.

Mohammed Sami still clocks 150kph. You want him back??

 

[Abdullah]

Until surf remains captain. Just hoping Mickley can Polish fahim. Everything else is covered

 

[PakLFC]

Mohammed Sami still clocks 150kph. You want him back??

We are talking about the future not the past. Sheer pace puts fear in the hearts of batsmen like nothing else. We don't have that at the moment.

 

[idrizzy]

its funny man.. tell Aus or SA to beat pak in the desert fort. world tourneys are real measure and not bilaterals. For your thread at the moment i can see Pakistan doing well for couple years cant say 5 years or 10 years

When we win bilaterals and lose in tournaments, "wow Pak are so bad and can only win in bilaterals"

When we win tournaments and lose bilaterals, "wow Pak are so bad they can only win tournaments"

I know which of the two I'd prefer. Hint: option 2.

Some people can't have a coherent view about Pakistan cricket. Not only do tournaments test you mentally, but physically too. It shows which teams are ready to be champions and which teams are afraid. Wheras bilaterals are relatively pressure-free. Dunno how some people can coin the CT2017 win as a fluke since we beat some formidable sides to get there.

 

[Syed1]

When we win bilaterals and lose in tournaments, "wow Pak are so bad and can only win in bilaterals"

When we win tournaments and lose bilaterals, "wow Pak are so bad they can only win tournaments"

I know which of the two I'd prefer. Hint: option 2.

Some people can't have a coherent view about Pakistan cricket. Not only do tournaments test you mentally, but physically too. It shows which teams are ready to be champions and which teams are afraid. Wheras bilaterals are relatively pressure-free. Dunno how some people can coin the CT2017 win as a fluke since we beat some formidable sides to get there.

The only people calling the tournament win a fluke are PP arm chair experts who think their opinion is more important than it really this. Such people should be ignored and their attention-seeking ways shunned.

 

[Buffet]

It was a very good performance to win CT. Downplaying is not warranted.

Having said that golden period would mean being among the top 3 teams in both formats for couple of years. Not sure if Pakistan has it to do that.

 

[shariqnoor]

A golden period would constitute winning at least 1 ICC tournament and winning Test and one-day series at will against most nations. I'm not confident on that happening.

Also I'm not sure UAE will be our fortress anymore. Our batting won us series after series in the UAE and with Younis and Misbah gone, we will struggle initially to bat teams out of the game there. I wouldn't bet against a series loss soon in the UAE. So no I don't think we'd have a golden period.

 

[The_Odd_One]

Let's wait and see if Pakistan can keep this level of performance for the next 12-18 months.

 

[The Googly]

Some pak people have called the ct win a fluke!!

I think these people need to examine themselves. I will try and guide them if it helps.

- Attention seeking trait. A common with people who like to draw attention to themselves by making ridiculous comments.

 

[Mamoon]

No, take it as it comes. It just so happened that we won the Champions Trophy, but it obviously does not whitewash the problems in our cricket. I would consider it a random high like the WT20 2009 rather than the start of something extraordinary.

 

[The Googly]

No, take it as it comes. It just so happened that we won the Champions Trophy, but it obviously does not whitewash the problems in our cricket. I would consider it a random high like the WT20 2009 rather than the start of something extraordinary.

Lol!!
Yaar - khuda ke wastay - maaf kaar

Koi positive sauch wee kar!

Jeet jeet heh. Random win?? Lol

 

[New Yorker]

Dont mind if we fall back to 8th place in the rankings if we also win the WC.

 

[MMHS]

I can relate something from past like this - in 1999 WC, AUS lost to PAK & NZ; the way that WC was designed, after the loss to Kiwis, AUS's were left with a proposition to win, at least avoid defeat in next 7 matches against Scotland, WI, IND, ZIM, SAF, Semi Final, Final to win the title - and they actually did that. That was the start of what was going to be a decade long brutal dominance everywhere by a wonderful team. In their matches against WI, IND & SAF they actually showed their determination, followed by the 2nd most one sided ICC Finals ever. This team also has shown lots of character - winning 4 virtual KO matches, all against teams ranked higher and winning the SF & Final against 2 pre-tournament favorites deserves lots of credit. Also, the apparent toughest 3 matches (SAF, ENG & IND) were won with bonus points, if it was applicable - which indicates the peak capacity of the team.

Winning a tournament needs peaking of all or most players at the right time, but raising in ranking needs a consistency of performance along the year. I think, I wrote something in this line in 2015, when we won 7 of the 9 ODIs against PAK, IND & SAF - if in any average team with 8/9 decent players & couple of world class players raise their game at same time, miracles can happen. Best example was probably SRL's WC in 1996 (& the WSC of 1996, which needed 13 Aussies to deny their title), by a team which basically had 2 world class players & a young spinner, rest just peaked together at same time - with in 2 years, they became just an average team, which was badly exposed in next WC, just 38 months later. On contrary, the WC win by AUS in 1987 was totally opposite - that was just the start of a young, but extremely talented team that went on to dominate the game for next 20 years, after that surprise WC win. In next 2 years, PAK has the chance to prove themselves in either way - but, going to AUS way requires fixing lots more things than playing skills only.

 

[Mamoon]

Lol!!
Yaar - khuda ke wastay - maaf kaar ��

Koi positive sauch wee kar!

Jeet jeet heh. Random win?? Lol

It was no different in 1992 and in 2009, and I don't expect 2017 to be any different either. Nothing changed after those two titles and I don't expect anything to change now. It is a one-off event for me and I fully expect Pakistan to remain unpredictable (in other words, inconsistent). However, if we can get into the top 3 rankings for a good period of time across both Tests and ODIs, it will definitely show that the CT triumph was the start of a new chapter in Pakistan cricket.

 

[cricketAXEpert]

Beating Australia in Australia is not a huge feat at all, Proteas have won 3 straight Test Series in Australia 2008,2012 and 2016. However failures in ICC tournaments have really unsettled ABD and many more senior players in their dressing room.

but no Asian team as ever done it. Both Pakistan and India have tied test series in Australia, Srilanka And Bangladesh Have also never won in Australia. Only England West Indies and South Africa Have won Test Series In Australia. So it is a Major Feat since only 3 test nations have ever done it.

 

[Aman]

but no Asian team as ever done it. Both Pakistan and India have tied test series in Australia, Srilanka And Bangladesh Have also never won in Australia. Only England West Indies and South Africa Have won Test Series In Australia. So it is a Major Feat since only 3 test nations have ever done it.

NZ beat a weakened Aus side 2-1 in 85/86.

 

[ExpressPacer]

You have every reason to think that Pakistan may domainate world cricket soon because of the talent they have coming through. Some world class players in Amir, Hasan and Babar. Explosive yet reliable and consistent openers in Fakhar Zaman and Sharjeel Khan. A variety of genuinely classy spinners to choose from. One of the best fast bowling units in the world. Solid talent coming through in shape of Talat and Co. The PSL offering more and more cricketers every year. A great coach and a brilliant captain. Only a bitter fool would say that Pakistan cannot dominate world cricket.

But then again, you have every reason to think otherwise - Pakistan have won tournaments in the past but have been abysmal later on. It's the unfortunate reality with Pakistan - we're extremely unpredictable. You just don't know what to expect. Some days you look world class and some days you lose Test matches to Zimbabwe.

For Pakistan to actually become the most prolific team in a few years, we can't simply rely on talent. I'm not calling the CT a fluke win but with talented cricketers, you have these type of things happening once in a blue moon but no consistency. Therefore, the team needs to work hard and there needs to be good man management. We need to realise that we need different players for different formats. We need to get rid off the some of the cancers to this team and most importantly, we need to depoliticize the system, otherwise, this Champions Trophy triumph will most certainly be looked to as a fluke win in a decade or so.

 

[Aman]

You have every reason to think that Pakistan may domainate world cricket soon because of the talent they have coming through. Some world class players in Amir, Hasan and Babar. Explosive yet reliable and consistent openers in Fakhar Zaman and Sharjeel Khan. A variety of genuinely classy spinners to choose from. One of the best fast bowling units in the world. Solid talent coming through in shape of Talat and Co. The PSL offering more and more cricketers every year. A great coach and a brilliant captain. Only a bitter fool would say that Pakistan cannot dominate world cricket.

But then again, you have every reason to think otherwise - Pakistan have won tournaments in the past but have been abysmal later on. It's the unfortunate reality with Pakistan - we're extremely unpredictable. You just don't know what to expect. Some days you look world class and some days you lose Test matches to Zimbabwe.

For Pakistan to actually become the most prolific team in a few years, we can't simply rely on talent. I'm not calling the CT a fluke win but with talented cricketers, you have these type of things happening once in a blue moon but no consistency. Therefore, the team needs to work hard and there needs to be good man management. We need to realise that we need different players for different formats. We need to get rid off the some of the cancers to this team and most importantly, we need to depoliticize the system, otherwise, this Champions Trophy triumph will most certainly be looked to as a fluke win in a decade or so.

It wasn't a fluke win, Pakistan peaked at the right time. England bottled it while India were never truly looked solid. They were more than deserving winners.

 

[ExpressPacer]

It wasn't a fluke win, Pakistan peaked at the right time. England bottled it while India were never truly looked solid. They were more than deserving winners.

I clearly mentioned that it wasn't a fluke win but it certainly will look to be a one-off lucky tournament for Pakistan a decade or so later IF sanity doesn't prevail. At the moment, Pakistanis and the Pakistan Cricket Team are over the moon (and righly so) but getting complacent will only do them wrong. The people have literally almost come to the standards of worshipping the team and I wouldn't be surprised if we lose our very next game.

 

[Aman]

I clearly mentioned that it wasn't a fluke win but it certainly will look to be a one-off lucky tournament for Pakistan a decade or so later IF sanity doesn't prevail. At the moment, Pakistanis and the Pakistan Cricket Team are over the moon (and righly so) but getting complacent will only do them wrong. The people have literally almost come to the standards of worshipping the team and I wouldn't be surprised if we lose our very next game.

I was just adding my throughts on it being considered a fluke. I do think the celebrations are getting a bit ridcolous. Feels like this tournament was a month back and Pakistan are still celebrating it. This is something you'd expect from Bangladesh, not a top side with Pakistan's rich cricketing history.

 

[Syed1]

I clearly mentioned that it wasn't a fluke win but it certainly will look to be a one-off lucky tournament for Pakistan a decade or so later IF sanity doesn't prevail. At the moment, Pakistanis and the Pakistan Cricket Team are over the moon (and righly so) but getting complacent will only do them wrong. The people have literally almost come to the standards of worshipping the team and I wouldn't be surprised if we lose our very next game.

Our last major tournament victory was in 2009 and believe it or not we won because of individual brilliance rather than team performance. The people who carried us to victory were AFRIDI (capitalized and bolded, without him we would have gone home from the group stages), Ajmal, Gul, Amir, Razzaq (final). The team also carried many passengers such as Shahzaib Hasan, Younis Khan, Fawad Alam, Misbah (yes he hardly played a part in 2009), Kamraan Akmal (hit or miss), Malik (neither here nor there).


Now compare that to the 2017 Champion's Trophy victory which was a team effort by every sense of the word. Fakhar, Amir, Hasan, Junaid, Shadab, Sarfaraz were excellent throughout the tournament. Azhar, Babar, Hafeez and Imad had huge impacts in one or two matches. The only person who had a quiet tournament was Malik.

So judging by above all the youngsters who really came to the fore in this tournament are here to stay for the next 2-3 years while Malik, Hafeez and possibly Azhar will be phased out. Obviously the team will lose matches and may even lose our next series, but no way in hell is this team going to take a knee like it was doing consistently against ENG/AUS in the ODI series.

 

[Aman]

Our last major tournament victory was in 2009 and believe it or not we won because of individual brilliance rather than team performance. The people who carried us to victory were AFRIDI (capitalized and bolded, without him we would have gone home from the group stages), Ajmal, Gul, Amir, Razzaq (final). The team also carried many passengers such as Shahzaib Hasan, Younis Khan, Fawad Alam, Misbah (yes he hardly played a part in 2009), Kamraan Akmal (hit or miss), Malik (neither here nor there).


Now compare that to the 2017 Champion's Trophy victory which was a team effort by every sense of the word. Fakhar, Amir, Hasan, Junaid, Shadab, Sarfaraz were excellent throughout the tournament. Azhar, Babar, Hafeez and Imad had huge impacts in one or two matches. The only person who had a quiet tournament was Malik.

So judging by above all the youngsters who really came to the fore in this tournament are here to stay for the next 2-3 years while Malik, Hafeez and possibly Azhar will be phased out. Obviously the team will lose matches and may even lose our next series, but no way in hell is this team going to take a knee like it was doing consistently against ENG/AUS in the ODI series.

The T20 WC is a money grab, not really an important tournament.

 

[ExpressPacer]

I was just adding my throughts on it being considered a fluke. I do think the celebrations are getting a bit ridcolous. Feels like this tournament was a month back and Pakistan are still celebrating it. This is something you'd expect from Bangladesh, not a top side with Pakistan's rich cricketing history.

Exactly. Maybe it would have been OK if we kept it a little under control but we've gone overboard but that isn't my problem, my problem is the complacency and narcissistic attitude that's going to come with it.

 

[ExpressPacer]

Our last major tournament victory was in 2009 and believe it or not we won because of individual brilliance rather than team performance. The people who carried us to victory were AFRIDI (capitalized and bolded, without him we would have gone home from the group stages), Ajmal, Gul, Amir, Razzaq (final). The team also carried many passengers such as Shahzaib Hasan, Younis Khan, Fawad Alam, Misbah (yes he hardly played a part in 2009), Kamraan Akmal (hit or miss), Malik (neither here nor there).


Now compare that to the 2017 Champion's Trophy victory which was a team effort by every sense of the word. Fakhar, Amir, Hasan, Junaid, Shadab, Sarfaraz were excellent throughout the tournament. Azhar, Babar, Hafeez and Imad had huge impacts in one or two matches. The only person who had a quiet tournament was Malik.

So judging by above all the youngsters who really came to the fore in this tournament are here to stay for the next 2-3 years while Malik, Hafeez and possibly Azhar will be phased out. Obviously the team will lose matches and may even lose our next series, but no way in hell is this team going to take a knee like it was doing consistently against ENG/AUS in the ODI series.

Possibly so. As long as the cricketers remain determined and more importantly, committed to the nation, we can even bully top clss teams like Aus/Eng/India. However the commitment levels are not there which is heartbreaking. Senior(ish) players like Amir, Azam, Imad Wasim, Hafeez have abysmal levels of fitness. Amir can become the Amir he was pre-ban if he starts maintains good fitness levels for an average person, let alone an athlete. The rest need to work on their agility and strength too.

The younger and newer bunch have been paramount in terms of commitment. You can see it in their eyes. Look at Hasan Ali. What a remarkable bowler he's become. He looked average when he first broke into the team and (unfortunately) I was quick to write him off but his hard work has made him one of the best bowlers in the world. Same goes for Shadab and Fakhar.

So like I said, we can become world beaters if we raise the commitment levels.

 

[Rayyman]

Possibly so. As long as the cricketers remain determined and more importantly, committed to the nation, we can even bully top clss teams like Aus/Eng/India. However the commitment levels are not there which is heartbreaking. Senior(ish) players like Amir, Azam, Imad Wasim, Hafeez have abysmal levels of fitness. Amir can become the Amir he was pre-ban if he starts maintains good fitness levels for an average person, let alone an athlete. The rest need to work on their agility and strength too.

The younger and newer bunch have been paramount in terms of commitment. You can see it in their eyes. Look at Hasan Ali. What a remarkable bowler he's become. He looked average when he first broke into the team and (unfortunately) I was quick to write him off but his hard work has made him one of the best bowlers in the world. Same goes for Shadab and Fakhar.

So like I said, we can become world beaters if we raise the commitment levels.

Amir is already better than pre-ban, aside from pace. Give him those green mambas from 2010 England series again and he'll do rh same thing. As we saw vs WI in Jamaica.

Agree about the fitness part though. Imad definitely needs to improve. Babar and Amir maybe.