“No truth in Andy Flower or Gary Kirsten replacing Misbah-ul-Haq" : Wasim Khan

[Babbar]

PCB has to pay more than SENA boards, even more than what SL, Ind, WI need to pay, to get the same overseas coach.

A coach may agree to get paid 400K for being coaching in WI with proximity to Jamaican beaches, bars, girls, weather and infrastructure without security risk and no extraordinary expectations. Similarly in India and SL, for a little higher security risk, provides a much better social life. But Pakistan has to pay much more for any SENA coach to take the additional (even if just perceived) security risk, probably having to leave family back, burden of sky high expectations, staying in hotels (and not the kind of luxury hotels/resorts that SL, WI or India can provide) most of the time and risk of anytime cancellation of contract.

It’s best however to groom coaches from among own people. Something India has done despite being able to pay for top foreign coach. Misbah (like Shastri) is not great but is a good step towards that goal.

 

[hoshiarpurexpress]

PCB has to pay more than SENA boards, even more than what SL, Ind, WI need to pay, to get the same overseas coach.

A coach may agree to get paid 400K for being coaching in WI with proximity to Jamaican beaches, bars, girls, weather and infrastructure without security risk and no extraordinary expectations. Similarly in India and SL, for a little higher security risk, provides a much better social life. But Pakistan has to pay much more for any SENA coach to take the additional (even if just perceived) security risk, probably having to leave family back, burden of sky high expectations, staying in hotels (and not the kind of luxury hotels/resorts that SL, WI or India can provide) most of the time and risk of anytime cancellation of contract.

It’s best however to groom coaches from among own people. Something India has done despite being able to pay for top foreign coach. Misbah (like Shastri) is not great but is a good step towards that goal.

Add to that a bunch of ex-players on Youtube abusing you and questioning your pay check day in and day out.
Really need very good salary to be paid to the coach for that. But I feel Pakistan team would also be a very exciting job to work on, especially if you start getting good results.

 

[ask_analyse_act]

Hafeez is our best T-20 batsman right now. And to be fair, Mickey's T-20 rankings our inflated, Pakistan has a habit of playing its Best 11 in all T-20 games whereas the rest of the world uses it to give chances to their bench strength and rest their main players. Our performance in the World T-20 tournaments is an accurate reflection of where we actually stand

Yes Hafeez is your best t20 batsmen alongside Babar right now, but what was he in ODIs , mind he still thinks can play in the ODI side , haven’t retired. Also he wasn’t that good in t20s back then, constantly trying to put Babar to no.4 and take his spot of no.3.

With regards to Malik, didn’t everybody know his record in England , wasn’t able to get rid of him till the CWC. MA selected the possible 11 against WI in the first match of the CWC , faced a nightmare and shifted back to Malik again till he fails , Haris played an inns of his life against SA and also the reason behind Pakistan able to beat NZL as well chasing the score which put Malik dreams of playing an ODI to bed.

 

[Hasan123]

No.

Cricket coaches do not work like football managers. No cricket coach is out of any team’s league and that is because of the very small number of Test playing countries.

Hiring a big name cricket coach is all about timing. Pakistan, like Bangladesh or Sri Lanka, can get their hands on any coach in the world provided that he is available and teams like India, Australia, England etc. are not interested at that point.

Sure you can make an exception for someone like Kirsten because of his history with India or Fleming who doesn’t seem interested in coaching in international cricket, but I am talking about the coaches that are willing to coach in international cricket.

So your telling me if an elite coach was told, you could have the Indian job or England job in a few months, or you could take the Pakistan job they wouldn't wait?

 

[Shafi]

PCB has to pay more than SENA boards, even more than what SL, Ind, WI need to pay, to get the same overseas coach.

A coach may agree to get paid 400K for being coaching in WI with proximity to Jamaican beaches, bars, girls, weather and infrastructure without security risk and no extraordinary expectations. Similarly in India and SL, for a little higher security risk, provides a much better social life. But Pakistan has to pay much more for any SENA coach to take the additional (even if just perceived) security risk, probably having to leave family back, burden of sky high expectations, staying in hotels (and not the kind of luxury hotels/resorts that SL, WI or India can provide) most of the time and risk of anytime cancellation of contract.

It’s best however to groom coaches from among own people. Something India has done despite being able to pay for top foreign coach. Misbah (like Shastri) is not great but is a good step towards that goal.

3 facts:::

1. Shastri is far better coach than Misbah who is not only lack of skill but also select players he likes
2. Pakistan cricket board is one of the poor board along with corrupt officials. No way we can even match Sena Boards' pay let alone pay more.
3. After those fake advertisements by all talk Wasim Khan no decent foreign coaches will apply for coaching positions unlike someone is desperate.

 

[Rana]

Babar gets about $85k per year from his contract and he is the highest paid among Pakistan cricketers

Can you provide a source for this? I don’t think this is true.

 

[Giannis]

PCB has to pay more than SENA boards, even more than what SL, Ind, WI need to pay, to get the same overseas coach.

A coach may agree to get paid 400K for being coaching in WI with proximity to Jamaican beaches, bars, girls, weather and infrastructure without security risk and no extraordinary expectations. Similarly in India and SL, for a little higher security risk, provides a much better social life. But Pakistan has to pay much more for any SENA coach to take the additional (even if just perceived) security risk, probably having to leave family back, burden of sky high expectations, staying in hotels (and not the kind of luxury hotels/resorts that SL, WI or India can provide) most of the time and risk of anytime cancellation of contract.

It’s best however to groom coaches from among own people. Something India has done despite being able to pay for top foreign coach. Misbah (like Shastri) is not great but is a good step towards that goal.

Pakistan does have luxury hotels and many of them are world class, India/Sri Lanka aren't exactly Hawaii either.

 

[KingOfPakBreakfast]

There is any number of good Aussie, English and South African coaches who are ambitious and would take the job as a stepping stone.

Realistically, with proper selection Pakistan would be ranked 3 or 4 in every form of cricket. And they are currently underachieving, which means that a competent coach working with Mohammad Wasim would probably get quick results.

I’m pretty sure Mickey Arthur will be back shortly. His board will not be happy with their recent results, and he knows that Sri Lanka lack the bowlers for him to achieve results with.

I think he will leave Sri Lanka by mutual consent and be reappointed to the Pakistan job.

Respectfully, I don't think it's in Mickey Arthur's makeup to throw the towel in, regarding the SL job. Plus, if he does leave SL he basically removes the chance of being reappointed by them in the future.

It also would be a terrible look for the PCB to go back to Mickey. It amounts to tacit admission that they were wrong to remove Mickey in the first place, even though he would do better than the current incumbent.

As regards up and coming SENA coaches, you end up in the same position as Misbah, I.e. a candidate who has not experienced coaching at the highest level.

The PCB really is in a bind with this coaching situation

 

[iniqbal223]

Misbah &Waqar wee such a waste of time, money and everything that , even though they had full backing from top to bottom failed to deliver anything....Instead we just fell backwards

Waqar as a coach should be banned for good (This guy is just Bully and that is why insists on getting very young cricketers or very old bowlers from domestic in the team so that he can bully them and, when it fails , he would throw everyone under the bus)

Same philosophy adopted by his dearest friend Misbah as well

 

[iniqbal223]

Why a foreign coach should not come to Pakistan :

1) He has to clean the mess created by Misbah and Waqar (same Mickey had to do , to clean up the dirts from Waqar post 2016)
2) Players are exciting if selected right ones.. But then coach has to deal with lots of politics, inside leaks.. And if he wants to escalate; the authorities are corrupt as well
3) Paycheck might be better (only if allowed to coach PSL team, which Mickey did).. If not in PSL then its of no use.. as you can see some of the potential in PSL tournaments
4) Abuse from ex cricketers in YT channel... and the rhetorics that there are so many legends available in Pakistan, and why PCB has hired GORA...
5) Incompetent PCB administration , who might block your salaries, etc.

Only if someone is desperate and wants to revive his coaching career will try to do.. because they could highlight they have managed team to these WINS despite of known challenges from PCB, board officials, uncertainties...This gives them a great resume..

 

[iniqbal223]

Why not PCB just reduce the salaries of Misbah and Waqar and make it performance based... these 2 leeches need a lesson.. DONT Gove them salaries and DONT even release them...

 

[Slog]

IMO PCB isn’t cash stricken. They have Shaheen and Babar on $750k per annum I believe?

Which fantasy world are Babar and Shaheen earning this from their PCB contracts

 

[Oxfordchamp]

Can you provide a source for this? I don’t think this is true.

Lots of sources...there were threads discussing central contracts given out by pcb

 

[cricketjoshila]

What is this fake advertisement posters are talking about?

 

[Thunderbolt14]

What is this fake advertisement posters are talking about?

Misbah’s selection process, where they put out an ad for the coach position but Misbah was probably always going to be picked.

Personally I don’t think it’s that big of a deal. In general corporate hiring practice, you always have candidates in mind for any job available and you put out an ad to see if there’s a bigger fish who takes the bite.

They didn’t find anyone compelling enough so they went with Misbah.

I disagree with them on that last point though, because there was a compelling option in Dean Jones. However, there was a strong narrative at that time against foreigners being hired for the position (due to Mickey), so really the PCB were looking for a domestic coach with qualifications.

They didn’t find anyone better than Misbah and probably I would have done the same thing in their position if there’s a genuine feeling that a “gora can’t deal with subcontinental players properly”.

I would have given Misbah the head coach position but I wouldn’t have given him the chief sector role too as that’s too much work for one person- ultimately, Misbah’s greatest failures have all come in the chief selector position for selecting Shehzad, Akmal, Irfan, Musa, etc.

As a coach, Misbah has been half bad but not as horrible compared to the selector stint. I reckon that if Misbah had only been given one role at the time, he wouldn’t be on the verge of getting sacked right now.

You have to remember that Mickey had a lot of fights with players in England during the World Cup and was being heavily criticized by the media and fans alike. This caused a huge narrative against foreigners being involved.

A lot of people thought Misbah might not be a bad decision and were willing to give him a shot - even now, there really aren’t many domestic coaches who are markedly better than him. The only real options are Mohammad Akram and Rashid Latif, I guess.

So at the time of appointment, PCB were well within their rights to put out an advertisement with Misbah already in mind - that’s what corporations do and it’s not their fault they couldn’t find a better domestic coach.

The other issue is Misbah’s own ethics of sacking Mickey then applying to the position himself, though even this I feel is blown out of proportion since the cricket committee really only had a minimal say in the sacking compared to Ehsan Mani, Wasim Khan, and Imran Khan himself.

As a result I feel that the only real mistake was to give both selector and coach roles to one person when it should have been blatantly obvious that selection alone is a full time job.

 

[Junaids]

What is this fake advertisement posters are talking about?

The advert was clearly written for Misbah.

Any other senior coaching advert requires senior coaching experience.

This advert required “significant experience as a coach, or other comparable experience”.

Which was used as an excuse to substitute Misbah’s captaincy experience for coaching experience.

On this argument you could make Wayne Rooney the England football coach tomorrow. Whereas in reality him getting the Derby County job last week was arguably premature. And they are the Number 37 domestic club team currently.

 

[iniqbal223]

Misbah is undisputed KING of excuses

Is still remember in 2016 Australia series, Misbah saying if 1999 touring team could not win any match in Australia so people can not expect us to win here -- Such a Defeatist mentality

And I am pretty sure, no Indian team, coach or player has ever said, look if team with Sachin, David, Laxman, etc. could not win test series, some can't win also..

 

[ishtiaq_ctg]

Misbah is undisputed KING of excuses

Is still remember in 2016 Australia series, Misbah saying if 1999 touring team could not win any match in Australia so people can not expect us to win here -- Such a Defeatist mentality

And I am pretty sure, no Indian team, coach or player has ever said, look if team with Sachin, David, Laxman, etc. could not win test series, some can't win also..

Misbah spoke the truth in 2016. Pakistan had no right to win a test in 2016 where the supposed goat Pakistani team of 99 were whitewashed. Misbah I would argue punched above his weight with that not so great team. But coaching is different from being a captain. He cant contribute in the field and there's no Younis Khan to save the day. In limited overs cricket, Pakistan is awful for so many years that Im not sure any coach can reverse that trend in short amount of time. Pakistan should accept their mediocrity and implement long term plans to get out of this situation. Constant changes in hope of immediate gains wont help Pakistan cricket in any way.

 

[observer1]

People need to get a grip.

Misbah has had a chance and PCB will need to look at next steps should he not perform against SA. Life goes on.

Misbah failing doesn't mean Mickey should have remaines. I think he took Pakistan has far has he could.

 

[Shafi]

And people think Wasim Khan will get decent job in England? Wasim Khan cannot do those fake advertisements in England and choose nobody as national coach and get away with no accountability. SHould give him one way ticket to England to save tax payers' money.

 

[Geil]

Giving a big responsibility to any international player without having any proven record or experience of coaching or managing any administrative position in the International setup is quite dangerous specially to a team like Pakistan who have been consistently a mid ranked team

One has to appoint people who at least have some credible and proven record of their performance at the domestic level if not international level

 

[FreePalestine]

And people think Wasim Khan will get decent job in England? Wasim Khan cannot do those fake advertisements in England and choose nobody as national coach and get away with no accountability. SHould give him one way ticket to England to save tax payers' money.

He already had a decent job in England — CEO Leicestershire cricket club... first asian CEO of any major sports club in England, I believe (or at least cricket club, for sure). He was shortlisted, along with Ashley Giles, for the top job.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Misbah’s selection process, where they put out an ad for the coach position but Misbah was probably always going to be picked.

Personally I don’t think it’s that big of a deal. In general corporate hiring practice, you always have candidates in mind for any job available and you put out an ad to see if there’s a bigger fish who takes the bite.

They didn’t find anyone compelling enough so they went with Misbah.

I disagree with them on that last point though, because there was a compelling option in Dean Jones. However, there was a strong narrative at that time against foreigners being hired for the position (due to Mickey), so really the PCB were looking for a domestic coach with qualifications.

They didn’t find anyone better than Misbah and probably I would have done the same thing in their position if there’s a genuine feeling that a “gora can’t deal with subcontinental players properly”.

I would have given Misbah the head coach position but I wouldn’t have given him the chief sector role too as that’s too much work for one person- ultimately, Misbah’s greatest failures have all come in the chief selector position for selecting Shehzad, Akmal, Irfan, Musa, etc.

As a coach, Misbah has been half bad but not as horrible compared to the selector stint. I reckon that if Misbah had only been given one role at the time, he wouldn’t be on the verge of getting sacked right now.

You have to remember that Mickey had a lot of fights with players in England during the World Cup and was being heavily criticized by the media and fans alike. This caused a huge narrative against foreigners being involved.

A lot of people thought Misbah might not be a bad decision and were willing to give him a shot - even now, there really aren’t many domestic coaches who are markedly better than him. The only real options are Mohammad Akram and Rashid Latif, I guess.

So at the time of appointment, PCB were well within their rights to put out an advertisement with Misbah already in mind - that’s what corporations do and it’s not their fault they couldn’t find a better domestic coach.

The other issue is Misbah’s own ethics of sacking Mickey then applying to the position himself, though even this I feel is blown out of proportion since the cricket committee really only had a minimal say in the sacking compared to Ehsan Mani, Wasim Khan, and Imran Khan himself.

As a result I feel that the only real mistake was to give both selector and coach roles to one person when it should have been blatantly obvious that selection alone is a full time job.

Other than Misbah, who were the applicants?

 

[observer1]

And people think Wasim Khan will get decent job in England? Wasim Khan cannot do those fake advertisements in England and choose nobody as national coach and get away with no accountability. SHould give him one way ticket to England to save tax payers' money.

What part of Wasim Khan's credentials do you have an issue with?

Can you tell me any previous members of the PCB that were more qualified or experienced than him?

He chose a veteran cricketer to coach the team and after a short period of time, it's not working. PCB will naturally look elsewhere. Misbhah is not a "nobody" and brought some dignity to the team after the boat load of issues they had.

This is part and parcel for all sports teams across the world.

You're acting like he made himself coach.

 

[Shafi]

He already had a decent job in England — CEO Leicestershire cricket club... first asian CEO of any major sports club in England, I believe (or at least cricket club, for sure). He was shortlisted, along with Ashley Giles, for the top job.

England should be consider themselves lucky not to have him in top post. If he cannot see the coaching credential of Misbah Waqar and sacked Micky and Azhar then he shouldn't involve in appointing coaches.

 

[Shafi]

What part of Wasim Khan's credentials do you have an issue with?

Can you tell me any previous members of the PCB that were more qualified or experienced than him?

He chose a veteran cricketer to coach the team and after a short period of time, it's not working. PCB will naturally look elsewhere. Misbhah is not a "nobody" and brought some dignity to the team after the boat load of issues they had.

This is part and parcel for all sports teams across the world.

You're acting like he made himself coach.

Some major issue with Wasim Khan:
1. Appointed serial failure like Waqar as bowling coach and lack of experience/no skill Misbah.
2. Appointed Nadim khan
3. Fake job advertisements
4. Appointed cheat like Basit Ali
5.Appointed unqualified fielding coach......
Misbah was himself in coach finding committee and sacked a professional coach and then selected by IK/Mani/Wasim without even have any experience and meeting the job criteria.

May be @ Mamoon can give more depth in this matter.

 

[cricketjoshila]

Some major issue with Wasim Khan:
1. Appointed serial failure like Waqar as bowling coach and lack of experience/no skill Misbah.
2. Appointed Nadim khan
3. Fake job advertisements
4. Appointed cheat like Basit Ali
5.Appointed unqualified fielding coach......
Misbah was himself in coach finding committee and sacked a professional coach and then selected by IK/Mani/Wasim without even have any experience and meeting the job criteria.

May be @ Mamoon can give more depth in this matter.

Who appoints the same guy as coach and chief selector? How can a man be in a coach finding committee and then become coach?

People think if xyz held a role in a foreign organization, he is qualified.

 

[FreePalestine]

Who appoints the same guy as coach and chief selector? How can a man be in a coach finding committee and then become coach?

People think if xyz held a role in a foreign organization, he is qualified.

He was a qualified cricket administrator, as is Nadeem Khan. That is what matters.

Yeah, he made a mistake with Misbah and Waqar, but has done many, many, many good things. Lots of the negative things listed above are actually quite superficial. I don’t want to bother going through the whole list of things that they have achieved, because most people are already aware of them.

The biggest test now is grassroots and city cricket tbh. Can they deliver this year or not? That is the big question, if you guys are really interested.

 

[Kroll]

At this point in time, I'd take anybody over Misbah-ul-Haq who's been destroying our cricket team since 2010 then came back to humiliate us even further.

Throw out the useless Waqar Younis while we're at it.

 

[Saj]

Some major issue with Wasim Khan:
1. Appointed serial failure like Waqar as bowling coach and lack of experience/no skill Misbah.
2. Appointed Nadim khan
3. Fake job advertisements
4. Appointed cheat like Basit Ali
5.Appointed unqualified fielding coach......
Misbah was himself in coach finding committee and sacked a professional coach and then selected by IK/Mani/Wasim without even have any experience and meeting the job criteria.

May be @ Mamoon can give more depth in this matter.

Some of the appointments have been questionable yes - Basit Ali, Atiq uz Zaman, Misbah. Some are also not happy about Saqlain Mushtaq and I know that Nadeem Khan's appointment has raised eyebrows too.

Several given roles with no qualifications and very little expereince.

Just to confirm that whilst Wasim Khan gave Saqlain Mushtaq his job, the NHPC coaches have been picked by Saqlain.

 

[Savak]

Some of the appointments have been questionable yes - Basit Ali, Atiq uz Zaman, Misbah. Some are also not happy about Saqlain Mushtaq and I know that Nadeem Khan's appointment has raised eyebrows too.

Several given roles with no qualifications and very little expereince.

Just to confirm that whilst Wasim Khan gave Saqlain Mushtaq his job, the NHPC coaches have been picked by Saqlain.

Basit Ali was perhaps appointed to shut him up as he was being very vocal against the PM and PCB's decision to abolish Department Cricket

Atiq uz Zaman has apparently obtained a Masters in Sports Coaching and has a top coaching qualification and coaching experience in the UK, therefore he was always going to be a top candidate vs the outdated unqualified local coaches who have had nothing to show for themselves for a long time in Pakistani Cricket circles.

Nadeem Khan got the job because of his experience of heading the UBL sports department

 

[Thunderbolt14]

Other than Misbah, who were the applicants?

Mohsin Khan
Dean Jones
Waqar Younis
Misbah ul Haq

Take your pick. I would obviously have gone with Deano, but like I said, keep in mind that there was a strong narrative at the time that we should go with a Pakistani because “Mickey as a foreigner isn’t able to communicate properly with the players”.

From the local options, I hate to say it but I would have gone with Misbah too.

 

[Yk313]

So what’s the prevalent opinion on this?

Has anyone (Akhtar or journalists) given a rebuttal to Wasim Khan’s statement reaffirming Flower’s signing or should we expect more daleri videos for the near future?

 

[Saj]

Basit Ali was perhaps appointed to shut him up as he was being very vocal against the PM and PCB's decision to abolish Department Cricket

True and also to shut up some of his friends in the Karachi media.

Atiq uz Zaman has apparently obtained a Masters in Sports Coaching and has a top coaching qualification and coaching experience in the UK, therefore he was always going to be a top candidate vs the outdated unqualified local coaches who have had nothing to show for themselves for a long time in Pakistani Cricket circles.

Well a few people have said to me that he has inflated his qualifications and experience. His coaching experience in the UK according to some was minimal.

Nadeem Khan got the job because of his experience of heading the UBL sports department

He hardly took them to the heights did he.

 

[Savak]

True and also to shut up some of his friends in the Karachi media.



Well a few people have said to me that he has inflated his qualifications and experience. His coaching experience in the UK according to some was minimal.

He hardly took them to the heights did he.

Bottomline, i don't think the PCB had better candidates available.