Australia winning the Ashes will be a victory for Test cricket

[MenInG]

 

[Abdullah]

Ominous — or a big positive?

England clearly had formulated solid plans in advance for bowling to all three of these guys and getting them out.

They need to rethink RE: how they are going to get Khawaja out though!

They wil score runs at some point. They are 1,2,3 in test rankings and every team comes out with a plan.
If the wickets are going to be flat like stokes wants then England could have a problem

 

[BunnyRabbit]

The only thing that was stupid was the declaration on first day.

England usually used to ground Australia in England on slow wickets or wet swinging ones.

I won't say Root isn't doing good in the current setup. He seems to be enjoying something he definitely wasn't in his best year as a batter in 2021.

Bmac isn't as brainless or one dimensional as a lot of people are saying. He is a good student of the game. He was the captain when NZ drew against India at home after getting bowled out for 100 on the first day.

Stokes need to be a little logical with his declarations though. The team seems to be enjoying their game which was missing under Root last year.

Plus they let Foakes play at his own pace at around 48-49 SR without having to go all ballistic. I would like Crawley to be replaced by Ben Compton and Moeen Ali with Dom Bess.

The thing is Australian cricketers are just a different breed when it comes to mental strength. They are born to play cricket and they have shown it throughout their history. They don't get fussed up about anything or any opponent. The last instance of prolonged malaise shown by Australia was in the 2010-11 Ashes.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Steady has its value. Most definitely this match is not an example. England was right in the game until that 8th wicket. Fielding lapses. some tactical errors put England away. 8 out 10 times England is likely to win the match. England could have won this match completely differently like posting 500 in the first dig and letting Australia do the catch up game.

 

[adi_62941]

Suicidal declarations and slogging will not reinvent Test cricket, it doesn’t solve the fundamental problem with Test cricket, i.e. the masses don’t have the appetite and the time to watch a game of cricket for 5 days. It doesn’t matter what the scoring rate is.

Similarly, those who watch Test cricket will watch it regardless of the run rate. Test cricket will have a limited audience and there is nothing that can be done to change that. It is what it is.

Stokes instincts led him to believe that declaring on day 1 was going to help England win the match. With such horrible instincts, he should be nowhere near the captaincy role.

I wouldn’t associate the word excellence with his captaincy. Not only is he a bad tactician, he is also a terrible leader.

He played IPL with an injured knee fully aware that it could risk his participation in the Ashes and further aggravated his injury, which is exactly what happened.

He is now hobbling on one leg because he put himself above English cricket (for the fourth time since 2021) and didn’t do the right thing which was skipping the IPL to fully recover in time for the Ashes.

Calling it a suicidal declaration is completely wrong if you enjoy a contest between top teams in test matches. They must have planned according to the weather predictions. We all knew that the weather was not good on some days, and we missed a significant number of important hours due to rain and wet conditions.

The declaration on the first day was brave and in line with their current approach and strategy. There's no doubt that this English team is mediocre, except for 3-4 players.

I'm sure if baseball was applied and strategized by the Aussies, you would have celebrated their match results because it would have been strategized by the great Aussies. Come on, man! We all need excitement in test matches. We can't just keep watching 2-3 runs per over (RPO) test matches anymore. Change with the times

 

[MenInG]

Calling it a suicidal declaration is completely wrong if you enjoy a contest between top teams in test matches. They must have planned according to the weather predictions. We all knew that the weather was not good on some days, and we missed a significant number of important hours due to rain and wet conditions.

The declaration on the first day was brave and in line with their current approach and strategy. There's no doubt that this English team is mediocre, except for 3-4 players.

I'm sure if baseball was applied and strategized by the Aussies, you would have celebrated their match results because it would have been strategized by the great Aussies. Come on, man! We all need excitement in test matches. We can't just keep watching 2-3 runs per over (RPO) test matches anymore. Change with the times

I feel that the declaration was more to throw Australia into panic

Similar to strange/unorthodox field settings such as when Stokes put all those players in front of Khawaja.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Calling it a suicidal declaration is completely wrong if you enjoy a contest between top teams in test matches. They must have planned according to the weather predictions. We all knew that the weather was not good on some days, and we missed a significant number of important hours due to rain and wet conditions.

The declaration on the first day was brave and in line with their current approach and strategy. There's no doubt that this English team is mediocre, except for 3-4 players.

I'm sure if baseball was applied and strategized by the Aussies, you would have celebrated their match results because it would have been strategized by the great Aussies. Come on, man! We all need excitement in test matches. We can't just keep watching 2-3 runs per over (RPO) test matches anymore. Change with the times

It is hard to time your declaration right on day 1. Turns out Australia had a brief overcast conditions where they made early in roads in the second innings. If England had the same conditions they could have done more damage. So to be safe you try to bat out the opposition.

 

[adi_62941]

I feel that the declaration was more to throw Australia into panic

Similar to strange/unorthodox field settings such as when Stokes put all those players in front of Khawaja.

Stoke and team management are trying to think out of the box, which is really exciting to watch, especially in test matches. They pulled off some tricks against Pakistan last year. However, against top teams like Australia, the chances of success are naturally lower compared to mediocre or average teams like Pakistan.

For someone like me who has been watching and following test cricket since 2003, these are incredibly exciting times for test matches and the English side, as long as this approach is supervised.

Moreover, it was Stokes' brave decision to declare on the first day that made this test match exciting; otherwise, it would have resulted in a boring draw.

 

[James]

The declaration on the first day was brave and in line with their current approach and strategy. There's no doubt that this English team is mediocre, except for 3-4 players.

It’s a good observation. The majority of Australia’s XI is world class. Whereas the world class players in the England team are probably limited to Root, Anderson, Broad, and Bairstow (as a batsman), with Brook too new to form a judgment on currently, and Stokes seemingly on the general decline as an all-rounder. The tactics, captaincy, and unorthodox ideas from England are probably implemented with the intention to bridge that gap in quality. And at Edgbaston, it nearly worked.

 

[Mamoon]

Calling it a suicidal declaration is completely wrong if you enjoy a contest between top teams in test matches. They must have planned according to the weather predictions. We all knew that the weather was not good on some days, and we missed a significant number of important hours due to rain and wet conditions.

The declaration on the first day was brave and in line with their current approach and strategy. There's no doubt that this English team is mediocre, except for 3-4 players.

I'm sure if baseball was applied and strategized by the Aussies, you would have celebrated their match results because it would have been strategized by the great Aussies. Come on, man! We all need excitement in test matches. We can't just keep watching 2-3 runs per over (RPO) test matches anymore. Change with the times

I don’t care about Australia. They get overrated on this forum because of what their golden generation achieved. Since 2007, Australia have never had a truly great team. Every decent side should be beating Australia in home conditions.

I always prefer England to beat Australia, but I hope Australia runs away with it this time because Bazball needs a reality-check.

Stokes’ declaration was not dictated by the weather forecast but by his belief that draws are bad for Test cricket.

They are not. It is an integral part of the nature of the format and he has successfully conned a large number of fans into believing that eliminating draws would boost the popularity of Test cricket.

The declaration was suicidal because (1) England did not have enough runs on the board and (2) they gave Australia ample time to work their way back into the game.

You can declare on day 1 if you have a massive total on board. For example, England scoring 500+ on the first day against Pakistan in the first Test. But 393 is not a massive total. It does not inflict any serious scoreboard pressure on the opposition.

The psychological barrier of staring at a 500+ total in the first innings as you come onto bat is a major component of why the batting second often succumbs to scoreboard pressure.

Joe Root was playing brilliantly and Robinson was comfortable as well. Australian bowlers were showing signs of fatigue. With two wickets to go, adding another 100 runs was perhaps out of reach, but England could have easily added another 50-60 runs in 15 overs, which would have helped them to a much more imposing first innings total.

It would not have killed Test cricket or made the game any less entertaining, but it would have significantly improved England’s chances of winning the game.

In spite of the so-called looming threat of rain, the major factor behind Australia’s victory was Usman Khawaja scoring 206 across both innings at a strike rate of 39, something Stokes and McCullum think is bad for the game.

It is a myth that Bazball is rejuvenating Test cricket. It is not. The people who didn’t care about Test cricket still don’t and those who cared and would continue to care regardless of Bazball or not.

The fundamental problem for Test cricket in terms of not appealing to the masses is the duration of the format. The majority of the fans don’t have the time or the patience or the interest to watch a game of cricket for 5 days. The scoring rate and whacky declarations won’t change that.

Not a single person that I know of (that was not interested in Test cricket) has been drawn back to the format because of Bazball. It is just what England like to tell themselves to justify their unsustainable approach that will die a painful death not far from today.

 

[Mamoon]

Stoke and team management are trying to think out of the box, which is really exciting to watch, especially in test matches. They pulled off some tricks against Pakistan last year. However, against top teams like Australia, the chances of success are naturally lower compared to mediocre or average teams like Pakistan.

For someone like me who has been watching and following test cricket since 2003, these are incredibly exciting times for test matches and the English side, as long as this approach is supervised.

Moreover, it was Stokes' brave decision to declare on the first day that made this test match exciting; otherwise, it would have resulted in a boring draw.

Before you think out of the box you have to think inside the box and do the basics right.

England’s declaration was a suicidal because there was no scoreboard pressure and they gave Australia all the time in the world to work their way back into the game.

It wasn’t brave, it was stupid.

Bazball tricks without doing the basics right would fail more often than not and the only outcome would be Stokes embarrassing himself like he did at Edgbaston and then justifying his recklessness by giving sermons on how he wants to entertain and play exciting cricket.

What nonsense. You cost your team a completely winnable Test match with your stupidity and you have the nerve to talk about entertainment.

The “we sent Australia a message” statement only made things worse. The only message Stokes sent to Australia was that he is a clown and Bazball will self-destruct as long as Australia stick to the basics and play traditional Test cricket.

 

[adi_62941]

I don’t care about Australia. They get overrated on this forum because of what their golden generation achieved. Since 2007, Australia have never had a truly great team. Every decent side should be beating Australia in home conditions.

I always prefer England to beat Australia, but I hope Australia runs away with it this time because Bazball needs a reality-check.

Stokes’ declaration was not dictated by the weather forecast but by his belief that draws are bad for Test cricket.

They are not. It is an integral part of the nature of the format and he has successfully conned a large number of fans into believing that eliminating draws would boost the popularity of Test cricket.

The declaration was suicidal because (1) England did not have enough runs on the board and (2) they gave Australia ample time to work their way back into the game.

You can declare on day 1 if you have a massive total on board. For example, England scoring 500+ on the first day against Pakistan in the first Test. But 393 is not a massive total. It does not inflict any serious scoreboard pressure on the opposition.

The psychological barrier of staring at a 500+ total in the first innings as you come onto bat is a major component of why the batting second often succumbs to scoreboard pressure.

Joe Root was playing brilliantly and Robinson was comfortable as well. Australian bowlers were showing signs of fatigue. With two wickets to go, adding another 100 runs was perhaps out of reach, but England could have easily added another 50-60 runs in 15 overs, which would have helped them to a much more imposing first innings total.

It would not have killed Test cricket or made the game any less entertaining, but it would have significantly improved England’s chances of winning the game.

In spite of the so-called looming threat of rain, the major factor behind Australia’s victory was Usman Khawaja scoring 206 across both innings at a strike rate of 39, something Stokes and McCullum think is bad for the game.

It is a myth that Bazball is rejuvenating Test cricket. It is not. The people who didn’t care about Test cricket still don’t and those who cared and would continue to care regardless of Bazball or not.

The fundamental problem for Test cricket in terms of not appealing to the masses is the duration of the format. The majority of the fans don’t have the time or the patience or the interest to watch a game of cricket for 5 days. The scoring rate and whacky declarations won’t change that.

Not a single person that I know of (that was not interested in Test cricket) has been drawn back to the format because of Bazball. It is just what England like to tell themselves to justify their unsustainable approach that will die a painful death not far from today.

You are overthinking, mate, and drawing conclusions from weak sources and information.

For your information, cricket is an outdoor sport, and weather forecasts can significantly impact the course of play, leading to strategic choices regarding declarations. I don't understand why you are not considering the weather forecast as a factor in the declaration. Perhaps you were sitting with Stokes in the dressing room at that time.

In the latter part of your post, you generalize that Test matches don't appeal to the masses. However, we have seen that when there is excitement in Test matches, people do show interest and attend in large numbers. It's true that if Test matches have a scoring rate as low as 2 runs per over consistently, then interest might wane. But Test cricket has the potential to captivate spectators with thrilling moments.

Regarding the match, England was in a winning position until the last two hours when the tailenders played some daring shots, putting England under pressure

 

[adi_62941]

Before you think out of the box you have to think inside the box and do the basics right.

England’s declaration was a suicidal because there was no scoreboard pressure and they gave Australia all the time in the world to work their way back into the game.

It wasn’t brave, it was stupid.

Bazball tricks without doing the basics right would fail more often than not and the only outcome would be Stokes embarrassing himself like he did at Edgbaston and then justifying his recklessness by giving sermons on how he wants to entertain and play exciting cricket.

What nonsense. You cost your team a completely winnable Test match with your stupidity and you have the nerve to talk about entertainment.

The “we sent Australia a message” statement only made things worse. The only message Stokes sent to Australia was that he is a clown and Bazball will self-destruct as long as Australia stick to the basics and play traditional Test cricket.

I have been following the English cricket team since 2003, and they have always been a mediocre side, whether it's in tests or ODIs, except for some good patches of time in the past. However, after the 2015 World Cup debacle, they introduced young players who have now started to reap the benefits. The players who represented England in ODIs underwent a complete transformation, turning them from a mediocre side into an extremely exciting and accomplished team. This transformation also led to the development of a strong T20 combination, which won the 2022 World Cup and performed admirably in the 2021 World Cup.

Similarly, their approach and standards in baseball have begun to yield positive results, and in the future, the players in the county will likely adjust their techniques to incorporate baseball elements. This prospect is very exciting to watch. England is striving for a broader vision that other teams may not yet see

 

[Markhor]

There was nothing wrong with Root’s captaincy.

Root is a gentleman who has always been there for England. The way he was hounded out of captaincy and replaced by a selfish man who has repeatedly put himself above England was very disappointing.

This statement alone hurts the credibility of your argument. I agree the systemic issues in English cricket, which Bazball is masking, undoubtedly hamstrung Joe Root's Test captaincy. It's difficult to imagine any ENG captain winning away in IND or AUS given the dearth of quality spinners, genuine quicks and opening batsmen.

However if there was nothing wrong with Root's captaincy, he wouldn't have won 1 of his last 17 Tests. He lost 19 out of 34 Tests against the top 3 teams (IND, AUS and NZL). Most importantly for an ENG skipper - not a single Ashes series win with only 2 Test wins in 15 vs AUS. One of them was, in your famous phrase, a fluke. You may argue ENG would've lost those Tests regardless of Root's captaincy but they also shelled Tests to poor PAK and WI teams.

It also suggests you didn't watch ENG under Joe Root's captaincy because there were mistakes practically every series.

- Playing four pacers on a square turner in Ahmedabad vs IND in 2021.
- Dropping Anderson and Broad on a Brisbane greentop vs AUS in the 21/22 Ashes.
- Bowling first despite a brittle batting lineup in that same Test.
- Bowling Archer into the ground in NZL in 2019.

And many more. You will not find a single pundit here in ENG who thinks Joe Root was a good captain. A terrific human being certainly. However as Root himself said "captaincy sucked the life out of me." His captaincy also sucked the life out of the ENG Test team. Yet with an identical team bar Brook and Duckett the transformation is there for everyone to see under Stokes.

Whatever the merits and demerits of Stokes' captaincy - no amount of War and Peace style essays from yourself will change these facts.

 

[Mamoon]

You are overthinking, mate, and drawing conclusions from weak sources and information.

For your information, cricket is an outdoor sport, and weather forecasts can significantly impact the course of play, leading to strategic choices regarding declarations. I don't understand why you are not considering the weather forecast as a factor in the declaration. Perhaps you were sitting with Stokes in the dressing room at that time.

In the latter part of your post, you generalize that Test matches don't appeal to the masses. However, we have seen that when there is excitement in Test matches, people do show interest and attend in large numbers. It's true that if Test matches have a scoring rate as low as 2 runs per over consistently, then interest might wane. But Test cricket has the potential to captivate spectators with thrilling moments.

Regarding the match, England was in a winning position until the last two hours when the tailenders played some daring shots, putting England under pressure

Bazball was born in June 2022 when New Zealand toured England. Please provide some factual evidence that over the last 12 months, there has been an increase in viewership in Test cricket in England let alone globally.

From what I see, there is practically no difference, or at least nothing significant enough that can be attributed to Bazball’s impact.

England has always been a great venue for Test cricket, probably the best in the world, and there is always excellent attendance especially for the major Test series.

Bazball was born out of necessity - England is a white ball team and they have decided to pay Test cricket like white ball cricket because it gives them the best chance for success.

However, Bazball has been packaged and advertised as an attempt to save Test cricket which is a load of nonsense. It is only an attempt to save the English Test team and it is purely temporary not a long-term, sustainable way of playing Test cricket.

If there is actual evidence that it has boosted Test cricket’s popularity, I’m happy to stand corrected and retract my statement.

 

[Mamoon]

I have been following the English cricket team since 2003, and they have always been a mediocre side, whether it's in tests or ODIs, except for some good patches of time in the past. However, after the 2015 World Cup debacle, they introduced young players who have now started to reap the benefits. The players who represented England in ODIs underwent a complete transformation, turning them from a mediocre side into an extremely exciting and accomplished team. This transformation also led to the development of a strong T20 combination, which won the 2022 World Cup and performed admirably in the 2021 World Cup.

Similarly, their approach and standards in baseball have begun to yield positive results, and in the future, the players in the county will likely adjust their techniques to incorporate baseball elements. This prospect is very exciting to watch. England is striving for a broader vision that other teams may not yet see

Bazball has yielded positive results because England is a white ball team. This is not how Test cricket is meant to be played when you have proper Test players.

England is trying to tell the world that this is how Test cricket is supposed to be played but the reality is that it is only working for them because of the special circumstances that they find themselves in.

The last thing other teams should try to do is to con themselves into thinking that England have shown them the light and they need to catch up. They don’t. If you play proper, good Test cricket Bazball will self-destruct and this is what happened in the first Test.

 

[Mamoon]

This statement alone hurts the credibility of your argument. I agree the systemic issues in English cricket, which Bazball is masking, undoubtedly hamstrung Joe Root's Test captaincy. It's difficult to imagine any ENG captain winning away in IND or AUS given the dearth of quality spinners, genuine quicks and opening batsmen.

However if there was nothing wrong with Root's captaincy, he wouldn't have won 1 of his last 17 Tests. He lost 19 out of 34 Tests against the top 3 teams (IND, AUS and NZL). Most importantly for an ENG skipper - not a single Ashes series win with only 2 Test wins in 15 vs AUS. One of them was, in your famous phrase, a fluke. You may argue ENG would've lost those Tests regardless of Root's captaincy but they also shelled Tests to poor PAK and WI teams.

It also suggests you didn't watch ENG under Joe Root's captaincy because there were mistakes practically every series.

- Playing four pacers on a square turner in Ahmedabad vs IND in 2021.
- Dropping Anderson and Broad on a Brisbane greentop vs AUS in the 21/22 Ashes.
- Bowling first despite a brittle batting lineup in that same Test.
- Bowling Archer into the ground in NZL in 2019.

And many more. You will not find a single pundit here in ENG who thinks Joe Root was a good captain. A terrific human being certainly. However as Root himself said "captaincy sucked the life out of me." His captaincy also sucked the life out of the ENG Test team. Yet with an identical team bar Brook and Duckett the transformation is there for everyone to see under Stokes.

Whatever the merits and demerits of Stokes' captaincy - no amount of War and Peace style essays from yourself will change these facts.

You will also not find a single pundit who will criticize Stokes for his awful captaincy during the last half hour of the Edgbaston Test and you will not find a single pundit who will criticize him for playing in the IPL with an injured knee instead of resting for the Ashes.

Instead, he is being praised for his “courage” and “fighting spirit” where as the reality is that he is hobbling on one knee in the Ashes because he put his interests above English cricket and not for the first time.

His PR is off the charts these days. The English media is desperate to sugarcoat and glorify everything that he does these days.

Root made plenty of mistakes. Name one captain who doesn’t. However, the fundamental issue for England during his time was the lack of proper Test batsman. Root literally had no one else in the team who could play a proper Test knock with the exception of a young and undercooked Pope.

The captaincy didn’t suck the life out of Root as much as being scapegoated did. He had no intentions of resigning until the West Indies tour but he was tired of being criticized for things that were beyond his control, i.e. England lacking proper batsmen.

 

[Markhor]

You will also not find a single pundit who will criticize Stokes for his awful captaincy during the last half hour of the Edgbaston Test and you will not find a single pundit who will criticize him for playing in the IPL with an injured knee instead of resting for the Ashes.

Instead, he is being praised for his “courage” and “fighting spirit” where as the reality is that he is hobbling on one knee in the Ashes because he put his interests above English cricket and not for the first time.

His PR is off the charts these days. The English media is desperate to sugarcoat and glorify everything that he does these days.

Root made plenty of mistakes. Name one captain who doesn’t. However, the fundamental issue for England during his time was the lack of proper Test batsman. Root literally had no one else in the team who could play a proper Test knock with the exception of a young and undercooked Pope.

The captaincy didn’t suck the life out of Root as much as being scapegoated did. He had no intentions of resigning until the West Indies tour but he was tired of being criticized for things that were beyond his control, i.e. England lacking proper batsmen.

Stokes rightly built up goodwill winning 11 out of 14 Tests after his predecessor left the Test side in its worst shape since 1999 when Nasser Hussain took over. ENG were near the foot of the WTC Table playing an unwatchable brand of cricket - unless people have a thing for sado-masochism.

Now I'm personally a Test traditionalist and abhor Tests being played like ODIs, but undoubtedly Stokes' ENG is both more watchable and successful.

However the English press are notoriously brutal. Already Jonathan Agnew in a BBC column has criticised Stokes' failure to take the 2nd new ball sooner. If Stokes keeps making reckless decisions he'll face the music don't worry.

Forget Stokes for a minute and let's address the key question since you state Root was robbed of the captaincy:

Which Test captain anywhere in the world would survive winning 1 Test out of 17 ? Do you think even the Bangladesh captain could escape accountability for such a run ?

 

[adi_62941]

Bazball has yielded positive results because England is a white ball team. This is not how Test cricket is meant to be played when you have proper Test players.

England is trying to tell the world that this is how Test cricket is supposed to be played but the reality is that it is only working for them because of the special circumstances that they find themselves in.

The last thing other teams should try to do is to con themselves into thinking that England have shown them the light and they need to catch up. They don’t. If you play proper, good Test cricket Bazball will self-destruct and this is what happened in the first Test.

What do you mean by 'proper good' test cricket? 'Proper good' test cricket is not only about being conservative ('tuk tuk'), but it can also involve playing aggressively. Show me any test match manual where it is written that batsmen have to play at a 2-3 RPO only to be considered as 'good' test cricket, and that they cannot play at better strike rates.

Your reasoning to justify your conclusions is absurd

 

[James]

Batsmen have been wasting starts and throwing away their wickets in Test cricket since it was invented. It’s rare that you get a Dravid or Jayawardene type batsmen who hardly ever makes a mistake, is happy to stand there all day accumulating runs and more often than not has to be legitimately bowled out. Most wickets have always fallen due to batsman error — whether that’s poor shot selection, impatience or impulsiveness, loss of concentration, having a nibble at wide balls — etc. The current England team undoubtedly plays some poor shots, but this is nothing new really. It “looks worse” because of the hype around “Bazball” and the evidently fast scoring rate.

 

[James]

Stokes is being praised for his “courage” and “fighting spirit” where as the reality is that he is hobbling on one knee in the Ashes because he put his interests above English cricket and not for the first time.

I’m not sure IPL or no IPL would have made much of a difference tbh. He is a crock now mate. Cant bowl a 3 over spell or bat for more than 45 minutes without his knee popping out. The ECB will need to find a window for Stokes to have surgery on this dodgy patella or it will cause his retirement soon.

If there was a suitable candidate to take his place, I’m sure they would be captaining the side already. The truth is that even with his contributions being reduced from a world class all-round output to the odd half century and occasional top order wicket, Stokes is still worth a place in this team as the captain. Unofficial “specialist captains” are nothing new in the game really.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Batsmen have been wasting starts and throwing away their wickets in Test cricket since it was invented. It’s rare that you get a Dravid or Jayawardene type batsmen who hardly ever makes a mistake, is happy to stand there all day accumulating runs and more often than not has to be legitimately bowled out. Most wickets have always fallen due to batsman error — whether that’s poor shot selection, impatience or impulsiveness, loss of concentration, having a nibble at wide balls — etc. The current England team undoubtedly plays some poor shots, but this is nothing new really. It “looks worse” because of the hype around “Bazball” and the evidently fast scoring rate.

Attempt to score fast hurts their bowling more than their batting. It gives very little rest for bowlers in between innings. By the time Lyon came in to bat England was absolutely drained. Nobody had any energy. You would expect 5 or 6 searing yorkers at Lyon with a mix of short all. All we saw was harmless stuff. You can score quickly as much as you want. At the end of the day bowlers win Tests not batsmen. They should be used optimally

 

[Mamoon]

I’m not sure IPL or no IPL would have made much of a difference tbh. He is a crock now mate. Cant bowl a 3 over spell or bat for more than 45 minutes without his knee popping out. The ECB will need to find a window for Stokes to have surgery on this dodgy patella or it will cause his retirement soon.

If there was a suitable candidate to take his place, I’m sure they would be captaining the side already. The truth is that even with his contributions being reduced from a world class all-round output to the odd half century and occasional top order wicket, Stokes is still worth a place in this team as the captain. Unofficial “specialist captains” are nothing new in the game really.

If you are already a crock, it is even more important that you manage your workload with caution.

As the England Test captain, it was completely indefensible for him to participate in the IPL with a bad knee especially with an Ashes coming up.

He does not get enough criticism for what he did. The PR is very strong these days.

 

[Mamoon]

What do you mean by 'proper good' test cricket? 'Proper good' test cricket is not only about being conservative ('tuk tuk'), but it can also involve playing aggressively. Show me any test match manual where it is written that batsmen have to play at a 2-3 RPO only to be considered as 'good' test cricket, and that they cannot play at better strike rates.

Your reasoning to justify your conclusions is absurd

Proper good Test cricket is the opposite of asking your premier batsman Joe Root to reverse scoop fast bowlers in the first over of the day and charge down the track to spinners for no good reason.

It is also the opposite of forcing your best batting talent since Joe Root (Harry Brook) to become a slogger when he has the potential to be so much more.

Bazball will be history soon, but proper Test cricket, the type of cricket Usman Khawaja played will never be out of fashion.

 

[Markhor]

Stokes rightly built up goodwill winning 11 out of 14 Tests after his predecessor left the Test side in its worst shape since 1999 when Nasser Hussain took over. ENG were near the foot of the WTC Table playing an unwatchable brand of cricket - unless people have a thing for sado-masochism.

Now I'm personally a Test traditionalist and abhor Tests being played like ODIs, but undoubtedly Stokes' ENG is both more watchable and successful.

However the English press are notoriously brutal. Already Jonathan Agnew in a BBC column has criticised Stokes' failure to take the 2nd new ball sooner. If Stokes keeps making reckless decisions he'll face the music don't worry.

Forget Stokes for a minute and let's address the key question since you state Root was robbed of the captaincy:

Which Test captain anywhere in the world would survive winning 1 Test out of 17 ? Do you think even the Bangladesh captain could escape accountability for such a run ?

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] any answers ? Does anyone here believe you'd be as charitable towards a Pakistani Test captain overseeing 1 win in 17 Tests ?

 

[jnaveen1980]

Let us wait for the series to be over.

 

[ssuhaide]

This Ashes has a sneaky 0-5 feel about it with the reckless abandon that England are adopting. This over attacking approach papers over the cracks of the England line up. Root is world class but the bowling is on its last legs and that's a huge issue. Bazball will be dead if England lose 0-5 at home the press will murder them.

 

[Mamoon]

This Ashes has a sneaky 0-5 feel about it with the reckless abandon that England are adopting. This over attacking approach papers over the cracks of the England line up. Root is world class but the bowling is on its last legs and that's a huge issue. Bazball will be dead if England lose 0-5 at home the press will murder them.

This Bazball drama will end in tears and Australia thrashing them will only speed up the process.

This is why this whole shtick of reviving Test cricket and teaching others how to play the format should have been kept at bay.

All these statements will look stupid when England themselves quit this Bazball nonsense not far from today.

 

[Mamoon]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] any answers ? Does anyone here believe you'd be as charitable towards a Pakistani Test captain overseeing 1 win in 17 Tests ?

Don’t ask questions when you have already decided what my answer would be. Next please.

 

[Markhor]

This whole Bazball stuff started 12 months ago and there is not a shred of evidence that it has boosted viewership

Think this is more than a shred:

https://www.sportspromedia.com/news...-sports-viewing-figures/?zephr_sso_ott=jJLvSB

England’s nail-biting defeat by Australia attracted the highest-ever viewing figures for a Test match on Sky Sports.

Ben Stokes’ side have made it clear they are determined to provide box office entertainment this summer and their efforts have clearly struck a chord with the British public, despite coming out on the wrong end of a tense final session in the first Test at Edgbaston.

The UK pay-TV broadcaster drew an unprecedented peak of 2.12 million on the fifth day with an average viewership of 1.17 million. The average sat at 877,000 over the full match, breaking a 14-year-old record of 717,000 set during an Oval Test against Australia in 2009.

Another 1.8 million views came via streaming, with strong showings across Sky’s app, website and social channels reflecting interest around the much-hyped cricket series.

The BBC also hailed ‘record breaking digital demand’ for its flagship Test Match Special radio coverage. The corporation said numbers for hours listened were ‘unprecedented’, with just under six million requests across BBC Sounds and BBC Sport.

Tony Singh, chief commercial officer at the England and Wales Cricket Board, said: “This first men’s Test kept us all on the edge of our seats and showed the thrills of Test cricket at its best.

“It’s great to see the excitement it’s generated across the country, whether it was the sell-out crowds inside Edgbaston or the millions watching on TV, online or listening.”

Don’t ask questions when you have already decided what my answer would be. Next please.

I don't know what your answer is - please tell us which captain in the world would survive 1 Test win in 17 ? The floor is yours.

 

[James]

Think this is more than a shred:

https://www.sportspromedia.com/news...-sports-viewing-figures/?zephr_sso_ott=jJLvSB.

Thanks for this.

I got the feeling that Test cricket in England was “back” during the recent Ireland match. Even taking the minnow status of the opposition into account, Lord’s across the three days was absolutely buzzing and very nearly full. Compare this to the first New Zealand match a year ago, also at Lord’s, where against an established Test team there was a desperate and embarrassing struggle to sell tickets even for the opening couple of days, to the point where the MCC had to take the very rare step (for them) of reducing their prices.

 

[MenInG]

Salman Butt on this topic:

“You have to adapt according to the situation. There are no guarantees that all of your batters will score in every match just because you have batting depth. If you're set, you have to score big. You can't rely on others to make up for the failure. Everyone is aggressive in this England team, some are even overly-aggressive. A batsman is playing on 130, he's set, you have 10-odd overs, you're on 393, have a chance to add 50-60 runs more, so why did you declare?”

“It didn't make sense. You have a five-day Test. They thought they will dismiss Australia early. I think they underestimated the opponents, it was an arrogant declaration. Australia aren't walkovers. In Pakistan, our bowlers were inexperienced. Even if it was our best bowling, even they didn't have that much of experience in Tests. We had three debutants in bowling attack, our emphasis had been on shorter formats. On the other hand, Australia are Test champions, they prefer Test cricket. They are ready to leave IPL for Tests. You can't take that team lightly,”

 

[Mesozoic]

Bazball has most definitely rejuvenated interest in cricket among the casuals in UK. British media and the general public love gimmicks (?) like this.

But once it gets old or if England loses a few series' playing this style....that is where the real challenge starts.

 

[JattMaula]

A home ashes defeat will test Bazball like nothing else. It will go from honeymoon to divorse real quick.

I don't like the preaching attitude adopted by English team. But I support the the style of play they have adopted. Playing without fear of failure is the right call.

 

[jnaveen1980]

This Bazball drama will end in tears and Australia thrashing them will only speed up the process.

This is why this whole shtick of reviving Test cricket and teaching others how to play the format should have been kept at bay.

All these statements will look stupid when England themselves quit this Bazball nonsense not far from today.

Even if they win , they will be forcecd to quit. You cannot find bowlers to sustain this model. You may find batsmen. But bowling is a thankless job as it is. Bowling in bazball approach where you get limited break in between innings it is even more thankless. They will need helpful pitches which will impact their batting. For England it works. For others it won't work. Selective people were already bazballing before even England started this. Rishab Pant for example already saved a test in Australia with that approach and won the next Test.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

A lot of big talk from the English camp

Ollie - 'Australia cannot go toe to toe with us'

Zak Crawley - 'We will win next next test probably by 150 runs'

Root- 'We will go even harder'

Hardly any talk from the OZ players.

 

[MenInG]

Look the fact is BazBall or not, the result was this mad crazy close game.

So whilst you can say that BazBall did not succeed, it did come close to defeating Australia.

 

[Kroll]

Meh, a victory for Oz wouldn't be a victory for Test cricket, it would be a victory for Oz and Oz alone. I hope the English smack these arrogant and contemptuous Ozzies into oblivion with Bazball.

 

[muqarrab]

Suicidal declarations and slogging will not reinvent Test cricket, it doesn’t solve the fundamental problem with Test cricket, i.e. the masses don’t have the appetite and the time to watch a game of cricket for 5 days. It doesn’t matter what the scoring rate is.

Similarly, those who watch Test cricket will watch it regardless of the run rate. Test cricket will have a limited audience and there is nothing that can be done to change that. It is what it is.

Stokes instincts led him to believe that declaring on day 1 was going to help England win the match. With such horrible instincts, he should be nowhere near the captaincy role.

I wouldn’t associate the word excellence with his captaincy. Not only is he a bad tactician, he is also a terrible leader.

He played IPL with an injured knee fully aware that it could risk his participation in the Ashes and further aggravated his injury, which is exactly what happened.

He is now hobbling on one leg because he put himself above English cricket (for the fourth time since 2021) and didn’t do the right thing which was skipping the IPL to fully recover in time for the Ashes.

They already reinvented test cricket, you are late.

 

[Colorblind Genius]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] you might have clocked on.

England appointed Stokes as captain to keep him interested and not retiring from this format too. (It wasn’t to save Test cricket)

On top of that, Stokes by nature is an extremely impatient person/cricketer. What you are basically seeing in England’s style of cricket is Stoke’s own impatient nature,

The guy is so bored of life it seems that he will just make decisions impulsively. At some point, it will start to hurt England

Not sure.
According to Jimmy Anderson, Stokes is THE BEST captain he had in 20 years.
And why all of a sudden, we shifted all the focus from “BazBall” to Stokes when coming with critique on English Testvcricket?

 

[James]

A lot of big talk from the English camp

Ollie - 'Australia cannot go toe to toe with us'

Zak Crawley - 'We will win next next test probably by 150 runs'

Root- 'We will go even harder'

Hardly any talk from the OZ players.

Because they truly believe in what they are doing. And if England go to Lord’s and lose again, they’ll still fancy themselves to win the series 3-2. It’s really quite impressive what Stokes and McCullum have done here — they have basically brainwashed the England squad in the space of one year.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Because they truly believe in what they are doing. And if England go to Lord’s and lose again, they’ll still fancy themselves to win the series 3-2. It’s really quite impressive what Stokes and McCullum have done here — they have basically brainwashed the England squad in the space of one year.

They should let their cricket do the talking. It's all well and good having self belief and confidence but England's media statements and player antics are starting to becoming annoying.

I say this as a fan of the current approach. It's enjoyable, but leave the preaching and false bravado please. There is a time and a place for it, acting this way after an embarassing and self inflicted defeat shows a complete lack of humility.

 

[James]

They should let their cricket do the talking. It's all well and good having self belief and confidence but England's media statements and player antics are starting to becoming annoying.

I say this as a fan of the current approach. It's enjoyable, but leave the preaching and false bravado please. There is a time and a place for it, acting this way after an embarassing and self inflicted defeat shows a complete lack of humility.

I don’t think it was a particularly embarrassing defeat, it was just a close game that had a winner right at the end. England can still come back in the series and this will all be completely forgotten, as the 1st Test was in 2005. Losing the series, now that would be considerably more embarrassing.

 

[Kroll]

They should let their cricket do the talking. It's all well and good having self belief and confidence but England's media statements and player antics are starting to becoming annoying.

I say this as a fan of the current approach. It's enjoyable, but leave the preaching and false bravado please. There is a time and a place for it, acting this way after an embarassing and self inflicted defeat shows a complete lack of humility.

Badtameezee coupled with some daleri and jazba, what’s not to like?

 

[TheSultan]

I think some people are just a bit hurt that bazball destroyed india last year.

People were waiting for this moment to bring it down.

You can’t really bring something down with a marginal loss.

My only complaint about bazball is it is forcing the production of flatter pitches in England. I quite enjoyed watching the ball seaming around - it was a unique element of tests in England.

 

[MenInG]

I think some people are just a bit hurt that bazball destroyed india last year.

People were waiting for this moment to bring it down.

You can’t really bring something down with a marginal loss.

My only complaint about bazball is it is forcing the production of flatter pitches in England. I quite enjoyed watching the ball seaming around - it was a unique element of tests in England.

Key point.

 

[goldenduk]

[MENTION=131701]Mamoon[/MENTION] you might have clocked on.

England appointed Stokes as captain to keep him interested and not retiring from this format too. (It wasn’t to save Test cricket)

On top of that, Stokes by nature is an extremely impatient person/cricketer. What you are basically seeing in England’s style of cricket is Stoke’s own impatient nature,

The guy is so bored of life it seems that he will just make decisions impulsively. At some point, it will start to hurt England

This is just pub talk with little substance. The declaration did not cost England the match and the English bowling with the various fields Stokes set, especially near the end of Australia's first innings were very effective.

The biggest problem was execution, England had 20+ extras while Australia had about 4? Theer were also more dropped chances and poor fielding. Execution was the issue, ring rust as they would say.

 

[Rana]

Not sure.
According to Jimmy Anderson, Stokes is THE BEST captain he had in 20 years.
And why all of a sudden, we shifted all the focus from “BazBall” to Stokes when coming with critique on English Testvcricket?

Jimmy will say that because Root was on the move to have him and Broad phased out. He knew that the most they had left in them was maybe a year or so and then you had to go with new seamers for the next decade.

Stokes knows he’s on the job for maybe 2 years max and he will keep these two (Broad and Anderson) with him as long as he’s there. So a guy on his last legs getting one last hurrah due to a captain will naturally see him as the ‘best captain he has played under’. Well, this Best captain didn’t have the the presence of mind to take the new ball at the 80th over mark and at least bring on his nation’s top wicket taker at the time when 50 were needed with 3 wickets remaining. How Broad and Robinson only bowled to the close was bizarre to say the least

 

[shaz619]

There was nothing in the pitch for the new ball, Rooty was more threatening but Mo’s finger was too damaged. It wasn’t as straight forward a decision as it was made out to be

 

[James]

Having had some time to reflect on what happened, Im still not really sure how much can be read into the result at Edgbaston.

It was just a really good, absorbing, close Test match, and won by a very narrow margin. On another day, Stokes holds onto the wonder catch he nearly pulled off to put Australia nine wickets down, and England probably go on to win the game.

Now if Australia hammer England in the upcoming Test at Lord’s then that would be concerning both for England and for the series as a whole; but if it’s another super-tight Australian win / a draw / or (dare we say it!) an England win, then it would just likely be more evidence of two good red ball teams playing out a great contest, with again nothing conclusive that can be taken from it about “BazBall”.

 

[Mamoon]

Ben Stokes and Brendon McCullum deserve this humiliation.

England are reinventing Test cricket my backside.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

There was nothing in the pitch for the new ball, Rooty was more threatening but Mo’s finger was too damaged. It wasn’t as straight forward a decision as it was made out to be

There was massive lateral movement in the first hour. Australia made the most of their luck.

 

[James]

Ben Stokes and Brendon McCullum deserve this humiliation.

England are reinventing Test cricket my backside.

I think Baz will reflect, yesterday was a poor day and he looked a lot more sullen and antsy than usual on the balcony.

England are at the stage where they are comfortably ranked as the number 3 side in Test cricket but there seems to be a gap between them and Australia, and England would be up against it v India in Indian conditions as well.

Lots of tweaks and improvements to be made if England are to come back here and to compete with India in India (Jan-Feb 2024).

 

[MenInG]

What about today? England got the wickets but the way they went after Australian bowlers resulted in some unnecessary wickets.

 

[jnaveen1980]

I think Baz will reflect, yesterday was a poor day and he looked a lot more sullen and antsy than usual on the balcony.

England are at the stage where they are comfortably ranked as the number 3 side in Test cricket but there seems to be a gap between them and Australia, and England would be up against it v India in Indian conditions as well.

Lots of tweaks and improvements to be made if England are to come back here and to compete with India in India (Jan-Feb 2024).

Your bazball game has to be around the known weaknesses. Not every batsman is capable playing every type of bowlers with equal effect. But England players assume they are good against every type of bowlers play the same way. Short ball ploy exposed this flawed thinking. If you are not good against short ball you are not good against it. That's it. Just because you are very positive suddenly you won't become a better player against short ball. Same against any type of bowling. Stokes is vulnerable against off spin. Suddenly he is not going to be great against off spin. That is the tweak they have to make. Forcing every fielder to the boundary is a victory for you. They should have focused on 1s and 2s and let them bring the field in. Then attack again.

 

[Forum363]

Ben Stokes and Brendon McCullum deserve this humiliation.

England are reinventing Test cricket my backside.

England went from losing 11 matches in embarrassing circumstances to being in the top two sides in the world.

Australia are the test championship winners and current best side in the world. Just because England lost the first test by a close margin doesn’t make it embarrassing. What root was doing with the team was embarrassing and had he been captain here we know for a fact England would have gotten hammered.

 

[jnaveen1980]

England went from losing 11 matches in embarrassing circumstances to being in the top two sides in the world.

Australia are the test championship winners and current best side in the world. Just because England lost the first test by a close margin doesn’t make it embarrassing. What root was doing with the team was embarrassing and had he been captain here we know for a fact England would have gotten hammered.

Even if they had not played Bazball before your best bet to beat AUstralia is playing aggressively. If you play traditional cricket against them you are toast. They will constrict you. Having said that aggression cannot become craziness. That is where England has to make some tweaking.

 

[Saj]

If Lyon is out of the series then that's a huge blow for the Aussies.

I'm not sure who their back up spinner are, but they are unlikely to be anywhere near the quality of Lyon.

 

[Technics 1210]

Copied from FB

As exciting as Bazball is to watch from a batting perspective, the fast rate that England score their runs actually works against them in the bowling and fielding departments.

Based on recent Test match run rates, if England batted for 80 overs, Australia would have to face an extra 27 overs to draw level on the scoreboard and in the case of the Edgbaston Test this is precisely what happened.

Australia only bowled 78 overs in the first innings and even less with 66.2 overs in the second dig, which meant in Test match terms their bowlers and fielders remained relatively fresh.

On the other hand the Englishmen toiled away for 116.1 and 92.3 overs in each innings on a flat track, resulting in noticeable signs of fatigue in Australia’s successful run chase of 281.

It is called Test cricket for a reason and at Edgbaston the match panned out as a classic contest between the tortoise and the hare and we all know who won that race.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Copied from FB

As exciting as Bazball is to watch from a batting perspective, the fast rate that England score their runs actually works against them in the bowling and fielding departments.

Based on recent Test match run rates, if England batted for 80 overs, Australia would have to face an extra 27 overs to draw level on the scoreboard and in the case of the Edgbaston Test this is precisely what happened.

Australia only bowled 78 overs in the first innings and even less with 66.2 overs in the second dig, which meant in Test match terms their bowlers and fielders remained relatively fresh.

On the other hand the Englishmen toiled away for 116.1 and 92.3 overs in each innings on a flat track, resulting in noticeable signs of fatigue in Australia’s successful run chase of 281.

It is called Test cricket for a reason and at Edgbaston the match panned out as a classic contest between the tortoise and the hare and we all know who won that race.

I have raised this point several of my posts. It is one of the most obvious point England team management keeps ignoring.

 

[Mamoon]

Cricket is a great leveler. There is no room for arrogance.

England’s entire approach over the last 12 months, the slogfest with the bat and risky declarations scream “we are too smart for this format”.

The narrative around England’s Bazball should have been what it is. A method that has worked for England because England is a white ball team.

The most effective way of getting results from white ball players in Test cricket is to ask them to play more like white ball cricket.

This is what the narrative for Bazball should have been. Instead, England went ahead and branded Bazball as an attempt to “save” Test cricket and “revive” interest in the format.

Instead of telling the world that this style of cricket works for them, they went ahead and starting dictating terms to other teams by giving the message that this brand of cricket is the right way to play the format. In other words, they know better than anyone else.

This is why Bazball’s defeat in this Ashes will be great for the game and McCullum and Stokes are going to look like complete fools when their brand of cricket gets exposed.

It is clearly not the right way to play this format. They have shown a complete lack of respect to the sanctity of this format but thankfully, it seems like a short-lived adventure.

It would be surprising if both survive for another 12 months. Bazball will be history soon and we might not even see Stokes in the field 12 months from now.

He is as washed up as any premier cricketer I have ever seen. He looks like a player who has come out to play an exhibition event 10 years after retirement.

Joe Root must be reinstated as Test captain and the careers of talented players like Harry Brook should not be toyed with.

 

[Mamoon]

I think Baz will reflect, yesterday was a poor day and he looked a lot more sullen and antsy than usual on the balcony.

England are at the stage where they are comfortably ranked as the number 3 side in Test cricket but there seems to be a gap between them and Australia, and England would be up against it v India in Indian conditions as well.

Lots of tweaks and improvements to be made if England are to come back here and to compete with India in India (Jan-Feb 2024).

James, Bazball is nothing but England’s attempt to get the best out of its white ball players. The problem with England is they have branded it as a revolution, a new dawn for the format.

Instead of telling the world that this is how England need to play because of the players that they have, the message delivered is that this is how Test cricket should be played.

There is a lot of arrogance and bragging at play here and it will look very stupid if it fails in the Ashes against an Australian side that is sticking to orthodox Test cricket.

 

[Mamoon]

This clown show must come to an end. England have been utterly embarrassing to watch today.

Harry Brook, England’s best player after Joe Root, looked good for a big one before he got the message from the dressing room and started slogging when it was not required.

McCullum and Stokes are circus clowns. This is not Test cricket. Australia is brutality exposing the frailties and fragilities of Bazball and they are doing great service to the tradition and sanctity of Test cricket.

ECB must do the right thing and sack this duo after this series before they do long-term damage to England’s Test cricket and destroy players like Harry Brook who is more than the slogger they are forcing him to become.

 

[Ab Fan]

Will Bazball lose the Ashes at home after 22 years?

 

[Forum363]

We should sack the captain who won 10 games and go back to the captain who was losing 11 games in a row with the same team!! A new level of craziness

 

[gazza619]

Never thought I would say this in a million years but England needs an Azhar Ali who can play 200 balls for 50 runs.

Too much of anything is not good.

 

[JattMaula]

If Lyon is out of the series then that's a huge blow for the Aussies.

I'm not sure who their back up spinner are, but they are unlikely to be anywhere near the quality of Lyon.

Todd Murphy is an excellent bowler.

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Copied from FB

As exciting as Bazball is to watch from a batting perspective, the fast rate that England score their runs actually works against them in the bowling and fielding departments.

Based on recent Test match run rates, if England batted for 80 overs, Australia would have to face an extra 27 overs to draw level on the scoreboard and in the case of the Edgbaston Test this is precisely what happened.

Australia only bowled 78 overs in the first innings and even less with 66.2 overs in the second dig, which meant in Test match terms their bowlers and fielders remained relatively fresh.

On the other hand the Englishmen toiled away for 116.1 and 92.3 overs in each innings on a flat track, resulting in noticeable signs of fatigue in Australia’s successful run chase of 281.

It is called Test cricket for a reason and at Edgbaston the match panned out as a classic contest between the tortoise and the hare and we all know who won that race.

Yep. In a long Test series (4/5) , the workloads of the bowlers begin to pile up and it becomes a battle of how many spells your attack had to be bowl compared to the opposition.

It's how India won in Austrslia twice. Kept forcing Austtalia to come back for multiple spells .

Bazball makes the game move so quickly that your own bowlers will pay the price if you come up against a team that won't get sucked into playing similarly.

 

[Jazx]

Entertainment in any sports comes naturally. Its really rubbish to be declared by any player that he is there for only entertaining the crowd. And moreover test cricket is more entertaining when you see bowlers getting wickets with quality bowling and batsmans showing their class against that. And looking at the t20s and ODIs strike rates, no one gets really excited to see batsmans scoring 5-6 runs per over in test cricket and making suicidal declarations.

 

[James]

This is the right way for England to play, it just needs some tweaks. It’s only been a year, which is not a huge amount of time in cricket when it comes to building a team with a clear identity.

So the series ended 2-2.

It felt to me that England fine-tuned their approach as the series went on, still playing positively with a high run rate but doing so by rotating the strike more with 1s & 2s and manipulating the fields, with less of the premeditated attempts to try and fashion boundaries as this more creative and forced type of shot selection is arguably what cost them early on. (They still put the bad balls away of course.)

England playing “refined Bazball” looked like a pretty solid Test side in the second half of the series.

 

[Ahmed216]

England was clearly the better side during the Ashes.
Loved their demolition of Australia at Manchester - 600 runs at almost 6rpo.
Test cricket still won because it was highly entertaining series

 

[Ahmed216]

Cricket is a great leveler. There is no room for arrogance.

England’s entire approach over the last 12 months, the slogfest with the bat and risky declarations scream “we are too smart for this format”.

The narrative around England’s Bazball should have been what it is. A method that has worked for England because England is a white ball team.

The most effective way of getting results from white ball players in Test cricket is to ask them to play more like white ball cricket.

This is what the narrative for Bazball should have been. Instead, England went ahead and branded Bazball as an attempt to “save” Test cricket and “revive” interest in the format.

Instead of telling the world that this style of cricket works for them, they went ahead and starting dictating terms to other teams by giving the message that this brand of cricket is the right way to play the format. In other words, they know better than anyone else.

This is why Bazball’s defeat in this Ashes will be great for the game and McCullum and Stokes are going to look like complete fools when their brand of cricket gets exposed.

It is clearly not the right way to play this format. They have shown a complete lack of respect to the sanctity of this format but thankfully, it seems like a short-lived adventure.

It would be surprising if both survive for another 12 months. Bazball will be history soon and we might not even see Stokes in the field 12 months from now.

He is as washed up as any premier cricketer I have ever seen. He looks like a player who has come out to play an exhibition event 10 years after retirement.

Joe Root must be reinstated as Test captain and the careers of talented players like Harry Brook should not be toyed with.

Next day Ben stokes played an outstanding 155 run knock. Don’t write off an ATG player so quickly

 

[James]

Next day Ben stokes played an outstanding 155 run knock. Don’t write off an ATG player so quickly

Looking forward to Mamoon’s return!

 

[Technics 1210]

So the series ended 2-2.

It felt to me that England fine-tuned their approach as the series went on, still playing positively with a high run rate but doing so by rotating the strike more with 1s & 2s and manipulating the fields, with less of the premeditated attempts to try and fashion boundaries as this more creative and forced type of shot selection is arguably what cost them early on. (They still put the bad balls away of course.)

England playing “refined Bazball” looked like a pretty solid Test side in the second half of the series.

Fine tuned?

1st Test 1st Day declaration sub 400 runs when Root was seeing a football

2nd Test, England were 188/1 but in the name of Bazball played every short ball only to collapse and lose.

5th Test, the rain helped England win, and not counting the suspect ball change.

Please tell me when Stokes manipulated the field beyond the Umbrella field in the 1st Test match.

 

[James]

Fine tuned?

1st Test 1st Day declaration sub 400 runs when Root was seeing a football

2nd Test, England were 188/1 but in the name of Bazball played every short ball only to collapse and lose.

5th Test, the rain helped England win, and not counting the suspect ball change.

Please tell me when Stokes manipulated the field beyond the Umbrella field in the 1st Test match.

3rd match England changed gears in their batting at different points and won the match.

4th match England would have registered a huge win if it hadn’t rained.

Manipulated field I mean when they were batting. The England batters (as the series went on) scored a lot of 1s and 2s which manipulated the Australian fields and kept Cummins making changes so there were always gaps open. England then could always take an easy single. It was the same story when England chased down 380ish to beat India.

 

[Bewal Express]

I thought England would get smashed after the Edgebaston defeat, but in the end they were unlucky not to get the Ashes back. In the end a fair result

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Australia's tactical stupidity did them in the field. Bazball frazzled them

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Australia thought they figured out Bazzball, but they lost the last 3 tests in terms of performance (the third test was clearly in England's favour, rain ruined it)

 

[gazza619]

Australia's tactical stupidity did them in the field. Bazball frazzled them

With no Nathan Lyon, they were clearly the inferior side.

 

[sweep_shot]

Aussies should have won 2-1 or 3-1.

2-2 was a win for England considering they were 0-2.