CA reaction to Steve Smith vs PCB reaction to Shahid Afridi's offence in 2010

[Bleedgreen4ever]

Since this is such a hot topic these days.

Who is the bigger culprit?

Was Afridi's offence of chewing the ball lesser than Smith's?

Do you feel that the disorganised Ijaz Butt PCB of 2010 should have punished Afridi for tampering the ball by chewing it by banning him for life since it was such an openly embarassing incident plus he also admitted the guilt like Smith.
In contrast to CA who sacked Smith,PCB APPOINTED Afridi as captain for all formats after that series LOL

Was the PCB of that time too weak to ban star players and stick to their judgements?

I certainly expect the current PCB to sack Sarfaraz if he commits such an offence.

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

That was a different era and a different Pakistan board. I do hope the team and the board have grown since then. As has the country.

 

[thelandofthebravepeople]

Afridi can hardly be compared to this incident.

Afridi was captain and got a ********* in middle of the game and did whatever he did himself.

Smith had it all preplanned with leadership group - which means coach and basically the whole team was in on it. And made a youngster do the dirty job

Plus Afridi and Pakistan team does not go around and preaching a higher morale and ethics.

There is the difference.

 

[Madplayer]

I dont think Afridi's offence was bigger than this one. He was being an idiot and didnt even try to hide it. Pretty sure he didnt even have it in mind before entering the field. Aussies on the other hand had clearly been planning and co ordinating it carefully.

Afridi's incident was funnier too so you cant really hate that. Gotta love Lala.

 

[MenInG]

Lookup the word premeditated.

 

[Convict]

Lookup the word premeditated.

What about Ajmal and throwing?

 

[MenInG]

What about Ajmal and throwing?

Dont think the whole team planned it.

 

[Convict]

Dont think the whole team planned it.

Surely Captain and bowler were aware?

 

[Hitman]

Afridi acted like a complete idiot at the heat of the moment. He was the captain and he was solely responsible for his actions. The Australians however completely hatched the script beforehand and several of the senior members of the squad were in it. What's worse is even the coach was in it. It's far more embarrassing.

 

[MenInG]

Surely Captain and bowler were aware?

Ajmals offence was not an offence in eyes of cricket and his action wasn't hidden either
Th


Think you are looking in the wrong place.

 

[CricFan2012]

Ajmals offence was not an offence in eyes of cricket and his action wasn't hidden either
Th


Think you are looking in the wrong place.

lol, chucking is even worse than what smith and co did.

look at the stats and performances and how many wickets the doosra got him.

he has been infamous around the world since ICC finally grew a spine regarding chuckers, it is time that Pakistani fans begin to take a stand against unfair gameplay.

 

[Madplayer]

What about Ajmal and throwing?

Chucking is by and large considered the responsibility of the bowler alone. 100% of the times.

And ajmal wasnt hiding and secretly planning. Everybody could see it. Its ICC and match refrees' fault that he wasnt caught earlier.

Also he didnt always chuck. Age and fatigue caught up with him and his arm gave in. Couldnt bowl without chucking anymore.

 

[Mirpur express]

Afridi can hardly be compared to this incident.

Afridi was captain and got a ********* in middle of the game and did whatever he did himself.

Smith had it all preplanned with leadership group - which means coach and basically the whole team was in on it. And made a youngster do the dirty job

Plus Afridi and Pakistan team does not go around and preaching a higher morale and ethics.

There is the difference.

Spot on.

 

[Madplayer]

lol, chucking is even worse than what smith and co did.

look at the stats and performances and how many wickets the doosra got him.

he has been infamous around the world since ICC finally grew a spine regarding chuckers, it is time that Pakistani fans begin to take a stand against unfair gameplay.

Chuckers should be banned instantly.

However, chucking is the responsibility of the bowler alone. And to spot it is the responsibility of the referee and umpires. Always has been. Chucking, at least now, cannot be a carefully co-ordinated and planned offence. Its open for everyone to see.

 

[barah_admi]

Afridi can hardly be compared to this incident.

Afridi was captain and got a ********* in middle of the game and did whatever he did himself.

Smith had it all preplanned with leadership group - which means coach and basically the whole team was in on it. And made a youngster do the dirty job

Plus Afridi and Pakistan team does not go around and preaching a higher morale and ethics.

There is the difference.

This sums it up perfectly. Add to that Australia's holier than thou attitude, shameful on field antics for the last several years and there is no reason to wonder why there has been such a backlash now.

 

[WengerOut]

Didn't Afridi tamper the pitch under the instruction of Younis Khan ?

 

[Convict]

Ajmals offence was not an offence in eyes of cricket and his action wasn't hidden either
Th


Think you are looking in the wrong place.

Ajmal's offence is considered an offence in the eyes of cricket which is why he was suspended from bowling.

Chucking is cheating.

In any comparison of the PCB and CA's reaction to their own players cheating then a discussion on the reaction to chucking is absolutely relevant imo.

 

[Hitman]

Chucking is by and large considered the responsibility of the bowler alone. 100% of the times.

And ajmal wasnt hiding and secretly planning. Everybody could see it. Its ICC and match refrees' fault that he wasnt caught earlier.

Also he didnt always chuck. Age and fatigue caught up with him and his arm gave in. Couldnt bowl without chucking anymore.

So how was be able to bowl in domestic cricket immediately with a proper remodeled action after he was banned by the ICC?

 

[Hitman]

Ajmal claimed multiple times that he has a deformity in his arm due to an accident. And that's the reason why he can't bowl with a proper clean action. And the moment he was banned by the ICC, he could 'magically' bowl with a proper clean action in domestic cricket.

 

[IMMY69]

Ajmal claimed multiple times that he has a deformity in his arm due to an accident. And that's the reason why he can't bowl with a proper clean action. And the moment he was banned by the ICC, he could 'magically' bowl with a proper clean action in domestic cricket.

Ajmal was allowed to bowl under the previous rules. Once the rule changed his bowling action was deemed illegal and he went through remedial work. Irrespective of whether he claimed to have an abnormality, once his action was called he was no longer picked to play for Pakistan, even after he supposedly 'fixed' his action.

The fact that Ajmal played international cricket with his action is not down to cheating but the rules of the game and governance.

There is a massive difference between bowling in front of the cameras, the fans, the match referee and the umpires then taking out tape from your pocket and intentionally trying to change the condition of the ball.

Some of the tougher Pakistany contributors have maintained that he was always a chucker and as such a cheat. But two wrongs do not make a right.

Coming back to the title thread, Afridi's incident cannot be compared because,

1. He never claimed to be something that he isn't. There were never any heading butting the line stuff.
2. I doubt very much the senior players went up to the captain and said, come on bite the ball to make it reverse swing.
3. No premeditation

I have my own opinions on Afridi and I know a lot of Pakistany's share that view. However, whatever we think of him as a player and a person the two incidents are like apples and oranges.

 

[Buffet]

Why not compare fixing reaction of PCB vs tampering reaction of CA?

 

[Madplayer]

So how was be able to bowl in domestic cricket immediately with a proper remodeled action after he was banned by the ICC?

Immediately? If i remember PCB had to hire saqlain mushtaq to remodel Ajmal's action and it took many weeks. The end result wasnt decent anyway.

And i think anybody, chucker or not, can change his action anytime and start bowling with straight arm or bent arm or whatever. The issue is that they dont remain effective anymore. And Ajmal wasnt effective anymore even after weeks of work on his action.

 

[IMMY69]

Australia have a different attitude towards the game.
Play hard but play within the rules.
So what transpired in Cape Town felt like a betrayal of their values and hence the reaction.

It's noble and explains why they are so good at certain sports. If you're gonna have attitude and play to the line consistently then that line can never be broken. The reaction now is understandable.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

PCB was more defensive back in those days because while tampering was going on everywhere, it was solely Pakistani players that got accused because of their discovery of the science of reverse swing. Now that other teams have also been caught on camera, it's become a universal problem rather than a witch hunt so PCB will hopefully continue to be part of the solution to stamp out cheating in the game.

 

[CricFan2012]

Chuckers should be banned instantly.

However, chucking is the responsibility of the bowler alone. And to spot it is the responsibility of the referee and umpires. Always has been. Chucking, at least now, cannot be a carefully co-ordinated and planned offence. Its open for everyone to see.

I'm sure that the coaches and others around the chucker notice the suspect action but don't say anything because they prefer to keep the unfair advantage, it's the same case as starc and Hazlewood bowling with the tampered ball even though they haven't took part in it but there is no way they do not see the scuffs that have come so early (if this is truly the case from the sound of the reports)

 

[CricFan2012]

PCB was more defensive back in those days because while tampering was going on everywhere, it was solely Pakistani players that got accused because of their discovery of the science of reverse swing. Now that other teams have also been caught on camera, it's become a universal problem rather than a witch hunt so PCB will hopefully continue to be part of the solution to stamp out cheating in the game.

PCB needs to grow a spine first and ban Hafeez from bowling ever again if they want to stamp out cheating in the game.

They keep allowing him to bowl despite the fact that the cheater goes back to his action after remodelling it just for the tests.

 

[Madplayer]

I'm sure that the coaches and others around the chucker notice the suspect action but don't say anything because they prefer to keep the unfair advantage, it's the same case as starc and Hazlewood bowling with the tampered ball even though they haven't took part in it but there is no way they do not see the scuffs that have come so early (if this is truly the case from the sound of the reports)

Yes everybody notices the chucker's action except ICC and referees and umpires. Its doesnt work that way bro. Whats the job of the umpires and referees?

Sunil narine was recently called for suspect action because the referee spotted it. Not his coach.

 

[JustNotAFanOfThings]

PCB has set much lower standards of ethics for its players. It's known historically for showing leniency towards convicted match fixers because they were "great players."

PCB did't do anything during 2010 Spot Fixing scandal. All the punishment was carried out by ICC & law inforcement agencies in England. PCB didn't even get the chance to show any leniency towards the spot fixers then.

However, there's some improvement in this regard in recent years which is good, but really there's no comparison.

 

[rhony]

He knew there were cameras. Yet, He turned himself into a foreign object and started biting the ball. Nothing can beat that.

 

[AFM]

The PCB didn't have the public pressure that CA are under. The Australian public must be commended for this. Afridi was a national hero at the time - he was our best LOI player and had just won us the 2009 WT20 a few months prior.

Steven Smith held a similar position in the Australian public - Ashes winning captain and best Test batsman in the world. Yet, there are calls for a life ban.

It was Afridi's 2nd caught attempt as well - he had a previous history of pitch tampering.

I don't think it's an ovestimatiom that a significant section of our population would cry conspiracy if this was our team. There was certainly some who thought so when the spot fixing story broke out, despite the overwhelming evidence.

See, this is what I don't understand of Misbah haters. The years before he took over, our cricket was a circus and a joke. Infighting, oath swearing, a captaincy revolving door, retirements and bans which would be revoked the next day. Misbah brought a lot of stability and respect to our team. That is why he commands a lot of respect from foreign journalists and cricketers.

 

[BlackShadow]

PCB has set much lower standards of ethics for its players. It's known historically for showing leniency towards convicted match fixers because they were "great players."

PCB did't do anything during 2010 Spot Fixing scandal. All the punishment was carried out by ICC & law inforcement agencies in England. PCB didn't even get the chance to show any leniency towards the spot fixers then.

However, there's some improvement in this regard in recent years which is good, but really there's no comparison.

This. If I remember correctly, PCB chairman's first reaction to 2010 spot fixing news was to accuse English players of fixing. Even when Ajmal was caught chucking, the immediate reaction from majority of Pakistanis was to point fingers at Ashwin and play victim of double standards. Seems like a cultural thing.

 

[Joseph Gomes]

Afridi didn't try to hide what he was doing. Nor there was any indication or proof anybody else was involved. There wasn't rumors about Afridi being a cheat for years, it was a single incident. Smith and the management had planned this one prior to the match, which suggests they have done it before this many times.

Smith was explicitly called out for cheating even last year. It's not even remotely comparable.

 

[Bleedgreen4ever]

Afridi can hardly be compared to this incident.

Afridi was captain and got a ********* in middle of the game and did whatever he did himself.

Smith had it all preplanned with leadership group - which means coach and basically the whole team was in on it. And made a youngster do the dirty job

Plus Afridi and Pakistan team does not go around and preaching a higher morale and ethics.

There is the difference.

That doesnt mean that you instead of punishing that guy appoint him captain in all 3 formats

That would set a wrong standard

 

[Rana]

To this day I would argue that Afridi being the immature guy that he is didnt bite that ball in an attempt to tamper with it. He is and was an absolute clown at times. Who remembers that infamous run out in 2010 at the oval? When Afridi had his bat in the air whilst doing some really funny acrobatic style of grounding the bat? The guy can be a complete joke at times because he knows all eyes are on him and he has millions of fans, the bollywood Akshay Kumar in him exposed itself randomly out of nowhere at times.

However, when I see the pitch tampering video, i question whether he truly is as stupid as he comes across at times. The Pitch tampering incident was premeditated and calculating. Something I believe he was used to doing in the sub continent at least.

 

[Bilal7]

Afridi can hardly be compared to this incident.

Afridi was captain and got a ********* in middle of the game and did whatever he did himself.

Smith had it all preplanned with leadership group - which means coach and basically the whole team was in on it. And made a youngster do the dirty job

Plus Afridi and Pakistan team does not go around and preaching a higher morale and ethics.

There is the difference.

It is suprising that more people do not realize what the actual problem here is. Afridi did what he did in the spur of the moment using his teeth. The ICC caught and charged him and his "smelling the ball" offense was no more serious than Sachin's "cleaning the ball" offense or any of the other cases where players used fingernails to scuff up the ball.

What Smith did was completely different. His was not a spur in the moment 'brain-fade' that he carried out himself. Smith actually asked the junior-most member of the team to take sand paper out on the field and use it to continuously scuff up the ball. When the cameras caught it, Smith's backroom staff relayed a message though walkie-talkie onto the field, asking Bancroft to hide it.

This was a premeditated tactic that has brought the team's entire success over the last year or so into disrepute. It was not a spur of the moment decision for which Smith took full responsibility. Instead he brought others players into it by repeating the words "leadership group" over and over again.

The fact that the Aussies were all over Faf du Plessis during the previous series over a much less serious offence means that they have to turn it up to 11 now that their own captain has been guilty of systematic cheating or risk looking like hypocrites.

 

[Bilal7]

Ajmal claimed multiple times that he has a deformity in his arm due to an accident. And that's the reason why he can't bowl with a proper clean action. And the moment he was banned by the ICC, he could 'magically' bowl with a proper clean action in domestic cricket.

If magically means after bowling 1000s of deliveries and leaving his bowling with 5% effectiveness, then sure. No surprise that a genius like you would make such a comment.

 

[BreadPakoda]

Its a shame that Afridi was allowed to represent Pakistan again after almost gobbling a ball in a desperate attempt to win a game. You can call him an idiot or immature, which he was and probably still is, but at the end of the day he cheated and made a mockery of the green shirt.
Fact that he’s still hailed as a legend and a cricketing icon by the Pakistani masses says a lot about them.

 

[Cryin Out Loud]

In order of magnitude IMO:

1. By a small margin, Ajmal takes the cake. Claimed an accident led to a deformity in his arm that miraculously vanished when he was called on it. It was sustained, calculated, went on for years and ultimately fake.

2. Smith/Bancroft: Even if it was done in 10 minutes, as the Aussies claim, it was premeditated. Plus what makes it totally worse was the concerted attempt to avoid deflection by lying to the Umpire.

3. Afridi: I doubt even Afridi he knew what he was doing one second before he did it. This does not make it OK, but it's not in the same league as #1 and #2. He was just nuts (in a nice way, but nuts)

 

[Arham_PakFan]

Even though I dislike Afridi immensely,that incident was not comparable to Smith's.I doubt it was premeditated(because of the nature of the tampering).Yes it was wrong,he was banned and fined IIRC.But Smith basically admitted that his team had been planning to cheat and had been devising means to do so.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

PCB has set much lower standards of ethics for its players. It's known historically for showing leniency towards convicted match fixers because they were "great players."

PCB did't do anything during 2010 Spot Fixing scandal. All the punishment was carried out by ICC & law inforcement agencies in England. PCB didn't even get the chance to show any leniency towards the spot fixers then.

However, there's some improvement in this regard in recent years which is good, but really there's no comparison.

Aussies also tried to cover up when Shane Warne was caught giving 'weather forecasts' to bookies, England's Michael Atherton was a stand up guy who was just using sawdust to 'dry the ball' when he was caught ball tampering. Nowadays the spotlight is everywhere so the good thing is that no board can point at one country only, everyone has to stand up equally, PCB included.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

This. If I remember correctly, PCB chairman's first reaction to 2010 spot fixing news was to accuse English players of fixing. Even when Ajmal was caught chucking, the immediate reaction from majority of Pakistanis was to point fingers at Ashwin and play victim of double standards. Seems like a cultural thing.

The culture is ingrained from generations in India, is that what you are referring to?

 

[Savak]

Afridi didn't deserve to be banned in 2010, he was just smelling the ball. Smith deserves to be banned for cheating

 

[ManFan]

The culture is ingrained from generations in India, is that what you are referring to?

It's in human nature. Look for the problem outwards when it is almost always inwards.

 

[ManFan]

Afridi didn't deserve to be banned in 2010, he was just smelling the ball. Smith deserves to be banned for cheating

You smell with your teeth?

 

[Ummii]

lol, chucking is even worse than what smith and co did.

look at the chuckers stats and performances and how many wickets the doosra got him.

he has been infamous around the world since ICC finally grew a spine regarding chuckers, it is time that Pakistani fans begin to take a stand against unfair gameplay.

If Ajmal chucks then it is the responsibility of officials to deal with him, just like they did with Smith & Co. You can't blame whole team. Also he got medical report ( which I personally think was just an excuse) However, ICC officials banned him but they were too late.

 

[Railu Katta]

lol, chucking is even worse than what smith and co did.

look at the chuckers stats and performances and how many wickets the doosra got him.

he has been infamous around the world since ICC finally grew a spine regarding chuckers, it is time that Pakistani fans begin to take a stand against unfair gameplay.

If you were a Pakistani fan, you wouldn't refer to Ajmal as a chucker but by his name. Since you and your guru are both personal computers you resort to personal attacks.

PP needs to take a stand against the likes of you who have no respect at all for Pakistanis or Pakistan in general. GH

 

[Hitman]

Immediately? If i remember PCB had to hire saqlain mushtaq to remodel Ajmal's action and it took many weeks. The end result wasnt decent anyway.

And i think anybody, chucker or not, can change his action anytime and start bowling with straight arm or bent arm or whatever. The issue is that they dont remain effective anymore. And Ajmal wasnt effective anymore even after weeks of work on his action.

So suddenly under Saqlain Mushtaq, his deformity disappeared? According to him previously, it was impossible for him to bowl with a proper action. And then after he was banned by the ICC, the deformity disappeared all off a sudden and he was able to bowl with a proper action?

What was not decent? The fact that he couldn't take wickets illegally once he had no option but to bowl with a legal action?

 

[MenInG]

CA CEO to speak shortly...

 

[Hitman]

PCB has set much lower standards of ethics for its players. It's known historically for showing leniency towards convicted match fixers because they were "great players."

PCB did't do anything during 2010 Spot Fixing scandal. All the punishment was carried out by ICC & law inforcement agencies in England. PCB didn't even get the chance to show any leniency towards the spot fixers then.

However, there's some improvement in this regard in recent years which is good, but really there's no comparison.

What did the then PCB Chief Ijaz Butt do? He claimed that it was all a conspiracy against Pakistan, and instead some of the England players were involved in match fixing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XusWdYJ55t8

 

[Savak]

You smell with your teeth?

Afridi is wired differently.

 

[Hitman]

Afridi didn't try to hide what he was doing. Nor there was any indication or proof anybody else was involved. There wasn't rumors about Afridi being a cheat for years, it was a single incident. Smith and the management had planned this one prior to the match, which suggests they have done it before this many times.

Smith was explicitly called out for cheating even last year. It's not even remotely comparable.

His first reaction was that he was 'smelling the ball, how it's feeling'.

 

[Hitman]

It is suprising that more people do not realize what the actual problem here is. Afridi did what he did in the spur of the moment using his teeth. The ICC caught and charged him and his "smelling the ball" offense was no more serious than Sachin's "cleaning the ball" offense or any of the other cases where players used fingernails to scuff up the ball.

What Smith did was completely different. His was not a spur in the moment 'brain-fade' that he carried out himself. Smith actually asked the junior-most member of the team to take sand paper out on the field and use it to continuously scuff up the ball. When the cameras caught it, Smith's backroom staff relayed a message though walkie-talkie onto the field, asking Bancroft to hide it.

This was a premeditated tactic that has brought the team's entire success over the last year or so into disrepute. It was not a spur of the moment decision for which Smith took full responsibility. Instead he brought others players into it by repeating the words "leadership group" over and over again.

The fact that the Aussies were all over Faf du Plessis during the previous series over a much less serious offence means that they have to turn it up to 11 now that their own captain has been guilty of systematic cheating or risk looking like hypocrites.

Verdict of the ICC -

Afridi guilty of trying to alter the condition of the ball.

Sachin not guilty of the charges pressed by the match referee

 

[sshakir411]

CA is acting like no previous Aussie skipper or players have taken part in changing the conditions of the ball. All this talk of life ban and whatnot is exaggerated...

 

[Hitman]

If magically means after bowling 1000s of deliveries and leaving his bowling with 5% effectiveness, then sure. No surprise that a genius like you would make such a comment.

'Magically' means being able to bowl with a clean action after claiming all his life that he couldn't do so because of an accident

 

[Kohli The King of Chase]

One is a Professional Cricket Board (PCB), and the other is Pakistan Cricket Board ( PCB).

 

[Hitman]

One is a Professional Cricket Board (PCB), and the other is Pakistan Cricket Board ( PCB).

Big typo there.

 

[waleed88]

Dont think the whole team planned it.

Afridi was just smelling the ball

 

[Saj]

I have to admit there are some folk in the cricketing world who are being hypocritcal, especially South Africans who are hardly clean when it comes to ball tampering - Du Plessis and zipgate anyone?

 

[JustNotAFanOfThings]

Pakistani fans defending actions of Afridi by giving him non-existent benefit of doubt proves my previous point as emphatically as possible.

Then take the example of Hafeez. He's been caught chucking god knows how many times. Yet, he doesn't have an iota of shame or embarrassment regarding this. Pakistani fans aren't embarrassed either. Just business as usual.

Yes, AustraliaN Board may have some leniency on Warne & Waugh as per their own standards, but not as per PCB's. Both were fined for sharing some information in an era where blatant match fixers got away with murder from other countries.

By the way, both players were heavily criticised & mocked during matches by the Australian public.

You don't see that with Pakistani fans.

 

[MenInG]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-partner="tweetdeck"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Hopefully those asking for bans against Smith, Warner and Bancroft are consistent when it's players from their own country in future <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Cricket?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Cricket</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BallTampering?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#BallTampering</a> <a href="https://t.co/SW6TAWfetv">pic.twitter.com/SW6TAWfetv</a></p>— Saj Sadiq (@Saj_PakPassion) <a href="https://twitter.com/Saj_PakPassion/status/978689373196685313?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 27, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Savak]

Pakistani fans defending actions of Afridi by giving him non-existent benefit of doubt proves my previous point as emphatically as possible.

Then take the example of Hafeez. He's been caught chucking god knows how many times. Yet, he doesn't have an iota of shame or embarrassment regarding this. Pakistani fans aren't embarrassed either. Just business as usual.

Yes, AustraliaN Board may have some leniency on Warne & Waugh as per their own standards, but not as per PCB's. Both were fined for sharing some information in an era where blatant match fixers got away with murder from other countries.

By the way, both players were heavily criticised & mocked during matches by the Australian public.

You don't see that with Pakistani fans.

Afridi and Hafeez don't go around giving moral lectures to the world or for being the bastions of righteousness. Steve Smith fell way short of the standard expected from an Australian Cricketer and has to be held to a higher pedestal.

 

[CricFan2012]

If Ajmal chucks then it is the responsibility of officials to deal with him, just like they did with Smith & Co. You can't blame whole team. Also he got medical report ( which I personally think was just an excuse) However, ICC officials banned him but they were too late.

I am not blaming the whole team here.

Same way I cannot blame the whole Aussie team here.

 

[CricFan2012]

If you were a Pakistani fan, you wouldn't refer to Ajmal as a chucker but by his name. Since you and your guru are both personal computers you resort to personal attacks.

PP needs to take a stand against the likes of you who have no respect at all for Pakistanis or Pakistan in general. GH

Nationalism can be truly an awful thing sometimes. It makes you overly biased and then deluded in some cases.

First and foremost we are all humans.

Second, cheating is cheating. I will call out Lance Armstrong, Ajmal, in all the same way, all have disgraced their respective sports their nationality should not be their saving grace.

 

[Bilal7]

Ajmal's offence is considered an offence in the eyes of cricket which is why he was suspended from bowling.

Chucking is cheating.

In any comparison of the PCB and CA's reaction to their own players cheating then a discussion on the reaction to chucking is absolutely relevant imo.

The ICC cleared Ajmal in 2009. His bowling from 2008 to 2014 was 100% legal and definitely not cheating. Why would he change something when he did not need to?

Verdict of the ICC -

Afridi guilty of trying to alter the condition of the ball.

Sachin not guilty of the charges pressed by the match referee

No, Sachin cheated. However, his blood-thirsty fans made the ICC change the decision. No worries though, several players have been caught ball-tampering, Sachin was no different.

'Magically' means being able to bowl with a clean action after claiming all his life that he couldn't do so because of an accident

No, he never claimed anything like that. His words were misinterpreted and people thought that the ICC were allowing him to bowl over the limits which was not true. His bowling was found to be well within the 15 degree limits and since his action was 100% legal, there was no reason for him to change it at all.

 

[Bilal7]

His first reaction was that he was 'smelling the ball, how it's feeling'.

Just like how Sachin was "cleaning" the ball.

Only difference between the two is that no Pakistani cricketer has legions of obsessed, blood-thirsty fans who started burning effigies.

 

[Hitman]

No, Sachin cheated. However, his blood-thirsty fans made the ICC change the decision. No worries though, several players have been caught ball-tampering, Sachin was no different.

Except that the cricketing world cares about the verdict of the ICC, not some conspiracy theories cooked by Pak fans. Was he acquitted of the charges? Yes, he was. And that's what history remembers.

No, he never claimed anything like that. His words were misinterpreted and people thought that the ICC were allowing him to bowl over the limits which was not true. His bowling was found to be well within the 15 degree limits and since his action was 100% legal, there was no reason for him to change it at all.

I'm not even debating that. The point is he claimed he suffers from a deformity due to an accident and that was the reason he couldn't bowl with a completely clean action. And the moment was was banned for chucking i.e cheating, he was immediately able to bowl with a completely clean action.

 

[Hitman]

Just like how Sachin was "cleaning" the ball.

Only difference between the two is that no Pakistani cricketer has legions of obsessed, blood-thirsty fans who started burning effigies.

Refer to post #66.

 

[Shutdown Corner]

Did Afridi actually admit to tampering back in 2010? I think he did, but can't remember. Besides him biting the ball was too blatant to be tampering wasn't it? It seemed more like he bit the ball out of frustration rather than a deliberate attempt to gain an advantage. I could be wrong.

But didn't the Saffers get accused of ball tampering not too long ago? What was the finding of that?

 

[PukhtoonZalmay88]

Afridi was smelling it, just "to see how its feeling". BIG difference

 

[giri26]

Did Afridi actually admit to tampering back in 2010? I think he did, but can't remember. Besides him biting the ball was too blatant to be tampering wasn't it? It seemed more like he bit the ball out of frustration rather than a deliberate attempt to gain an advantage. I could be wrong.

But didn't the Saffers get accused of ball tampering not too long ago? What was the finding of that?

Faf admitted to tampering and was punished by ICC I guess.

 

[HuzaifaE]

1) Afridi is the public's darling, always was, always will be. He is the embodiment of many of the wrongs in Pakistani cricket. A genuinely, sincerely mentally deficient player with no shred of responsibility who somehow rose to star status and public favorite on the basis of inconsistency. PCB hammering Afridi would neither satisfy the people nor teach the most immature cricketer of the past two decades a single lesson.

2) We as a society have far less regard for actual principle than the Australians so there was minimal outrage over the matter. The Aussies talk about how Smith's actions set such a poor example for the children etc. I will laugh if anyone pretends most of our fanbase would even consider that thought if one of our players was caught like this instead of "everyone does it", "Faf got away with it" blabla. Playing the victim card and looking for equivalent sinners as justification is something we are far better at than talking about keeping sports athletes on a pedestal, to uphold national integrity etc.

3) Subsequently, while CA is going to nail Smith to appease the public, the PCB avoided sprinkling the fire of public opinion. Lets not forget, the tour of Australia was so disgraceful people were genuinely appreciative of Afridi's antics. "Well at least he tried to give the team an edge" was not a fringe opinion in our delusional fanbase. Says it all really.

 

[HuzaifaE]

Why not compare fixing reaction of PCB vs tampering reaction of CA?

Because that's like comparing the sentence of murder versus the sentence of theft.

 

[Bilal7]

Except that the cricketing world cares about the verdict of the ICC, not some conspiracy theories cooked by Pak fans. Was he acquitted of the charges? Yes, he was. And that's what history remembers.




I'm not even debating that. The point is he claimed he suffers from a deformity due to an accident and that was the reason he couldn't bowl with a completely clean action. And the moment was was banned for chucking i.e cheating, he was immediately able to bowl with a completely clean action.

Was Sachin found to be ball tampering? Yes. What happened after is irrelevant. He was clearly picking the seam of that ball and the ICC gave him a lower charge of 'cleaning the ball without the umpires' consent' because of the backlash in India. The fact that you're still getting emotional over this tells the whole story.

He was bowling with a "completely clean action". Any action that allows you to ball within 15 degrees is legal and Ajmal's deliveries were all found to be under 12 degrees. Like I said, you're misinterpreting his statements.

Refer to post #66.

View attachment 80423

This is in response to Pakistan losing an important match, not in response to Afridi being charged with ball tampering.

 

[Hitman]

Was Sachin found to be ball tampering? Yes. What happened after is irrelevant. He was clearly picking the seam of that ball and the ICC gave him a lower charge of 'cleaning the ball without the umpires' consent' because of the backlash in India. The fact that you're still getting emotional over this tells the whole story.

Really? Was the Pak team accused to have tampered the ball in the Oval Test back in 2006? Yes. What happens after that is irrelevant. Right?

No! What matters is the final verdict. And the final verdict was that Sachin was innocent. There's nothing you can do about it. That's what history says, and that's what history will remember

Here, enjoy it -

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2001/nov/29/cricket2

He was bowling with a "completely clean action". Any action that allows you to ball within 15 degrees is legal and Ajmal's deliveries were all found to be under 12 degrees. Like I said, you're misinterpreting his statements.

No, I didn't. There were always talks from current and former players that he was chucking the ball. In response, he kept yapping that he couldn't bowl with a completely clean action because of a deformity. So how did the deformity disappear after he was found out to be chucking? He started bowling with a clean action after that. And as a result lost the advantage that he previously had in cheating countless batsmen of their wickets.

This is in response to Pakistan losing an important match, not in response to Afridi being charged with ball tampering.

The picture was in response that effigies are indeed burnt by Pak fans.

 

[big_gamer007]

1) Afridi is the public's darling, always was, always will be. He is the embodiment of many of the wrongs in Pakistani cricket. A genuinely, sincerely mentally deficient player with no shred of responsibility who somehow rose to star status and public favorite on the basis of inconsistency. PCB hammering Afridi would neither satisfy the people nor teach the most immature cricketer of the past two decades a single lesson.

2) We as a society have far less regard for actual principle than the Australians so there was minimal outrage over the matter. The Aussies talk about how Smith's actions set such a poor example for the children etc. I will laugh if anyone pretends most of our fanbase would even consider that thought if one of our players was caught like this instead of "everyone does it", "Faf got away with it" blabla. Playing the victim card and looking for equivalent sinners as justification is something we are far better at than talking about keeping sports athletes on a pedestal, to uphold national integrity etc.

3) Subsequently, while CA is going to nail Smith to appease the public, the PCB avoided sprinkling the fire of public opinion. Lets not forget, the tour of Australia was so disgraceful people were genuinely appreciative of Afridi's antics. "Well at least he tried to give the team an edge" was not a fringe opinion in our delusional fanbase. Says it all really.

Good post sums it up..

 

[Slog]

Verdict of the ICC -

Afridi guilty of trying to alter the condition of the ball.

Sachin not guilty of the charges pressed by the match referee

Sachin was also charged though for a downgraded offence right?

 

[Hitman]

Sachin was also charged though for a downgraded offence right?

He wasn't guilty of cheating like Wasim and Waqar were &#55357;&#56859;

 

[SM1989]

I remember back in the day some of my fellow Pakistanis were coming out with statements like:

"Yaar usne mulk ke liyay ball khaayee thii, qaum ko khushi dena chahtaa thaa (Man he bit the ball for the country, he wanted to bring happiness to his nation, his intentions were good)"

 

[Slog]

He wasn't guilty of cheating like Wasim and Waqar were ��

What was Wasim charged for?

 

[SamNJ]

Any other country, any other cricket board and Afridi would not have set foot on ground after that day. Less for being a cold blooded cheat and more for being an absolute nutcase who is not mentally fit to play any sort of sport.