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"Forget Jasprit Bumrah, I will acknowledge Shaheen Shah Afridi if he manages to bowl better than Siraj": Harbhajan Singh

Do you agree with Harbhajan Singh's statement here?

  • Total voters
    45
The Bald Eagle

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Do you agree with Bhaji's gaffe here or is it the bitter truth?

=====
Recently in an interview, Harbhajan Singh passed some bizarre comments regarding Shaheen Shah Afridi:

“Jasprit Bumrah anyday. He has no competition. I think Siraj is a better bowler than Afridi. With no offence to anyone, Siraj has more pace and wicket-taking ability than the Pakistani fast bowler,”

"Forget Bumrah, I will acknowledge Shaheen if he manages to bowl better than Siraj"

“I am not saying this just to make someone feel ordinary, but this is my point of view, and I have a habit of keeping across my point even if people don’t like it,”
 
If he's talking about ODI then he's 100% right
We all seen how bumrah was the flavor worldcup. Took his team to the finals

we pakistanis over hype our bowlers to the moon and back

When we had waqar waseem asif then we were in competition but we've not had bowlers since who have replaced them
 
Siraj somewhat is improving. I can still see the hunger in his eyes.

Afridi seems to get stagnant (may be regressed). When I see him bowling, it feels as if he is very exhausted and out of energy.

I disagree with bhajji but Siraj may surpass Afridi if it continues in my opinion.
 
Itachi said:
Siraj somewhat is improving. I can still see the hunger in his eyes.

Afridi seems to get stagnant (may be regressed). When I see him bowling, it feels as if he is very exhausted and out of energy.

I disagree with bhajji but Siraj may surpass Afridi if it continues in my opinion.
Click to expand...
In test & ODI Siraj is comfortably better than Shaheen

In T20 Shaheen is slightly ahead
 
Siraj has achieved some good things. But he is not a smart guy like Bumrah. Far from it. Either bowls really well. Really badly.
 
Well, it's a known fact that Harbhajan usually takes digs at Pakistani players. He most of the time denies it, but it is what it is. But here, he is right.
Siraj is working hard because there is so much competition, and Shaheen in his head is already a superstar whom no one can touch. That's why he is not trying to improve.
 
NishanKonar said:
In test & ODI Siraj is comfortably better than Shaheen

In T20 Shaheen is slightly ahead
Click to expand...
This is the fact..

Test and odi- siraj over Shaheen any day. His line and length, fitness and accuracy is very good

T20- Shaheen over siraj any day. Siraj should be nowhere near the T20 international ind team
 
Siraj in this IPL:
MatchesWicketsAverageEconomyStrike Rate
7553.4010.3431.20

Siraj has improved phonomenly in ODIs and that's been significantly boosted due to his partners Shami and Bumrah where they all hunt in packs in ODIs. But he is the weakest among them and is really vulnerable against aggressive batsman.

Even what we are terming as a regressed Shaheen, Shaheen clears Siraj in T20s. It is frankly laughable to suggest Siraj is even a T20 bowler with his stats and is a complete mismatch. Siraj is ahead in ODIs for now as a 3rd seamer in Indias line up but once he is actually elevated to their opening and 1st seamer option, batsman are going to realise how nothing of bowler he is, he is going to get the Hasan Ali treatment.
 
Harbhajan like many of the present and past Indian players and fans have been basking in BCCIs, India's and IPLs riches and hence why he too has developed the confidence to indulge in Virender Sehwag level trolling of Pakistani players.
 
Seam Specialist said:
Siraj in this IPL:
MatchesWicketsAverageEconomyStrike Rate
7553.4010.3431.20

Siraj has improved phonomenly in ODIs and that's been significantly boosted due to his partners Shami and Bumrah where they all hunt in packs in ODIs. But he is the weakest among them and is really vulnerable against aggressive batsman.

Even what we are terming as a regressed Shaheen, Shaheen clears Siraj in T20s. It is frankly laughable to suggest Siraj is even a T20 bowler with his stats and is a complete mismatch. Siraj is ahead in ODIs for now as a 3rd seamer in Indias line up but once he is actually elevated to their opening and 1st seamer option, batsman are going to realise how nothing of bowler he is, he is going to get the Hasan Ali treatment.
Click to expand...
Agree Siraj is not a T20 bowler. He seems to be improving in this format also..
 
deltexas said:
This is the fact..

Test and odi- siraj over Shaheen any day. His line and length, fitness and accuracy is very good

T20- Shaheen over siraj any day. Siraj should be nowhere near the T20 international ind team
Click to expand...
Harshit Rana, Mohsin Khan & Kuldeep Sen for T20 WC along with Bumrah

No place for Siraj ideally
 
Biggest problem with Shaheen is he is one trick pony. He has that big inswinging yorker but nothing else to offer

Good batters know this. They just play out the first 2-3 overs with the new ball and after that when the ball stops swinging, Shaheen becomes very pedestrian
 
as if the world is dieing for the acknowledgement of a person who is not even part of the top pundits and analyst of cricket.
 
In T20 Shaheen is much better than Siraj.

In odis and tests, Siraj is way better. Numbers don’t matter here, Siraj has won tests in SA, Eng, Aus and at home with his bowling, won man of the match in Asia cup final. Leagues ahead of Shaheen in that format.

Shaheen is a good T20 bowler but that’s the least respected of the 3 formats. I mean you can’t say David Willey is a better overall bowler than Jimmy Anderson based on who is better in T20. Obviously not saying the gulf is that huge here but yes Bhajji is correct. Problem is because of lack of education etc he might come across a little crude saying it.
 
Local.Dada said:
In T20 Shaheen is much better than Siraj.

In odis and tests, Siraj is way better. Numbers don’t matter here, Siraj has won tests in SA, Eng, Aus and at home with his bowling, won man of the match in Asia cup final. Leagues ahead of Shaheen in that format.

Shaheen is a good T20 bowler but that’s the least respected of the 3 formats. I mean you can’t say David Willey is a better overall bowler than Jimmy Anderson based on who is better in T20. Obviously not saying the gulf is that huge here but yes Bhajji is correct. Problem is because of lack of education etc he might come across a little crude saying it.
Click to expand...

Most of the Pak bowlers are 4 over specialists. It suits them. Show full aggression for 4 overs split by 2 spells.
 
jnaveen1980 said:
Most of the Pak bowlers are 4 over specialists. It suits them. Show full aggression for 4 overs split by 2 spells.
Click to expand...
Whatever Bhajji said is a gaffe but unfortunately SSA's continuous regression may just vindicate him one day.
 
Not long before Shaheen's lack of impact even in the T20 team will result him in being dropped from the team.
 
The real reason is that shaheen is an overhyped age fudger.

He never was an intelligent bowler or had the skills or tactical nous with the ball , yes he has the physical attributes but due to blatant age fudging afghani style knocking off years the pace has gone to trundler level speed that's what happens when you start getting old, so to cover this up they have created this not fully recovered from injury drama, pcb medical negligence overbowled and captaincy drama.

Basically he's washed up and is only going to deteriorate not get better.

21 yrs old falcon parvaz 😄
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Shaheen reminds me of Irfan pathan. Irfan was bowling at good speeds when he was new. But he was made to bowl 40 overs, 50 overs in a test innings at the age of 19. They also tried to turn him intoall rounder. His action got all screwed up. There was a significant drop in pace. Shaheen has no worry about becoming a batsman. But his pace has dropped. Action is very ungainly. It is almost like ball is refusing to come out of his hand smoothly. If i have to compare one left arm bowler it will be Boult. He still looks the same i saw 5 or 6 years back. If anything better. Shaheen still relies a lot on magic deliveries which he may bowl in right conditions. But that only makes you predictable.
 
There is a lot of truth about what Bhajji is saying about Shaheen. Since the injury, Shaheen lost his pace and swing that made him deadly.

Shaheen can still be good some days, but I feel there are better bowlers in Pakistan than him right now. At least from what I saw in PSL. He should not be an automatic selection in the squad.
 
Savak said:
Harbhajan like many of the present and past Indian players and fans have been basking in BCCIs, India's and IPLs riches and hence why he too has developed the confidence to indulge in Virender Sehwag level trolling of Pakistani players.
Click to expand...
Sachin Ganguly Dravid Zaheer Kumble Yuvi all gave basked in riches as well no one speaks like this.

This is a very Paindo behaviour, probably Punjabis (on both sides) Haryanvis indulge in this
 
I agree with Bajji. Siraj is a different bowler in international matches. I don't care about IPL. He is an all-format bowler.
 
mazkhan said:
The real reason is that shaheen is an overhyped age fudger.

He never was an intelligent bowler or had the skills or tactical nous with the ball , yes he has the physical attributes but due to blatant age fudging afghani style knocking off years the pace has gone to trundler level speed that's what happens when you start getting old , so to cover this up they have created this not fully recovered from injury drama, pcb medical negligence overbowled and captaincy drama.

Basically he's washed up and is only going to deteriorate not get better ,

21 yrs old falcon parvaz 😄
Click to expand...
Players from Kpk seem to be the most blatant age fudgers
 
mazkhan said:
The real reason is that shaheen is an overhyped age fudger.

He never was an intelligent bowler or had the skills or tactical nous with the ball , yes he has the physical attributes but due to blatant age fudging afghani style knocking off years the pace has gone to trundler level speed that's what happens when you start getting old, so to cover this up they have created this not fully recovered from injury drama, pcb medical negligence overbowled and captaincy drama.

Basically he's washed up and is only going to deteriorate not get better.

21 yrs old falcon parvaz 😄
Click to expand...
What do you think his official age is?
 
Siraj is averaging 53.8 in IPL 2024, with economy of 10.34.
But the Impact Player rule and skewed figures of most bowlers in the IPL.

Surely Shaheen's doing better.

I think Bhajji only remembers their recent ODI performance. :unsure: especially with World Cup.
 
DeadlyVenom said:
What do you think his official age is?
Click to expand...


I would say he's around 30-32 yrs old

His brother riaz 39 yrs old but we know he played u19 level and was built like a tank and was bowling 90mph at u19s so even he must have fudged his age back then to play u19s. So add a few yrs onto 39 .

There's no way the youngest sibling can have such an Age gap of 14 yrs + from his brother riaz afridi is not even the eldest amongst shaheens siblings.

You can see his pace has gone down obviously injury played his part but main thing is afridi bowling abilities never kicked on or developed so that tells me he isn't going to get any better and his peak is over he clearly looks like someone in decline.

If you remember injury age declined waqars pace but waqar was always had technical ability and nous with the ball even when he was overhill bowling 75-80 mph he still had great skill with the ball and even became a better bowler with the new ball In odi cricket because he had skill and talent.

Afridi never had that skill to begin with he bowls with the new ball and is a one trick pony that inswinger moment it stops swinging he's no threat and due to lack of skill and ability he is also useless with the old ball at the death hence his tendency to start getting smashed. And what's made it worse he's lost pace even In 4overs t20 he's bowling at 130-135 kph .

Look at m amir he's clearly past his best but he still has nous with the ball look how he varied his pace in the bowling , and bowled cutters and slower deliveries. Afridi never had that intelligence to begin with.
 
mazkhan said:
I would say he's around 30-32 yrs old

His brother riaz 39 yrs old but we know he played u19 level and was built like a tank and was bowling 90mph at u19s so even he must have fudged his age back then to play u19s. So add a few yrs onto 39 .

There's no way the youngest sibling can have such an Age gap of 14 yrs + from his brother riaz afridi is not even the eldest amongst shaheens siblings.

You can see his pace has gone down obviously injury played his part but main thing is afridi bowling abilities never kicked on or developed so that tells me he isn't going to get any better and his peak is over he clearly looks like someone in decline.

If you remember injury age declined waqars pace but waqar was always had technical ability and nous with the ball even when he was overhill bowling 75-80 mph he still had great skill with the ball and even became a better bowler with the new ball In odi cricket because he had skill and talent.

Afridi never had that skill to begin with he bowls with the new ball and is a one trick pony that inswinger moment it stops swinging he's no threat and due to lack of skill and ability he is also useless with the old ball at the death hence his tendency to start getting smashed. And what's made it worse he's lost pace even In 4overs t20 he's bowling at 130-135 kph .

Look at m amir he's clearly past his best but he still has nous with the ball look how he varied his pace in the bowling , and bowled cutters and slower deliveries. Afridi never had that intelligence to begin with.
Click to expand...

The whole him being early 20's was cap.

I saw his picture from when he was 17, dude looks like he just graduated masters or PhD 😂😂. 17 year old kids with 5 o clock shadows lol.
 
Shaheen is being demoted from competing with Bumrah to now competing with Siraj. Just like how Umar Akmal got demoted competing to Kohli to competing with nalli nihari.

The regression is there for all to see. Shaheen is as much a culprit, as are Babar and Rizwan in terms of not progressing their game forward to match the best. And the fact they're showing their arrogance in celebrating statistics is now making a mockery of the system and fan sentiments.
 
mominsaigol said:
The whole him being early 20's was cap.

I saw his picture from when he was 17, dude looks like he just graduated masters or PhD 😂😂. 17 year old kids with 5 o clock shadows lol.
Click to expand...
There is a thread on this site where it's mentioned that he considers Wasim Akram his childhood hero. Wasim played his last game when Shaheen was 2 years and 11 months old.
 
mazkhan said:
The real reason is that shaheen is an overhyped age fudger.

He never was an intelligent bowler or had the skills or tactical nous with the ball , yes he has the physical attributes but due to blatant age fudging afghani style knocking off years the pace has gone to trundler level speed that's what happens when you start getting old, so to cover this up they have created this not fully recovered from injury drama, pcb medical negligence overbowled and captaincy drama.

Basically he's washed up and is only going to deteriorate not get better.

21 yrs old falcon parvaz 😄
Click to expand...
He should still be at peak, he’s probably still younger than when Wahab was launching rockets.

I think its injuries and perhaps mental issues more than anything.
 
RyanRyan10 said:
There is a thread on this site where it's mentioned that he considers Wasim Akram his childhood hero. Wasim played his last game when Shaheen was 2 years and 11 months old.
Click to expand...
Must be a smart baby to be able to visualise cricket at 2 years of age
 
Shaheen and Siraj both are hit and miss bowlers. But Shaheen did had a better and more entertaining start to his career with a lot of promise. Siraj is capable of running through attacks too like he did in Gabba or Lords( both match winning second innings performance) but he also has knock of producing very ordinary spells.

As of today, I will pick Shaheen over Siraj. But I am not very opportunistic of Pakistani bowlers longevity so Siraj has a chance to go past him.
 
Ab Fan said:
Shaheen and Siraj both are hit and miss bowlers. But Shaheen did had a better and more entertaining start to his career with a lot of promise. Siraj is capable of running through attacks too like he did in Gabba or Lords( both match winning second innings performance) but he also has knock of producing very ordinary spells.

As of today, I will pick Shaheen over Siraj. But I am not very opportunistic of Pakistani bowlers longevity so Siraj has a chance to go past him.
Click to expand...
You will pick shaheen over siraj as of today? Huh? Based of what?
 
From being compared to the GOAT Bumrah to being dropped from the home Test against Bangladesh, I don't think any bowler has declined as rapidly as Afridi.
 
Ab Fan said:
Shaheen and Siraj both are hit and miss bowlers. But Shaheen did had a better and more entertaining start to his career with a lot of promise. Siraj is capable of running through attacks too like he did in Gabba or Lords( both match winning second innings performance) but he also has knock of producing very ordinary spells.

As of today, I will pick Shaheen over Siraj. But I am not very opportunistic of Pakistani bowlers longevity so Siraj has a chance to go past him.
Click to expand...
Siraj has made significant contributions in test wins in Aus. That is more than Shaheens entire test career.
 
Kaptan said:
From being compared to the GOAT Bumrah to being dropped from the home Test against Bangladesh, I don't think any bowler has declined as rapidly as Afridi.
Click to expand...

Most Pakistani bowlers don't shine beyond 10-20 tests anyway. It was always coming.

Not since Waqar Younis (debut 1989) have Pakistan produced a fast bowler who has played 50 tests and taken 200 wickets. Nothing to do with them being a non big 3 nation either. Refer Kemar Roach, Tim Southee etc.
 
Varun said:
Most Pakistani bowlers don't shine beyond 10-20 tests anyway. It was always coming.

Not since Waqar Younis (debut 1989) have Pakistan produced a fast bowler who has played 50 tests and taken 200 wickets. Nothing to do with them being a non big 3 nation either. Refer Kemar Roach, Tim Southee etc.
Click to expand...

Shoaib was decent 175 odd wickets avg 24ish
 
GLORY OF '92 said:
Shoaib was decent 175 odd wickets avg 24ish
Click to expand...

Yep. But for a country which claims such a rich fast bowling legacy (mainly only W and W, but I'll let it slide), it's astounding how decades have flown without the 50 test/200 wicket mark has been broken.

They all come and go - Mohammad Sami - Umar Gul - Mohammad Amir - Junaid Khan - now Shaheen Afridi. And countless others in between.
 
trolling very slightly but fact is Bumrah is the best in business & Shaheen at his knee level
 
Arshdeep in the last 2-3 yrs has had the same or better returns as Shaheen, bowled the difficult overs and also probably bowled at the same average pace.
 
GLORY OF '92 said:
Shoaib was decent 175 odd wickets avg 24ish
Click to expand...
25.69 to be precise. But that's not something that matters. Here are his numbers against the 2 best batting line ups of his time, Australia and India.


Australia -

Innings - 17; Wickets - 31; Ave - 35.64; SR - 56.4


India -

Innings - 16; Wickets - 28; Ave - 34.50; SR - 61.9
 
Hitman said:
25.69 to be precise. But that's not something that matters. Here are his numbers against the 2 best batting line ups of his time, Australia and India.


Australia -

Innings - 17; Wickets - 31; Ave - 35.64; SR - 56.4


India -

Innings - 16; Wickets - 28; Ave - 34.50; SR - 61.9
Click to expand...
But even more than that, his career is defined when he cried like a little child to his captain in the 2003 WC match against India after taken to the cleaners by Tendulkar saying, "Mere se bowling nahi ho rahi hain".
 
Shaheen's stock has fallen drastically. Only a matter of time when he has no takers in the T20 circuit and he will have to toil in the domestic circuit to desperately find a spot in the national team again.
 
Varun said:
Yep. But for a country which claims such a rich fast bowling legacy (mainly only W and W, but I'll let it slide), it's astounding how decades have flown without the 50 test/200 wicket mark has been broken.

They all come and go - Mohammad Sami - Umar Gul - Mohammad Amir - Junaid Khan - now Shaheen Afridi. And countless others in between.
Click to expand...

Yes no doubt
Hitman said:
25.69 to be precise. But that's not something that matters. Here are his numbers against the 2 best batting line ups of his time, Australia and India.


Australia -

Innings - 17; Wickets - 31; Ave - 35.64; SR - 56.4


India -

Innings - 16; Wickets - 28; Ave - 34.50; SR - 61.9
Click to expand...

Not the worst considering Australia were the ATG side.

Also Indian line up was insane and he has won a few Tests against India for us.
 
Sardarji made a casual comment and it worked few months later. Must be telling his friends vekheya? Mae keha si k nahi? :bhajji
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Devadwal said:
Because we have better option than him . it's doesn't mean that Siraj is rubbish. :kp
Click to expand...
I think he is penalized for his Test performance in Australia. Siraj was ICC ranked no.5 before England series. He definitely needs a break. If anything Shami should also take a break for Test series. He is not fully fit yet. India should play Rana and Arshdeep.
 
Hitman said:
25.69 to be precise. But that's not something that matters. Here are his numbers against the 2 best batting line ups of his time, Australia and India.


Australia -

Innings - 17; Wickets - 31; Ave - 35.64; SR - 56.4


India -

Innings - 16; Wickets - 28; Ave - 34.50; SR - 61.9
Click to expand...
Pretty average tbh in a more bowling friendly era and I like shoaib alot

Maybe I have been overrating him too
 
Siraj is a bang-on average bowler who is being carried by Bumrah. Take Bumrah out of that attack and you will see Siraj get exposed. India need to start investing in Harshit Rana. He is younger and has more upside than Siraj, who is a throwback to 90s steady-eddy Indian medium-pacers.
 
Hitman said:
25.69 to be precise. But that's not something that matters. Here are his numbers against the 2 best batting line ups of his time, Australia and India.


Australia -

Innings - 17; Wickets - 31; Ave - 35.64; SR - 56.4


India -

Innings - 16; Wickets - 28; Ave - 34.50; SR - 61.9
Click to expand...
These numbers are not good but I'll take impactful performances over stats any day of the week. And Shoaib's spell in the 1999 Kolkata test will always be remembered when you talk about iconic India-Pakistan moments. He also averages 24.47 in India, which is pretty good.

Against Australia his record his poor, although even against them he bent his back to bowl some fantastic, fast spells in unhospitable conditions.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
These numbers are not good but I'll take impactful performances over stats any day of the week. And Shoaib's spell in the 1999 Kolkata test will always be remembered when you talk about iconic India-Pakistan moments. He also averages 24.47 in India, which is pretty good.

Against Australia his record his poor, although even against them he bent his back to bowl some fantastic, fast spells in unhospitable conditions.
Click to expand...
LOL, even Ajit Agarkar has a 6 wicket haul in Australia that came in a victory, even though he averages 39 overall against Australia, and 35 in Australia.

Champions perform against the best teams instead of relying on excuses.
 
Hitman said:
LOL, even Ajit Agarkar has a 6 wicket haul in Australia that came in a victory, even though he averages 39 overall against Australia, and 35 in Australia.

Champions perform against the best teams instead of relying on excuses.
Click to expand...
I think you have trouble reading. I just said that Shoaib averages 24.47 in India. You see that as an excuse?

Also, comparing Agarkar to Shoaib is like comparing a rickshaw to a muscle car.
 
I believe in Mohammad Siraj. The guy bowls his heart out. It’s true he’s not the same impact bowler every time he bowls like Bumrah is but when it’s his day he’s a total match winner.

SSA has declined from being the top white ball fast bowler in the world to among the mediocre ones with occasional match winning spells with the new ball. See him off for 2 overs and he becomes half the bowler.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
Also, comparing Agarkar to Shoaib is like comparing a rickshaw to a muscle car.
Click to expand...
Fair analogy but here is another way of looking at it, a Honda/ Toyota might give you a great return on your buck as it has great mileage and low maintenance and long-lasting.

A Ferrari might become a white elephant as you can’t really drive it on crowded roads, high maintenance and a really specialized/occasion vehicle and more about show off if you look at it practically.

That’s exactly how both their respective returns to their respective teams looks like.

Agarkar for what’s it’s worth has won a test in Aus for his team and is a WT20 winner and a wc finalist.

Akthar is a wc finalist and has the fastest delivery which if if I remember correctly didn’t even fetch a wicket.

Maximizing a lot out of less is also a win.
 
Bhaijaan said:
I believe in Mohammad Siraj. The guy bowls his heart out. It’s true he’s not the same impact bowler every time he bowls like Bumrah is but when it’s his day he’s a total match winner.

SSA has declined from being the top white ball fast bowler in the world to among the mediocre ones with occasional match winning spells with the new ball. See him off for 2 overs and he becomes half the bowler.
Click to expand...

Siraj Bhai is a happy character, one of my fav Indian cricketers.

As an Indian I never thought Bumrah, Siraj, Shami, Arshdeep, Hardik Pandya (bowling) will be my top favs over the superstar batsmen. Than add exciting mystery spinners like Kuldeep, Varun

Maybe we are the new bowling powerhouse :akhtar
 
Oh noo, we are dying for Harbajhans acknowledgement here.
 
RedwoodOriginal said:
Siraj is a bang-on average bowler who is being carried by Bumrah. Take Bumrah out of that attack and you will see Siraj get exposed. India need to start investing in Harshit Rana. He is younger and has more upside than Siraj, who is a throwback to 90s steady-eddy Indian medium-pacers.
Click to expand...
He was good at the start with good pace. He even clocked 145k. But he became a workhorse since India abandoned the 4 pacer policy. When India had 4 pacers workload was managed more effectively. Not even Aussies couldn't handle workload. Look at Cummins. After 5 test series took a break.Siraj played 9 tests in 2 or 3 months
 
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