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India v Pakistan | 1st Test | Delhi | 22/11/07 | Day 1

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Hopefully we can play Harby a bit better than we've played the others. At least we've had a good chance to see him in the one day series.
 
74 for 3 at lunch

That session just about edged by India. I think we lost one wicket more than we would have liked. But we still have a well set Mohammad Yousuf and with Misbah, Malik and Kamran a bit of batting to come.

Let's hope we can have a good post lunch session.
 
And its lunch. 1st session easily to India, but Pakistan are no where near out of this. Yousuf looks in great touch, they still have Misbah, and the captain, Malik. Also, Akmal has a great track record against India down the order.

300 looks quite possible.
 
Touching 300 looks tough since not much batting to come.

Let's see what these gentlemen can do.
 
W63L35 said:
You can differ as much as you want...but your comment was "Pakistan is better on paper".....and let me show why thats not right.

Pak Batting:

Code: 
[B]Players Mat Inns   NO 	Runs 	 HS 	 Ave 	100	50	 0 [/B]
Kaneria 48    65   31	 256	 29	 7.52	 0	 0	20
Kamran	35    59    4	1695	154	30.81	 4	 7	 8
Misbah	8     12    0	 207	 41	17.25	 0	 0	 0
Sami 	30    46   11	 382	 49	10.91	 0	 0	 8
Yousuf 	76   128   10	6641	223	56.27	23	28	 8
Salman	16    30    0	 850	122	28.33	 2	 4	 4
Akhtar	43    63   12	 541	 47	10.60	 0	 0	10
Malik	20    33    5	1065	148* 	38.03	 1	 6	 2
Sohail  0      -    - 	 - 	 - 	- 	 - 	 - 	 - 
Yasir  	20    39    3	1292	170	36.87	 2	 8	 0
Younis 	55    99    6	4556	267	48.98	14	19	10

Indian batting
Code: 
[B]Players     Mat   Inns  NO    Runs  HS    Ave  	100	 50	 0 [/B]
Dhoni 	     20	   32	 4    1019  148	 36.39	 1	  6	 1
R Dravid    112	  191	23    9492  270	 56.50	24	 48	 6
Ganguly      96	  155	14    5812  173	 41.21	13	 29	 9
Harbhajan    57	   79	18     986   66	 16.16	 0	  2	11
W Jaffer     22	   41	 1    1391  212	 34.77	 4	  8	 5
Karthik      16	   24	 1     816  129	 35.47	 1	  6	 0
Z Khan 	     50	   66	16     608   75	 12.16	 0	  1	17
A Kumble    118	  152	30    2212  110* 18.13	 1	  4	15
Laxman 	     83	  135	16    5083  281  42.71	10	 29	 9
MM Patel      7	    9	 3	32   13	  5.33	 0	  0	 3
Tendulkar   140   226	23   11150  248* 54.92	37	 45	13
India-Total 721  1110  149   38601  270	 40.17	91	178	89

Total Batting averages of BOTH teams;
Code: 
 	  [B]  Mat  Inns  NO   Runs   HS 	 Ave 	100  50	 0[/B]
Pak-Total   351	 574   82   17485  267	35.54	46   72	70
India-Total 721 1110  149   38601  270	40.17	91  178	89
Pakistan team has scored less than half of the runs that Indian team has scored. Dravid and Sachin has scored more runs than whole Pak team!

Lets compare both bowling on the paper now;
Code: 
[B]Pak 	 Mat 	Overs 	Mdns 	Runs 	Wkts 	Ave 	5      10[/B]
Kaneria  48	2324	442	6830	208	32.83	12	2
Kamran	 35	  - 	  - 	- 	 - 	- 	 - 	- 
Misbah	  8	  - 	  - 	- 	 - 	- 	 - 	- 
Sami 	 30	1042	171	3686	 77	47.87	 2	0
Yousuf 	 76	   1	  0	   3	  0	- 	 0	0
Salman	 16	   4	  0	  18	  0	- 	 0	0
Akhtar	 43	1259.2	220	4276	169	25.30	12	2
Malik	 20	 251.1	 37	 871	 13	67.00	 0	0
Sohail    0	   - 	 - 	   - 	  - 	- 	 - 	- 
Yasir  	 20	   1	  0	   5	  0	- 	 0	0
Younis 	 55	  48	  7	 189	  2	94.50	 0	0
Code: 
[B]India     Mat	 Overs 	 Mdns 	 Runs 	Wkts 	Ave 	 5     10[/B]
Dhoni 	   20	    1	    0	   13	   0	- 	 0	0
R Dravid  112	   20	    4	   39	   1	39.00	 0	0
Ganguly    96	  451.2    95	 1506	  28	53.78	 0	0
Harbhajan  57	 2527	  520	 7108	 238	29.86	19	4
W Jaffer   22	   11	    3	   18	   2	 9.00	 0	0
Karthik    16	  - 	   - 	   - 	  - 	- 	 - 	- 
Z Khan 	   50	 1621	  336	 5339	 160	33.36	 5	0
A Kumble  118	 6117	 1464	16262	 566	28.73	33	8
Laxman 	   83	   43	   10	  105	   1   105.00	 0	0
MM Patel    7	  250.1	   54	  725	  25	29.00	 0	0
Tendulkar 140	  619.4	   79	 2135	  42	50.83	 0	0

Code: 
	 [B] Mat 	Overs 	Mdns 	Runs 	Wkts 	Ave 	5      10[/B]
Ind Tot	  721	11661.1	 2565	33250	1063	31.28	57     12
Pak Tot	  351	 4930.3	  877   15878	 469	33.86	26	4

Just Kumble has more wickets than the whole Pak team. Just like runs, Pak team has less than half of the wickets taken by India.

..and by the way, Indian team has taken 608 catches while Pak team has 308.

Still think Pak team is better than India on paper?
Click to expand...


not trying to be stubborn here, or trying to go against you for the sake of proving my point, "looking at teams on paper" has a whole different meaning to me than what it is to you I believe, absolutely not saying that your way of looking at teams on paper is wrong, that's one way of looking at it, but those stats of india are not completely against us, Indian team has taken 608 catches, are those all against us? ditto for batting and bowling averages as well, now you can dig in and find out head to head stats for these two teams specifically, and even those could prove that indian players have better stats, but to me it does not prove anything, cause kumble took most of his wickets against a different pakistani team, and this pakistani team is different, by looking at the paper, you can also matter things like "kumble has been absent from cricket for quite some time"
now let's take test cricket, I think most of you guys might believe that batting wins matches, and you can look at the paper and see which team has better batting line up and go from there, people think differently. I am simply looking at these both teams "on paper" in terms of which team has better bowling, cause to me, bowling wins matches in test cricket, now you can disagree with that as well, and that would be completely okay, cause that's the way you think, and I have all the respect for your views and the way you analyze stuff, all I am trying to say is that people can compare and look at teams on paper in different ways, and that could be
skills, stats(just like you did), bowlers recent averages or skills(ditto for batting), fielding, catching abilities and etc etc.
In basketball, I don't know if you have heard of Toronto Raptors, they are said to be an unbelievable team on paper, and 80% of their players have only played 1-3 years, see stats don't come into play here, but still most of the Tv commentators say that Raptors are a good team on paper, that's because they are looking at it in a different way.
BTW thanks for the stats, It definitely made some interesting reading and allowed me to look at these teams in a different manner as well. :)
 
Last edited:
Caved12 said:
not trying to be stubborn here, or trying to go against you for the sake of proving my point, "looking at teams on paper" has a whole different meaning to me than what it is to you I believe, absolutely not saying that your way of looking at teams on paper is wrong, that's one way of looking at it, but those stats of india are not completely against us, Indian team has taken 608 catches, are those all against us? ditto for batting and bowling averages as well, now you can dig in and find out head to head stats for these two teams specifically, and even those could prove that indian players have better stats, but to me it does not prove anything, cause kumble took most of his wickets against a different pakistani team, and this pakistani team is different, by looking at the paper, you can also matter things like "kumble has been absent from cricket for quite some time"
now let's take test cricket, I think most of you guys might believe that batting wins matches, and you can look at the paper and see which team has better batting line up and go from there, people think differently. I am simply looking at these both teams "on paper" in terms of which team has better bowling, cause to me, bowling wins matches in test cricket, now you can disagree with that as well, and that would be completely okay, cause that's the way you think, and I have all the respect for your views and the way you analyze stuff, all I am trying to say is that people can compare and look at teams on paper in different ways, and that could be
skills, stats(just like you did), bowlers recent averages or skills(ditto for batting), fielding, catching abilities and etc etc.
In basketball, I don't know if you have heard of Toronto Raptors, they are said to be an unbelievable team on paper, and 80% of their players have only played 1-3 years, see stats don't come into play here, but still most of the Tv commentators say that Raptors are a good team on paper, that's because they are looking at it in a different way.
BTW thanks for the stats, It definitely made some interesting reading and allowed me to look at these teams in a different manner as well. :)
Click to expand...

just forget "on paper".. and everything in the world will be easy.
 
lolz.....pakistan need Misbah and Yousuf to fight back for atleast until tea and make centuries. Easier said that done, but its better to hope then disbelieve.
 
shahidrazzaq said:
lolz.....pakistan need Misbah and Yousuf to fight back for atleast until tea and make centuries. Easier said that done, but its better to hope then disbelieve.
Click to expand...

first session of the 1st morning of a test is always a little difficult to bat....regardless of the pitch.

This next session is crucial for us. If we can get through it without losing a wicket or maybe losing 1 tops then we will be on course.
 
Hash said:
first session of the 1st morning of a test is always a little difficult to bat....regardless of the pitch.

This next session is crucial for us. If we can get through it without losing a wicket or maybe losing 1 tops then we will be on course.
Click to expand...

What do you reckon is a good score on this surface?
 
ogredastur said:
What do you reckon is a good score on this surface?
Click to expand...
Its not the old delhi pitch. Its a relaid wicket. Looks flattish but will take longer to crack. Its november in Delhi so expect a bit for faster bowlers in first session every day. Second seesion will be best for batting and third will have some light related issues etc.. 4th and fifth day, it will become even lower and slower.. Whoever doesnt score 400 on this pitch in first inings will lose the match. India has to take min 100 runs lead in order to win else they will lose. Result look a good probablity.
 
ogredastur said:
What do you reckon is a good score on this surface?
Click to expand...

I don't know since I haven't seen the pitch....at work.

But by all accounts it is going to crumble as the game goes on. So if we can get to 325+ I will be happy.
 
Ganguly was useful like this in England. I didnt believe he would be so in India.. wow, He has bowled well so far I believe.. Pace isnt everything as they say..
 
Come on, Ganguly is just bowling stump to stump, he has a bit of movement there is no way whe should have lost a wicket to him. Our poor batting and shot selection has been the reason for this dismal display...As usual the Pak batsman make avergae bowling seem unplayable..
 
If anything this is a clear oppertunity for the Misbah, Malik and Akmal to actually show themselves as worthy players ...

i think we should be able to get around 220~250 ...
 
overlord said:
If anything this is a clear oppertunity for the Misbah, Malik and Akmal to actually show themselves as worthy players ...

i think we should be able to get around 220~250 ...
Click to expand...
Yeah.. in the past they hardly got a bat since the first 4 were enough till declration..
 
250 is distance away and that is by no means enough on this pancake track...Guys this is a batting wicket it is not Headingly
 
30.5 Patel to Shoaib Malik, no run, Malik chooses to stay in his crease and block a good length ball from off and middle stump, that kept a bit low on Malik

not the first ball which has kept low. All is not lost. This will happen more and more as the game progresses.
 
Kumble's gamble with Ganguly has paid of. Overall I think he is using his bowling resources well. Too early to comment though.

The test match could as well be on Mars - with the brown haze and all that. Somewhat surreal.
 
Re-Verse said:
250 is distance away and that is by no means enough on this pancake track...Guys this is a batting wicket it is not Headingly
Click to expand...

It's not enough but it keeps us in the game....especially since India will have to bat 4th.
 
UsmanhailsAfridi said:
what a joke performance up to this point....making the indians look likke the best attack in the world
Click to expand...

It has nothing to do with Indian attack being best or worst.. Pakistanis always lose a wicket every 20-30 runs.. irrespective of opposition, irespective of pitch.. Only exception being Inzi/MoYo and only against India YK.. Rest of the story has no twists generally.. rarely yes but thats cricket for you.
 
the worst part is that PAK could easily have been 6 or 7 down....all the 50 50 calls have gone PAK's way.
 
Munaf Patel finally gets a wicket - Shoaib Malik gone!

NOW Pakistan is in deep trouble. Unless someone like Tanvir surprises everyone.
 
Time for a Kamran special ala Mohali and Karachi
 
Khatmal on the crease to bite India.. Guys Tanvir will be figured out.. here is the pain part for us.. this last hurdle we always find hard to cross..
 
malik out for 0...in his first test match for captain...hmmm...83 for 5...and watch as soon as the indians land on the pitch to bat ....it will be the easiest pitch to bat on

i have a question...is this test match in south africa somewhere?
 
In Karachi 2006 we were 39 for 6 and won by 340 odd runs

we will win this test too....maybe not by 340 runs but we will win.
 
wickets are falling like it is a 15 overs tape tennis game minus slogs and deadly hitting.
 
Well this is just sad. Our batsman have shown no resolve whatsoever. Kamran Akmal now has yet another chance to save his career. The last time he had that oppurtunity, he was pitiful. Get it together boy, we need you.
 
Guys its no suprise. India to win this series easily. Pakistan have forgotten there only chance, and sent him home (Afridi). I knew this would happen.
 
UsmanhailsAfridi said:
malik out for 0...in his first test match for captain...hmmm...83 for 5...and watch as soon as the indians land on the pitch to bat ....it will be the easiest pitch to bat on

i have a question...is this test match in south africa somewhere?
Click to expand...
say what now?
 
Hash said:
In Karachi 2006 we were 39 for 6 and won by 340 odd runs

we will win this test too....maybe not by 340 runs but we will win.
Click to expand...
History often repeats.. Afridi did so recently in Kanpur too..
 
aussiecricketer said:
Guys its no suprise. India to win this series easily. Pakistan have forgotten there only chance, and sent him home (Afridi). I knew this would happen.
Click to expand...

The guy playing ahead of Afridi is the only one currently showing some resolve and commitment
 
ganguly's pitch grouping is mcgrath-eque.. the pakistani batsmen have not forced him to stray..the are treating him like mcgrath.. poor batting more then anything..
 
aussiecricketer said:
Guys its no suprise. India to win this series easily. Pakistan have forgotten there only chance, and sent him home (Afridi). I knew this would happen.
Click to expand...
:))) When the most successful batsman in the Test circuit at the moment (Yousuf) struggles, you know a guy like Afridi would be a walking-wicket !
 
JosheelaKaptan said:
History often repeats.. Afridi did so recently in Kanpur too..
Click to expand...

Well we were also 26 for 6 against India in Calcutta 99 test match......and we won that test.

So it did repeat itself in Karachi.
 
This is unbelievable, we can't even give our bowlers something something to play with.
 
India need to focus here ... Should not get carried away ... Hope they have the memories of 39/5 and 26/5 ! No way can they relax ... They should relentlessly push forward for the wickets and wrap up the innings for less than 200 ...
 
invincible said:
India need to focus here ... Should not get carried away ... Hope they have the memories of 39/5 and 26/5 ! No way can they relax ... They should relentlessly push forward for the wickets and wrap up the innings for less than 200 ...
Click to expand...

both were for 6! :D
 
I dont think India also will fare much better. There is something in the pitch. Partly contributed by the low temp and haze. Pak quickies can be quite a handful.

Will this match pack up by Day 4?
 
invincible said:
:))) When the most successful batsman in the Test circuit at the moment (Yousuf) struggles, you know a guy like Afridi would be a walking-wicket !
Click to expand...
:))) Or maybe he gets a quick 30. Which would really help the Pak cause. Better than having a team apart from Yousuf that can't bat right?
 
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