Is time up for match/spot fixers under Ramiz Raja's reign?

[MenInG]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">So Umar Akmal officially makes it to the list of idiots! Banned for 3 years. What a waste of a talent! It’s high time that Pakistan moved towards passing a legislative law against match fixing. Behind bars is where such jack ***** belong! Otherwise brave for more!!</p>— Ramiz Raja (@iramizraja) <a href="https://twitter.com/iramizraja/status/1254742858051080192?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 27, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

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"I was shell-shocked when Mohammad Amir had returned to international cricket. I know that he was young and was misled whatever the reason may be but even before that we had a lot of dangerous examples that should have made them realize that they should have never done this. Maybe you can be forgiven in a one-off scenario but even that does not have a scope in my book. In these 150 players, if you say that let the person who has made a mistake be forgiven then you have this dirt (accused player) among them who have played their cricket very honestly then what message are you trying to convey?", asked a puzzled Ramiz Raja while interacting with Aakash Chopra on his Youtube channel.

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"I have observed that the tainted players who were punished in England, they have come here (Pakistan) and have become experts on news channels. My blood boils when they talk about cricket and integrity. One or two current players have raised their voices on Sharjeel Khan's return. My question is what is the fault of the people who are standing in line and waiting for their chances? The tainted player comes back and also jumps the queue and everyone starts showering praise on his talent as if he has not made any mistake.

Had I been in a powerful position at this moment then the question of their comeback would have never arisen in the first place", he added.

https://www.republicworld.com/sports-news/cricket-news/ramiz-raja-lashes-out-at-pcb.html

 

[Junaids]

Don’t forget Ed Hawkins’ book “Bookie Gambler Fixer Spy”.

He alleged that the batsmen in the 2011 World Cup semi-final threw the run chase at Chandigarh against India.

The players still active are Hafeez, Shafiq and Misbah who scored slowly, and Umar Akmal who kept up with the run rate.

I try to assume that we have not identified all the fixers.

 

[Shoaibbtt]

Don’t forget Ed Hawkins’ book “Bookie Gambler Fixer Spy”.

He alleged that the batsmen in the 2011 World Cup semi-final threw the run chase at Chandigarh against India.

The players still active are Hafeez, Shafiq and Misbah who scored slowly, and Umar Akmal who kept up with the run rate.

I try to assume that we have not identified all the fixers.

What is it with you and Umar Akmal? He was the most mediocre cricketer of all time.

 

[rockyboy2018]

in Islam, there is also even a concept of blood money. It is not either black or white. Muhammad Amir came back after serving his sentence. You can not judge him based on his past record. The sad reality is, the upcoming players can not even qualify for club-level cricket let alone representing Pakistan. We have no other option apart from relying on past players. Whatever Ramiz is talking about integrity is going out of the window if Imran Khan(his boss) just tell him to select Muhammad Amir and Sharjeel Khan. Integrity and Pakistanis should not go hand in hand in the same breadth. It is all about power who holds it.

 

[Shoaibbtt]

In regards to all the negative this is the one thing i will applaud Ramiz on which is tightening the stranglehold on match fixers and closing the road for any return. Fixers need to know such things should have zero tolerance and i for one support this.

 

[cricketAXEpert]

Mohd Amir's return caused every fixer to say that he deserves a comeback. Especially the retired lot looking for coaching jobs like Salim Malik, Danish Kaneria etc.

 

[Major]

Ths is the one thing i like rameez raja for. Rest of the decisions were pathetic

 

[daytrader]

It'll be great if he cracks down on this. Let's see if he walks the talk

 

[captain.hansolo]

How prevalent is match fixing? Or spot fixing? Especially at the higher tiers of the game? I imagine with the bigger paychecks that these players receive, the lure of the fixing money is curtailed…?

 

[Junaids]

What is it with you and Umar Akmal? He was the most mediocre cricketer of all time.

I was not drawing attention to Umar Akmal.

I was pointing out that a published book - which did not result in the subjects suing for libel - pointed the finger at the Pakistan batsmen at Chandigarh. And one of them, whom I am not accusing of impropriety, has already lost his job since Rameez took over.

I have never considered any of the players in that World Cup semi-final to be "innocent" of matchfixing. I consider all of them to have "not been proven to be guilty".

Personally, on the basis of the Hawkins book I would never have allowed any of those players to occupy a leadership position in Pakistan cricket.

If the book is true - and Hawkins says that he was given a script of the Pakistan innings at the innings break, and the innings followed the pre-written script - then none of those players can be considered to be above suspicion.

And it's a matter of record that two of them went on to captain Pakistan, and one went on to coach Pakistan.

 

[Shoaibbtt]

I was not drawing attention to Umar Akmal.

I was pointing out that a published book - which did not result in the subjects suing for libel - pointed the finger at the Pakistan batsmen at Chandigarh. And one of them, whom I am not accusing of impropriety, has already lost his job since Rameez took over.

I have never considered any of the players in that World Cup semi-final to be "innocent" of matchfixing. I consider all of them to have "not been proven to be guilty".

Personally, on the basis of the Hawkins book I would never have allowed any of those players to occupy a leadership position in Pakistan cricket.

If the book is true - and Hawkins says that he was given a script of the Pakistan innings at the innings break, and the innings followed the pre-written script - then none of those players can be considered to be above suspicion.

And it's a matter of record that two of them went on to captain Pakistan, and one went on to coach Pakistan.

You’ve completely avoided the question

 

[iniqbal223]

I am all for RR tough stance against Fixers;

Then he should clean the mess first with his own dear friend Wasim Akram (who held multiple positions within PCB, PSL)..
He was the one who did not get any punishment but leniency

On the other hand, RR's concern about Amir,Sharjeel should be last as they are the ones who served the punishment

 

[shamaan]

The only thing that looks promising is that he will take a stance on match fixers.

 

[Junaids]

The only thing that looks promising is that he will take a stance on match fixers.

I would draw your attention to the fact that the PCB's own Tribunal which convicted Sharjeel Khan wrote in its report that there was no evidence whatsoever to convict him, and that he was convicted because Najam Sethi told them to convict him.

The Sharjeel Khan case was the most comical travesty of sporting justice that I have ever seen.

 

[shamaan]

I would draw your attention to the fact that the PCB's own Tribunal which convicted Sharjeel Khan wrote in its report that there was no evidence whatsoever to convict him, and that he was convicted because Najam Sethi told them to convict him.

The Sharjeel Khan case was the most comical travesty of sporting justice that I have ever seen.

My statement was general obviously thier needs to be evidence such as Amir came

 

[Junaids]

My statement was general obviously thier needs to be evidence such as Amir came

That's a fair point, but it raises the injustice of what happened with Mohammad Asif, who is too old to return.

There is evidence by which Amir and Butt were convicted - marked bank notes in their safes, SMS traffic and actual testimony.

In the case of Asif, even the ICC accepted that he repeatedly rejected the request to bowl no balls, and that eventually he agreed to bowl one as a favour to his agent, for which he was neither offered nor received payment.

The ICC Tribunal wrote that while they had to find him guilty and give him the minimum 5 year ban (just as they would have had to if Brendon McCullum has admitted at the time to not reporting the alleged Chris Cairns corrupt approach), they recommended that if he committed no further offences he in particular should be welcomed back to cricket after 5 years.

Asif's offence was massively less serious than Amir's and Butt's, yet the more guilty fast bowler was allowed to return.

 

[shamaan]

That's a fair point, but it raises the injustice of what happened with Mohammad Asif, who is too old to return.

There is evidence by which Amir and Butt were convicted - marked bank notes in their safes, SMS traffic and actual testimony.

In the case of Asif, even the ICC accepted that he repeatedly rejected the request to bowl no balls, and that eventually he agreed to bowl one as a favour to his agent, for which he was neither offered nor received payment.

The ICC Tribunal wrote that while they had to find him guilty and give him the minimum 5 year ban (just as they would have had to if Brendon McCullum has admitted at the time to not reporting the alleged Chris Cairns corrupt approach), they recommended that if he committed no further offences he in particular should be welcomed back to cricket after 5 years.

Asif's offence was massively less serious than Amir's and Butt's, yet the more guilty fast bowler was allowed to return.

But he stil ended up bowling no balls even if he was reluctant.he didn't make a come back due to his age whilst at stil had time on his side.

 

[Buffet]

The only thing that looks promising is that he will take a stance on match fixers.

If he does that then it will go a long way to have an impact on future generations.

 

[Junaids]

Hawkins received a script at the innings break, which he forwarded to the journalist Geoffrey Riddle BEFORE Pakistan started their run chase.

It read “Pakistan will cruise to 100, then lose two quick wickets, at 150 they will be five down and will crumble and lose by a margin of over 20 runs”.

If you read the scorecard, it’s obvious who must have been involved. And terrifying as well as obvious.

And the fact that Hawkins sent a time stamped email to Riddle before the innings started is the Smoking Gun that the PCB never had against Sharjeel Khan.

 

[pakistanigoneaussie]

This has to be codified or stated policy

Otherwise it’s just fluff and giving false hope to people who have served their suspensions

 

[NishanKonar]

If Ramiz Raja walks the talk on fixers , he will do a great service to Pakistan cricket in the long term

I have a feeling even today a lot of Pakistani fans do not really understand the gravity of the issue of match fixing. even seen fans here saying Steve Smith's sandpaper incident is worse than Amir & Sharjeel 's match fixing

 

[Junaids]

If Ramiz Raja walks the talk on fixers , he will do a great service to Pakistan cricket in the long term

I have a feeling even today a lot of Pakistani fans do not really understand the gravity of the issue of match fixing. even seen fans here saying Steve Smith's sandpaper incident is worse than Amir & Sharjeel 's match fixing

How can he? The biggest fish got away with it, in all major countries including Pakistan.

There is no point subjecting Mohammad Amir to Triple Jeopardy when every single batsman from Chandigarh got away scot free.

 

[shaz619]

How can he? The biggest fish got away with it, in all major countries including Pakistan.

There is no point subjecting Mohammad Amir to Triple Jeopardy when every single batsman from Chandigarh got away scot free.

Those batsman were not convicted though unlike Amir, you and your conspiracy theories

Going back to Umar Akmal, he is not worth any attention, rubbish batsman and mentally disturbed bloke

 

[NishanKonar]

How can he? The biggest fish got away with it, in all major countries including Pakistan.

There is no point subjecting Mohammad Amir to Triple Jeopardy when every single batsman from Chandigarh got away scot free.

That Mohali 2011 was typical Pakistani batting ineptitude while chasing in big games. Nothing fishy about it

 

[JibranAnsari]

Hopefully , there should be zero tolerence.

 

[Major]

How can he? The biggest fish got away with it, in all major countries including Pakistan.

There is no point subjecting Mohammad Amir to Triple Jeopardy when every single batsman from Chandigarh got away scot free.

Plz bring actualy proof or just stop.

I dont understand why you have to make 5-10 post of the same thing in a single thread. We heard you the first time, if you have proof post it here and forward it to the ascu.

 

[Buffet]

Hawkins received a script at the innings break, which he forwarded to the journalist Geoffrey Riddle BEFORE Pakistan started their run chase.

It read “Pakistan will cruise to 100, then lose two quick wickets, at 150 they will be five down and will crumble and lose by a margin of over 20 runs”.

If you read the scorecard, it’s obvious who must have been involved. And terrifying as well as obvious.

And the fact that Hawkins sent a time stamped email to Riddle before the innings started is the Smoking Gun that the PCB never had against Sharjeel Khan.

So it seems, Pakistan fixed all 250+ chases then because Pakistan was hardly able to chase 250+ in those days.

No one should start calling players fixers without proof.

 

[Major]

I would draw your attention to the fact that the PCB's own Tribunal which convicted Sharjeel Khan wrote in its report that there was no evidence whatsoever to convict him, and that he was convicted because Najam Sethi told them to convict him.

The Sharjeel Khan case was the most comical travesty of sporting justice that I have ever seen.

Doesnt work that way. Sharjeel could have gone on to appeal that decision if there wasnt any proof

 

[shamaan]

If he does that then it will go a long way to have an impact on future generations.

Hopefully it does have an impact

 

[Junaids]

Doesnt work that way. Sharjeel could have gone on to appeal that decision if there wasnt any proof

Absolutely not.

The PCB’s unofficial and unlawful extension of the Asif and Butt bans in defiance of the ICC Tribunal sent a very clear message:

“You will not get back in the team by being no longer banned. The only way back is to have senior PCB patronage. So if you appeal and win, we still won’t pick you.”

I wrote a thread about the PCB Tribunal Report about Sharjeel. The report explicitly acknowledges that there was zero evidence against him. The report explicitly acknowledges that the only reason the tribunal was passing a guilty verdict was because Sethi told them to find him guilty.

I think Sharjeel is a useless hack. But he is one of two Pakistanis - Umar Akmal was the other - to have received ludicrously unfair hearings by a kangaroo court of the PCB.

In any other country, the Court of Arbitration for Sport verdict in favour of Umar Akmal against the PCB would have been viewed as an utter humiliation for the board. But in Pakistan he is treated as if the verdict went the other way!

 

[IMMY69]

Don’t forget Ed Hawkins’ book “Bookie Gambler Fixer Spy”.

He alleged that the batsmen in the 2011 World Cup semi-final threw the run chase at Chandigarh against India.

The players still active are Hafeez, Shafiq and Misbah who scored slowly, and Umar Akmal who kept up with the run rate.

I try to assume that we have not identified all the fixers.

But both Hafeez and Shafiq scored their runs fairly quickly in the context of the game.

 

[Junaids]

But both Hafeez and Shafiq scored their runs fairly quickly in the context of the game.

I don’t think that Hafeez or Shafiq fixed that innings.

You need to view the four suspicious matches in 2009-11 in combination to arrive at any conclusions.

And you need to remember the prosecution’s testimony in the English court case: Amir, Asif and Butt were not part of the two (yes, TWO) fixing cliques in the Pakistan team in 2010. They were vulnerable to the News of the World sting precisely BECAUSE they were seeing their teammates lose matches for money.

And it wasn’t their lawyers who said so. It was the prosecution which said so.

The four ultra-suspicious matches to consider were:

The absurd first two Tests in Sri Lanka in 2009.

The Sydney Test in 2009-10 which Mazhar Majeed has confessed to fixing.

The 2011 World Cup semi-final.

Hafeez and Shafiq weren’t even regulars in the team in that era. They are not likely participants.

 

[IMMY69]

I don’t think that Hafeez or Shafiq fixed that innings.

You need to view the four suspicious matches in 2009-11 in combination to arrive at any conclusions.

And you need to remember the prosecution’s testimony in the English court case: Amir, Asif and Butt were not part of the two (yes, TWO) fixing cliques in the Pakistan team in 2010. They were vulnerable to the News of the World sting precisely BECAUSE they were seeing their teammates lose matches for money.

And it wasn’t their lawyers who said so. It was the prosecution which said so.

The four ultra-suspicious matches to consider were:

The absurd first two Tests in Sri Lanka in 2009.

The Sydney Test in 2009-10 which Mazhar Majeed has confessed to fixing.

The 2011 World Cup semi-final.

Hafeez and Shafiq weren’t even regulars in the team in that era. They are not likely participants.

IMHO the 2009 Sri Lankan tests were lost due to the backlash YK was getting as captain. It was around this time when groupings started to oust YK as captain. I don't think those tests were lost to make money, more so to get rid of YK... Of course the fixers may have decided to kill two birds with one stone (i.e. make some money by losing the tests and get of rid of YK too). However, I think that series had more to do with YK then fixing.

Sydney test was definitely suspicious. Once YK was ousted I think it was literally free for all.
This is why every time we lost in England in 2010 Butt would be asked at pressers whether YK and Moyo will be re-called and he would firmly dismiss this notion.

I'm not sure about the 2011 world cup semi final. When we're chasing a total we do often end up blowing it more often than not... in this case it was a semi final against the arch enemy so there was even more pressure then usual. Bit like the 2007 T20 final. We were a superb outfit in that tournament and favourites in many peoples eyes. Restricted India to a mediocre total on a good wicket and still ended up short.

 

[Varun]

I don’t think that Hafeez or Shafiq fixed that innings.

You need to view the four suspicious matches in 2009-11 in combination to arrive at any conclusions.

And you need to remember the prosecution’s testimony in the English court case: Amir, Asif and Butt were not part of the two (yes, TWO) fixing cliques in the Pakistan team in 2010. They were vulnerable to the News of the World sting precisely BECAUSE they were seeing their teammates lose matches for money.

And it wasn’t their lawyers who said so. It was the prosecution which said so.

The four ultra-suspicious matches to consider were:

The absurd first two Tests in Sri Lanka in 2009.

The Sydney Test in 2009-10 which Mazhar Majeed has confessed to fixing.

The 2011 World Cup semi-final.

Hafeez and Shafiq weren’t even regulars in the team in that era. They are not likely participants.

Who were these geniuses who paid money to Pakistani players to lose?

Clearly aren't too bright with their investments.

 

[Junaids]

IMHO the 2009 Sri Lankan tests were lost due to the backlash YK was getting as captain. It was around this time when groupings started to oust YK as captain. I don't think those tests were lost to make money, more so to get rid of YK... Of course the fixers may have decided to kill two birds with one stone (i.e. make some money by losing the tests and get of rid of YK too). However, I think that series had more to do with YK then fixing.

Sydney test was definitely suspicious. Once YK was ousted I think it was literally free for all.
This is why every time we lost in England in 2010 Butt would be asked at pressers whether YK and Moyo will be re-called and he would firmly dismiss this notion.

I'm not sure about the 2011 world cup semi final. When we're chasing a total we do often end up blowing it more often than not... in this case it was a semi final against the arch enemy so there was even more pressure then usual. Bit like the 2007 T20 final. We were a superb outfit in that tournament and favourites in many peoples eyes. Restricted India to a mediocre total on a good wicket and still ended up short.

Good post, but given what emerged in the London court I choose to view the Sri Lankan Tests as part of this.

Remember, multiple Pakistan and NZ players had joined the ICL, only for the BCCI to set up the IPL and drive them into international exclusion. In both countries there was a sense of injustice and a tendency to think “I need to do whatever I have to do to be financially secure”.

A dozen years on people hide behind considering Amir, Asif and Butt as the main fixers when even the court which sent them to jail recognised that they were cleaner than most of their team-mates.

It suits everyone to say “it was just them, there’s no proof against anyone else”.

But it’s complete nonsense. We have a fixer who has actually confessed to fixing the Sydney Test, for goodness sake!

 

[IMMY69]

Good post, but given what emerged in the London court I choose to view the Sri Lankan Tests as part of this.

Remember, multiple Pakistan and NZ players had joined the ICL, only for the BCCI to set up the IPL and drive them into international exclusion. In both countries there was a sense of injustice and a tendency to think “I need to do whatever I have to do to be financially secure”.

A dozen years on people hide behind considering Amir, Asif and Butt as the main fixers when even the court which sent them to jail recognised that they were cleaner than most of their team-mates.

It suits everyone to say “it was just them, there’s no proof against anyone else”.

But it’s complete nonsense. We have a fixer who has actually confessed to fixing the Sydney Test, for goodness sake!

I agree that fixing must have taken place before 2010. Although I wouldn't put it past then but it would have been extremely foolish to fix the 2011 Semi Final. It was such a big game on the world stage and so soon after the 2010 fixing fiasco. Having said that I wouldn't rule out some intervention at a higher level that determined the result snd yes this too is fixing, but just for money? I'm not so sure.

 

[iniqbal223]

Can Ramiz Not apply his PCB ban on Amir and Sharjeel retrospectively

Since these 2 already played for Pakistan, we dont need to dig the old grave
What he can do is make a policy where in future whoever gets caught becomes unavailable to play for Pakistan in future

Any thoughts?

 

[Rana]

This is a fair call.

 

[Hasan123]

Well he said he didn’t want fixers to represent Pakistan. Let’s see if he sticks to his words.

 

[ask_analyse_act]

Well he said he didn’t want fixers to represent Pakistan. Let’s see if he sticks to his words.

That would go a long way with Pakistan being fixers free...

 

[masterblaster]

We won't be seeing Sharjeel or Amir as long as Rambo is in charge. He was always against bringing them back into the team.
It also may be the end of Hafeez and Malik.
BUT anything can happen with Pakistan cricket.

 

[Savak]

Should RR backtrack on his fixer's stance as PCB Chairman?

It is one thing to be an individual with firm fixed opinions. But is it right for an individual who is the head of a Cricket Board to be bringing his personal opinions into policy matters i.e. someone involved in spot fixing will never play for Pakistan again especially if the players deserve to play on Cricketing Grounds.

No one is shedding any tears for Amir because the guy has been past it as a bowler for a number of years but no one can be blind to ignore Sharjeel's form with the bat.

Plus why one rule for Nawaz but another for Sharjeel?

 

[pratiktc]

Pak will lose nothing by not picking useless hacks like Sharjeel.

 

[NishanKonar]

It is one thing to be an individual with firm fixed opinions. But is it right for an individual who is the head of a Cricket Board to be bringing his personal opinions into policy matters i.e. someone involved in spot fixing will never play for Pakistan again especially if the players deserve to play on Cricketing Grounds.

No one is shedding any tears for Amir because the guy has been past it as a bowler for a number of years but no one can be blind to ignore Sharjeel's form with the bat.

Plus why one rule for Nawaz but another for Sharjeel?

Ramiz will look as big hypocrite if he does not walk the talk after making so much noise about fixers

As Chairman , he cannot give any excuses if Sharjeel gets selected. Either resign as Chairman or stand by his word on fixers

 

[sam_ahm]

The question should never be about how good or bad a player is. The question is if a player has served his punishment time then the only criteria for selecting or not selecting him should be his cricketing abilities not anything else.

If anyone has a problem with that then that person is a phsyco, cannot think straight.

Ramiz's argument of a 'tainted' player jumping the queue is flawed, because he will only jump the queue if others are not good enough and he is performing better, otherwise what is the meaning of queue? These kind of comments show that Ramiz Raza is quite dumb.