Islam/Hinduism/Sikhism- Which of these religion can easily assimilate with Western civilization?

[Cpt. Rishwat]

What? Living in Britain does not mean there is no problem with Muslims putting Islam above British culture and law. You know the truth, but just playing dodo to troll.

Why can't you just answer the question? If you are going to say it's a problem then it shouldn't be so difficult to give some examples. Where do Muslims put Islam above British culture and law? Don't give example of some extremist either, you have specifically said Just about every Muslim will do this.

If you are going to make sweeping and ignorant statements, then you need to back them up.

 

[Varun]

I'm sure Indians who live in the West are well versed in English in addition to the local Indian languages specific to their region.

It's pretty obvious that this would be the case.

 

[James]

Ok this thread hit the bottom of the barrel. Have just cleared out a bunch of posts.

Let’s start again. Respectfully.

 

[the Great Khan]

Hi TGK,

I have to disagree, celebrating Diwali or sharing sweets with a colleague or friend is not assertion. Assertion is more along the lines of things like wanting to introduce Sharia Law, Threatening ppl's lives because they spoke about the prophet as it is Blasphemy etc.

Hindus/Sikhs assimilate and practice their beliefs successfully in the west as they do not show the fanatical behavior which certain Muslims are prone to..

Sorry but this isn't what I'm talking about. When you organise in the workplace using your Hindu workplace group to ensure you can celebrate diwali by putting up Hindus religious artefacts and organise a collective prayer session in the atrium that's not a few sweets with friends. Your attempt to try and falsely claim Islam violent Hinduism benign is disappointing.

With regards to fanatical behaviour I have met many fanatical Sikhs and Hindus..many Sikhs carry a dangerous weapon and Hindus are known to have actively discriminated against Hindu boys and girls due to caste.

You just don't hear about it. Finally there is nonattempt by Muslims to implement shariah in the uk as the shariah does not apply to non Muslims and therefore any attempt to allow access to shariah is only for Muslims and their right to practice freely..

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Large proportion of non Muslim Indians own corner shops, takeaways and work in service industry.

They have strong work ethic, not sure why that's conflated with intellect/ education

 

[Romali_rotti]

With regards to fanatical behaviour I have met many fanatical Sikhs and Hindus..many Sikhs carry a dangerous weapon and Hindus are known to have actively discriminated against Hindu boys and girls due to caste.

Sikh's do carry a knife or a blade, I know, and there are violent Hindus also in the West agreed. However how many Hindus have you heard of committing terror attacks in the UK ? like certain muslims have done, causing chaos and violence ? Discrimination exists in Hindu community, heck muslims have the Shia, Sunni, Ahmadi issue, this is not an assimilation issue imo.

You just don't hear about it. Finally there is nonattempt by Muslims to implement shariah in the uk as the shariah does not apply to non Muslims and therefore any attempt to allow access to shariah is only for Muslims and their right to practice freely..

This is an assimilation issue, UK is a non Islamic country and they have their law and order and Muslims shouldn't get special privilege's to practice Sharia Law, this is not following the law of the land.

Bold...

Sharia courts in the UK:

https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CDP-2019-0102/CDP-2019-0102.pdf

 

[Romali_rotti]

What makes you think Muslims go telling their British friends and associates about their religion? It's usually the whites who will ask about it in my experience. Why do you do this? What day is your version of Christmas, etc. The vast majority of Muslims abroad have little interest in converting anyone, although there are definitely fundamentalists who believe it's their duty, just like the there are Jehovah's Witnesses who are the same.

Do you have much interraction with Muslims at all, or do you just get your impressions online?

Well to be fair I have seen more Christians trying to convert non Christians than muslims. If you say converting someone to a different religion is fundamentalist mentality then are you indicating that Usman Khawaja is a fundamental, along with other Pakistani men that marry non muslims and convert their partners ?

My experiences come from real life interactions as well as online.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Well to be fair I have seen more Christians trying to convert non Christians than muslims. If you say converting someone to a different religion is fundamentalist mentality then are you indicating that Usman Khawaja is a fundamental, along with other Pakistani men that marry non muslims and convert their partners ?

My experiences come from real life interactions as well as online.

Anyone who thinks getting married to a person of different religion is conversion clearly is unhinged.

 

[RexRex]

[MENTION=48620]Cpt. Rishwat[/MENTION] and [MENTION=29115]RexRex[/MENTION] were discussing in other thread where it was pointed out that Sikhs and Hindus can easily assimilate to western culture with reason being given that they probably look at western values as superior to their own.

Ah yes .. this was in the other Rushdie thread. Rishwat said hindus/sikhs assimilate well coz they consider western values as superior to their own whereas muslims rejects these western values . He should tell us which values he is referring to, I wanna know [MENTION=48620]Cpt. Rishwat[/MENTION]

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Ah yes .. this was in the other Rushdie thread. Rishwat said hindus/sikhs assimilate well coz they consider western values as superior to their own whereas muslims rejects these western values . He should tell us which values he is referring to, I wanna know [MENTION=48620]Cpt. Rishwat[/MENTION]

You'd have to find the exact quote as that looks slightly different to what I said. For a start I never said Muslims reject western values. Find the quote and I'll elaborate gladly.

 

[RexRex]

You'd have to find the exact quote as that looks slightly different to what I said. For a start I never said Muslims reject western values. Find the quote and I'll elaborate gladly.

That was the implication. It's around post #303 in the Rushdie thread.

 

[Major]

Ah yes .. this was in the other Rushdie thread. Rishwat said hindus/sikhs assimilate well coz they consider western values as superior to their own whereas muslims rejects these western values . He should tell us which values he is referring to, I wanna know [MENTION=48620]Cpt. Rishwat[/MENTION]

Turns out, now he doesnt know what the word assimilation means .

I was hoping for a proper argument by him when he said in that thread he didnt want to derail it and was welcomed to having a seperate topic on it

 

[SpiritOf1903]

You are not making sense here Cap. No one said anything about marrying a person of different religion is conversion.

You implied that with Khawaja who's probably the most liberal Muslim cricketer you'd find

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

That was the implication. It's around post #303 in the Rushdie thread.

Just post the quote if you want to ask me something about it. You are the one asking for more detail so it shouldn't be on me to go looking for it.

 

[Romali_rotti]

You implied that with Khawaja who's probably the most liberal Muslim cricketer you'd find

Well I can't help what other ppl think on the basis of what they feel I implied.

However if the compression skills were adequate you would be able to figure out that my post was not saying: if you marry someone of a different religion it is an automatic religious conversion.

Obviously there is a task at hand, before or after marriage, you have to speak to your husband or wife, change their ways of thinking and convince them to convert otherwise your partner wouldn't convert to the beliefs you want them to, despite of marriage..

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Well I can't help what other ppl think on the basis of what they feel I implied.

However if the compression skills were adequate you would be able to figure out that my post was not saying: if you marry someone of a different religion it is an automatic religious conversion.

Obviously there is a task at hand, before or after marriage, you have to speak to your husband or wife, change their ways of thinking and convince them to convert otherwise your partner wouldn't convert to the beliefs you want them to, despite of marriage..

I'm not a hydraulic press. Comprehension is not yours

 

[RexRex]

Just post the quote if you want to ask me something about it. You are the one asking for more detail so it shouldn't be on me to go looking for it.

I gave you the post num #. Just click on that thread, scroll down to that post and read it. Pretty simple, no ?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

I gave you the post num #. Just click on that thread, scroll down to that post and read it. Pretty simple, no ?

You made a claim that I said something, I disputed it and asked for a quote so I could verify your claim. Why is it so hard to produce a quote? Why is it on me to quote myself and try to explain what you think I meant?

 

[the Great Khan]

Bold...

Sharia courts in the UK:

https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CDP-2019-0102/CDP-2019-0102.pdf

Actually I disagree. It's not against the law for me to follow the shariah in the uk. I do it everyday and I have not been arrested by the police. Actually Infollow the shariah nearly every minute of the day. I have not had a problem..why??? I thought it was against British law?

 

[Justcrazy]

Why is western civilization superior ?

 

[daytrader]

"Islam And Europe Have A Compatibility Problem": Italy PM Georgia Meloni
Meloni's controversial remark came at an event organised by her right-wing, ultra-conservative Brothers of Italy party, which was attended by UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak and billionaire Elon Musk.

Italy's Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni has said that Islamic culture and the values and rights of European civilisation have a "compatibility problem". Meloni's controversial remark came at an event organised by her right-wing, ultra-conservative Brothers of Italy party, which was attended by UK Prime Minister Rishi Sunak and billionaire Elon Musk.
"I believe there is a problem of compatibility between Islamic culture or a certain interpretation of Islamic culture and the rights and values of our civilisation," she said. "It does not escape my mind that most of the Islamic cultural centres in Italy are financed by Saudi Arabia."

Meloni also criticised Saudi Arabia's rigid Sharia law under which apostasy and homosexuality are criminal offences. Sharia law, commonly referred to as Islamic law, constitutes a set of principles and regulations rooted in the Quran and the Hadith, representing the foundational religious texts of Islam.

NDTV

 

[CricketCartoons]

Sikhism easily assimilates with any civilization, while still not diluting its identity because sikhs believe in serving communities around them and treat all humans as equals. Less said about hinduism and islam.

 

[Champ_Pal]

At the core none of these religions can assimilate into the Western civilization. I strongly believe that religions must be restricted by geography as religions are basically cultures and its ideas masquerading as universal truths.

To assimilate into any new culture, one has to believe that all Gods are same and all religions have truth in them. On top of that, people should not take religion seriously. Any seriously believing person can never integrate into any foreign culture. Religion puts a lot of restrictions on your activities which is pretty much like self imposed social ostracization.

Only irreligious can truly integrate into any new culture without any guilt and with wholeheartedness.

 

[IndoorCricket]

At the core none of these religions can assimilate into the Western civilization. I strongly believe that religions must be restricted by geography as religions are basically cultures and its ideas masquerading as universal truths.

To assimilate into any new culture, one has to believe that all Gods are same and all religions have truth in them. On top of that, people should not take religion seriously. Any seriously believing person can never integrate into any foreign culture. Religion puts a lot of restrictions on your activities which is pretty much like self imposed social ostracization.

Only irreligious can truly integrate into any new culture without any guilt and with wholeheartedness.

That’s what Hinduism prescribes.

 

[Champ_Pal]

That’s what Hinduism prescribes.

Some religions and cultures are more liberal in acceptance. But overall, most religious Hindus will also struggle to accept and fully integrate into the Western civilization. Its all relative.

 

[JaDed]

Buddhism and Sikkhism.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Buddhism and Sikkhism.

I would not call Sikkhism peaceful. Its all relative. Buddhism and Jainsim are the most accepting and peaceful of all.

No one is 100% accepting and peaceful. Its all relative.

 

[sweep_shot]

Western civilization isn't exactly a benchmark or anything. It has many good aspects but also many flaws.

Assimilation can mean many things. I personally think as long as the immigrant is being a productive citizen (working and/or studying, paying taxes, not committing crimes etc.), that's assimilation.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Western civilization isn't exactly a benchmark or anything. It has many good aspects but also many flaws.

Assimilation can mean many things. I personally think as long as the immigrant is being a productive citizen (working and/or studying, paying taxes, not committing crimes etc.), that's assimilation.

Nope. Paying Taxes and earning honest living does not mean assimilation. That is only part of it.

True Assimilation means, celebrating the host countries culture, festivals and eventually intermarrying into the host country people.

 

[sweep_shot]

Nope. Paying Taxes and earning honest living does not mean assimilation. That is only part of it.

True Assimilation means, celebrating the host countries culture, festivals and eventually intermarrying into the host country people.

Not everyone is artistic. Some people don't celebrate anything. For example, I am a Bangali-Canadian but I never celebrate any Bangali festival let alone a Canadian festival. I am not interested in these.

Also, modern west is different. It has become extremely diverse. It has become a melting pot of different cultures.

I live in Toronto. In my city, there are probably 150+ different cultures. You can find all sorts of people here. White population in my city is less than 50%.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Nope. Paying Taxes and earning honest living does not mean assimilation. That is only part of it.

True Assimilation means, celebrating the host countries culture, festivals and eventually intermarrying into the host country people.

This is definitely where Hinduism will be the most amenable of religions. Priti Patel, take a curtsey.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Not everyone is artistic. Some people don't celebrate anything. For example, I am a Bangali-Canadian but I never celebrate any Bangali festival let alone a Canadian festival. I am not interested in these.

Also, modern west is different. It has become extremely diverse. It has become a melting pot of different cultures.

I live in Toronto. In my city, there are probably 150+ different cultures. You can find all sorts of people here. White population in my city is less than 50%.

You may not celebrate Bangali festivals. But you should not be averse to participate in host country's culture and festivals if invited because it is against your faith.

 

[CricketCartoons]

I would not call Sikkhism peaceful. Its all relative. Buddhism and Jainsim are the most accepting and peaceful of all.

No one is 100% accepting and peaceful. Its all relative.

Peaceful is a privilege, that is why mostly merchant communities adopted jainism. A poor farmer cannot be peaceful if he has to grow food. He has to kill rodents and pests. Peace is a privilege of the elite, poor cannot avoid violence for their survival.

 

[JaDed]

I would not call Sikkhism peaceful. Its all relative. Buddhism and Jainsim are the most accepting and peaceful of all.

No one is 100% accepting and peaceful. Its all relative.

Please read the Op again, peaceful is not the question.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Please read the Op again, peaceful is not the question.

I was only answering the poster who mentioned peace.

 

[Justcrazy]

The answer is easy . the one which has no jurisprudence of it own will assimilate . Those whose followers follow a religion like philosophy rather than religion , will accept whatever is thrown at them.

 

[Justcrazy]

Hindus have concept of Karma. Basically Hindus believe that we get results based on our actions. So if I do something bad - I will face the consequences in this life. Even if I pray to God - it cannot help me. Which is why Hindus don't invoke God in everything bcoz we know it wont help. Therefore we focus more on our actions.

In contrast Muslims believe everything happens as per God's will. Thats why Mulsims always invoke God in everything. This why u guys say Inshallah , Mashallah for everything

So you believe in a God but you think he cannot help you. Karma is greater than God itself

 

[Justcrazy]

Hindus believe in Karma. Basically our actions begets our future consequences. So we are free to do whatever we do in life but we have to face consequences for our actions later. This is core philosophy. Ultimately the goal if to get Moksha and liberation which we get basis our actions / deeds

This is different from Islam where most of ur actions are dictated by the Quran and Hadith

Who dictates good or bad karma?

 

[Justcrazy]

Nope. Paying Taxes and earning honest living does not mean assimilation. That is only part of it.

True Assimilation means, celebrating the host countries culture, festivals and eventually intermarrying into the host country people.

What do you think assimilation means? What should a Muslim do to prove assimilation ?

 

[Romali_rotti]

There has been a lot of anti Islamic movements all across Europe. Denmark, Poland, then Sweden, Germany following suit... There hasn't been any such to that extreme against Hinduism or Sikhism, so I would say a lot of muslims are struggling to assimilate in the West.

Issues I keep hearing from Germany, Sweden etc are wherever muslims are in those countries the crime rates are high and offer nothing meaningful to the economy..

 

[Major]

when you guys talk about Muslims, are you referring to all muslims, or muslim of specific country?

 

[Romali_rotti]

when you guys talk about Muslims, are you referring to all muslims, or muslim of specific country?

I was meaning all muslims.

 

[Major]

There has been a lot of anti Islamic movements all across Europe. Denmark, Poland, then Sweden, Germany following suit... There hasn't been any such to that extreme against Hinduism or Sikhism, so I would say a lot of muslims are struggling to assimilate in the West.

Issues I keep hearing from Germany, Sweden etc are wherever muslims are in those countries the crime rates are high and offer nothing meaningful to the economy..

Plz provide us the data that the high crime rate is directly correlated with muslim in Germany and Sweden

 

[SpiritOf1903]

The latter two are flexible in their beliefs. They're not meant to drink but it's become a cornerstone of their culture. 'Desi pubs ' is the perfect example of assimilation.

Muslims have struggled in tolerance. Either become too insular of or been victims of social design.

Muslims ultimately have more conviction in their belief. Criminal convictions are based on social demographics

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

There has been a lot of anti Islamic movements all across Europe. Denmark, Poland, then Sweden, Germany following suit... There hasn't been any such to that extreme against Hinduism or Sikhism, so I would say a lot of muslims are struggling to assimilate in the West.

Issues I keep hearing from Germany, Sweden etc are wherever muslims are in those countries the crime rates are high and offer nothing meaningful to the economy..

If you study lions you would see the dominant male won't tolerate other males coming into their territory because they feel the threat to their own dominance. But they will happily accept females who pose no threat and in fact offer the chance to mate and produce more offspring for their bloodline.

I think this is a good analogy for why Muslims are sometimes looked at warily by Europeans, the European wants to dominate and assimilate into their own culture. Nothing wrong with that, a Muslim will be happy to do so with shared values, but won't where there is a conflict they will politely decline and say each to their own, obviously within the law of the respected host nation.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Plz provide us the data that the high crime rate is directly correlated with muslim in Germany and Sweden

By all means look it up yourself and place the data. I cant be bothered, I only shared what I heard as I stated earlier

 

[RexRex]

You made a claim that I said something, I disputed it and asked for a quote so I could verify your claim. Why is it so hard to produce a quote? Why is it on me to quote myself and try to explain what you think I meant?

Because the quote came within the context of other posts next to it. Hence why I gave the post#. Not surprise that you have not bothered to look it up, you probably have no idea what you meant either.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Because the quote came within the context of other posts next to it. Hence why I gave the post#. Not surprise that you have not bothered to look it up, you probably have no idea what you meant either.

Well you are right about one thing, context is important, that conversation was from months ago, not many are going to reread all the posts to see what the context back then was because the thread got recently bumped.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

On paper, it should be Islam since it continues Judeo-Christian philosophy and culture.

However, the reality is quite different.

Hindus seem to be able to cope quite well in secular west but there beliefs go under the radar a bit too. If they were more open about caste, karma, disability etc they wouldn't be as tolerated.

For example, Muslim and Christian politicians get grilled on LGBT, but nobody asks Rishi or Priti if they belief disabled people are born due to negative karma.

Hindus have done good job keeping their head down and working away rather than enter into religious discussions and be overly religious in the west.

 

[Major]

By all means look it up yourself and place the data. I cant be bothered, I only shared what I heard as I stated earlier

Claiming crime rate by muslims to be high and than say i cant be bothered to provide the data and only claimed this because it supports your biasness against muslims.

Next time you mention some rate, plz defend it with actual stats.

 

[Champ_Pal]

On paper, it should be Islam since it continues Judeo-Christian philosophy and culture.

However, the reality is quite different.

Hindus seem to be able to cope quite well in secular west but there beliefs go under the radar a bit too. If they were more open about caste, karma, disability etc they wouldn't be as tolerated.

For example, Muslim and Christian politicians get grilled on LGBT, but nobody asks Rishi or Priti if they belief disabled people are born due to negative karma.

Hindus have done good job keeping their head down and working away rather than enter into religious discussions and be overly religious in the west.

Islam does not continue Judeo-Christian Culture. All 3 religions say there is only 1 God. But that God is quite different in all 3 cases. If we just go by 1 God thing, then you should include Sikhism too to the list.

Hindus do not claim that Britain should implement Caste system in Britain or Europe or USA. Karma is just a philosophy. No Hindu says that you need to ignore the poor, disabled and destitute because it is just their bad Karma from a previous life. Hinduism's answer to the difficulties in current life is the bad Karma of previous life. I find it very silly answer anyway.

No Hindu supports Caste system even though they still follow it. Any discrimination based on caste system is punishable by law in India (The only country that has caste system based on birth). Christian and Muslim politicians get grilled on LGBT issues because of their religions history of LGBT persecution. Till today no serious Christian or Muslim supports LGBT cause. Christians have softened their stand on LGBT significantly the past few decades.

 

[Champ_Pal]

Claiming crime rate by muslims to be high and than say i cant be bothered to provide the data and only claimed this because it supports your biasness against muslims.

Next time you mention some rate, plz defend it with actual stats.

Can this help? Muslims are only about 6% of UK population, but they form a big chunk of total prison population.

England and Wales prison population by religion 2024 | Statista

Approximately 39,068 prisoners in England and Wales identified as being Christian in 2024, the most of any religious faith among prisoners.

www.statista.com

 

[TSA321]

Can this help? Muslims are only about 6% of UK population, but they form a big chunk of total prison population.

England and Wales prison population by religion 2024 | Statista

Approximately 39,068 prisoners in England and Wales identified as being Christian in 2024, the most of any religious faith among prisoners.

www.statista.com

View attachment 140486

Because people convert to Islam when they go to prison.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conversion_to_Islam_in_prisons#:~:text=According%20to%20%22Muslim%20Prisoners'%20Experiences,of%20identifying%20as%20Muslim%22%20in

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Islam does not continue Judeo-Christian Culture. All 3 religions say there is only 1 God. But that God is quite different in all 3 cases. If we just go by 1 God thing, then you should include Sikhism too to the list.

Hindus do not claim that Britain should implement Caste system in Britain or Europe or USA. Karma is just a philosophy. No Hindu says that you need to ignore the poor, disabled and destitute because it is just their bad Karma from a previous life. Hinduism's answer to the difficulties in current life is the bad Karma of previous life. I find it very silly answer anyway.

No Hindu supports Caste system even though they still follow it. Any discrimination based on caste system is punishable by law in India (The only country that has caste system based on birth). Christian and Muslim politicians get grilled on LGBT issues because of their religions history of LGBT persecution. Till today no serious Christian or Muslim supports LGBT cause. Christians have softened their stand on LGBT significantly the past few decades.

Sikhism is different. It doesn't have similar philosophy nor does it venerate the books and religious figures of the Abrahamic faith.

I agree that Hindus have done well by keeping their head down and not making their beliefs public or asking for them to be implemented in a wider scale. A former England football manager mentioned bad karma being responsible for disabilities and he lost his job quickly. I think a PM responsible for the fate of disabled people should be asked whether he feels its their own fault or not. It's a fair question because his faith could influence his policies. If he feels that maybe they raped someone in a previous life and now are reborn disabled then he may not have their best interests at heart. It makes sense that caste based discrimination is punishable by Indian law - we aren't talking about Indian law here but Hindu beliefs. Perhaps if after Modi, Yogi comes in then they will try to implement Hindu beliefs legally. Who knows.

I don't understand what you mean by no Hindus support the caste system even though they follow it. Do you mean they follow something that disgusts them? Please clarify.

Anyway the point is not to bash Hindus but its to say they have done well to keep their beliefs hidden and work hard to become assets to their countries of migration. In contrast, Muslims may have revealed their beliefs too much and not worked hard enough to become part of the fabric.

 

[The Bald Eagle]

Can this help? Muslims are only about 6% of UK population, but they form a big chunk of total prison population.

England and Wales prison population by religion 2024 | Statista

Approximately 39,068 prisoners in England and Wales identified as being Christian in 2024, the most of any religious faith among prisoners.

www.statista.com

View attachment 140486

Its because the criminals find the peace in Islam and the high ratio is because of the fact that many Christians and non Muslims convert to Islam after their reformation in prison.

 

[Romali_rotti]

Claiming crime rate by muslims to be high and than say i cant be bothered to provide the data and only claimed this because it supports your biasness against muslims.

Next time you mention some rate, plz defend it with actual stats.

Err you have comprehension issues ? I said that's what I heard, I never said it was a fact, it's open to be debunked.

Why don't you just look it up and put up the stats? If what I said is wrong I would love to take it back to them and show them...


Or you too lazy to defend your religion ?

 

[Champ_Pal]

Its because the criminals find the peace in Islam and the high ratio is because of the fact that many Christians and non Muslims convert to Islam after their reformation in prison.

The report is on current number of inmates by the religion they follow. It’s not about what they converted to while in prison.

 

[Bewal Express]

It depends on what you mean by assimilate. I have grown up with whites all my life, I lived white areas, went to school with whites, work in a predominantly white school, know many of the white parents from the community but I don't socialise where alcohol is involved. Have a assimilated or not

 

[Champ_Pal]

Sikhism is different. It doesn't have similar philosophy nor does it venerate the books and religious figures of the Abrahamic faith.

I agree that Hindus have done well by keeping their head down and not making their beliefs public or asking for them to be implemented in a wider scale. A former England football manager mentioned bad karma being responsible for disabilities and he lost his job quickly. I think a PM responsible for the fate of disabled people should be asked whether he feels its their own fault or not. It's a fair question because his faith could influence his policies. If he feels that maybe they raped someone in a previous life and now are reborn disabled then he may not have their best interests at heart. It makes sense that caste based discrimination is punishable by Indian law - we aren't talking about Indian law here but Hindu beliefs. Perhaps if after Modi, Yogi comes in then they will try to implement Hindu beliefs legally. Who knows.

I don't understand what you mean by no Hindus support the caste system even though they follow it. Do you mean they follow something that disgusts them? Please clarify.

Anyway the point is not to bash Hindus but its to say they have done well to keep their beliefs hidden and work hard to become assets to their countries of migration. In contrast, Muslims may have revealed their beliefs too much and not worked hard enough to become part of the fabric.

Hindus follow caste system when it comes to marriage and sometimes profession. But overall, if Hindus were to really follow caste system, they would be stuck in 8th century.

As per Caste system, only Kshatriyas can be rulers. But it’s the Shudras that are ruling India.
Brahmins should only carry out temple duties and teaching jobs. They are not supposed to own any lands and they should beg to live. No sane Brahmin follows it. Brahmins are into ruling and army too. They will laugh if I say that to any Brahmin now.
Vyshyas aka Baniyas should only do trading work. But every caste does it now.
Shudras should do manual labor like agriculture , be the village leaders and be the members of kings army. No one follows that.
Dalits and Tribals are not part of caste system. They are not even allowed into caste society. But that is not the case either.

So basically, caste is just a common identity among groups of people who do similar jobs. No one really follows it. You do not become a non-Hindu just because you are not following caste system.
Modi who is the poster boy for Hinduism across the world is a Shudra. But he is ruling the country. If Hindus were to follow Manu Smriti of Caste system, Modi should be punished and ostracized.

 

[Champ_Pal]

It depends on what you mean by assimilate. I have grown up with whites all my life, I lived white areas, went to school with whites, work in a predominantly white school, know many of the white parents from the community but I don't socialise where alcohol is involved. Have a assimilated or not

I don’t drink either. But I just hold a soft drink and be part of the conversations. They don’t force me to drink and I don’t lecture them about the ill effects of alcohol.

 

[Bewal Express]

I don’t drink either. But I just hold a soft drink and be part of the conversations. They don’t force me to drink and I don’t lecture them about the ill effects of alcohol.

I don't feel comfortable around alcohol. But my point is that outside this part of indigenous culture, I talk like them, I am more educated than most of them, I more integrated than them. So what does assimilation mean.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Hindus follow caste system when it comes to marriage and sometimes profession. But overall, if Hindus were to really follow caste system, they would be stuck in 8th century.

As per Caste system, only Kshatriyas can be rulers. But it’s the Shudras that are ruling India.
Brahmins should only carry out temple duties and teaching jobs. They are not supposed to own any lands and they should beg to live. No sane Brahmin follows it. Brahmins are into ruling and army too. They will laugh if I say that to any Brahmin now.
Vyshyas aka Baniyas should only do trading work. But every caste does it now.
Shudras should do manual labor like agriculture , be the village leaders and be the members of kings army. No one follows that.
Dalits and Tribals are not part of caste system. They are not even allowed into caste society. But that is not the case either.

So basically, caste is just a common identity among groups of people who do similar jobs. No one really follows it. You do not become a non-Hindu just because you are not following caste system.
Modi who is the poster boy for Hinduism across the world is a Shudra. But he is ruling the country. If Hindus were to follow Manu Smriti of Caste system, Modi should be punished and ostracized.

No wonder there is so much confusion about what is Hinduism, seems the best way to follow it is to ignore all the traditional Hindu beliefs and then just claim every trending belief of the day as Hinduism.

While that allows plenty of bend and flexibility, it would not be looked upon as assimilation to claim modern British ideas as Hindu belief in this country.

 

[TSA321]

The report is on current number of inmates by the religion they follow. It’s not about what they converted to while in prison.

Yes, and there is an overrepresentation because people adopt Islam in prison for various reasons.

The two largest Muslim groups in the UK (Pakistanis and Bangladeshis ) both have below average crime rates. https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures...licing/number-of-arrests/latest/#by-ethnicity
Bangladeshis have the exact rate as White Brits despite being 2-3 times more likely to grow up in relative poverty than them.
And Arabs have the 2nd lowest arrest rate in the country.

 

[Champ_Pal]

No wonder there is so much confusion about what is Hinduism, seems the best way to follow it is to ignore all the traditional Hindu beliefs and then just claim every trending belief of the day as Hinduism.

While that allows plenty of bend and flexibility, it would not be looked upon as assimilation to claim modern British ideas as Hindu belief in this country.

There is no confusion as majority Hindus hate manu smriti which corrupted the caste by profession to caste by birth. The rigidity of caste is what people follow till today.

 

[Bewal Express]

No wonder there is so much confusion about what is Hinduism, seems the best way to follow it is to ignore all the traditional Hindu beliefs and then just claim every trending belief of the day as Hinduism.

While that allows plenty of bend and flexibility, it would not be looked upon as assimilation to claim modern British ideas as Hindu belief in this country.

From what I have observed Hindu kids in the UK run a mile from Hinduism. The Christians from Ind are much more proud of their heritage than any Hindus I have observed or know.

 

[Varun]

I understand that many of the posters in question live in Western countries, but come on - the quest for acceptance and a pat on the back by the Caucasians is hilarious.

 

[Firebat]

"Assimilation" is an irrelevant, poorly-defined and vague concept.

Islam told me to work hard to be a contributing member of the society and community I'm in, while holding firm to my values of praying, giving charity, avoiding drink etc etc etc.

If I do all those things have I "assimilated"? Do I give a crap if the white man thinks I have? No.

 

[Major]

On paper, it should be Islam since it continues Judeo-Christian philosophy and culture.

However, the reality is quite different.

Hindus seem to be able to cope quite well in secular west but there beliefs go under the radar a bit too. If they were more open about caste, karma, disability etc they wouldn't be as tolerated.

For example, Muslim and Christian politicians get grilled on LGBT, but nobody asks Rishi or Priti if they belief disabled people are born due to negative karma.

Hindus have done good job keeping their head down and working away rather than enter into religious discussions and be overly religious in the west.

But LGQBT is

Can this help? Muslims are only about 6% of UK population, but they form a big chunk of total prison population.

England and Wales prison population by religion 2024 | Statista

Approximately 39,068 prisoners in England and Wales identified as being Christian in 2024, the most of any religious faith among prisoners.

www.statista.com

View attachment 140486

The poster mentioned germany and swedan crime rate

 

[Major]

I understand that many of the posters in question live in Western countries, but come on - the quest for acceptance and a pat on the back by the Caucasians is hilarious.

You clearly dont understand what social assimilation is

 

[Major]

Err you have comprehension issues ? I said that's what I heard, I never said it was a fact, it's open to be debunked.

Why don't you just look it up and put up the stats? If what I said is wrong I would love to take it back to them and show them...


Or you too lazy to defend your religion ?

The only one having issues is you.

First you mention high crime rate but had no proof or source, now to defend that you are going around that you heard...

Why shouldi post a stat when you are the one making false claims. Funny how you are calling me lazy when you are the one claiming data but cant provide any data

When questioned, just say i heard things...

 

[Romali_rotti]

The only one having issues is you.

First you mention high crime rate but had no proof or source, now to defend that you are going around that you heard...

Why shouldi post a stat when you are the one making false claims. Funny how you are calling me lazy when you are the one claiming data but cant provide any data

When questioned, just say i heard things...

Again, I said, what I am 'hearing', I did not say it was a fact or it is the proven. It is open to ambiguity, so since you don't want to put up stats, I will stick to what I am hearing as evidence for now since it has not been proven wrong.

There is a reason why Europe has anti muslim sentiment going on and there is no such thing for Hindus/Sikhs in comparison, if there is one, it is more of an anomaly. So to the thread YES, Sikh/Hindus assimilate better to their environment in the West than the muslims.


The image is from a protest in London, we can see muslims really assimilating well here, and NO I am not saying all muslims are like this but itself is enough for the Westerners to feel threatened.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

There is no confusion as majority Hindus hate manu smriti which corrupted the caste by profession to caste by birth. The rigidity of caste is what people follow till today.

So if they hate the rigidity of caste why do they still follow it?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Again, I said, what I am 'hearing', I did not say it was a fact or it is the proven. It is open to ambiguity, so since you don't want to put up stats, I will stick to what I am hearing as evidence for now since it has not been proven wrong.

There is a reason why Europe has anti muslim sentiment going on and there is no such thing for Hindus/Sikhs in comparison, if there is one, it is more of an anomaly. So to the thread YES, Sikh/Hindus assimilate better to their environment in the West than the muslims.


The image is from a protest in London, we can see muslims really assimilating well here, and NO I am not saying all muslims are like this but itself is enough for the Westerners to feel threatened.

Why don't you post a wider picture of the protests? There we can see two posters held up by two people. These could even be hindutva false flags for all we know. If there are crowds of hundreds waving these placards then maybe we could take this seriously.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Hindus follow caste system when it comes to marriage and sometimes profession. But overall, if Hindus were to really follow caste system, they would be stuck in 8th century.

As per Caste system, only Kshatriyas can be rulers. But it’s the Shudras that are ruling India.
Brahmins should only carry out temple duties and teaching jobs. They are not supposed to own any lands and they should beg to live. No sane Brahmin follows it. Brahmins are into ruling and army too. They will laugh if I say that to any Brahmin now.
Vyshyas aka Baniyas should only do trading work. But every caste does it now.
Shudras should do manual labor like agriculture , be the village leaders and be the members of kings army. No one follows that.
Dalits and Tribals are not part of caste system. They are not even allowed into caste society. But that is not the case either.

So basically, caste is just a common identity among groups of people who do similar jobs. No one really follows it. You do not become a non-Hindu just because you are not following caste system.
Modi who is the poster boy for Hinduism across the world is a Shudra. But he is ruling the country. If Hindus were to follow Manu Smriti of Caste system, Modi should be punished and ostracized.

They may not follow it but deep down they must believe in it right? Otherwise the whole thing just unravels.

Maybe when India becomes a Hindu Rashtra these things will come into the open more.

 

[Major]

Again, I said, what I am 'hearing', I did not say it was a fact or it is the proven. It is open to ambiguity, so since you don't want to put up stats, I will stick to what I am hearing as evidence for now since it has not been proven wrong.

There is a reason why Europe has anti muslim sentiment going on and there is no such thing for Hindus/Sikhs in comparison, if there is one, it is more of an anomaly. So to the thread YES, Sikh/Hindus assimilate better to their environment in the West than the muslims.


The image is from a protest in London, we can see muslims really assimilating well here, and NO I am not saying all muslims are like this but itself is enough for the Westerners to feel threatened.

now you are going on about reasons.;

bhai, you said high crime rate, either post the crime rate of muslims involved in germany and sweadn or just admit you made a mistake making a hate filled comment.

 

[Major]

Why don't you post a wider picture of the protests? There we can see two posters held up by two people. These could even be hindutva false flags for all we know. If there are crowds of hundreds waving these placards then maybe we could take this seriously.

his next response would be someone gave him the halfcut pic and he did not know better.

i find it astonishing how posters here with prejudice against muslims will go any lengths to come up with stupid things and when confronted they come up with here say

 

[Romali_rotti]

Why don't you post a wider picture of the protests? There we can see two posters held up by two people. These could even be hindutva false flags for all we know. If there are crowds of hundreds waving these placards then maybe we could take this seriously.

British-Muslim family law and citizenship

Muslims in Britain marry, divorce, bring up their children and deal with death by resorting to a variety of norms such as Sharia law, English family law and customary law. The sole legal framework of state law within which western conceptions of citizenship are imagined is in contrast to...

www.opendemocracy.net

Cap, UK certainly has a problem in the muslim community with assimilation, you can deny it all you want on PP, however the growing anti-muslim protest on the streets etc is a clear indication of this.

You can pretend all this is fake and ignore it but in the future it will make life very difficult for muslims in the West, especially in Europe.

I am hearing there is Sharia courts in the UK? I mean what the hell ?? LOL If this is true good lord the Caucasians needs to get their rear end in gear and take their country back.

Imagine going to an Islamic country and trying to bringing in a foreign religious legislation, you will be put to death or thrown in jail most likely.....

You do not see this kind of behavior with the Sikhs/Hindus in the West, they just mind their business and get on with their lives mostly hence they assimilate well while we see a lot of muslims do not..

 

[Romali_rotti]

now you are going on about reasons.;

bhai, you said high crime rate, either post the crime rate of muslims involved in germany and sweadn or just admit you made a mistake making a hate filled comment.

I admit, I heard there are high crime rates by the muslim migrants in Germany and Sweden.

Bhai, relax, just prove me wrong, be the defender of Islam and you put up the stats. I am willing to fully concede if you can prove me wrong and I will also take your feedback to the sources I heard this from.

Instead of playing the victim here and saying silly things like I hate Islam, be the champion of Islam, show me the light, prove me wrong..

 

[Major]

I admit, I heard there are high crime rates by the muslim migrants in Germany and Sweden.

Bhai, relax, just prove me wrong, be the defender of Islam and you put up the stats. I am willing to fully concede if you can prove me wrong and I will also take your feedback to the sources I heard this from.

Instead of playing the victim here and saying silly things like I hate Islam, be the champion of Islam, show me the light, prove me wrong..

you are the one claiming these things, i am not gonna waste my time here to show stats to someone with prejudice. If you really cared about facts you would had first looked up the stats yourselves instead of posting on here say.

You should be the one providing stats if you are gonna use the phrase crime rate, dont expect others to do the job for you because of your prejudice.

Champion of Islam? Why are you using such phrases?

I asked you a simple question on providing us with data and stats, what does this have to do with being champion of Islam or defender of islam?

 

[Major]

British-Muslim family law and citizenship

Muslims in Britain marry, divorce, bring up their children and deal with death by resorting to a variety of norms such as Sharia law, English family law and customary law. The sole legal framework of state law within which western conceptions of citizenship are imagined is in contrast to...

www.opendemocracy.net

Cap, UK certainly has a problem in the muslim community with assimilation, you can deny it all you want on PP, however the growing anti-muslim protest on the streets etc is a clear indication of this.

You can pretend all this is fake and ignore it but in the future it will make life very difficult for muslims in the West, especially in Europe.

I am hearing there is Sharia courts in the UK? I mean what the hell ?? LOL If this is true good lord the Caucasians needs to get their rear end in gear and take their country back.

Imagine going to an Islamic country and trying to bringing in a foreign religious legislation, you will be put to death or thrown in jail most likely.....

You do not see this kind of behavior with the Sikhs/Hindus in the West, they just mind their business and get on with their lives mostly hence they assimilate well while we see a lot of muslims do not..

@Cpt. Rishwat asked you to provide more and wider pics of the protest pic that you shared earlier. Meaning, there should be more pics of that one protest.

Interestingly, you posted pics of different multiple protests. One pic seems to be infront of a shop the other has trees. What are you trying to prove here?

Upon further research of the images you shared.

Image 1: From UK and around 2019
Image 2: From Germany and its from 2012
Image 3: Is from 2009
Image 4: From 2006