Liverpool explosion: Three arrested under Terrorism Act after car blast at hospital

[MenInG]

Three men have been arrested under the Terrorism Act after a man was killed in a car explosion outside Liverpool Women's Hospital.

A taxi carrying one passenger pulled up just before 11:00 GMT - as a national two minutes' silence for Remembrance Sunday was due to begin - and exploded.

The passenger was declared dead at the scene and is yet to be formally identified.

The male driver was injured and is in hospital in a stable condition.

Detectives from Counter Terrorism Police North West said three men - aged 29, 26 and 21 - were detained in the Kensington area of the city.

They said they were continuing to keep an open mind about the cause of the blast and were working with Merseyside Police as the investigation continued "at pace". The security service, MI5, is also assisting.

Armed officers have carried out raids on properties on Rutland Avenue near Sefton Park, and Boaler Street in Kensington.

Specialist officers remain outside a house on Rutland Avenue, in an operation police say is linked to the explosion.

Police negotiators are on the scene, a fire crew is on standby, and a number of residents have been evacuated.

A large cordon, guarded by uniformed officers, is in place.

Carl Bessant, whose partner had just had a baby, was inside the hospital at the time of the blast.

"My partner is really shook up to be honest," he said.

"We were so close and she was feeding the baby when it happened. We heard a loud bang and looked out of the window.

"We saw the car on fire and someone jump out... screaming, and there was someone inside the car.

"The hospital shut down, no-one in or out, so they said, but people were using the back entrance."

Prime Minister Boris Johnson said on Twitter: "My thoughts are with all those affected by the awful incident in Liverpool today.

"I want to thank the emergency services for their quick response and professionalism, and the police for their ongoing work on the investigation."

Home Secretary Priti Patel also tweeted she was "being kept regularly updated on the awful incident".

At the scene
By Jim Clarke, BBC North West Tonight deputy editor

The first raid happened at about 13:00 GMT on Rutland Avenue in the Sefton Park area of the city. It's about 0.75 miles from the hospital. It's an area of the city with large Victorian houses.

The house that was raided had been split up into flats. Local residents said they had not seen anybody coming or going from the property for some weeks - they thought it was unoccupied. The street remains cordoned off and some residents have been evacuated.

Police were also seen at Boaler Street in the Kensington area of the city. It's about a mile away from the hospital.

Eyewitnesses on the street said armed police arrived at about 14:00 GMT and raided a house. They said they saw men being arrested and handcuffed. They were led by armed officers into a car. That street also remains cordoned off.

Chief Constable Serena Kennedy, of Merseyside Police, sought to reassure the public, saying events of this nature were very rare and that there would be an increased and visible police presence on the streets in the coming days.

A bomb disposal unit and fire engines attended the scene earlier, which remains cordoned off. Road closures are also in place.

Chief Constable Serena Kennedy said the police response would be ongoing "for some time"
Police were called at 10:59 GMT to reports of a car explosion.

Phil Garrigan, chief fire officer of Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service, said the car fire had been "fully developed" when crews arrived shortly after 11:00 GMT.

"The operational crews extinguished the fire rapidly but... there was one fatality," he said.

"Another individual had left the vehicle prior to the fire developing to the extent that it did. Our thoughts are with them and the families of those involved."

Liverpool Women's Hospital said visiting access had been restricted until further notice and patients had been diverted to other hospitals where possible.

"We are reviewing our patient activity for the next 24-48 hours and patients should wait to be contacted for updates about any planned appointments or other attendance at the hospital," chief executive Kathryn Thomson said.

Liverpool Women's Hospital receives about 50,000 patients annually and is the largest hospital in its specialism in Europe.

BBC

 

[TAK]

Taxi exploding outside a maternity hospital...

three men, aged 21, 26 and 29, had been arrested in the Kensington area of Liverpool. Their names were not immediately released.

Three men were arrested under Britain’s Terrorism Act after a taxi exploded outside a hospital in Liverpool, England, on Sunday morning, killing one person and injuring another, the authorities said.

The cause of the explosion was not immediately clear. About eight hours after it was reported, the authorities announced that three men, aged 21, 26 and 29, had been arrested in the Kensington area of Liverpool. Their names were not immediately released.

Counter Terrorism Policing North West, part of a national alliance of police forces, said it was leading the investigation with support from the Merseyside Police in Liverpool.

At about 11 a.m. local time, the police responded to reports that a taxi had pulled up outside Liverpool Women’s Hospital and exploded, the Merseyside Police said in a statement.

“Work is still ongoing to establish what has happened and could take some time before we’re in a position to confirm anything,” Chief Constable Serena Kennedy of the Merseyside Police told reporters on Sunday.

Ms. Kennedy said the authorities were “keeping an open mind” as they investigated.

Given the circumstances of how the explosion occurred, she added, Britain’s Counter Terrorism Policing would lead the investigation. Britain’s home secretary, Priti Patel, said on Twitter that she was receiving regular updates “on the awful incident at Liverpool Women’s Hospital.”

In an update on Sunday night, the Greater Manchester Police said a “large cordon” had been placed on Rutland Avenue in Liverpool, about a mile and a half from the hospital, and that a few homes had been evacuated as a precaution. The evacuation was part of an investigation into the explosion, the police said on Twitter.

It was unclear whether any of the three men who had been arrested lived on Rutland Avenue.

Information about the person who was killed in the explosion was not immediately available.

A second victim, a man, was hospitalized with injuries that the authorities said were not life-threatening. Phil Garrigan, the chief fire officer of the Merseyside Fire and Rescue Service, told reporters on Sunday that the man “had left the vehicle prior to the fire developing to the extent that it did.”

The fire from the explosion was extinguished quickly, Chief Garrigan said.

Access to the hospital, the authorities said, would be restricted “until further notice,” and some patients were diverted to other hospitals. Ambulances were still being allowed access to the hospital for emergencies, and staff members were being escorted into and out of the building by the authorities.

The mayor of Liverpool, Joanne Anderson, said in a statement that “the incident at the Liverpool Women’s Hospital is unsettling and upsetting and my thoughts are with those affected.”

In a statement on Sunday night, Ms. Kennedy said that investigators were still asking for information and that there would be “an increased and visible police presence on the streets of Merseyside.”

“It is also important,” she said, “that, at this very early stage, people do not speculate about what has happened.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/11/14/world/europe/liverpool-hospital-car-explosion.html

 

[TAK]

A hero taxi driver has been credited with saving many lives after locking an alleged suicide bomber inside his cab just moments before the vehicle blew up outside a hospital in what police and MI5 are now probing as a Poppy Day terror attack.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-sounds-explosion-heard-outside-entrance.html

 

[MenInG]

Home Secretary Priti Patel says the UK's terror threat level has been increased from 'substantial' to 'severe' following the explosion in a taxi outside Liverpool Women’s Hospital which is being treated as a terror incident

 

[Last Monetarist]

https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-police-say-passenger-loaded-explosive-device-into-liverpool-taxi-2021-11-15/

Britain raised its national threat level on Monday to severe, meaning an attack is seen as highly likely, after declaring that a taxi explosion outside a hospital in Liverpool on Sunday was a terrorist incident.

Interior minister Priti Patel said the blast in the northern English city was the second fatal incident in one month following the stabbing to death of lawmaker David Amess.

British police said earlier on Monday that the Liverpool blast killed one passenger who is believed to have made the explosive device and carried it into the taxi. They are treating it as a terrorist incident.

"Our inquiries indicate that an improvised explosive device was manufactured, and our assumption so far is that it was built by the passenger in the taxi," said Assistant Chief Constable Russ Jackson of Counter-Terrorism Policing Northwest.

Police said they believed they knew the identity of the passenger but could not disclose it.

"Although the motivation for this incident is yet to be understood, given all the circumstances, it has been declared a terrorist incident," he said.

The explosion engulfed the taxi in flames outside Liverpool Women's Hospital just before 11 a.m. on Sunday, when a Remembrance Day service to commemorate war dead was being held at nearby Liverpool Cathedral.

"We cannot at this time draw any connection with this but it is a line of inquiry which we are pursuing," said Jackson.

Three men aged 29, 26 and 21 were arrested on Sunday, and Jackson said on Monday another man aged 20 had been arrested. He added that "significant items" had been found at one address while several other addresses had been or would be searched.

He said the passenger had boarded the taxi at a location in Liverpool and asked to be driven to the hospital, which was about a 10-minute drive away. The blast took place within the car as it approached the drop-off point in front of the hospital.

The driver managed to escape from the vehicle but was injured and received medical treatment. He has since been released.

Jackson said it was unclear why the passenger had wanted to go to the hospital or what had caused the sudden explosion of the device.

Earlier, Liverpool Mayor Joanne Anderson described the actions of the taxi driver as heroic. The BBC said he had locked the passenger inside the vehicle.

Prime Minister Boris Johnson later chaired a meeting of the government's emergency committee on Monday to discuss the blast and Patel said the Joint Terrorism Analysis Centre had decided to increase the threat level to the second highest, of severe.

"It is important that the public remains alert to the threat from terrorism but not alarmed," she said.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

This could have been catastrophic. Big up the taxi driver for maintaining his cool and composure. mans a hero!

but what kind of btec operation was this that the terrorists had to hail a cab to the destination.

 

[Ramsay]

Who’s behind this heinous attack?

 

[Bewal Express]

Thankfully these losers failed in their bid to kill innocent people.

 

[in_cutter]

So the guy was a Christian (converted from Islam). Narrative has now changed to ‘mental health issues’.

 

[Technics 1210]

So the guy was a Christian (converted from Islam). Narrative has now changed to ‘mental health issues’.

Yup. And recent bombs by the IRA are not even reported as terrorist attacks either.

 

[Robert]

So the guy was a Christian (converted from Islam). Narrative has now changed to ‘mental health issues’.

I didn’t know there was a narrative to change.

The deceased man’s name was Al Swealman, who had been sectioned for six months under the Mental Health Act for behaviour with a knife.

Four men arrested have been released without charge.

 

[MenInG]

Four men arrested under terrorism laws following a bomb explosion outside Liverpool Women's Hospital on Sunday have been released without charge.

It comes after police named Emad Al Swealmeen as the man who died when a homemade device blew up in the back of a taxi shortly before 11.00 GMT.

It is understood the 32-year-old was an asylum seeker from the Middle East who converted to Christianity in 2017.

Police say "important evidence" has been found at an address he rented.

In an update on Monday evening, Assistant Chief Constable Russ Jackson, head of Counter Terrorism Policing North West, said the property at Rutland Avenue near Sefton Park, in the south-east of the city, was "becoming central to the investigation".

This was the address where Al Swealmeen was picked up by the taxi before being driven to the maternity hospital.

ACC Jackson said: "We have made significant progress since Sunday morning and have a much greater understanding of the component parts of the device, how they were obtained and how the parts are likely to have been assembled."

But he said it could take weeks to establish how the incident was planned and prepared.

Four men were arrested in the Kensington area of Liverpool - three aged 21, 26 and 29, who were held on Sunday, and a 20-year-old man who was detained on Monday.

ACC Jackson said: "Following interviews with the arrested men, we are satisfied with the accounts they have provided and they have been released from police custody."

Reports suggest Al Swealmeen formally converted from Islam to Christianity at a ceremony in Liverpool's Anglican Cathedral. The cathedral, which was the scene of the city's main Remembrance Day service on Sunday, is a short distance from Liverpool Women's Hospital.

After his conversion, Al Swealmeen briefly lived with a local couple, Elizabeth and Malcolm Hitchcott, at their home.

Mrs Hitchcott told the BBC she was "just so sad" and "very shocked", adding: "We just loved him, he was a lovely guy."

Speaking to ITV News, Mr Hitchcott said in the years before the attack he had been sectioned under the Mental Health Act for about six months because of his behaviour with a knife.

Another address in Sutcliffe Street in the city, where officers believe Al Swealmeen previously lived, is also part of the investigation.

The taxi driver David Perry escaped before his car caught fire and has since been discharged from hospital.

The UK terror threat level was raised from "substantial" to "severe" on Monday, meaning an attack is "highly likely", because the explosion in Liverpool was the second incident in a month, following the death of Conservative MP Sir David Amess.

Deputy Assistant Commissioner Matt Twist, one of Counter Terrorism Policing's senior national co-ordinators, said the change was a "precautionary measure and not based on any specific threat".

BBC

 

[Bewal Express]

So the guy was a Christian (converted from Islam). Narrative has now changed to ‘mental health issues’.

The vast majority of these losers have mental health issues and mostly linked to smoking cannabis. I take your point that it's emphasised when it suits the narrative

 

[Bewal Express]

I didn’t know there was a narrative to change.

The deceased man’s name was Al Swealman, who had been sectioned for six months under the Mental Health Act for behaviour with a knife.

Four men arrested have been released without charge.

What is worrying is that he knew how to make a bomb.

 

[drubwrubnat]

A syrian iraqi muslim asylum seeker recently converted to christianity, and detonated a suicide bomb near the Sunday 11am Cathedral ( not the hospital ) whilst having mental issues. The plot was foiled by a heroic taxi driver.

 

[Manunited18]

The hypocrisy is mind boggling. As this pathetic loser was a Christian convert, mental health issues were quickly attached. The question is he seemed mentally stable enough to manufacture a home made bomb device

 

[street cricketer]

So I just saw the cctv video of the incident and the explosion. This guy must be the most low budget terrorist out there because he basically ended up making a bomb roughly to the same potency to what we call a country bomb in India that small time rowdies use. The cab driver did not jump out just in the nick of time as mentioned in the media, I always thought the story was too good to be true.

Looks like the cab driver had pressed the central lock and locked all the doors of the car from inside and yes, the cab driver was incredibly inside the car along with the suicide bomber when the bomb went off. After there is a minor explosion in the rear end of the car, the driver is seen escaping and running out of the car through the open door of the driver side, with the rear end starting to smoke through because of the explosion. The driver apparently had a torn ear drum, a back fracture and some minor injuries.

So this bloke made a DIY home-made bomb which had the potency to kill basically none but himself as it was wrapped around his waist. If there was a university for terrorists, this guy would have failed at his practicals miserably. Either he's an incredibly stupid terrorist or just plain insane. Fortunately, nobody else was severely injured in the attack. The world would be a far better and more peaceful place if all the terrorists were as stupid at their job as this guy was.

 

[Robert]

What is worrying is that he knew how to make a bomb.

Police say they have found evidence in his room, so they will work out where he got the knowledge from.

 

[Robert]

The hypocrisy is mind boggling. As this pathetic loser was a Christian convert, mental health issues were quickly attached. The question is he seemed mentally stable enough to manufacture a home made bomb device

So medical history of being sectioned is hypocrisy now? Or are you saying the press invented a false medical history?

 

[Technics 1210]

So medical history of being sectioned is hypocrisy now? Or are you saying the press invented a false medical history?

He means if the terrorist was Muslim instead of a Christian then the media would not mention his mental health issues.

Now that the public are aware he was a Christian convert, his medical and mental health issues are being plastered all over the news.

Thus hypocrisy.

 

[Manunited18]

He means if the terrorist was Muslim instead of a Christian then the media would not mention his mental health issues.

Now that the public are aware he was a Christian convert, his medical and mental health issues are being plastered all over the news.

Thus hypocrisy.

Yep

 

[Gilly]

So medical history of being sectioned is hypocrisy now? Or are you saying the press invented a false medical history?

Strawman argument.

 

[mazkhan]

This what happens when you let all these bogus asylum seekers and chancers in from these countries

Britain has lost total control of its immigration since Tony Blair became pm.

These millions that are being shipped over here in last 20-25 yrs have destroyed the country and infrastructure.

 

[mazkhan]

He means if the terrorist was Muslim instead of a Christian then the media would not mention his mental health issues.

Now that the public are aware he was a Christian convert, his medical and mental health issues are being plastered all over the news.

Thus hypocrisy.

He only converted to Christianity to get a visa and British passport .

The guy was not even a syrian but iraqi .

A bogus asylum seeker and chancer.

Thank god he didn't kill everyone the lunatic was at a maternity wing and gonna blow up mothers and babies

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

So the guy was a Christian (converted from Islam). Narrative has now changed to ‘mental health issues’.

He probably converted to Christianity to improve his chances of getting asylum. What's more worrying is that he was on the counter terrorism radar, and that despite having mental issues, no one saw this coming.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

This what happens when you let all these bogus asylum seekers and chancers in from these countries

Britain has lost total control of its immigration since Tony Blair became pm.

These millions that are being shipped over here in last 20-25 yrs have destroyed the country and infrastructure.

Problem is, because we have been waging wars in many of these countries like Iraq, Afghanistan and Syria, then we feel obliged to let good few numbers of them in over here. That is the reason why many of those who come here support our war efforts in the first place. It would be pretty hard to justify bombing countries then expecting our allies over there to stay there and enjoy getting bombed.

There will be genuine asylum seekers, but inevitably there will be chancers, lunatics, and actual ISIS sleepers sneaking over as well.

 

[Robert]

Strawman argument.

Not an argument, a request for clarification.

 

[Gilly]

Not an argument, a request for clarification.

Not you, I meant you are replying to a strawman argument.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Strawman argument.

Muslims are still deemed terrorists even if they have health concerns

 

[Gilly]

Muslims are still deemed terrorists even if they have health concerns

Terrorism is related to the intent behind the act.

 

[sweep_shot]

I am glad nobody else was killed.

This could've been worse.

 

[rhony]

So I just saw the cctv video of the incident and the explosion. This guy must be the most low budget terrorist out there because he basically ended up making a bomb roughly to the same potency to what we call a country bomb in India that small time rowdies use. The cab driver did not jump out just in the nick of time as mentioned in the media, I always thought the story was too good to be true.

Looks like the cab driver had pressed the central lock and locked all the doors of the car from inside and yes, the cab driver was incredibly inside the car along with the suicide bomber when the bomb went off. After there is a minor explosion in the rear end of the car, the driver is seen escaping and running out of the car through the open door of the driver side, with the rear end starting to smoke through because of the explosion. The driver apparently had a torn ear drum, a back fracture and some minor injuries.

So this bloke made a DIY home-made bomb which had the potency to kill basically none but himself as it was wrapped around his waist. If there was a university for terrorists, this guy would have failed at his practicals miserably. Either he's an incredibly stupid terrorist or just plain insane. Fortunately, nobody else was severely injured in the attack. The world would be a far better and more peaceful place if all the terrorists were as stupid at their job as this guy was.

It's not always about the number of victims. It's about the ability of an average village idiot acting independently to make a bomb and ready to blow some one up. The impact of this is far reaching with every brown person with a backpack a potential suspect. Every guy that's not white is suspicious.

It's like that Japanese guy that got beaten up for corona virus in US.

 

[James]

It sounds like the cab driver thought on his feet here and was incredibly brave. We need to hear his testimony.

 

[street cricketer]

It sounds like the cab driver thought on his feet here and was incredibly brave. We need to hear his testimony.

I think he locked himself in with the suicide bomber to prevent a massive loss of human lives. Must be appreciated and awarded a bravery medal.

 

[MenInG]

Priti Patel has said the suspected Liverpool terror attacker was able to exploit Britain's "dysfunctional" asylum system to remain in the country.

On a three-day visit to Washington, the UK's home secretary said the system was a "complete merry-go-round" with a "whole industry" devoted to defending the rights of individuals intent on causing harm.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Terrorism is related to the intent behind the act.

Except that's patently disingenuous isn't it?.

 

[Robert]

Not you, I meant you are replying to a strawman argument.

Ok.

 

[Robert]

Priti Patel has said the suspected Liverpool terror attacker was able to exploit Britain's "dysfunctional" asylum system to remain in the country.

On a three-day visit to Washington, the UK's home secretary said the system was a "complete merry-go-round" with a "whole industry" devoted to defending the rights of individuals intent on causing harm.

I knew Patel would jump on this bandwagon. The daughter of refugees fleeing persecution, she is pulling up the ladder on more refugees, while using this tragedy to fire up the culture war and distract from the government’s current difficulties over sleaze.

 

[Technics 1210]

Priti Patel has said the suspected Liverpool terror attacker was able to exploit Britain's "dysfunctional" asylum system to remain in the country.

On a three-day visit to Washington, the UK's home secretary said the system was a "complete merry-go-round" with a "whole industry" devoted to defending the rights of individuals intent on causing harm.

She is spot on. The asylum seeker process needs a complete overall. It's bad enough that over stayers or illegals cannot be deported with ease, but the screening process for Asylum seekers needs to be more stringent.

 

[Technics 1210]

I knew Patel would jump on this bandwagon. The daughter of refugees fleeing persecution, she is pulling up the ladder on more refugees, while using this tragedy to fire up the culture war and distract from the government’s current difficulties over sleaze.

She is making the point of having a better process that can distinguish and deal with between genuine and fraudulent asylum seekers. She is the daughter of genuine asylum seekers.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

She is making the point of having a better process that can distinguish and deal with between genuine and fraudulent asylum seekers. She is the daughter of genuine asylum seekers.

You don't think asylum seekers from Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc are genuine?

 

[Technics 1210]

You don't think asylum seekers from Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc are genuine?

Where did I said that? I am merely expanding on your point in 26 : There will be genuine asylum seekers, but inevitably there will be chancers, lunatics, and actual ISIS sleepers sneaking over as well.

So let me repeat, we need a better screening process.

 

[Robert]

She is making the point of having a better process that can distinguish and deal with between genuine and fraudulent asylum seekers. She is the daughter of genuine asylum seekers.

This guy was a failed asylum seeker. He was denied asylum in 2014 and then denied again on appeal in 2017.

Why didn’t Patel deport him?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

This guy was a failed asylum seeker. He was denied asylum in 2014 and then denied again on appeal in 2017.

Why didn’t Patel deport him?

Especially as she was appointed specifically to do this after criticising previous administrations for not being far tougher.

 

[Technics 1210]

This guy was a failed asylum seeker. He was denied asylum in 2014 and then denied again on appeal in 2017.

Why didn’t Patel deport him?

Was Patel home sec in 2014 and 2017? It took Thersea May over 10 years to deport Abu Hamza, a convicted terrorist because of ECJ human rights. So what chance did the UK government have to deport a failed Asylum seeker?

Now that we are out of the EU deportation will be straight forward.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Was Patel home sec in 2014 and 2017? It took Thersea May over 10 years to deport Abu Hamza, a convicted terrorist because of ECJ human rights. So what chance did the UK government have to deport a failed Asylum seeker?

Now that we are out of the EU deportation will be straight forward.

Straightforward? Lol. Priti is begging France to stop allowing these asylum seekers through, why would they feel any obligation to do that when Britain is no longer part of the EU?

 

[DeadlyVenom]

The asylum system is heavily abused.

Many Iranians become Christians/Bahais/Zoroastrians and claim asylum.

Many Pakistanis become homosexuals/Christians but one that has been more common recently is Ahmedi.

Indians are similar to the Pakistanis.

These chancers make the process difficult for legitimate asylum seekers.

Interestingly whenever they get a permanent visa they go back home for a holiday. There are many like the Aussie cricketer Fawad Ahmed in the UK - he claimed asylum but went back to play PSL lol.

Britain needs to flat out reject asylum from Asian countries and Iran & Iraq. Maybe this will help.

Its a hopeless situation overall with no winners, and for once I sympathise with Priti Patel.

 

[Technics 1210]

Straightforward? Lol. Priti is begging France to stop allowing these asylum seekers through, why would they feel any obligation to do that when Britain is no longer part of the EU?

We know France have a chip on their shoulder over Brexit, so makes sense France want to make an example of the UK.

I suggest you read up on how many illegal immigrants were deported in the past month since the UK was out of the EU, but no, I dare you to do a Gary Lineker as an EUphile and open your home to asylum seekers. 3.2.1 Go!

 

[Tubs]

Some people are saying that he may have 'converted' to Christianity to get asylum easier. Regardless of whether he is 'genuine' Christian or not, he still committed a terror act. Even if he may have mental health issues, it is still an act of terror.

And I see the 'if he was Muslim he'd be labelled a terrorist immediately' victimhood has infested this thread already. Just this year, a mass shooting was conducted by a person of Arab descent (I think Syrian), and it has been declared that he was mentally ill, with no mention of Islam or Islamic extremism at all. If you're too myopic to look at this stuff at a case-by-case basis, then that's your issue.

 

[Robert]

Was Patel home sec in 2014 and 2017? It took Thersea May over 10 years to deport Abu Hamza, a convicted terrorist because of ECJ human rights. So what chance did the UK government have to deport a failed Asylum seeker?

Now that we are out of the EU deportation will be straight forward.

Let’s tease that out.

Hamza was not deported, he was extradited to the USA after being held on remand in Belmarsh. He was married to a Briton so had legal protection. The ECHR (not ECH) held extradition up because it was unconvinced that the US would treat him decently. Hamza remained in British custody while the ECHR considered this issue.

The ECJ exists to manage alleged breaches of a member state’s obligations to the EU. It cannot overrule a member state criminal court.

The ECHR is an institution of the European Council, of which UK is a founder member. UK is still a member of the European Council which was set up in 1947 to uphold human rights and democracy.

Swealmeen didn’t appeal to the ECHR, so why didn’t Patel deport him?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

We know France have a chip on their shoulder over Brexit, so makes sense France want to make an example of the UK.

I suggest you read up on how many illegal immigrants were deported in the past month since the UK was out of the EU, but no, I dare you to do a Gary Lineker as an EUphile and open your home to asylum seekers. 3.2.1 Go!

I have a better solution: stop fighting other people's wars halfway across the world, then we wouldn't feel any obligation to house asylum seekers in the first place. Who knows, if Libya or Syria didn't get bombed to buggery with their economies shattered by sanctions and warfare, you might get more of them being happy to stay where they are.

 

[Technics 1210]

I have a better solution: stop fighting other people's wars halfway across the world, then we wouldn't feel any obligation to house asylum seekers in the first place. Who knows, if Libya or Syria didn't get bombed to buggery with their economies shattered by sanctions and warfare, you might get more of them being happy to stay where they are.

A better solution is to stop fighting other people’s wars? Give a salute to Captain obvious.

Use your brain - you think asylum seekers from war torn nations want to become Teachers, Doctors, Engineers? How about they want to avenge the death of their families at the hands of the West?

 

[Technics 1210]

Let’s tease that out.

Hamza was not deported, he was extradited to the USA after being held on remand in Belmarsh. He was married to a Briton so had legal protection. The ECHR (not ECH) held extradition up because it was unconvinced that the US would treat him decently. Hamza remained in British custody while the ECHR considered this issue.

The ECJ exists to manage alleged breaches of a member state’s obligations to the EU. It cannot overrule a member state criminal court.

The ECHR is an institution of the European Council, of which UK is a founder member. UK is still a member of the European Council which was set up in 1947 to uphold human rights and democracy.

Swealmeen didn’t appeal to the ECHR, so why didn’t Patel deport him?

Patel wasn’t HS in 2014 or 2017, she was HS in 2019. This is the simple answer. What’s your point here?

On top of this, if Patel does talk of deportation then its the left who cry racist or what not. As witnessed in this thread too.

As for Abu Hamza, he was on an extradition order for being a convicted terrorist. The ECJ proved that the UK was powerless hence a further impetus for Brexit.

Case in point, you were quite supportive of Asange being extradited right? Yet he doesn’t come under ECJ because he is actually Australian.

So which side do you sit on? HS has the power to deport without being labelled inhumane, sleaze, racist? Or do you sit in the humanitarian side? Open all borders and accept free for all?

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

A better solution is to stop fighting other people’s wars? Give a salute to Captain obvious.

Use your brain - you think asylum seekers from war torn nations want to become Teachers, Doctors, Engineers? How about they want to avenge the death of their families at the hands of the West?

Such a dumb comment it's not even worth a response. You are clearly just trolling, albeit there are probably mental issues as well.

 

[Technics 1210]

Such a dumb comment it's not even worth a response. You are clearly just trolling, albeit there are probably mental issues as well.

Yet you did respond cos my point stands and it is a point to ponder.

Take a break. Come back when you have an answer - that is if you don't put words in people's mouth.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Yet you did respond cos my point stands and it is a point to ponder.

Take a break. Come back when you have an answer - that is if you don't put words in people's mouth.

So you seriously believe asylum speakers are risking death on the high seas, detention in refugee camps and such so they can come and avenge the deaths of their families at the hands of the west? Bear in mind many asylum seekers are women and children? And before you pipe up most of them are men, let me interject that 99% of those aren't blowing up hospitals either.

 

[Technics 1210]

So you seriously believe asylum speakers are risking death on the high seas, detention in refugee camps and such so they can come and avenge the deaths of their families at the hands of the west? Bear in mind many asylum seekers are women and children? And before you pipe up most of them are men, let me interject that 99% of those aren't blowing up hospitals either.

Again, you are putting words in people’s mouth. Stop this nonsense.

I merely mentioned that refugees from war torn countries are not motivated by professional fields of work such as engineers, doctors, etc - but their loss of family at the hands of a Western manufactured bombs still hurts them. You imploded - pardon the pun - cos your juvenile behaviour on this forum has never entertained the opposing thought. You know why? All you do is paraphrase mainstream media.

You can wind your neck in, I will not fall for you web of words game, I will pull you up on your lies, ignorance, and silly word games.

 

[Technics 1210]

What Captain Rishwat is saying is that if his family (and this is purely a hypothetical) was bombed in a war, an illegal war potentially, lost his family to ‘collateral damage’ as the West would say, then he will forgive and forget, and dare I say it, move on; be it as a refugee in another country, be it as an astronaut or whatever profession.

Pull the other one and jog on.

 

[Robert]

Patel wasn’t HS in 2014 or 2017, she was HS in 2019. This is the simple answer. What’s your point here?

On top of this, if Patel does talk of deportation then its the left who cry racist or what not. As witnessed in this thread too.

As for Abu Hamza, he was on an extradition order for being a convicted terrorist. The ECJ proved that the UK was powerless hence a further impetus for Brexit.

Case in point, you were quite supportive of Asange being extradited right? Yet he doesn’t come under ECJ because he is actually Australian.

So which side do you sit on? HS has the power to deport without being labelled inhumane, sleaze, racist? Or do you sit in the humanitarian side? Open all borders and accept free for all?

You can’t have read my previous post. The ECJ had no involvement in the Hamza case. UK criminal law was outside its aegis. The ECHR was involved. This is not an EU court, it is a Council of Europe court. and British criminal law can be overruled by it since 1947.

I’m on the “side” of sacking Patel for incompetence and appointing a competent Home Secretary. Patel had nearly a year to deport this guy in Liverpool and didn’t. She was not held up by the EHCR. She did nothing. She failed to act. That’s my point.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Again, you are putting words in people’s mouth. Stop this nonsense.

I didn't put any words in your mouth, I included the quote just so there was no confusion. Maybe write what you actually mean and then I can respond to that, but I'm not a mind reader so at present I can only respond to your quotes.

 

[Technics 1210]

You can’t have read my previous post. The ECJ had no involvement in the Hamza case. UK criminal law was outside its aegis. The ECHR was involved. This is not an EU court, it is a Council of Europe court. and British criminal law can be overruled by it since 1947.

I’m on the “side” of sacking Patel for incompetence and appointing a competent Home Secretary. Patel had nearly a year to deport this guy in Liverpool and didn’t. She was not held up by the EHCR. She did nothing. She failed to act. That’s my point.

You make no sense. When Patel talks of deporting, you claim the government is sleaze and racist. Windrush ring a bell too? Were you not accusing the then government of being racist?

Now you demand of Patel accordingly? You may have not read my post, PAtel was not HS in 2014 or 2017.

What do you support? Deportation of illegal immigrants/refugees, or cries of racism when deportation is at then helm.

As. For Abu Hamza and ECJ :

Abu Hamza extradition to US blocked by European court - https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2010/jul/08/abu-hamza-human-rights-ruling?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

 

[Technics 1210]

I didn't put any words in your mouth, I included the quote just so there was no confusion. Maybe write what you actually mean and then I can respond to that, but I'm not a mind reader so at present I can only respond to your quotes.

More web of words.

Come back to me when you have a citation where I stated causal racism is ok.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

More web of words.

Come back to me when you have a citation where I stated causal racism is ok.

Why are you deliberately mis-spelling casual with 'causal'? Once I could let go as a mistake, but twice is no slip of the keyboard. If you just don't understand how it's spelt then I would suggest don't make it a central point of your argument.

 

[Firebat]

Liverpool bomb: Flames beat me back, says explosion witness

A couple who were metres away from a bomb that exploded outside Liverpool Women's Hospital on Sunday say they have been left in "shock" and "numb".

Liam Spencer and Stephanie Stitt, who were in their car at the time, told the BBC they felt a "big impact" and first thought there had been a crash.

Emad Al Swealmeen was killed when his homemade device exploded inside a taxi.

Mr Spencer said he tried to pull Al Swealmeen from the burning wreckage of the taxi but the flames stopped him.

The 21-year-old, who used to work at the hospital, had been visiting with Ms Stitt to collect some of his possessions when the explosion happened just before 11:00 GMT.

After grabbing Ms Stitt, 20, and taking her to the hospital's reception, Mr Spencer returned to the burning car.

Realising that taxi driver David Perry was safe, and not knowing what had caused the explosion, Mr Spencer went to see if there were any passengers.

Seeing a man in the back of the cab, Mr Spencer said: "I went to go grab him but he became engulfed in flames very quickly and I couldn't reach hold of them without setting myself on fire."

He and Ms Stitt returned to get help and a fire extinguisher but the flames went up "so, so quickly".

It was only later the couple were told what had actually happened.

Ms Stitt said: "At the time, I just couldn't stop shaking. I think it was just the adrenaline and the whole shock of everything.

"I haven't stopped crying because... I thought the car had been hit and then all this stuff had gone flying over the car and I'm just thinking that things could have been different, like my life could have been lost more than anything or I could be in a worse situation than I am now."

Taxi driver David Perry escaped seconds before his car fully caught light and has since been discharged from hospital.

His wife has said he was lucky to be alive.

In the days after the explosion it emerged that 32-year-old Al Swealmeen, whose claims for asylum in the UK had been turned down, began making purchases for his attack in April.

Mr Spencer and Ms Stitt said they remained in shock at what they had witnessed.

"As much as I'm laughing and joking with everyone, like I would normally, there's just always that feeling in the back of my head," Mr Spencer said.

"Just what if things had gone different and I'm just constantly worried about 'what if?'."

Ms Stitt said: "I think I'm the same really. I think at the minute I'm an emotional wreck.

"There's a lot of anger in a sense at times. Why did that have to happen to me, why did I have to be in that wrong place, wrong time?"

Mr Spencer said Al Swealmeen was a "coward".

"I just think it's a selfish and cowardly thing to do."

Ms Stitt added that the couple wanted to thank the doctors and nurses at the hospital for "helping us on that day and doing whatever they could to help".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-59327506

 

[Robert]

You make no sense. When Patel talks of deporting, you claim the government is sleaze and racist. Windrush ring a bell too? Were you not accusing the then government of being racist?

Now you demand of Patel accordingly? You may have not read my post, PAtel was not HS in 2014 or 2017.

What do you support? Deportation of illegal immigrants/refugees, or cries of racism when deportation is at then helm.

As. For Abu Hamza and ECJ :

Abu Hamza extradition to US blocked by European court - https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2010/jul/08/abu-hamza-human-rights-ruling?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Ok, so May and Rudd screwed up too. Then Patel got the job, and the Home Office didn’t deport this bomber guy on her watch either.

I support the law. If this guy was not a refugee he should have been deported. Windrush is a different kettle of fish. West Indians “answered the call” from the Foreign Office, entered the UK legally, and as they were British citizens, they stayed. But some were not able to prove citizenship under the Hostile Environment as they never acquired passports, and were deported.

Once more with feeling - the ECHR, not the ECJ, blocked Hamza extradition. The ECJ had no power in this area, but the ECHR did. UK law can still be overruled by the ECHR because we remain signatories to Council of Europe.

 

[Technics 1210]

Ok, so May and Rudd screwed up too. Then Patel got the job, and the Home Office didn’t deport this bomber guy on her watch either.

I support the law. If this guy was not a refugee he should have been deported. Windrush is a different kettle of fish. West Indians “answered the call” from the Foreign Office, entered the UK legally, and as they were British citizens, they stayed. But some were not able to prove citizenship under the Hostile Environment as they never acquired passports, and were deported.

Once more with feeling - the ECHR, not the ECJ, blocked Hamza extradition. The ECJ had no power in this area, but the ECHR did. UK law can still be overruled by the ECHR because we remain signatories to Council of Europe.

You need to understand the mandatory requirements for deportation. The first is the person must have a passport for the country to which they are being deported too, secondly, those who overstay their visa status go into hiding. The home office has a record of those who overstay, this is dead easy and derived from the Passport scans at the ports.

Also I am not sure you have read the article. Here is the 1st paragraph:

Europe's highest court today said it would not allow Abu Hamza and three other men held in Britain to be extradited to the United States to face terrorism charges until it is satisfied they will not be treated inhumanely.

What is Europes Highest Court? The ECJ.

The ECHR is the European convention of human rights, it’s not a court; rights which are applied by the European courts, in this case the ECJ.

The difference now that the UK has left, is that the ECHR can still be applied but UK courts will have full 100% jurisdiction and the ECJ will not. This is the key difference now.

 

[Robert]

What is Europes Highest Court? The ECJ.

The ECHR is the European convention of human rights, it’s not a court; rights which are applied by the European courts, in this case the ECJ.

The difference now that the UK has left, is that the ECHR can still be applied but UK courts will have full 100% jurisdiction and the ECJ will not. This is the key difference now.

Seriously suggest you look up European Court of Human Rights - which sits in Strasbourg and is a function of the Council of Europe - and have a read.

It is not the same court as the European Court of Justice which is a function of the EU and has different powers.

Council of Europe =/= European Union.

 

[Technics 1210]

Seriously suggest you look up European Court of Human Rights - which sits in Strasbourg and is a function of the Council of Europe - and have a read.

It is not the same court as the European Court of Justice which is a function of the EU and has different powers.

Council of Europe =/= European Union.

Your are confusing rights (ECHR) with a court of law that ensures those rights are applied (ECJ).

If you want to claim ECJ is not a court, not the higest court in Europe, and the article is wrong, then fine.

 

[MenInG]

The Liverpool terror attacker died from the blast from his improvised explosive device after calling his brother to warn he might do "something bad", a coroner has said.

Emad al Swealmeen died in a taxi outside Liverpool Women's Hospital when the device detonated on Remembrance Sunday on 14 November.

He made it with "murderous intent" and could have killed "many, many innocent people" - but it is unclear whether he intended for the device to go off when it did, said senior coroner Andre Rebello.

Ball bearings from the explosion blew out the taxi windscreen with such force it travelled 16 metres and hit a tree, the inquest heard.

Recording a narrative conclusion, the coroner said: "(Al Swealmeen) died from an explosion and subsequent fire caused by an improvised explosive device which he had carried into the taxi.

"It is found he manufactured the improvised explosive device, designed to project shrapnel, with murderous intent."

The inquest also heard that al Swealmeen, 32, had called his brother in America two days before the blast and suggested he might do "something bad".

Tory councillor to pay 'substantial' damages to Jeremy Corbyn over doctored photo of ex-Labour leader at scene of Liverpool terror attack

David Perry with his wife Rachel
Liverpool terror attack: 'It's a miracle I'm alive' - Taxi driver who survived explosion condemns 'evil act'

Mr Rebello told the inquest: "He says towards the end of call Emad said something like 'if I do something bad that will affect the family what do you think?'

"He replied something like 'don't do s***', advising him as an older brother, although this was something which caused him concern, knowing his previous issues."

No one else died in the blast - which happened moments after the taxi pulled up - and the driver David Perry had a miraculous escape and managed to run from the car.

The inquest heard he had picked up al Swealmeen from his Rutland Avenue flat, with the attacker pushing himself up against the window and the door.

Mr Rebello said: "The only words he spoke were 'Women's Hospital' in what Mr Perry describes as a foreign, Middle Eastern accent."

"As his car came to a stop he didn't notice anything unusual, no warning, no movement from the passenger, just the blast," the coroner added.

Mr Perry blacked out for a few seconds before coming to and feeling burning on his back.

"He could see smoke and smell burning plastic and the smell of burning body and thought 'I'm dead if I don't get out'," Mr Rebello said.

"He saw light coming from the floor near his driver's door and without taking his seatbelt off he pushed the door as hard as he could to force himself out of the car.

"He didn't know if the passenger was still in there, he didn't turn round to look at him."

Iraq-born al Swealmeen came to the UK legally on a visa in May 2014, the coroner said.

"Shortly after his arrival he claimed, it is believed falsely, that he was of Syrian heritage and claimed asylum as a refugee from that country," said Mr Rebello.

All his asylum claims were rejected - the last in November 2020.

Liverpool Coroner's Court heard claims that al Swealmeen had converted from Islam to Christianity in order to improve his asylum chances.

Detective Chief Inspector Andrew Meeks said he agreed, as becoming a Christian would have made him "liable to persecution on return to Syria or Iraq".

When al Swealmeen's accommodation was searched a Koran and prayer mat were found, the coroner added, suggesting he still followed Islam.

Mr Meeks said it was accurate to describe the Rutland Avenue address as a "bomb-making factory", but that there was so far no evidence to suggest anyone else had helped make the device.

He said al Swealmeen had bought 2,000 ball bearings and that items likely to have been intended for use in improvised firearms were also found at his previous address in Sutcliffe Street.

The chief inspector confirmed he had not been on the radar of security services and that police were still investigating what his intention was.

SKY

 

[Halaribo]

Again, you are putting words in people’s mouth. Stop this nonsense.

I merely mentioned that refugees from war torn countries are not motivated by professional fields of work such as engineers, doctors, etc - but their loss of family at the hands of a Western manufactured bombs still hurts them. You imploded - pardon the pun - cos your juvenile behaviour on this forum has never entertained the opposing thought. You know why? All you do is paraphrase mainstream media.

You can wind your neck in, I will not fall for you web of words game, I will pull you up on your lies, ignorance, and silly word games.

You literally have no idea about what the asylum system is like, what happens within it, the profiles of claimants, the trends or patterns known about claimants.

You literally parrot your media of choice and then make stuff up from fantasy (similar to many of your other posts).

As someone who works in this field on a day to day basis... you're the one who should wind their neck in, because you literally know nothing about what you're talking about.

You can't even acknowledge or seem to understand that the ECHR is a court and is independent of the ECJ lol. You're lost.

 

[MenInG]

The Liverpool terror attacker's asylum claim was dismissed six years before he tried to carry out his strike, court documents show.

Emad al Swealmeen died after his homemade bomb detonated inside a taxi outside Liverpool Women's Hospital on Remembrance Sunday last year.