London attacks: Fatalities after vehicle and stabbing incidents

[Robert]

Sorry to butt in, but i think the biggest reason why Poland hasn't suffered any jihadist attack is because they have flat out refused to grant asylum to any refugees. Even their immigration policy is very strict. Same for Japan. No terrorist attacks there as they refuse 99% of immigrants.

I remember reading somewhere that around 1,50,000 Polish people took to the streets in Warsaw to protest against 'Islamification of Europe' sometime back.

But the British jihadis aren't refugees, they are born Britons. There have been Muslims in Poland since the 1500s when their neighboured one of the caliphates. Albeit not many in comparison with the UK.

 

[mani1]

Of course, not for an instant do I agree with EDL and MAGA idiots.

NATO stopped the genocide of Muslims in Bosnia.

Not getting the thrust of your second point.

Israel is a constant fly in the ointment of course. But no POTUS will end support for them because he will lose the Bible Belt vote if he does. Catch-22.

I think we can agree that the Saudis are exporting terror which kills far more Muslims than it kills Westerners, and if the West had never intervened in any Muslim counties this would still happen.

Nato got involved in Kosovo not Bosnia. As for the Saudi's, I think the Qatari's have over taken them but considering they own the Shard, Harrods, the Olympic Village HSBC etc etc We need them.

The second point in regards to integration was not directed at you bit others.

 

[Bewal Express]

Germany is seen as part of Europe . But most don't attach Germany or Sweden . When they start attacking Argentina or Mexico then you may have a point.

No attacks in Europe or America before the war of terror . If people want to keep denying foreign policy isn't the main cause , their choice . Luckily we have a leader in Corbyn who isn't burying his head in the sand.

How will they attack Argentina or Mexico if they don't have people to attack them because there has been no recent Muslim migration to these countries. If your argument goes it logical conclusion then get rid of all muslims from your society and you won't be attacked. Foreign policy or no foreign policy, let's call them the **** they are.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

It is so difficult to control these "stabbing incidents". How do police detect them ?

You can't really legislate for knife attacks as they don't make much sense from a political organisation point of view. So I suppose the only comfort to be taken is that as a result very few people will be attracted to such a cause. It's like suicide int that respect, you can't really understand those who do it, but there are plenty out there that do.

 

[Adil_94]

The ideological extremism behind these attackers motivations needs to be challenged and eradicated..No doubt these guys will be Salafi Jihadis and non violent extremism also needs to be clamped down especially those spreading hatred against western lifestyles and the way of life of everyone.

Foreign policy is one component of what these guys do. They have attacked countries who have opposed western interventions in certain countries. These guys also hate the western way of life its anti thetical to their world view. The same old tired tropes of it purely a foreign policy issue doesnt hold up.
Theyve done attacks in Kabul in Manila and now London in Ramadan.

Baghdadi did call Ramadan the month of Jihad 3 years ago and IS are living up to their reputation to wreak havoc in this month.

The Salafi Wahhabi extremist ideology has been around for 200 + yeara ever since Ibn Wahab and the days of the first Saudi state and it has been hostile to outsiders since its inception. Way before any colonial interventions or neo imperialist invasions.

Gulf funded mosques really need to be looked at as do any mosques that are preaching hatred and disunity. Govt also needs to look at ghettotisation and segregation too.

 

[KingKhanWC]

Actually the WTC was bombed before the WOT, and 9/11 marked the start of the WOT. There was no reason to go into Afghanistan prior to that.

And why no jihadist attacks in Poland? They put more soldiers into Afghanistan than the UK did.

More complex than Corbyn would have you believe. His head is in a different sandpit.

911 was a false flag attack to launch a imperial war on the Middle East & for the protection of Israel . But even if you disagree , the point still stands regarding Britain. Besides history didn't start at 911, try the last 100 years before that .

 

[KingKhanWC]

How will they attack Argentina or Mexico if they don't have people to attack them because there has been no recent Muslim migration to these countries. If your argument goes it logical conclusion then get rid of all muslims from your society and you won't be attacked. Foreign policy or no foreign policy, let's call them the **** they are.

There are plenty of muslims in South America too .

Of course these attackers are the lowest of the low but burying your head as to the deeper issues & root causes is for the intellectually bankrupt.

 

[mani1]

The ideological extremism behind these attackers motivations needs to be challenged and eradicated..No doubt these guys will be Salafi Jihadis and non violent extremism also needs to be clamped down especially those spreading hatred against western lifestyles and the way of life of everyone.

Foreign policy is one component of what these guys do. They have attacked countries who have opposed western interventions in certain countries. These guys also hate the western way of life its anti thetical to their world view. The same old tired tropes of it purely a foreign policy issue doesnt hold up.
Theyve done attacks in Kabul in Manila and now London in Ramadan.

Baghdadi did call Ramadan the month of Jihad 3 years ago and IS are living up to their reputation to wreak havoc in this month.

The Salafi Wahhabi extremist ideology has been around for 200 + yeara ever since Ibn Wahab and the days of the first Saudi state and it has been hostile to outsiders since its inception. Way before any colonial interventions or neo imperialist invasions.

Gulf funded mosques really need to be looked at as do any mosques that are preaching hatred and disunity. Govt also needs to look at ghettotisation and segregation too.

What benefit would that bring? How many of the terrorists are from Tower Hamlets Newham, Ilford, Bradford Oldham etc

How would the Government go about doing this? Would it be pump billions in like they have in Manchester, (Moss side) Leeds (Chapeltown) London (Brixton) etc

Also Teresa may could put pressure on Oxbridge like Cameron did by saying something like more Muslims live in "Ghettos" than go to top University's "British Society has failed Muslim's"

 

[Adil_94]

9/11 happened before War on Terror started. Thats what triggered it. Not to mention World Trade Centre bombing in 1993. U.S embassies were attacked in Tanzania and Kenya in 1998. War on Terror has accentuated the problem. But these type of groups and this ideology has been around since before the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq.

 

[Robert]

Nato got involved in Kosovo not Bosnia.

NATO put 54,000 soldiers into Bosnia after the UN peacekeeping mission failed.

 

[Adil_94]

[MENTION=396]mani1[/MENTION] ghettoisation isnt good for any community it can foster an environment where extreme views can go unchallenged and propagates a lot of non violent extremism. A greater effort to integrate schools and communities needs to happen. Than the total sunset segregation that occurs in certain places.

Greater govt investment to alleviate povery and increase job prospects in certain areas would help.

 

[Slog]

Germany is seen as part of Europe . But most don't attach Germany or Sweden . When they start attacking Argentina or Mexico then you may have a point.

No attacks in Europe or America before the war of terror . If people want to keep denying foreign policy isn't the main cause , their choice . Luckily we have a leader in Corbyn who isn't burying his head in the sand.

Yes Belgium, Turkey and others were leading the war in Iraq...

You really think these idiots differentiate between the foreign policies of different western nations when deciding their actions

 

[90MPH]

9/11 happened before War on Terror started. Thats what triggered it. Not to mention World Trade Centre bombing in 1993. U.S embassies were attacked in Tanzania and Kenya in 1998. War on Terror has accentuated the problem. But these type of groups and this ideology has been around since before the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq.

That's true. The war in Iraq made the problem 10 times worse.

But to suggest all this started in 2001 is simply not true. It was actually the USSR invasion and subsequent defeat that was the catalyst for these extremist groups to emerge, especially the civil war and ungoverneed spaces after 1989.

 

[mani1]

NATO put 54,000 soldiers into Bosnia after the UN peacekeeping mission failed.

So after the fact then unlike Kososvo.

 

[Slog]

911 was a false flag attack to launch a imperial war on the Middle East & for the protection of Israel . But even if you disagree , the point still stands regarding Britain. Besides history didn't start at 911, try the last 100 years before that .

Yes of ofcourse the false flag bs ends all debate

Ofcourse when a historical event doesn't support your warped logic call it false flag

Get your head out of the sand

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

The ideological extremism behind these attackers motivations needs to be challenged and eradicated..No doubt these guys will be Salafi Jihadis and non violent extremism also needs to be clamped down especially those spreading hatred against western lifestyles and the way of life of everyone.

Foreign policy is one component of what these guys do. They have attacked countries who have opposed western interventions in certain countries. These guys also hate the western way of life its anti thetical to their world view. The same old tired tropes of it purely a foreign policy issue doesnt hold up.
Theyve done attacks in Kabul in Manila and now London in Ramadan.

Baghdadi did call Ramadan the month of Jihad 3 years ago and IS are living up to their reputation to wreak havoc in this month.

The Salafi Wahhabi extremist ideology has been around for 200 + yeara ever since Ibn Wahab and the days of the first Saudi state and it has been hostile to outsiders since its inception. Way before any colonial interventions or neo imperialist invasions.

Gulf funded mosques really need to be looked at as do any mosques that are preaching hatred and disunity. Govt also needs to look at ghettotisation and segregation too.

All of those measures will already have been taken. Unless of course you know of specific institutions which aren't complying and have somehow gone under the radar.

 

[Slog]

See, this is where your credibility always disintegrates.

Yea. If facts don't align with your ridiculous story, just act as if they don't exist

We can all see who the problem is here

 

[cricketfanfirst]

It looks like religion will surely ensure wiping out of our entire civilization.

When you are motivated of afterlife and nothing to lose concept, it becomes a dangerous concoction.

I will not be surprised in another decade or so, religion in general and Islam in particular will be outlawed in the West.

 

[mani1]

[MENTION=396]mani1[/MENTION] ghettoisation isnt good for any community it can foster an environment where extreme views can go unchallenged and propagates a lot of non violent extremism. A greater effort to integrate schools and communities needs to happen. Than the total sunset segregation that occurs in certain places.

Greater govt investment to alleviate povery and increase job prospects in certain areas would help.

That along with Gentrification and Billions being put in in places such as Tower Hamlets and Newham, Ilford etc and Schools in those areas are now amongst the best in the Country yet the ethnics in said areas are the most deprived in the Country hence "London is still the Poverty Capital of England"

 

[s28]

Jemima totally shut down her brother

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">In UK, you're more likely to be killed by dogs (average 18 deaths per year) than terrorism (1.4 deaths per year) Fear mongering doesn't help <a href="https://t.co/YovUOfUivQ">https://t.co/YovUOfUivQ</a></p>— Jemima Goldsmith (@Jemima_Khan) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jemima_Khan/status/871307459520061441">4 June 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Adil_94]

[MENTION=43583]KingKhanWC[/MENTION] lmao so you are peddling complete conspiracy theories about 9/11. if the U.S wanted to get rid of Saddam it had his WMD threat and his brutal suppression of civilians to use. not killing 3000 of its own citizens. They didnt need to commit 9/11 for that. you are talking about the ideological roots the ideological roots go further than 9/11. these groups were carrying out attacks in Muslim countries for 20 years before 9/11. its their ideology that causes them to hate anyone who doesnt think like them. Salafi Jihadi Takfirism espoused by likes of Al Qaeda and ISIS is very clear on what it thinks of disbelievers and minorities. And the proof is in their actions.

 

[Slog]

Jemima totally shut down her brother

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">In UK, you're more likely to be killed by dogs (average 18 deaths per year) than terrorism (1.4 deaths per year) Fear mongering doesn't help <a href="https://t.co/YovUOfUivQ">https://t.co/YovUOfUivQ</a></p>— Jemima Goldsmith (@Jemima_Khan) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jemima_Khan/status/871307459520061441">4 June 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Stupid logic

I guess everyone should give terrorists a free rein as cars and dogs kill more every year?

 

[Adil_94]

[MENTION=107620]s28[/MENTION] its been 3 terror attacks in 3 months you can forgive people for getting enraged and angry. Luckily most Brits anger stays on social media and you dont get communal responses
A dog biting someone or being killed in a car accident or of cancer is a little different to an intentional act of terror to kill and maim random civilians

 

[Bewal Express]

There are plenty of muslims in South America too .

Of course these attackers are the lowest of the low but burying your head as to the deeper issues & root causes is for the intellectually bankrupt.

No, these guys showed that most are drug addicted cretins and Foreign policy is not the reason. If it was Sweden or Germany would not have been attacked. ISIS have killed 1000's of muslims so if these guys cared for muslims they would be attacking ISIS and not innocent civilians.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

It looks like religion will surely ensure wiping out of our entire civilization.

When you are motivated of afterlife and nothing to lose concept, it becomes a dangerous concoction.

I will not be surprised in another decade or so, religion in general and Islam in particular will be outlawed in the West.

So you think a tactic of hoping people armed with cars and knives will kill pedestrians will wipe out the civilised world which has cruise missiles and well funded military programmes? I think this is very silly thinking.

 

[Adil_94]

[MENTION=78661]cricketfanfirst[/MENTION] religion and Islam wont be banned but i expect to see right wing populists like Trump and Le Pen to carry on gaining support in the West. So certain things like burqa ban headscarf ban and visible signs of Muslim religiosity could be banned in next 10-15 years if current trends continue.

 

[KingKhanWC]

No, these guys showed that most are drug addicted cretins and Foreign policy is not the reason. If it was Sweden or Germany would not have been attacked. ISIS have killed 1000's of muslims so if these guys cared for muslims they would be attacking ISIS and not innocent civilians.

You're entitled to your opinion but imo it's worrying you are a teacher if you don't research what intelligence services have said .

Back to some fun , match is about to resume

 

[Robert]

So after the fact then unlike Kososvo.

Fairer to say that the soft UN approach was tried and failed so NATO had to go in hard. Then in Kosovo they learned the lesson and went in hard from the get-go.

 

[s28]

Love how there is always a servile Western apologist about to bow and scrape to their colonial masters

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Ad hominem responses in full flow here, talk about ostriches with heads in the sand.

 

[cricketfanfirst]

So you think a tactic of hoping people armed with cars and knives will kill pedestrians will wipe out the civilised world which has cruise missiles and well funded military programmes? I think this is very silly thinking.

No, Cpt. Rishwat...I'm thinking more deep here, when you are simply killing random people who are not cause of your grievances, that means there is more sinister here...We will continue to have this, because of religion, which is like a drug. In India also, we will see this happening in future, as right wing party is in place.

Religion is the cause of all evils, and when you are motivated of afterlife, and think you are doing all to please Allah, then there is no bigger incentive than wipe out as many people as you could, which don't adhere to your religious line...

I think I have done enough research and critical thinking on this and have come to the conclusion, only way we can have peace is by simply eradicating religion, specially the hard-line forms...

Apart from religion, what do you think someone from Libya/Somalia/etc is motivated to kill some random pedestrian. Their logic is simple "I'm going to Jannat, and I'm sacrificing for the cause of Allah"

We will continue to have these incidents and they will only be increasing ...

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Theresa May was Home Secretary for 6 years, now Prime Minister. Her job is to keep us safe. She has failed to keep us safe from terrorism.</p>— Liam Young (@liamyoung) <a href="https://twitter.com/liamyoung/status/871318960632995840">4 June 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Robert]

Well, this debate went belly-up quick

This is what happens when conspiracy theory is invoked

 

[cricketfanfirst]

[MENTION=78661]cricketfanfirst[/MENTION] religion and Islam wont be banned but i expect to see right wing populists like Trump and Le Pen to carry on gaining support in the West. So certain things like burqa ban headscarf ban and visible signs of Muslim religiosity could be banned in next 10-15 years if current trends continue.

Adil, from my perspective, I definitely think West will outlaw religion in a decade or so. Too many incidents have happened in the recent past, and they are smart enough to understand how dangerous religion can be.

In our part of the World, it will definitely will take more time, and we will continue to suffer till that time, as we haven't matured enough to understand the evils of religion.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

No, Cpt. Rishwat...I'm thinking more deep here, when you are simply killing random people who are not cause of your grievances, that means there is more sinister here...We will continue to have this, because of religion, which is like a drug. In India also, we will see this happening in future, as right wing party is in place.

Religion is the cause of all evils, and when you are motivated of afterlife, and think you are doing all to please Allah, then there is no bigger incentive than wipe out as many people as you could, which don't adhere to your religious line...

I think I have done enough research and critical thinking on this and have come to the conclusion, only way we can have peace is by simply eradicating religion, specially the hard-line forms...

Apart from religion, what do you think someone from Libya/Somalia/etc is motivated to kill some random pedestrian. Their logic is simple "I'm going to Jannat, and I'm sacrificing for the cause of Allah"

We will continue to have these incidents and they will only be increasing ...

Seems like you believe in the ultimate victory of religion over the modern world then if you believe it will wipe out the civilised world. I disagree but each to their own.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Well, this debate went belly-up quick

This is what happens when conspiracy theory is invoked

It's not a debate, merely a bunch of posters calling each other names. On the real points which were raised by Adil94, I asked him for clarification and he didn't respond. Instead went after an anonymous poster about conspiracy theories.

 

[s28]

No need for conspiracy theory, those who understand Western foreign policy know how these people operate and the concept of blowback

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">When then UK PM Margarget Thatcher came to Pakistan and addressed an audience comprising many Mujahideen calling them the West's allies <a href="https://t.co/XtiZQwmBWW">pic.twitter.com/XtiZQwmBWW</a></p>— omar r quraishi (@omar_quraishi) <a href="https://twitter.com/omar_quraishi/status/869500443541463042">30 May 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Adil_94]

[MENTION=78661]cricketfanfirst[/MENTION] u definitely dont live in the West. This isnt China or North Korea where u can ban religious beliefs and force people to eat during Ramadan.

Freedom of religion is enshrined in the West. Overt signs of religiosity will be attacked by right wing populists i.e if u are a Muslim and want to carry on living here you cant wear niqab hijab abaya jilbab.

And maybe there will be talks of banning building further mosques and a Trump style Muslim ban could be touted by certai parties.

But the religion or any religion wont be outlawed. Even likes of Le Pen have never proposed that.
Only if neo nazis got power would that happen.

 

[Adil_94]

@Cpt.Rishwat what are u talking about. My point was that jihadi ideology has been around since before our govts invaded iraq and afghanistan. Of course foreign policy hasnt helped the issue but it is just one of the causes. the ideology that spreads hatred against western ways of life is an issue too well anyway of life that they dont agree with has been There are elements within this country that espouse hatred against mainstream society.

whether it be gender mixing womens rights lgbt rights.

 

[s28]

I love the complete ignorance of some arrogant young people. It's like history only happened during their lifetime.

Britain has been bombing the Middle East for 100 years

Westerners were crusading there for 1000 years

They have serious problems with their foreign policy which is why anti-war leaders like Corbyn and Sanders gaining popularity

 

[kabbirann]

All of those measures will already have been taken. Unless of course you know of specific institutions which aren't complying and have somehow gone under the radar.

It's crazy,isn't it?
You're supposed to go on with your life,protect yourself and your family from these attacks as well as from a backlash to these attacks and in addition, somehow prevent these attacks .

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

@Cpt.Rishwat what are u talking about. My point was that jihadi ideology has been around since before our govts invaded iraq and afghanistan. Of course foreign policy hasnt helped the issue but it is just one of the causes. the ideology that spreads hatred against western ways of life is an issue too well anyway of life that they dont agree with has been There are elements within this country that espouse hatred against mainstream society.

whether it be gender mixing womens rights lgbt rights.

I'm not arguing against your general laments about the salafist ideology, I was putting forward that there are already measures taken by the government to counter these, especially hate speech and Islamic institutions, unless you know of any specific organisations which are going under the radar.

 

[Adil_94]

@Cpt.Rishwat i think it needs to be a mix of govt and community led initatives to clarify to our youth that this ideology has no place in our societ and to make them more aware and savvy how to not fall into the traps of these radical firebrand clerics and speakers. Thats why i think more youth is needed at the top of mosque committees rather than the old boys club who are more worried about village politics back home than the issues facing young lads especially who are being radicalised.

 

[Gilly]

I love the complete ignorance of some arrogant young people. It's like history only happened during their lifetime.

Britain has been bombing the Middle East for 100 years

Westerners were crusading there for 1000 years

They have serious problems with their foreign policy which is why anti-war leaders like Corbyn and Sanders gaining popularity

Sounds a lot like what a extremist would say to brainwash someone.

Westerners, crusaders its like the past is the future.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

@Cpt.Rishwat i think it needs to be a mix of govt and community led initatives to clarify to our youth that this ideology has no place in our societ and to make them more aware and savvy how to not fall into the traps of these radical firebrand clerics and speakers. Thats why i think more youth is needed at the top of mosque committees rather than the old boys club who are more worried about village politics back home than the issues facing young lads especially who are being radicalised.

What if the youth aren't interested in sitting on mosque committees and just want to listen to music and have a drink at the club with their English friends? Or go watch a film with their girlfriend or maybe chill out at the beach? Are you suggesting they give all this up to go to the mosques and get on the committee?

 

[Markhor]

Maybe the response is good, but their intelligence is pathetic. So much happening right under their nose and they are not able to prevent it, despite being warned and sometimes knowing the suspects beforehand. They are also partially responsible for these deaths.

Intelligence services have foiled over 50 terror attacks since 7/7 including 12 in the last year and 5 plots since the Westminster attacks.

Unless they are given more resources, they cannot follow up on every lead and every person.

 

[Adil_94]

@cpt.rishwat obviously not all youth of course most people dont have the time to do it or want to do it. it means promoting youngsters who are training to be scholars to higher leadership positions because they can speak to younger kids in their language

where i live for example the largest local mosque have utilised that by giving a younger scholar a chance rather than a dinosaur from Pakistan and his talks on terrorism on young kids getting seduced by drug dealing petty crime have attracted a lot more youngsters to sermons than some old guy from Pakistan speaking a language most the kids dont understand properly.

 

[Robert]

Westerners were crusading there for 1000 years

And the Caliphates invaded Europe for much of that time and took millions of Europeans as slaves. But since their golden age they went into reverse while Europe kicked on, and they have allowed themselves to be ruled by corrupt despots, in the main. No wonder some turn to extremism, as their leaders have let them down so consistently.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

@cpt.rishwat obviously not all youth of course most people dont have the time to do it or want to do it. it means promoting youngsters who are training to be scholars to higher leadership positions because they can speak to younger kids in their language

where i live for example the largest local mosque have utilised that by giving a younger scholar a chance rather than a dinosaur from Pakistan and his talks on terrorism on young kids getting seduced by drug dealing petty crime have attracted a lot more youngsters to sermons than some old guy from Pakistan speaking a language most the kids dont understand properly.

Great. Who would you give the credit to for that?

 

[enkidu_]

And the Caliphates invaded Europe for much of that time and took millions of Europeans as slaves. But since their golden age they went into reverse while Europe kicked on, and they have allowed themselves to be ruled by corrupt despots, in the main. No wonder some turn to extremism, as their leaders have let them down so consistently.

The West has been imperialistic centuries before the rise of Islam. What was Alexander the Great - who inaugurated Western imperialism - doing as far as in modern day northern India ? It's about the control of strategic geopolitical areas, and the Umayyad expansions (the Abbasid caliphate stopped expanding itself, and by the 9th century Harun Al Rashid was signing a peace treaty with Charlemagne, while peace with the Byzantines was on and off) as much as the Crusades were about controlling the Mediterranean sea - like the creation of Israel yesterday or the "civil war" in Syria today are all about.

The only difference is that while before peoples in France, England, ... used to make cynical plans in their lofty homes which would impact the lives of millions (from famines in Bengal to carving out territories by discarding anthropological realities), now they have a taste of their own medicine.

 

[Gilly]

The only difference is that while before peoples in France, England, ... used to make cynical plans in their lofty homes which would impact the lives of millions (from famines in Bengal to carving out territories by discarding anthropological realities), now they have a taste of their own medicine.

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't these people die many years ago and now lay in graves.

 

[mani1]

Unfortunately looks like it could be Pakistan's involved

Twelve people were arrested at a block of flats in Barking


Another neighbour added: 'I often saw him playing table tennis with the guys in the lobby. You could tell from his accent he was either born here or grew up here but he told me he was from Pakistan.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-east-London-bridge-attack.html#ixzz4j2dSbSlH
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

 

[CricketCartoons]

Intelligence services have foiled over 50 terror attacks since 7/7 including 12 in the last year and 5 plots since the Westminster attacks.

Unless they are given more resources, they cannot follow up on every lead and every person.

Not sure whether to believe the govts claim of foiling attacks, because it is a favourable claim made by themselves. And if it is truly the case, then UK is under attack, don't know why they are not putting more resources to defend themselves.

 

[s28]

yes what is more important is what the Government try to hide not what they reveal

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Says person who refuses to release secret government report on terrorist funding in the U.K.:<a href="https://t.co/lQpCRKs81l">https://t.co/lQpCRKs81l</a> <a href="https://t.co/Ax1EJmoRfA">https://t.co/Ax1EJmoRfA</a></p>— Mehdi Hasan (@mehdirhasan) <a href="https://twitter.com/mehdirhasan/status/871320576056377344">4 June 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[cricketfanfirst]

The West has been imperialistic centuries before the rise of Islam. What was Alexander the Great - who inaugurated Western imperialism - doing as far as in modern day northern India ? It's about the control of strategic geopolitical areas, and the Umayyad expansions (the Abbasid caliphate stopped expanding itself, and by the 9th century Harun Al Rashid was signing a peace treaty with Charlemagne, while peace with the Byzantines was on and off) as much as the Crusades were about controlling the Mediterranean sea - like the creation of Israel yesterday or the "civil war" in Syria today are all about.

The only difference is that while before peoples in France, England, ... used to make cynical plans in their lofty homes which would impact the lives of millions (from famines in Bengal to carving out territories by discarding anthropological realities), now they have a taste of their own medicine.

Let's say they were pathetic, cunning, conniving, dastardly during those times, but that doesn't mean we link that and try to find a way to the current mayhem.

Christianity has overcome those dark times and now you don't see religion to play any significant in majority of Westerners life. We cannot afford to again wait for another 400 to 500 years for reform of religion.

Only drastic solution would be to outlaw religion and then only peace will prevail.

 

[cricketfanfirst]

[MENTION=78661]cricketfanfirst[/MENTION] u definitely dont live in the West. This isnt China or North Korea where u can ban religious beliefs and force people to eat during Ramadan.

Freedom of religion is enshrined in the West. Overt signs of religiosity will be attacked by right wing populists i.e if u are a Muslim and want to carry on living here you cant wear niqab hijab abaya jilbab.

And maybe there will be talks of banning building further mosques and a Trump style Muslim ban could be touted by certai parties.

But the religion or any religion wont be outlawed. Even likes of Le Pen have never proposed that.
Only if neo nazis got power would that happen.

I'm not so sure, Adil... See, any decent person will lose patience, if the same things happen again and again...

 

[prakash]

There are plenty of muslims in South America too .

There are 3762 muslims in Mexico as of 2010. Not sure about other countries in SA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Mexico

 

[KingKhanWC]

There are 3762 muslims in Mexico as of 2010. Not sure about other countries in SA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Mexico

I mentioned South America, around 4 million plus.

 

[s28]

Police accuse Government of lying

Theresa May has to go

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">MUST WATCH: Wow. You know the Police have had enough when they accuse Theresa May of outright lies. Cuts have made us all less safe. <a href="https://t.co/D4Fe44swpI">pic.twitter.com/D4Fe44swpI</a></p>— EL4C (@EL4JC) <a href="https://twitter.com/EL4JC/status/871334312221736960">4 June 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[James]

The West has been imperialistic centuries before the rise of Islam. What was Alexander the Great - who inaugurated Western imperialism - doing as far as in modern day northern India ? It's about the control of strategic geopolitical areas, and the Umayyad expansions (the Abbasid caliphate stopped expanding itself, and by the 9th century Harun Al Rashid was signing a peace treaty with Charlemagne, while peace with the Byzantines was on and off) as much as the Crusades were about controlling the Mediterranean sea - like the creation of Israel yesterday or the "civil war" in Syria today are all about.

The only difference is that while before peoples in France, England, ... used to make cynical plans in their lofty homes which would impact the lives of millions (from famines in Bengal to carving out territories by discarding anthropological realities), now they have a taste of their own medicine.

Current generations did not perpetrate imperialism. Ordinary citizens of today, non-combatants, civilians - they are innocent people. They did not deserve to die yesterday because of an interpretation of history.

Your post reads a bit like a justification to me, enkidu. I am hoping that I have misread this and you can clarify your words for me.

 

[Cpt. Rishwat]

Current generations did not perpetrate imperialism. Ordinary citizens of today, non-combatants, civilians - they are innocent people. They did not deserve to die yesterday because of an interpretation of history.

Your post reads a bit like a justification to me, enkidu. I am hoping that I have misread this and you can clarify your words for me.

Apart from anything else, how is knifing random civilians or running them over in a vehicle, giving anyone a 'taste of their own medicine'? You can't answer a cruise missile with a pop gun. Imperialism whether you liked it or not, at least had some sort of logic for those countries that benefited.

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I am a serving firearm officer and the Government is wrong to say police cuts have nothing to do with recent attacks <a href="https://t.co/4FOCXDsO9G">https://t.co/4FOCXDsO9G</a></p>— The Independent (@Independent) <a href="https://twitter.com/Independent/status/871417450407104512">4 June 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">EXC: Former NI counter-terror chief <a href="https://twitter.com/JimGamble_INEQE">@JimGamble_INEQE</a> slams May's 'endless cuts' to police numbers. <a href="https://t.co/Cg871iM7Z7">https://t.co/Cg871iM7Z7</a></p>— Paul Waugh (@paulwaugh) <a href="https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status/871456272016703491">4 June 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[s28]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en-gb"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">In Feb, half of some 850 Britons whom MI6 had green lighted to go to fight in Libya/Syria returned, consolidating domestic extremist threat <a href="https://t.co/d1xfmTQ3NX">https://t.co/d1xfmTQ3NX</a></p>— Dr Nafeez Ahmed (@NafeezAhmed) <a href="https://twitter.com/NafeezAhmed/status/871322602563932160">4 June 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Slog]

^^What's the point? Backhanded justification?

 

[Eagle_Eye]

Fairer to say that the soft UN approach was tried and failed so NATO had to go in hard. Then in Kosovo they learned the lesson and went in hard from the get-go.

Seriously Robert, how naive are you. Europe failed Croatia and Bosnia and let thousands be killed, stop tagging them along for credit by calling it NATO.

No it was The US that unlilaterlly decided enough is enough and started bombing from the air and gave green light to Muslims countries to come and covertly send troops and anti tank missiles that halted and then broke the Serbian stranglehold, forcing Serbia to the negotiating table.....
Embarrassed, Europe decided to act when Kosovo happened and not be shown up by US again in their own back yard.

 

[s28]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wor...ck-leaves-6-dead-20-injured-article-1.3218632

 

[Gabbar Singh]

Another intelligence failure?

It is understood the killer was a home-grown jihadi who came from Pakistan as a child but was brought up in the UK.

But in recent years he had become increasingly radical and was twice reported to anti-terror authorities, it has been claimed.

He even appeared in TV documentary about British jihadis and was questioned by police after an Islamic State flag was unfurled in a park.

The revelations will put further pressure on Britain's security services after Manchester bomber Salman Abedi also appeared to have slipped through the net before carrying out the atrocity.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/london-bridge-terror-attack-terrorists--10562096

 

[shah_1]

SHOCKING!!!......One of the attacker was in Channel 4 documentary.

Everyone of these people radicals that are on watch list need to be deported or locked in a cell. The biggest victims are the Muslims because of these people.

 

[TSA321]

One of the killers is apparently a Moroccan from Ireland.

 

[Donal Cozzie]

One of the killers is apparently a Moroccan from Ireland.

Well that's just lovely.

 

[Markhor]

Seriously Robert, how naive are you. Europe failed Croatia and Bosnia and let thousands be killed, stop tagging them along for credit by calling it NATO.

No it was The US that unlilaterlly decided enough is enough and started bombing from the air and gave green light to Muslims countries to come and covertly send troops and anti tank missiles that halted and then broke the Serbian stranglehold, forcing Serbia to the negotiating table.....
Embarrassed, Europe decided to act when Kosovo happened and not be shown up by US again in their own back yard.

Exactly [MENTION=44089]Eagle_Eye[/MENTION]. Let's not forget the cowardice of the Dutch troops who simply rolled over for Mladic's thugs in Srebrenica allowing them to commit the biggest war crime in Europe since the end of WW2.

There's unnecessary interventionism by the west that's helped fuel extremism - but the failure to act in Bosnia also helped radicalise many youngsters too.

 

[Markhor]

More than 130 British imams refuse to bury London attackers

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/06/05/europe/imams-london-burial/

(CNN) More than 130 imams from Britain are refusing to offer Islamic burials to the three men who launched attacks Saturday night in London, killing seven and wounding dozens more.

"We will not perform the traditional Islamic funeral prayer for the perpetrators and we also urge fellow imams and religious authorities to withdraw such a privilege," the Muslim leaders said Monday in a statement posted on social media.

The imams described their actions as "unprecedented," though mosques in Manchester, England, and in the United States have refused to bury Muslims involved in terror attacks in recent years.

Imam Abdullah Hasan of Imams Against Domestic Abuse, who posted the statement online, said the funeral rite "is normally performed for every Muslim regardless of their actions."

Seven people died and 48 were injured when three men drove a van into pedestrians on London Bridge, then leaped out and stabbed several others in nearby bars and restaurants. Police killed the three attackers in a hail of gunfire.

 

[KingKhanWC]

More than 130 British imams refuse to bury London attackers

What does the religion say about this? What about rapists, child molestors, those and other murderers?

 

[Gabbar Singh]

One attacker has been named as Khuram Butt. Another Rachid Redouane.