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Mohammad Rizwan vs Mohammad Haris – Is the comparison even justified anymore?

Who should be Pakistan's first-choice wicketkeeper in T20Is?


  • Total voters
    31
All Australian WK post Gilchrist have been mediocre. A quality all-format WK like Rizwan is better than all of them.
Australia doesn't typically do all format keepers thats why, post gilly they've historically opted for test keeping specialists and whoteball keeper specialists.

Inglis and Carey are far superior. Wade at no 7 is a better keeper bat, brad Haddin is > Rizzu in virtually all metrics
 
Australia doesn't typically do all format keepers thats why, post gilly they've historically opted for test keeping specialists and whoteball keeper specialists.

Inglis and Carey are far superior. Wade at no 7 is a better keeper bat, brad Haddin is > Rizzu in virtually all metrics
But my man wants to laugh at others for comparing Harris with others :ROFLMAO:
 
But my man wants to laugh at others for comparing Harris with others :ROFLMAO:
Haris at no 3 is better then Rizwan. I already posted an entire argument and rather then people addressing it they've as usual cut small pieces that they can counter without any context.
 
Backing and properly grooming Mohd Haris will be more beneficial for Pakistan Cricket in the long run vs sticking with Rizwan in the T20 format.

Mohd Haris needs to consistently play 4 day cricket to properly develop his batting skills overall to suit ODI, Test.
 
Backing and properly grooming Mohd Haris will be more beneficial for Pakistan Cricket in the long run vs sticking with Rizwan in the T20 format.

Mohd Haris needs to consistently play 4 day cricket to properly develop his batting skills overall to suit ODI, Test.
agree with the first part, disagree with the second. pakistani first class cricket is sub standard and completely irrelevant to modern day t20 cricket. hed be better off just playing loads of leagues until hes comfortable with his game.
 
Backing and properly grooming Mohd Haris will be more beneficial for Pakistan Cricket in the long run vs sticking with Rizwan in the T20 format.

Mohd Haris needs to consistently play 4 day cricket to properly develop his batting skills overall to suit ODI, Test.
They made Azam Khan play red ball too

It does Jack all!
 
agree with the first part, disagree with the second. pakistani first class cricket is sub standard and completely irrelevant to modern day t20 cricket. hed be better off just playing loads of leagues until hes comfortable with his game.

Playing 4 day cricket will help him develop game awareness, his defensive skills, knowing how to bat through tough phases, improving his game against spin. The attack from ball one approach doesn't work all the time on difficult surfaces or against quality bowling attacks. If he can improve his defence, develop strike rotation then he can become a regular in ODI Cricket and Test matches.
 
They made Azam Khan play red ball too

It does Jack all!

Yes but how much 4 day cricket has he really played? It takes a body of work, experience to develop your overall game and skills.
 
Playing 4 day cricket will help him develop game awareness, his defensive skills, knowing how to bat through tough phases, improving his game against spin. The attack from ball one approach doesn't work all the time on difficult surfaces or against quality bowling attacks. If he can improve his defence, develop strike rotation then he can become a regular in ODI Cricket and Test matches.
why does he need to bat through phases, if he manages to slog through 7 or 8 overs hes pbly done his job. the attack from ball 1 approach doesnt need to work every time if you want to bat down till 8 or wherever fahim is playing these days. if he can average mid 20s, and strikes 140+ he'll be doing a good job at three.

he doesnt need to play odis, and absolutely no way should he be near the test team. let him specialise as a glorified slogger, and if other facets develop to his game great, but u dont want to take one of the few sloggers u have in the team and try to turn him into a test bat, hell never have the mentality to play test cricket, ull only ruin him as a t20 player.
 
How did he missed that run out. The ball was in his glove.

Than the shot he played. Lol even amir was blaming him for the loss
 
I am not worried by his batting as I believe he should be opening or bat at 3, but his keeping is a major issue and lol at people wanting Farhan as wk. He's far worse than Azam khan.
 
Playing with Mohammad Haris is like sending your team out to bat with 10 players more often than not.
 
Problem with Rizwan is where do you play him? He can’t open because the openers are doing well. If he plays at 3 or 4, he will slow the momentum down because he has limited stroke play and for that reason he is useless at 7 aswel. He can only play as an opener and for that you would need to shuffle the whole line up for him again. He is a much better keeper than Haris but it’s difficult to slot him in.
 
Problem with Rizwan is where do you play him? He can’t open because the openers are doing well. If he plays at 3 or 4, he will slow the momentum down because he has limited stroke play and for that reason he is useless at 7 aswel. He can only play as an opener and for that you would need to shuffle the whole line up for him again. He is a much better keeper than Haris but it’s difficult to slot him in.
He plays the Agha role. Comes in to prevent a collapse, or doesn't come in at all
 
He plays the Agha role. Comes in to prevent a collapse, or doesn't come in at all
He’s too senior of a batsman to agree to that sort of role. If he comes in, he will want to play as an opener or at best number 3. I don’t think he is flexible to do a Sarfraz/Agha and come down the order.
 
He’s too senior of a batsman to agree to that sort of role. If he comes in, he will want to play as an opener or at best number 3. I don’t think he is flexible to do a Sarfraz/Agha and come down the order.
Well if he wants to play for Pakistan ever again, he should accept whatever comes his way.

This bhai bhai culture has also been a cause of the downfall of Pakistan cricket culture
 
sorry i missed that moment.. what he did?
there was a runout cahnce against Tilak Verma. The ball went behind, Varma was denied a run, he came back running, the ball was thrown accurately to the keeper, keeper caught the ball and this is where it got interestng.

The ball is in the keeprs gloves, batsman is no where in the frame, and Harris decided to get his legs in position and only slowedly tried to run the batter out. In that time, Varma came back into the frame and made it back.
 
Irrespective of how much he scores how he looks says everything. He looks like a proper hack. He is not even strong or tall so that he can mishit balls for six.
He looks like he picks up length late. You can see his front foot struggle to move and he meets ball behind his front foot a lot of time. He is going to struggle against any decent side unless he fixes his technique
 
He's not even comparable as a batsman, forget keeping. He had one good game vs India early in his career where he played fearlessly and had some stunning shots. He's looked a damp squib this tournament. Also zero contributions as far as I could see with field placings, which Rizwan contributes with. Still remember Rizwan gesturing to Babar to set a field for the scoop to Wade in the WC and Babar shook his head skeptically.
 
Problem with Rizwan is where do you play him? He can’t open because the openers are doing well. If he plays at 3 or 4, he will slow the momentum down because he has limited stroke play and for that reason he is useless at 7 aswel. He can only play as an opener and for that you would need to shuffle the whole line up for him again. He is a much better keeper than Haris but it’s difficult to slot him in.

We won't be shuffling anymore than we already are. Haris doesn't have a confirmed number as well, he's a floater. Rizwan can easily play that role.
 
Both guys are batting atm in the QEA Trophy game for Peshawar against Sialkot...

Rizwan has already struck a brilliant century, playing at 121* atm, while Haris is batting at 86*.

Riz is looking in good form before the first test match against South Africa begins on 12th.
 
Both guys are batting atm in the QEA Trophy game for Peshawar against Sialkot...

Rizwan has already struck a brilliant century, playing at 121* atm, while Haris is batting at 86*.

Riz is looking in good form before the first test match against South Africa begins on 12th.
Highlights of innings of Mohammad Rizwan

 
Mohd Haris who couldn't buy a run in the Asia Cup scored an easy effortless century in Domestic. Naseem Shah who has been trashed against the West Indies recently and looked unfit and overweight picked an effortless 5 wicket hall in his first innings in domestic cricket. Saim Ayub who scored 4-5 ducks and looked like getting out on every ball in the Asia Cup has already scored two back to back fifties in his first outing in Domestic Cricket.

Pakistan's domestic cricket is very substandard and not even close to International quality. It is also clear that the wickets in domestic cricket do not mirror international cricket wickets at all.
 
Big time besti done today to all of Haris critics, in a head to head with their favourite, serious damage was caused to many posters and their winter holiday plans.
 
Now that Harris has scored some runs, quality of domestic cricket is the problem 🤡

But if Pir Rizwan scores some runs, then the domestic system is as robust as the Australian one.
 
Now that Harris has scored some runs, quality of domestic cricket is the problem 🤡

But if Pir Rizwan scores some runs, then the domestic system is as robust as the Australian one.
Well spotted

I read the comments on social media on different posts. The freshies in Pakistan who can’t write in English love Rizwan’s innings as if he’s scored it against Starc, Hazlewood and Cummins….but apparently Harris is a domestic bully and can’t score runs at International level.

I mean, they both scored tons against the same opposition, on the same ground, in the same match, in the same innings!

It’s quite clear that the majority of Pakistan cricket fans are as pathetic as Rizwan’s thought process.
 
He plays the Agha role. Comes in to prevent a collapse, or doesn't come in at all
So then you might as well keep Harris in the team? At least he might pull off a 15 ball 30-40 runs if it’s his day?

Can Rizwan do that? I would be amazed if he gets a 15 ball 16 if he has to slot in at any point.
 
Now that Harris has scored some runs, quality of domestic cricket is the problem 🤡

But if Pir Rizwan scores some runs, then the domestic system is as robust as the Australia.
But do you know why this is happening? It’s simply because Haris has failed to make the most of his international opportunities, even though he’s arguably more skilled than Rizwan. In contrast, Rizwan has earned everyone’s respect through remarkable consistency, despite having limited range and shot selection. Haris has no one but himself to blame for how his career has turned out. If he performs on the big stage, no one will bother counting his domestic runs.
 
Whenever a batter who plays higher division cricket drops down to a lower division, he’s expected to dominate. It’s just how it works, less pressure, easier conditions, and you’re now playing at a level you’ve already outgrown.

If you’ve played the game, you’d know that once you’ve been exposed to higher level cricket, coming back to lower division stuff feels a lot easier mentally. You’ve already dealt with tougher bowlers, faster conditions, and more pressure situations, so your mind handles things way better. That’s why it’s a really good sign to see both of these batters scoring centuries yesterday. Performances like these only help Pakistan become a stronger side.

And this is where senior players matter. Haris looked like he was in the mood for a 50 ball ton, started very aggressively, but you could clearly see Rizwan guiding him through the innings, keeping him calm and focused. That’s exactly why experienced players are so important to have in any squad. They guide the youngsters in real time, this is how cricket works and has always worked.

As for Haris, he really needs to keep playing the longer format and learn to build those big innings with patience. And honestly, Rizwan is absolutely vital across all formats for that reason. He’s got over 10 years of leadership experience, knows this game inside out, and right now, there’s basically no one else in the setup guiding the younger guys.

Ideally, you want 4–5 senior players in a team for balance, but thanks to our brilliant PCB, we’ve managed to cut that number down to one or even zero. The board is an absolute joke at this point.
 
Mohd Haris who couldn't buy a run in the Asia Cup scored an easy effortless century in Domestic. Naseem Shah who has been trashed against the West Indies recently and looked unfit and overweight picked an effortless 5 wicket hall in his first innings in domestic cricket. Saim Ayub who scored 4-5 ducks and looked like getting out on every ball in the Asia Cup has already scored two back to back fifties in his first outing in Domestic Cricket.

Pakistan's domestic cricket is very substandard and not even close to International quality. It is also clear that the wickets in domestic cricket do not mirror international cricket wickets at all.
Domestic cricket is generally easier than international cricket in any country, including Pakistan—though the gap varies from place to place. Batters also tend to perform better in familiar conditions.

To make such a drastic claim about Pakistan’s domestic standard, we’d need to show that batters elsewhere don’t perform significantly better at home compared to international level.

Pakistan’s domestic standard is about average to above average, as reflected in the overall results. It’s not as poor as some critics suggest—it’s at least decent. If Pakistan can fix it pathways and bring structure and stability, it can be a very competitive team even with this domestic system.
 
Whenever a batter who plays higher division cricket drops down to a lower division, he’s expected to dominate. It’s just how it works, less pressure, easier conditions, and you’re now playing at a level you’ve already outgrown.

If you’ve played the game, you’d know that once you’ve been exposed to higher level cricket, coming back to lower division stuff feels a lot easier mentally. You’ve already dealt with tougher bowlers, faster conditions, and more pressure situations, so your mind handles things way better. That’s why it’s a really good sign to see both of these batters scoring centuries yesterday. Performances like these only help Pakistan become a stronger side.

And this is where senior players matter. Haris looked like he was in the mood for a 50 ball ton, started very aggressively, but you could clearly see Rizwan guiding him through the innings, keeping him calm and focused. That’s exactly why experienced players are so important to have in any squad. They guide the youngsters in real time, this is how cricket works and has always worked.

As for Haris, he really needs to keep playing the longer format and learn to build those big innings with patience. And honestly, Rizwan is absolutely vital across all formats for that reason. He’s got over 10 years of leadership experience, knows this game inside out, and right now, there’s basically no one else in the setup guiding the younger guys.

Ideally, you want 4–5 senior players in a team for balance, but thanks to our brilliant PCB, we’ve managed to cut that number down to one or even zero. The board is an absolute joke at this point.
Great post
 
So then you might as well keep Harris in the team? At least he might pull off a 15 ball 30-40 runs if it’s his day?

Can Rizwan do that? I would be amazed if he gets a 15 ball 16 if he has to slot in at any point.
@Mamoon @Caved12

Rizwan’s been found out — and hasn’t been able to adapt. He won’t be able to do that as regularly.

When he first burst onto the scene, his scoring pattern was heavily leg-side dominant. His magnum opus was that 152-run chase against India — where he was consistently fed into his body, and most of his boundaries came from squats and pulls through square leg or flicks to midwicket. His strike rate then hovered in the high 130s.

But by the 2022 World Cup, teams had done their homework. They bowled wide of off, and Rizwan had no response. Most dismissals came from dragging off-side deliveries to the leg side, or from mistimed cuts that crashed into his stumps or found fielders. Occasionally, when the ball pitched middle and straightened, his head fall-over got him bowled clean.

Since 2022, his strike rate has dropped below 120 AS AN OPENER, and his scoring areas have shrunk drastically. His effective range is from square leg to midwicket. You rarely see him play a clean cover drive, square cut, or upper cut. When he does try to loft straight or on the off side, it usually ends up in mid-off’s hands — so he avoids those zones altogether.

In today’s T20 landscape, where teams demand 360° hitters, Rizwan is 90ish degrees. He simply doesn’t fit the mold. His leg-side strength works against weaker attacks that err in line, but top teams have long adjusted.

It’s become way too predictable now. Remember the 2024 T20 World Cup game against India — Bumrah set him up perfectly. Early on, Rizwan was dropped after a mistimed pull to the fielder behind square, but the plan was clear: bowl short of a good length, outside off, and force him to play across the line. Later, Bumrah went wider and fuller, tempting him to swipe across again — Rizwan missed it completely and was bowled.

That dismissal summed up his recent struggles: premeditated across-the-line movement, head falling over, and no ability to adjust. Against South Africa too, it was almost painful to watch. They kept hammering that short-of-a-length channel outside off, and he kept trying to drag everything to midwicket — even losing balance and collapsing on the pitch a couple of times.

It’s not about form anymore — it’s about being one-dimensional. Bowlers know his trigger movement, know he won’t hit through or over cover, and keep feeding that outside-off trap. At this level, when teams can plan you out so completely, it’s a red flag.

Contrast that with Saim Ayub (or even Sahibzada Farhan) — both show a far more complete range. They can loft drives straight, go over extra cover, and still dominate leg-side. They’re multi-angle players — the kind of prospects worth investing in for the modern game.
 
Good that they both scored runs,,, Good for their confidence but bowling quality is still pathetic... Pitches look pretty flat so I am not shocked at riz's 100 or Haris scoring 100... Even saim scored 60+ runs after scoring a number of ducks recently in asia cup .
 
Whenever a batter who plays higher division cricket drops down to a lower division, he’s expected to dominate. It’s just how it works, less pressure, easier conditions, and you’re now playing at a level you’ve already outgrown.

If you’ve played the game, you’d know that once you’ve been exposed to higher level cricket, coming back to lower division stuff feels a lot easier mentally. You’ve already dealt with tougher bowlers, faster conditions, and more pressure situations, so your mind handles things way better. That’s why it’s a really good sign to see both of these batters scoring centuries yesterday. Performances like these only help Pakistan become a stronger side.

And this is where senior players matter. Haris looked like he was in the mood for a 50 ball ton, started very aggressively, but you could clearly see Rizwan guiding him through the innings, keeping him calm and focused. That’s exactly why experienced players are so important to have in any squad. They guide the youngsters in real time, this is how cricket works and has always worked.

As for Haris, he really needs to keep playing the longer format and learn to build those big innings with patience. And honestly, Rizwan is absolutely vital across all formats for that reason. He’s got over 10 years of leadership experience, knows this game inside out, and right now, there’s basically no one else in the setup guiding the younger guys.

Ideally, you want 4–5 senior players in a team for balance, but thanks to our brilliant PCB, we’ve managed to cut that number down to one or even zero. The board is an absolute joke at this point.

I find it strange and bizzare that Umar Akmal who at one point from 2009 to 2016 was recognized as Pakistan's top limited overs batsman in T20 and ODI Cricket fell away so badly that he was unable to force a claim to be recalled from his domestic performances.

From 2020 onwards he could not buy a run in domestic cricket either and he found no takers in leagues either.
 
I find it strange and bizzare that Umar Akmal who at one point from 2009 to 2016 was recognized as Pakistan's top limited overs batsman in T20 and ODI Cricket fell away so badly that he was unable to force a claim to be recalled from his domestic performances.

From 2020 onwards he could not buy a run in domestic cricket either and he found no takers in leagues either.
Umar was simply a messed up case mentally, and as his career went on, he only kept getting worse. He was an extremely dumb player, not smart at all and he let everything fall apart: his batting, his fitness, and whatever little cricketing sense he had completely vanished too. It was a strange case, but I realized early on that he was never going to succeed because he just couldn’t play long innings or value his wicket. Unfortunately, there are many players like him who regress over time simply because of poor work ethic and an unwillingness to put in the hard work to improve their game.
 
Mohd Haris who couldn't buy a run in the Asia Cup scored an easy effortless century in Domestic. Naseem Shah who has been trashed against the West Indies recently and looked unfit and overweight picked an effortless 5 wicket hall in his first innings in domestic cricket. Saim Ayub who scored 4-5 ducks and looked like getting out on every ball in the Asia Cup has already scored two back to back fifties in his first outing in Domestic Cricket.

Pakistan's domestic cricket is very substandard and not even close to International quality. It is also clear that the wickets in domestic cricket do not mirror international cricket wickets at all.
He was Pakistan’s 3rd highest run scorer after Farhan and Fakhar 🤡
 
Good that they both scored runs,,, Good for their confidence but bowling quality is still pathetic... Pitches look pretty flat so I am not shocked at riz's 100 or Haris scoring 100... Even saim scored 60+ runs after scoring a number of ducks recently in asia cup .
Yes, it was pathetic, no doubt about that. But this is the only setup where these players can go back and work on their game. Hopefully, some of the other teams will have better bowling attacks so they get tested a bit more. Still, it’s at least a good opportunity for clowns like Haris to spend more time at the crease and work on building longer innings
 
Unfortunately, there are many players like him who regress over time simply because of poor work ethic and an unwillingness to put in the hard work to improve their game
Yes but there are players who you love and admire, even lie so much for their cause….even though they have been on the job for over 5 years and still haven’t learned how to play on the off side and also improve their strike rate with the passage of time considering the ever evolving white ball game 🤡
 
But do you know why this is happening? It’s simply because Haris has failed to make the most of his international opportunities, even though he’s arguably more skilled than Rizwan. In contrast, Rizwan has earned everyone’s respect through remarkable consistency, despite having limited range and shot selection. Haris has no one but himself to blame for how his career has turned out. If he performs on the big stage, no one will bother counting his domestic runs.

Rizwan is more respected for his religious piety by his most hardcore fans, he didn’t achieve anything for Pakistan in limited overs & held the batting line up hostage by making it hi right to open, not to mention the toxic environment he helped shape with Babar & friendship culture opposed to being professionals who prioritise their nation first, Haris had one poor tournament & we should give him as big a long rope as others, Rizwan was defended for half a decade of mediocrity. Now that Harris scored the more impressive century in a head to head with Rizwan we’re ostracising domestic cricket ignorantly.
 
@Mamoon @Caved12

Rizwan’s been found out — and hasn’t been able to adapt. He won’t be able to do that as regularly.

When he first burst onto the scene, his scoring pattern was heavily leg-side dominant. His magnum opus was that 152-run chase against India — where he was consistently fed into his body, and most of his boundaries came from squats and pulls through square leg or flicks to midwicket. His strike rate then hovered in the high 130s.

But by the 2022 World Cup, teams had done their homework. They bowled wide of off, and Rizwan had no response. Most dismissals came from dragging off-side deliveries to the leg side, or from mistimed cuts that crashed into his stumps or found fielders. Occasionally, when the ball pitched middle and straightened, his head fall-over got him bowled clean.

Since 2022, his strike rate has dropped below 120 AS AN OPENER, and his scoring areas have shrunk drastically. His effective range is from square leg to midwicket. You rarely see him play a clean cover drive, square cut, or upper cut. When he does try to loft straight or on the off side, it usually ends up in mid-off’s hands — so he avoids those zones altogether.

In today’s T20 landscape, where teams demand 360° hitters, Rizwan is 90ish degrees. He simply doesn’t fit the mold. His leg-side strength works against weaker attacks that err in line, but top teams have long adjusted.

It’s become way too predictable now. Remember the 2024 T20 World Cup game against India — Bumrah set him up perfectly. Early on, Rizwan was dropped after a mistimed pull to the fielder behind square, but the plan was clear: bowl short of a good length, outside off, and force him to play across the line. Later, Bumrah went wider and fuller, tempting him to swipe across again — Rizwan missed it completely and was bowled.

That dismissal summed up his recent struggles: premeditated across-the-line movement, head falling over, and no ability to adjust. Against South Africa too, it was almost painful to watch. They kept hammering that short-of-a-length channel outside off, and he kept trying to drag everything to midwicket — even losing balance and collapsing on the pitch a couple of times.

It’s not about form anymore — it’s about being one-dimensional. Bowlers know his trigger movement, know he won’t hit through or over cover, and keep feeding that outside-off trap. At this level, when teams can plan you out so completely, it’s a red flag.

Contrast that with Saim Ayub (or even Sahibzada Farhan) — both show a far more complete range. They can loft drives straight, go over extra cover, and still dominate leg-side. They’re multi-angle players — the kind of prospects worth investing in for the modern game.

That was a one off fluke knock from Rizwan & he got away with it against India because we were chasing such a low total, 150 odd even for India was going to be difficult to defend (Pak bowlers deserve more credit for that), but since them Bumrah has found it very straight forward to dismiss Rizwan & has easily exposed his limited stroke play, not including the blessed release shot he was anointed with by Misbah.
 
I find it strange and bizzare that Umar Akmal who at one point from 2009 to 2016 was recognized as Pakistan's top limited overs batsman in T20 and ODI Cricket fell away so badly that he was unable to force a claim to be recalled from his domestic performances.

From 2020 onwards he could not buy a run in domestic cricket either and he found no takers in leagues either.

When Umar Akmal first came up he was a hard worker, he had to grind in domestic cricket to force his selection. However, when playing for Pakistan, he was abused & mistreated so badly with Misbah that he lost the passion he once did and unfortunately he no longer had the work ethic he did, Umar Akmal is the most famous cricketer to be ruined by Misbah, but the positive was that after that, more people became aware of Misbah’s politics and favouritism; he was the god father of the dosti yari culture and especially player seniority.
 
People talking about Haris performing shows the quality of Pakistani domestic. But this is an anomaly innings. His record in domestic is generally bad. Pakistani domestic may not be the highest standard. But still hardly anyone really excels. They’re just decent records. Even in first class who averages 50? Can only think of Saud Shakeel, who is probably our best test batsman anyway.

This excuse was also used with Fawad alam who absolutely dominated first class. Came back past his peak and still put in performances and scoring centuries. Showed we just absolutely wasted a career. And somehow was played in formats he didn’t do as well in domestic (with sr considered) more than he was given test chances. His technique was as ugly as it gets. And yet still showed performance.

Look at India, the guys in the team have absolutely insane records. Averaging even 50 or 60 in domestic. That’s what you need to get into the team.

Instead we tend to give up on domestic, say it’s rubbish and then use that as an excuse to pick guys doing far worse due to some eye technique analysis. Which rarely works out. Not saying you can’t use that too, but it’s not an excuse to have a bad record and get picked.

I really think we need to wait to pick players until they are absolutely dominating domestic. Not just talented or one good season etc. It also creates a better system in domestic where cricketers really feel like they can work hard and earn their spot. Most of the guys who have actually performed for us in this era have been guys picked late on the back of good domestic performances.

I think from the current generation, guys like Abdullah, Saim and Haris have been picked far too early based on supposed talent. They should have been left to absolutely dominate domestic and show their worth before getting international call ups. If they aren’t able to do that, they won’t succeed in international cricket anyway. But picking them early for international cricket I feel has hindered the development of their overall cricket game. In the past I think we made mistakes picking guys like Umar akmal, imam ul haq etc too early too. They didn’t develop their game after they got picked for internationals regularly.

In our desperation to get these guys as quickly as possible to international, I think we actually delay the age at which they actually turn good at international level. Or if they turn good at all.
 
I think from the current generation, guys like Abdullah, Saim and Haris have been picked far too early based on supposed talent
Easier said than done

What are you supposed to do in the meanwhile? Continue to allow crap players like Babar and Rizwan to play at a run a ball in the T20s? Especially as openers?
 
People talking about Haris performing shows the quality of Pakistani domestic. But this is an anomaly innings. His record in domestic is generally bad. Pakistani domestic may not be the highest standard. But still hardly anyone really excels. They’re just decent records. Even in first class who averages 50? Can only think of Saud Shakeel, who is probably our best test batsman anyway.

This excuse was also used with Fawad alam who absolutely dominated first class. Came back past his peak and still put in performances and scoring centuries. Showed we just absolutely wasted a career. And somehow was played in formats he didn’t do as well in domestic (with sr considered) more than he was given test chances. His technique was as ugly as it gets. And yet still showed performance.

Look at India, the guys in the team have absolutely insane records. Averaging even 50 or 60 in domestic. That’s what you need to get into the team.

Instead we tend to give up on domestic, say it’s rubbish and then use that as an excuse to pick guys doing far worse due to some eye technique analysis. Which rarely works out. Not saying you can’t use that too, but it’s not an excuse to have a bad record and get picked.

I really think we need to wait to pick players until they are absolutely dominating domestic. Not just talented or one good season etc. It also creates a better system in domestic where cricketers really feel like they can work hard and earn their spot. Most of the guys who have actually performed for us in this era have been guys picked late on the back of good domestic performances.

I think from the current generation, guys like Abdullah, Saim and Haris have been picked far too early based on supposed talent. They should have been left to absolutely dominate domestic and show their worth before getting international call ups. If they aren’t able to do that, they won’t succeed in international cricket anyway. But picking them early for international cricket I feel has hindered the development of their overall cricket game. In the past I think we made mistakes picking guys like Umar akmal, imam ul haq etc too early too. They didn’t develop their game after they got picked for internationals regularly.

In our desperation to get these guys as quickly as possible to international, I think we actually delay the age at which they actually turn good at international level. Or if they turn good at all.
you have made some good points there. We should have left the young players excel in domestic cricket. Same process as was applied for Riz & Babar.
 
Easier said than done

What are you supposed to do in the meanwhile? Continue to allow crap players like Babar and Rizwan to play at a run a ball in the T20s? Especially as openers?
Farhan could and has been inducted in. Fakhar could have been promoted. Usman was the better than everyone else in PSL, yet given chances scattered around the order, he could have been given a run as opener. Saud could have even played as an opener. There are options.

Even if there weren’t, it’s worth waiting two years or so. We have now already waited that time and these players are not up to mark. Arguably they have regressed. So we haven’t saved any time inducting them, we’ve wasted it. Particularly in Saim who hasn’t really figured out what batting gameplay works out for him yet which is probably leading to his inconsistency.

Abdullah was tried out in t20s before he even debuted in PSL. And then got dropped from his PSL franchise as a result. That’s an example which seems a bit insane how it’s the other way around.

The pressure also lumped in on these guys is also too much. I remember Umar akmal he made the team what was it 19? And yet somehow by 20 people were expecting him to finish games and be the next Kohli. There’s just too much expectations and generally they crumble under it, their whole career goes.

Look at the guys making the team and staying in it in recent history. Fakhar, saud, agha, Rizwan, Sarfraz etc. all cricketers who debuted late or didn’t get a good run until later on in life. I don’t think that’s a coincidence. Only exception I can think of is Babar. Who debuted quite late for a guy of his talent anyway, I remember he was making a name for himself when he was just 14.
 
Abdullah was tried out in t20s before he even debuted in PSL
Who was making these catastrophic calls?

The same guy who opened a T20i with Imam ul Haq?

The same guy who promoted Rizwan to open in T20s?

The same guy who had Fakhar and Sharjeel in his T20i XI for a game but didn’t allow the two to open?

Name and shame the idiot behind these calls.
 
While many also arguing did Rizwan have only one jersey and that too of national Test side
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As per protocol, players must cover all sponsor logos before going onto the ground and that’s exactly what he did. Believe me, all our sports journalists and most fans know this rule very well, yet they’re twisting the story as if Rizwan deliberately hide or bbycotted the Pepsi logo.

Screenshot_20251010-214146.jpg
 
That was a one off fluke knock from Rizwan & he got away with it against India because we were chasing such a low total, 150 odd even for India was going to be difficult to defend (Pak bowlers deserve more credit for that), but since them Bumrah has found it very straight forward to dismiss Rizwan & has easily exposed his limited stroke play, not including the blessed release shot he was anointed with by Misbah.
Before 2020, Rizwan batted lower down the order and didn’t really have the T20 gears — his strike rate stayed under 100, and he struggled to accelerate in short cameos. Once he moved to opener in 2020, his strike rate jumped to around 128 as he finally got time to build innings. 2021 was his peak at about 135. But after that, the tempo faded — down to roughly 123 in 2022, a small rebound in 2023 over just five games, and then another drop to around 117 in 2024. At that pace, an opener is basically playing for the opposition; even if he scores runs, the team is crawling toward 120–130 totals. He’s still reliable, but his strike rate has fallen so much that his innings now often hurt Pakistan’s momentum more than they help.
 
People talking about Haris performing shows the quality of Pakistani domestic. But this is an anomaly innings. His record in domestic is generally bad. Pakistani domestic may not be the highest standard. But still hardly anyone really excels. They’re just decent records. Even in first class who averages 50? Can only think of Saud Shakeel, who is probably our best test batsman anyway.

This excuse was also used with Fawad alam who absolutely dominated first class. Came back past his peak and still put in performances and scoring centuries. Showed we just absolutely wasted a career. And somehow was played in formats he didn’t do as well in domestic (with sr considered) more than he was given test chances. His technique was as ugly as it gets. And yet still showed performance.

Look at India, the guys in the team have absolutely insane records. Averaging even 50 or 60 in domestic. That’s what you need to get into the team.

Instead we tend to give up on domestic, say it’s rubbish and then use that as an excuse to pick guys doing far worse due to some eye technique analysis. Which rarely works out. Not saying you can’t use that too, but it’s not an excuse to have a bad record and get picked.

I really think we need to wait to pick players until they are absolutely dominating domestic. Not just talented or one good season etc. It also creates a better system in domestic where cricketers really feel like they can work hard and earn their spot. Most of the guys who have actually performed for us in this era have been guys picked late on the back of good domestic performances.

I think from the current generation, guys like Abdullah, Saim and Haris have been picked far too early based on supposed talent. They should have been left to absolutely dominate domestic and show their worth before getting international call ups. If they aren’t able to do that, they won’t succeed in international cricket anyway. But picking them early for international cricket I feel has hindered the development of their overall cricket game. In the past I think we made mistakes picking guys like Umar akmal, imam ul haq etc too early too. They didn’t develop their game after they got picked for internationals regularly.

In our desperation to get these guys as quickly as possible to international, I think we actually delay the age at which they actually turn good at international level. Or if they turn good at all.
I’m nominating this for Post of the Eternity — incredibly strong take.

I’ve long said that in a country like Pakistan, where proper systems are abandoned for endless “talent hunts” and everyone claims to be a talent-spotting genius but one of them are, we desperately need minimum benchmarks — say, at least 40 first-class games, a 40+ average, and 10 centuries before national selection. That alone would fix a lot of our problems because it removes subjective bias. The coaches/selectors can then use their eyes to select among players who meet this basic criteria.

Sahibzada Farhan is the perfect example — he’s been topping domestic seasons for years yet couldn’t catch a break because people nitpicked his technique or footwork. But he’s proven that domestic performance does matter. There are countless players like him who were wasted because the process was ignored.
 
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