Pakistan’s home Test formula crumbles as our batters struggle against spin bowling

[FearlessRoar]

Since the Aaqib-ball era began, we’ve seen a spin-heavy attack at home, during which we’ve missed our main pacers. Our head coach has a dream of making the Pakistan Test team at home as difficult for opponents as it is to defeat Australia in Australia and South Africa in South Africa.

While this strategy has worked well, as our spinners are performing extraordinarily, we’ve seen the inability of our batters to play on these spin-friendly tracks at home. This formula won’t work in the long run if the spinners do their job well and the batters keep losing the game for us.

Here’s what Sohaib Maqsood has said about it:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1883419062639726853

And here’s what Sajid Khan, while addressing the press conference post-Day 2 of the second Test between Pakistan and West Indies, said:

"While we focus on taking 10 wickets, it’s equally important that our batters step up. We understand that the responsibility lies with us to find solutions for playing spin better, and we’re working hard to do that."

"These pitches are not impossible to play on, but they require effort and patience. We are determined to keep fighting, and with the right mindset and strategy, we can turn this situation around."

"The way we’re creating results with these pitches has sparked interest in Test cricket. People are now paying attention to the game, which wasn’t the case before. Whether we win or lose, the crowd’s engagement is a positive sign for the sport."

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Is it excelling?

Jomel Warrican is averaging under 10 with an er of under 3.

Our fans made these uncle bowlers into next Ashwin and Jadeja, Jomel must therefore be next Warne and Murali combined.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Is it excelling?

Jomel Warrican is averaging under 10 with an er of under 3.

Our fans made these uncle bowlers into next Ashwin and Jadeja, Jomel must therefore be next Warne and Murali combined.

About to post that. West Indies fan can say exactly the same "Our bowlers performing extraordinarily. Batsmen have to step up"

 

[ElRaja]

1. the west indies bowlers are used to bowling on spinning pitches, look at their first class stats. if anything the spin strategy evened out the contest in hindsight.
2. pak do not have technically proficient batsmen. theres guys in the xi who arent test level, how are we expecting those who dont make it to the test xi to be better?
3. playing kashif ali was stupid, you clearly dont need a pacer on these wickets, would have made sense to play another batsman.
4. abrars job is cleaning up the tail, if he cant do that, then whats the point of him in the team?

as usual nothing is pak is run with any analytical rigour, its all ad hoc punts. i still think pak can win this test, the pitch is tough, but some of the shot making is just staggeringly bad.

 

[jnaveen1980]

Imagine Afghanistan playing on a deck like this where they don't face pace threat lol It could become an embarrassment.

 

[moghul]

Pakistani spin bowlers are very average , even worst than an average spinners from West Indies.

 

[moghul]

RIP Pakistan cricket.

 

[jnaveen1980]

And also about batsmen. Pakistan lost 20 wickets on a pitch where one team made 800 runs. A flat road. When your batsmen can't bat well on those pitches what are the odds they will do wel on these pitches? Basically Pakistan brought out the par score from 500 all the way to 150 with these pitches.

 

[Farabi]

Since the Aaqib-ball era began, we’ve seen a spin-heavy attack at home, during which we’ve missed our main pacers. Our head coach has a dream of making the Pakistan Test team at home as difficult for opponents as it is to defeat Australia in Australia and South Africa in South Africa.

While this strategy has worked well, as our spinners are performing extraordinarily, we’ve seen the inability of our batters to play on these spin-friendly tracks at home. This formula won’t work in the long run if the spinners do their job well and the batters keep losing the game for us.

Here’s what Sohaib Maqsood has said about it:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1883419062639726853

And here’s what Sajid Khan, while addressing the press conference post-Day 2 of the second Test between Pakistan and West Indies, said:

"While we focus on taking 10 wickets, it’s equally important that our batters step up. We understand that the responsibility lies with us to find solutions for playing spin better, and we’re working hard to do that."

"These pitches are not impossible to play on, but they require effort and patience. We are determined to keep fighting, and with the right mindset and strategy, we can turn this situation around."

"The way we’re creating results with these pitches has sparked interest in Test cricket. People are now paying attention to the game, which wasn’t the case before. Whether we win or lose, the crowd’s engagement is a positive sign for the sport."

 

[Farabi]

View attachment 150172

Before the keyboard warriors come out swinging, let’s set the record straight—these pitches are nothing like the ones used in the England series.

In the second Test against England, Pakistan posted 344 in the first innings, and England replied with 291.
In the third Test, England scored 266, and Pakistan responded with 344.

Those pitches weren’t minefields—they still required skill to outfox the batters.

It seems like they’ve taken the “greenhouse effect” too far this time. Now we’re seeing 20 wickets fall on Day 1, which takes skill out of the equation and turns the game into a shootout.

At this point, every spinner gets a level playing field, and batters are left clueless. Essentially, you’ve forfeited your home advantage.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Before the keyboard warriors come out swinging, let’s set the record straight—these pitches are nothing like the ones used in the England series.

In the second Test against England, Pakistan posted 344 in the first innings, and England replied with 291.
In the third Test, England scored 266, and Pakistan responded with 344.

Those pitches weren’t minefields—they still required skill to outfox the batters.

It seems like they’ve taken the “greenhouse effect” too far this time. Now we’re seeing 20 wickets fall on Day 1, which takes skill out of the equation and turns the game into a shootout.

At this point, every spinner gets a level playing field, and batters are left clueless. Essentially, you’ve forfeited your home advantage.

Weren't you doing bhangra after the first test though and claiming that Pakistan is just doing what SENA do and what's wrong with spin bowling dominating etc etc

Now Pakistan may lose you seem to have seen the light regarding this bad strategy.

 

[Farabi]

Weren't you doing bhangra after the first test though and claiming that Pakistan is just doing what SENA do and what's wrong with spin bowling dominating etc etc

Now Pakistan may lose you seem to have seen the light regarding this bad strategy.

Did you even read my message? I am still fully convicted this is the best strategy.
We need same type of pitches as those in England test series. This WI test series has taken it too far.

 

[topspin]

Before the keyboard warriors come out swinging, let’s set the record straight—these pitches are nothing like the ones used in the England series.

In the second Test against England, Pakistan posted 344 in the first innings, and England replied with 291.
In the third Test, England scored 266, and Pakistan responded with 344.

Those pitches weren’t minefields—they still required skill to outfox the batters.

It seems like they’ve taken the “greenhouse effect” too far this time. Now we’re seeing 20 wickets fall on Day 1, which takes skill out of the equation and turns the game into a shootout.

At this point, every spinner gets a level playing field, and batters are left clueless. Essentially, you’ve forfeited your home advantage.

I agree with this.

What you want are slow turners, which resemble traditional Indian wickets. First 3 days offer enough assistance for good spinners and batsmen. The pitch naturally breaks up on day 4 to aid all spinners.

What we're seeing now are filthy dust bowls, where it's become more of a lottery since it's become more toss dependent.

The overarching problem here are the pitch curators. Nearly all of them in Pakistan (if not all) are severely incompetent. Just as incompetent as Misbah's captaincy and white ball batsmanship.

 

[Farabi]

I agree with this.

What you want are slow turners, which resemble traditional Indian wickets. First 3 days offer enough assistance for good spinners and batsmen. The pitch naturally breaks up on day 4 to aid all spinners.

What we're seeing now are filthy dust bowls, where it's become more of a lottery since it's become more toss dependent.

The overarching problem here are the pitch curators. Nearly all of them in Pakistan (if not all) are severely incompetent. Just as incompetent as Misbah's captaincy and white ball batsmanship.

They really overdid it this time. They had the industrial fans working just fine—why switch to the greenhouse effect and try something completely new?

As the saying goes, "If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it."

The pitches against England worked great and gave solid results, so why mess with the curation method?

The issue is not lack of curators, the issue here is the switch in the method, which was likely top down.

 

[topspin]

I agree with this.

What you want are slow turners, which resemble traditional Indian wickets. First 3 days offer enough assistance for good spinners and batsmen. The pitch naturally breaks up on day 4 to aid all spinners.

What we're seeing now are filthy dust bowls, where it's become more of a lottery since it's become more toss dependent.

The overarching problem here are the pitch curators. Nearly all of them in Pakistan (if not all) are severely incompetent. Just as incompetent as Misbah's captaincy and white ball batsmanship.

To add to the above, since it's more toss dependent, whoever is batting in the 2nd and 4th innings is at a big disadvantage.

Pakistan happens to be batting last and that will be the reason why they will lose this test match and fail to win this series.

 

[mominsaigol]

To add to the above, since it's more toss dependent, whoever is batting in the 2nd and 4th innings is at a big disadvantage.

Pakistan happens to be batting last and that will be the reason why they will lose this test match and fail to win this series.

Since aqib ball started, Has Pakistan ever batted 2nd? I dont recall Pakistan batting 2nd against England.

I think this is the first time they are batting 2nd against wi.

 

[Farabi]

To add to the above, since it's more toss dependent, whoever is batting in the 2nd and 4th innings is at a big disadvantage.

Pakistan happens to be batting last and that will be the reason why they will lose this test match and fail to win this series.

Exactly.

In those two tests against England, Pakistan put up 350 in their first innings both times. We saw centuries from Kamran Ghulam and Saud, along with some solid 50s. There was a lot more for the batters to work with.

Now you're talking about 20 wickets falling on day one—that's a whole different story.

 

[topspin]

Since aqib ball started, Has Pakistan ever batted 2nd? I dont recall Pakistan batting 2nd against England.

I think this is the first time they are batting 2nd against wi.

Those wickets in England weren't dust bowls like the ones we've in this series. They were slow turners, there's nothing wrong with those. It's the rank turners which play like a day 5 wicket from day 1.

 

[mominsaigol]

Those wickets in England weren't dust bowls like the ones we've in this series. They were slow turners, there's nothing wrong with those. It's the rank turners which play like a day 5 wicket from day 1.

Tbf, we've only had one dust bowl which was wi vs Pakistan 1st test.

This game hasn't been a dustbowl, infact the wicket is even better then the one against England.

It's just both wi and pakistan batted horribly in the 1st innings.

This pitch is still a 250 pitch and a good team like nz would have scored 270 to 280 in the first innings.

 

[Savak]

The Sweep shot, reverse sweep, getting the front foot outside the line of offstump, getting to the pitch of the ball are vital ingredients in destroying spin bowling. Most Pakistani batsmen are crease bound. Rizwan, Saud Shakeel, Agha Salman are the best players of the sweep shot and they have better records against spin vs the rest of the other batters.

 

[kingusama92]

They will need to keep finding good players of spin.

The formula with the spinning tracks is fine (maybe tone it down a bit) but it's important to have 4-5 batsmen that can play spin effectively.

1.Saim
2.Shan
3.
4.
5. Saud
6. Rizwan
7. Agha

Right now they have two spots that need to be improved on. Babar and Kamran can remain in contention but they need to see others at the domestic level to determine which batsmen play spin the best.

 

[Abid Z]

They really overdid it this time. They had the industrial fans working just fine—why switch to the greenhouse effect and try something completely new?

As the saying goes, "If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it."

The pitches against England worked great and gave solid results, so why mess with the curation method?

The issue is not lack of curators, the issue here is the switch in the method, which was likely top down.

You are correct the Pak management have created a lottery. The pitch is unpredictable from day one. In actual fact a spin heavy attack is correct because that’s paks strong suit but to have dust bowls has nullified our batsmen. Plus of course West Indies brought better spinners than England did. And naturally England were caught off guard but Pak pretty much telegraphed their plan. West Indies have adapted beautifully and slowed their speed right down and focused on drift and loop.

Any pitch that spins moderately can also seam. It’s the same stitching that grips and seams. Just we’ve nullified any fast bowler.

 

[Abid Z]

Tbf, we've only had one dust bowl which was wi vs Pakistan 1st test.

This game hasn't been a dustbowl, infact the wicket is even better then the one against England.

It's just both wi and pakistan batted horribly in the 1st innings.

This pitch is still a 250 pitch and a good team like nz would have scored 270 to 280 in the first innings.

Santner and Ish wouldn’t have let us cross 50

 

[Farabi]

You are correct the Pak management have created a lottery. The pitch is unpredictable from day one. In actual fact a spin heavy attack is correct because that’s paks strong suit but to have dust bowls has nullified our batsmen. Plus of course West Indies brought better spinners than England did. And naturally England were caught off guard but Pak pretty much telegraphed their plan. West Indies have adapted beautifully and slowed their speed right down and focused on drift and loop.

Any pitch that spins moderately can also seam. It’s the same stitching that grips and seams. Just we’ve nullified any fast bowler.

Yup.

It’s hard to say whether the West Indies have brought better spinners or if these pitches are just way more supportive than what we saw against England.

I can easily imagine Jack Leach wreaking havoc on these dust bowls where 20 wickets fell to spinners on Day 1.

Our batters are generally better equipped to handle spin than most teams because they’ve built their games around slow turners in domestic cricket. That’s what their reflexes are trained for, more so than most visiting teams.

But if you start producing these square turners, skill goes out the window—even for our own batters. Let me be clear: no one, absolutely no one, can bat on these kinds of pitches, so the difference between Pakistani and visiting teams is eliminated.

 

[RidiculousMan]

Since the Aaqib-ball era began, we’ve seen a spin-heavy attack at home, during which we’ve missed our main pacers. Our head coach has a dream of making the Pakistan Test team at home as difficult for opponents as it is to defeat Australia in Australia and South Africa in South Africa.

While this strategy has worked well, as our spinners are performing extraordinarily, we’ve seen the inability of our batters to play on these spin-friendly tracks at home. This formula won’t work in the long run if the spinners do their job well and the batters keep losing the game for us.

Here’s what Sohaib Maqsood has said about it:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1883419062639726853

And here’s what Sajid Khan, while addressing the press conference post-Day 2 of the second Test between Pakistan and West Indies, said:

"While we focus on taking 10 wickets, it’s equally important that our batters step up. We understand that the responsibility lies with us to find solutions for playing spin better, and we’re working hard to do that."

"These pitches are not impossible to play on, but they require effort and patience. We are determined to keep fighting, and with the right mindset and strategy, we can turn this situation around."

"The way we’re creating results with these pitches has sparked interest in Test cricket. People are now paying attention to the game, which wasn’t the case before. Whether we win or lose, the crowd’s engagement is a positive sign for the sport."

Bingo!

 

[RidiculousMan]

Pakistan have to be very careful with this formula and wickets. Specially if they make rank turners in domestic season as well. This will have long term consequences

 

[Justcrazy]

Such pitches are necessary right now for Pakistan. Pakistan tried all kinds , even flat ones , but were losing. There was no choice left. You need to win to get momentum back.

 

[FearlessRoar]

Pakistan is getting a taste of their own formula

 

[jnaveen1980]

Afghanistan, ZImbabwe both teams will fancy their chances on these pitches.

 

[Ab Fan]

This is humiliating defeat for Pakistan. They have lost test series to Bangladesh and now lost a test match to Windies. You either accept BD and WI as decent team or call yourself a minnow in an era where SENAI are top teams.

Also, to add fuel to fire, England are a mediocre travelling team too as they couldn’t beat this mediocre Pakistan side lol. This is even more humiliating and saddening for Pakistani posters on this forum especially those who live in England and support these two teams. Both teams have been embarrassed with this dominant win by West Indies.

 

[gazza619]

Calm down, Pakistan cricket has not died after this defeat. If Australia can lose to WI at home so can Pakistan.

Batting is a huge concern though.

 

[Major]

This is humiliating defeat for Pakistan. They have lost test series to Bangladesh and now lost a test match to Windies. You either accept BD and WI as decent team or call yourself a minnow in an era where SENAI are top teams.

Also, to add fuel to fire, England are a mediocre travelling team too as they couldn’t beat this mediocre Pakistan side lol. This is even more humiliating and saddening for Pakistani posters on this forum especially those who live in England and support these two teams. Both teams have been embarrassed with this dominant win by West Indies.

SENAI?

The way you tagged India along with those developed countries is like watching a SUV drive by with a begger running behind it

 

[jnaveen1980]

Pakistan's only type of bowlers that take wickets are spinners. If teams come up with a counter plan like West Indies did in the 2nd dig and other teams can attack Pakistan with both pace and spin Pakistan team will look handicapped. That is why this is not a viable option. Essentially Pakistan's entire plan revolve around two uncles. Even one cannot get injured or be out of rhythm. It is not that hard to work out a plan against these guys. This is a high risk short term solution. Pakistan batsmen lost 20 wickets even on flat wickets. So they decided to bring down the par score with this tactic hoping they would reach the par score every time by winning the toss. This will make the batsmen worse. Fast bowlers extinct. Spinners predictable. They are no spring chickens either. They will get tired.

 

[Ab Fan]

SENAI?

The way you tagged India along with those developed countries is like watching a SUV drive by with a begger running behind it

We are discussing cricket and the top tap teams are Australia and India. You have to be extremely biased and bitter to deny that.

 

[adi_62941]

Not a single batsmen can handle spin in home is a worry sign. I mean how can your whole batting collapse in 2 innings against a mediocre spinner attack in home conditions.
Certainly the formula against Aqib and co has started to show results.
I feel pity for babar, he will prove to be a very average batsmen for Pakistan

 

[jnaveen1980]

So Shan wants this to happen in domestic as well. Under-prepared pitches

On whether these pitches should be replicated in domestic cricket as well: "100%"

 

[zaidihusain]

Calm down, Pakistan cricket has not died after this defeat. If Australia can lose to WI at home so can Pakistan.

Batting is a huge concern though.

Absolutely correct. Batting let the team down big time; you can't win a test match by failing in both innings

Aus lost to WI at home, NZ lost to Bang at home, SA against SRI at home. It's not a big deal

At least Pakistan knows the recipe of victory at home, but they have to keep improving

 

[mominsaigol]

We are discussing cricket and the top tap teams are Australia and India. You have to be extremely biased and bitter to deny that.

India is 3 now. They aren't in wtc. You cant call them top 2 when they lost to nz brutally at home and lost to aus 3-1. Techincally 4-1.

I'll never forget the Indian celebration when they celebrated a drawn rained off 2.5 day test game.

^^ This is not the mentality of a top 2 side.

 

[Savak]

Tbh England were surprised and caught off guard by how quickly Pakistan changed the pitches, they didn't have enough time to adapt.

If England were to come again, I guarantee they will come up with a proper counter plan against Nauman, Sajid. Let's not forget the importance of Sajids assault with the bat against England in the third test which allowed Pakistan to get a vital 70 runs lead.

WI were quick enough to launch a counter assault and Sajid, Nauman failed to handle the pressure when they were tested in the second innings.

Other teams will be very well prepared for Sajid, Nauman and Pakistan's spin strategy. Pakistan needs to find a way to get two proper pacers in the team and to do away with Abrar who is a useless fraud in test cricket.

 

[Major]

We are discussing cricket and the top tap teams are Australia and India. You have to be extremely biased and bitter to deny that.

Where in the title are we discussing top teams?

The desperation from indians to be mentioned in undeniable

 

[AMSS]

SENAI?

The way you tagged India along with those developed countries is like watching a SUV drive by with a begger running behind it

 

[Barragan]

Can't bat on green pitches

Can't bat on bouncy pitches

Can't bat on spinning pitches

Get out-batted on flat tracks

Disgraceful batsmen!

I say, stick with spinning pitches and replace the batsmen that can't bat on it - only way Pakistan have picked up 20 wickets

 

[FearlessRoar]

Shan Masood while addressing the press conference after losing to the West Indies in the 2nd Test:

"We haven’t played enough domestic cricket in these conditions, but the exposure has been valuable. We need to adapt, and our batters need to get accustomed to these conditions for future performances."

"As for the bowlers, we need to figure out how to get the opposition out quickly. In these conditions, scoring over 140-150 in the fourth innings can still lead to a competitive total, as the pitch has some turn and unpredictable bounce."

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

They really overdid it this time. They had the industrial fans working just fine—why switch to the greenhouse effect and try something completely new?

As the saying goes, "If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it."

The pitches against England worked great and gave solid results, so why mess with the curation method?

The issue is not lack of curators, the issue here is the switch in the method, which was likely top down.

I think weather conditions played a part in them creating that greenhouse. The climate at this type of the year is far colder. But still, they could have replicated those England series pitches. I personally believe that they underestimated the West Indies and expected them to roll over on rank-turners.

 

[followed]

Pakistan should stop playing test cricket.
Not a single good batsman in the team apart from rizwan to an extent, all others are terrible.

Pakistan's fast bowling is joke only one player deserve to play test cricket that's chacha Nauman who is very good and can bat a bit as well.
Tinda sajid is not that good though.

 

[Farabi]

I think weather conditions played a part in them creating that greenhouse. The climate at this type of the year is far colder. But still, they could have replicated those England series pitches. I personally believe that they underestimated the West Indies and expected them to roll over on rank-turners.

Yup. Not going to lie. I expected the same.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Pakistan should stop playing test cricket.
Not a single good batsman in the team apart from rizwan to an extent, all others are terrible.

Pakistan's fast bowling is joke only one player deserve to play test cricket that's chacha Nauman who is very good and can bat a bit as well.
Tinda sajid is not that good though.

Rizwan and Saud are test class to an extent.

The rest aren't. Even Chacha Naumi will get carted around on unhelpful pitches.

 

[Farabi]

Tbh England were surprised and caught off guard by how quickly Pakistan changed the pitches, they didn't have enough time to adapt.

If England were to come again, I guarantee they will come up with a proper counter plan against Nauman, Sajid. Let's not forget the importance of Sajids assault with the bat against England in the third test which allowed Pakistan to get a vital 70 runs lead.

WI were quick enough to launch a counter assault and Sajid, Nauman failed to handle the pressure when they were tested in the second innings.

Other teams will be very well prepared for Sajid, Nauman and Pakistan's spin strategy. Pakistan needs to find a way to get two proper pacers in the team and to do away with Abrar who is a useless fraud in test cricket.

Exactly.

This is just the beginning of a journey, not the final solution. AJ has mentioned that a reversal might be necessary at some point, and that will be critical.

Batting needs to evolve. Field placements and leadership also need improvement. Above all, pitch curation must improve. The pitches against the West Indies went too far, and we need to create more balanced pitches, like those against England, that offer more for batters.

 

[Buffet]

Eng scoring 800 runs in very little time.

To

3 spinners taking 50 wickets with SR in 20s.



Why go for such extremes? Just have regular SC turning tracks.

Going extreme in both ends is dangeours. In one end, you can get outbowled and another you can get outbatted. Just have slow turners and have spin/pace both able to contribute. May be struggle against good treams, but come on against WI? You don't need worst pitches served in entire hitory to win against WI. Pakistan should be able to beat WI at home on slow turners.

These pitches are only good if batting first. Winning while batting last will be very tough.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Rizwan and Saud are test class to an extent.

The rest aren't. Even Chacha Naumi will get carted around on unhelpful pitches.

Let's not undersell the guy who took a 10-fer and a hat-trick in the same match. He also took a 7-fer in Sri Lanka and helped Pakistan win a series there. Pakistan's spin duo is very good and definitely test class. But it's unrealistic to expect them to bowl 60 overs in every match and just destroy oppositions. Some questions also need to be asked of the captaincy and tactics that allowed West Indies to score 100+ despite being 8 down. This isn't even the first time this has happened. It has happened numerous times now, mostly in matches in which Noman and Sajid weren't even playing.

 

[Buffet]

The lowest 3 SR in last 50-60 years and all 3 came in this series ( 15+ wickets & 2 tests minimum )




I think it's absurd to have pitches like this. People can complain about batsmen not being good, but when you have 3 lowest SR in history happening in the same series, something is surely very wrong with pitches. No need to look for any excuses or hype some past players by saying that they would have done this or that.

Pitches were disgusting.

 

[Kianig89]

The series demanded a 3rd Test , a harsh reality Pak let WI off the hook from 38/7 another grilling point

 

[Barragan]

I hope everyone calms down and realises this is just the beginning of a process and there is no reason to drop the spinning pitches formula

This Windies side are way better than given credit and they actually won in Australia, which not even Pakistan team could achieve

 

[Kianig89]

If not WI and Bangladesh who do you think Pak will beat in this format

I hope everyone calms down and realises this is just the beginning of a process and there is no reason to drop the spinning pitches formula

This Windies side are way better than given credit and they actually won in Australia, which not even Pakistan team could achieve

 

[Barragan]

If not WI and Bangladesh who do you think Pak will beat in this format

They literally beat England

Spin pitches were not made against BD - what are you talking about?

It was green pitches, Pak bowlers and batsmen failed miserably

Australia also lost against West Indies, do they now stop making bouncy pitches?

 

[DeadlyVenom]

Let's not undersell the guy who took a 10-fer and a hat-trick in the same match. He also took a 7-fer in Sri Lanka and helped Pakistan win a series there. Pakistan's spin duo is very good and definitely test class. But it's unrealistic to expect them to bowl 60 overs in every match and just destroy oppositions. Some questions also need to be asked of the captaincy and tactics that allowed West Indies to score 100+ despite being 8 down. This isn't even the first time this has happened. It has happened numerous times now, mostly in matches in which Noman and Sajid weren't even playing.

He is too close to 40. He is a wily bowler but realistically now much too old to have too much if an impact going forward - especially for unhelpful conditions.

Honestly I think we really only have Saud and Rizwan as potentially test class home and away.

Khurram perhaps too but he's not got the best fitness record.

 

[Rana]

One formula that was proving to be good was keeping Babar out of the side. This is starting to haunt us again with him back in it.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

He is too close to 40. He is a wily bowler but realistically now much too old to have too much if an impact going forward - especially for unhelpful conditions.

Honestly I think we really only have Saud and Rizwan as potentially test class home and away.

Khurram perhaps too but he's not got the best fitness record.

He may not have alot of time left on the clock but he is still the best red-ball spinner in the country right now. I'm sure he would deliver if he was trusted more overseas. What should worry fans more is the fact that Pakistan don't have a single young spinner who is even in the same league. Abrar is a good white-ball bowler but I don't think he works in red-ball unless he is playing a supporting role to Noman and Sajid.

 

[zaidihusain]

I hope everyone calms down and realises this is just the beginning of a process and there is no reason to drop the spinning pitches formula

This Windies side are way better than given credit and they actually won in Australia, which not even Pakistan team could achieve

Fully agree. The batters must adopt to these conditions and should learn how to stay on the wicket and play long innings. Aus & Eng offers bouncy & seaming wickets, and they expect their batters to perform on those wickets. They know their strength & their winning formula, and they stick with that rather than switching to spin friendly wickets after few loses.

 

[DeadlyVenom]

He may not have alot of time left on the clock but he is still the best red-ball spinner in the country right now. I'm sure he would deliver if he was trusted more overseas. What should worry fans more is the fact that Pakistan don't have a single young spinner who is even in the same league. Abrar is a good white-ball bowler but I don't think he works in red-ball unless he is playing a supporting role to Noman and Sajid.

Yeah he is a good bowler overall.

With regards to the back up spinner I don't follow domestic too much but read on here that domestics are generally played on green mambas where dibbly dibbly medium pacers run riot. So there is no real way for a spinner to learn the art of spin bowling and given our main focus on T20 cricket most of the spinners have turned into darters now too.

We need a major effort to salvage our cricket going forward

 

[chinaman00]

We are living in the dark age of Pakistan cricket.

Fake superstars and PSL to blame. Players routinely selected for Test & ODI sides based on PSL performances. No consideration given to domestic first class cricket. PCB is as inept and corrupt as ever. No science or even art behind the thinking of team management.

High time ICC restores the prestige of test cricket by relegating weak and boring teams like Pakistan to second division.

Pakistan sits at the very bottom of the Test table for a reason.

 

[emranabbas]

Struggle on green pitches, bouncy pitches, and spinning tracks, and even get outplayed on flat ones utterly disgraceful batting! Yet, some of these players are labelled world-class and compared to the likes of younis Khan. Delusional nonsense. I say stick to spinning pitches and replace the batsmen who can’t cope; it’s the only way Pakistan have managed to take 20 wickets.

 

[Deewana Mastana]

We are living in the dark age of Pakistan cricket.

Fake superstars and PSL to blame. Players routinely selected for Test & ODI sides based on PSL performances. No consideration given to domestic first class cricket. PCB is as inept and corrupt as ever. No science or even art behind the thinking of team management.

High time ICC restores the prestige of test cricket by relegating weak and boring teams like Pakistan to second division.

Pakistan sits at the very bottom of the Test table for a reason.

What's the point of FC cricket when the team only plays 4 tests per year - Players, fitness and pitches in FC cricket are worse than club level.

 

[Major]

View attachment 150183

lol India missed out on another final.....

and they think they dominate world cricket

 

[AMSS]

lol India missed out on another final.....

and they think they dominate world cricket

Take a look at pakistani dummy. Can you see the SENAI up above, basement dweller?

 

[The Bald Eagle]

Pakistan deserved it

View attachment 150183

 

[Major]

Take a look at pakistani dummy. Can you see the SENAI up above, basement dweller?

Retarded Indian, plz read the thread title. Can you see that this thread has nothing to do with India or its desperate attempts to be labelled along side good teams?

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Retarded Indian, plz read the thread title. Can you see that this thread has nothing to do with India or its desperate attempts to be labelled along side good teams?

Yeah , on the other hand it has everything to do with whether it's a developed economy or not as per your posts.

Talk about irrelevance

 

[AMSS]

Retarded Indian, plz read the thread title. Can you see that this thread has nothing to do with India or its desperate attempts to be labelled along side good teams?

There India, Australia and England. And then there is Pakistani..the bottomfeeder team. Lmao.

 

[RedwoodOriginal]

Yeah he is a good bowler overall.

With regards to the back up spinner I don't follow domestic too much but read on here that domestics are generally played on green mambas where dibbly dibbly medium pacers run riot. So there is no real way for a spinner to learn the art of spin bowling and given our main focus on T20 cricket most of the spinners have turned into darters now too.

We need a major effort to salvage our cricket going forward

Yes that is true. The nature of the pitches varies wildly season to season. For a number of years now though they have been producing these medium pacer friendly pitches. For a period of time they switched to flatter wickets that would come alive on the later days. In general there is no consistency though.

Funnily enough, Noman and Sajid hadn't played FC for a year when they were selected for the England series.

 

[Major]

Yeah , on the other hand it has everything to do with whether it's a developed economy or not as per your posts.

Talk about irrelevance

Offcourse i will make such post when indians will try to bring up an irrelevent country to a thread that is not relevant to them.

The desperation for attention that indians what is hilarious

 

[Major]

There India, Australia and England. And then there is Pakistani..the bottomfeeder team. Lmao.

Lol did not even reach the finals, and you are celebrating 3rd position.

 

[AMSS]

Atleast Pakistan is not desperate to write its name with developed economies like indians are.

Lol did not even reach the finals, and you are celebrating 3rd position.

aTleaSt pAkista...LMAO, here. Pakistan is a bottom tier, boring, weak team that gets shown its aukaat by bangaladesh. Stay in your lane.

 

[AZulfi]

Second Test = ‘Dig a pit for someone else, fall in yourself.’

Short-sighted PCB management (Aqib etc.) and captain Shan pushing for pitches to favour their spinners but forgetting that we do not have many batsmen apart from Saud and Rizwan who play spin well.

 

[Energy]

Preparing a spinning wicket was not a bad idea.

But allowing West Indies batsmen to outscore your premiere branded tullay is an abomination.

 

[SpiritOf1903]

Idiots don't know how to use home advantage. One nil up, prepare a road that won't produce a result.

Or a novelty, prepare a good spinning pitch, not a replica of the moon

 

[Nikhil_cric]

Lol did not even reach the finals, and you are celebrating 3rd position.

The comparison was in terms of cricket. Nothing to do with whether the economies are developed or not.

 

[jnaveen1980]

The lowest 3 SR in last 50-60 years and all 3 came in this series ( 15+ wickets & 2 tests minimum )

View attachment 150187


I think it's absurd to have pitches like this. People can complain about batsmen not being good, but when you have 3 lowest SR in history happening in the same series, something is surely very wrong with pitches. No need to look for any excuses or hype some past players by saying that they would have done this or that.

Pitches were disgusting.

Whey you consider west indies dropped 4 chances in the 2nd dig it looks even worse. You can keep coming back on a surface like this.

 

[Major]

aTleaSt pAkista...LMAO, here. Pakistan is a bottom tier, boring, weak team that gets shown its aukaat by bangaladesh. Stay in your lane.

So we dont make it to the final and u dont make it to the final.

Seems like u are no better than us. As for auqaat, it is you who is desperate to be labelled with England and Australia

 

[jnaveen1980]

I see suggestinon of "improving" batsmen on these pitches. You cannot improve on unpredictable tracks even if you play on tracks like this for so many years. Even ATG players have struggled against no name bowlers on tracks like this. Also it will hurt your batting fundamental big times.