Yes. Caretaker governments will run Pakistan for the next 2-3 years.
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PDM has proven to be politically savvy and clever than PTI for the last 12 plus months?
- Thread starter Savak
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Yes. Caretaker governments will run Pakistan for the next 2-3 years.
wasim-fan
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Imran Khan as politician is emblematic of what is wrong with Pakistan. Pride and ego under the garb of idealism. Nobody wants to or can work with someone like that. To a point, that they are willing to spend all the time and resource to isolate you even during an economic crisis. You have taken such staunch positions and abused your opponents to such a degree that you can't talk with them anymore.
You can create fervour among people. But such things don't last too long. His image has literally been banned from TV. He will remain relevant for only so long. It would have been great for him to sit in assembly and take on the chor and daaku. He would have shown himself as the only logical alternative. But now it's done. Nobody can work with him and military have made up their mind. For now.
You can create fervour among people. But such things don't last too long. His image has literally been banned from TV. He will remain relevant for only so long. It would have been great for him to sit in assembly and take on the chor and daaku. He would have shown himself as the only logical alternative. But now it's done. Nobody can work with him and military have made up their mind. For now.
Khan's ego, stubbornness and narcissism have consumed him. He is irrelevant now.
UP
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Khan is still a massive force and a monster in politics. Give him a fair and free elections and let him campaign freely - he will sweep the country.
The goons are afraid of him and thats why they are using every trick in the book to eliminate him.
70-90% vote bank is not a joke.
Varun
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Thread title should be "savvy" not "savy".
Apologies for being a grammar nazi lol.
Apologies for being a grammar nazi lol.
Cpt. Rishwat
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Who is contsructing this master game plan?
daytrader
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PDM unlikely to contest elections from single platform, says Fazl
n opposition to Defence Minister Khawaja Asif’s proposal, JUI-F chief Maulana Fazlur Rehman has expressed doubt about the likelihood of Pakistan Democratic Movement (PDM) parties contesting the next elections from a single platform, as PDM is not an election alliance.
“The PDM is not an election alliance and it is unlikely that it contests the next polls on one platform. Every party has its own manifesto. However, the parties in the PDM may go for seat-adjustment at local levels,” the PDM president said in a talk with journalists at the residence of PML-N stalwart Sardar Ayaz Sadiq on Monday.
Khawaja Asif of PML-N recently said the PDM parties should contest upcoming elections together.
The PDM is a nine-party alliance with PML-N leading it. The PPP is not part of this alliance, however, it has hinted at making seat-adjustment with the PML-N, especially in Punjab.
The ruling coalition parties have stepped up efforts to take full advantage of the crumbling of Imran Khan’s PTI following the events of May 9. The PML-N, PPP, JUI-F, PML-Q, and the Jahangir Khan Tareen group have all launched campaigns in anticipation of October, 2023 general elections and wooing the support of electables and the PTI deserters.
Like many coalition leaders, Maulana Fazl also did not categorically say that the elections would be held this October.
“We are political people who are in favour of elections but the decision regarding (October) polls will be taken in consultation with the coalition parties, just as the PDM made decisions in consultation with the allied parties in the past,” Maulana Fazl said.
...
https://www.dawn.com/news/1758235/pdm-unlikely-to-contest-elections-from-single-platform-says-fazl
n opposition to Defence Minister Khawaja Asif’s proposal, JUI-F chief Maulana Fazlur Rehman has expressed doubt about the likelihood of Pakistan Democratic Movement (PDM) parties contesting the next elections from a single platform, as PDM is not an election alliance.
“The PDM is not an election alliance and it is unlikely that it contests the next polls on one platform. Every party has its own manifesto. However, the parties in the PDM may go for seat-adjustment at local levels,” the PDM president said in a talk with journalists at the residence of PML-N stalwart Sardar Ayaz Sadiq on Monday.
Khawaja Asif of PML-N recently said the PDM parties should contest upcoming elections together.
The PDM is a nine-party alliance with PML-N leading it. The PPP is not part of this alliance, however, it has hinted at making seat-adjustment with the PML-N, especially in Punjab.
The ruling coalition parties have stepped up efforts to take full advantage of the crumbling of Imran Khan’s PTI following the events of May 9. The PML-N, PPP, JUI-F, PML-Q, and the Jahangir Khan Tareen group have all launched campaigns in anticipation of October, 2023 general elections and wooing the support of electables and the PTI deserters.
Like many coalition leaders, Maulana Fazl also did not categorically say that the elections would be held this October.
“We are political people who are in favour of elections but the decision regarding (October) polls will be taken in consultation with the coalition parties, just as the PDM made decisions in consultation with the allied parties in the past,” Maulana Fazl said.
...
https://www.dawn.com/news/1758235/pdm-unlikely-to-contest-elections-from-single-platform-says-fazl
the Great Khan
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They are so happy. Their main enemy is under house arrest..his party is shackled and they think they can continue as we are. To hell with the awaam
emranabbas
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70-90% of the vote bank is online only with half of it not eligible to vote as they are not even living in the country
Imran khan has a very strong online media team
Mainly Youtubers Tiktokers Twitter users etc...
Who mainly create content so they could get views and like to earn USD Dollers
Plus he's an ex cricketer and a world cup winner people who have nothing to do with pakistani politics or pakistan also know of him and he gets that extra support by people who again are not eligible to vote
That's why it seems like as if imran khan has alot of support by voters
What really matters is who turns up to vote & the ground reality is imran khan is irrelevant after the 9th May terrorism
Secondly when imran khan is giving speech he will use terms like "mere saath 22 caror awam hai" which are 100 percent fake claims and its just a tool to brainwash people like you
Half of those 22 caror people are not eligible to vote
And Out of 11 caror people only probably half of them will make an effort to vote
If I go in details
Pakistan population 242,923,845
Registered voters 105,955,409
people voted in 2018 election 53,123,733
Imran khan voters : 16,903,702 that's about 30%
This was when the army was supportive of imran khan pre 9th may
Pmln voters: 12,934,589 about 25%
You can see plmn have not been far off
After 9th may I can only see pmln moving upwards and imran khan downwards
emranabbas
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And with comments like "hell with awaam" and "hell with army" that's just like a little child throwing toys out of his pram because he can't get his way. That child needs to man up and face the reality
Manager101
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Pakistan is not a country, its a property of few elites and those still shamelessly defending these elites are their slaves.
Savak
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Do you seriously think the PML N vote bank has increased inspite of the worst one year governance in the last one year. Even May 9th is not really going to help the PML N vote bank. In fact the establishment is moving on from PML N and is now trying to help PPP and Jahangir Tareen group, Aleem Khan group, PML Q and the PTI dissidents.
There is a reason why the establishment and the PDM are desperately trying to avoid elections inspite of having so many things in their favour
1) A scared compliant judiciary
2) Election Commission in their pockets
3) Care taker governments in their pockets
4) Police in their Pockets
5) Millitary in their pockets
Even inspite of this, they know full well the above are not enough to stop Imran Khan's groundswell on the ground.
UP
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Hold free and fair elections then. What are they so scared of?
IK is totally crushed right now - what is stopping them?
People like you are brainwashed by the loot maar of Dakoo movement of 75 years.
Savak
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So time has shown IK decision to dissolve the Punjab and KP Assemblies in Jan 2023 was a disasterous mistake due to which he and his party workers suffered badly.
Wait and watch what Maryam Nawaz as Chief Minister does to PTI at the hands of Punjab Police.
Wait and watch what Maryam Nawaz as Chief Minister does to PTI at the hands of Punjab Police.
How wrong you were!!!!!!
How's the House cleaning going??
The people of Pakistan will decide who is or ain't coming back and they have showed their decision in this election and will keep showing it in future elections.
Tens of Millions of Pakistanis have voted for the nobody's unknown candidates. It's the people of Pakistan who will decide who is or isn't a nobody and who will be politically destroyed like PPP and PMLN have been in this election and not the Establishment, not anymore!!!! They're all on borrowed time and they know it!!
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How come are PDM guys savvy, they have lost the elections ignominously and now clinging to the power with the blessings of Establishment.
Rana
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aboveandbeyond
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By the looks of it. Your parading on a stolen Mandate of the people.
A self respected person would have sympathy. But not surprised at all with the behaviour and actions of Patwaris.
Rana
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By the looks of it, I am not telling myself things to make me feel better about what the reality of the situation is.
aboveandbeyond
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Good. Atleast some reality to the dire situation with the previous Pdm governments abject failures.
IMMY69
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What does the "D" stand for in PDM?
Major
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learning from the PTI playbook who lsot the 2017 election but still formed govt on rigged seats
I don't understand why people love to bring Allah's Name in the dirty politics of Establishment.
Project Establishment was the biggest failure of the people and they won't repeat the same mistake again!!!
Savak
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So the Establishment has given the PDM PTI's reserves seats as well? Talk about robbery with full fledged besharmi
Game is still in play and last I checked PTI is not back in the government and Imran Khan is still in jail. And the PDM is still here and in government. The establishment wins again as expected.
aboveandbeyond
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Stewie
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I dont think this is a question of who is savvy or not anymore. PDM has buried themselves in the ground with this election. first they lost massively, then they allowed the boots to put them in power afer massive rigging.
They will have zero support in the masses. There will always be some some fringe supporters, we see a few of those here on this board as well, but overall their goose is cooked.
Pakistan is in a virtual martial law where the boots picked the government and yeah that has been the formula for a while now, even when they picked PTI but at least now we know PTI is the only party standing up against them. the rest are all in bed with the boots.
They will have zero support in the masses. There will always be some some fringe supporters, we see a few of those here on this board as well, but overall their goose is cooked.
Pakistan is in a virtual martial law where the boots picked the government and yeah that has been the formula for a while now, even when they picked PTI but at least now we know PTI is the only party standing up against them. the rest are all in bed with the boots.
Thats your opinion. Prove it in the courts that PTI had 270 seats out of 265.
Yep at this stage these games and experiments are tiring and just causing more instability. Army should drop the facade and just rule directly. Atleast we will have a stable government.
Stewie
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They dont do that because of course its not a good look at the international stage. It makes things difficult when it comes to foreign affairs and dealing with democracies around the world for trade deals, as well as dealing with institutions like the IMF.
The bottom-line is the boots are not trained/equipped to deal with these issues. They are there to defend the country and not meddle with internal affairs and governance and to dictate the foreign policy. They have been doing that for over 50 years now (possibly more).
The skills a democratic and independent government was supposed to learn through independence of governance with zero oversight from military were of course never picked up. Which is why we see embarassing videos of people like NS and Shehbaz, Bilawal and Zardari fumbling through stuff because they were just being drones and doing what their masters told them to do. How can you expect proper leadership when the leader does not have the courage of conviction in anything he does?
I think the people of Pakistan realize that now. Imran was a free thinker and did not like it when they started telling him what he could or could not do. People have seen that now as well. Which is why I think this debate should be really settled now. WHETHER by design or not, Imran has proven that being politically savvy is secondary if the people who these leaders answer to can see the true faces of theirs.
.
Savak
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Courts that are controlled by the Establishment and PDM? Come on.
Savak
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Asim Munir has been photographed with a big smile on his face when shaking hands with NS, Zardari and Bilawal during SS opening ceremony. Making it blatantly clear whose side he is on. Sadly the international establishment i.e. US, UK and EU are on his side.
aboveandbeyond
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The only reason your stating this because every institution in the land with the corrupt boot lickers
UP
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This party will soon be over. Time will tell.
UP
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Come back next year.
UP
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Let them enjoy choti choti khushiyaan. They are cooked and they know it, it’s a desperate hold for power, rent seeking and status co. Things will change in long term, 12-24 months.
As I said earlier in this thread last May, expect IK to rise from dead.
Savak
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AM and his troika of Generals ie Nadeem Anjum, Faisal Naseer are absolute madmen, they just might be emboldened to take out IK in prison seeing the full fledged support they have from the major international players ie USA, UK, EU, incompetence of the pti leadership team and the lack of firepower from the pti supporters and Pakistani people on the streets.
UP
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The only fact that’s stopping these goons to take that extreme step to eliminate IK is the KPK scenario. If you noticed they haven’t rigged KPK elections and didn’t create a lot of chaos post May 9 in KPK. A little dhaandli happened on few seats. They will think many times because they know the KPK people can play titt for tat.
And also after their retirement - their own lives will be in extreme danger. Any junooni supporter of IK can hurt them.
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Red-Indian
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I find it relevant to the topic of this Thread i.e. the political savviness of Imran Khan and the PTI that after 4 years of managing foreign relations while in power that not a single foreign power has come out in support of him. Not the US, not the rest of the West, not China, not Saudi & the rest of the gulf and not even Russia who he supported at the peak of their international pariahdom.
He's been reduced to paying huge amounts of money in lobbying fees and writing letters to backbencher US House Reps to sign form letters of support which everyone ignores.
I don't think the guy is capable of being Prime Minister of a modern nation. Does he have someone in his party who is 'politically savvy' enough to run the government and day to day operations while he remains the power behind the throne and the People's leader? Shah Mahmood Qureshi? Some of these new guys who're in charge of the party - I confess I don't know much about them.
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Get ready for the worst to come, Pakistan. The group has come together once again who were once trying to drag one another on the streets. Pakistan is so unfortunate with the leaders that have been made to come to power. Pathetic.
SportsWarrior
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lol, IK is the most naive politician I have seen in last four decades. I have campaigned for various parties, wen to countless tallis, visited thousands of homes seeking votes, and met many politicians form all walks of life. Even the most corrupt politicians are pretty street smart. They know what to do to gain power. They all understand that if they want to achieve anything they need to be in power. They also understand that they always have to work within the system. No one is above the system
Whereas, IK spent years alienating every country of any value. He spent four years calling modi Hitler and fascist while Modi did not respond to him even for courtesy. CPEC slowed down and angered Chinese. Visited Russia and met Putin while he was starting Ukraine war, angered Saudis by trying build a counter group, dragged US name for very common diplomatic issues, etc etc. Just about no international leader wants to do anything about him. Why will they support him now?
He has dorm in the exactly the same thing internally. Noone or any stature wants to align with him. All he had to do was curb his ego, bide time in the opposition and his time would have come.
PTI has faced the biggest crackdown in the history of Albakitan but salute to them, still standing tall and standing the biggest party of the country by miles.
Albakistan is doom and dusted.
PPP faced worse under Zia yet they still exist
These same courts were celebrated by PTI supporters in 2017 and 2018.
These same institutions were in PTI’s good books pre 2022.
No they didn’t face worst, and ppp does not exist, this is not Bhutto,a ppp at all.
Yes when they did the right thing by putting hands on thugs, though they never put hands on few more thugs which they never will. Now its a complete mockery.
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SportsWarrior
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What does "Albakistan" mean
Stewie
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The elections results have shown the political savvy of PDM, their is egg and other stuff on their faces..
pro-ppp villages were bombed by fighter jets. PTI has faced nothing in comparison to that
So if at the behest of establishment they go after your opponents, they are good, but when they come after you they are bad. Got it.
IMMY69
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Some, very few posters, which I suppose reflect the actual voting pattern of the country, accuse PTI supporters of being crass and often demeaning the PMLN/PDM supporters (all four or five of them)
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If the opponent are corrupt why not, these criminals needed that but unfortunately establishment wouldn’t do that because they are corrupt themselves.
Only in albaksitan you can have Zardari as pm and Shobaz as PM. RIP Pakistan mi people.
If they re not voting the daako and criminals they are not hood han, hahahha
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Lol, 25k workers never went to jail. That never happened to ppp. ptI emerged the largest party within 6 months. Thats the power of Khan.
Albakistan is funny version of the present pakistan. Being a pathan, I would have never wanted to go with Pakistan and so my leader khan abdul ghafar kahn was right.
It was far better to be with india rather than under military backed looters.
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Some of eggs have to be thrown on the feces of few monafiqs.
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Kianig89
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Politically savvy yet corrupt to the core having zero credibility in general public, loot & plunder is their motto
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When we have Shehbaz as PM and Zardari as President, as Pakistani, we a doomed. They will eat 9 rupees out of 10 and people will come on the roads celebrating that 1 rupee that is used for their metro bus (which is being built by putting the same as collateral). Khan was right in 1 things, these people are not educated.
Funny how the PTI govt never went after the corrupt generals only political opponents. And those within their own ranks like Dakkoo Pervaiz Elahi were let off and given positions. PTI has no moral leg to stand on.
Everyone goes to jail in politics. Thats nothing new. Hence for you to claim what happened to PTI is unprecedented is false.
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SO making Zardari the president is the right thing, and support from PP to make shehbaz was also right. Because Shehbaz was supposed to drag Zardari in the streets and they threw pics of Benazir from the helicopter was also not morally wrong I guess?
Yes, that's a great objection. You can see how much freedom of opinion you have in this country. He should definitely have named the establisment members. There certainly wouldn't have been any consequences.
25 thousand pti workers never went tk jail
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Thats why they kick your enqilabi out and he even lost his own seat. Go back to my original post, I said few more needed to be finished which didn’t happen, but cleaning should start from politicians and nawaz and zardari comes fist in that list.
Why start from politicians and not the generals who are the biggest cause of derailment of democracy? Oh thats right, its the generals who were backing PTI pre 2022, ofcourse they couldn’t go against them.
No ofcourse it isn’t. My point is PTI isn’t any different.
Stewie
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It is different. And what the establishment is doing is unprecedented.
PML and PPP leaders would take the jilawatani when offered and run away, managing to keep the spoils they looted from the country during their less than 5 year reign. Imran Khan has not done that. He is in jail and he has refused deals being offered to him.
I do not recall such mass disappearances, murders, tortures and threats to workers of other parties in the past. The scale is unprecedented. DOnt recall the intikhabi nishaan being banned or taken away from a party either.
Savak
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It appears that History will prove IK was foolish not to accept any deals with the establishment and PDM. In Pak politics you have to live to survive another day, being dead is no good in the end and PTI will be irrelevant without IK.
UP
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The goal was not to make deals, the purpose was to expose the system which he has done. History will prove him right when the status co will crumble be it in 2 years or 15 years.
Savak
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Tbh there wasn't anything unknown to expose. The entire nation since independence has known the corrupt nexus b/w the establishment, PML N, PPP. People know the reality of most actors, they are just too scared, timid to do anything about it.
UP
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The boots were not exposed at such an extreme level. Establishment was very well respected but now that’s in drain.
When you make a deal, you can’t fight against your opponent.
Change is inevitable. You can delay the mother nature, you can’t fight it, the status co is on its last legs. IK will be proven right in future.
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Politicians should start from themselves, criminals like Zardari and Nawaz do not have the moral courage to do it of course.
Level is different now, hate is obvious.
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Every person in Pakistan knows about the corruption and morally Ill stuff PPP and PMLN did to get into power but they are ignorant about it because what Nawaz did was he built a metro (Collateral BTW) in which that specific guy can travel for 30 rupees. He is happy about that while his children are out of school and not getting any health benefits and it has been difficulty to eat meal 2 times a day even.
Pakpak
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I get your point but it has made a difference. I mean until 2019 post Swift Retort an army solider could turn up at a chai wala stall and people would give it free, seen many videos. Now no chance, they'd get hatred which is why they never show up at any public place anymore.
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